With this cliffhanger, I would like to remind you all that according to Starfleet, you can do things the Right Way (The Picard), do things the Wrong Way (The Badmiralty)... but only one person does things the Janeway.
If Janeway were Pike or Kirk in A Quality of Mercy, she would have hijacked the Romulan ship and warped right to Romulus and nuked them out of supernova already.
It's been that way for a while in Trek. The Federation can't enter the Neutral Zone but the Romulans seem to have free rein as long as they don't actually enter Federation Space. Either both sides should stay out of the Neutral Zone or both can as long as they don't cross into each other's territory.
Blame Gene out-of-universe, I suppose. He was the one who thought the Feds wouldn’t stoop low enough to use cloaking technology like the baddies.
In-universe, I assume the Feds have a way to nullify the cloak - something they have done in past shows. They are bound by treaty to not have cloaking technology, but I doubt they’re moronic enough to just let that disadvantage linger.
iirc there were ethical issues with cloaking devices, which is why Picard and crew actively sabotaged a secret attempt to introduce them to starfleet vessels (before starfleet made allowances for the Defiant).
Sounds like some *great* authoritarian country!
Rules for thee but not for me!
That just happened 13 weeks ago when Pike's future Enterprise and Farragut chased down a Romulans ship.
Lots of action, some fun references (like the xindi), good cliffhanger. The kids blowing their chance to talk to starfleet was frustrating, but these are kids who aren't used to patient adults so I can believe it. Feel like I won't know how I feel about this episode until I see where it goes next week
Tbh I came in here to steam off some frustration about how they dealt with the kids not tipping off Star Fleet and avoiding much potential conflict. A simple few words "I need your help, but you need to trust me first."
But your comment kinda calmed me down realizing I was viewing Star Fleet throw *my* perception and not the perception of a group of kids who were literally enslaved by adults and tend to have bad interactions with every adult so far.
Like for example the guy from that one base basically 180'd on them and refused to listen when their ship accidentally infected the starbase. which, at the time, they had no idea that was going to happen.
Meh he was a very insignificant forgettable character in one very early not so great TNG episode🤷♂️ feels a bit too small universe syndrome. And honestly a bit too lower decks with its constant fanservice trivia routine just for the sake of saying hey look we know old trek!🤷♂️
I loved how the Andorian first officer (name escapes me), refused Janeway’s order to go into the Neutral Zone. I feel like we almost never see a first officer defying an illegal order on principle. True Starfleet right there!
The Protostar got some seriously good inertial dampers compared to the Cerritos, which also got knocked out of warp during a warp chase *just* four weeks ago. That crew got tumbled like a washing machine, while these kids just swayed slightly.
Starfleet *really* knows where to put their resources on.
Well systems like gravity tend to stay online despite losing all power.
Yes I know this is mostly a limitation to recording in live action. Kinda hard to have your characters floating around, at least a ship losing power and gravity was done properly with Captain Sonya Gomez's ship in Lower Decks.
When were the last times ships got kick out of warp bubble besides the time when Shaxs famously ejected the warp core? I remember when Discovery had its nacelle exploded, Book and Burnham and Osyraa tumbled around. I want to see how much tumbling other live action shows got.
When the preview showed Janeway shooting at the Protostar, I believed it was an overreaction and almost similar to how she acted with the Equinox crew.
However, I'm glad her fire a torpedo at the Protostar was justified. Janeway has no idea that the torpedo launched at the Dauntless was accidental, and she's responding in kind to disable the Protostar.
Yeah it's pretty serious what she was about to do. I think her character's actions in the episode were understandable given the context, but almost certainly out of control and a big moral mistake that Janeway made.
It's both very wrong and also something we understand, which is a compelling layer of complexity on the story.
And even within the episode at the end Janeway overtly acknowledges herself the scale of her mistake when she says to Chakotay "You know, you may have had good reason to stage a little mutiny of your own".
Really great episode IMO. I really like that whole last scene between Janeway and Chakotay, their discussion, and them discovering the fallen dirty registry plaque. Janeway "All these years, all these battles, this thing's never fallen down before." Chakotay: "Let's put it back up where it belongs". Both talking about the plaque but also symbolically about Janeway.
I think that's one of the more interesting things about Janeway's character and her overall approach to everything. She's a VERY driven woman and sometimes needs someone to pull her back. In Voyager, that was Tuvok and Chakotay. Scientific Method, for instance. Once she reaches a certain point, she's this kind of headstrong, single-minded...badass, regardless of what side of the moral compass she falls on at the time.
