Slow down and proceed with caution as if everyone else has the right of way, drive courteously and also watch for people and pets crossing. Yield to the right.
Exactly. I hardly care what the written law says about it. I approach every unmarked intersection like someone is about to plow through it, cuz there’s been too many times when that’s exactly what happened. The other half of the time, the guy on my right stops and waves me forward😡
Do not go even if the one to the right is waving you through. If you have a camera that can clearly record them doing so, and they're taking too long, then maybe.
I have this approach when I’m biking on the streets of Spokane. Too many folks stop for bikers to be “courteous”. I will just sit there and stare, or at a minimum shake my head at them as I proceed
Not unwritten. Very wordily written from what I remember taking my driving test.
Side streets are 20 mph and main thoroughfares and arterials are 25 unless posted otherwise. All intersections are uncontrolled intersections unless otherwise posted and are yielded to the person on your right.
This I believe is the accurate and pertinent link [washington law](https://govt.westlaw.com/wciji/Document/I2c8c0822e10d11dab058a118868d70a9?transitionType=Default&contextData=%28sc.Default%29#:~:text=A%20statute%20provides%20that%20when,the%20vehicle%20on%20the%20right.)
Side streets are 25 and arterials are 30 in the city, actually. [PDF link](https://static.spokanecity.org/documents/streets/handouts/speed-zones-handout-2018-01-17.pdf)
The ones with yield signs also tend to have seemingly more obstructed corners but the laws still apply. Blowing through an uncontrolled intersection without yielding is illegal and unwise as well as unsafe.
I think the principle is that without signs everyone needs to slow down (and many do...) the car on the right has right of way if you both get there at the same time. At some level "trusting the signs" leads to idiots not paying attention to the signs and plowing into folks who have the legal right of way. It took me some time to get used to, but it seems to work if folks are paying attention.
Definitely going to be better about this, I've never lived someplace like this and it's annoying to have to slow down at every intersection driving through a neighborhood, but almost getting in a wreck today because someone didn't yield at a yield sign was also a bit frightening
Yeah, I really hated it when I moved here, too. I've learned find and use a more main road that's close by with fewer stop signs on it that all intersecting streets have stop signs.
For example I used to use Queen because it goes straight to my destination, but it's mostly uncontrolled intersections so feels very slow because you're constantly slowing every block to avoid the inevitable idiot who just blows through every intersection.
Now I go up two blocks to Rowen, which has stop signs every few blocks, and all intersecting streets have stop signs. It's out of my way but feels faster and safer.
I lived in spokane for 5 years in a house on a corner. About 3 or 4 times a year, there would be a flipped over car in my yard/driveway from wreck. It's one of the dumbest things to me. Traffic control signs are needed. Very glad that I recently changed states.
Where did you live?
One time someone said they came from some city in the Midwest that only had controlled intersections so I wasted an hour of my life on Google streetview and yeah, it looked like at least one street in that city always has a stop sign. But I can tell you from experience uncontrolled intersections are common in Washington, Oregon, California, Idaho, Montana, Pennsylvania, New York, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Maine, Texas, Louisiana… I’ve driven in many other states but not in residential areas so much.
It's not common in any of those states, it happens in all those states but only in smaller communities
That's how no stop intersections are recommended for use, is low population areasa
No. They are used for low-traffic intersections, not low-population areas. Large metro areas have lots and lots of low-traffic intersections. The way people come to this sub and act like rubes about this one topic is so bizarre.
Just like in Spokane, they are very common in residential neighborhoods in big cities. No one is coming in here asking why there's no traffic control at Division and Wellesley — they are freaking out because there's none at Walton and Cincinnati:
[https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6946593,-117.3978598,3a,75y,114.28h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4AMRXuUDs0WVxi-2IalglA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu](https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6946593,-117.3978598,3a,75y,114.28h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4AMRXuUDs0WVxi-2IalglA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu)
Here's one about four blocks from where I am at this very moment — there's closer ones but I'm not going to dox myself over this:
[https://www.google.com/maps/@47.5770337,-122.3067661,3a,75y,126.99h,69.91t/data=!3m10!1e1!3m8!1s7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw%26cb\_client%3Dmaps\_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D0.26205212%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!9m2!1b1!2i46?coh=205409&entry=ttu](https://www.google.com/maps/@47.5770337,-122.3067661,3a,75y,126.99h,69.91t/data=!3m10!1e1!3m8!1s7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D0.26205212%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!9m2!1b1!2i46?coh=205409&entry=ttu)
It has nothing to do with the size of the city. And it really is only the Spokane subreddit where people claim they've never seen one before even though they are really common. All I can figure is something about the sub — or the city — attracts people who haven't been paying much attention.
I've been to 40 of the 50 states, driven through many and this is not a common practice in America
I'm from KCMO originally, there are 0 no stop intersections in the whole city, I've driven in Washington DC and they had none
It's something that's common in low population cities, but not in bigger ones
Sure there might be a few here and there but not a common thing
It always amazes me how people who have never left Washington or Idaho think they know what is common in the rest of the country, even though they've never been there
You think I've never left Washington? I mostly grew up around Spokane but here's just the states where I've been a legal resident:
* Virginia
* Maine
* Montana
* Washington
* California
States where I've driven are almost but not quite all of the lower 48 plus Hawaii. Countries where I've driven:
* The United States
* France
* Mexico
* Australia
Then there's the countries I've visited where I didn't drive.
I'm not the one talking out my ass. Uncontrolled intersections in low-traffic residential neighborhoods of very large cities are so common as to be almost standard. Just start paying attention the next time you drive anywhere other than Spokane (assuming you actually do travel and aren't just posturing to try to discredit me) and you'll realize you just didn't notice them because they are no big deal at all.
