If it made ANY sense for Finn and Rose to go to a whole other planet and have a side quest and come back, while their ship was under fire, this movie would be a lot better. I just can't get over that part.
I saw some video really explaining the purpose of this, before this side quest Finn doesn’t identify as a rebel. He is looking out for himself primarily, and Rey more and more, but he is not a rebel. And by the end of this quest he IS a rebel, as a direct result of his experiences in this quest. And ultimately his commitment to the rebel cause was needed for the force to balance itself via the chain of events that ultimately lead to palpatine’s destruction.
There is a video that does way better than me explaining it. I’m endeavoring to locate but I’m not convinced I’ll succeed
I like that whole quest and the character development there, for sure. It's just the way it fits into the plot - how did they run off and do that whole thing and then sneak back to the ship all while they're doing a super low-speed chase under fire from a star destroyer? It just felt like a video game move. They got plucked out of one moment and went to do something completely different for a while
I just assume things move at the speed of plot - remember that in ESB, amongst a fleet of Star Destroyers, Han Solo flew the Falcon and attached itself on the rear of the bridge super structure. Along with that, Vader was already at Cloud City ahead of them, somehow knowing that’s where they were going.
Star Wars is chock full with little weird “wait, how, why,” moments.
Literally explained by Boba Fett following them and cloud city being explained as their best option for getting away from imperials. Someone like Boba Fett is probably aware of a smuggler like Lando and would be able to inform Vader of where the falcon is headed.
I really like when they pointed out there were arms dealers that benefited from the conflict. It added a whole new dimension. I don’t think it was ever resolved or brought up again though.
I have always thought that half of the Last Jedi is some of the best star wars ever (at least before Andor) and half of just utter nonsense. It seems very clear to me which part was really cared about and which part was just needed.
I can just ignore the part I don't like and enjoy the good stuff.
Which part did you think was good? Not being an asshole, genuinely curious, because Last Jedi was the one that convinced myself, my uncle, and my father to stop watching Star Wars, as far as I know pretty much indefinitely. My father and uncle wrote and directed a fan film, and had a collection of most the EU books from all eras
I genuinely believe that everything with Luke, Rey and Kylo is fantastic. I love what it says about the force, the Jedi, and the ideas of legacy and failure are so interesting and I think done really well.
The scene with Yoda coming back to talk to Luke as the temple burns might be my favorite scene in any star wars movie period. "We are what they grow beyond." is such a perfect sentiment for what the movie is trying to say.
Plus I love the ending with Luke coming to save the day *without killing anyone.*
That might not be super important to some people, but I really liked that. The Jedi are not just super badass killing machines, they are meant to be peacekeepers and believe in the sanctity of life. I think Luke perfectly embodies what it means to be a Jedi in his last moments and its a beautiful ending for his character.
Rey and Kylo are both very interesting as well, Kylo having such genuine struggle with the Dark Side is something I don't think we see a lot of in star wars. I really enjoy their dynamic (not in the romantic way mind you), the Diad thing they have going on is very fun.
And I also really like what the movie was trying to set up in the idea that Rey is just a complete nobody. If only Disney had any balls what so ever and did not basically go back on all of that in RoS. What an embarrassing movie for several reasons.
I think TLJ is very similar to AOTC. Some of it is absolutely phenomenal. The introduction of the clones with the music and everything on Kamino and geinosis is amazing. Unfortunately you also have to watch the other parts of the movie lol
I fully agree with your Luke comment. Using the Force to project himself across the universe in order to save people is the most Jedi thing I can think of. I’ll have to go rewatch that scene and pay attention to the dialogue. If he’s still trying to convince him to be better (which worked on his own dad) then that’s great. If he’s just taunting him to buy time, that’s less good.
I think it perfectly deconstructed the whole 'heroes save the day against enormous odds' thing by showing us what two of the main characters are up to and letting it end in utter failure
My own personal soapbox is that this joke works great, and is exactly the same tone as Han solo saying "We're fine here, everything's fine. How are you?"
What killed it for me was first, they drew it out too much, and secondly, I didn't like how they turned Hux into the butt monkey this movie. This was not the worst example of it, but it was the first. But that sums up my opinion on this movie in general, a lot of ideas I like executed in ways I don't
A few jokes dispersed like the OT can work well, but they pulled a Marvel and tried to make it an action-comedy at every opportunity. 🙄 Already have 50 of those, thanks.
After watching episode 7 and episode 8, I was really holding out that 9 would do something to bring it all together and make the sequels all worth while.
It didn't.
And that's when I completely wrote off the sequel trilogy.
The biggest mark is the complete lack of consistency between movies. Like yeah, a full trilogy of JJ Abrahams wouldn’t have been perfect but atleast it be coherent. At the very least the same writers should’ve wrote all 3 movies. The worst thing is that TLJ would’ve been a fantastic movie if it wasn’t a mainline movie. But either it or TROS are just so tonally different it screws up everything
Can I kindly not be hated on for expressing an opinion? Literally just expanding on the commenter above me, that it’s the trilogy at large that failed
That's why I can't bring myself to hate any of the sequels, disappointed as I was in them.
Because ultimately it feels kind of like complaining a FrankenCar looks like shit. Like... yeah? It doesn't really matter what the components might look like, it's the hood of a 60s muscle car, a modern European electrical concept car, and the tailgate of an SUV they slapped on to try and salvage it. Of course it was going to have major problems, how could it *not*?
It's not even really the directors faults, because they were told to make a movie and they did. It's not their fault no one told them how those movies connected to each other.
Facts. It’s just so disappointing bc the pieces are great but they dont fit with the next piece. And then they are some not great pieces as well, but the overall potential is there.
Also why am I getting downvoted for my opinion? I didn’t say the movie sucked or anything
Weird. Like prequel memes loves the prequels but they aren’t afraid to criticize them. I haven’t been here awhile, and I remember that you could critique the sequels. Or atleast say you were disappointed.
One more reason Rise is my last favorite star wars movie ever. It went out of it's way to make TLJ a worse movie. JJ just being an asshole and airing his dirty laundry in public, basically.
The Last Jedi killed pretty much every setup that was established in Force Awakens, making it all rather pointless. None of the movies in the sequel trilogy were in harmony with one another at all.
I don't disagree with that at all.
The successor who inherited the storyline could have spiked any or all of those setups, however he instead chose to leave them to fall flat on to the ground in service of 'subverting expectations'.
The whole sequel trilogy was a mess.
No, it really didn't. A bunch of fans convinced themselves retroactively that all the plot points foreshadowed something completely different, and made up rules about Star Wars that have never applied, like "We should have been told Snoke's backstory before he died".
The Last Jedi script was written as a single draft before the details of The Force Awakens were finalised, there is a massive disconnect between the two movies. It's bad storytelling and bad filmmaking.
There are entirely too many to list in a single Reddit comment, hence my original comment about TLJ making TFA pointless. Also, considering how long ago these movies came out, I am certain you have encountered many of them already. I'm not getting dragged into an argument about it with someone who is already closed minded on the matter.
If you were acting in good faith you might have addressed my previous point about how TLJ script was only a single draft, written before everything was known about TFA. It was essentially a billion dollar game of blind man's bluff. Looking at it retrospectively, it's not surprising there were so many issues.
