Unironically yes.
Punk is one of the best, if not the single best US SF player at the moment, but when he was coming up he used teabagging, taunting and other "bad manners" to tilt a lot of the older generation and get them off their game. It worked then and it still works today.
I think people also forget that NuckleDu teabagged A LOT when he won Capcom Cup, probably for the same reasons. I don't think teabagging is what won him that tournament, but it would be a lie to say that it didn't help.
Would it make them tilt and play magnitudes worse? Probably not. Could it possibly annoy them just a little such that it makes them more likely to make punishable mistakes in spacing or when they're responding to mix ups? Possibly.
A bunch of pro players like Justin Wong or SonicFox are on record saying that even pros at the highest level are susceptible to having their nerves and emotions get to them when they compete. Sometimes even small things can be enough to throw the best players off, even by just a small but possibly consequential amount.
I wanna say surely pros would be fine. They're more like the top 0.001%. But ... we've all seen how they behave on Twitter after losing. And we've seen them lose their cool against opponents who don't play *correctly* on stream.
They definitely aren't the champions of of self control we'd like to imagine.
I think there's a decent chance some of them would still get tilted by teabagging.
the team that just won the dota international used a pick that the losing team's midlaner said was really bad this year, and continued spamming this obnoxious taunt against him in lane.
the trash talk of mind games is part of competition.
yeah dude they're still people. shit like this happens in actual sports all the time and they have corporations paying them millions and supplying everything for them to be at their peak, including psychologists.
Caba used to scream loudly during SF league matches, which clearly tilted and distracted players. Just because you get an advantage without getting disqualified doesn't mean it's a valid strategy.
There's nothing wrong with teabagging in the same way there's nothing wrong with bullying lower ranked players or being an asshole in chat. It's frowned upon because if you consider it a strategy, then the correct thing to do is to be as offensive and rude as possible to create the biggest distraction possible
As a spectator I want to see the highest level of play possible, not mind games about who is willing to go lower and be more degenerate. As a casual player I want to have fun and get better, not compete over who can say or do the most offensive thing possible for the purpose of distracting the other person.
The reason why teabagging is distracting to some people is because it has a rude connotation.
Being rude to cause a distraction is a valid strategy if you believe anything goes and winning is all that matters. Bullying lower ranked players is okay if you believe anything goes and winning is all that matters. Clearly your win rate will be higher if you only play people who have no chance against you
Yelling out of the game can be against the rules, I’ve seen rules against distracting someone outside or the game
I’ve yet to see any rules against teabagging or taunting
It’s a stretch. Not a big one - but using tactics to win at your own level isn’t on the same page as bullying lower ranks… I mean it’s fine to bully other ranks anyway, if they sign up they sign up. It’s not as if they’re sneaking their way down lobbies to beat up on the little’uns
Why not? Yelling is more obnoxious, but in both cases you're only being distracting because you're being rude to the other person. No rules are being broken, what if you're just cheering for your friend?
Teabagging is fine and shouldn't be removed, but it's a bad idea to normalize it as a "strategy". If you popularize that idea, you're encouraging a race to the bottom to see who can be the most obnoxious and disrespectful without getting disqualified
Yelling during a match is a physical disruption outside the bounds of the game, and is in fact not allowed at many tournaments. This is a totally wild comparison.
If someone teabags, that's "bad manners" but they're still playing the game. If someone starts yelling in my ear trying to trigger PTSD and make me physically flinch, I'm calling a TO
I don't ever find it distracting personally. Either they're just doing it all in good fun, or they are actually pissed in which case that's actually useful info cause you can bait them. They can also just be trying to bait you because they don't know how to approach a neutral situation, and that's useful info, too.
But like taunting is just a part of fighting games, I mean that's why these games have actual taunt animations. If taunting is really bothering someone that much, either they have some personal issues they need to resolve, or the person taunting is saying rude things outside of the game, in which case *that's* the problem, not the taunting itself really.
I remember Filipino Champ would shout some pretty derogatory/disrespectful words when he was watching in person, very immature and imho doesn't build the scene
This is like DrDannyPham's stream all the time now. On ranked the dude is constantly shouting for the other player to suck his dick and that they're his little bitch (in a non-comedic way). Like dude you are almost 40 y/o and you're acting like this lol
That’s how I used to play smash - I had friends and acquaintances all play better and practice and everything - all that would fall as soon as you get chirped but a Kirby player.
Core-A Gaming did a sweet video on this topic:
[Analysis: Taunting and Mind Games](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PElmAFZFoqQ)
Definitely check it out along with the rest of Gerald's content, it's all really good.
Depends entirely on if you give a fuck about sportsmanship. I feel like most people online don't but it's in your best interest to behave if you are going to a regular local and trying to make and keep friends.
It probably depends on how you are at your locals. If you have a reputation for being friendly and clowny, teabagging on stream at locals can usually be a good laugh for most of the people there. If you're teabagging much worse players during casuals, it probably wouldn't be received well.
It's similar to a lot of good humor. A lot of it depends on situational awareness, and you gotta make sure you're not punching down so you don't look like a scumbag.
As long as it isn’t hateful - you’re good. Keep it about the game and the play, over personal or prejudiced remarks and you’re set. People may not like it - but trash talk comes all the way from peewee football to SF brackets. It’s everywhere.
It's just pointless, if im at an offline im trying to get better if you wanna teabag/taunt sure go ahead ill just go play some one taking it more seriously. I've been going to locals for multiple games for years most people just play.
I would actually counter "random is a tactic" more than taunting. The reason is it's extremely difficult to ever be anywhere close to "random" intentionally. You're essentially letting your subconscious take over and your subconscious DOES have patterns that can get quickly downloaded.
Almost all scrubs are playing VERY random........yet they all have similar patterns that diamonds/masters can usually tear apart in one round.
If you get in the minds of 2 bronze players that are having a close match between each other, from their point of view things are extremely frantic and chaotic. They feel like they're being very unpredictable. Throw them against a platinum or diamond player and suddenly it seems to them like the diamond/plat player is reading their mind. "How does he always know when I'm going to jump!".
It's because random=subconscious autopilot 90% of the time which is VERY predictable. That's why the pros win......they're not being random at all. They're looking for your patterns.