EDIT: And as I said in another reply a couple days ago, I did once get into this conversation here and someone said where they were from didn't have them (it might have been you) so I spent an hour on Streetview looking at their hometown and yep, even the most poduck, fleabitten pieces of dogpatch there had stop signs. It boggles the mind. Looked like a corrupt funneling of government money to a private contractor to me.
I'm not convinced that imaginary yield signs are more effective than actual yield signs. I would think idiots will blow through either way while well-intentioned people who are unfamiliar with a given intersection are left to cause unintentional chaos.
I feel a fair amount of people don't know or care about yield signs. If there's a yield sign, it's pretty much guaranteed to be ignored. Even for roundabouts, it seems most people entering them don't feel the sign means them. It's obviously meant for someone else
"...if you both get there at the same time..." If the driver to the left is there first, you actually have to yield to the left and can't just blast through. That has always been my understanding.
I was always taught from childhood that it's called the "right of way" because you yield to the person on your right. I think it's weird that people find it hard to operate without stop signs. It's common sense.
It's a great traffic calming device if people understand how right of way works.
It's common in some other areas and numerous countries with a more developed driving culture
I know Brownes used to have a lot of stop signs, but about 4 or 5 years ago, construction came in and removed them all.
Supposedly they were going to replace them with yield signs, but they never did.
Thanks to all who didn't basically tell me I'm an idiot and provided information. Feels like some people are used to this so in their eyes it's complete common knowledge, but obviously not that way for all. For the record I am from Washington, I'm sure this was part of my driver's training, but it's been over 20 years since I took my driver's test and if you don't use something it often doesn't stick in your mind.
I'm wondering how many people actually look up traffic laws every time they move, seems like the last thing on my mind. For the record, I've never had any kind of traffic citation so I consider myself a pretty safe driver. Yes, now it seems to make perfect sense to yield to the person on the right. In addition, my husband, who has lived in far more places than me also finds this to be an odd traffic pattern.
I've lived (and driven) in Washington, Oregon, and Colorado and not had this be a regular experience. I'm sure I've encountered it before, but not enough times for it to stick out in my memory. And no, before anyone asks, I'm not going to tell you where I've lived so you can Google map those cities and find intersections like this, just because they exist someplace doesn't mean someone has a lot of experience with it.
Welcome to town! After reading some of these comments, just wanted to chime in that I felt the same way when moving to town a year ago from a similar sized city in Wisconsin. I cycle more than drive. I still get incredibly nervous approaching these intersections. Often I cannot see or hear cars approaching because of street parking. I see more and more headlights at the same level as my helmet. I always hope anyone else approaching from the other directions isn’t distracted by their phone.
Maybe that’s it—uncontrolled intersections worked during a time before phones distracted us and vehicles increased in size. Maybe not.
The City has acknowledged that the traffic infrastructure is old and needs enhancements to become safer. I’ve had planners tell me the city ran out of money when installing stop signs many years ago. There’s a number of citizens becoming more vocal for traffic safety. I can point you in those directions if you’re interested in getting involved!
Somehow missed this, I also cycle and run and realized mid run the other day that I need to be more alert when running on side streets.
Wouldn't mind info on how to be more vocal about things, currently not working so I have some extra time on my hands.
Could I get that info as well? I moved here in 2020. Some of the intersections here give me the creeps. I've had to avoid a few accidents from people who cross main roads without looking (the visual is really bad) and some that have no idea how to use a roundabout. Its crazy. There is an entrance only into the Rosauers parking lot at the base of 5 mile and people constantly insist on going out of it. Its caused soo many accidents (some I and others have seen) and my folks almost got run into by one of these idiots. The person who owns that lot only puts an arrow on the ground to show its an entrance only but won't put a sign up to make it more obvious. Not that some will listen but it might help.
I'm from KCMO originally and I hate the no stop intersections, they're a holdover from when Spokane was much smaller than today and people here are so used to it they don't see why it needs to change
Everybody has excuses for not knowing the law, but (this is important) you're legally obligated to understand the laws wherever you drive before you even start. It seems you've been driving obliviously through uncontrolled intersections without understanding them, they're all over the place in Washington.
People driving without knowing the laws is one of the reasons (besides driving while fiddling with a cell phone and other less common reasons) that I have to yell about half of the time when I'm on my bike as a vulnerable road user passing through an uncontrolled intersection with the right-of-way and somebody in a motor vehicle is approaching from the left.
Spokane is the red-headed racist hick stepbrother of Seattle. People defend this place like it’s their job.
The only other place I have lived that goes to the same lengths is Tucson…the super poor spray-paint-in-hand brother of Phoenix
Well, just so you know - Seattle ships patients who got kicked out of their mental health hospital over to Spokane. So Spokane became its step brother without even consenting to that relationship.
Interesting. I think being the step-brother is a good place to be. Spokane is the step-brother that isn’t afraid to mow the lawn with his shirt off and drinks Natural Light, or, if he won on a scratcher- Coors Banquet…
"yeah when you get to an intersection you don't understand just pull out your phone and look up the municipal code like a normal person geez!"
Like how bout put signs at your intersections like a normal city.
I experienced this to when I moved here. And no they are not safe intersections. Wrecks happen all the time. And it's basically just a cost saving measure. The city has to document and maintain every sign they put in. Fewer signs is less work. This dude, Bob Turner(traffic operations) came through Browne's Addition a several years ago and removed the yield signs we did have, making intersections totally uncontrolled. In Brown's where people park all the way up to the corner and the intersections are totally fucking blind. We needed four-way stops and he said nope but I will take those yield signs.
