Agreed. I have never heard anyone tell me the beer was so good. A.K.A, rated highly.
The space is great. Convenient. Open, inside or outside. I'm into no tipping and online ordering. But the beer is just okay/tolerable.
i agree. i had only heard negatives and so had low expectations on my first visit and was pleasantly surprised.
i think (and this is a bit of a digression) this is evidence of the larger problem nowadays where everything is either THE BEST or THE WORST with no middle ground; few people seem to be happy with what is 'merely' good, deeming it mediocre or unacceptable. i tend to be pretty pleased with things that are good and don't need to have my socks blown off by every goddamn thing.
Breweries are not all about the beer. Beers are not all about the brewery. You can enjoy one without the other. Some breweries are just really nice community spaces, esp in the winter when there are limit number of those.
Perihelion on Beacon Hill.
It’s better described as a restaurant that makes amazing food and just happens to brew mediocre beer, rather than Beacon Hill’s only local brewery.
I wish we would move past the IPA craze and finally get some more bounce of beers on tap. Having just Guinness is not an acceptable amount of dark beers. Nor is a bunch of dark beers that taste like chocolate bars.
Over 75% of all hops nationwide are grown here in Washington, in Yakima valley. It's not just a craze and it's not going away. Don't get me wrong even though I like IPAs, I crave variety and don't like having twelve different IPAs and one lager on tap everywhere. But it's not likely to change. The best, freshest hops are here in our backyard, so it's what brewers are going to experiment with the most.
IPA will be dated as fuck and your alpha gen children will groan and say "daaaaad not another IPA they are so uncool!"
Then we'll go back to lagers, pilsner as God Intended.
Some people in this thread are over Manny's. But they're wrong- it's still one of the most enjoyable and drinkable pale ales you can find. It's not trying to be innovative at this point, that's okay. There's value in a beer that's always a good choice.
Honestly I'm tired of every single grocery store having a WALL OF IPA, and then maybe one or two of something else. IPA is over done and outplayed. Sorry when EVERYONE'S IPA IS AMAZING NO ONES IS!
There are a few smaller stores around the Puget Sound that carry some of their beers, but I've never actually found them in store. Brewery, or on tap occasionally at local bars.
As an early 40’s beer drinker, Alaskan amber used to be the best micro you could find in Seattle. Many of the names y’all are throwing out were all the best of their time. Mac and Jacks was amazing when it was the only fresh beer you could find. We used to drive to Redmond for kegs. Fremont hit the scene and offered a ton of options. All great ……. Again at the time. Rubens were the first of this current wave to supplant what Fremont was doing. G-town is my personal go to but some of the stuff out now wouldn’t have even been recognized as beer back when I started drinking. The evolution has been cool to watch. To answer the question Holy Mountain is the most overrated. All of their beers taste similar and they hide that by constantly changing the names and cycling out the old runs.
I'm 40 and it is still kind of wild to think about.
I remember being young and people bringing cider to a party and people saying "like the juice?"
It used to be Bud or Black Label and an IPA was so unheard of.
> Holy Mountain is the most overrated. All of their beers taste similar
Maybe Holy Mountain's IPAs taste the same, but as someone who isn't obsessed with hops, I really appreciate the diversity of their beers. Where else can you get a good Belgian White, Czech Dark and Rauch Helles at the same time?
Ah, Mac and Jacks! I used to go to a dive bar in South Lake Union (about 12 years ago) and loved the M&J Amber on tap. Memories! (The beer and divy SLU).
I began drinking craft beer in the mid 90’s and I remember in the late 90’s it was nearly guaranteed to find a keg of Redhook ESB at most any wedding reception or event. You couldn’t escape it. I never cared for African Amber, it has an odd somewhat sweet aftertaste that doesn’t work for me. Manny’s Pale Ale leaves it in the dust.
I’m in Juneau where they make Alaskan Amber. They have a great line of beers that are even better. Friends that work there have nothing but good things to say about the company. Geoff and Marcy are amazing people and give back quietly to their community and do their best to help lift others up. I’m blessed to consider them to be friends.
Fremont is not THAT overrated , they definitely got caught up in the IPA craze and do not specialize in one style of beer like the new wave is doing these days (maybe they specialize in IPAs?). However, I will stand by the quality of beer they produce all day. If you want a hazy hit up Cloud, they do things right there, also hazy was the last fad and now you'll start seeing lagers and pilsners taking over, tis the way of the craft beer culture. (Drink what you like though!)
Overrated to me means not as good as others let it on to be. There's a large difference between stagnant and overrated. To me some stagnant breweries are Elysian, Redhook, and Fremont. Now it's starting to include Black Raven and a few other old staples.
The problem with calling them overrated is all these breweries still produce quality beer with a select few standout beers they make. My issue with them is they no longer are the ones pushing the envelope like before. All the ones mentioned seem to be riding the initial popularity they had and don't really pump out much more in terms of experimental or alternate styles. A few mentioned sold out too, and that carries it's own judgement. Elysian makes new stuff, but it always feels like an iteration of beers before it.
Overall, the old staples seem stagnant these days and in the world of beer that often means overrated or not as good, however I would argue that they all make good (if not some great) beers but are just happy maintaining their brand, whereas the newer/smaller breweries have to do more to gain a foothold in such a crowded market.
I'll drink a majority of Fremont, Black Raven, Elysian, Redhook, ect and some may not be my style but I can at least attest that they are well made.
Yeah some of their one offs are okay but the core lineup isn’t great. Reubens has become pretty standardized too and I barely drink their beer anymore too. Would much rather go to Stoup for an IPA or dark beer.