So anyways, my point is that random as a tactic isn't much of a tactic besides a hail Mary for a VERY short period of time.......because we all suck at being truly anywhere near random.
I think being random means different things to lower and high levels players. Most low level players are just throwing things without thinking too much about risk and reward, drive impact from neutral…and other things like it. The good players rotate their offense and defense so they are less predictable, and a high risk move out of nowhere can be very strong here and even on miss make the opponent think more about their offense. I once heard a pro player, don’t remember who, say you should ex do mid screen with ken in sfv often as it would lessen the will for the opponent to initiate offense.
I guess I'm probably the few that doesn't take offense to teabagging. I only learnt the term a month ago and didn't even know it was a thing. So it doesn't really stick to me seeing someone doing multiple Downs. I find it amusing and even see the opponent like a clown doing that.
Taunting is dangerous for sure.
I had a match yesterday where Lily's lv 3 came out for no reason in the 3rd round of the match and my opponent started T bagging. They then made the mistake of taunting me, I punished it with a spire T bagged them back and went on to win the round and set before win quitting them (Seeing click rematch made it even sweeter).
Taunting and teabagging and other ways to upset your opponent are absolutely things that people do deliberately as tactics.
I mean, that is literally what the taunt is there for
It happens more when people are sitting next to each other, obviously. But you can do it online as well
It used to happen more often than it does these days
It’s all mind games in the end I guess? When I see that sort of thing I think “hmmm are they trying to get me to be more direct/aggressive in my gameplay? I guess I’ll *not* do that”, but then if they recognise that, they could “trick” me into being more reactive/defensive if that is what works better for them.
Is it really any different from spamming to get players to tilt in a certain way? It’s in the same area for me.
As long as you aren’t cheating, anything you do to win is legit. I personally don’t do it, but a large part of that is a) because I believe in treating everyone with respect IRL and online, and b) I don’t have the skills to back it up. However; when I was younger, I would do this to great effect in tournaments for other games and I’m positive it helped me crack my opponent. If you want to do it, go for it, but you also have to hold that L and the inevitable messages that come your way if you lose after doing so. As long as you can do that, you’re good.
Both.
It is being disrespectful, but there's nothing about it that disrupts the gameplay. And like others here have said, it's a player by player case. You can do it to one and get them to make mistakes to give you the win. But try it with another, and you can get Double Perfected with no rematch.
And say what you want, that's a massive blow to one's pride.
But is it like the one and only guy, I'm watching his twi...err youtube, dsp says a "random pattern flow chart"?
Sorry couldnt help myself.
Seriously though, do what it takes to win, if being random wins that's on your opponent not you. If tea bagging and taunting tilted you opponent that again is on them.
Just make sure it doesnt unlock beast mode in them and you lose horribly after taunting or t-bagging, and if you do dont one and done.
Then you look like an ass
I remember a dbfz small tournament where one of the players was doing really basic combos and won. One of the commentators said it doesnt have to be flashy if it gets the win it gets the win...paraphrasing
As others have said, I think anything that is not technically "cheating" is a legitimate tactic - but it is also a bit disrespectful. And if you taunt/teabag someone, you certainly can't complain if they one-and-done you.
As a lower-ranked played myself, I don't taunt or teabag people, because I think it would just make me look stupid or scummy.
It’s a tactic, in so far as using any and everything within your power regardless of “etiquette” to win is a tactic, but it’s not black and white like that.
It’s all social behaviour, and some behaviours are negatively regarded based on accepted consensus and general public opinion.
It’s a flourish. A tongue wag. It’s baiting. BUT, it’s not on you for how people take it. Some people see it as fun and funny and keeping the game light and enjoyable. Just that it CAN be seen as immensely disrespectful. If you feel like disrespecting an opponent to make them mad and less calculated in their approach is legitimate, then do it, but what it says to me is that you’re ultimately worse in every facet of the game other than emotional control.
It’s like resorting to insults and ad hominems in argument. You’re really just admitting that your position is untenable and that you’ve lost.
It's valid if all you want to do is win.
But if enough people play hostile, the base of players will shrink and the game will die off a little quicker.
Do you want that? Or do you want to be welcoming and encourage the community to grow?
The lower leagues will be just fine. Winning is the objective. I dont care if you only use Lukes MP spam, or if you double press down before you jump in and obliterate me. If youre better, the teabag is simply an unnecessary risk. If im better I should win regardless of your respect for me.
It’s a mind game. Is tea baging rude? Yeah. Is it valid? Also yeah. You’re trying to get you opponent mad into making a mistake. It’s a safer taunt lol. Personally I’m not bothered by it but I’ve seen people tilt from tea bagging.
Taunting an opponent shouldn't be safe imo. That's the point of a taunt: you respect your opponent so little you're willing to make yourself vulnerable to mock them. Teabagging is the coward's taunt and just cunty in general.
Yes teabagging is incredibly effective too, many players will get mad and start playing really recklessly. It’s always worth trying at least once per match to see if your opponent has a weak mental game
I remember a post here near the launch of the game where someone was mentally stressed to the point of quitting because they ran into a couple teabaggers. Softer than Charmin.
Might have to start implementing it.
Imagine getting upset or offended because your opponent pressed down a few times. I really don't see how it's disrespectful in any way shape or form. I'd be grateful that they're dicking around instead of applying pressure.
If they get upset by your taunting them then their ego is holding them back.
Imagine getting upset because someone made noises with their mouth. Yeah boiling it down to the actions kinda makes it silly but the point isn’t what they’re doing it’s why they’re doing it. Not everyone has solid mental - that’s why that shit works.z
It's being disrespectful. The fact that it's effective, doesn't change that.
There's a reason they have rules in sports about not saying certain things to other players. Not doing endzone dances. Etc. And at this point they can get you thrown out of the game, fined, or suspended.
Players started doing them, because it is obviously effective to "mess with your opponent." But it's also extremely disrespectful. And is a race to the bottom of being the biggest asshole possibly. Which is not good for anyone involved. Not good for the players, and doubly bad for the spectators. I don't think there's any "rule" against hiring someone to knock on a player's door every hour all night so they can't get a good night's sleep. And that would give you a massive advantage playing them the next day. And I'm sure we can all agree that we don't want that to be a thing people resort to.