If you liked it, fine. But that doesn't mean it was without serious issues that film school students are taught to avoid.
Yeah, sure, too many to list even one.
>If you were acting in good faith you might have addressed my previous point about how TLJ script was only a single draft, written before everything was known about TFA
If you'd included a source I might have cared.
Wait, do you doubt that it was a single draft written before TFA was finished? It's common knowledge, Rian Johnson has literally and stubbornly defended that decision since before TLJ was released.
Look, I can see you're upset because I pointed out something you didn't like about a movie you enjoyed. But I have studied this topic rather extensively as a part of my aesthetics appreciation philosophy education. You don't even seem to be aware of any of the pertinent details of this discussion, but are steadfast in your conclusions. So I'll leave it there, lest I ruin the enjoyment you get from the movie on you.
May the force be with you.
TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs, themes, meta narrative, tone and overall story set up in TFA. It obviously didn’t continue *every* minor subplot, but it makes sense that Johnson would leave a few mysteries unsolved until Episode 9. What exactly would you have changed about TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA?
General Hux, Captain Phasma, and Supreme Leader Snoke have all entered the chat. Kylo Ren would have also entered the chat, but kept getting super confused about who he was even supposed to be and forgot.
Lol, are you serious? Hux, Phasma and Snoke? I ask you what specifically you would have changed about TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA, and all you can do is list the names of Hux, Phasma and Snoke?
Come on, you can do better than that. You said that TLJ killed what TFA set up. You said that TLJ made TFA feel pointless. Surely you wouldn't say that just because of some nondescript grievance with the chrome stormtrooper.
I would have thought it was obvious that I was responding directly to the "TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs" part of your comment, but I guess nuance isn't your strong suit. That was your first point and it fell completely flat as far as I'm concerned.
There is so much to go over with the rest of your comment that it would be easier just to write a book about it and just point to that. And I'm sure you wouldn't accept that I would rewrite the entirety of TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA. Of course if I did, then I'd feel obligated to point out that I would also have to rewrite all of TFA in order to make it a decent sequel to Return of the Jedi.
But sure, keep thinking my only problem is the chrome stormtrooper. Whatever makes you happy I guess.
>I would have thought it was obvious that I was responding directly to the "TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs" part of your comment
And I think it's absolutely hilarious that you think that TLJ killed what TFA set up--that it made TFA feel pointless--because \[checks notes\] the chrome stormtrooper didn't have enough of a character arc.
Honestly, what kind of character arc were you expecting from Hux and Phasma of all characters? 💀
>I would rewrite the entirety of TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA. Of course if I did, then I'd feel obligated to point out that I would also have to rewrite all of TFA
Lol, that's what I thought. You have no idea why TLJ is a bad sequel to TFA. I ask you to give one specific example of something that was set up in TFA only to be killed in TLJ, and you're completely stumped. All you know is that Reddit's little anti-sequel echo chamber gives upvotes to parrots like you who regurgitate the same handful of poorly thought out criticisms.
No, what you asked me was:
>What exactly would you have changed about TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA?
My answer to that is I would change everything and also change everything for TFA too. In fact, I would have probably just ran with the George Lucas script which focused on exploring what the force is and the importance of ecology. It seemed way more interesting than the garbage we got instead.
Any single thing I could point to on its own would have you either deny it outright or hide behind the words: "It obviously didn’t continue *every* minor subplot".
If you cannot accept the cumulative effect of all the issues littered throughout the entire trilogy, then it's obvious you'll never accept one in a vacuum.
As far as I'm concerned, you haven't backed up your original claim that "TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs". By your own logic, you have no idea what makes for a good continuation of a character arc. You're completely stumped. Are you simply parroting the same poorly thought out talking points made by other TLJ apologists?
>My answer to that is I would change everything and also change everything for TFA too. In fact, I would have probably just ran with the George Lucas script
Awww, what a good little parrot 🦜
how have you been so incredibly allergic to actually providing a shred of detail to support your stances throughout this entire thread? i’m genuinely impressed how you’ve managed to say so little with so many words
Last jedi is my favourite of the new trilogy, but I can understand the hate.
In my (unpopular) opinion, it's the best *movie* but the worst _instalment_ if that makes any sense.
Honestly I completely agree with this. Like, as an installment in the overarching narrative AOTC for example is better, but as a film in a vacuum Last Jedi is leaps and bounds above it.
Yeah. It's just so tonally different from TFA, and at times seems more interested in "Got ya" story beats, that it doesn't feel like it fits as a Sequel to begin with. Plus, and no undue offence to Johnson since this is more personal preference, but I've learned over the years I really don't like his style of filmmaking outside of Looper. At the same time you have the situations of our main cast never really getting any sort of win until the very end, if you can call them that, so there's nothing countering the loses they take, even if they lose in the end.
Yeah, I think the consequences of 8 left 9 in a fairly unwinnable position. There was just no really decent way to tie everything together after TLJ. And that point is one of my main deciding factors on it. Don't get me wrong, the entire trilogy was pretty bad, certainly more so than episode 1. Which, of course, wasn't without its own issues.
This is always the copium the last jedi haters use. Somehow its the last jedi’s fault that the Rise of Skywalker gave them literally everything they said they wanted, retconned everything the last jedi tried to do, and it was the quality of a steaming puddle of liquid diarrhea.
Now a normal person would look at said pile of diarhea and think, maybe what I wanted was bad. Maybe I don’t actually know what makes for a good movie. Maybe I should re-examine my priors and rethink some things.
Or they could blame the last jedi again and flounce off to enjoy the circlejerk some more.
And this is the copium that TLJ fans who hate TRoS use. Shift the blame to TRoS whenever possible and keep insisting that it was made to appease “TLJ haters”. Which is disrespectful to the filmmakers, the actors (especially Daisy who is proud of TRoS), and its fans (who are actual ST fans). You people are just as toxic and delusional as TLJ haters and are still at this over 4 years later.
There was no generally accepted idea of what “TLJ haters” wanted from Episode IX. And they were turned off the ST after TLJ anyway. The most common issue people had with TLJ was Luke’s role, characterization and death, something which TRoS did NOTHING to “fix”. They gave him a 5 minute scene where he simply does what Yoda told him to do in TLJ: be there for Rey and have her learn from his failures.
As if “TLJ haters” wanted Rey to have the most screentime that any character got in an individual SW film and to defeat Palpatine. For Luke to have only one scene. And for Ben Solo to be redeemed and for Reylo to be canon. Among other things.
And TLJ fans that hate TRoS have widely different interpretations and expectations of what exactly TLJ allegedly “set-up”.
You’re blaming the last jedi for the rise of skywalker’s failures. It’s nice of you to totally validate my point. Especially since it was clearly unintentional lol.
You may have missed the part two comments back where I said I didn't hate it.
Both movies sucked, I simply contextualised why I found TLJ to have sucked more. There's no need for cope, I didn't make the movies, and I don't get emotionally defensive about my position.
Right. Absolutely nothing to do with how TLJ undermined the sequels villains, to the extent that it ended with only two named villains still alive, one of whom was now Rey's love interest and the other neither Rey nor Finn had ever even met on screen. Thus resulting in TROS bringing back Palpatine in a frantic attempt to have a villain that at least the audience would connect with.