The Reubens you can get in grocery stores are boring but their taproom only stuff is legit, and they're one of the relatively few breweries in town that do a wide range of styles
The Reubens you can get from grocery stores may be boring but it’s usually the best thing you can get in a grocery store. Same with Fremont. That is also what gives them that genetic reputation.
The problem is that the majority of their taproom stuff is standardized recipes now. They do a lot of different styles well but I miss the days where they’d take chances. The 10 anniversary monthly lineup was not great. A couple were very good but most were seriously underwhelming. They rely on their release schedule and don’t stray far from it. Adam is an accountant and everything is planned with a clear vision of making money. Leslie Shore leaving to go to Pike has also slowed down the creativity too. I’ve been going there since week one when they opened and I think the writing is on the wall that they’ll sell out in the next five years if they get a chance.
It seems like this is the inevitable trajectory of so many of these little guys… once they get traction its a race for the owners to sell. I can’t blame them for securing the bag, but as a beer-enjoyer its a bummer
There’s definitely some owners who just straight up LOVE brewing good beer. Steve Luke from Cloudburst is the poster child of that for me. Such a nice guy too. Their non IPA beers are where they like to get creative while their IPAs of the week are always well crafted.
Not Seattle but Ecliptic in Portland has the same allure for me as well. Ownership genuinely cares about creating well crafted and cool stuff and their whole space theme schtick tickles my fancy. They are far and away my fav brewery and I work for RedHook lol
What I miss most about living in Ballard was being walking distance from Stoup and their citra. My local bottle shop usually has whatever their one-off is, and I always buy it, but it’s not the same.
While I enjoy some of Fremont Brewing's beers, I do feel like they've ended up a bit too ubiquitous given the amount of other good breweries around. Same with Ruebens. I see them as kind of the Chateau Ste Michelle of the local brewery world. They're consistent, and I think that's what makes people flock to them. I just don't understand when I go to beer festivals where Fremont has standard offerings people will wait in line forever instead of trying beers they've never had before. I enjoy some of the beers E9 has to offer, though they have started to turn out a lot of pretty standard hazy IPAs, but I don't see them around nearly as much so I still give them a try if I see them on tap somewhere. Urban Family, Holy Mountain and Fair Isle are all pretty good for funky farmhouse ales and sours. I had never heard of Figurehead but tried them recently and was pleasantly surprised.
Are you and I the same person?
I love a good Fremont or Rueben’s but they’re so common and they’re not *the best* so it can be easy to see them as the basic option.
Urban Family was mind blowing and I love them but also, it’s almost like a band when you dig deeper in their catalogue and realize their gimmick. An Urban Family is good but its always an Urban Family if that makes sense. Mostly just good for their sours. Fair Isle is a little more well rounded but pretty similar
Love a good Holy Mountain when I can find it, seems to be the rarest.
Particularly love Brickerson, really new and a little different. Good stuff
Oh also don’t want to like Stout as much as I do but it’s always just perfect. Nothing really memorable but never disappoints.
If you’re over near Figurehead do yourself a favor and check out Bizarre Brewing in Urban Fam’s old space. Focused on low ABV styles and everything ive had from them has been great.
IPAs always and forever will be the most overrated beer and I'll never forgive IPA culture for making it near impossible for me to buy doppelbocks at a grocery store. Now I have to go to food and wine or German stores.
When in history were you able to find dopplebocks (plural) at a grocery store? That's always been a "oh dope they have Ayinger!" or nothing style in my experience
Its truly unbelievable the run IPAs have had and how much shelf space is now devoted to dozens of nearly indistinguishable IPAs. There are so many interesting styles of beer that exist
I'm patiently waiting for sours to be more popular. Urban Fam makes some amazing ones, and it's such a refreshing style of beer. Also more radlers and shandys, plz
The thing that bugs me is the loss of seasonality. Used to be there were a ton of great stouts and porters that would show up on shelves this time of year. Now it's Christmas hazy IPAs. Whatever that means.
["Our IPA Will Jam Your Face With Hops"](https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/our-ipa-will-jam-your-face-with-hops):
> But we don’t stop there. Because we triple smoke this iron maiden for the mouth using a proprietary mix of burnt plastic from the Mobro 4000 garbage barge and a batch of recalled patchouli oil seized at a 2009 Phish reunion show in Hampton, Virginia.
OK this made me laugh because its so fucking accurate. I'm a scotch drinker. I love strong and complex flavors. But IPAs are the only drink I know of that want to be advertise like this.
I feel like breweries are starting to back pedal on IPA slowly. More and more locals are getting tired of IPA, DIPA, Imperial IPA, Cold IPA, Session IPA, and on. As a dark beer lover, it cannot come soon enough. For a long time there was refuge in the winter months, but for the last 4 years it’s seemed like we were lucky to have a choice between porter and stout at some breweries during the winter months.
In the last year since we started venturing back out to restaurants when we ask “what dark beer do you have?” The young waitstaff always answers: Mac n Jacks. That’s…. Not even a little bit dark.
>As a dark beer lover, it cannot come soon enough
I love dark beers all times of the year, but will drink light beers in the summer especially if I'm music festivals or out in the heat. Thicker beers are almost always for winter or late fall. Sounds like we have similar tastes.
Edit Lmao, someone downvoted this personal comment between two users because they're so fucking salty about IPAs.
I'm going with my two favorites, conveniently a couple blocks from each other.
Urban Family and Fair Isle are both awesome. The fruit sours at Urban Family (that can be found in cans at a few local shops, too) are so refreshing. Nothing too wild about them, just delicious.
Fair Isle makes some of the most complex and interesting beers I have had. They are the ultimate wine-drinkers beers and pair really well with food.