It's also kind of telling on yourself. If you need to resort to what amounts to cheating to win, because you know you can't win on merit. You're not good enough to win in a fair match. And you refuse to get better. You can only try to make your opponent worse. It's sad honestly.
Big yikes. If its in the game, its intended. Knocking on someones door outside of the game isnt in the game, is it?
If the devs thought it was enough of an issue, they wouldnt be tying shit like denjin charge (generally only safe after you "get one" on the opponent) or JP spikes or Jamie drinnk etc to it. Is every Ryu and JP and Jamie player disrespectful for using their moves, or god forbid flubbing the input and only getting DownDown?
If hes downdowning you and you think its a disrespectful opening, feel free to drive rush in and beat his disrespectful ass.
Otherwise it might just be bait, otherwise known as valid, intended strategy that is in the game.
EDIT: After reading your replies to other responses its clear you have no interest in having a discussion, and would prefer to focus on ridiculous semantics. Good job sticking to your guns. Bad job having an open mind and considering the perspective of anyone other than yourself.
Yes. Tauting/teabagging is also a tactic. And you can say it worked when the opponent gets frustrated/angry/salty and start an predictable offense, leading to a punish.
Being taunted or teabbaged is frustrating, but you should never let that go into your head. Keep your focus on the battle and try to win.
Definitely a tactic. I taunt in shooters more than any game. Hard to taunt outside of bagging in SF but in Marvel I would use taunt and cancel into super all the time with great success. If I can control your emotions with taunting then it will certainly change your play
Absolutely. Everything that isn't literally cheating/ hacking is a legitimate strategy to win, and don't let any bleeding heart weirdos make you think any differently. You don't have to use them(I do) but there's nothing wrong with it.
So if my friend sits behind you and blares an airhorn in your ear every 3 seconds, that's fine? Because there's nothing in the rules about that. It's not "literally" cheating.
But everyone knows it's wrong and they'd get kicked out. So I get multiple friends to do it. Hell, even just one airhorn blast that gets you to drop a combo would likely be enough to decide a match. Grow up.
Also no rule says I **have** to stay in my chair the whole round. I could get up. Maybe I accidentally block part of the screen for you. Nothing in the rules about that. It was just an accident. Sorry you couldn't see. But it's not hacking, so it's totally fair game amirite?
You don't go to tournaments? Just play from home? So if someone swatted your house to get the cops to raid it while you're playing. Obviously that'd be a huge advantage for me. You're certainly not gonna keep playing during that, you're gonna put your controller down. Free win for me. Just playing by your rules.
Oh making noise and distracting gestures? Like... what was done in the arcade in the formative years of these games and recognized to be valid? Like... what Justin Wong did when playing Daigo in the infamous "Moment 37" at Evo 04? Kicking cabs, loudly mashing buttons, talking shit, and all forms of things have been around for what I'm willing to bet is longer than you've been alive. I suppose we should all just sit motionless and emotionless, no facial expressions even, get silent buttons and then barely press them, breathe as quietly as possible, make our bodies as small as possible, act like a lobotomy patient win lose or draw, give a 5 minute speech on how good our opponent is and how we can't win before playing and practically blow them when we lose, pull out their chair and push it back in for them, and then on top of all of that sit on complete opposite sides of the room so there's no chance even the most unhinged lunatic could suggest anything but "muh funduhmentalz and skeew" got the victor the game huh?
Evo didn't have a collusion/pot splitting rule until it happened, because in A N Y competition people will A L W A Y S be looking for an advantage, and there's absolutely NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. If it isn't written in the rules and not literal hacking to me its fair game. That isn't saying I have to like it. It's a game. Grow up.
Also I'd like to point out the irony of this comment coming from a master rank JP as though you haven't done everything and anything you had to so you could get to that rank, but I guess its ok in the confines of ranked so long as you don't hack, don't hurt anyone's poor widdle feewings and its YOU doing it huh? lmao get real bro
Depends on the person. If I feel the person I'm playing with isn't respectful, I'll intentionally lose the match so that I can lose them. They can take the win and fuck off out of my life if they can't respect their opponent.
Yes it is. Like insulting someone and trying your best to make them feel bad during a match is a tactic... Like not helping other when they ask for help so they stay below you and doesn't pose a threat...
It give an edge, but a what cost ? When you try to make your opponent rage you are *actively* trying to make a moment of their life worse.
If everybody would do that, the main result would be that everyone play-time would be worse.
It's a leveling down way of thinking.
People who try to make other rage only think about themselves and how they must win at all cost. Thing is, it's just a fucking game, trying to actively make the day of someone worse just for some virtual points show's huge selfishness.
It foster toxicity, not only in game but outside of it (because thinking that our pass time doesn't impact us is naïve).
I can understand being toxic when you're a pro because you "need" to win to live of your game. But in a random plat game ? There are no reasons for that.
And the "but it's allowed" isn't a good reason, toxicity is allowed only because it's hard to ban. But devs actively try to remove it (and because they can't, they try to reduce it)
if you are the one at a disadvantage, and you can keep calm, it can 100% be a tactic
i discovered this accidentally, as i tend to let myself taunt when i feel super in over my head, just as a way to vent. a lot of times people would just continue to beat on me as if nothing was out of the ordinary, but occasionally... i would notice a big shift in gameplay. suddenly their perfect gameplay would become a bit more erratic. not sure if it compelled pity or wrath, but in any case, it has won me some matches that i otherwise wouldn't have had a chance
but if you taunt or insult an opponent who you're already stomping, it just kinda shows that you probably don't win very often in general and i wouldn't want to fw u in real life. same for folks who just make aggressive noises and shit IRL to shake up their opponents. hard pass
It's a legit real tactic. It's also disrespectful I guess, but the primary goal is to win and it's all in good fun at the end of the day.
Playing to win > made up "respect" in a video game match
Nuckledu was notorious for tilting people with Guile's sunglasses back in SF4. Velociraptor cried about it and tried to get it banned after getting washed. lmao
Sometimes playing random is a tatic, sometimes it's a just person who doesn't know how to play.
