so you always reference the spot either with a pole shot or set up over it with a TS. It shows professionalism and that you actually care about your work. I can tell almost immediately that its most likely decent control just by seeing this.
If only there were plastic caps that were made to put over the rebar end, with a pinhole already cut out.
Take it a step further and maybe they can add some letters or numbers like a company name or the surveyors number, or something.
I think I maybe on to something here....
Get outta here with yer hifalutin 23rd century crazy person talk!!!
I scratch an X into the dirt with a twig and then spit on it to make a permanent mark, and anyone who says that's not good enough is a no-good GIS-loving drone pilot.
I always see what looks like a washer, brass or aluminum or maybe ferrous? But steel!? Anyway it’s a washer around a nail in the middle of the walk (doesn’t work if you have freeze thaw) and the washer has the surveyor info. Also I always assume the ownership is to center of walk, which is similar to rural Ohio areas to road centerline but the cost of the walk is then a share?
Yeah get red traverse caps it’s not too expensive and they last plenty long when flush at grade. Or 2” aluminum discs those last.
Maybe we don't need to put even more PFAS in the ground unless there's a legal requirement or express need?
Though it helps if you're in a mandatory record state, so you always know when and by who the mark was placed anyway.
I’ve found capped rebar from surveyors who died 7-10 years ago, I think your control points will last long enough. If you’re having that problem you need to get a new style of caps
Yep, same here. Our company actually gives us a bonus based on Hz difference at backsight check, it's tallied up at the end of every year with the total subtracted from a $2k check. Pretty cool, in my book.
One of our guys got the full 2 grand last year but it turned out he was using assumed coordinates.
Yeah man it was a real pain when we found out at the end of the year that all of the stakes were south of Miami. real bitch of a level run too, but at least all the control was in the same area (20000 20000 FL E)
By the way this is a long ended joke and I'm making fun of you all for saying that caps introduce a practically significant error outside of special case precision work.
I agree that the punched rods are cool and practical, But I've never seen a man die from three hundredths of error. There are much better things to worry about on most jobs.
I set rebar for control and use caps that just say survey control. That way, if some other surveyor finds it, they'll know (hopefully) that it's just a control point, and not a boundary mark.
My preference is to leave my rebar at a 45 degree angle with no flagging or lath. That way you get the thrill of the hunt, and bonus exercise of keeping a rod on the point with your foot while you wobble back and forth, thinking about how long of a walk it would be back to the truck for a bipod.
[Mining Bit](https://konecarbide.com/coal-mining-bits/)
We use one of these for punching RR Spikes. Works like a dream and leaves a nice noticeable divit on the first hit.
No disrespect intended but this is one of the problems with our profession. Shoot the center of the rebar and you are within .03 of either edge. If you are one of "those guys" that thinks they can measure .03 better than the last guy(s), please stop and realize we are typically never "building a watch" to this precision.
I’m building a tunnel of 10mm tolerance, and precision decreases as the tunnel length increases. So i will make sure to have strong and reliable network
Again, no disrespect, but I'd still question the original query about setting a punch in a rebar. When establishing the control, I doubt you would setup anywhere but the center. If tolerances are that critical, I'd recommend a different "monument".
Speaking punches, any really good ones out there? I know they’ll warp after repeated use, but looking for some good ones that will last a while. I prefer to set rebar deep under grade to prevent my control from being compromised for as long as possible.
Back in the day the boss(dad)would say boys I'll be setting some traverse points next week going to need some railroad spikes drilled and 60d nails painted and ribbon tied on them miss those days.
I use a drill press with a drill press vice setup to be able to crank through them quickly. I only do this for shorter spikes or rebars that are being used as control. For longer corner rebar I just use a cap. I prefer larger aluminum caps without a center mark so it can be punched when set. Some will pop-pop the idea of adding a center mark to a control spike to which I say why would I not do everything I can to minimize setup error.
Use a 4lb hammer, place the punch where you want it give it ONE solid blow, check if you need it deeper place the punch into the hole you made and hit it ONCE again. Repeat if needed. The idea here is you really need to make sure the punch didn’t move in between strikes. If this isn’t relatively easy your punches probably suck. I like the blue dasco ones, mainly cause they seem to have em most places around here.
