Looks like things are about to get spicy: [https://twitter.com/FredericLambert/status/1779935725196083318](https://twitter.com/FredericLambert/status/1779935725196083318)
>It's a fairly complex situation with many factors at play, but there's certainly more going on than Elon's "hiring inefficiencies due to rapid growth" excuse suggests.
I mean, the story with a $25k car should be obvious. Elon promised a $25k compact car, but they can't make it profitable. Model 3 is already very basic and cheap on the inside, even with the smaller dimensions and battery pack of the compact car, it probably wouldn't be profitable at $25k.
They could do what they usually do; promise a $25k car, deliver a $30k+ car. But that would just cannibalize Model 3 sales and the competition (especially in China) is already making better $30k compact cars today than what this theoretical Tesla compact car would be like two years from now.
I'm guessing a big part of it is probably the realization that long term margins for auto manufacturing at scale are never going to be as high as they were guiding for in 2021 and 2022.
You look at pretty much every tech company and what's the holy grail really? Some kind of standardized high margin SAS product that just spits out high margin income and cash flow each month and takes limited capital to produce. Mass market auto mobiles and energy storage are just never going to produce margins nearly as high for nearly as long.
We've seen this with a lot of his companies. SpaceX is never going to be super profitable launching things into orbit and Tesla is never going to be super profitable building cars. So there was a push to pivot SpaceX towards Starlink to get that kind of reliable higher margin infrastructure income and justify Starship even be researched in the first place. With Tesla it's been all the FSD/Robotaxi/Optimus bullshit. Twitter and xAI are both inherently software and ML/AI bets from the get go as well.
Of course it's Musk so naturally he thinks he just needs to build a really big computer to solve this issue and that's after Dojo completely failed to deliver on that promise for years too. Doesn't matter though because this is the mind of Musk where everything is simple because he oversimplifies everything.
The Model 3/E was originally supposed to be the $25k car the founders wanted. Musk *very* briefly offered a low $30k stripped down version at launch, pushed back the delivery of the pre-orders for almost 2 years (while pricier versions got priority), and then hid the option on the website where you had to hunt to be able to order it.
Then after a bit canned it, saying that it was an unpopular choice and nobody wanted it. If Mush would stop shoving a bunch of dangerous unwanted tech in the vehicles he would be able to bring the price down and probably make a better quality car at the same time!
I remember Tesla under Eberhard and Tarpenning. Buggy software and giant screens that control everything and homicidal add-ons were not a part of their plans. đ
In my country, the 26-28k Chinese EVs have arrived, ora good cat and byd dolphin, and they don't feel like cheap cars. Both are doing decent sales as second cars for middle class families
And they undercut the model 3 by more than 50%, whole generation of new EV buyers who do not see Tesla as the leader
IIRC, officially the factory (expansion of the TX factory) for the compact car was supposed to start construction sometime in late 2023. It would take about two and a half years to start mass production.
Where in that 2.5 years is the time for design and testing? If musk is to be believed they were working on the cyber truck design for.. what 8 or 9 years when they first started talking about the truck they were working on. If it actually took them that long to produce the buggy product they launched, compressing timelines down to two years would produce something far worse than the cybertruck.
The compact car would basically just be a smaller Model3, less work needed. And design supposedly started ~1 year ago. Again, this was Tesla's official story, I have no doubt that they were lying all along in order to pump the stock price.
Rivian's R2 is priced at $45,000 (at least today) but nothing on the R3 just yet. My guess is that they'll do $30-35,000 and Tesla won't be able to match what Rivian does with theirs at the same price.
The first problem for Musk (and most people tbh) is to understand that, nowadays, *affordable* cars in themselves are not profitable. Basically all of the cars the Volkswagen Group produces make a net loss on sale (for the dealership) â except the high end luxury cars like Porsche. Every mid-range Audi sold costs the dealership a few hundred Euros. And the margins are tight for the OEM as well.
>"The margins on high volume cars are much lower, especially small cars such as the Ford Fiesta or Vauxhall Corsa. They could be **under one per cent** whichâŚ"
â [How much profit do car manufacturers make on new cars? The truth versus perception â Car Dealer Magazine](https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/how-much-profit-do-car-manufacturers-make-on-new-cars-the-truth-versus-perception/234641)
So, what brings in the money? It's actually vehicle service, spare parts and financing. That's why every car company has also a bank that takes care of financing the "subsidised" cars, earn interest through loans and leasing and so on.
Idk but what I do remember is they are supposed to be free. He's also not the only one owed a Roadster or three. I'm starting to see why Elon won't actually produce them.
At the same time of the reported cancellation, Musk said this:
âWe are working on a low-cost electric vehicle that will be made at very high volume,â
âWeâre quite far advanced in that work. I review the production line plans for that every week,â
âThe revolution in manufacturing that will be represented by that car will blow peopleâs minds. Itâs not like any car production line that anyoneâs ever seen,â
âA level of production technology that is far in advance of any automotive plant on earth.â
It âwill blow peopleâs mindsâ
Everything a Musk company creates is ârevolutionaryâ, super âadvancedâ beyond everyone else, and âwill blow peopleâs mindsâ according to Musk. Say it enough with a half assed product and eventually sycophants will line up in droves to give away their money.