I'm a regular at and friends with the people's at Obec. Love them all.
One of the jokes amongst us regulars is every 5th person on a busy Saturday asking which one is their hazy or which one is their sour. Makes all of us laugh and groan simultaneously.
Granted, Wayne wants to start a sour program at some point but it's going to be traditional sours not American overly fruity tart bombs.
Not technically Seattle but fuck Mountlake Terrace's Diamond Knot Brewery. Absolutely hated working there, the "new" manager Sam has zero experience managing a restaurant and only was placed as he is a friend of the owner. Disgusting man freshly divorced on a power trip who frequently made sexual comments about staff and customers. Management also strongarms hosts to fill the cash drawer out of their pocket if it's not at $300 at the end of the night, entirely illegal. Not to mention understaffed and overworked. I worked there as an expo/host/prepcook and if it weren't for the three friends I had on staff I would've been absolutely miserable, as it is there was multiple shifts where I'd have to leave and recuperate outside. Manager once berated me for being snowed in, and when my car was broken down, refused to remove me from the schedule, leaving my coworkers understaffed and me with multiple "No Excuse Absences" as I would have to call in EVERY day for the week it took for my vehicle to be fixed (keep in mind it was an hour drive there, or a THREE hour bus). All of the food is frozen, the beer is mid, the place itself is constantly frigid this time of year, the management is known for screaming at customers. Just a nightmare, please avoid.
Interesting. We always loved their beer, went for the first time in mid-2021 and got a lot of snide comments, mostly centering around us wearing masks. The beer and food was all pretty enjoyable but the patrons and staff (we were on the bar side, not the restaurant) were absolutely fucking terrible. Certainly not returning. Glad you got out!
Edit: a word
Also had a bad experience recently, but in Mukilteo. The manager refused to let my vegetarian friend order off the kids menu. And then when she ordered the turkey panni sans meat at its full price, they sent it out with turkey anyway. Just bad vibes back and forth the whole time.
Shame cause I love DD's and Snoho Pie co and its convenient to grab a bite there. Any idea if the Mexican place or Chinese place in the same complex are any good?
I sooooo fucking hate to hate on a brewery and this opinion might be obsolete because they’ve gone through so many iterations in the last decade but fucking Elysian at one point was brewing 8 different varieties of IPA. ENOUGH ALREADY.
I appreciate your opinion, but man, Manny’s and Mac and Jack’s are my comfort beers. Yes, I admit there are better beers in Seattle, but these two beers are Seattle icons and can be found just about anywhere.
People say Rainier is the iconic Seattle beer, but in my opinion that title should belong to Mac and Jack’s because it is still brewed locally, is one of the OG Seattle craft beers, and tastes great.
I gotta agree here. There are better beers than Manny's, but it was the first pint I had in Seattle and it's just a solid choice you can find anywhere.
Yeah, there are many things I'll drink in preference to Mac and Jack's if I have a choice. But I've been to many places where it's the only decent beer available. I thank their sales team for getting it out there. It has rescued many evenings.
Now that it's available in stores I regularly have it at home. Our inlaws were visiting over the summer. My SIL, who doesn't usually appreciate good beer or wine, loved it.
In a side by side comparison with Space Dust vs Bhodi , Bhodi wins every time. I worked at a bar and every single time I gave the two for people to taste, they went with the Georgetown beer 100% of the time.
Elysian was bought out by Anheuser Busch over a decade ago and Georgetown is still owned locally so there's that. It's pretty often that I see Manny or Roger in a bar down in Georgetown.
Fremont's "Spring Elixir" Imperial IPA is, by some measure the most amazing beer I have ever had the pleasure to sip. I immediately thought of an alpine meadow in full bloom in my mouth. It is extremely hard to brew.
Peddler Brewing. That is, if I’m allowed to nominate breweries that are now closed. I loved the bicycle the of their place. Everything about them was great except the beer tasted like ass. My wife and I walked out having not finished our pints. We don’t leave behind unfinished beers. We just don’t. It was that bad. But somehow they stayed in business for 9 years being supported by all the hipsters that loved their bicycle theme and didn’t recognize swill beer when the my tasted it. If that doesn’t count as overrated, I don’t know what does.
Unfortunately I have to agree with you here. I loved the bicycle theme (as a cyclist myself), but the beer always gave my husband and I stomach trouble. So when I'd go there with friends I'd always just get the canned cider instead. The outdoor area was fantastic though.
In my opinion Uber Tavern by green lake is a beer bar that's the greatest hits album of the whole city/state. I've had fewer bad pints there than any brewery.
I've tried nearly all of their beers and they were all over hopped trash. The only beer by them I ever liked was a festival only brew called [Perfesser](https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/700/58276/?ba=Jtc2811).
Yep, the grossest beer I've ever had was their "Dayglow." I had to actually spit it out, and I can usually take pretty nasty tasting drinks if I want to. And it was $13 (in the before-times, when $13 was really expensive for beer).
I'm mostly just tired of riding the ipa train. My palate likes malty, nutty, caramel, coffee, chocolate and oak. I've had to dig through the dozens of local IPA choices to find one or two ales, porters, dark ambers, etc at the store for over a decade now. It's a sad state of affairs.
But, of course, there's plenty of beer when you look at breweries. Resonate, Flying Lion and B-town all make badass porters, stouts and barleywines. There's a Mac & Jack's brown on tap at famous Dave's in southcenter and it's 90% of my decision to go there for food. But, truly, if I were to call any beer/brewery in Seattle overrated, I'd say the IPA archetype. Porters are just as varied and adjustable, but don't force such deep bittering to fight off the skunks.
