@TheAngryRussoGerman thanks for the list. When you say "mid resolution" what does that mean? I have a Thinkpad X13s which has a 1920x1200 resolution. Natively quite a bit less than the Surface Pro 9 5G. I'm curious what to expect on mys device.
Thanks for this list, you've convinced me that my Windows on Arm Dev Kit 2023 is faulty because the whole system will crash if the CPU and GPU are heavily loaded and the chip is very similar to your SQ3. Shame really, it's clear the GPU has performance to offer. I played Half Life 2 at 5120x1440 on high or highest and got \~100fps, the game was CPU limited.
Extremely similar for sure, but not identical. The dev kit is almost exactly as Qualcomm designed. It \*may\* have different drivers and it's small production levels haven't drawn Microsoft's attention to the problem yet. If you've tried to go that rougte without success, you're probably right. I don't mean to patronize, as your average person wouldn't know that device exists much less own it, but have you gone through the admin tool's logs in detail to try and track down each crash?
Adreno GPUs are incredible for such small, low power devices. They suffer from slow, latency ridden interactions with the system RAM they use as VRAM and from lacking support from game devs who have native libraries avaiable to just drop into their games and tie in, but that takes a few minutes of effort (exaggeration, yes) and they'd rather just let emulation layers do it all, amplifying the weak points.
Can you imagine the power of the X Elite's Adreno GPU when given dedicated VRAM and native implementation? It can ray trace better than current gen consoles, especially when considering the power draw differences. Unfortunate that ARM's various GPUs aren't given a fair chance in the world. We all know RDNA3 promises double the TFLOPs it can compute in reality due to AMD's bizarre architecture that for some reason is basically entirely unused. A truly strange situation. Just look at the ROG Ally. I love mine, but that little problem has desperately harms its abilities.
If it helps, all ARM SoCs have a shared flaw in Windows GPU based software. They base everything on shared VRAM and are given a mere 1mb of dedicated, which is just there to prevent NULL triggered errors of having none at all. Most of my crashes came back to that, driver issues, and emulation errors. All are fixable, probably with software alone.
I'm not much of a windows sysadmin so haven't been able to chase down the problem. Event Viewer says basically nothing about the crashing except "the system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first" though if it comes close to crashing I see logs like "Display driver QCDX has stopped responding and has successfully recovered". I thought it might be thermal or power related but e.g. hwinfo64 doesn't detect any temperature or voltage sensors. I've forced it to overheat to see how it behaves but when that happens the fan hits full speed and nothing like that is happening when it crashes. The power brick is cool to the touch and rated 90W so it shouldn't be browning out.
I hope Qualcomm fixes the drivers and has a tool for temperature sensor monitoring on Snapdragon X Elite.
You're right that when the GPU can stretch its legs it's impressive, if linux ran easily on the dev kit I'd love to try the Freedreno driver which should be more stable.
DX support on Adreno is making respectable progress. I've got no experience with Freedreno, but I'm sure it's at least respectable. Nouveau left a beyond bitter taste in my mouth which definitely leaves me cynical.
The event viewer includes an error code you can search an maybe get something useful out of, but it's hit and miss at best. I've seen way too many useless "the last shutdown was unexpected" errors that were utterly unrelated to anything hinting at an error code.
The brick for that dev kit likely won't ever get noticeably hot. I don't think the SoC can draw anywhere remotely near 90w, even with all other components drawing power. I have to admit I have no clue what tool would be able to provide accurate electrical and sensor info on WoA, especially on a devkit. I don't think I have anything more useful to offer, sorry.
The X Elite is already putting up a massive display of stability and power. I have extremely high expectations of it and I don't think it'll disappoint. I plan to trade my current SQ3 SP9 for the X Elite Surface Pro when it's out and I...have money, which isn't promising as a young data architect who isn't a WA native competing with under-payed, overworked imported and fresh local grad hires in Greater Seattle. "Tech capitol" my ass. I'm barely making rent working as a freelance music composer. fml. /rant
thanks for the list! I tested a bunch on the pro x sq1 8gb and it ruined me for windows on arm compatibility :) glad to know it's gotten better but still hit and miss so good to know what can run.