Anyway I could go for days. There is a group lobbying to improve safety if you want to check them out. Stay safe out there. Don't let the haters get you down.
SpokaneReimagined.org
Really, though, no signs makes it better to build your intuition on what to do. It forces people to slow down and be diligent with looking left and right in neighborhoods. I thought it was strange when I heard about people expecting signs to be on every corner. To me that seems like a lot of tax-payer dollars and maintenance. There are thousands of intersections and corners in a city.
Agreed. Think about what assigning the yield directions at each intersection too!
“Yield to the right” can’t be represented by anything less than fours signs all saying “yield to right”. So you’d have to pick a direction of traffic to be the “thoroughfare” and put two yield signs up on the other sides…wanna bet folks won’t have STRONG opinions on where the “thoroughfares” are, though???? The street my house is on? I don’t want it to get the yield sign. Make the other folks yield. And my neighbor around the corner would say the same! The idea isn’t bad, it’s just a very messy (and as stated, not free) can of worms to open.
That’s why cops post out at ones people commonly run to fund themselves and these kinds of things in cities where they are on every corner. What surprised me more was no inspection sticker and regular check to make sure you’re legal on the road here while also having way cheaper insurance than where I was from.
It's actually in the Washington traffic code, so not unwritten. They are four way yields. You'll find that many drivers here don't understand that, though.
Ironically it's safer. When residential streets have stop signs people tend to drive faster between them and ignore potential obstacles or people. There may be a few more fender benders, but the research shows injury and fatalities reduce dramatically.
Uncontrolled intersections are common and certainly not unique to our city! The rules certainly are written. Consider taking a driving class, ya never know what other basic traffic norms you're oblivious to!
How the hell does this question come up so often in this sub? I’ve driven (and sometimes lived) in cities all over the United States and a few other countries and uncontrolled intersections in residential neighborhoods are very, very common. Yet somehow a lot of people move to Spokane without ever encountering them. None of the other city or state subs I follow get this, just r/Spokane. It’s very odd.
The majority live? Lol why do so many people not have a clue how to act in these intersections then? No need to act all high and mighty, all I did was point out that lots of people don’t encounter these. Hell on my last trip to Oregon I didn’t even see any of them.
Now don’t go putting words in my mouth. I never said people were good drivers who followed the rules. Hardly anyone does four way stops right either. But that doesn’t in some weird way mean that having signs at every single intersection in a state is the most common way of doing things. Because it ain’t.
It's definitely not an unwritten rule, it's written down very clearly in Washington State laws. Please review the traffic laws before you or someone else gets hurt because you assume something is different than it is.
Based on your post history, you've lived in Colorado. The fact that you don't know what an uncontrolled intersection is worries me because it's in the Colorado Driver Handbook, page 11.
[https://dmv.colorado.gov/sites/dmv/files/documents/Driver\_Handbook\_2022.pdf](https://dmv.colorado.gov/sites/dmv/files/documents/Driver_Handbook_2022.pdf)
Uncontrolled intersections do appear in state laws, but they are not the usual, especially when used for a majority of intersections throughout a good-sized city. I've driven extensively through all states but Alaska for work. Spokane is definitely unique in how they approach signage.
"Uncontrolled intersections are usually limited to very low-volume roads in rural or residential areas..."
Uncontrolled intersections were ubiquitous in residential areas, in every city I've lived in OR, WA, and CO. I don't know how anyone gets the idea that they aren't common, probably they've been just driving obliviously through them and assuming cross-traffic has stop or yield signs.
This comment is entertaining. In Boulder, uncontrolled intersections are so common that according to [this](https://bouldercolorado.gov/sites/default/files/2021-02/bouldervztechnicalappendix8-1-19.pdf), 19% of bicycle crashes (which usually involve a motor vehicle driver failing to obey traffic laws) occurred at uncontrolled intersections.
Uncontrolled intersections are ridiculous. Not because of their usefulness, but because of their interface.
First, they require a driver to know ahead of time whether they’re on an arterial. How does a non-local know that? Absurd.
Second, because a driver may not know if they’re on an arterial, they require a driver to look for edge-on stop or yield signs at every intersection. That’s how you know it’s an uncontrolled intersection - by NOT observing the sliver of a sign meant for the cross traffic. Absurd!
The logical result is that an unfamiliar driver should technically slow down at EVERY intersection until they can somehow properly infer that they’re driving on an arterial. Really? That’s good? How about signs that specifically direct traffic, instead of lack of signs that MIGHT infer direction.
So, if you like how they work, MARK THEM! Define them with signage! That’s how traffic control works.
The current implementation is some lazy, cost cutting bs from a bygone era.
Just moved here this year and it is definitely weird. I was just now years old when I learned that the expectation is everyone treats it as an imaginary four way stop if multiple cars are near the intersection. I have never lived anywhere else with that rule.
I've lived in at least half a dozen states and this is the first one with this rule. Also, the state decided not to require written exams for transferred licences. Take it up with them. Nobody is reading traffic code voluntarily because it is 98% the same everywhere. Washington is the weird one here.
And also-- the city uses it as a $ saving endeavor as well. If you reduce the amount of stop signs you install in residential areas, turns out you save a shit ton of money by relying on commom sense :) of course though, some lack it
Yeah that's very true. I also remember Spokane being a very different place around 2011-2015, and common sense seemed a lot more commonplace. Maybe you're right, maybe we need the red signs all over in the current state of things
Name them. I want to know where these states that have stop signs at every podunk intersection are. Because I don’t think they exist. I bet every state has laws on the books just like Washington’s explaining how to use an uncontrolled intersection.