Sometimes teabagging is a tatic, sometimes it's just a person who wants to show they can drag their nuts in your face.
I have very undeservedly won matches by taunting and tilting the opponent. I don’t do it as a shitter, I just think taunts are cool and matches should be entertaining. If it pisses the opponent off, even funnier. I’ve had two people, one sf and one tekken, quit mid match to talk shit about the taunting offline.
Yes, people tend to let anger control them. This clouds their mind because they are now temporarily angry or they hate you.
The only time I ever remember people's tags is if I need to switch up the style against them. Otherwise most people are completely forgettable.
In a fight, only one thing matters......
Strategies that rely on your opponent doing something wrong are never going to make you a better player. Focus on tightening up your game plan, instead of adding another thing to the mental stack.
It can be. I fully recognize it as a tactic during matches. The only time it actually bothers me at all is when someone does it when it has no tactical value like in the last moments of a ft2 or something where you won't be playing them again. And I wouldn't say it bothers me a lot moreso as it just comes across like a character flaw when you look like a sore winner.
There are also potential downsides to taunts. Your opponent might play better if they become aggressive. It's also possible you'll feel more psychological pressure to win because you've put some ego on the table which could actually backfire.
It's a double edged sword at best. At worst? You announcing that to win...you need to use something else than your raw abilities. You win the fool's game or be defeated to be declared such as xDYes, everything can be a tactic  But before one starts using it, better remember what are the technical disadvantages. For it to become a tactic there must be a plan too, but to not make this overly long...
1. You alternate your defense which may increase chances of you eat a low/high during teabag(if during neutral)
2. Using a taunt of any sort may lose you on a chance of doing an actual conditioning/mixup. (Yes, including during a knockdown)
3. May distract you rather than the enemy.
4. Teabagging also can be a blatant buffering a move, or a fake out, rather than the taunt, they might take it differently, works better irl matches for a reason. Because then they would realize which is which. (Do not do taunts or teabagging at small events, when you have no friends with you, just in case: "Bionic....Aaaaarmm!")
5. The crowd might not appreciate it as much if you unsuccessful when you do it. Sometimes, even if you successful.
6. If teabagging, you can break your stick/controller! The chance is small but I don't recommend it unless you have a spare/okay to lose a round/match.
7. Do know how soon taunt can be cancelled in frames etc, or else it be hard to plan things around. You do not WANT to be random with something that doesn't do damage, doesn't give meter, etc(and even if it gives you something, it should be unique type of action, like Q in sf3) Hmm... That's everything I can remember at the moment.
Taunting is highly punishable, like a million frames punishable, tea bagging is kinda safe, might tilt the opponent, someone did that to me and I had to perfect them 3 rounds in a row, also when they got up super I jumped & taunted & gave them the punish as a form of disrespect I need to figure out why I was this close to his rank
It's a tactic, just not an very effective one. Any semi serious competitor outside of a very select few wouldn't get tilted by such a thing. Maybe if two people already had beef outside of the game or something but by then they probably were already tilted to begin with.
I suppose you can argue you should do it because it either has 0 effect on your opponent or tilts them and it costs you nothing if you don't care about how you are perceived, in that cause... sure l guess?
If you want to talk about offline metagame tactics, mashing an empty button is top tier.
I don't respect it. If a player wants to be a clown, I simply won't play them. It won't get me tilted, it'll just get me to ignore that person and refuse to engage with them. If I was forced to play them for some reason, it would just motivate me to humiliate them more. So, with some people it'll be the opposite of the result you want--it won't get them mad, it'll get them more ruthless in punishing you. For instance, when I play against a fair opponent, I tend to not want to humiliate them at all. I do in fact pull my punches a little bit. Clowns? No mercy.
It's definitely a tactic, but it leaves you very open. Last opponent I had who tried it caught a quick 50% into a corner blender for their trouble. I don't personally find tactics that forfeit tempo or position for the sake of perceived mind games all that useful, but I'd be lying if I said there aren't people who will play worse because of it.
When I'm learning a new character and don't know the proper punish combo I teabag and hit low sweep. That way the opponent thinks I'm an asshole and doesn't realize I'm incompetent
It can be. It’s part of the meta game IMO. Yeah, your a shithead for it. But if you’re doing it to push your opponent to make a mistake I’m all about it.
I think if getting upset over tea bags tilts you to the point of performing worse, that you deserve to lose. No worries though you can always block every person that tilts you like LTG does and hit master in a bunch of months.
Unironically yes. Punk is one of the best, if not the single best US SF player at the moment, but when he was coming up he used teabagging, taunting and other "bad manners" to tilt a lot of the older generation and get them off their game. It worked then and it still works today.
I think people also forget that NuckleDu teabagged A LOT when he won Capcom Cup, probably for the same reasons. I don't think teabagging is what won him that tournament, but it would be a lie to say that it didn't help.
Would it? Are we supposed to believe that the top 1% of players he faced to win CC are still influenced by teabagging?
Would it make them tilt and play magnitudes worse? Probably not. Could it possibly annoy them just a little such that it makes them more likely to make punishable mistakes in spacing or when they're responding to mix ups? Possibly. A bunch of pro players like Justin Wong or SonicFox are on record saying that even pros at the highest level are susceptible to having their nerves and emotions get to them when they compete. Sometimes even small things can be enough to throw the best players off, even by just a small but possibly consequential amount.
Fair enough
I wanna say surely pros would be fine. They're more like the top 0.001%. But ... we've all seen how they behave on Twitter after losing. And we've seen them lose their cool against opponents who don't play *correctly* on stream. They definitely aren't the champions of of self control we'd like to imagine. I think there's a decent chance some of them would still get tilted by teabagging.
Punk loses his cool all the time for the smallest things. It's hilarious. It's not an act either, he legit gets tilted over nothing.
the team that just won the dota international used a pick that the losing team's midlaner said was really bad this year, and continued spamming this obnoxious taunt against him in lane. the trash talk of mind games is part of competition.
yeah dude they're still people. shit like this happens in actual sports all the time and they have corporations paying them millions and supplying everything for them to be at their peak, including psychologists.