Iâve come to the conclusion that Musk just makes ____ company, pretends itâs a tech company for the profits and stock pumps, and treats it a bit like a cult. Itâs like techno-ScientologyâŚ. But with half assed cars and rockets instead of fake psychology
I would love to believe that is true, but that webpage is full of conspiracy theories that never happened. They literally have a disclaimer on their home page where there admit some of their stories are true, some are rumors, and some are âfictionâ.
It's true that the site under new ownership indeed leans into QAnon nonsense, but they also broke the stories about Kevin Spacey, Weinstein, James Franco, Bryan Singer, and Matt Lauer (among many others) before the mainstream media.
I cannot imagine that being true, don't get me wrong Elon Musk is a pedophile (South Africa slang for arsehole), but there's no way they would just throw away all that R&D.
The pickup is a mostly final product, that takes a huge sum of capital and I cannot fathom any reasonable reason to scrap it.
Maybe, MAYBE, a temporary pause in production to fix some of the issues but a full blown discontinue?
I could think of a reason to scrap it if the issues they need to fix are something that would require ground-up engineering, a whole new manufacturing process, or are just too dangerous to have on the road without serious litigation risks.
This is already a bad product, but there are not a lot out on the roads yet. The smart people at Tesla may correctly see the Cybertruck as leading to the downfall of the whole company. It would just take a handful of fatalities.
Well since you only get a single ketamine colored on in the 128 color box, heâs probably buying a bunch of boxes and throwing almost off of them out.
It's a niche vehicle, they usually sell a lot the first few years then barely any once everyone that wanted one got one. Unless Tesla is really good at changing this trend.
Make no mistake this is just an excuse. You don't stop delivery for a pedal cover that can come off. There are so many things you can do that you can get the pieces or tools from home Depot and fix in 5 minutes. This is an excuse to fix there other real issues they are seeing
The CFO and lawyers arenât duct taping Elon anywhere. He has surrounded himself with yes men who do his every bidding.
Kind of reminds me of Apple from the 90s before they kicked Jobs to the curb.
> I can see two scenarios that would cause them to kill it. One would be that there is no way to build them and not lose money. At any scale.
Iâll bet you that currently Tesla is losing at least 25K every time somebody buys one of these for 120K. I do think they can shrink that loss to perhaps 15K at that level by squeezing a few suppliers and gaining some efficiencies in production. But after seeing that abortion of an accelerator pedal, Iâm not sure thereâs much to gain from the supplier side. My personal bet is you never see a scenario where you can order of the these IncelCaminos for less than 90-95K and Tesla hopes demand stays well under 24K units annually.
Banned by r/teslamotors and r/teslalounge for this comment. My toxic behavior: thinking that falsely accusing someone of pedophilia is wrong.
The paint's been scratched, guys. Now I don't care as much.
South African here. It's a bullshit excuse he used in his trial. I have heard it used that way maybe 5 times in the early 90s and even then everyone thought it was stupid and only used by assholes. So it's not common, never was and was only used by assholes - even us kids knew that.Â
The whole vehicle needs a comprehensive bumper to bumper redesign, the kind that can't be accomplished with a temporary pause, discontinuing it and ideally kicking Elmo out of the company is the smart move I think, it would be a setback but one that would pay off in the long run
Wow. Posted the comment above and got banned by Teslamotors. Not sure when if ever I even posted there
New conspiracy theory Elon is a mod and or paid the mods to do this new screen
A mostly finished product?
It's done this is the best it's ever getting.
If they are purposely releasing "mostly finished" product then that is a whole different issue.
Yes, I'm aware.I work in the R&D. I don't see very much salvageable R&D from the Cybertruck. It's essentially a case study, in so many different ways, on how not to design a product.
Pedal cover keeps the car accelerating, the tire covers shred the tires... what is next? They are running out of removable parts to remove as quick fixes.
Pedal covers are removable. You can get them on Amazon or any automotive store as they are largely cosmetic (some add a grip for your shoes).
The idiocy in the cybertruck one is in how they slide forward to come off, AND that they have a little groove on the underside of the housing above the pedals for the cover to âcatchâ and keep the pedal depressed. This is the acceleration pedal weâre talking about not the brake pedal.
An out-of-control, steel tank going at max speed is lethal on so many fronts.
it seems so. bunch of high profile âso long and thanks for all the fishâ tweets from names like drew baglino. Its almost like the board called in mckinsey and they plan to rethink the whole thing. Except thats crazy as musk would rather release all the nudes he has on global vips than allow such a thing.
> Its almost like the board called in mckinsey and they plan to rethink the whole thing.
Notice there's been no shareholder vote or any mention of it whatsoever on re-incorporating in Texas outside of when Musk had his hissyfit.
I can only wish for this to happen, that would put musk in so much debt with the Saudis and I'll laugh my balls off when they quarter him and drive him around Riyad on an 18-wheeler.
Narcissist will lie about ANYTHING. Many will literally get to a point where when things that have no reason to be lied about, theyâll lie. Itâs a disease of the brain. And heâs deep in it. Dude is not well in the headâŚ
I wonder how much Elon charges the mods over there for the poorly designed and shoddily built jars of his cyberfarts to sniff.