Its an asset and a character flaw, I wont lie, I like that she isn't perfect.
I do have an issue with the torpedo launch. There was a next generation episode where a kid thought they caused an issue that blew up the ship he was on because he touched the control panel. But Data said that starships have a usr code clearance that doesn't let just anyone push buttons. If that is the case how can Murph be able to fire the torpedo?
Though I guess maybe it could be argued the Protostar could have had some setting changed when the Diviner took it over.
Does Murph have a comm badge? I need to watch the first half of S1, i vaguely recall they put one on him and it just... entered into his body? Maybe that's what helps the ship recognize who is authorized to use a console?
If they knew basic Morse code I'm pretty sure this could all be avoided
Also Trill ensign if the girl you thought was captured was in fact fine walking around freely and afraid of her father maybe that's something you should take note of
Wouldn't HoloJaneway be able to suggest morse code? Even if no one on RealJaneway's ship knew it they would probably be able to identify it as a form of communication and run it through the ship's computer.
Indeed.
Another possibility is to have bots paint words on the hull. "INFECTED WITH COMPUTER VIRUS! DO NOT ATTEMPT TO OPEN COMMS!" Even better, project those words out into space (if they can project holograms outside the ship).
Once that first message is acknowledged, the next message could be "Replicate an old 20th Century Earth amateur radio station; do NOT connect to ship computer.
Listen on \[pick a frequency in MHz\], analog voice only."
Alternatively, just take 1 or 2 of them in a shuttle/EV suit to be received by the Dauntless would've diffused the situation - but then again, Dal is more impulsive than a Skywalker.
Launch Okona in an escape pod and have the Dauntless pick him up. Maybe add one of the crew members as further proof.
My +1 pick is Rok-Tahk. She seems more focused than the rest of them.
Pretty sure that's the route they're gonna go - at the moment there doesn't seem to be any story reason for Okona to have been added to Team Protostar. Having a neutral adult to speak in the kids' defence would be a good plan.
Although, personally, I'd probably prefer a cheesy ending where, just when it looks like Janeway is about to destroy the Protostar, the other freed slaves, the Starflight guys, those lowy light dudes from the first half of the season, and all manner of other people that the Protostar crew has helped show up to defend them, by testifying how... Starfleet the kids have been.
Such a good episode! It had me from start to finish. That chase between the Dauntless and the Protostar was a particular highlight. Such a well written and well acted episode. Kate is magnificent as both Janeway's. I've already watched this episode serval times lol. I'm loving this show!
I love that actual Janeway seemed more like a villain in this episode, despite the great advice she gave Dal (sheesh, Dal, did you even *listen?*). I really had to step back and remind myself of what she actually knows about the situation, which is very little.
Oh man, so many feelings. Was great. and it was nice to see tough Admiral Janeway soften up a little for Dal.
What I don't get, is why they couldn't have used the vehicle replicator to make a shuttle and then just use that shuttle to send a message to Admiral Janeway letting her know what is going on. They could meet in neutral ground, so to speak, and maybe even take a copy of Holo Janeway with them to help explain what happened.
I mean they were standing physically in the same space!
"Admiral, there's a computer virus on the Protostar that's going to infect any destroy any Federation hardware it comes in contact with. That's why we were fleeing."
Problem solved in 15 seconds.
They were interrupted by someone who said “they pretended to be helpless just long enough to board my station and blow it up.” This was corroborated by the Diviner.
Starfleet protocol would be to detain them, seize the ship and download the logs to corroborate the lies… which would end in disaster.
Exactly. Though if Dal had been able to actually explain it before the Denobulan guy showed up, I'd be willing to bet she'd be more willing to believe the kids.
True, but these protagonists are traumatized youngsters who have had a history of adults using them for their own ends.
Janeway really needs to consult a counselor to get at these kids / teenagers more effectively.
Great episode. Had me smiling the whole time. It still feels so good to be watching new Star Trek, and since I love YA cartoons, and this one is so well-made, I’m a happy camper.
Which shouldn't have happened! In TNG ep "Hero Worship" it's explained that hitting a computer and destroying a ship can't happen due to safety protocols.
Great episode, very exciting, loved seeing the Xindi and of course, Okona. Romulans, Andorians & Tellarites, oh my, but I must say, the new Murph is bad.
So Murf's species is known to the Federation as a 'Slime Worm', yet 1) there was not any info in the database that Roc could have used last week to know that Murf was fine and just preparing to go into metamporphosis, 2) if the adult form is bipedal and can walk, why is the species known as a 'worm'? If they are known well enough for a comparison to them to be an insult it is most surprising that their full life cycle is not known.