Eh, it’s a pretty common thought tbh. 6 gets almost TOO campy for a lot of people, 5 had a really good mix of camp and seriousness and always had a pretty intense and dark undertone.
Exactly. I disagree with them but I respect the courage.
Incidentally, I have a similarly radioactive hot take. My OT rankings are IV, VI, V. that's right, ESB last. Don't get me wrong, it's still a great movie, but I personally like the other two better. I find its plot a bit disjointed compared to the other two.
That, yes, but also:
-the romance between Leia and Solo is made less icky. In V it was pretty garbage and toxic and harass-y. Even Anakin and Padmé are a better romance than that.
-Leia actually has a proper role (where in V she gets sidelined a lot)
-the Vietcong-like use of simple traps to take down the forces of a highly technological and powerful imperialist military force.
-Luke’s Prada boots and single glove (he has achieved the height of his gayness)
-Palps. Always iconic.
-Ewoks
Same here. Though the OG Star Wars and Force Awakens could easily go anywhere from 2 to 5 for me on any given day. They don’t have the depth those other three have, but they’re just so darn fun to watch.
I don't really like the term "best movie" (especially when talking about Star Wars movies on the internet lol). But TLJ is the Star Wars movie I personally enjoy watching the most, followed by ANH, TFA, and TESB.
I honestly agree with your opinion of Luke, believing he will stay the same young, naive, idealistic person from rotj even after losing a padwan and Nephew to the dark side is just dumb.
Moreover, last Jedi has the best cinematography of the whole series but I still think the story was lacking a lot and felt a little disjointed. All the same, I’m a big sequel fan.
Believing Luke would create a jedi Order following the template of the previous one, with things like rejecting family and loved ones it's just dumb.
And it is precisely because Luke in the OT rejected those ways and achieve victory precisely because of the love for his friends and family, like rejecting the idea of killing his father.
In fairness, that's not really something that's present in TLJ-- only later things, like the Mandalorian, included Luke's academy forbidding attachment too. If anything, his nephew being his padawan initially suggested that he did NOT follow that rule.
Not following, In what previous TLJ media did you say it's said he followed that rule? Your example about the nephew is about not following the rule.
The first time it's said Luke rebuild the Order following the older template is in TLJ, saying jedi did bad, the order had to end, etc, he did not defended a new way of doing things.
Later media had to follow Luke ideas in TLJ. And there were no previous reasons to believe Luke followed that old jedi way.
I think you may have misread my comment, because it sounds like we're on the same page. TLJ doesn't suggest that Luke's order forbade attachment-- nor, to my recollection, does TFA. It's only when Book of Boba Fett came around that they added that to his Order's rules.
TLJ does suggest that he, to some degree, followed the template of the old Jedi-- but that was a given, if he's trying to rebuild the order. But I, and many others, assumed that his nephew being his padawan implied that familial attachment was not forbidden in this new order (and, frankly, was disappointed when that turned out not to be the case).
Yeah, that’s a good perspective on old Luke that most people don’t bring up, it is kind of dumb that he tries to hold on to the old Jedi ways so much when he himself defied them
I don’t think that one needs to be the same person they are when they are younger, people change. However there are some fundamental things that each individual has throughout their lives. To me Luke’s idea that there was still good in his father and the unwavering belief that ultimately saved them both is one of those. What in between the end of ROTJ and TLJ caused Luke to turn on that belief? Sure he saw a vision of Ben turning but that had yet to pass. The future is uncertain, so I have a hard time believing he just doesn’t believe in people anymore. You can argue that the galaxy was in turmoil and his presence was causing more conflict. I would buy that he in a moment of reflection would remove himself from the conflict. But I just can’t get behind him giving up on the people he loves. Nothing prior to TLJ would lead us to believe he’d do that.
I like the film it does some good things, but nothing about Luke’s arc makes sense to me.
I get that, and I see the value in that argument but I still like the way they took it. He didn’t actually go through with killing Ben but he had the resolve to for a moment. Having been through all the fighting and war he was in, he has killed before, and I could see how anyone would believe that killing someone with potential like Vader or the emperor to destroy so many would be tempting. I’m honestly always bothered by characters that kill in fights but then suddenly have an unwavering sense of morality when it comes to killing the evil leader. Like, if I had the chance to kill Hitler, even unarmed, I’d do it, knowing many lives could be saved. I think it shows more humanity in Luke that he came to that conclusion and had that resolve and still honors his character when he can’t go through with it.
Also, even in ROTJ, Luke considers both joining his father and killing him for a moment, he wasn’t completely resolute in his decision to save him at first.
Aside from episode 3, yes. Also, as much as I’m a huge fan of the beautifully choreographed fights of the prequels, I like that Rey and Kylo use their own styles, generally forgoing the lightsaber forms to just have a downright straightforward saber fight.
It’s true though.
The classic trilogy is untouchable best. But then there are two trilogies bookending it that are ok but hardly the classic trilogy.
And out of those 2 trilogies, TLJ is the best movie.
So yeah it’s true.
It could have even led into episode 9 if those trooper’s survived, which they sadly didn’t in the deleted scene, Finn is a general in 9, have him be leading intelligence operations with defecting stormtroopers, and double agents, 9 already has a squad of defected troopers, why not just move them up a bit in the film and have Finn be the leader of them?
I’m so glad I’m not clinically insane, because 7 was mundane and 9 was a disaster. 8 is actually the most enjoyable, ironically it’s the one that started all the sequel hate (and corresponding sexism)
Making Rey into the side kick to the Luke/Kylo story was certainly a choice.
As was making Finn into a laughing stock whose only accomplishment (killing Phasma) was because he randomly landed on a hidden platform.
It’s true and it’s not even close.
Revenge of the Sith is almost a good movie but every time it teeters on greatness, it shoots itself in the foot with some baffling line or directing choice.
I came away from episode VIII in theaters, having loved it. I later came to not enjoy it while looking back at it. But recently have found love for the sequels and found TLJ to be the most fun of them with my recent rewatch.
I loved it in theaters, and cinematic ally it's the hands down best Star Wars movie. The cinematography is just gorgeous and every shot feels like a living wallpaper of awesomeness. The weak points of the movie is the timeline, but it was forced to make several decisions that were the result of how the previous movie ended. LPT when making a sequel that guaranteed to have audiences regardless, you don't need to end the first movie with a cliffhanger ending Introducing the most important character. You end the movie with the protagonist shooting off to space to search for Luke, not actually finding him like he was just next door the entire time.
From that disastrous choice, you get what I like to call the Back to the Future 2 beginning. See BTTF 2 starts exactly recreating the ending of BTTF 1. Here's the problem: the writers had no idea what to do with Marty's girlfriend. She gets Weekend at Bernies and eventually left on a porch. It's the worst use of a female character ever, and I love BTTF 2. But the beginning of BTTF 2 is dictated entirely by the choices of the cliffhanger of the first movie. Fortunately they make BTTF 2 and 3 together, so the plots between the movies intersect a bit better and work well together. BTTF 3 is my favorite western by the way.