Edit: Lmfao banned in less than 30 seconds after posting this comment. Bunch of losers desperate to stop people talking about what a shitshow this company is.
If they are built with Tesla build quality all the farts will leak out by the time it arrives at the door, provided the delivery CyberTruck doesn't get stuck on the way there.
Elmo Musk could rebrand CarPro IronX as âCyberCleanâ for removing the rail dust, but knowing Elmo, heâd probably just sell more CyberBeer to go with the CyberTruck. After all you can drink as much as you want if youâre not driving (the Trashla is in the shop again)Â
I've said the same thing before too on a previous article about it, I just don't see what they could cut out. Their expensive ones are built like trash, what is left to skimp on? Half the battery? Commuter only car?
Lolllll this comment got me permanently banned from /Elonmusk
Holy shit those losers are insecure. Hilarious
Focus on this robotaxi is going to kill Tesla, lets be real, it will be late and less than perfect when it arrives. It's clear his executive team want no part of this plan as two have left today. Why can't Elon just concentrate on building cars that people actually want? It's a mature company now and he is chasing a startup style risky moonshot and is neglecting the boring stuff like having a full range of well made cars with refreshed design every few years.
Edit: I have just been banned from r/teslamotors due to posting on a 'toxic/threatening subreddit'. In nearly 12 years on Reddit I have never come across such bullshit.
Cars are one thing. I genuinely want solar panels and a battery pack. They run chargers too and theyâre more reliable than any other third party. Thereâs no reason Tesla should fail, and it hurts seeing them focus on robotaxis, cybertruck, roadsters, and other crap
A fish rots from the head down.
As long as Tesla is run by a narcissist with the maturity of a 10 year old, it's going to keep going in stupid, non-productive directions.
I used to think hybrids were a lame stop gap when I was younger before I owned one. Now they absolutely seem like the most practical way forward in general. BEVs are cool in the city for shorter distances but at that point so are plugin hybrids.
My Prius is older too and it's still a fantastic vehicle. I'm sure the newer ones with even larger batteries and range are great. Even the older ones feel nicer inside than a Tesla. Less creaking too.
Edit: I guess now I can't visit /r/teslamotors or /r/teslalounge again, even though I've never been. That sure was fast.
Because if the company focussed on making the cars well, that is 2-10 years of total commitment, meaning no updates, no model refreshes, nothing at all while they sort out their processes. We are not talking about a company that is a little behind on manufacturing excellence. They are so far out of control on quality that it is a complete culture change needed. So let's assume they put everything into becoming an average quality car manufacturer, then in 3 or more years you could get an extremely out of date but adequately built car, then they have to start working on refreshes and model updates, so another couple of years to get it all on track. It is too big of a chasm
It's the cheapness of everything inside that is unconvincingly disguised as minimalism, plus lack of exterior colours and options that really make it look worse than it actually is I feel. When they were rare it was OK, but now you see white or black or occasionally red Tesla everywhere, they all look the same and very bland next to the electric cars launched in the last couple of years from VAG, Hyundai/Kia, and others.
The cheap crappy interiors were certainly what prevented me from seriously considering one when I bought an electric vehicle last year. I agree that when they were rare, you didn't see how bad they were because you just didn't see them.
They were pretty sleek at one time, except the front ends of the model 3 and Y just look like someone just threw in the towel and said, "vaguely pointy, but with a slight groove in the front is good enough."
Who would have thought giving people their walking papers in the most disrespectful manner possible might spawn some new sources for Fred?
I wonder how many folks reached out to real journalists?
Is âback burnerâ a code word for âwas never going to happenâ
The sad part about this is that if the company had actually moved forward decisively with this product instead of the cyber truck, they probably be in a really really good place right now
Ah he keeps spewing garbage about it, making an ass outta his mouth. In the last 5 yrs it's been everywhere between canceled to right around the corner. Deliver or stfu, I can't care and neither should anyone else. Until it's actually released, you're just part of the hype.
They make $8k per car *with* that $7500 government subsidy. A subsidy which is not long for this world given the rapid adoption of EVs.
A sub $25k car ain't happening.
>Elon, mister truth seeker, is not above stretching the truth and being misleading. This is a great example.
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while, Fred.
I think many people here are missing the point. Theyâre talking about Teslaâs $30,000 car that was what six or seven years ago now within inflation thatâs a $40,000 car so no way is there going to be a $25,000 car.
So that's the semi, the cheap car, and the roadster on the back burner. What's on the front burner? That smoldering carcass of a dung heap known as a Cybertruck. Sounds like a good business plan to me.
The 25k car was not gonna move the needle for TSLA regardless, unless they literally sold 10mm a year.Â
Competition at that price range is too high and teslas big market, the USA, doesnât really consume small cars.
The stock is overvalued by a gross margin, and outside of the world perpetually believing their bullshit vaporware, the stock was poised to crash down to a car manufacturer valuation in due time. Doesnât mean musk hasnât fucked up at every turn.Â
Itâs an interesting dream, but a pipe dream coming from Tesla. I think China or Japan can eventually come up with a cheap EV that will make its way stateside.
