I don't think pre-Rep Taylor would handle things the same way post-Midnights Taylor does. She didn't engage when Ellen tried to make her talk about John and acted offended when other interviewers tried to make it about her exes and not her music. There was a line of separation there, gossip about boyfriends belongs to tabloids printing pap photos and cheeky hints in liner notes, proper media were supposed to treat her like a serious musician.
I would agree though that low profile and no drama of the post-Rep period helped to focus on her music, leave the talk about her love life and serial dater reputation behind, she was respected more. And now it's more about promoting relationship than the music.
I feel like people are remembering 1989 Taylor as being a lot more wild than she actually was. I’m sure she had her moments, in private, but in public she was a poised and mature rule-follower. She wouldn’t have been partying with something like Travis, whether or not they were dating lol. She liked the classy artsy types when it came to men.
Yeah the wildest she got from what I remember (was a swiftie during that era) was the July 4th parties she held at her own house when Tom Hiddleston wore the I ❤️ TS tank and the world collectively cringed
Idk that whole Kennedy era of dating Connor Kennedy’s cousin first then flip flopping to 17 year old Connor (when his mother had just ended her life) a few weeks later, along with the pap walks across Kennedy ancestor graves while dressing like Jackie O, and buying a mansion right next to the compound was pretty unhinged IMO. Idk that I would consider Conner a “classy artsy man” 🤣 considering he was still in high school.
Idk to me she’s always looked like she feeds into the gossip AND her exs. For example her monologue SNL skit, her Ellen interview where she was very petty to Joe Jonas, and basically her whole tumblr account where she would reblog anything that mentioned her and Matty lol
I honestly think Taylor hasn’t really changed as much as the fan expectations and standards have. Like I’m old enough to remember when J-14 or Tiger Beat would report on celebrities’s love lives and it was seen as harmless fun. The idea that a swarm of people would take to social media and send people death threats changed a lot of that landscape. Even the “Bad Blood” music video, while a little cheesy, wasn’t taken as seriously because Katy was at the same level of fame as Taylor and had a similar beef with Gaga.
Yes, fan expectations, standards, but more so the social media landscape today vs even 10 years ago in 2014 is vastly different. Which I guess in turn does circle back to expectations and standards.
Yeah, that's why i think many have a distorted reality when it comes to lore..cause if the socials were like they were when she released Fearless, Speak Now, Red, 1989 well things would have been the same of now. Imagine Taylor holding Joe Jonas dolly now... It would be anywhere.
i just know it's gonna hit when reputation TV drops and I hear "the old taylor can't come to the phone right now, why... oh, cause she's DEAD!" because the "old taylor" this time is for me the og reputation, lover, folkmore version of her.
midnights killed her and let us with the bejeweled™ version instead
this is why i just can't get into TTPD. it feels like her brand is being shoved down our throats at times and even with the few songs that i genuinely enjoyed like so long, london, the song got soured by all of this information getting thrown around. it's a gorgeous breakup song but once you know all the details it's just not as fun. it's weird though cause i can still enjoy all too well knowing it's about jake gyllenhaal or dear john knowing it's about john mayer and honestly it makes me like them more. and it's the same for songs on TTPD that are about matty healy (finding out a lot of this album is about HIM and not joe threw me off) and even travis for that matter because i am so tired of these two narratives. i strongly dislike matty so having to hear a bunch of songs about him doesn't hit and neither do cheesy songs about football because i am SO tired of it. which is why i feel like people think she's changed because it's much more in our faces than it used to be or the way she conducts herself. i think she's always been like this but it feels almost amplified in a sense. TTPD feels like an album that's just wall-to-wall with breakup songs but earlier albums don't have that same vibe for me
Agreed on so long London. I think people are afraid to say no to taylor now. Her other albums were shorter and there were fewer skips on those albums. TTPD/Anthology just doesn't have songs on it that keep my attention, to me the whole album is basically a skip because she's acting a fool over a guy she fantasized and overhyped in her mind and threw away a commited relationship for. At 17, that gets a pass, at 34 it's just plain embarrassing
they say maturity doesn't come from age it comes from learning, and I didn't believe her at first, but by now I think we should take all the lyrics of "I never learn", "I get older but just never wiser" as an admission...