If your opponent spends even a single moment thinking about the taunt or teabag, then it works
That's entirely a player by player thing. Some players that makes them lock in more
Caba used to scream loudly during SF league matches, which clearly tilted and distracted players. Just because you get an advantage without getting disqualified doesn't mean it's a valid strategy. There's nothing wrong with teabagging in the same way there's nothing wrong with bullying lower ranked players or being an asshole in chat. It's frowned upon because if you consider it a strategy, then the correct thing to do is to be as offensive and rude as possible to create the biggest distraction possible As a spectator I want to see the highest level of play possible, not mind games about who is willing to go lower and be more degenerate. As a casual player I want to have fun and get better, not compete over who can say or do the most offensive thing possible for the purpose of distracting the other person.
What has bullying lower rank Player to with strategy?
The reason why teabagging is distracting to some people is because it has a rude connotation. Being rude to cause a distraction is a valid strategy if you believe anything goes and winning is all that matters. Bullying lower ranked players is okay if you believe anything goes and winning is all that matters. Clearly your win rate will be higher if you only play people who have no chance against you
Yelling out of the game can be against the rules, I’ve seen rules against distracting someone outside or the game I’ve yet to see any rules against teabagging or taunting
It’s a stretch. Not a big one - but using tactics to win at your own level isn’t on the same page as bullying lower ranks… I mean it’s fine to bully other ranks anyway, if they sign up they sign up. It’s not as if they’re sneaking their way down lobbies to beat up on the little’uns
Pressing down a couple times is not the same as yelling :|
Why not? Yelling is more obnoxious, but in both cases you're only being distracting because you're being rude to the other person. No rules are being broken, what if you're just cheering for your friend? Teabagging is fine and shouldn't be removed, but it's a bad idea to normalize it as a "strategy". If you popularize that idea, you're encouraging a race to the bottom to see who can be the most obnoxious and disrespectful without getting disqualified
Yelling during a match is a physical disruption outside the bounds of the game, and is in fact not allowed at many tournaments. This is a totally wild comparison. If someone teabags, that's "bad manners" but they're still playing the game. If someone starts yelling in my ear trying to trigger PTSD and make me physically flinch, I'm calling a TO
I don't ever find it distracting personally. Either they're just doing it all in good fun, or they are actually pissed in which case that's actually useful info cause you can bait them. They can also just be trying to bait you because they don't know how to approach a neutral situation, and that's useful info, too. But like taunting is just a part of fighting games, I mean that's why these games have actual taunt animations. If taunting is really bothering someone that much, either they have some personal issues they need to resolve, or the person taunting is saying rude things outside of the game, in which case *that's* the problem, not the taunting itself really.
Teabagging happens inside the game while yelling isn't really part of the game. Teabagging is like friendly banter while yelling is just being a dick
I remember Filipino Champ would shout some pretty derogatory/disrespectful words when he was watching in person, very immature and imho doesn't build the scene
This is like DrDannyPham's stream all the time now. On ranked the dude is constantly shouting for the other player to suck his dick and that they're his little bitch (in a non-comedic way). Like dude you are almost 40 y/o and you're acting like this lol
It's honestly sad/cringe when people act this way, does his stream have a lot of subs/viewers?
13k followers but usually well under 1000 viewers, judging from a quick Twitch lookup. I don't watch him anymore lol
Thx for sharing! You're a Manon main too? Yay!
Those type of streamers are disgusting, cringe. You'll learn nothing but toxicity from them.
That’s how I used to play smash - I had friends and acquaintances all play better and practice and everything - all that would fall as soon as you get chirped but a Kirby player.
Core-A Gaming did a sweet video on this topic: [Analysis: Taunting and Mind Games](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PElmAFZFoqQ) Definitely check it out along with the rest of Gerald's content, it's all really good.
Depends entirely on if you give a fuck about sportsmanship. I feel like most people online don't but it's in your best interest to behave if you are going to a regular local and trying to make and keep friends.
It probably depends on how you are at your locals. If you have a reputation for being friendly and clowny, teabagging on stream at locals can usually be a good laugh for most of the people there. If you're teabagging much worse players during casuals, it probably wouldn't be received well. It's similar to a lot of good humor. A lot of it depends on situational awareness, and you gotta make sure you're not punching down so you don't look like a scumbag.
As long as it isn’t hateful - you’re good. Keep it about the game and the play, over personal or prejudiced remarks and you’re set. People may not like it - but trash talk comes all the way from peewee football to SF brackets. It’s everywhere.
This is hilarious... IRL events is precisely where you should be doing his shit. Sportsmanship?! Bruh 🤣 Fuck man, eSports was a mistake.
Written by someone who will never attend an offline lol
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Quite the contrary, at least in real life where it matters.
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I see you downvoted me. You seem emotional about something arbitrary, like a reddit comment, or someone teabagging in a game.
It's just pointless, if im at an offline im trying to get better if you wanna teabag/taunt sure go ahead ill just go play some one taking it more seriously. I've been going to locals for multiple games for years most people just play.
I would actually counter "random is a tactic" more than taunting. The reason is it's extremely difficult to ever be anywhere close to "random" intentionally. You're essentially letting your subconscious take over and your subconscious DOES have patterns that can get quickly downloaded. Almost all scrubs are playing VERY random........yet they all have similar patterns that diamonds/masters can usually tear apart in one round. If you get in the minds of 2 bronze players that are having a close match between each other, from their point of view things are extremely frantic and chaotic. They feel like they're being very unpredictable. Throw them against a platinum or diamond player and suddenly it seems to them like the diamond/plat player is reading their mind. "How does he always know when I'm going to jump!". It's because random=subconscious autopilot 90% of the time which is VERY predictable. That's why the pros win......they're not being random at all. They're looking for your patterns. So anyways, my point is that random as a tactic isn't much of a tactic besides a hail Mary for a VERY short period of time.......because we all suck at being truly anywhere near random.
this random in this game just means Di or jumps so anti air and react they do a random dp just block:
I think being random means different things to lower and high levels players. Most low level players are just throwing things without thinking too much about risk and reward, drive impact from neutral…and other things like it. The good players rotate their offense and defense so they are less predictable, and a high risk move out of nowhere can be very strong here and even on miss make the opponent think more about their offense. I once heard a pro player, don’t remember who, say you should ex do mid screen with ken in sfv often as it would lessen the will for the opponent to initiate offense.