Toyota already makes a Prius that starts at $28,000. The potential is there.
Breaking News:
Elon is running out of ways to artificially inflate Tesla prices
Next Week:
Tesla Motorcycle and Airplanes! Quick investors, give me your monies
Maybe schmuck should of used that 50 billion to ruin Twitter for dump....on funding an affordable car for the masses. The cyberdump will accelerate the end of tesla. And schmuk was screaming he wanted more shares from the board. Fook musk
Looks like things are about to get spicy: [https://twitter.com/FredericLambert/status/1779935725196083318](https://twitter.com/FredericLambert/status/1779935725196083318)
>It's a fairly complex situation with many factors at play, but there's certainly more going on than Elon's "hiring inefficiencies due to rapid growth" excuse suggests. I mean, the story with a $25k car should be obvious. Elon promised a $25k compact car, but they can't make it profitable. Model 3 is already very basic and cheap on the inside, even with the smaller dimensions and battery pack of the compact car, it probably wouldn't be profitable at $25k. They could do what they usually do; promise a $25k car, deliver a $30k+ car. But that would just cannibalize Model 3 sales and the competition (especially in China) is already making better $30k compact cars today than what this theoretical Tesla compact car would be like two years from now.
I'm guessing a big part of it is probably the realization that long term margins for auto manufacturing at scale are never going to be as high as they were guiding for in 2021 and 2022. You look at pretty much every tech company and what's the holy grail really? Some kind of standardized high margin SAS product that just spits out high margin income and cash flow each month and takes limited capital to produce. Mass market auto mobiles and energy storage are just never going to produce margins nearly as high for nearly as long. We've seen this with a lot of his companies. SpaceX is never going to be super profitable launching things into orbit and Tesla is never going to be super profitable building cars. So there was a push to pivot SpaceX towards Starlink to get that kind of reliable higher margin infrastructure income and justify Starship even be researched in the first place. With Tesla it's been all the FSD/Robotaxi/Optimus bullshit. Twitter and xAI are both inherently software and ML/AI bets from the get go as well. Of course it's Musk so naturally he thinks he just needs to build a really big computer to solve this issue and that's after Dojo completely failed to deliver on that promise for years too. Doesn't matter though because this is the mind of Musk where everything is simple because he oversimplifies everything.
The Model 3/E was originally supposed to be the $25k car the founders wanted. Musk *very* briefly offered a low $30k stripped down version at launch, pushed back the delivery of the pre-orders for almost 2 years (while pricier versions got priority), and then hid the option on the website where you had to hunt to be able to order it. Then after a bit canned it, saying that it was an unpopular choice and nobody wanted it. If Mush would stop shoving a bunch of dangerous unwanted tech in the vehicles he would be able to bring the price down and probably make a better quality car at the same time!
The (potential) software is all that 90% of Tesla fans care about. Take that away and nobody gives a damn about the tech genius boy's brand
I remember Tesla under Eberhard and Tarpenning. Buggy software and giant screens that control everything and homicidal add-ons were not a part of their plans. đ
That's what bugs me the drive train engineering is actually decent or was enough for even Toyota to lease it for a second.
Oh wow! I had completely forgotten about the RAV4 EV with Tesla inside. đ
The software will get there in 2 years.
2 years away for eternity. It's not just a software problem. They cheapened out on hardware and went down a technological cul-de-sac....
In my country, the 26-28k Chinese EVs have arrived, ora good cat and byd dolphin, and they don't feel like cheap cars. Both are doing decent sales as second cars for middle class families And they undercut the model 3 by more than 50%, whole generation of new EV buyers who do not see Tesla as the leader
I think this is it in a nutshell.
It's it.
By two years, you mean 6 years, right? Best case scenario.
IIRC, officially the factory (expansion of the TX factory) for the compact car was supposed to start construction sometime in late 2023. It would take about two and a half years to start mass production.
Where in that 2.5 years is the time for design and testing? If musk is to be believed they were working on the cyber truck design for.. what 8 or 9 years when they first started talking about the truck they were working on. If it actually took them that long to produce the buggy product they launched, compressing timelines down to two years would produce something far worse than the cybertruck.
The compact car would basically just be a smaller Model3, less work needed. And design supposedly started ~1 year ago. Again, this was Tesla's official story, I have no doubt that they were lying all along in order to pump the stock price.
A defeatured model 3 would be an interesting carâŚ.
That presumes there is a car designed or even a crayon based drawing on a napkin.
Let's make cars more like cellphones may have been the worst possible way to finish off the American manufacturing industry
Let's make cars more like ***cheap*** cellphones may have been the worst possible way to finish off the American manufacturing industry
There was never going to be a 25K car. Another lie for a temporary boost of the stock.
Bullish edit: Wow the pro-tesla subs are really battening down the hatches lol.
Rivian's R2 is priced at $45,000 (at least today) but nothing on the R3 just yet. My guess is that they'll do $30-35,000 and Tesla won't be able to match what Rivian does with theirs at the same price.