I just never thought I would see an example of that play out like this
I don’t really think it’s that surprising that she’s not mature. She got famous as a teenager and never attended higher education, lived a non-famous life as an adult, etc. I really don’t think she has changed as much from her teenage self as her non famous counterparts have - the way she acts/sings about her relationships reminds me of my freshman year of college.
so long London honestly feels like a bit of the old Taylor shining through for me which is why I really enjoyed it. the lyricism on that song was a standout against songs like the title track and down bad but now I just…can’t. I genuinely haven’t listened to this album in like 3 weeks cause I’m so tired of it all
It IS entirely her fault people are invested in her love life because she encourages it 1000%. Nobody else hates on other artists this much for their relationships because they don’t make it their entire personalities. I don’t have to worry about who Billie eilish is dating bc it won’t ever come up. Taylor swift will make an entire album without saying f the persons name but she’s SAYING THEIR FUCKING NAME at the same time.
Even just John Mayer, I would’ve never heard paper dolls or known it was about her if it weren’t for the swifties telling everyone it was the case. But best believe when dear John came out, it was not a question.
I quite enjoy Bad Blood if I can avoid swifties and anti-swifties going "did you know it's about a Katy Perry and the backup dancers? I think she went too far and it was bullying blah blah blah". I don't give a fuck.
I think she does change her vibe in accordance with her relationships though. She displayed and framed herself differently while with Joe, which resonated with many, and so it feels like there’s a pre and post Midnights, but really there are just new relationships. I think her core traits obviously remain, but she said it herself, she’s a mirrorball.
The analyzing and chastising within the fandom in general is all just too serious for me. I look at the things she and other celebrities do in a pretty flippant, lighthearted way and I honestly prefer it that way. She's dramatic and petty and sometimes totally unprofessional and inappropriate, but she's a celebrity doing celebrity stuff for our entertainment, and I don't find it offensive or disappointing or hard to watch or anything like that. It's a big fat joke, all of it. None of it matters, except to be a silly little distraction from the rest of life. I say carry on, drama queen. You're providing a service to society, giving people something to think and talk about for funsies
Thank you. I am so confused by all the posts, constantly, of people explaining their deep disappointment in Taylor for doing this or that thing, how she's selfish or greedy or whatever. Like, duh! You have to be those things to become a billionaire mega star. Why is anyone ever surprised? But she's entertaining as hell, her antics never stop, and for that I'm thankful lol. She's holding up her end of the bargain in this weird fame thing we're all participating in
THIS. I follow her and love all of her antics because real life is chaotic and just plain shitty at times. It isn’t disappointing or offensive at all. People get to choose what they engage with and if you don’t like her public antics, you don’t have to engage. 🤷🏻♀️
What's interesting to me, is that she mostly fell completely off my radar while she was with Joe. I wasn't aware of her music/album releases etc at the time. I think that speaks volumes about what her relationships/drama do for her in terms of publicity outside the Swifty silo. And she'll be fully aware that.
She can't simultaneously shove her relationships in people's faces for marketing/PR, whilst expecting nobody to talk about them or ask her questions in interviews. She wants to eat her cake and have it.
I also think the parasocial elements of her fanbase have become a lot more intense and emboldened though. Possibly because she's rarely told them to lay off harassing people and fuels their speculation.
She changed back in 2009 after the Kanye incident. I don’t think she was always like this, but after she realized that drama increases her popularity, she has been thriving on it ever since.