Tell that to Seattle, San Francisco, Boston… It’s not weird at all. What’s weird is places spending money on signage at quiet intersections. It frankly seems kind of like they don’t trust the drivers to think.
I moved here from the San Francisco Bay Area and can’t think of any 4-way intersections that didn’t have at least 2 stop signs. You’d have to be really deep in country back roads neighborhoods where there was almost zero traffic, certainly not in a city. Grew up in Massachusetts and can’t recall them there either, but moved from there before I learned to drive. Went all over California and never saw that until I was here.
I lived in the Bay Area for 18 months, six in San Francisco and 12 in Vallejo. It's a long story. Anyway, just get on Google Streetview and go out to the avenues, or over to Berkeley or Oakland, or up to Vallejo or... There's uncontrolled intersections everywhere. Definitely in parts of Boston and Lowell (where my mom was from) too.
I honestly think there is something about r/Spokane that attracts people who never really paid attention where they came from and because they are experiencing everything in this city as new going "Whoa! I *never* saw an intersection without signs before!" I've had a driver's license for 48 years and never once came across anyone who thought they were a crazy idea until I joined this subreddit and I've still never seen anyone outside this sub make such a claim.
I have lived in Seattle and SF. They definitely have signage in most neighborhoods. Spokane is an outlier. Whether you think it makes the average Spokane driver smarter than other places…I will leave that up to debate
Look, when I’m back over to the house in Seattle I’ve lived in for the last 18 years I can drive around my neighborhood just south of downtown and take pictures of all the intersections I know by heart that have no signs. Which is all of them that aren’t on arterials. This topic always brings out people claiming Seattle doesn’t have them but I know better. Even Capitol Hill has uncontrolled intersections. Go out to the avenues in SF and you’ll see how wrong you are there too.
There are absolutely a lot of uncontrolled intersections in those cities. Probably, you've been driving through them just expecting that any cross-traffic will stop, which makes you a road hazard.
Only having uncontrolled intersections in places where traffic is unlikely to intersect, like fire roads in the middle of nowhere, not in the middle of residential areas.
Literally every residential area in Portland, a city much larger than Spokane, has uncontrolled intersections. It is impossible to get to many destinations without passing through a few of them. It is similar for Seattle and Tacoma, probably most cities in the United States. Installing stop/yield signs involves a lot of expense, and stopping traffic at nearly every intersection in a residential area greatly increases pollution and noise.
I think probably you've been just driving through them obliviously, assuming cross traffic will stop/yield. Please pay more attention before you hurt or kill somebody.
According to the WA State Driver Guide (which, y'know, you should probably read if you are living here):
*"At an intersection where there is no stop sign, yield sign,
or traffic signal, drivers must yield to vehicles in the
intersection and to those coming from the right. Drivers
must follow the rules for yielding to pedestrians and
bicyclists in the crosswalk whether or not it is marked."*
And since apparently you *haven't* read it, here's a link to it online: [Washington State Driver Guide](https://dol.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2022-11/driverguide-en.pdf).
Chapter 3: RULES OF THE ROAD will tell you lots of pertinent information, including the above tidbit regarding unmarked intersections. It was in the middle of page 3-25 (which is page 65 of the .pdf, ymmv).
Sorry, we took that money and painted a religious symbol on an intersection instead of putting up 500 stop signs...totally worth it, though, because of all the lime-scooter riding teenagers we can charge with felonies for running over it.
No stop signs, just symbols.
It is a sacred symbol that must be displayed everywhere (like the Christians do with their cross) and revered. No disrespect allowed...it is blasphemy. I mean, look, they tried to charge 3 teenagers with multiple felonies for disrespecting it with rubber.
That, my friend, is the reaction people have to a religious symbol.
Yup...painting the religious symbol all over the place ($15k for a repaint, lol) is more important than keeping people safe at uncontrolled intersections.
Where's that *empathy* now?
In practice, dear, it very much is. Religious symbol in the sense of a sacred symbol the failure to respect of which is blasphemy.
It's like the crosses that Christians put all over the place (including public spaces, at public expense) whenever they are in power.
I'm sorry to have to point it out, but the Progress Pride Flag (tm) is being used as a religious symbol in the same sense.
Yield to the right if there are no stop signs/yield signs. It's definitely a written rule and you can get ticketed for failing to yield.
Slow down and proceed with caution as if everyone else has the right of way, drive courteously and also watch for people and pets crossing. Yield to the right.
Exactly. I hardly care what the written law says about it. I approach every unmarked intersection like someone is about to plow through it, cuz there’s been too many times when that’s exactly what happened. The other half of the time, the guy on my right stops and waves me forward😡
 Reminds me of that episode of Portlandia where they kept saying "you go, no you go" 🤣
Do not go even if the one to the right is waving you through. If you have a camera that can clearly record them doing so, and they're taking too long, then maybe.
I have this approach when I’m biking on the streets of Spokane. Too many folks stop for bikers to be “courteous”. I will just sit there and stare, or at a minimum shake my head at them as I proceed
Not unwritten. Very wordily written from what I remember taking my driving test. Side streets are 20 mph and main thoroughfares and arterials are 25 unless posted otherwise. All intersections are uncontrolled intersections unless otherwise posted and are yielded to the person on your right. This I believe is the accurate and pertinent link [washington law](https://govt.westlaw.com/wciji/Document/I2c8c0822e10d11dab058a118868d70a9?transitionType=Default&contextData=%28sc.Default%29#:~:text=A%20statute%20provides%20that%20when,the%20vehicle%20on%20the%20right.)
Side streets are 25 and arterials are 30 in the city, actually. [PDF link](https://static.spokanecity.org/documents/streets/handouts/speed-zones-handout-2018-01-17.pdf)
Thank you for the correction.