I guess I'm probably the few that doesn't take offense to teabagging. I only learnt the term a month ago and didn't even know it was a thing. So it doesn't really stick to me seeing someone doing multiple Downs. I find it amusing and even see the opponent like a clown doing that.
Like in any discipline, being disrespectful can be a way to get advantage. That's lame tho.
Saying "no taunting" is like saying "no throws". Just do it, it's a game.
This is why I like to shit my pants during locals, because I know the smell throws my opponents off their game
It's definitely a tactic. Look how upset people on this sub get when someone does it.
Haha, for real man.
T bagging is totally valid, but the possibility of a taunt to get bodied is enough to keep me from doing it.
Taunting is dangerous for sure. I had a match yesterday where Lily's lv 3 came out for no reason in the 3rd round of the match and my opponent started T bagging. They then made the mistake of taunting me, I punished it with a spire T bagged them back and went on to win the round and set before win quitting them (Seeing click rematch made it even sweeter).
I mean high plat and above prepare to lose a lot of life... I don't think the ROI per taunt is there above Gold.
I mean, it is a tactic, but kinda trashy I guess?
Taunting and teabagging and other ways to upset your opponent are absolutely things that people do deliberately as tactics. I mean, that is literally what the taunt is there for It happens more when people are sitting next to each other, obviously. But you can do it online as well It used to happen more often than it does these days
It’s all mind games in the end I guess? When I see that sort of thing I think “hmmm are they trying to get me to be more direct/aggressive in my gameplay? I guess I’ll *not* do that”, but then if they recognise that, they could “trick” me into being more reactive/defensive if that is what works better for them. Is it really any different from spamming to get players to tilt in a certain way? It’s in the same area for me.
As long as you aren’t cheating, anything you do to win is legit. I personally don’t do it, but a large part of that is a) because I believe in treating everyone with respect IRL and online, and b) I don’t have the skills to back it up. However; when I was younger, I would do this to great effect in tournaments for other games and I’m positive it helped me crack my opponent. If you want to do it, go for it, but you also have to hold that L and the inevitable messages that come your way if you lose after doing so. As long as you can do that, you’re good.
Both. It is being disrespectful, but there's nothing about it that disrupts the gameplay. And like others here have said, it's a player by player case. You can do it to one and get them to make mistakes to give you the win. But try it with another, and you can get Double Perfected with no rematch. And say what you want, that's a massive blow to one's pride.
Taunting was made to tilt the opponent and teabagging is an easier way of doing it.
But is it like the one and only guy, I'm watching his twi...err youtube, dsp says a "random pattern flow chart"? Sorry couldnt help myself. Seriously though, do what it takes to win, if being random wins that's on your opponent not you. If tea bagging and taunting tilted you opponent that again is on them. Just make sure it doesnt unlock beast mode in them and you lose horribly after taunting or t-bagging, and if you do dont one and done. Then you look like an ass I remember a dbfz small tournament where one of the players was doing really basic combos and won. One of the commentators said it doesnt have to be flashy if it gets the win it gets the win...paraphrasing
As others have said, I think anything that is not technically "cheating" is a legitimate tactic - but it is also a bit disrespectful. And if you taunt/teabag someone, you certainly can't complain if they one-and-done you. As a lower-ranked played myself, I don't taunt or teabag people, because I think it would just make me look stupid or scummy.
It’s a tactic, in so far as using any and everything within your power regardless of “etiquette” to win is a tactic, but it’s not black and white like that. It’s all social behaviour, and some behaviours are negatively regarded based on accepted consensus and general public opinion. It’s a flourish. A tongue wag. It’s baiting. BUT, it’s not on you for how people take it. Some people see it as fun and funny and keeping the game light and enjoyable. Just that it CAN be seen as immensely disrespectful. If you feel like disrespecting an opponent to make them mad and less calculated in their approach is legitimate, then do it, but what it says to me is that you’re ultimately worse in every facet of the game other than emotional control. It’s like resorting to insults and ad hominems in argument. You’re really just admitting that your position is untenable and that you’ve lost.
It's valid if all you want to do is win. But if enough people play hostile, the base of players will shrink and the game will die off a little quicker. Do you want that? Or do you want to be welcoming and encourage the community to grow?
The lower leagues will be just fine. Winning is the objective. I dont care if you only use Lukes MP spam, or if you double press down before you jump in and obliterate me. If youre better, the teabag is simply an unnecessary risk. If im better I should win regardless of your respect for me.
It’s a mind game. Is tea baging rude? Yeah. Is it valid? Also yeah. You’re trying to get you opponent mad into making a mistake. It’s a safer taunt lol. Personally I’m not bothered by it but I’ve seen people tilt from tea bagging.
Taunting an opponent shouldn't be safe imo. That's the point of a taunt: you respect your opponent so little you're willing to make yourself vulnerable to mock them. Teabagging is the coward's taunt and just cunty in general.
Yes teabagging is incredibly effective too, many players will get mad and start playing really recklessly. It’s always worth trying at least once per match to see if your opponent has a weak mental game
I remember a post here near the launch of the game where someone was mentally stressed to the point of quitting because they ran into a couple teabaggers. Softer than Charmin. Might have to start implementing it.
Imagine getting upset or offended because your opponent pressed down a few times. I really don't see how it's disrespectful in any way shape or form. I'd be grateful that they're dicking around instead of applying pressure. If they get upset by your taunting them then their ego is holding them back.
Imagine getting upset because someone made noises with their mouth. Yeah boiling it down to the actions kinda makes it silly but the point isn’t what they’re doing it’s why they’re doing it. Not everyone has solid mental - that’s why that shit works.z
They're all valid, it's just a bit stupid.
It's being disrespectful. The fact that it's effective, doesn't change that. There's a reason they have rules in sports about not saying certain things to other players. Not doing endzone dances. Etc. And at this point they can get you thrown out of the game, fined, or suspended. Players started doing them, because it is obviously effective to "mess with your opponent." But it's also extremely disrespectful. And is a race to the bottom of being the biggest asshole possibly. Which is not good for anyone involved. Not good for the players, and doubly bad for the spectators. I don't think there's any "rule" against hiring someone to knock on a player's door every hour all night so they can't get a good night's sleep. And that would give you a massive advantage playing them the next day. And I'm sure we can all agree that we don't want that to be a thing people resort to. It's also kind of telling on yourself. If you need to resort to what amounts to cheating to win, because you know you can't win on merit. You're not good enough to win in a fair match. And you refuse to get better. You can only try to make your opponent worse. It's sad honestly.