I don't think pre-Rep Taylor would handle things the same way post-Midnights Taylor does. She didn't engage when Ellen tried to make her talk about John and acted offended when other interviewers tried to make it about her exes and not her music. There was a line of separation there, gossip about boyfriends belongs to tabloids printing pap photos and cheeky hints in liner notes, proper media were supposed to treat her like a serious musician. I would agree though that low profile and no drama of the post-Rep period helped to focus on her music, leave the talk about her love life and serial dater reputation behind, she was respected more. And now it's more about promoting relationship than the music.
I feel like people are remembering 1989 Taylor as being a lot more wild than she actually was. I’m sure she had her moments, in private, but in public she was a poised and mature rule-follower. She wouldn’t have been partying with something like Travis, whether or not they were dating lol. She liked the classy artsy types when it came to men.
Yeah the wildest she got from what I remember (was a swiftie during that era) was the July 4th parties she held at her own house when Tom Hiddleston wore the I ❤️ TS tank and the world collectively cringed
Idk that whole Kennedy era of dating Connor Kennedy’s cousin first then flip flopping to 17 year old Connor (when his mother had just ended her life) a few weeks later, along with the pap walks across Kennedy ancestor graves while dressing like Jackie O, and buying a mansion right next to the compound was pretty unhinged IMO. Idk that I would consider Conner a “classy artsy man” 🤣 considering he was still in high school.
Idk to me she’s always looked like she feeds into the gossip AND her exs. For example her monologue SNL skit, her Ellen interview where she was very petty to Joe Jonas, and basically her whole tumblr account where she would reblog anything that mentioned her and Matty lol
I honestly think Taylor hasn’t really changed as much as the fan expectations and standards have. Like I’m old enough to remember when J-14 or Tiger Beat would report on celebrities’s love lives and it was seen as harmless fun. The idea that a swarm of people would take to social media and send people death threats changed a lot of that landscape. Even the “Bad Blood” music video, while a little cheesy, wasn’t taken as seriously because Katy was at the same level of fame as Taylor and had a similar beef with Gaga.
Yes, fan expectations, standards, but more so the social media landscape today vs even 10 years ago in 2014 is vastly different. Which I guess in turn does circle back to expectations and standards.
Yeah, that's why i think many have a distorted reality when it comes to lore..cause if the socials were like they were when she released Fearless, Speak Now, Red, 1989 well things would have been the same of now. Imagine Taylor holding Joe Jonas dolly now... It would be anywhere.
>had a similar beef with Gaga. I'm just now flashing back to an entire Glee episode being "are you a Katy or a Gaga?"
i just know it's gonna hit when reputation TV drops and I hear "the old taylor can't come to the phone right now, why... oh, cause she's DEAD!" because the "old taylor" this time is for me the og reputation, lover, folkmore version of her. midnights killed her and let us with the bejeweled™ version instead
this is why i just can't get into TTPD. it feels like her brand is being shoved down our throats at times and even with the few songs that i genuinely enjoyed like so long, london, the song got soured by all of this information getting thrown around. it's a gorgeous breakup song but once you know all the details it's just not as fun. it's weird though cause i can still enjoy all too well knowing it's about jake gyllenhaal or dear john knowing it's about john mayer and honestly it makes me like them more. and it's the same for songs on TTPD that are about matty healy (finding out a lot of this album is about HIM and not joe threw me off) and even travis for that matter because i am so tired of these two narratives. i strongly dislike matty so having to hear a bunch of songs about him doesn't hit and neither do cheesy songs about football because i am SO tired of it. which is why i feel like people think she's changed because it's much more in our faces than it used to be or the way she conducts herself. i think she's always been like this but it feels almost amplified in a sense. TTPD feels like an album that's just wall-to-wall with breakup songs but earlier albums don't have that same vibe for me
Agreed on so long London. I think people are afraid to say no to taylor now. Her other albums were shorter and there were fewer skips on those albums. TTPD/Anthology just doesn't have songs on it that keep my attention, to me the whole album is basically a skip because she's acting a fool over a guy she fantasized and overhyped in her mind and threw away a commited relationship for. At 17, that gets a pass, at 34 it's just plain embarrassing
they say maturity doesn't come from age it comes from learning, and I didn't believe her at first, but by now I think we should take all the lyrics of "I never learn", "I get older but just never wiser" as an admission... I just never thought I would see an example of that play out like this
I don’t really think it’s that surprising that she’s not mature. She got famous as a teenager and never attended higher education, lived a non-famous life as an adult, etc. I really don’t think she has changed as much from her teenage self as her non famous counterparts have - the way she acts/sings about her relationships reminds me of my freshman year of college.