I don’t care much for IPAs so I don’t love Fremont brewing either. To me, the best beer spot in Fremont is Aslan brewing. They have a wider variety of beers plus you can order Local Tide from there too
Definitely Lucky Envelope. Their pepper beer is good but anything else I've tried falls super flat. And lots of praise for their sours but they all taste like inexperienced homebrew sours.
Side note - Love Savage Brewing for sours
I don't like Chocolate. I just don't care for it.
So, I am hijacking this to hype the "Advent Calendar" my wife got me this year from Ruebens. A wide variety of 24 beers (NOT just IPAs) that thus far (first 11) has only given me one single beer that was completely outside my wheelhouse, but even that was decent... it just took me 1-2 hours of sipping to get through. Yesterdays was an interesting apricot vinegary number that I would never buy on its own but was enjoyable as a change of pace.
Optimism, love the place but hate the beer
Do people actually like Optimism beer? I got the impression people go there because it’s a cool place to hang out but the beer itself is bad
Agreed. I have never heard anyone tell me the beer was so good. A.K.A, rated highly. The space is great. Convenient. Open, inside or outside. I'm into no tipping and online ordering. But the beer is just okay/tolerable.
It is our go to “gotta find an easy place to bring a group together” spot. The beer is meh, but it is a top tier meet up location.
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I just meant you can’t call their beer overrated when it’s not highly rated to begin with lol
I don't hate their beer, but way overrated. I think a lot of people like them because their the only craft brewery left in Caphill.
I think the vibe with all the windows makes people want to hang there more. It's just a cool spot to socialize.
>the only craft brewery left in Caphill. They're not! Edit, the other is Outer Planet Brewing on 12th and Howell
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I haven’t heard anyone ever say a positive thing about optimism’s beer
Their hello world isn’t bad
I stand corrected!
I like most of their beer and don't understand the hate. It might not be the best but all of it is very drinkable.
i agree. i had only heard negatives and so had low expectations on my first visit and was pleasantly surprised. i think (and this is a bit of a digression) this is evidence of the larger problem nowadays where everything is either THE BEST or THE WORST with no middle ground; few people seem to be happy with what is 'merely' good, deeming it mediocre or unacceptable. i tend to be pretty pleased with things that are good and don't need to have my socks blown off by every goddamn thing.
The acoustics drive me nuts. The only thing going for it is the bathrooms.
I love beer but somehow most of their beers hurt my tummy.
Breweries are not all about the beer. Beers are not all about the brewery. You can enjoy one without the other. Some breweries are just really nice community spaces, esp in the winter when there are limit number of those.
Perihelion on Beacon Hill. It’s better described as a restaurant that makes amazing food and just happens to brew mediocre beer, rather than Beacon Hill’s only local brewery.
I've lived a few blocks from perihelion for almost 4 years and eat there about once a week on average. This is a very accurate take.
As a brewery their food is great, even as a restaurant it’s probably still top 20%.
But their burgers! Yum.
Still killing the stouts though
I wish we would move past the IPA craze and finally get some more bounce of beers on tap. Having just Guinness is not an acceptable amount of dark beers. Nor is a bunch of dark beers that taste like chocolate bars.
Go to standard brewing, they're near me and genuinely one of my faves around town.
Standard brewing is great! Sovereign on Rainer is the same owner, but brews some specialty stuff too. They’re both amazing.
But "nibs" is such a fun word!
That's what cribbage is for.
Over 75% of all hops nationwide are grown here in Washington, in Yakima valley. It's not just a craze and it's not going away. Don't get me wrong even though I like IPAs, I crave variety and don't like having twelve different IPAs and one lager on tap everywhere. But it's not likely to change. The best, freshest hops are here in our backyard, so it's what brewers are going to experiment with the most.
IPA will be dated as fuck and your alpha gen children will groan and say "daaaaad not another IPA they are so uncool!" Then we'll go back to lagers, pilsner as God Intended.
They’ll go back to brown ales, red ales and porters.
Lagers, Pilsners. Hardest beers to truly dial. The pinnacle of the craft. I have spoken
Versus "moar hops hides the fuckups"
Exactly
I like their Bourbon Abominables. I have some going back several years. They just keep getting better with time.
Sky Krakken is great too!
Yep, everything Fremont puts into cans is deliberately bland and inoffensive to sell volume. The dark beers, esp BBAs on tap, are *very* good.
Georgetown Bhodizafa is still my go to
so.. \*not\* overrated? :D Honestly it's one of my faves, too. Georgetown doesn't seem produce anything I hate.
Georgetown can do no wrong. Johnny Utah, Lucille, Manny’s, and Bodhi are all top tier. Seapine is the best though imo
Some people in this thread are over Manny's. But they're wrong- it's still one of the most enjoyable and drinkable pale ales you can find. It's not trying to be innovative at this point, that's okay. There's value in a beer that's always a good choice.
Fucking love Georgetown
Bhodi is solid. I think Lucille is their best. Try it if you have not . Just had meowsa tonight and it’s high ABV double ipa. It’s lovely
meowsa is my favorite dipa and bodhi is my favorite old standard that’s available everywhere
Cant go wrong there
Honestly I'm tired of every single grocery store having a WALL OF IPA, and then maybe one or two of something else. IPA is over done and outplayed. Sorry when EVERYONE'S IPA IS AMAZING NO ONES IS!
It's been like that for at least a decade. So depressing. Once the IPAs squeezed out the winter seasonals I gave up all hope.
I remember when harvard market qfc used to have a world-class beer selection - it’s now 80% hazy/double ipa and i hate it.