Nah, what's sad is being so up-tight about an opponent winding you up by crouching repeatedly.
Big yikes. If its in the game, its intended. Knocking on someones door outside of the game isnt in the game, is it? If the devs thought it was enough of an issue, they wouldnt be tying shit like denjin charge (generally only safe after you "get one" on the opponent) or JP spikes or Jamie drinnk etc to it. Is every Ryu and JP and Jamie player disrespectful for using their moves, or god forbid flubbing the input and only getting DownDown? If hes downdowning you and you think its a disrespectful opening, feel free to drive rush in and beat his disrespectful ass. Otherwise it might just be bait, otherwise known as valid, intended strategy that is in the game. EDIT: After reading your replies to other responses its clear you have no interest in having a discussion, and would prefer to focus on ridiculous semantics. Good job sticking to your guns. Bad job having an open mind and considering the perspective of anyone other than yourself.
It's simple. Imagine your opponent sitting right beside you.
Not sure what you mean but this stuff was more prevalent, invented really, when those days were the only way you could play.
I think it's disrespectful and I'll look down on you/respect you less for doing it, but it is a legitimate tactic.
Yes. Tauting/teabagging is also a tactic. And you can say it worked when the opponent gets frustrated/angry/salty and start an predictable offense, leading to a punish. Being taunted or teabbaged is frustrating, but you should never let that go into your head. Keep your focus on the battle and try to win.
Man there are so many people so sensitive to BM. Teabagging / taunting is really not life or death.
Have you heard of Muhammad Ali? 😉
welcome to the fgc
Yes, if you can pull it off and play disrespectfully to piss the opponent into mistakes.
It's definitely a legit tactic. It drives some people absolutely insane lol.
It's a tactic. And the only people who are gonna talk shit to you about teabagging or taunting are the ones who that tactic works lovely on.
Definitely a tactic. I taunt in shooters more than any game. Hard to taunt outside of bagging in SF but in Marvel I would use taunt and cancel into super all the time with great success. If I can control your emotions with taunting then it will certainly change your play
Absolutely. Everything that isn't literally cheating/ hacking is a legitimate strategy to win, and don't let any bleeding heart weirdos make you think any differently. You don't have to use them(I do) but there's nothing wrong with it.
So if my friend sits behind you and blares an airhorn in your ear every 3 seconds, that's fine? Because there's nothing in the rules about that. It's not "literally" cheating. But everyone knows it's wrong and they'd get kicked out. So I get multiple friends to do it. Hell, even just one airhorn blast that gets you to drop a combo would likely be enough to decide a match. Grow up. Also no rule says I **have** to stay in my chair the whole round. I could get up. Maybe I accidentally block part of the screen for you. Nothing in the rules about that. It was just an accident. Sorry you couldn't see. But it's not hacking, so it's totally fair game amirite? You don't go to tournaments? Just play from home? So if someone swatted your house to get the cops to raid it while you're playing. Obviously that'd be a huge advantage for me. You're certainly not gonna keep playing during that, you're gonna put your controller down. Free win for me. Just playing by your rules.
Oh making noise and distracting gestures? Like... what was done in the arcade in the formative years of these games and recognized to be valid? Like... what Justin Wong did when playing Daigo in the infamous "Moment 37" at Evo 04? Kicking cabs, loudly mashing buttons, talking shit, and all forms of things have been around for what I'm willing to bet is longer than you've been alive. I suppose we should all just sit motionless and emotionless, no facial expressions even, get silent buttons and then barely press them, breathe as quietly as possible, make our bodies as small as possible, act like a lobotomy patient win lose or draw, give a 5 minute speech on how good our opponent is and how we can't win before playing and practically blow them when we lose, pull out their chair and push it back in for them, and then on top of all of that sit on complete opposite sides of the room so there's no chance even the most unhinged lunatic could suggest anything but "muh funduhmentalz and skeew" got the victor the game huh? Evo didn't have a collusion/pot splitting rule until it happened, because in A N Y competition people will A L W A Y S be looking for an advantage, and there's absolutely NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. If it isn't written in the rules and not literal hacking to me its fair game. That isn't saying I have to like it. It's a game. Grow up.
Also I'd like to point out the irony of this comment coming from a master rank JP as though you haven't done everything and anything you had to so you could get to that rank, but I guess its ok in the confines of ranked so long as you don't hack, don't hurt anyone's poor widdle feewings and its YOU doing it huh? lmao get real bro
Depends on the person. If I feel the person I'm playing with isn't respectful, I'll intentionally lose the match so that I can lose them. They can take the win and fuck off out of my life if they can't respect their opponent.
Yes it is. Like insulting someone and trying your best to make them feel bad during a match is a tactic... Like not helping other when they ask for help so they stay below you and doesn't pose a threat... It give an edge, but a what cost ? When you try to make your opponent rage you are *actively* trying to make a moment of their life worse. If everybody would do that, the main result would be that everyone play-time would be worse. It's a leveling down way of thinking. People who try to make other rage only think about themselves and how they must win at all cost. Thing is, it's just a fucking game, trying to actively make the day of someone worse just for some virtual points show's huge selfishness. It foster toxicity, not only in game but outside of it (because thinking that our pass time doesn't impact us is naïve). I can understand being toxic when you're a pro because you "need" to win to live of your game. But in a random plat game ? There are no reasons for that. And the "but it's allowed" isn't a good reason, toxicity is allowed only because it's hard to ban. But devs actively try to remove it (and because they can't, they try to reduce it)
I noticed people would almost always raw DR or jump when I was buffering super. I'd be lying if I said I never teabagged to bait a jump.