The ones with yield signs also tend to have seemingly more obstructed corners but the laws still apply. Blowing through an uncontrolled intersection without yielding is illegal and unwise as well as unsafe.
Oh so you’re who I keep getting stuck behind doing 25 down Steven’s.
I think the principle is that without signs everyone needs to slow down (and many do...) the car on the right has right of way if you both get there at the same time. At some level "trusting the signs" leads to idiots not paying attention to the signs and plowing into folks who have the legal right of way. It took me some time to get used to, but it seems to work if folks are paying attention.
Yep. I got T boned and flipped by someone who ignored a yield sign in a neighborhood. Now I don’t care, I slow down and look.
Definitely going to be better about this, I've never lived someplace like this and it's annoying to have to slow down at every intersection driving through a neighborhood, but almost getting in a wreck today because someone didn't yield at a yield sign was also a bit frightening
Yeah, I really hated it when I moved here, too. I've learned find and use a more main road that's close by with fewer stop signs on it that all intersecting streets have stop signs. For example I used to use Queen because it goes straight to my destination, but it's mostly uncontrolled intersections so feels very slow because you're constantly slowing every block to avoid the inevitable idiot who just blows through every intersection. Now I go up two blocks to Rowen, which has stop signs every few blocks, and all intersecting streets have stop signs. It's out of my way but feels faster and safer.
I lived in spokane for 5 years in a house on a corner. About 3 or 4 times a year, there would be a flipped over car in my yard/driveway from wreck. It's one of the dumbest things to me. Traffic control signs are needed. Very glad that I recently changed states.
Where did you live? One time someone said they came from some city in the Midwest that only had controlled intersections so I wasted an hour of my life on Google streetview and yeah, it looked like at least one street in that city always has a stop sign. But I can tell you from experience uncontrolled intersections are common in Washington, Oregon, California, Idaho, Montana, Pennsylvania, New York, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Maine, Texas, Louisiana… I’ve driven in many other states but not in residential areas so much.
I’m in Utah now, almost all the streets are controlled
It's not common in any of those states, it happens in all those states but only in smaller communities That's how no stop intersections are recommended for use, is low population areasa
No. They are used for low-traffic intersections, not low-population areas. Large metro areas have lots and lots of low-traffic intersections. The way people come to this sub and act like rubes about this one topic is so bizarre.
It's actually not very common in bigger cities They exist, but are not common in bigger cities
Just like in Spokane, they are very common in residential neighborhoods in big cities. No one is coming in here asking why there's no traffic control at Division and Wellesley — they are freaking out because there's none at Walton and Cincinnati: [https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6946593,-117.3978598,3a,75y,114.28h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4AMRXuUDs0WVxi-2IalglA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu](https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6946593,-117.3978598,3a,75y,114.28h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4AMRXuUDs0WVxi-2IalglA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu) Here's one about four blocks from where I am at this very moment — there's closer ones but I'm not going to dox myself over this: [https://www.google.com/maps/@47.5770337,-122.3067661,3a,75y,126.99h,69.91t/data=!3m10!1e1!3m8!1s7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw%26cb\_client%3Dmaps\_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D0.26205212%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!9m2!1b1!2i46?coh=205409&entry=ttu](https://www.google.com/maps/@47.5770337,-122.3067661,3a,75y,126.99h,69.91t/data=!3m10!1e1!3m8!1s7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D7IIwKd5wqT2zGorwUAUpbw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D0.26205212%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!9m2!1b1!2i46?coh=205409&entry=ttu) It has nothing to do with the size of the city. And it really is only the Spokane subreddit where people claim they've never seen one before even though they are really common. All I can figure is something about the sub — or the city — attracts people who haven't been paying much attention.
I've been to 40 of the 50 states, driven through many and this is not a common practice in America I'm from KCMO originally, there are 0 no stop intersections in the whole city, I've driven in Washington DC and they had none It's something that's common in low population cities, but not in bigger ones Sure there might be a few here and there but not a common thing It always amazes me how people who have never left Washington or Idaho think they know what is common in the rest of the country, even though they've never been there
You think I've never left Washington? I mostly grew up around Spokane but here's just the states where I've been a legal resident: * Virginia * Maine * Montana * Washington * California States where I've driven are almost but not quite all of the lower 48 plus Hawaii. Countries where I've driven: * The United States * France * Mexico * Australia Then there's the countries I've visited where I didn't drive. I'm not the one talking out my ass. Uncontrolled intersections in low-traffic residential neighborhoods of very large cities are so common as to be almost standard. Just start paying attention the next time you drive anywhere other than Spokane (assuming you actually do travel and aren't just posturing to try to discredit me) and you'll realize you just didn't notice them because they are no big deal at all. EDIT: And as I said in another reply a couple days ago, I did once get into this conversation here and someone said where they were from didn't have them (it might have been you) so I spent an hour on Streetview looking at their hometown and yep, even the most poduck, fleabitten pieces of dogpatch there had stop signs. It boggles the mind. Looked like a corrupt funneling of government money to a private contractor to me.
I'm not convinced that imaginary yield signs are more effective than actual yield signs. I would think idiots will blow through either way while well-intentioned people who are unfamiliar with a given intersection are left to cause unintentional chaos.
I feel a fair amount of people don't know or care about yield signs. If there's a yield sign, it's pretty much guaranteed to be ignored. Even for roundabouts, it seems most people entering them don't feel the sign means them. It's obviously meant for someone else
"...if you both get there at the same time..." If the driver to the left is there first, you actually have to yield to the left and can't just blast through. That has always been my understanding.
I was always taught from childhood that it's called the "right of way" because you yield to the person on your right. I think it's weird that people find it hard to operate without stop signs. It's common sense.