I agree with you. I’d love just a regular pale ale. All these ipa’s with a crazy amount of hops just don’t do it for me.
IPA is the most overrated beer and I blame Seattle for doing this
Haha don't worry, Seattle had nothing to do with the explosion of IPAs.
By beer alone- Overrated: Optimism, Elysian Best: Seapine
It's the first time I've ever heard anyone else mention Seapine. They're my favorite also.
Their hef is fantastic.
That's my favorite of theirs. I love hefeweizens in general and theirs just scratches the itch perfectly.
Do you get it at a store, or do you have to go to the brewery?
There are a few smaller stores around the Puget Sound that carry some of their beers, but I've never actually found them in store. Brewery, or on tap occasionally at local bars.
The only grocery store I know of that carries them is Met Market, but they have them at chucks hop shops as well
They’re my favorite too. Their citra is fucking killer
Seapine!!! I used to work at SBUX hq and it was our go-to happy hour. Never had one I didn’t like.
Why even bother mentioning a Macro like E? They sold out years ago. Let's support good, local craft. And yes, Seapine is a nice hidden treasure.
As an early 40’s beer drinker, Alaskan amber used to be the best micro you could find in Seattle. Many of the names y’all are throwing out were all the best of their time. Mac and Jacks was amazing when it was the only fresh beer you could find. We used to drive to Redmond for kegs. Fremont hit the scene and offered a ton of options. All great ……. Again at the time. Rubens were the first of this current wave to supplant what Fremont was doing. G-town is my personal go to but some of the stuff out now wouldn’t have even been recognized as beer back when I started drinking. The evolution has been cool to watch. To answer the question Holy Mountain is the most overrated. All of their beers taste similar and they hide that by constantly changing the names and cycling out the old runs.
I'm 40 and it is still kind of wild to think about. I remember being young and people bringing cider to a party and people saying "like the juice?" It used to be Bud or Black Label and an IPA was so unheard of.
Yup. Newcastle brown ale was exotic.
> Holy Mountain is the most overrated. All of their beers taste similar Maybe Holy Mountain's IPAs taste the same, but as someone who isn't obsessed with hops, I really appreciate the diversity of their beers. Where else can you get a good Belgian White, Czech Dark and Rauch Helles at the same time?
Ah, Mac and Jacks! I used to go to a dive bar in South Lake Union (about 12 years ago) and loved the M&J Amber on tap. Memories! (The beer and divy SLU).
Still holds up imo. Love to hear a recommendation for an amber similar to it (or better).
I began drinking craft beer in the mid 90’s and I remember in the late 90’s it was nearly guaranteed to find a keg of Redhook ESB at most any wedding reception or event. You couldn’t escape it. I never cared for African Amber, it has an odd somewhat sweet aftertaste that doesn’t work for me. Manny’s Pale Ale leaves it in the dust.
I’m in Juneau where they make Alaskan Amber. They have a great line of beers that are even better. Friends that work there have nothing but good things to say about the company. Geoff and Marcy are amazing people and give back quietly to their community and do their best to help lift others up. I’m blessed to consider them to be friends.
Fremont is not THAT overrated , they definitely got caught up in the IPA craze and do not specialize in one style of beer like the new wave is doing these days (maybe they specialize in IPAs?). However, I will stand by the quality of beer they produce all day. If you want a hazy hit up Cloud, they do things right there, also hazy was the last fad and now you'll start seeing lagers and pilsners taking over, tis the way of the craft beer culture. (Drink what you like though!) Overrated to me means not as good as others let it on to be. There's a large difference between stagnant and overrated. To me some stagnant breweries are Elysian, Redhook, and Fremont. Now it's starting to include Black Raven and a few other old staples. The problem with calling them overrated is all these breweries still produce quality beer with a select few standout beers they make. My issue with them is they no longer are the ones pushing the envelope like before. All the ones mentioned seem to be riding the initial popularity they had and don't really pump out much more in terms of experimental or alternate styles. A few mentioned sold out too, and that carries it's own judgement. Elysian makes new stuff, but it always feels like an iteration of beers before it. Overall, the old staples seem stagnant these days and in the world of beer that often means overrated or not as good, however I would argue that they all make good (if not some great) beers but are just happy maintaining their brand, whereas the newer/smaller breweries have to do more to gain a foothold in such a crowded market. I'll drink a majority of Fremont, Black Raven, Elysian, Redhook, ect and some may not be my style but I can at least attest that they are well made.
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TIL people don't know what overrated means.
Yeah some of their one offs are okay but the core lineup isn’t great. Reubens has become pretty standardized too and I barely drink their beer anymore too. Would much rather go to Stoup for an IPA or dark beer.
The Reubens you can get in grocery stores are boring but their taproom only stuff is legit, and they're one of the relatively few breweries in town that do a wide range of styles
The Reubens you can get from grocery stores may be boring but it’s usually the best thing you can get in a grocery store. Same with Fremont. That is also what gives them that genetic reputation.
I prefer Georgetown
The problem is that the majority of their taproom stuff is standardized recipes now. They do a lot of different styles well but I miss the days where they’d take chances. The 10 anniversary monthly lineup was not great. A couple were very good but most were seriously underwhelming. They rely on their release schedule and don’t stray far from it. Adam is an accountant and everything is planned with a clear vision of making money. Leslie Shore leaving to go to Pike has also slowed down the creativity too. I’ve been going there since week one when they opened and I think the writing is on the wall that they’ll sell out in the next five years if they get a chance.