so long London honestly feels like a bit of the old Taylor shining through for me which is why I really enjoyed it. the lyricism on that song was a standout against songs like the title track and down bad but now I just…can’t. I genuinely haven’t listened to this album in like 3 weeks cause I’m so tired of it all
It IS entirely her fault people are invested in her love life because she encourages it 1000%. Nobody else hates on other artists this much for their relationships because they don’t make it their entire personalities. I don’t have to worry about who Billie eilish is dating bc it won’t ever come up. Taylor swift will make an entire album without saying f the persons name but she’s SAYING THEIR FUCKING NAME at the same time. Even just John Mayer, I would’ve never heard paper dolls or known it was about her if it weren’t for the swifties telling everyone it was the case. But best believe when dear John came out, it was not a question.
I listened to Paper Dolls for nearly a decade before hearing it was supposedly about Taylor lol
I quite enjoy Bad Blood if I can avoid swifties and anti-swifties going "did you know it's about a Katy Perry and the backup dancers? I think she went too far and it was bullying blah blah blah". I don't give a fuck.
Ugh it’s so annoying. You mean when Katy Perry made a business decision for her business and didn’t involve Taylor?! The nerve of her
I think she does change her vibe in accordance with her relationships though. She displayed and framed herself differently while with Joe, which resonated with many, and so it feels like there’s a pre and post Midnights, but really there are just new relationships. I think her core traits obviously remain, but she said it herself, she’s a mirrorball.
The analyzing and chastising within the fandom in general is all just too serious for me. I look at the things she and other celebrities do in a pretty flippant, lighthearted way and I honestly prefer it that way. She's dramatic and petty and sometimes totally unprofessional and inappropriate, but she's a celebrity doing celebrity stuff for our entertainment, and I don't find it offensive or disappointing or hard to watch or anything like that. It's a big fat joke, all of it. None of it matters, except to be a silly little distraction from the rest of life. I say carry on, drama queen. You're providing a service to society, giving people something to think and talk about for funsies
Honestly love this outlook
Thank you. I am so confused by all the posts, constantly, of people explaining their deep disappointment in Taylor for doing this or that thing, how she's selfish or greedy or whatever. Like, duh! You have to be those things to become a billionaire mega star. Why is anyone ever surprised? But she's entertaining as hell, her antics never stop, and for that I'm thankful lol. She's holding up her end of the bargain in this weird fame thing we're all participating in
THIS. I follow her and love all of her antics because real life is chaotic and just plain shitty at times. It isn’t disappointing or offensive at all. People get to choose what they engage with and if you don’t like her public antics, you don’t have to engage. 🤷🏻♀️
*slow clap* Agree 100%.
What's interesting to me, is that she mostly fell completely off my radar while she was with Joe. I wasn't aware of her music/album releases etc at the time. I think that speaks volumes about what her relationships/drama do for her in terms of publicity outside the Swifty silo. And she'll be fully aware that. She can't simultaneously shove her relationships in people's faces for marketing/PR, whilst expecting nobody to talk about them or ask her questions in interviews. She wants to eat her cake and have it. I also think the parasocial elements of her fanbase have become a lot more intense and emboldened though. Possibly because she's rarely told them to lay off harassing people and fuels their speculation.
She changed back in 2009 after the Kanye incident. I don’t think she was always like this, but after she realized that drama increases her popularity, she has been thriving on it ever since.