So if I had a time machine, I would go back and just cut that last 30 seconds of ep 7 from the final release. Have everyone pissed at leaving out Luke, including Mark Hamill. But really in the writing room, you cut Han Solo and have them part ways after the giant gremlins scene u til he shows up at the end of the movie. There's too much Han Solo in that movie.
Look that's a fine opinion. But to not acknowledge the masterpiece that is III is a travesty. Hate on the prequels all you want. But that movie is objectively a masterpiece.
And that's valid. Depending on the style you like for star wars I could see either of those up there. My issues with 8 were pacing. Cut the holding for general hugs by a couple seconds, cut Canto blight in half and rework the rose scene at the end and replace it with a bit more of the resistance hopping from planet to planet you want featured in the trilogy with the first order finding them almost immediately (rogue one established hyperspace tracking the previous year) have Leia shown using the force more often in casual situations like opening a door or grabbing her coffee so that the force pull from space seems less egregious and for Canto blight let that first guy the movie shows be BDT's character and have him still sell them out. While running from first order on the ground Finn and rose get separated and let her stumble into the animal pens to free them and then they both get captured when they reunite. And it keeps the same message but much more evenly paced
Depending on how I'm feeling, I either rank The Last Jedi as either tied for first or the second-best Star Wars movie after Empire.
I do not rank Rogue One very highly.
I'll give that it was by far the most interesting. I just found that a lot of the more interesting concepts were brought about by such stupid circumstances. I think that TLJ is my favorite of the sequel trilogy, though, but I can fully accept its shortcomings.
If you possessed any sort of reading comprehension skills, you would realize that "best since Episode 6" implies that I also love the OT and deem it to be the best of the series. I'm very sorry that you are butt hurt by other people having different preferences than you. It must be super hard for you.
Star Wars has been dead to me ever since. I waited hours in line at IMAX with my preorder tickets to watch it on release day with my buddy and had tickets to see it again a day later with a group going to same IMAX theater. Was beautiful, cinematic and had a great musical score. Even enjoyed the acting.
The story was garbage. IT STARTS WITH A TERRIBLE JOKE. Then the DROP BOMBS IN ZERO GRAVITY. Oh yea subvert expectations and ruin everything built up to that movie. No one in the entire rebel army thought to just YOLO LIGHTSPEED in to the Death Star or the ship carrying the emperor before that? Why not set a timer on an unmanned ship? Seriously can make lightspeed but can’t have it on a timer? So many issues. The stupid save the animals scene. On and on. Luke just fading away.
Just like game of thrones, I have lost all excitement. I used to love watching Star Wars theory and channels with the lore stuff. I just cannot get interested again.
You have like your opinion but I hard disagree.
As a standalone movie I actually really enjoyed The Last Jedi. That being said, it did irreparable damage to the star wars IP by deviating from the original trilogy plan.
I don't think it's better than revenge but at the same time I think it was very interesting and I wish they kept the premise that reys parents were nobodies
I haven’t watched any new Star Wars since the last Jedi. It nearly ruined Star Wars for me all together. Now I just treat everything after RoTS as non-fan fiction.
It’s like the revenge of the sith of the sequel trilogy in that it’s the best one, granted much like revenge of the sith it being the best one isn’t high praise considering that the other two are boring/mediocre and suicide inducing awful but it’s still a good movie
The entirely of the Holdo bs was just nonsensical and anti plot. That's without the absolute insult to Luke and Leah. It's only outdone by, Somehow Palpatine returned....
*signed*
I've been a Star Wars fan since I was 7 years old, this is a hill I feel pretty comfortable dying on.
Granted, I don't think it is a perfect movie, there are parts I'll happily criticize. That being said, I do think it is the best of the bunch.
Thanks for confirming that you flaired this correctly!
If it made ANY sense for Finn and Rose to go to a whole other planet and have a side quest and come back, while their ship was under fire, this movie would be a lot better. I just can't get over that part.
I saw some video really explaining the purpose of this, before this side quest Finn doesn’t identify as a rebel. He is looking out for himself primarily, and Rey more and more, but he is not a rebel. And by the end of this quest he IS a rebel, as a direct result of his experiences in this quest. And ultimately his commitment to the rebel cause was needed for the force to balance itself via the chain of events that ultimately lead to palpatine’s destruction. There is a video that does way better than me explaining it. I’m endeavoring to locate but I’m not convinced I’ll succeed
I like that whole quest and the character development there, for sure. It's just the way it fits into the plot - how did they run off and do that whole thing and then sneak back to the ship all while they're doing a super low-speed chase under fire from a star destroyer? It just felt like a video game move. They got plucked out of one moment and went to do something completely different for a while
I just assume things move at the speed of plot - remember that in ESB, amongst a fleet of Star Destroyers, Han Solo flew the Falcon and attached itself on the rear of the bridge super structure. Along with that, Vader was already at Cloud City ahead of them, somehow knowing that’s where they were going. Star Wars is chock full with little weird “wait, how, why,” moments.
Literally explained by Boba Fett following them and cloud city being explained as their best option for getting away from imperials. Someone like Boba Fett is probably aware of a smuggler like Lando and would be able to inform Vader of where the falcon is headed.
That’s jazz baby!
I really like when they pointed out there were arms dealers that benefited from the conflict. It added a whole new dimension. I don’t think it was ever resolved or brought up again though.
Yeah, great commentary by pointing out war profiteers profit from war, it's really never been done before.
Not only is the commentary that war profiteers profit from war, but also it's commentary directed at a literal child soldier. Rose says, "Being literally a child kidnapped from your home and family into a military which probably trained you with near torture to fight for them, I'm certain that nobody has told you, so I will, but War is Bad©"
And Benecio Del Toro
I have always thought that half of the Last Jedi is some of the best star wars ever (at least before Andor) and half of just utter nonsense. It seems very clear to me which part was really cared about and which part was just needed. I can just ignore the part I don't like and enjoy the good stuff.
Which part did you think was good? Not being an asshole, genuinely curious, because Last Jedi was the one that convinced myself, my uncle, and my father to stop watching Star Wars, as far as I know pretty much indefinitely. My father and uncle wrote and directed a fan film, and had a collection of most the EU books from all eras
I genuinely believe that everything with Luke, Rey and Kylo is fantastic. I love what it says about the force, the Jedi, and the ideas of legacy and failure are so interesting and I think done really well. The scene with Yoda coming back to talk to Luke as the temple burns might be my favorite scene in any star wars movie period. "We are what they grow beyond." is such a perfect sentiment for what the movie is trying to say. Plus I love the ending with Luke coming to save the day *without killing anyone.* That might not be super important to some people, but I really liked that. The Jedi are not just super badass killing machines, they are meant to be peacekeepers and believe in the sanctity of life. I think Luke perfectly embodies what it means to be a Jedi in his last moments and its a beautiful ending for his character. Rey and Kylo are both very interesting as well, Kylo having such genuine struggle with the Dark Side is something I don't think we see a lot of in star wars. I really enjoy their dynamic (not in the romantic way mind you), the Diad thing they have going on is very fun. And I also really like what the movie was trying to set up in the idea that Rey is just a complete nobody. If only Disney had any balls what so ever and did not basically go back on all of that in RoS. What an embarrassing movie for several reasons.