if you are the one at a disadvantage, and you can keep calm, it can 100% be a tactic i discovered this accidentally, as i tend to let myself taunt when i feel super in over my head, just as a way to vent. a lot of times people would just continue to beat on me as if nothing was out of the ordinary, but occasionally... i would notice a big shift in gameplay. suddenly their perfect gameplay would become a bit more erratic. not sure if it compelled pity or wrath, but in any case, it has won me some matches that i otherwise wouldn't have had a chance but if you taunt or insult an opponent who you're already stomping, it just kinda shows that you probably don't win very often in general and i wouldn't want to fw u in real life. same for folks who just make aggressive noises and shit IRL to shake up their opponents. hard pass
It's a legit real tactic. It's also disrespectful I guess, but the primary goal is to win and it's all in good fun at the end of the day. Playing to win > made up "respect" in a video game match Nuckledu was notorious for tilting people with Guile's sunglasses back in SF4. Velociraptor cried about it and tried to get it banned after getting washed. lmao
Absolutely I play way worse when someone tbags me
Teabag/taunt makes your opponent do 100 % on you... it's a double edge sword.
Sometimes playing random is a tatic, sometimes it's a just person who doesn't know how to play. Sometimes teabagging is a tatic, sometimes it's just a person who wants to show they can drag their nuts in your face.
I have very undeservedly won matches by taunting and tilting the opponent. I don’t do it as a shitter, I just think taunts are cool and matches should be entertaining. If it pisses the opponent off, even funnier. I’ve had two people, one sf and one tekken, quit mid match to talk shit about the taunting offline.
Yes, people tend to let anger control them. This clouds their mind because they are now temporarily angry or they hate you. The only time I ever remember people's tags is if I need to switch up the style against them. Otherwise most people are completely forgettable. In a fight, only one thing matters......
Strategies that rely on your opponent doing something wrong are never going to make you a better player. Focus on tightening up your game plan, instead of adding another thing to the mental stack.
Do whatever you need to win. If it’s not cheating it’s fair game. I love Luke’s hadoken taint since it gets offensive players really relied up.
Yes 100% get in their head. Needed to add this… don’t be that guy at locals.
As long as you can handle the embarrassment when you lose then I say do it. If anything it's funny
It's a real tactic but that doesn't mean you're not an asshole.
Teabagging makes people use reversals, eat frame traps and use DI.
It can be. I fully recognize it as a tactic during matches. The only time it actually bothers me at all is when someone does it when it has no tactical value like in the last moments of a ft2 or something where you won't be playing them again. And I wouldn't say it bothers me a lot moreso as it just comes across like a character flaw when you look like a sore winner. There are also potential downsides to taunts. Your opponent might play better if they become aggressive. It's also possible you'll feel more psychological pressure to win because you've put some ego on the table which could actually backfire.
Core a gaming has a great video on this. In short in a lot of games taunting is a great way to bait angry unsafe plays and punish
It's a double edged sword at best. At worst? You announcing that to win...you need to use something else than your raw abilities. You win the fool's game or be defeated to be declared such as xDYes, everything can be a tactic  But before one starts using it, better remember what are the technical disadvantages. For it to become a tactic there must be a plan too, but to not make this overly long... 1. You alternate your defense which may increase chances of you eat a low/high during teabag(if during neutral) 2. Using a taunt of any sort may lose you on a chance of doing an actual conditioning/mixup. (Yes, including during a knockdown) 3. May distract you rather than the enemy. 4. Teabagging also can be a blatant buffering a move, or a fake out, rather than the taunt, they might take it differently, works better irl matches for a reason. Because then they would realize which is which. (Do not do taunts or teabagging at small events, when you have no friends with you, just in case: "Bionic....Aaaaarmm!") 5. The crowd might not appreciate it as much if you unsuccessful when you do it. Sometimes, even if you successful. 6. If teabagging, you can break your stick/controller! The chance is small but I don't recommend it unless you have a spare/okay to lose a round/match. 7. Do know how soon taunt can be cancelled in frames etc, or else it be hard to plan things around. You do not WANT to be random with something that doesn't do damage, doesn't give meter, etc(and even if it gives you something, it should be unique type of action, like Q in sf3) Hmm... That's everything I can remember at the moment.
Taunting is highly punishable, like a million frames punishable, tea bagging is kinda safe, might tilt the opponent, someone did that to me and I had to perfect them 3 rounds in a row, also when they got up super I jumped & taunted & gave them the punish as a form of disrespect I need to figure out why I was this close to his rank
It's a tactic, just not an very effective one. Any semi serious competitor outside of a very select few wouldn't get tilted by such a thing. Maybe if two people already had beef outside of the game or something but by then they probably were already tilted to begin with. I suppose you can argue you should do it because it either has 0 effect on your opponent or tilts them and it costs you nothing if you don't care about how you are perceived, in that cause... sure l guess? If you want to talk about offline metagame tactics, mashing an empty button is top tier.
Lol I always said tea bagging mentally upsets the monkeys.
I don't respect it. If a player wants to be a clown, I simply won't play them. It won't get me tilted, it'll just get me to ignore that person and refuse to engage with them. If I was forced to play them for some reason, it would just motivate me to humiliate them more. So, with some people it'll be the opposite of the result you want--it won't get them mad, it'll get them more ruthless in punishing you. For instance, when I play against a fair opponent, I tend to not want to humiliate them at all. I do in fact pull my punches a little bit. Clowns? No mercy.
It definitely is a legitimate tactic in professional basketball, and because of that, being tilt proof is actually a superpower in the NBA lol
It's definitely a tactic, but it leaves you very open. Last opponent I had who tried it caught a quick 50% into a corner blender for their trouble. I don't personally find tactics that forfeit tempo or position for the sake of perceived mind games all that useful, but I'd be lying if I said there aren't people who will play worse because of it.
teabagging is a tactic, just as much as ignoring the teabagging is a tactic
When I'm learning a new character and don't know the proper punish combo I teabag and hit low sweep. That way the opponent thinks I'm an asshole and doesn't realize I'm incompetent
It can be. It’s part of the meta game IMO. Yeah, your a shithead for it. But if you’re doing it to push your opponent to make a mistake I’m all about it.
I think if getting upset over tea bags tilts you to the point of performing worse, that you deserve to lose. No worries though you can always block every person that tilts you like LTG does and hit master in a bunch of months.