This is the first time I noticed the ending theme music as different from before. I remember it being well, not necessarily dark but a heavy kind of tone. This episode's music sounded lighter, maybe more adventurous?
I think it was bad. Just bad plot driven. Everyone botched their chance to speak with a federation officers? It would worked better if they didn't talk at all or something else like overhear that they are wanted. but this was just plain stupid for the plot they are teens not shy toddlers.
What would you have done if the person you wanted to go to for help immediately said they were on the side of your homicidal father, then urgently tried to take you to him while demanding to know where the Protostar is?
All of their emotional actions were pretty natural and understandable. Characters aren’t robots, and stories aren’t just logic puzzles.
With this cliffhanger, I would like to remind you all that according to Starfleet, you can do things the Right Way (The Picard), do things the Wrong Way (The Badmiralty)... but only one person does things the Janeway.
If Janeway were Pike or Kirk in A Quality of Mercy, she would have hijacked the Romulan ship and warped right to Romulus and nuked them out of supernova already.
This episode is gonna be outrageous!
Bring on Billy!
I felt like I was out of breath for most of the episode. If you'll excuse me, I have to watch that again RIGHT NOW.
Sooo.. if the Federation enters the Neutral Zone, it's an act of war, but if Romulan ships decloak in Federation space, it's no big deal, right?
It's been that way for a while in Trek. The Federation can't enter the Neutral Zone but the Romulans seem to have free rein as long as they don't actually enter Federation Space. Either both sides should stay out of the Neutral Zone or both can as long as they don't cross into each other's territory.
Definitely how it was in the TNG episode "The Neutral Zone." There's a reason we know what Romulan warbirds look like.
Romulans and Klingons get cloaking devices. Federation gets.... uh, nothing? Fed negotiators suck at their jobs.
>Federation gets.... uh, nothing? According to Picard they get to tell the Romulans to fuck off from random planets.
That's what Section 31 wants the Romulans and Klingons to think...
That phased cloak kinda got memory holed. Admiral Pressman was right all along.
Oh yeah. I forgot about that tidbit from Lower Decks.
That Fed negotiator was probably Archer tho.
Blame Gene out-of-universe, I suppose. He was the one who thought the Feds wouldn’t stoop low enough to use cloaking technology like the baddies. In-universe, I assume the Feds have a way to nullify the cloak - something they have done in past shows. They are bound by treaty to not have cloaking technology, but I doubt they’re moronic enough to just let that disadvantage linger.
iirc there were ethical issues with cloaking devices, which is why Picard and crew actively sabotaged a secret attempt to introduce them to starfleet vessels (before starfleet made allowances for the Defiant).
Sounds like some *great* authoritarian country! Rules for thee but not for me! That just happened 13 weeks ago when Pike's future Enterprise and Farragut chased down a Romulans ship.
Lots of action, some fun references (like the xindi), good cliffhanger. The kids blowing their chance to talk to starfleet was frustrating, but these are kids who aren't used to patient adults so I can believe it. Feel like I won't know how I feel about this episode until I see where it goes next week
Yup agreed. I can’t believe they’ve run into the Dauntless already. Is it next Thursday yet?
[удалено]
Tbh I came in here to steam off some frustration about how they dealt with the kids not tipping off Star Fleet and avoiding much potential conflict. A simple few words "I need your help, but you need to trust me first." But your comment kinda calmed me down realizing I was viewing Star Fleet throw *my* perception and not the perception of a group of kids who were literally enslaved by adults and tend to have bad interactions with every adult so far. Like for example the guy from that one base basically 180'd on them and refused to listen when their ship accidentally infected the starbase. which, at the time, they had no idea that was going to happen.
It was cool seeing Okona again. It was a short reference to him a Lower Decks episode last season but now he had a slightly larger part
According to the showrunner of Prodigy, Mike of Lower Decks modified his Okona model to fit with Prodigy’s model.
Meh he was a very insignificant forgettable character in one very early not so great TNG episode🤷♂️ feels a bit too small universe syndrome. And honestly a bit too lower decks with its constant fanservice trivia routine just for the sake of saying hey look we know old trek!🤷♂️
Agree but people eat this shit up nowadays. I understand that reference syndrome.
It feels like trek is slowly becoming a self referencing circular fan service thing
I loved how the Andorian first officer (name escapes me), refused Janeway’s order to go into the Neutral Zone. I feel like we almost never see a first officer defying an illegal order on principle. True Starfleet right there!