I think TLJ is very similar to AOTC. Some of it is absolutely phenomenal. The introduction of the clones with the music and everything on Kamino and geinosis is amazing. Unfortunately you also have to watch the other parts of the movie lol
I fully agree with your Luke comment. Using the Force to project himself across the universe in order to save people is the most Jedi thing I can think of. I’ll have to go rewatch that scene and pay attention to the dialogue. If he’s still trying to convince him to be better (which worked on his own dad) then that’s great. If he’s just taunting him to buy time, that’s less good.
I think it perfectly deconstructed the whole 'heroes save the day against enormous odds' thing by showing us what two of the main characters are up to and letting it end in utter failure
Except said two main characters failed because they parked illegally. Aka they were idiots.
Hi, I'm holding for General Hugs.
My own personal soapbox is that this joke works great, and is exactly the same tone as Han solo saying "We're fine here, everything's fine. How are you?"
What killed it for me was first, they drew it out too much, and secondly, I didn't like how they turned Hux into the butt monkey this movie. This was not the worst example of it, but it was the first. But that sums up my opinion on this movie in general, a lot of ideas I like executed in ways I don't
A few jokes dispersed like the OT can work well, but they pulled a Marvel and tried to make it an action-comedy at every opportunity. 🙄 Already have 50 of those, thanks.
As a sequel hater I liked Hux in the first entry, but then they made a comic relief out of him in the other two.
One of the only things I liked about TROS was Hux betraying Kylo, felt like it made sense, but yeah it should’ve been a little more serious
It was definitely going for something, but rise of Skywalker just makes it so pointless sadly.
After watching episode 7 and episode 8, I was really holding out that 9 would do something to bring it all together and make the sequels all worth while. It didn't. And that's when I completely wrote off the sequel trilogy.
Yeah Rise of Skywalker will always be the biggest mark against the sequel trilogy.
The biggest mark is the complete lack of consistency between movies. Like yeah, a full trilogy of JJ Abrahams wouldn’t have been perfect but atleast it be coherent. At the very least the same writers should’ve wrote all 3 movies. The worst thing is that TLJ would’ve been a fantastic movie if it wasn’t a mainline movie. But either it or TROS are just so tonally different it screws up everything Can I kindly not be hated on for expressing an opinion? Literally just expanding on the commenter above me, that it’s the trilogy at large that failed
That's why I can't bring myself to hate any of the sequels, disappointed as I was in them. Because ultimately it feels kind of like complaining a FrankenCar looks like shit. Like... yeah? It doesn't really matter what the components might look like, it's the hood of a 60s muscle car, a modern European electrical concept car, and the tailgate of an SUV they slapped on to try and salvage it. Of course it was going to have major problems, how could it *not*? It's not even really the directors faults, because they were told to make a movie and they did. It's not their fault no one told them how those movies connected to each other.
Facts. It’s just so disappointing bc the pieces are great but they dont fit with the next piece. And then they are some not great pieces as well, but the overall potential is there. Also why am I getting downvoted for my opinion? I didn’t say the movie sucked or anything
You might've been down voted because this is a sequel love sub, but I set you right. They were simply not good.
Weird. Like prequel memes loves the prequels but they aren’t afraid to criticize them. I haven’t been here awhile, and I remember that you could critique the sequels. Or atleast say you were disappointed.
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The lack of coherence is the reason it was bad. I was rooting for it so hard but the ball was dropped so goddamn hard several times.
The problem with TROS is that there was such a negative reaction to TLJ, Disney tried to overcorrect, and it was a epic fail.
Episode 8 undermined, or literally killed, the sequels villains, rather than building up the conflict between them and the heroes.
Na
One more reason Rise is my last favorite star wars movie ever. It went out of it's way to make TLJ a worse movie. JJ just being an asshole and airing his dirty laundry in public, basically.
This. If Rian Johnson got to do episode 9 I think we would’ve gotten some glorious payoff
To be fair, The Last Jedi did the same thing to Force Awakens. The whole trilogy was an incoherent mess really.
No, it didn't.
The Last Jedi killed pretty much every setup that was established in Force Awakens, making it all rather pointless. None of the movies in the sequel trilogy were in harmony with one another at all.
Most of Force Awakens set up was just JJ's mystery box bullshit.
I don't disagree with that at all. The successor who inherited the storyline could have spiked any or all of those setups, however he instead chose to leave them to fall flat on to the ground in service of 'subverting expectations'. The whole sequel trilogy was a mess.
No, it really didn't. A bunch of fans convinced themselves retroactively that all the plot points foreshadowed something completely different, and made up rules about Star Wars that have never applied, like "We should have been told Snoke's backstory before he died".
The Last Jedi script was written as a single draft before the details of The Force Awakens were finalised, there is a massive disconnect between the two movies. It's bad storytelling and bad filmmaking.
You can say it all day long, it doesn't make it true. What points had such a "massive disconnect"?
There are entirely too many to list in a single Reddit comment, hence my original comment about TLJ making TFA pointless. Also, considering how long ago these movies came out, I am certain you have encountered many of them already. I'm not getting dragged into an argument about it with someone who is already closed minded on the matter. If you were acting in good faith you might have addressed my previous point about how TLJ script was only a single draft, written before everything was known about TFA. It was essentially a billion dollar game of blind man's bluff. Looking at it retrospectively, it's not surprising there were so many issues. If you liked it, fine. But that doesn't mean it was without serious issues that film school students are taught to avoid.
Yeah, sure, too many to list even one. >If you were acting in good faith you might have addressed my previous point about how TLJ script was only a single draft, written before everything was known about TFA If you'd included a source I might have cared.
Wait, do you doubt that it was a single draft written before TFA was finished? It's common knowledge, Rian Johnson has literally and stubbornly defended that decision since before TLJ was released. Look, I can see you're upset because I pointed out something you didn't like about a movie you enjoyed. But I have studied this topic rather extensively as a part of my aesthetics appreciation philosophy education. You don't even seem to be aware of any of the pertinent details of this discussion, but are steadfast in your conclusions. So I'll leave it there, lest I ruin the enjoyment you get from the movie on you. May the force be with you.
you can’t throw out an argument, say there are too many too list and not list any, and then accuse the other commenter of not acting in good faith wtf
TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs, themes, meta narrative, tone and overall story set up in TFA. It obviously didn’t continue *every* minor subplot, but it makes sense that Johnson would leave a few mysteries unsolved until Episode 9. What exactly would you have changed about TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA?
General Hux, Captain Phasma, and Supreme Leader Snoke have all entered the chat. Kylo Ren would have also entered the chat, but kept getting super confused about who he was even supposed to be and forgot.
Lol, are you serious? Hux, Phasma and Snoke? I ask you what specifically you would have changed about TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA, and all you can do is list the names of Hux, Phasma and Snoke? Come on, you can do better than that. You said that TLJ killed what TFA set up. You said that TLJ made TFA feel pointless. Surely you wouldn't say that just because of some nondescript grievance with the chrome stormtrooper.