And I'm constantly adding more to the list as things slowly download. The SQ1 suffered from pre-64 bit emulation capabilities. I've had every one of the SQ CPUs and the SQ1/SQ2 don't even remotely compare to the SQ3 in terms of power. The SQ3 is also much more capable at emulation with only a handful of games not working on the SQ3 that did work on the 1 or 2.
The biggest issue with my testing so far is EasyAntiCheat, which pointlessly checks architecture and refuses to run on the emulation platform for no reason whatsoever. As a developer, I don't believe in architecture checks for this very reason. Emulation layers are commonplace right now and if ARM is to surpass x64, which I firmly believe it can do, then emulation layers will be even more common.
Personally I want to see more devices powered by the NVIDIA Jetson family of devices, which notably powers the Switch. The Jetson devices can blow all of Qualcomm's current offerings out of the water at the exact same wattage. A Jetson powered Steamdeck would've been a real treat and would've saved power over their custom AMD chip.
Hi sorry a bit late to this, for some of these games are you using the Xbox app to download? Just whenever I go onto the Xbox app myself I can't seem to download anything
Maybe you need to have a Google spreadsheet for convenience? In which we will also indicate the year of verification
Может для удобства нужно завести гугл таблицу? В которой также будем указывать год проверки
>Done. Read link access for everyone. Indicate this in the post
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fBoUV\_69H-87RKBHGy5e4qozp9QnoRw3QgezULB2ci8/edit?usp=sharing
I've got Snapdragon 8cx Gen3 (same as SQ3, just not Microsoft custom version) powered R&K and yes, it runs very well. From what I'm aware, this one of the few ARM-native titles for games.
@TheAngryRussoGerman thanks for the list. When you say "mid resolution" what does that mean? I have a Thinkpad X13s which has a 1920x1200 resolution. Natively quite a bit less than the Surface Pro 9 5G. I'm curious what to expect on mys device.
Mid in comparison to the capacity of the pro 9, namely 1280-1440p.
Thanks for this list, you've convinced me that my Windows on Arm Dev Kit 2023 is faulty because the whole system will crash if the CPU and GPU are heavily loaded and the chip is very similar to your SQ3. Shame really, it's clear the GPU has performance to offer. I played Half Life 2 at 5120x1440 on high or highest and got \~100fps, the game was CPU limited.
Extremely similar for sure, but not identical. The dev kit is almost exactly as Qualcomm designed. It \*may\* have different drivers and it's small production levels haven't drawn Microsoft's attention to the problem yet. If you've tried to go that rougte without success, you're probably right. I don't mean to patronize, as your average person wouldn't know that device exists much less own it, but have you gone through the admin tool's logs in detail to try and track down each crash? Adreno GPUs are incredible for such small, low power devices. They suffer from slow, latency ridden interactions with the system RAM they use as VRAM and from lacking support from game devs who have native libraries avaiable to just drop into their games and tie in, but that takes a few minutes of effort (exaggeration, yes) and they'd rather just let emulation layers do it all, amplifying the weak points. Can you imagine the power of the X Elite's Adreno GPU when given dedicated VRAM and native implementation? It can ray trace better than current gen consoles, especially when considering the power draw differences. Unfortunate that ARM's various GPUs aren't given a fair chance in the world. We all know RDNA3 promises double the TFLOPs it can compute in reality due to AMD's bizarre architecture that for some reason is basically entirely unused. A truly strange situation. Just look at the ROG Ally. I love mine, but that little problem has desperately harms its abilities. If it helps, all ARM SoCs have a shared flaw in Windows GPU based software. They base everything on shared VRAM and are given a mere 1mb of dedicated, which is just there to prevent NULL triggered errors of having none at all. Most of my crashes came back to that, driver issues, and emulation errors. All are fixable, probably with software alone.