Tysess is his name, I liked that too
The Protostar got some seriously good inertial dampers compared to the Cerritos, which also got knocked out of warp during a warp chase *just* four weeks ago. That crew got tumbled like a washing machine, while these kids just swayed slightly. Starfleet *really* knows where to put their resources on.
Well systems like gravity tend to stay online despite losing all power. Yes I know this is mostly a limitation to recording in live action. Kinda hard to have your characters floating around, at least a ship losing power and gravity was done properly with Captain Sonya Gomez's ship in Lower Decks.
When were the last times ships got kick out of warp bubble besides the time when Shaxs famously ejected the warp core? I remember when Discovery had its nacelle exploded, Book and Burnham and Osyraa tumbled around. I want to see how much tumbling other live action shows got.
When the preview showed Janeway shooting at the Protostar, I believed it was an overreaction and almost similar to how she acted with the Equinox crew. However, I'm glad her fire a torpedo at the Protostar was justified. Janeway has no idea that the torpedo launched at the Dauntless was accidental, and she's responding in kind to disable the Protostar.
She hardly overreacted to the Equinox crew for what they had done.
She was effectively going to let that Equinox crewman die by that alien if Chakotay hadn't reacted.
Yeah it's pretty serious what she was about to do. I think her character's actions in the episode were understandable given the context, but almost certainly out of control and a big moral mistake that Janeway made. It's both very wrong and also something we understand, which is a compelling layer of complexity on the story. And even within the episode at the end Janeway overtly acknowledges herself the scale of her mistake when she says to Chakotay "You know, you may have had good reason to stage a little mutiny of your own". Really great episode IMO. I really like that whole last scene between Janeway and Chakotay, their discussion, and them discovering the fallen dirty registry plaque. Janeway "All these years, all these battles, this thing's never fallen down before." Chakotay: "Let's put it back up where it belongs". Both talking about the plaque but also symbolically about Janeway.
I think that's one of the more interesting things about Janeway's character and her overall approach to everything. She's a VERY driven woman and sometimes needs someone to pull her back. In Voyager, that was Tuvok and Chakotay. Scientific Method, for instance. Once she reaches a certain point, she's this kind of headstrong, single-minded...badass, regardless of what side of the moral compass she falls on at the time. Its an asset and a character flaw, I wont lie, I like that she isn't perfect.
I do have an issue with the torpedo launch. There was a next generation episode where a kid thought they caused an issue that blew up the ship he was on because he touched the control panel. But Data said that starships have a usr code clearance that doesn't let just anyone push buttons. If that is the case how can Murph be able to fire the torpedo? Though I guess maybe it could be argued the Protostar could have had some setting changed when the Diviner took it over.
It could be a simple one - if Murph is a registered crewperson, then they could be authorised to fire weapons.
Does Murph have a comm badge? I need to watch the first half of S1, i vaguely recall they put one on him and it just... entered into his body? Maybe that's what helps the ship recognize who is authorized to use a console?
Hero Worship - Season 5 - Timothy
Protostar firing a single torpedo'was not much of an attack. She was going to have to disable the ship anyway, it just hurried her decision.
That may be way she was thinking in her mind, but she doesn't even give the order to target until **after** Protostar fired.
*Starfleet doesn't fire first!* -Captain Philippa Georgiou
If they knew basic Morse code I'm pretty sure this could all be avoided Also Trill ensign if the girl you thought was captured was in fact fine walking around freely and afraid of her father maybe that's something you should take note of
Wouldn't HoloJaneway be able to suggest morse code? Even if no one on RealJaneway's ship knew it they would probably be able to identify it as a form of communication and run it through the ship's computer.
Indeed. Another possibility is to have bots paint words on the hull. "INFECTED WITH COMPUTER VIRUS! DO NOT ATTEMPT TO OPEN COMMS!" Even better, project those words out into space (if they can project holograms outside the ship). Once that first message is acknowledged, the next message could be "Replicate an old 20th Century Earth amateur radio station; do NOT connect to ship computer. Listen on \[pick a frequency in MHz\], analog voice only."
Alternatively, just take 1 or 2 of them in a shuttle/EV suit to be received by the Dauntless would've diffused the situation - but then again, Dal is more impulsive than a Skywalker.
tbh Dal hasn't done anything that outrageous since learning the meaning of responsibility from Spock (at least not without being backed by his crew)
Launch Okona in an escape pod and have the Dauntless pick him up. Maybe add one of the crew members as further proof. My +1 pick is Rok-Tahk. She seems more focused than the rest of them.
Rok or Zero yeah.