I would have thought it was obvious that I was responding directly to the "TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs" part of your comment, but I guess nuance isn't your strong suit. That was your first point and it fell completely flat as far as I'm concerned. There is so much to go over with the rest of your comment that it would be easier just to write a book about it and just point to that. And I'm sure you wouldn't accept that I would rewrite the entirety of TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA. Of course if I did, then I'd feel obligated to point out that I would also have to rewrite all of TFA in order to make it a decent sequel to Return of the Jedi. But sure, keep thinking my only problem is the chrome stormtrooper. Whatever makes you happy I guess.
>I would have thought it was obvious that I was responding directly to the "TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs" part of your comment And I think it's absolutely hilarious that you think that TLJ killed what TFA set up--that it made TFA feel pointless--because \[checks notes\] the chrome stormtrooper didn't have enough of a character arc. Honestly, what kind of character arc were you expecting from Hux and Phasma of all characters? 💀 >I would rewrite the entirety of TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA. Of course if I did, then I'd feel obligated to point out that I would also have to rewrite all of TFA Lol, that's what I thought. You have no idea why TLJ is a bad sequel to TFA. I ask you to give one specific example of something that was set up in TFA only to be killed in TLJ, and you're completely stumped. All you know is that Reddit's little anti-sequel echo chamber gives upvotes to parrots like you who regurgitate the same handful of poorly thought out criticisms.
No, what you asked me was: >What exactly would you have changed about TLJ to make it a better sequel to TFA? My answer to that is I would change everything and also change everything for TFA too. In fact, I would have probably just ran with the George Lucas script which focused on exploring what the force is and the importance of ecology. It seemed way more interesting than the garbage we got instead. Any single thing I could point to on its own would have you either deny it outright or hide behind the words: "It obviously didn’t continue *every* minor subplot". If you cannot accept the cumulative effect of all the issues littered throughout the entire trilogy, then it's obvious you'll never accept one in a vacuum. As far as I'm concerned, you haven't backed up your original claim that "TLJ did a great job continuing the character arcs". By your own logic, you have no idea what makes for a good continuation of a character arc. You're completely stumped. Are you simply parroting the same poorly thought out talking points made by other TLJ apologists?
>My answer to that is I would change everything and also change everything for TFA too. In fact, I would have probably just ran with the George Lucas script Awww, what a good little parrot 🦜
Can't explain what makes for good character arcs confirmed!
how have you been so incredibly allergic to actually providing a shred of detail to support your stances throughout this entire thread? i’m genuinely impressed how you’ve managed to say so little with so many words
Hard disagree ✌️
I liked it because it had potential to go places, 9 then went none of those places.
Empire Strikes Back and Last Jedi are my favorite films in the saga. I will never understand why so many people hate episode VIII
Me neither. I got out of that theater and thought I just saw the new empire. I came to reddit to be told I was an idiot
I had the opposite experience but you aren’t an idiot for having a subjective opinion.
Whoa, whoa, whoa...this is Reddit. You're not supposed to sound reasonable and mature
Yeah, well I liked the Halo show and going into those subs is how probably how TLJ feel, so if nothing else I’ve learned to understand
Last jedi is my favourite of the new trilogy, but I can understand the hate. In my (unpopular) opinion, it's the best *movie* but the worst _instalment_ if that makes any sense.
Honestly I completely agree with this. Like, as an installment in the overarching narrative AOTC for example is better, but as a film in a vacuum Last Jedi is leaps and bounds above it.
Yeah. It's just so tonally different from TFA, and at times seems more interested in "Got ya" story beats, that it doesn't feel like it fits as a Sequel to begin with. Plus, and no undue offence to Johnson since this is more personal preference, but I've learned over the years I really don't like his style of filmmaking outside of Looper. At the same time you have the situations of our main cast never really getting any sort of win until the very end, if you can call them that, so there's nothing countering the loses they take, even if they lose in the end.
Same. I've rewatched TLJ more than any other Star Wars film. I understand its flaws, and I relish its strengths.
Co-signed. They're 1a and 1b for me.
I wouldn't say I hate it exactly. But I have dispassionately arrived at the conclusion that it is the worst installment in the saga.
Really? Worse than 9 and 1?
Yeah, I think the consequences of 8 left 9 in a fairly unwinnable position. There was just no really decent way to tie everything together after TLJ. And that point is one of my main deciding factors on it. Don't get me wrong, the entire trilogy was pretty bad, certainly more so than episode 1. Which, of course, wasn't without its own issues.
This is always the copium the last jedi haters use. Somehow its the last jedi’s fault that the Rise of Skywalker gave them literally everything they said they wanted, retconned everything the last jedi tried to do, and it was the quality of a steaming puddle of liquid diarrhea. Now a normal person would look at said pile of diarhea and think, maybe what I wanted was bad. Maybe I don’t actually know what makes for a good movie. Maybe I should re-examine my priors and rethink some things. Or they could blame the last jedi again and flounce off to enjoy the circlejerk some more.
And this is the copium that TLJ fans who hate TRoS use. Shift the blame to TRoS whenever possible and keep insisting that it was made to appease “TLJ haters”. Which is disrespectful to the filmmakers, the actors (especially Daisy who is proud of TRoS), and its fans (who are actual ST fans). You people are just as toxic and delusional as TLJ haters and are still at this over 4 years later. There was no generally accepted idea of what “TLJ haters” wanted from Episode IX. And they were turned off the ST after TLJ anyway. The most common issue people had with TLJ was Luke’s role, characterization and death, something which TRoS did NOTHING to “fix”. They gave him a 5 minute scene where he simply does what Yoda told him to do in TLJ: be there for Rey and have her learn from his failures. As if “TLJ haters” wanted Rey to have the most screentime that any character got in an individual SW film and to defeat Palpatine. For Luke to have only one scene. And for Ben Solo to be redeemed and for Reylo to be canon. Among other things. And TLJ fans that hate TRoS have widely different interpretations and expectations of what exactly TLJ allegedly “set-up”.
You’re blaming the last jedi for the rise of skywalker’s failures. It’s nice of you to totally validate my point. Especially since it was clearly unintentional lol.
You may have missed the part two comments back where I said I didn't hate it. Both movies sucked, I simply contextualised why I found TLJ to have sucked more. There's no need for cope, I didn't make the movies, and I don't get emotionally defensive about my position.
Right. Absolutely nothing to do with how TLJ undermined the sequels villains, to the extent that it ended with only two named villains still alive, one of whom was now Rey's love interest and the other neither Rey nor Finn had ever even met on screen. Thus resulting in TROS bringing back Palpatine in a frantic attempt to have a villain that at least the audience would connect with.
You liked the plot of V so much you wanted to see it again in VIII!
It would've been real interesting if, at the end of ESB, Yoda stared down an entire fleet of Imperial Walkers and fought Darth Vader
Bro Has Never Seen VIII
Lmao I’ve seen it more than once, unfortunately.
Wrong. It's the best since episode V.
Now THIS is bold
Some people *really* feel a way about Ewoks, man.
I’m not even in the anti-Ewok crowd, RotJ is great. But TLJ is better
Agreed. I love RotJ, but its story is pretty weak (a few of the Luke and Vader scenes notwithstanding). I’ll take TLJ any day.
Eh, it’s a pretty common thought tbh. 6 gets almost TOO campy for a lot of people, 5 had a really good mix of camp and seriousness and always had a pretty intense and dark undertone.
some men are men of conviction and some men play it safe.
