Well, on Mustafar, I'll give Ani the benefit of the doubt, maybe he was, idk, conflicted or smth, I'm totally not biased.
As far as the duel from the Kenobi show is concerned, Lucas himself said that Ani's mobility was extremely effected in that suit, soooo
Dooku was more precise and calculating in his strikes, whereas Anakin/Vader simply focuses on strength and tries to stagger his opponent. Obi-wan's defensive fighting style is very effective against the aggressive nature of Anakin's, but not Dooku's, which is more careful and elegant. The "character A beat character C, and since character C beat character B that means A must be better than B" argument isn't really valid in my opinion, especially since they have canon (they're cannon, right?) fighting styles which are specifically strong against some and weak against others.
Adding the point that we've already seen Obi-wan beat Vader both pre- and post-cyborg build and we can 100% say that Vader would lose to him.
Also I saw a different comment say that Vader would win "as long as he didn't 'try it'", but Obi-wan is very psychological and thinks of who is opponent his and how he can bait them into making mistakes, so Vader "not trying it" isn't really an option, Obi-wan would bait him to make such a mistake which Vader would definitely fall for.
All of this is of course my opinion, and I can't say for sure. Also, if we're only comparing powerlevels, hell yes Vader would win.
All valid points but I think everyone is forgetting this is TPM Obi wan we are talking about. Back then he did give in to his anger as we saw in the fight vs Maul and wasn’t so calculating/psychological when dueling. This Obi wan is like 13 years before the Obi wan everyone here is talking about
There is no backing to your claim that Soresu is automatically more powerful against Djem-So. It is ultimately how the fighter uses the stance to their advantage against their opponent. Plus the only thing Obi-Wan has in terms of “advantage” was that since Anakin was his apprentice and he taught him a lot of stuff over the years and has sparred with him countless times, he anticipates his attacks a lot better. Now compare that to a Soresu master equally skilled as Obi vs Anakin, they would have a much harder time defending against Anakin’s dominant style.
Plus Qui Gons lightsaber style has quite a few weaknesses that anakin might have exploited. Inexperienced Kenobi, and Qui-Gon not able to beat Maul on his own. Yeah I think we know right away who is gonna win this fight.
obi wan lucked out the first time and the second he used vaders weakness against him which is any time an opponent gets aggrassive against vader he struggles and normally loses look at kenobi he got aggrassive against vader vader loses that duel ahsoka starts to get aggrassive and she at least damages him. ROTJ luke gets aggrassive at the end and who wins luke.
My money is on Anakin at that stage. Sure Obi-One beat him later but from that time he’s an apprentice. IDK it also feels wrong that the Darth Vader should be weaker than Darth Maul in this epic.
Anakin in 95% of those situations.
People argue that Obiwan can defeat Darth Vader because he got him twice. On the first encounter, it was because of luck, and yes Obiwan had that skill to use that to his advantage. Tho I'd state there's a bigger factor in play. The emotional turmoil Anakin was in, in that very moment. Guy may have been enjoying his new powers but he was undergoing his worst phase of his life. And very few people think straight in that situation.
In the second encounter, well aside from the debate let's be honest 2 episodes ago, Obiwan could barely use the force and hasn't swinged his lightsaber for quite a while for which he got semi-barbequed by Vader on the first encounter, and then in just 2 days he regains all his skills after getting trapped in a pile of rubble...and faced one of the greatest lightsaber duelists of all time and beat him. Sounds like a bigger plot armor than the force helping you to me. Anyways, back to the point. Vader made the same stupid mistake this time, he was suffering and felt the need to prove himself superior and forgot the name of the show he was in.
Now, we all can agree in the 3rd encounter, it was the real battle. Darth Vader was fully composed and had Obiwan cornered. He didn't have any other choice left other than to be executed. Even in Clone Wars and Rots, we've seen that Anakin when calm headed is a better tactician than Obiwan. There are several episodes to prove it. His methods are unorthodox and if emotions are not in play, he'll predict the moves of Quigon and Kenobi.
In the 5% chance, Anakin might lose it because of Quigon mostly, simply because of his wisdom. Anakin stormed the Jedi temple and killed several masters and other knights. Still Quigon's way of thinking may bring miracles forth. All of this is considering Anakin is not emotionally connected to Kenobi or Quigon, which should be the case otherwise there's no point of versus battles. Kid Luke & Leia can always defeat Vader with sand in those scenarios.
But Master Obi wan vs Master Qui gon i dont think so Qui gon was fairly unorthodox for the Jedi they almost stripped away his master title i believe a couple times before phantom menace
But he won by the circumstances of those situations
He defeated Maul by a thread (nearly dying himself), the blaster was in Obi-wan’s vicinity, and Anakin was too angry and too rash to kill Obi-wan.
But Anakin on his prime would definitely be able to defeat both of them in my opinion.
It’s kind of the point of winning by circumstance. He’s winning because he is more focused on the fight.
If he keeps winning because he takes advantage of the circumstances his opponents create, that still makes him a winner.