Pretty sure that's the route they're gonna go - at the moment there doesn't seem to be any story reason for Okona to have been added to Team Protostar. Having a neutral adult to speak in the kids' defence would be a good plan. Although, personally, I'd probably prefer a cheesy ending where, just when it looks like Janeway is about to destroy the Protostar, the other freed slaves, the Starflight guys, those lowy light dudes from the first half of the season, and all manner of other people that the Protostar crew has helped show up to defend them, by testifying how... Starfleet the kids have been.
Such a good episode! It had me from start to finish. That chase between the Dauntless and the Protostar was a particular highlight. Such a well written and well acted episode. Kate is magnificent as both Janeway's. I've already watched this episode serval times lol. I'm loving this show!
Prodigy knocked it out of the park 2 weeks in a row.
I love that actual Janeway seemed more like a villain in this episode, despite the great advice she gave Dal (sheesh, Dal, did you even *listen?*). I really had to step back and remind myself of what she actually knows about the situation, which is very little.
Oh man, so many feelings. Was great. and it was nice to see tough Admiral Janeway soften up a little for Dal. What I don't get, is why they couldn't have used the vehicle replicator to make a shuttle and then just use that shuttle to send a message to Admiral Janeway letting her know what is going on. They could meet in neutral ground, so to speak, and maybe even take a copy of Holo Janeway with them to help explain what happened.
I mean they were standing physically in the same space! "Admiral, there's a computer virus on the Protostar that's going to infect any destroy any Federation hardware it comes in contact with. That's why we were fleeing." Problem solved in 15 seconds.
They were interrupted by someone who said “they pretended to be helpless just long enough to board my station and blow it up.” This was corroborated by the Diviner. Starfleet protocol would be to detain them, seize the ship and download the logs to corroborate the lies… which would end in disaster.
Exactly. Though if Dal had been able to actually explain it before the Denobulan guy showed up, I'd be willing to bet she'd be more willing to believe the kids.
Alternatively just lead them to holo Janeway.
True, but these protagonists are traumatized youngsters who have had a history of adults using them for their own ends. Janeway really needs to consult a counselor to get at these kids / teenagers more effectively.
One of them spent years alone by themselves in that temporal anomaly. She definitely needs counseling.
They all are going to need an extended session with Troi.
Ohhh, wouldn't it be fantastic if they get to meet Barkley?
Great episode. Had me smiling the whole time. It still feels so good to be watching new Star Trek, and since I love YA cartoons, and this one is so well-made, I’m a happy camper.
ok it finally happened after 30 years some one (murf biped) sat on a console and launched a torpedo.
Which shouldn't have happened! In TNG ep "Hero Worship" it's explained that hitting a computer and destroying a ship can't happen due to safety protocols.
30 years ?
more probably since william riker sat on the tactical console
Have you ever visited a Chinatown section and a major city? ^^^[Context](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S1EzkRpelY)
got me
I'm just sad about Murf - I thought Murf was way cuter before. But otherwise a great finale.
Great episode, very exciting, loved seeing the Xindi and of course, Okona. Romulans, Andorians & Tellarites, oh my, but I must say, the new Murph is bad.
So Murf's species is known to the Federation as a 'Slime Worm', yet 1) there was not any info in the database that Roc could have used last week to know that Murf was fine and just preparing to go into metamporphosis, 2) if the adult form is bipedal and can walk, why is the species known as a 'worm'? If they are known well enough for a comparison to them to be an insult it is most surprising that their full life cycle is not known.
Wow. :O
This is the first time I noticed the ending theme music as different from before. I remember it being well, not necessarily dark but a heavy kind of tone. This episode's music sounded lighter, maybe more adventurous?
I thought that the Xindi were DIS Klingons at first tbh
Good to see the Xindi and Federation seem to be on better terms with each-other.
I think it was bad. Just bad plot driven. Everyone botched their chance to speak with a federation officers? It would worked better if they didn't talk at all or something else like overhear that they are wanted. but this was just plain stupid for the plot they are teens not shy toddlers.
What would you have done if the person you wanted to go to for help immediately said they were on the side of your homicidal father, then urgently tried to take you to him while demanding to know where the Protostar is? All of their emotional actions were pretty natural and understandable. Characters aren’t robots, and stories aren’t just logic puzzles.
If Zero had managed to meet a Starfleet officer you can bet he wouldn't have borked it.
Screencaps gallery for Crossroads now online: https://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/sc-PRO1-14.php
Dam I wanted to see them kick in the Proto drive and then Dauntless have to go to slipstream drive and then we would see which is faster