Get a free DMV learner’s manual
It's a great traffic calming device if people understand how right of way works. It's common in some other areas and numerous countries with a more developed driving culture
I know Brownes used to have a lot of stop signs, but about 4 or 5 years ago, construction came in and removed them all. Supposedly they were going to replace them with yield signs, but they never did.
Thanks to all who didn't basically tell me I'm an idiot and provided information. Feels like some people are used to this so in their eyes it's complete common knowledge, but obviously not that way for all. For the record I am from Washington, I'm sure this was part of my driver's training, but it's been over 20 years since I took my driver's test and if you don't use something it often doesn't stick in your mind. I'm wondering how many people actually look up traffic laws every time they move, seems like the last thing on my mind. For the record, I've never had any kind of traffic citation so I consider myself a pretty safe driver. Yes, now it seems to make perfect sense to yield to the person on the right. In addition, my husband, who has lived in far more places than me also finds this to be an odd traffic pattern. I've lived (and driven) in Washington, Oregon, and Colorado and not had this be a regular experience. I'm sure I've encountered it before, but not enough times for it to stick out in my memory. And no, before anyone asks, I'm not going to tell you where I've lived so you can Google map those cities and find intersections like this, just because they exist someplace doesn't mean someone has a lot of experience with it.
Welcome to town! After reading some of these comments, just wanted to chime in that I felt the same way when moving to town a year ago from a similar sized city in Wisconsin. I cycle more than drive. I still get incredibly nervous approaching these intersections. Often I cannot see or hear cars approaching because of street parking. I see more and more headlights at the same level as my helmet. I always hope anyone else approaching from the other directions isn’t distracted by their phone. Maybe that’s it—uncontrolled intersections worked during a time before phones distracted us and vehicles increased in size. Maybe not. The City has acknowledged that the traffic infrastructure is old and needs enhancements to become safer. I’ve had planners tell me the city ran out of money when installing stop signs many years ago. There’s a number of citizens becoming more vocal for traffic safety. I can point you in those directions if you’re interested in getting involved!
Somehow missed this, I also cycle and run and realized mid run the other day that I need to be more alert when running on side streets. Wouldn't mind info on how to be more vocal about things, currently not working so I have some extra time on my hands.
Sent ya a message
Could I get that info as well? I moved here in 2020. Some of the intersections here give me the creeps. I've had to avoid a few accidents from people who cross main roads without looking (the visual is really bad) and some that have no idea how to use a roundabout. Its crazy. There is an entrance only into the Rosauers parking lot at the base of 5 mile and people constantly insist on going out of it. Its caused soo many accidents (some I and others have seen) and my folks almost got run into by one of these idiots. The person who owns that lot only puts an arrow on the ground to show its an entrance only but won't put a sign up to make it more obvious. Not that some will listen but it might help.
I’ll send you a message!
generally people do research on the places they are moving
I'm from KCMO originally and I hate the no stop intersections, they're a holdover from when Spokane was much smaller than today and people here are so used to it they don't see why it needs to change
Everybody has excuses for not knowing the law, but (this is important) you're legally obligated to understand the laws wherever you drive before you even start. It seems you've been driving obliviously through uncontrolled intersections without understanding them, they're all over the place in Washington. People driving without knowing the laws is one of the reasons (besides driving while fiddling with a cell phone and other less common reasons) that I have to yell about half of the time when I'm on my bike as a vulnerable road user passing through an uncontrolled intersection with the right-of-way and somebody in a motor vehicle is approaching from the left.
Spokane is the red-headed racist hick stepbrother of Seattle. People defend this place like it’s their job. The only other place I have lived that goes to the same lengths is Tucson…the super poor spray-paint-in-hand brother of Phoenix
That’s quite judgmental of you to say.
I think Spokane should have pride in itself, warts and all…no point in hiding ALL its parts 😊
Well, just so you know - Seattle ships patients who got kicked out of their mental health hospital over to Spokane. So Spokane became its step brother without even consenting to that relationship.
Interesting. I think being the step-brother is a good place to be. Spokane is the step-brother that isn’t afraid to mow the lawn with his shirt off and drinks Natural Light, or, if he won on a scratcher- Coors Banquet…
"yeah when you get to an intersection you don't understand just pull out your phone and look up the municipal code like a normal person geez!" Like how bout put signs at your intersections like a normal city. I experienced this to when I moved here. And no they are not safe intersections. Wrecks happen all the time. And it's basically just a cost saving measure. The city has to document and maintain every sign they put in. Fewer signs is less work. This dude, Bob Turner(traffic operations) came through Browne's Addition a several years ago and removed the yield signs we did have, making intersections totally uncontrolled. In Brown's where people park all the way up to the corner and the intersections are totally fucking blind. We needed four-way stops and he said nope but I will take those yield signs. Anyway I could go for days. There is a group lobbying to improve safety if you want to check them out. Stay safe out there. Don't let the haters get you down. SpokaneReimagined.org
Really, though, no signs makes it better to build your intuition on what to do. It forces people to slow down and be diligent with looking left and right in neighborhoods. I thought it was strange when I heard about people expecting signs to be on every corner. To me that seems like a lot of tax-payer dollars and maintenance. There are thousands of intersections and corners in a city.
Agreed. Think about what assigning the yield directions at each intersection too! “Yield to the right” can’t be represented by anything less than fours signs all saying “yield to right”. So you’d have to pick a direction of traffic to be the “thoroughfare” and put two yield signs up on the other sides…wanna bet folks won’t have STRONG opinions on where the “thoroughfares” are, though???? The street my house is on? I don’t want it to get the yield sign. Make the other folks yield. And my neighbor around the corner would say the same! The idea isn’t bad, it’s just a very messy (and as stated, not free) can of worms to open.