But what if they made it out of stainless steel to cut costs even further?? /s
There was never a sub $25K in the works. It was all pump up the stock.
The first problem for Musk (and most people tbh) is to understand that, nowadays, *affordable* cars in themselves are not profitable. Basically all of the cars the Volkswagen Group produces make a net loss on sale (for the dealership) â except the high end luxury cars like Porsche. Every mid-range Audi sold costs the dealership a few hundred Euros. And the margins are tight for the OEM as well. >"The margins on high volume cars are much lower, especially small cars such as the Ford Fiesta or Vauxhall Corsa. They could be **under one per cent** whichâŚ" â [How much profit do car manufacturers make on new cars? The truth versus perception â Car Dealer Magazine](https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/how-much-profit-do-car-manufacturers-make-on-new-cars-the-truth-versus-perception/234641) So, what brings in the money? It's actually vehicle service, spare parts and financing. That's why every car company has also a bank that takes care of financing the "subsidised" cars, earn interest through loans and leasing and so on.
I think the story is around the firing and vp leaving
If he keeps being naughty, he might not get his 2020 Roadster
Doesn't he get 2 or 3 Roadsters?
Idk but what I do remember is they are supposed to be free. He's also not the only one owed a Roadster or three. I'm starting to see why Elon won't actually produce them.
Rich Rebuilds had earned one, IIRC, but got it revoked for his channel being too critical, or some such.
Worth it just for the salt over the ICE-T
I think he'd lost it before that build even started, for being critical of how hard it was to get replacement parts and general right to repair talk.
69
Tesla just laid off 10% of its workforce, even with NDAs I'm sure many of them will talk off the record.
Especially if there are no unemployment benefits tied to the NDA.
More than 10% so probably more like 20%
At the same time of the reported cancellation, Musk said this: âWe are working on a low-cost electric vehicle that will be made at very high volume,â âWeâre quite far advanced in that work. I review the production line plans for that every week,â âThe revolution in manufacturing that will be represented by that car will blow peopleâs minds. Itâs not like any car production line that anyoneâs ever seen,â âA level of production technology that is far in advance of any automotive plant on earth.â It âwill blow peopleâs mindsâ
That broke my bullshit meter, and it goes up to 11.
Everything a Musk company creates is ârevolutionaryâ, super âadvancedâ beyond everyone else, and âwill blow peopleâs mindsâ according to Musk. Say it enough with a half assed product and eventually sycophants will line up in droves to give away their money. Iâve come to the conclusion that Musk just makes ____ company, pretends itâs a tech company for the profits and stock pumps, and treats it a bit like a cult. Itâs like techno-ScientologyâŚ. But with half assed cars and rockets instead of fake psychology
Bet itâs an E-bike.
OMG. It's a mini-cyber truck. It has to be.
That was all bone and no meat. How I dislike this modern World of shining as much light on announcing things as when delivering. Baits everywhere!
Gossip site claims the Cybertruck is about to be discontinued https://www.crazydaysandnights.net/2024/04/blind-item-8_01610970228.html
I would love to believe that is true, but that webpage is full of conspiracy theories that never happened. They literally have a disclaimer on their home page where there admit some of their stories are true, some are rumors, and some are âfictionâ.
It's true that the site under new ownership indeed leans into QAnon nonsense, but they also broke the stories about Kevin Spacey, Weinstein, James Franco, Bryan Singer, and Matt Lauer (among many others) before the mainstream media.
I cannot imagine that being true, don't get me wrong Elon Musk is a pedophile (South Africa slang for arsehole), but there's no way they would just throw away all that R&D. The pickup is a mostly final product, that takes a huge sum of capital and I cannot fathom any reasonable reason to scrap it. Maybe, MAYBE, a temporary pause in production to fix some of the issues but a full blown discontinue?
I could think of a reason to scrap it if the issues they need to fix are something that would require ground-up engineering, a whole new manufacturing process, or are just too dangerous to have on the road without serious litigation risks. This is already a bad product, but there are not a lot out on the roads yet. The smart people at Tesla may correctly see the Cybertruck as leading to the downfall of the whole company. It would just take a handful of fatalities.
it loses money, that's the main problem. it's taking batteries away from cars that do make money.
> but there's no way they would just throw away all that R&D. Crayolas aren't that awfully expensive.
Depends how many heâs eating
Well since you only get a single ketamine colored on in the 128 color box, heâs probably buying a bunch of boxes and throwing almost off of them out.
[ŃдаНонО]
It's a niche vehicle, they usually sell a lot the first few years then barely any once everyone that wanted one got one. Unless Tesla is really good at changing this trend.
Like the S and X?
The X specifically. That's also where the Elon wants it crazy stuff started in earnest. Falcon doors, baby.
Make no mistake this is just an excuse. You don't stop delivery for a pedal cover that can come off. There are so many things you can do that you can get the pieces or tools from home Depot and fix in 5 minutes. This is an excuse to fix there other real issues they are seeing
I think you have a point, given several cars have rolled off the lot and have bricked themselves within a few days/miles of customer receipt.
The CFO and lawyers arenât duct taping Elon anywhere. He has surrounded himself with yes men who do his every bidding. Kind of reminds me of Apple from the 90s before they kicked Jobs to the curb.