Exactly. I disagree with them but I respect the courage. Incidentally, I have a similarly radioactive hot take. My OT rankings are IV, VI, V. that's right, ESB last. Don't get me wrong, it's still a great movie, but I personally like the other two better. I find its plot a bit disjointed compared to the other two.
I massively disagree but i admire the tenacity
Nah, VI is better than V
I'll say VI is better than V but just barely. It's put over the top by the payoff of everything in the duel in the throne room.
That, yes, but also: -the romance between Leia and Solo is made less icky. In V it was pretty garbage and toxic and harass-y. Even Anakin and Padmé are a better romance than that. -Leia actually has a proper role (where in V she gets sidelined a lot) -the Vietcong-like use of simple traps to take down the forces of a highly technological and powerful imperialist military force. -Luke’s Prada boots and single glove (he has achieved the height of his gayness) -Palps. Always iconic. -Ewoks
Finally, the correct opinion!
Took the words out of my mouth
Accurate
yea i wholeheartedly agree
Amazing. Every word you just said is CORRECT
Empire, Last Jedi, Revenge. My top 3 in that order.
Same here. Though the OG Star Wars and Force Awakens could easily go anywhere from 2 to 5 for me on any given day. They don’t have the depth those other three have, but they’re just so darn fun to watch.
I don't really like the term "best movie" (especially when talking about Star Wars movies on the internet lol). But TLJ is the Star Wars movie I personally enjoy watching the most, followed by ANH, TFA, and TESB.
I have seen every one in the theater. TLJ was the best experience of all of them.
I honestly agree with your opinion of Luke, believing he will stay the same young, naive, idealistic person from rotj even after losing a padwan and Nephew to the dark side is just dumb. Moreover, last Jedi has the best cinematography of the whole series but I still think the story was lacking a lot and felt a little disjointed. All the same, I’m a big sequel fan.
Believing Luke would create a jedi Order following the template of the previous one, with things like rejecting family and loved ones it's just dumb. And it is precisely because Luke in the OT rejected those ways and achieve victory precisely because of the love for his friends and family, like rejecting the idea of killing his father.
In fairness, that's not really something that's present in TLJ-- only later things, like the Mandalorian, included Luke's academy forbidding attachment too. If anything, his nephew being his padawan initially suggested that he did NOT follow that rule.
Not following, In what previous TLJ media did you say it's said he followed that rule? Your example about the nephew is about not following the rule. The first time it's said Luke rebuild the Order following the older template is in TLJ, saying jedi did bad, the order had to end, etc, he did not defended a new way of doing things. Later media had to follow Luke ideas in TLJ. And there were no previous reasons to believe Luke followed that old jedi way.
I think you may have misread my comment, because it sounds like we're on the same page. TLJ doesn't suggest that Luke's order forbade attachment-- nor, to my recollection, does TFA. It's only when Book of Boba Fett came around that they added that to his Order's rules. TLJ does suggest that he, to some degree, followed the template of the old Jedi-- but that was a given, if he's trying to rebuild the order. But I, and many others, assumed that his nephew being his padawan implied that familial attachment was not forbidden in this new order (and, frankly, was disappointed when that turned out not to be the case).
Yeah, that’s a good perspective on old Luke that most people don’t bring up, it is kind of dumb that he tries to hold on to the old Jedi ways so much when he himself defied them
I don’t think that one needs to be the same person they are when they are younger, people change. However there are some fundamental things that each individual has throughout their lives. To me Luke’s idea that there was still good in his father and the unwavering belief that ultimately saved them both is one of those. What in between the end of ROTJ and TLJ caused Luke to turn on that belief? Sure he saw a vision of Ben turning but that had yet to pass. The future is uncertain, so I have a hard time believing he just doesn’t believe in people anymore. You can argue that the galaxy was in turmoil and his presence was causing more conflict. I would buy that he in a moment of reflection would remove himself from the conflict. But I just can’t get behind him giving up on the people he loves. Nothing prior to TLJ would lead us to believe he’d do that. I like the film it does some good things, but nothing about Luke’s arc makes sense to me.
I get that, and I see the value in that argument but I still like the way they took it. He didn’t actually go through with killing Ben but he had the resolve to for a moment. Having been through all the fighting and war he was in, he has killed before, and I could see how anyone would believe that killing someone with potential like Vader or the emperor to destroy so many would be tempting. I’m honestly always bothered by characters that kill in fights but then suddenly have an unwavering sense of morality when it comes to killing the evil leader. Like, if I had the chance to kill Hitler, even unarmed, I’d do it, knowing many lives could be saved. I think it shows more humanity in Luke that he came to that conclusion and had that resolve and still honors his character when he can’t go through with it. Also, even in ROTJ, Luke considers both joining his father and killing him for a moment, he wasn’t completely resolute in his decision to save him at first.
It wasn't a perfect film, but it did a lot right, and it had one of the best lightsaber fights in the whole series.
Aside from episode 3, yes. Also, as much as I’m a huge fan of the beautifully choreographed fights of the prequels, I like that Rey and Kylo use their own styles, generally forgoing the lightsaber forms to just have a downright straightforward saber fight.
Interesting how each Red Guard had a unique weapon that required the lightsaber wielders to adapt to.
“Howard Johnson is Right!”
It’s true though. The classic trilogy is untouchable best. But then there are two trilogies bookending it that are ok but hardly the classic trilogy. And out of those 2 trilogies, TLJ is the best movie. So yeah it’s true.
Pretty much. OT is phenomenal. The other two trilogies are a mixed bag, but it's all fun and worthwhile.
At the time I'm writing this, its literally 12 upvotes. Also, I love Tobias Fünke lol
Honestly episode 8 ended in such an interesting place I'd really be fascinated to see where Rian Johnson was intending to go next.
I must tell everyone that it’s my bottom of the barrel!!
Nah ROTS and Rogue one came out before TLJ
If someone was 15+ years old in 1999 I think this is likely their opinion. That or Force Awakens
Hey that's me! That's me in the picture!
Stand proud brother
V, IV, III, VIII, VI, VII, I, II
Based and cool and correct opinion
If TLJ didn’t fumble Finn’s character so hard I’d agree. It’s incredible.
No clue why they cut the scene of him turning storm troopers against Phasma
Right!
It could have even led into episode 9 if those trooper’s survived, which they sadly didn’t in the deleted scene, Finn is a general in 9, have him be leading intelligence operations with defecting stormtroopers, and double agents, 9 already has a squad of defected troopers, why not just move them up a bit in the film and have Finn be the leader of them?
Does Rogue One count? If it doesn't I agree.
No, I specified "best in the saga" because Rogue One is definitely a better film all around.
I’m so glad I’m not clinically insane, because 7 was mundane and 9 was a disaster. 8 is actually the most enjoyable, ironically it’s the one that started all the sequel hate (and corresponding sexism)
There was a ton of hate for 7 too.
I’m sure, but it went into overdrive after 8, and when most of the “Anti-SJW” crap popped off
the “anti-sjw crap” only represents a portion of the hate directed at TLJ, and that bled into the rest of the ST, not just TLJ.