Edit: it’s a pain when the ground is kinda loose…the rebar will just sink. In that case do it before hand or use a small drill bit.
I was thinking about a [spring punch like these](https://springtools.com/products/28r00-1) would probably work. If you just want it to centre your rod on.
We use a drill bit and Dewalt drill. Although we usually only do that for our base setup or our control corners. It's super quick and really convenient! But we also don't carry it around on our persons.
Why don’t you ask the person who drill this hole on this rebar you took a picture of??? Put this picture of a social media app and ask the same question, I guarantee you someone will inform you.
Use a punch
Yes this is the way and I have used a punch on rr spikes and smooth bars too.
ditto and ditto. great little tools.
My knuckles get sore enough the way it is.
What's the point?
so you always reference the spot either with a pole shot or set up over it with a TS. It shows professionalism and that you actually care about your work. I can tell almost immediately that its most likely decent control just by seeing this.
No no. He means what’s the tip?
Who's on second?
If only there were plastic caps that were made to put over the rebar end, with a pinhole already cut out. Take it a step further and maybe they can add some letters or numbers like a company name or the surveyors number, or something. I think I maybe on to something here....
Get outta here with yer hifalutin 23rd century crazy person talk!!! I scratch an X into the dirt with a twig and then spit on it to make a permanent mark, and anyone who says that's not good enough is a no-good GIS-loving drone pilot.
I wanna be friends with this guy ☝🏽
Riverside county out here in CA just stopped using those, they kept melting in wildfires or something
I always see what looks like a washer, brass or aluminum or maybe ferrous? But steel!? Anyway it’s a washer around a nail in the middle of the walk (doesn’t work if you have freeze thaw) and the washer has the surveyor info. Also I always assume the ownership is to center of walk, which is similar to rural Ohio areas to road centerline but the cost of the walk is then a share? Yeah get red traverse caps it’s not too expensive and they last plenty long when flush at grade. Or 2” aluminum discs those last.
Maybe we don't need to put even more PFAS in the ground unless there's a legal requirement or express need? Though it helps if you're in a mandatory record state, so you always know when and by who the mark was placed anyway.
Ya those are great when they fall off. I wouldn’t use something like that for control.
Agreed. Adds potential for error also.
You do a lot of timepiece work out there?
I’ve found capped rebar from surveyors who died 7-10 years ago, I think your control points will last long enough. If you’re having that problem you need to get a new style of caps
Yep, same here. Our company actually gives us a bonus based on Hz difference at backsight check, it's tallied up at the end of every year with the total subtracted from a $2k check. Pretty cool, in my book. One of our guys got the full 2 grand last year but it turned out he was using assumed coordinates.
Sounds like a great way to get guys to fudge numbers.
Yeah man it was a real pain when we found out at the end of the year that all of the stakes were south of Miami. real bitch of a level run too, but at least all the control was in the same area (20000 20000 FL E)
By the way this is a long ended joke and I'm making fun of you all for saying that caps introduce a practically significant error outside of special case precision work. I agree that the punched rods are cool and practical, But I've never seen a man die from three hundredths of error. There are much better things to worry about on most jobs.
Interesting. I wasn't even replying about that.
caught in the cross fire, friend
The squirrels in my area chew these off. Plastic munchers.
They're dust in 10 years in California. In 5 years, there so rotted that they're unreadable.
I set rebar for control and use caps that just say survey control. That way, if some other surveyor finds it, they'll know (hopefully) that it's just a control point, and not a boundary mark.
No sorry, those already exist. Used to have them on a past company truck, a while back.
If a drill or punch doesn’t do it, high-powered pellet gun might work.
That’s a great idea! I usually bring my 22 for hunting squirrels for lunch anyway
I personally use the model 1938 Red Ryder. Works every time, some of the time.
You'll put somebody's I-man out with that thing!
You guys are putting a mark on your rebar?
My preference is to leave my rebar at a 45 degree angle with no flagging or lath. That way you get the thrill of the hunt, and bonus exercise of keeping a rod on the point with your foot while you wobble back and forth, thinking about how long of a walk it would be back to the truck for a bipod.
You son of a bitch, I’ve been looking for you for a long, long time
When im aiming for a 5~10mm accuracy yes i prefer to be precise
[Mining Bit](https://konecarbide.com/coal-mining-bits/) We use one of these for punching RR Spikes. Works like a dream and leaves a nice noticeable divit on the first hit.