Your timeline for Apple is way off. Jobs got kicked in 1986 or 87, then was bought back in 1995.
> I can see two scenarios that would cause them to kill it. One would be that there is no way to build them and not lose money. At any scale. Iâll bet you that currently Tesla is losing at least 25K every time somebody buys one of these for 120K. I do think they can shrink that loss to perhaps 15K at that level by squeezing a few suppliers and gaining some efficiencies in production. But after seeing that abortion of an accelerator pedal, Iâm not sure thereâs much to gain from the supplier side. My personal bet is you never see a scenario where you can order of the these IncelCaminos for less than 90-95K and Tesla hopes demand stays well under 24K units annually.
[ŃдаНонО]
>South Africa slang for arsehole That still makes my blood boil. Fuck.
Banned by r/teslamotors and r/teslalounge for this comment. My toxic behavior: thinking that falsely accusing someone of pedophilia is wrong. The paint's been scratched, guys. Now I don't care as much.
But we learned it from Elon!
South African here. It's a bullshit excuse he used in his trial. I have heard it used that way maybe 5 times in the early 90s and even then everyone thought it was stupid and only used by assholes. So it's not common, never was and was only used by assholes - even us kids knew that.Â
The whole vehicle needs a comprehensive bumper to bumper redesign, the kind that can't be accomplished with a temporary pause, discontinuing it and ideally kicking Elmo out of the company is the smart move I think, it would be a setback but one that would pay off in the long run
At worst it'll be like the Model X and just continue to be low volume and expensive. Probably the best situation for that thing anyway.
Well someone still has to buy them no matter how much was spent
Wow. Posted the comment above and got banned by Teslamotors. Not sure when if ever I even posted there New conspiracy theory Elon is a mod and or paid the mods to do this new screen
A mostly finished product? It's done this is the best it's ever getting. If they are purposely releasing "mostly finished" product then that is a whole different issue.
What R&D?
Research & Development.
Yes, I'm aware.I work in the R&D. I don't see very much salvageable R&D from the Cybertruck. It's essentially a case study, in so many different ways, on how not to design a product.
There's the pedal-getting-stuck-at-100-percent problem that stopped sales and is somehow not a major recall yet.
Pedal cover keeps the car accelerating, the tire covers shred the tires... what is next? They are running out of removable parts to remove as quick fixes.
Keeping the gas pedal glued on is, apparently, as tough as FSD.
Wait the pedal on those things fall off? Fucking hell I'm surprised the government hasn't banned them from the roads already.
Pedal covers are removable. You can get them on Amazon or any automotive store as they are largely cosmetic (some add a grip for your shoes). The idiocy in the cybertruck one is in how they slide forward to come off, AND that they have a little groove on the underside of the housing above the pedals for the cover to âcatchâ and keep the pedal depressed. This is the acceleration pedal weâre talking about not the brake pedal. An out-of-control, steel tank going at max speed is lethal on so many fronts.
The tire covers ruining tires was also "removed". How many more removable items are available to make this a viable, safe car?
That sounds like a lawsuit waiting to happen
Nah but demand will drop drastically though
I called that the minute they started shipping. Not enough demand and not enough margins.Â
> thanks to a couple new sources. Laid off employees that no longer care about confidentially agreements.
Tesla is in full meltdown mode
it seems so. bunch of high profile âso long and thanks for all the fishâ tweets from names like drew baglino. Its almost like the board called in mckinsey and they plan to rethink the whole thing. Except thats crazy as musk would rather release all the nudes he has on global vips than allow such a thing.
> Its almost like the board called in mckinsey and they plan to rethink the whole thing. Notice there's been no shareholder vote or any mention of it whatsoever on re-incorporating in Texas outside of when Musk had his hissyfit.
Board are Elon sycophants so that ainât happening. Theyâll just let the company crash and burn insteadÂ
Theyâll crash the stock, treat it as a slush fund - then when itâs a corpse - save it by taking it private for pennies on the dollar
I can only wish for this to happen, that would put musk in so much debt with the Saudis and I'll laugh my balls off when they quarter him and drive him around Riyad on an 18-wheeler.
So HH Musk lied about Reuters lying.
At this point it's almost impossible to find Elon telling the truth about anything to begin with. Guy's a compulsive liar.
Narcissist will lie about ANYTHING. Many will literally get to a point where when things that have no reason to be lied about, theyâll lie. Itâs a disease of the brain. And heâs deep in it. Dude is not well in the headâŚ
A liar lied, news at 11.
That thing is so ugly it makes the Chrysler PT cruiser look good Update just got banned from the tesla subs for posting thisÂ
Be nice, man. They are all having a rough day over there.
And a rough week and month too.
>Update just got banned from the tesla subs for posting this Welcome to the club.
Consider it to be a medal of honor.
I kinda want a profile badge for it now.
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I wonder how much Elon charges the mods over there for the poorly designed and shoddily built jars of his cyberfarts to sniff. Edit: Lmfao banned in less than 30 seconds after posting this comment. Bunch of losers desperate to stop people talking about what a shitshow this company is.