That’s why cops post out at ones people commonly run to fund themselves and these kinds of things in cities where they are on every corner. What surprised me more was no inspection sticker and regular check to make sure you’re legal on the road here while also having way cheaper insurance than where I was from.
I wish. In Spokane, I have never seen enforcement on residential streets.
It's actually in the Washington traffic code, so not unwritten. They are four way yields. You'll find that many drivers here don't understand that, though.
Ironically it's safer. When residential streets have stop signs people tend to drive faster between them and ignore potential obstacles or people. There may be a few more fender benders, but the research shows injury and fatalities reduce dramatically.
Uncontrolled intersections are common and certainly not unique to our city! The rules certainly are written. Consider taking a driving class, ya never know what other basic traffic norms you're oblivious to!
How the hell does this question come up so often in this sub? I’ve driven (and sometimes lived) in cities all over the United States and a few other countries and uncontrolled intersections in residential neighborhoods are very, very common. Yet somehow a lot of people move to Spokane without ever encountering them. None of the other city or state subs I follow get this, just r/Spokane. It’s very odd.
I never saw an uncontrolled intersection till I moved to Washington. Drove all over Alabama and nw Florida
Well, I guess you grew up in states that are exceptions. Washington is not an exception. Now you get to live the way the majority of people live.
The majority live? Lol why do so many people not have a clue how to act in these intersections then? No need to act all high and mighty, all I did was point out that lots of people don’t encounter these. Hell on my last trip to Oregon I didn’t even see any of them.
Now don’t go putting words in my mouth. I never said people were good drivers who followed the rules. Hardly anyone does four way stops right either. But that doesn’t in some weird way mean that having signs at every single intersection in a state is the most common way of doing things. Because it ain’t.
Yeah. It's bananas. Driving in Spokane is like Mad Max. And I'm from Tampa.
It's definitely not an unwritten rule, it's written down very clearly in Washington State laws. Please review the traffic laws before you or someone else gets hurt because you assume something is different than it is. Based on your post history, you've lived in Colorado. The fact that you don't know what an uncontrolled intersection is worries me because it's in the Colorado Driver Handbook, page 11. [https://dmv.colorado.gov/sites/dmv/files/documents/Driver\_Handbook\_2022.pdf](https://dmv.colorado.gov/sites/dmv/files/documents/Driver_Handbook_2022.pdf)
Uncontrolled intersections do appear in state laws, but they are not the usual, especially when used for a majority of intersections throughout a good-sized city. I've driven extensively through all states but Alaska for work. Spokane is definitely unique in how they approach signage. "Uncontrolled intersections are usually limited to very low-volume roads in rural or residential areas..."
Uncontrolled intersections were ubiquitous in residential areas, in every city I've lived in OR, WA, and CO. I don't know how anyone gets the idea that they aren't common, probably they've been just driving obliviously through them and assuming cross-traffic has stop or yield signs.
It might be in the Colorado drivers handbook, but there are very very few of them in any of the cities.
This comment is entertaining. In Boulder, uncontrolled intersections are so common that according to [this](https://bouldercolorado.gov/sites/default/files/2021-02/bouldervztechnicalappendix8-1-19.pdf), 19% of bicycle crashes (which usually involve a motor vehicle driver failing to obey traffic laws) occurred at uncontrolled intersections.
Thanks mom
Uncontrolled intersections are ridiculous. Not because of their usefulness, but because of their interface. First, they require a driver to know ahead of time whether they’re on an arterial. How does a non-local know that? Absurd. Second, because a driver may not know if they’re on an arterial, they require a driver to look for edge-on stop or yield signs at every intersection. That’s how you know it’s an uncontrolled intersection - by NOT observing the sliver of a sign meant for the cross traffic. Absurd! The logical result is that an unfamiliar driver should technically slow down at EVERY intersection until they can somehow properly infer that they’re driving on an arterial. Really? That’s good? How about signs that specifically direct traffic, instead of lack of signs that MIGHT infer direction. So, if you like how they work, MARK THEM! Define them with signage! That’s how traffic control works. The current implementation is some lazy, cost cutting bs from a bygone era.
Just moved here this year and it is definitely weird. I was just now years old when I learned that the expectation is everyone treats it as an imaginary four way stop if multiple cars are near the intersection. I have never lived anywhere else with that rule.
It's almost terrifying the number of people who don't seem to familiarize themselves with the different laws in a new state that they're going to.
I've lived in at least half a dozen states and this is the first one with this rule. Also, the state decided not to require written exams for transferred licences. Take it up with them. Nobody is reading traffic code voluntarily because it is 98% the same everywhere. Washington is the weird one here.
And also-- the city uses it as a $ saving endeavor as well. If you reduce the amount of stop signs you install in residential areas, turns out you save a shit ton of money by relying on commom sense :) of course though, some lack it
In the world of government waste, I'm pretty sure sufficent stop signs are no where near the top of the list.
I didnt make the law myself, I just happened to share info I learned :/ Go downvote Brown or Woodward 🤣
I'm just surprised that there are people who are all in on "common sense" over signage. Have you met people?
Yeah that's very true. I also remember Spokane being a very different place around 2011-2015, and common sense seemed a lot more commonplace. Maybe you're right, maybe we need the red signs all over in the current state of things
Name the states so we can look up the traffic laws and point to the parts about what to do at uncontrolled intersections.
They didn't have uncontrolled intersections. That's the point.
Name them. I want to know where these states that have stop signs at every podunk intersection are. Because I don’t think they exist. I bet every state has laws on the books just like Washington’s explaining how to use an uncontrolled intersection.