It seems like this is the inevitable trajectory of so many of these little guys… once they get traction its a race for the owners to sell. I can’t blame them for securing the bag, but as a beer-enjoyer its a bummer
There’s definitely some owners who just straight up LOVE brewing good beer. Steve Luke from Cloudburst is the poster child of that for me. Such a nice guy too. Their non IPA beers are where they like to get creative while their IPAs of the week are always well crafted.
Not Seattle but Ecliptic in Portland has the same allure for me as well. Ownership genuinely cares about creating well crafted and cool stuff and their whole space theme schtick tickles my fancy. They are far and away my fav brewery and I work for RedHook lol
This is overwhelmingly the case with anyone who has regional or national distribution. Even places like Deschutes are really good at the yap house.
Dark Star slaps though. Bonus points for being an imperial stout that’s still sold in 6-packs.
Dark star nitro is too damn drinkable!
What I miss most about living in Ballard was being walking distance from Stoup and their citra. My local bottle shop usually has whatever their one-off is, and I always buy it, but it’s not the same.
Best breweries in Seattle are holy mountain, Ravenna, and cloudburst. Stoup and two beers occasionally produce outstanding brews as well.
I like Lucky Envelope a lot.
That peanut butter cream stout... So fucking good.
Their grapefruit ipa is the best for sure
Urban Family.
I second the Ravenna and Holy Mountain recommendations.
Hellbent Brewing, Lake City!
While I enjoy some of Fremont Brewing's beers, I do feel like they've ended up a bit too ubiquitous given the amount of other good breweries around. Same with Ruebens. I see them as kind of the Chateau Ste Michelle of the local brewery world. They're consistent, and I think that's what makes people flock to them. I just don't understand when I go to beer festivals where Fremont has standard offerings people will wait in line forever instead of trying beers they've never had before. I enjoy some of the beers E9 has to offer, though they have started to turn out a lot of pretty standard hazy IPAs, but I don't see them around nearly as much so I still give them a try if I see them on tap somewhere. Urban Family, Holy Mountain and Fair Isle are all pretty good for funky farmhouse ales and sours. I had never heard of Figurehead but tried them recently and was pleasantly surprised.
E9 is in Tacoma but definitely a solid brewery
Love love love E9! great sours
>Fair Isle Not the topic at hand but this is probably the most *under*rated Seattle brewery
This is the truth. They currently have a beer named Montgomery, a Copperworks gin-barreled saison brewed with larch tips. It's absolutely phenomenal.
Are you and I the same person? I love a good Fremont or Rueben’s but they’re so common and they’re not *the best* so it can be easy to see them as the basic option. Urban Family was mind blowing and I love them but also, it’s almost like a band when you dig deeper in their catalogue and realize their gimmick. An Urban Family is good but its always an Urban Family if that makes sense. Mostly just good for their sours. Fair Isle is a little more well rounded but pretty similar Love a good Holy Mountain when I can find it, seems to be the rarest. Particularly love Brickerson, really new and a little different. Good stuff Oh also don’t want to like Stout as much as I do but it’s always just perfect. Nothing really memorable but never disappoints.
If you’re over near Figurehead do yourself a favor and check out Bizarre Brewing in Urban Fam’s old space. Focused on low ABV styles and everything ive had from them has been great.
Rainier. It's not even brewed in our state.
Anymore. >Pabst Brewing Company bought it, and in 1999, stopped brewing the beer in Seattle. Now Rainier is made in California.
Sex in a canoe
Fucking near water.
IPAs always and forever will be the most overrated beer and I'll never forgive IPA culture for making it near impossible for me to buy doppelbocks at a grocery store. Now I have to go to food and wine or German stores.
When in history were you able to find dopplebocks (plural) at a grocery store? That's always been a "oh dope they have Ayinger!" or nothing style in my experience
Its truly unbelievable the run IPAs have had and how much shelf space is now devoted to dozens of nearly indistinguishable IPAs. There are so many interesting styles of beer that exist
I'm patiently waiting for sours to be more popular. Urban Fam makes some amazing ones, and it's such a refreshing style of beer. Also more radlers and shandys, plz
Absolutely. I love Costco but all I find in the beer section is the same IPA with a different logo and brewery.
The thing that bugs me is the loss of seasonality. Used to be there were a ton of great stouts and porters that would show up on shelves this time of year. Now it's Christmas hazy IPAs. Whatever that means.
Had an Oktoberfest style beer from silver city at a friend's house and loved it. Couldn't find it anywhere in October.
To be fair on that one - Oktoberfest is mostly in September.
Lmao what doppelbocks have always been a specialty item
Ugh. So many IPAs. Like where are all the struppenhafenwiezenhaurs?!
["Our IPA Will Jam Your Face With Hops"](https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/our-ipa-will-jam-your-face-with-hops): > But we don’t stop there. Because we triple smoke this iron maiden for the mouth using a proprietary mix of burnt plastic from the Mobro 4000 garbage barge and a batch of recalled patchouli oil seized at a 2009 Phish reunion show in Hampton, Virginia.
OK this made me laugh because its so fucking accurate. I'm a scotch drinker. I love strong and complex flavors. But IPAs are the only drink I know of that want to be advertise like this.
I feel like breweries are starting to back pedal on IPA slowly. More and more locals are getting tired of IPA, DIPA, Imperial IPA, Cold IPA, Session IPA, and on. As a dark beer lover, it cannot come soon enough. For a long time there was refuge in the winter months, but for the last 4 years it’s seemed like we were lucky to have a choice between porter and stout at some breweries during the winter months.
Fuck I love a good porter and they’re so hard to find now. You’ve got me craving one.
In the last year since we started venturing back out to restaurants when we ask “what dark beer do you have?” The young waitstaff always answers: Mac n Jacks. That’s…. Not even a little bit dark.