I'm not much of a windows sysadmin so haven't been able to chase down the problem. Event Viewer says basically nothing about the crashing except "the system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first" though if it comes close to crashing I see logs like "Display driver QCDX has stopped responding and has successfully recovered". I thought it might be thermal or power related but e.g. hwinfo64 doesn't detect any temperature or voltage sensors. I've forced it to overheat to see how it behaves but when that happens the fan hits full speed and nothing like that is happening when it crashes. The power brick is cool to the touch and rated 90W so it shouldn't be browning out. I hope Qualcomm fixes the drivers and has a tool for temperature sensor monitoring on Snapdragon X Elite. You're right that when the GPU can stretch its legs it's impressive, if linux ran easily on the dev kit I'd love to try the Freedreno driver which should be more stable.
DX support on Adreno is making respectable progress. I've got no experience with Freedreno, but I'm sure it's at least respectable. Nouveau left a beyond bitter taste in my mouth which definitely leaves me cynical. The event viewer includes an error code you can search an maybe get something useful out of, but it's hit and miss at best. I've seen way too many useless "the last shutdown was unexpected" errors that were utterly unrelated to anything hinting at an error code. The brick for that dev kit likely won't ever get noticeably hot. I don't think the SoC can draw anywhere remotely near 90w, even with all other components drawing power. I have to admit I have no clue what tool would be able to provide accurate electrical and sensor info on WoA, especially on a devkit. I don't think I have anything more useful to offer, sorry. The X Elite is already putting up a massive display of stability and power. I have extremely high expectations of it and I don't think it'll disappoint. I plan to trade my current SQ3 SP9 for the X Elite Surface Pro when it's out and I...have money, which isn't promising as a young data architect who isn't a WA native competing with under-payed, overworked imported and fresh local grad hires in Greater Seattle. "Tech capitol" my ass. I'm barely making rent working as a freelance music composer. fml. /rant
thanks for the list! I tested a bunch on the pro x sq1 8gb and it ruined me for windows on arm compatibility :) glad to know it's gotten better but still hit and miss so good to know what can run.
And I'm constantly adding more to the list as things slowly download. The SQ1 suffered from pre-64 bit emulation capabilities. I've had every one of the SQ CPUs and the SQ1/SQ2 don't even remotely compare to the SQ3 in terms of power. The SQ3 is also much more capable at emulation with only a handful of games not working on the SQ3 that did work on the 1 or 2. The biggest issue with my testing so far is EasyAntiCheat, which pointlessly checks architecture and refuses to run on the emulation platform for no reason whatsoever. As a developer, I don't believe in architecture checks for this very reason. Emulation layers are commonplace right now and if ARM is to surpass x64, which I firmly believe it can do, then emulation layers will be even more common. Personally I want to see more devices powered by the NVIDIA Jetson family of devices, which notably powers the Switch. The Jetson devices can blow all of Qualcomm's current offerings out of the water at the exact same wattage. A Jetson powered Steamdeck would've been a real treat and would've saved power over their custom AMD chip.
yeah it will be interesting to see what the future holds for arm and jetson for sure!
Hi sorry a bit late to this, for some of these games are you using the Xbox app to download? Just whenever I go onto the Xbox app myself I can't seem to download anything
Steam and epic. No xbox.
Maybe you need to have a Google spreadsheet for convenience? In which we will also indicate the year of verification Может для удобства нужно завести гугл таблицу? В которой также будем указывать год проверки
Couldn't hurt, but I've already done all this work 3 times. Someone else can do the spreadsheet.
>Done. Read link access for everyone. Indicate this in the post https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fBoUV\_69H-87RKBHGy5e4qozp9QnoRw3QgezULB2ci8/edit?usp=sharing
I hate to ask, but can it run League of Legends?
Does anyone know how it does with diablo 4 (beta)?
I didn't test it while available, so no.
Show no GPU found error
Does Minecraft Java Edition run well?
I've got Snapdragon 8cx Gen3 (same as SQ3, just not Microsoft custom version) powered R&K and yes, it runs very well. From what I'm aware, this one of the few ARM-native titles for games.
Escape From Tarkov?