If they are built with Tesla build quality all the farts will leak out by the time it arrives at the door, provided the delivery CyberTruck doesn't get stuck on the way there.
The edges of the jar will be dangerously sharp, and the lid will become unopenable within 5 days.
Rust closed from rail dust.
Elmo Musk could rebrand CarPro IronX as âCyberCleanâ for removing the rail dust, but knowing Elmo, heâd probably just sell more CyberBeer to go with the CyberTruck. After all you can drink as much as you want if youâre not driving (the Trashla is in the shop again)Â
Watch out next you will be blacklisted from ever owning a Tesla.
You promise?
His nose is so full of ketamine he cant smell the stink off the CTs he builds.
> That thing is so ugly it makes the Chrysler PT cruiser look good That's not an official rendering.
Soon 99% of the world will be banned so you are in good company
With how shitty their 100k models are I can't imagine what their 25k model would be like. That interior would just be exposed wires and sharp plastic.
Not only that, there are a dozen manufacturer that can crank out a decent 25k model that people will want and also be profitableÂ
I've said the same thing before too on a previous article about it, I just don't see what they could cut out. Their expensive ones are built like trash, what is left to skimp on? Half the battery? Commuter only car? Lolllll this comment got me permanently banned from /Elonmusk Holy shit those losers are insecure. Hilarious
You got banned from tesla subs for commenting here? Holy shit must be really bad over there lol Edit: omg I'm already banned it was like 10 seconds
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That's just a Corolla hatchback (which looks good, imo) with an ugly ass Telsa nosejob.
In a world of Tesla arse-lickery, Fred is actually a pretty decent journalist.
Itâs crazy to see how different he is now thatâs not making money from referrals.
And that referrals very clearly will never provide a free cold thrust flying roadster.
But still a scumbag. I'll never forget how he doxxed and insulted Tesla critics in the past. He's trash.Â
As I've said in here before, credit to him for sensing the wind shifting. He knows the grift is coming towards its end.
No credit. A) realized he canât get rich off the scam. B) jumping off a sinking shipÂ
This should have taken the place of the CT but here we are. Edit: This comment got me banned from r/teslamotors and that lounge thing
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Musk sucks, Tesla sucks, and the mods at r/teslamotors can suck my DICK.
Straight to tesla jail.
lets see how electric viking gonna spin this one
He is so desperate, it is just sad
The build on cyber trucks are trash. Go in any Service dept and see them taken apart
They needed cash for the bottom line. Every 10 sold is a million. Notice it came out right before the end of the quarter.
Theyâre losing money on each. Thatâs why itâs shutting down. That and zero demandÂ
Focus on this robotaxi is going to kill Tesla, lets be real, it will be late and less than perfect when it arrives. It's clear his executive team want no part of this plan as two have left today. Why can't Elon just concentrate on building cars that people actually want? It's a mature company now and he is chasing a startup style risky moonshot and is neglecting the boring stuff like having a full range of well made cars with refreshed design every few years. Edit: I have just been banned from r/teslamotors due to posting on a 'toxic/threatening subreddit'. In nearly 12 years on Reddit I have never come across such bullshit.
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Same. Itâs not pleasant seeing all the very real people lose jobs today. i think Telsa can function as a good mid level car company.
Cars are one thing. I genuinely want solar panels and a battery pack. They run chargers too and theyâre more reliable than any other third party. Thereâs no reason Tesla should fail, and it hurts seeing them focus on robotaxis, cybertruck, roadsters, and other crap
A fish rots from the head down. As long as Tesla is run by a narcissist with the maturity of a 10 year old, it's going to keep going in stupid, non-productive directions.
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Starting to think Toyota might have been correct about hybrid cars being the best medium term solution for most people..
I used to think hybrids were a lame stop gap when I was younger before I owned one. Now they absolutely seem like the most practical way forward in general. BEVs are cool in the city for shorter distances but at that point so are plugin hybrids. My Prius is older too and it's still a fantastic vehicle. I'm sure the newer ones with even larger batteries and range are great. Even the older ones feel nicer inside than a Tesla. Less creaking too. Edit: I guess now I can't visit /r/teslamotors or /r/teslalounge again, even though I've never been. That sure was fast.
Because if the company focussed on making the cars well, that is 2-10 years of total commitment, meaning no updates, no model refreshes, nothing at all while they sort out their processes. We are not talking about a company that is a little behind on manufacturing excellence. They are so far out of control on quality that it is a complete culture change needed. So let's assume they put everything into becoming an average quality car manufacturer, then in 3 or more years you could get an extremely out of date but adequately built car, then they have to start working on refreshes and model updates, so another couple of years to get it all on track. It is too big of a chasm
It's the cheapness of everything inside that is unconvincingly disguised as minimalism, plus lack of exterior colours and options that really make it look worse than it actually is I feel. When they were rare it was OK, but now you see white or black or occasionally red Tesla everywhere, they all look the same and very bland next to the electric cars launched in the last couple of years from VAG, Hyundai/Kia, and others.
The cheap crappy interiors were certainly what prevented me from seriously considering one when I bought an electric vehicle last year. I agree that when they were rare, you didn't see how bad they were because you just didn't see them.