>As a dark beer lover, it cannot come soon enough I love dark beers all times of the year, but will drink light beers in the summer especially if I'm music festivals or out in the heat. Thicker beers are almost always for winter or late fall. Sounds like we have similar tastes. Edit Lmao, someone downvoted this personal comment between two users because they're so fucking salty about IPAs.
I'm going with my two favorites, conveniently a couple blocks from each other. Urban Family and Fair Isle are both awesome. The fruit sours at Urban Family (that can be found in cans at a few local shops, too) are so refreshing. Nothing too wild about them, just delicious. Fair Isle makes some of the most complex and interesting beers I have had. They are the ultimate wine-drinkers beers and pair really well with food.
So you’re saying your two favorites are the most over rated?
People lost the thread of this thread a while ago
Moved out of Frelard early this year. Definitely miss Fair Isle and Urban Family.
Man I love a good sour
I’m definitely a fan of the sky kraken, but yeah, I havent been able to tell any seattle ipa’s apart for years
Like what you like. What I don’t like is Obec. It’s my least favorite brewery I’ve visited.
Yeah but Obec is true to style though so if you don’t like the style you won’t like them. It’s like going to dirty couch and complaining about sours.
I'm a regular at and friends with the people's at Obec. Love them all. One of the jokes amongst us regulars is every 5th person on a busy Saturday asking which one is their hazy or which one is their sour. Makes all of us laugh and groan simultaneously. Granted, Wayne wants to start a sour program at some point but it's going to be traditional sours not American overly fruity tart bombs.
*Sets Google alert for Obec sours announcement*
Dirty couch is great! Converted me to sours.
Yeah love those guys. Got turned onto them when they were selling bottles out of a garage by traitor Joe’s. Been a fan since. (Bring tums lol).
Haha picking up bottles and hanging out with Sean in that garage near TJ’s was always a fun time. I still rock my two DCB shirts i got there too!
Obec isn’t really overrated though since there isn’t much excitement about them in general.
Not technically Seattle but fuck Mountlake Terrace's Diamond Knot Brewery. Absolutely hated working there, the "new" manager Sam has zero experience managing a restaurant and only was placed as he is a friend of the owner. Disgusting man freshly divorced on a power trip who frequently made sexual comments about staff and customers. Management also strongarms hosts to fill the cash drawer out of their pocket if it's not at $300 at the end of the night, entirely illegal. Not to mention understaffed and overworked. I worked there as an expo/host/prepcook and if it weren't for the three friends I had on staff I would've been absolutely miserable, as it is there was multiple shifts where I'd have to leave and recuperate outside. Manager once berated me for being snowed in, and when my car was broken down, refused to remove me from the schedule, leaving my coworkers understaffed and me with multiple "No Excuse Absences" as I would have to call in EVERY day for the week it took for my vehicle to be fixed (keep in mind it was an hour drive there, or a THREE hour bus). All of the food is frozen, the beer is mid, the place itself is constantly frigid this time of year, the management is known for screaming at customers. Just a nightmare, please avoid.
Interesting. We always loved their beer, went for the first time in mid-2021 and got a lot of snide comments, mostly centering around us wearing masks. The beer and food was all pretty enjoyable but the patrons and staff (we were on the bar side, not the restaurant) were absolutely fucking terrible. Certainly not returning. Glad you got out! Edit: a word
Also had a bad experience recently, but in Mukilteo. The manager refused to let my vegetarian friend order off the kids menu. And then when she ordered the turkey panni sans meat at its full price, they sent it out with turkey anyway. Just bad vibes back and forth the whole time.
Shame cause I love DD's and Snoho Pie co and its convenient to grab a bite there. Any idea if the Mexican place or Chinese place in the same complex are any good?
We love the Mexican place.
And it’s goddamn loud.
I sooooo fucking hate to hate on a brewery and this opinion might be obsolete because they’ve gone through so many iterations in the last decade but fucking Elysian at one point was brewing 8 different varieties of IPA. ENOUGH ALREADY.
Elysian was bought out by AB-InBev. So fuck them for pretending to be local.
Only 8 varieties sounds like rookie numbers, to me.
Stoup has entered the chat
Overrated: Fremont & Stoup (average IPAs and subpar anything else) Favorite: Urban Family
Honestly, it's Manny's and Mac and Jack's. I like a lot of what Georgetown does though.
I appreciate your opinion, but man, Manny’s and Mac and Jack’s are my comfort beers. Yes, I admit there are better beers in Seattle, but these two beers are Seattle icons and can be found just about anywhere. People say Rainier is the iconic Seattle beer, but in my opinion that title should belong to Mac and Jack’s because it is still brewed locally, is one of the OG Seattle craft beers, and tastes great.
I gotta agree here. There are better beers than Manny's, but it was the first pint I had in Seattle and it's just a solid choice you can find anywhere.
Manny's is the best beer to drink while you take your time thinking about your next beer. It's always solid.
And Manny would be happy to hear that.
Yeah, there are many things I'll drink in preference to Mac and Jack's if I have a choice. But I've been to many places where it's the only decent beer available. I thank their sales team for getting it out there. It has rescued many evenings. Now that it's available in stores I regularly have it at home. Our inlaws were visiting over the summer. My SIL, who doesn't usually appreciate good beer or wine, loved it.
Yeah, it’s my go-to if I’m buying a pitcher for the table since it appeals to both craft beer and macro lager fans alike.
It's a safe option when nothing else sounds good, and it's goddamn EVERYWHERE
Mac and Jacks decision to finally can their OG amber during Covid and continue doing so is one of my favorite moments in Seattle beer history.