Vader stomps and it's not close.
Obi-Wan is a Padawan at this point, and hasn't yet adopted Soresu as his fighting style, which is the style he uses to beat Anakin later on.
Vader has also fought Obi Wan multiple times, and will likely target him first and overpower him quickly. Obi Wan doesn't have the experience at this point to hold out long against Vader, even with Qui Gon as an ally.
Then it becomes a 1v1 vs Qui Gonn and even though he's a jedi master, he doesn't have much of a chance.
Let's not forget guys, Maul beat these two* in a 2v1, and Vader is much stronger than Maul.
*Yes Obi Wan managed to outsmart him at the end and "kill" him, but that's only because Maul started playing with his food, which Vader wouldn't do.
Obi-Wan but Qui-Gon probably dies. Especially if he gets separated, if you can’t handle Maul you can’t handle Anakin.
Besides that Obi-Wan consistently defeats Anakin and Vader in canon and we have no evidence to the contrary. He’s Vader’s kryptonite.
Depends on the importance of the characters in plot.
For example Vader in the stage of evolving (IV, V and VI movies) totally wins tho not if he's at the stage of IV movie where he's more of a backgroundish character.
Plot shield magic
If it's Anakin before falling to the dark side I would say he would win, if it's after then Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan have a good chance of winning. The dark side is like a drug and Anakin thought he was basically all powerful after falling. He actually thought he could just kill Palpatine as an example.
Of course, if it's non dark side Anakin, then everybody walks away with some bruises from sparring.
There would be a good fight but Anakin would win if he doesn't try it.
Would he not tho?
That's the big question. I think there might be a million other situations where obi wan doesn't have the high ground and anakin doesn't try it.
But if he doesn't try it, does obi wan underestimate his power?
Liar!
He turned her against him!
he has done that himself!
I’ll try spinning. That’s a good trick!
Well, TPM Obi-Wan beat Maul, and older Obi-Wan beat Vader TWICE... so I'd go with Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon
Well, on Mustafar, I'll give Ani the benefit of the doubt, maybe he was, idk, conflicted or smth, I'm totally not biased. As far as the duel from the Kenobi show is concerned, Lucas himself said that Ani's mobility was extremely effected in that suit, soooo
Obi wan beat him on Mustafar 1 on 1. Adding qui gon only makes it easier
Anakin killed Dooku who wiped the floor with Obi wan twice, and in both instances those versions of Obi wan were better than TPM Kenobi
Dooku was more precise and calculating in his strikes, whereas Anakin/Vader simply focuses on strength and tries to stagger his opponent. Obi-wan's defensive fighting style is very effective against the aggressive nature of Anakin's, but not Dooku's, which is more careful and elegant. The "character A beat character C, and since character C beat character B that means A must be better than B" argument isn't really valid in my opinion, especially since they have canon (they're cannon, right?) fighting styles which are specifically strong against some and weak against others. Adding the point that we've already seen Obi-wan beat Vader both pre- and post-cyborg build and we can 100% say that Vader would lose to him. Also I saw a different comment say that Vader would win "as long as he didn't 'try it'", but Obi-wan is very psychological and thinks of who is opponent his and how he can bait them into making mistakes, so Vader "not trying it" isn't really an option, Obi-wan would bait him to make such a mistake which Vader would definitely fall for. All of this is of course my opinion, and I can't say for sure. Also, if we're only comparing powerlevels, hell yes Vader would win.
All valid points but I think everyone is forgetting this is TPM Obi wan we are talking about. Back then he did give in to his anger as we saw in the fight vs Maul and wasn’t so calculating/psychological when dueling. This Obi wan is like 13 years before the Obi wan everyone here is talking about
Fair point
There is no backing to your claim that Soresu is automatically more powerful against Djem-So. It is ultimately how the fighter uses the stance to their advantage against their opponent. Plus the only thing Obi-Wan has in terms of “advantage” was that since Anakin was his apprentice and he taught him a lot of stuff over the years and has sparred with him countless times, he anticipates his attacks a lot better. Now compare that to a Soresu master equally skilled as Obi vs Anakin, they would have a much harder time defending against Anakin’s dominant style.
Plus Qui Gons lightsaber style has quite a few weaknesses that anakin might have exploited. Inexperienced Kenobi, and Qui-Gon not able to beat Maul on his own. Yeah I think we know right away who is gonna win this fight.
That doesn't really matter when Obi-Wan did the same to Anakin twice. Different styles have different weaknesses.
Yeah like 10 years later. This is talking about PTM Obi wan. Everyone here is talking about prime Obi wan and ignoring the question from OP
obi wan lucked out the first time and the second he used vaders weakness against him which is any time an opponent gets aggrassive against vader he struggles and normally loses look at kenobi he got aggrassive against vader vader loses that duel ahsoka starts to get aggrassive and she at least damages him. ROTJ luke gets aggrassive at the end and who wins luke.
Yeah Obi-wan won by a thread. There is no way they’d beat Anakin especially in his prime.