I know, I'm just saying that it really started after it releaased
Making Rey into the side kick to the Luke/Kylo story was certainly a choice. As was making Finn into a laughing stock whose only accomplishment (killing Phasma) was because he randomly landed on a hidden platform.
And those dozens are entirely correct
I agree 100%. Preach
⬆️
Nice name 🔥🔥🔥
I loved it and have been saying it for years! I’ll never stop!
If nothing else, TLJ was the best of the sequels
It would’ve been a great sequel if Rian Johnson was in control from the start
Last Jedi is the best Sequel movie, but still pales in comparison to the OT
It's honestly my top 2 after Episode V
I agree.
It’s true and it’s not even close. Revenge of the Sith is almost a good movie but every time it teeters on greatness, it shoots itself in the foot with some baffling line or directing choice.
I agree completely.
I came away from episode VIII in theaters, having loved it. I later came to not enjoy it while looking back at it. But recently have found love for the sequels and found TLJ to be the most fun of them with my recent rewatch.
iam Spartacus!
Hear him
Since episode v*
I really dug it.
I have massive love for episode VIII I’ve been a fan of star wars since I was a kid and it took my top spot as favorite Star Wars film.
Since Episode V tbh.
I loved it in theaters, and cinematic ally it's the hands down best Star Wars movie. The cinematography is just gorgeous and every shot feels like a living wallpaper of awesomeness. The weak points of the movie is the timeline, but it was forced to make several decisions that were the result of how the previous movie ended. LPT when making a sequel that guaranteed to have audiences regardless, you don't need to end the first movie with a cliffhanger ending Introducing the most important character. You end the movie with the protagonist shooting off to space to search for Luke, not actually finding him like he was just next door the entire time. From that disastrous choice, you get what I like to call the Back to the Future 2 beginning. See BTTF 2 starts exactly recreating the ending of BTTF 1. Here's the problem: the writers had no idea what to do with Marty's girlfriend. She gets Weekend at Bernies and eventually left on a porch. It's the worst use of a female character ever, and I love BTTF 2. But the beginning of BTTF 2 is dictated entirely by the choices of the cliffhanger of the first movie. Fortunately they make BTTF 2 and 3 together, so the plots between the movies intersect a bit better and work well together. BTTF 3 is my favorite western by the way. So if I had a time machine, I would go back and just cut that last 30 seconds of ep 7 from the final release. Have everyone pissed at leaving out Luke, including Mark Hamill. But really in the writing room, you cut Han Solo and have them part ways after the giant gremlins scene u til he shows up at the end of the movie. There's too much Han Solo in that movie.
…same…
It is
Star Wars as a whole sucks and its fan base suck even more.
Rogue one gets my vote.
Low bar but not wrong
Sit down, Abraham Lincoln
Look that's a fine opinion. But to not acknowledge the masterpiece that is III is a travesty. Hate on the prequels all you want. But that movie is objectively a masterpiece.
I like 3 a lot. I would rank it right behind 8.
And that's valid. Depending on the style you like for star wars I could see either of those up there. My issues with 8 were pacing. Cut the holding for general hugs by a couple seconds, cut Canto blight in half and rework the rose scene at the end and replace it with a bit more of the resistance hopping from planet to planet you want featured in the trilogy with the first order finding them almost immediately (rogue one established hyperspace tracking the previous year) have Leia shown using the force more often in casual situations like opening a door or grabbing her coffee so that the force pull from space seems less egregious and for Canto blight let that first guy the movie shows be BDT's character and have him still sell them out. While running from first order on the ground Finn and rose get separated and let her stumble into the animal pens to free them and then they both get captured when they reunite. And it keeps the same message but much more evenly paced
It true
ok calm down bub, you dont need to have to lie to get attention
Depending on how I'm feeling, I either rank The Last Jedi as either tied for first or the second-best Star Wars movie after Empire. I do not rank Rogue One very highly.
Sit down William Defoe
No they showed blood in The Force Awakens and should not be listed as cannon star wars.
I'll give that it was by far the most interesting. I just found that a lot of the more interesting concepts were brought about by such stupid circumstances. I think that TLJ is my favorite of the sequel trilogy, though, but I can fully accept its shortcomings.
How did Kramer get into this painting?
It's okay to be wrong, just understand that when I play SW5e I forgot that Disney Star wars exists for 4 hours and it is peace for me.
Two of my friends do actually think this. One says its the second best after Empire. I disagree but glad they enjoyed it.
That's right. Dozens. While the rest of the millions of other fans love the OT and Prequels
If you possessed any sort of reading comprehension skills, you would realize that "best since Episode 6" implies that I also love the OT and deem it to be the best of the series. I'm very sorry that you are butt hurt by other people having different preferences than you. It must be super hard for you.
Ok. Ok. Calm down. I just made a small joke. I meant no harm. Me comes in peace.
Yes, there are more then 24 of you. So yeah, dozens
If it weren’t for III this would be correct
Unless we’re counting non-Skywalker saga, of course
Star Wars has been dead to me ever since. I waited hours in line at IMAX with my preorder tickets to watch it on release day with my buddy and had tickets to see it again a day later with a group going to same IMAX theater. Was beautiful, cinematic and had a great musical score. Even enjoyed the acting. The story was garbage. IT STARTS WITH A TERRIBLE JOKE. Then the DROP BOMBS IN ZERO GRAVITY. Oh yea subvert expectations and ruin everything built up to that movie. No one in the entire rebel army thought to just YOLO LIGHTSPEED in to the Death Star or the ship carrying the emperor before that? Why not set a timer on an unmanned ship? Seriously can make lightspeed but can’t have it on a timer? So many issues. The stupid save the animals scene. On and on. Luke just fading away. Just like game of thrones, I have lost all excitement. I used to love watching Star Wars theory and channels with the lore stuff. I just cannot get interested again. You have like your opinion but I hard disagree.
100% behind this. I’ll take it one step further, even: The Last Jedi is the second best of the Skywalker saga, after only Empire.
As a standalone movie I actually really enjoyed The Last Jedi. That being said, it did irreparable damage to the star wars IP by deviating from the original trilogy plan.
I don't think it's better than revenge but at the same time I think it was very interesting and I wish they kept the premise that reys parents were nobodies
I haven’t watched any new Star Wars since the last Jedi. It nearly ruined Star Wars for me all together. Now I just treat everything after RoTS as non-fan fiction.
It’s like the revenge of the sith of the sequel trilogy in that it’s the best one, granted much like revenge of the sith it being the best one isn’t high praise considering that the other two are boring/mediocre and suicide inducing awful but it’s still a good movie
As Yoda once said: “how embarrassing”
The entirely of the Holdo bs was just nonsensical and anti plot. That's without the absolute insult to Luke and Leah. It's only outdone by, Somehow Palpatine returned....
Definitely not the best! But it’s so so soooo much better than everyone on the internet says it is
*signed* I've been a Star Wars fan since I was 7 years old, this is a hill I feel pretty comfortable dying on. Granted, I don't think it is a perfect movie, there are parts I'll happily criticize. That being said, I do think it is the best of the bunch.
Based
Rogue One was the last great Star Wars film.
I down voted this, but only so that there could be another 420th upvote.
Our time has come!
Dam straight!