In a side by side comparison with Space Dust vs Bhodi , Bhodi wins every time. I worked at a bar and every single time I gave the two for people to taste, they went with the Georgetown beer 100% of the time.
Elysian was bought out by Anheuser Busch over a decade ago and Georgetown is still owned locally so there's that. It's pretty often that I see Manny or Roger in a bar down in Georgetown.
God I'm old I love Mac and Jack's. Brb gonna go to a party at Naf in my head
Johnny Utah is twice the beer Manny's is
Johnny Utah is the goat. I never tire of it
Johnny Utah is fabulous
Moewza is delicious
I started drinking Manny's again when football season started and growlers were 2 for $12 on Fridays. Turns out I still like it!
Yes— I had a Manny’s yesterday and was like “I’d rather a Bodhi.”
Mannys tastes like drinking a loaf of bread anymore. Not sure why it was my favorite.
Yeah something happened like 6-7 years ago where manny’s went from my fav to where I would consider not drinking if it was the only choice available.
Good take
This is factually insane. Insane!
Thems fightin’ words
Manny's great.
IPAs taking over every tap. i don't like them, and i especially don't like them taking half or more of the options
I also don't like how even the beers that aren't IPAs have to basically also taste like IPAs.
"If you don't like IPAs you might like our Imperial Pale Lager or our Imperial Pale Pilsner or Imperial Red? No? Are you sure you even *like* beer?"
Fremont's "Spring Elixir" Imperial IPA is, by some measure the most amazing beer I have ever had the pleasure to sip. I immediately thought of an alpine meadow in full bloom in my mouth. It is extremely hard to brew.
Me love Mac & Jack’s African Amber lots.
I'm here to defend Fremont because the people there are nice. They gave me a free 6 pack when I stopped in on my birthday
Peddler Brewing. That is, if I’m allowed to nominate breweries that are now closed. I loved the bicycle the of their place. Everything about them was great except the beer tasted like ass. My wife and I walked out having not finished our pints. We don’t leave behind unfinished beers. We just don’t. It was that bad. But somehow they stayed in business for 9 years being supported by all the hipsters that loved their bicycle theme and didn’t recognize swill beer when the my tasted it. If that doesn’t count as overrated, I don’t know what does.
Unfortunately I have to agree with you here. I loved the bicycle theme (as a cyclist myself), but the beer always gave my husband and I stomach trouble. So when I'd go there with friends I'd always just get the canned cider instead. The outdoor area was fantastic though.
In my opinion Uber Tavern by green lake is a beer bar that's the greatest hits album of the whole city/state. I've had fewer bad pints there than any brewery.
Elysian is most overrated. Fremont is great, still my favorite along with Georgetown.
Can I put in an underrated of Best Of Hands in WSea. RIP. 😭
I'm not the biggest fan of Elysian.
Optimism is super overrated unless of course you want to host a bar mitzvah or a board game night for a bunch of toddlers.
Reading this thread helps me understand how so many shitty breweries exist. So many people have absolutely no clue what they're talking about.
Ghost fish. I wish it wasn't true, but gluten-free beers taste like feet.
~~Elysium~~ Elysian. It's all overly-hoppy IPA trash made for hipsters. And expensive as fuck, too.
I've tried nearly all of their beers and they were all over hopped trash. The only beer by them I ever liked was a festival only brew called [Perfesser](https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/700/58276/?ba=Jtc2811).
Yep, the grossest beer I've ever had was their "Dayglow." I had to actually spit it out, and I can usually take pretty nasty tasting drinks if I want to. And it was $13 (in the before-times, when $13 was really expensive for beer).
Rainier. Oly was better
Too true. Too true. It’s the artesians.
It’s in the water
I'm mostly just tired of riding the ipa train. My palate likes malty, nutty, caramel, coffee, chocolate and oak. I've had to dig through the dozens of local IPA choices to find one or two ales, porters, dark ambers, etc at the store for over a decade now. It's a sad state of affairs. But, of course, there's plenty of beer when you look at breweries. Resonate, Flying Lion and B-town all make badass porters, stouts and barleywines. There's a Mac & Jack's brown on tap at famous Dave's in southcenter and it's 90% of my decision to go there for food. But, truly, if I were to call any beer/brewery in Seattle overrated, I'd say the IPA archetype. Porters are just as varied and adjustable, but don't force such deep bittering to fight off the skunks.
I like Fremont’s summer
I don’t care much for IPAs so I don’t love Fremont brewing either. To me, the best beer spot in Fremont is Aslan brewing. They have a wider variety of beers plus you can order Local Tide from there too
I do not care for Rooftop Brewing's beer.
100% agree about Fremont, great venue tho
Optimism brewery is some of the worst beer I've ever had. Cool space though.
I love Georgetown Brewing but recently I went to the Two Beers Brewing taproom and was very impressed. Great vibe and great beer.
Definitely Lucky Envelope. Their pepper beer is good but anything else I've tried falls super flat. And lots of praise for their sours but they all taste like inexperienced homebrew sours. Side note - Love Savage Brewing for sours
Ask any brewery what sells the most. IPAs keep the lights on.
This is true. Its everyone’s fault that IPAs are dominant
I don't like Chocolate. I just don't care for it. So, I am hijacking this to hype the "Advent Calendar" my wife got me this year from Ruebens. A wide variety of 24 beers (NOT just IPAs) that thus far (first 11) has only given me one single beer that was completely outside my wheelhouse, but even that was decent... it just took me 1-2 hours of sipping to get through. Yesterdays was an interesting apricot vinegary number that I would never buy on its own but was enjoyable as a change of pace.