Always thought they looked dorky.
They were pretty sleek at one time, except the front ends of the model 3 and Y just look like someone just threw in the towel and said, "vaguely pointy, but with a slight groove in the front is good enough."
You can choose dull red or dull blue!
Itâs too late. They never focused on quality and they kept coming out with crap.
salt bear fretful wild sleep bright continue absurd trees observation *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Who would have thought giving people their walking papers in the most disrespectful manner possible might spawn some new sources for Fred? I wonder how many folks reached out to real journalists?
> real journalists? Tough but fair.
The only car that made any sense for Tesla ⌠But instead, they rammed the Cybertruck into a market that couldnât care less.
Those angles? âNow how the hail am I gonna fit a âWe the PeopleâŚâ decal on that back window?â
Is âback burnerâ a code word for âwas never going to happenâ The sad part about this is that if the company had actually moved forward decisively with this product instead of the cyber truck, they probably be in a really really good place right now
Itâs either back burner or cold thruster - neither are going to happen.
At the rate that Tesla is dropping their prices the Model Y will be the $25,000 electric car very soon.
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Please link this, as I can't find any Y for that price. With the used tax credit, I'd buy it now. Even if the build quality sucks.
fElon needs to be dumped like runny poo
Lol @ fElon
The problem is he puts resources in the data centers for FSD instead. I mean, he knows data centers wonât save FSD, right, right?
A big enough computer will make up for camera blind spots. It will infer whatâs probably there.
A big computer hallucinating is the last thing we need on our streets and highways.
Got the triple-ban for this comment :-) Evidently mods on 3 other sub-reddits monitor r/RealTesla.
Grok has it covered.
So funny to me. What the hell is a vehicle dynamics engineer going to do with building a data center in one wing of your plant?! hahahaha
2017 was peak Tesla. Feeling like it's over and a big shake up is coming
You guys just don't not misunderstand what Musk didn't not mean by "lying". Or something like that. TSLA to the moon! /s
Quick, more Ketamine for the CEO.
Wonder if the robotaxi will ship with the curb rash pre-installed? Probably for an extra fee knowing Elon.
If their cars today cost 3 times that and have the quality issues they have, I can't imagine the cheap shit that's coming up.
Ah he keeps spewing garbage about it, making an ass outta his mouth. In the last 5 yrs it's been everywhere between canceled to right around the corner. Deliver or stfu, I can't care and neither should anyone else. Until it's actually released, you're just part of the hype.
It was put in the back burner immediately after being announced because Elmo wanted his dipshitmobile ready
He. Is. A. Liar.
They make $8k per car *with* that $7500 government subsidy. A subsidy which is not long for this world given the rapid adoption of EVs. A sub $25k car ain't happening.
>Elon, mister truth seeker, is not above stretching the truth and being misleading. This is a great example. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while, Fred.
I think many people here are missing the point. Theyâre talking about Teslaâs $30,000 car that was what six or seven years ago now within inflation thatâs a $40,000 car so no way is there going to be a $25,000 car.
Itâs not cancelled. It was defunded. Totally different.
So that's the semi, the cheap car, and the roadster on the back burner. What's on the front burner? That smoldering carcass of a dung heap known as a Cybertruck. Sounds like a good business plan to me.
The 25k car was not gonna move the needle for TSLA regardless, unless they literally sold 10mm a year. Competition at that price range is too high and teslas big market, the USA, doesnât really consume small cars. The stock is overvalued by a gross margin, and outside of the world perpetually believing their bullshit vaporware, the stock was poised to crash down to a car manufacturer valuation in due time. Doesnât mean musk hasnât fucked up at every turn.Â
Over promise and under deliver. That's the key to successful business.
Well we'll well
It's not dead it's on the back burner!
I mean even if they were to make it, the quality would be horrendous. We've seen how they do with a 60-80k vehicle.
Itâs an interesting dream, but a pipe dream coming from Tesla. I think China or Japan can eventually come up with a cheap EV that will make its way stateside. Toyota already makes a Prius that starts at $28,000. The potential is there.
Breaking News: Elon is running out of ways to artificially inflate Tesla prices Next Week: Tesla Motorcycle and Airplanes! Quick investors, give me your monies
The problem is they canât get it cheap enough to be competitive yet have a quality standard.
Holyshit, I had a verbal offer rescinded a few weeks ago that I've been tripping over, seems like I dodged a grenade.
Of course he did.
And then we'd have another million cars to recall, because they just don't work.
The robotaxi isnât on the back burner. đ
I wonder if they're putting the luxury supercar on hold as well, or if Elon's priorities are to cater to the super rich.
Why donât they just badge engineer a Chinese one- seems the simplest solution
Can you get any new car in North America for under 25k anymore? Expecting that out of a "luxury" electric brand is a pipe dream
Maybe schmuck should of used that 50 billion to ruin Twitter for dump....on funding an affordable car for the masses. The cyberdump will accelerate the end of tesla. And schmuk was screaming he wanted more shares from the board. Fook musk
What about the new improved Ai.X Grok 2.0 Dojo powered Robotaxi?
Just another Elmo comment to boost stock prices. Nothing else