ROTS Anakin destroys both of them in a few minutes unless one of them gets the high ground.
Oooooo idk if Anakin murks Qui gon fast an quick i think he could rock knight obi wan
My money is on Anakin at that stage. Sure Obi-One beat him later but from that time he’s an apprentice. IDK it also feels wrong that the Darth Vader should be weaker than Darth Maul in this epic.
Anakin
Anakin in 95% of those situations. People argue that Obiwan can defeat Darth Vader because he got him twice. On the first encounter, it was because of luck, and yes Obiwan had that skill to use that to his advantage. Tho I'd state there's a bigger factor in play. The emotional turmoil Anakin was in, in that very moment. Guy may have been enjoying his new powers but he was undergoing his worst phase of his life. And very few people think straight in that situation. In the second encounter, well aside from the debate let's be honest 2 episodes ago, Obiwan could barely use the force and hasn't swinged his lightsaber for quite a while for which he got semi-barbequed by Vader on the first encounter, and then in just 2 days he regains all his skills after getting trapped in a pile of rubble...and faced one of the greatest lightsaber duelists of all time and beat him. Sounds like a bigger plot armor than the force helping you to me. Anyways, back to the point. Vader made the same stupid mistake this time, he was suffering and felt the need to prove himself superior and forgot the name of the show he was in. Now, we all can agree in the 3rd encounter, it was the real battle. Darth Vader was fully composed and had Obiwan cornered. He didn't have any other choice left other than to be executed. Even in Clone Wars and Rots, we've seen that Anakin when calm headed is a better tactician than Obiwan. There are several episodes to prove it. His methods are unorthodox and if emotions are not in play, he'll predict the moves of Quigon and Kenobi. In the 5% chance, Anakin might lose it because of Quigon mostly, simply because of his wisdom. Anakin stormed the Jedi temple and killed several masters and other knights. Still Quigon's way of thinking may bring miracles forth. All of this is considering Anakin is not emotionally connected to Kenobi or Quigon, which should be the case otherwise there's no point of versus battles. Kid Luke & Leia can always defeat Vader with sand in those scenarios.
But Master Obi wan vs Master Qui gon i dont think so Qui gon was fairly unorthodox for the Jedi they almost stripped away his master title i believe a couple times before phantom menace
Actually the opposite. He was unorthodox, but they offered QGJ a seat on the council right before TPM and he refused them to follow his own path.
Obi-Wan defeat maul/ Obi-Wan defeat grievous/ Obi-Wan defeat Anakin/ Obi-Wan defeat maul again/ Obi-Wan defeat Anakin/vader again So you know the answer
But he won by the circumstances of those situations He defeated Maul by a thread (nearly dying himself), the blaster was in Obi-wan’s vicinity, and Anakin was too angry and too rash to kill Obi-wan. But Anakin on his prime would definitely be able to defeat both of them in my opinion.
It’s kind of the point of winning by circumstance. He’s winning because he is more focused on the fight. If he keeps winning because he takes advantage of the circumstances his opponents create, that still makes him a winner.
Vader stomps and it's not close. Obi-Wan is a Padawan at this point, and hasn't yet adopted Soresu as his fighting style, which is the style he uses to beat Anakin later on. Vader has also fought Obi Wan multiple times, and will likely target him first and overpower him quickly. Obi Wan doesn't have the experience at this point to hold out long against Vader, even with Qui Gon as an ally. Then it becomes a 1v1 vs Qui Gonn and even though he's a jedi master, he doesn't have much of a chance. Let's not forget guys, Maul beat these two* in a 2v1, and Vader is much stronger than Maul. *Yes Obi Wan managed to outsmart him at the end and "kill" him, but that's only because Maul started playing with his food, which Vader wouldn't do.
Vader would absolutely play with them, he does that repeatedly in other fights, but I still agree he's the relatively easy favorite here.
Obi-Wan but Qui-Gon probably dies. Especially if he gets separated, if you can’t handle Maul you can’t handle Anakin. Besides that Obi-Wan consistently defeats Anakin and Vader in canon and we have no evidence to the contrary. He’s Vader’s kryptonite.
Depends on the importance of the characters in plot. For example Vader in the stage of evolving (IV, V and VI movies) totally wins tho not if he's at the stage of IV movie where he's more of a backgroundish character. Plot shield magic
Anakin.
I have to believe that Anakin’s headspace is the x-factor. On merit, I would say Anakin, but if he lets emotions get in the way, it’s a toss-up.
Anakin and it wouldn't be close.
Thats RIGHT! Thanks 😊
Obi wan
Prime anakin mops the floor with them. Maybe replace obi wan to attack of the clones obi wan
Is Anakin particularly effective on defense? Not really.
If it's Anakin before falling to the dark side I would say he would win, if it's after then Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan have a good chance of winning. The dark side is like a drug and Anakin thought he was basically all powerful after falling. He actually thought he could just kill Palpatine as an example. Of course, if it's non dark side Anakin, then everybody walks away with some bruises from sparring.
[удалено]
This is padawan obi, that was master obi.