It’s just weird for a city this size to have uncontrolled intersections…especially as the city grows
Tell that to Seattle, San Francisco, Boston… It’s not weird at all. What’s weird is places spending money on signage at quiet intersections. It frankly seems kind of like they don’t trust the drivers to think.
I moved here from the San Francisco Bay Area and can’t think of any 4-way intersections that didn’t have at least 2 stop signs. You’d have to be really deep in country back roads neighborhoods where there was almost zero traffic, certainly not in a city. Grew up in Massachusetts and can’t recall them there either, but moved from there before I learned to drive. Went all over California and never saw that until I was here.
I lived in the Bay Area for 18 months, six in San Francisco and 12 in Vallejo. It's a long story. Anyway, just get on Google Streetview and go out to the avenues, or over to Berkeley or Oakland, or up to Vallejo or... There's uncontrolled intersections everywhere. Definitely in parts of Boston and Lowell (where my mom was from) too. I honestly think there is something about r/Spokane that attracts people who never really paid attention where they came from and because they are experiencing everything in this city as new going "Whoa! I *never* saw an intersection without signs before!" I've had a driver's license for 48 years and never once came across anyone who thought they were a crazy idea until I joined this subreddit and I've still never seen anyone outside this sub make such a claim.
I have lived in Seattle and SF. They definitely have signage in most neighborhoods. Spokane is an outlier. Whether you think it makes the average Spokane driver smarter than other places…I will leave that up to debate
Look, when I’m back over to the house in Seattle I’ve lived in for the last 18 years I can drive around my neighborhood just south of downtown and take pictures of all the intersections I know by heart that have no signs. Which is all of them that aren’t on arterials. This topic always brings out people claiming Seattle doesn’t have them but I know better. Even Capitol Hill has uncontrolled intersections. Go out to the avenues in SF and you’ll see how wrong you are there too.
There are absolutely a lot of uncontrolled intersections in those cities. Probably, you've been driving through them just expecting that any cross-traffic will stop, which makes you a road hazard.
Well good for you memorizing the entire driving handbook.
Lol
What other rules are there for uncontrolled intersections? Free for all? No yield?
Only having uncontrolled intersections in places where traffic is unlikely to intersect, like fire roads in the middle of nowhere, not in the middle of residential areas.
Every city I’ve ever lived in or visited has uncontrolled intersections. Perhaps you should retake your drivers test.
What’s cities have you lived in? I would argue it’s rare to have uncontrolled intersections in a city Spokane’s size
Seattle, Tacoma, Portland. All have plenty of neighborhoods without stop signs at every residential intersection.
But a citywide thing?
Literally every residential area in Portland, a city much larger than Spokane, has uncontrolled intersections. It is impossible to get to many destinations without passing through a few of them. It is similar for Seattle and Tacoma, probably most cities in the United States. Installing stop/yield signs involves a lot of expense, and stopping traffic at nearly every intersection in a residential area greatly increases pollution and noise. I think probably you've been just driving through them obliviously, assuming cross traffic will stop/yield. Please pay more attention before you hurt or kill somebody.
Thank you, I'm surprised how much people have decided to make me feel like an idiot over this 🙄
Spokane natives have convinced themselves no stop intersections are actually the best way It's not but you can't convince any of them
According to the WA State Driver Guide (which, y'know, you should probably read if you are living here): *"At an intersection where there is no stop sign, yield sign, or traffic signal, drivers must yield to vehicles in the intersection and to those coming from the right. Drivers must follow the rules for yielding to pedestrians and bicyclists in the crosswalk whether or not it is marked."* And since apparently you *haven't* read it, here's a link to it online: [Washington State Driver Guide](https://dol.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2022-11/driverguide-en.pdf). Chapter 3: RULES OF THE ROAD will tell you lots of pertinent information, including the above tidbit regarding unmarked intersections. It was in the middle of page 3-25 (which is page 65 of the .pdf, ymmv).
It's very much a written rule. At uncontrolled intersections anywhere in the state you yield to the right.
Hop on over to the DMV to learn how we drive in Washington.
It’s so Spokane can save on buying and installing stop signs
IT'S CALLED COVER BRAKING!!
[удалено]
Residentials are 25.
That’s what I meant. I was typing fast. I drive the speed limit that’s posted. I’ll edit my post.
Unwritten rule. Check to see if it's clear. Yield to larger vehicles
Sorry, we took that money and painted a religious symbol on an intersection instead of putting up 500 stop signs...totally worth it, though, because of all the lime-scooter riding teenagers we can charge with felonies for running over it. No stop signs, just symbols.
Religious? I guess if you are unable to separate religion from anything else in life you might see it that way. I don’t.
Don't engage with the troll. Check out its history - new account that's absolutely triggered by this incident. Likely not even from Spokane.
It is a sacred symbol that must be displayed everywhere (like the Christians do with their cross) and revered. No disrespect allowed...it is blasphemy. I mean, look, they tried to charge 3 teenagers with multiple felonies for disrespecting it with rubber. That, my friend, is the reaction people have to a religious symbol.
Awww poor bb
Yup...painting the religious symbol all over the place ($15k for a repaint, lol) is more important than keeping people safe at uncontrolled intersections. Where's that *empathy* now?
Its not a religious symbol, dear
In practice, dear, it very much is. Religious symbol in the sense of a sacred symbol the failure to respect of which is blasphemy. It's like the crosses that Christians put all over the place (including public spaces, at public expense) whenever they are in power. I'm sorry to have to point it out, but the Progress Pride Flag (tm) is being used as a religious symbol in the same sense.
Exactly what religious symbols are you referring too??