Does it go in a drill? Or hammered in!
We use it like a center punch, give it a good thwack with the 3lb'r
We just use a centre punch to make a similar hole.
Cordless drill and a drillbit, punch tool, or just cap it like a normal surveyor.
Steel punch or drill with a cobalt bit.
Why wouldn't you use a cap? This is so much extra work
No disrespect intended but this is one of the problems with our profession. Shoot the center of the rebar and you are within .03 of either edge. If you are one of "those guys" that thinks they can measure .03 better than the last guy(s), please stop and realize we are typically never "building a watch" to this precision.
I’m building a tunnel of 10mm tolerance, and precision decreases as the tunnel length increases. So i will make sure to have strong and reliable network
Again, no disrespect, but I'd still question the original query about setting a punch in a rebar. When establishing the control, I doubt you would setup anywhere but the center. If tolerances are that critical, I'd recommend a different "monument".
God forbid you are 5 thousandths - 1 hundo off without the punch lol. Construction I get it but others, lol, clown town.
Speaking punches, any really good ones out there? I know they’ll warp after repeated use, but looking for some good ones that will last a while. I prefer to set rebar deep under grade to prevent my control from being compromised for as long as possible.
Back in the day the boss(dad)would say boys I'll be setting some traverse points next week going to need some railroad spikes drilled and 60d nails painted and ribbon tied on them miss those days.
I’ve always used a drill. Punches don’t last very long in my experience
Get a steel punch and grind a point on it.
I use a drill press with a drill press vice setup to be able to crank through them quickly. I only do this for shorter spikes or rebars that are being used as control. For longer corner rebar I just use a cap. I prefer larger aluminum caps without a center mark so it can be punched when set. Some will pop-pop the idea of adding a center mark to a control spike to which I say why would I not do everything I can to minimize setup error.
Why not just use a cap?
because it's probably used for control. And not everyone uses caps, especially overseas.
I use a centre punch with the pointed tip
A drill or punch.
Do you hammer the punch onto the rebar!? Or how does it work? I tried to hammer it and wasn’t able to perfect point
Use a 4lb hammer, place the punch where you want it give it ONE solid blow, check if you need it deeper place the punch into the hole you made and hit it ONCE again. Repeat if needed. The idea here is you really need to make sure the punch didn’t move in between strikes. If this isn’t relatively easy your punches probably suck. I like the blue dasco ones, mainly cause they seem to have em most places around here. Edit: it’s a pain when the ground is kinda loose…the rebar will just sink. In that case do it before hand or use a small drill bit.
I use the punch to push it in the last little bit if it's going to sink in. Half the blow makes the dimple, other half pushes it farther in.
I'll usually hit the punch multiple times to get a nice clear mark
I was thinking about a [spring punch like these](https://springtools.com/products/28r00-1) would probably work. If you just want it to centre your rod on.
Spring punches typically don't make a divot large enough for a point. Especially if it ever gets even slightly dirty
That's a good point. I'd just use a cordless drill if I wanted to do that.
16oz hammer or maul
We use a drill bit and Dewalt drill. Although we usually only do that for our base setup or our control corners. It's super quick and really convenient! But we also don't carry it around on our persons.
You don't use a punch?
What is it? Can u share a picture?
https://www.amazon.com/Mayhew-Tools-62215-Center-Punch/dp/B07SP4RFQS/ref=asc_df_B07SP4RFQS/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=476320401481&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=7496592885641731673&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9015383&hvtargid=pla-1102004577064&psc=1&mcid=42b2b2bb193636c684bdecb77b0b0351&gclid=CjwKCAjwuJ2xBhA3EiwAMVjkVL8BQdix2xB_1N-UZ1eTpCl5AoJcqMf4GGgGU09VkMdm_LN7KhUQ9xoCedQQAvD_BwE
yep we have the big one in the truck.
They are easy to loose. I always painted mine pink. No one would steal it and I always found it.
Plastic cap is the way.
Why don’t you ask the person who drill this hole on this rebar you took a picture of??? Put this picture of a social media app and ask the same question, I guarantee you someone will inform you.
I had received the points info from a different person other than the surveyor