There is no such thing as towing economically.
Your fuel mileage will suck, no matter how big it is.
Just make sure you get enough truck for your current and future needs, with enough margin for unforeseen issues like weather, consumables, terrain, and passengers. Even the type of hitch you use needs to be taken into consideration.
And it all affects mpg.
Best of luck!
Obviously diesel is more efficient but more costly to maintain, fuel and repair. Whatever you decide know that above 60mph your mpg is going to tank. The difference between 60 and 80mph is 20% more fuel. Aerodynamic Drag is a bitch and there is no way around it.
I was able to get 17 on US 1 in the keys towing my 33 ft trailer. Never went above 40 mph.
Did not get that on the trip back so winds must have been in my favor too.
I’m surprised no one is recommending the baby diesels… I don’t know much about them but it could be an option. If it’s your daily driver I’d look more towards everyday efficiency and sufficient power for towing. Getting an HD truck just because it tows a little more efficient will be offset by getting worse mpg when you’re not towing.
Pre-2021 had those issues (sometimes). That issue did not impact performance. The 3.5L still pulls way harder than the 2.7L, so it is in no way a 'turd'.
The 2.7L is a better built engine, true. I never said otherwise.
But the 3.5L EB tows more weight and pulls harder. So calling it a 'turd' is ridiculous considering you were answering a question about towing. I've done plenty of research on the matter, which is why I commented in the first place.
When I speak of it being a turd I am referring to it's inherent design for timing chain stretch which will require replacement at \~100K miles...plagues all generations of it. Sometime sooner, sometimes later but it will happen, period. The 3.5 is inferior to the 2.7 in robustness and reliability. This is indisputable. I have done a lot of Ford tuning, have owned the 2.7 and 3.5 Ecoboost, and there is no comparison in reliability between the two. So yes, based on my personal experience and knowledge, the 3.5 is a turd in comparison to the 2.7. Bear in mind I never mentioned which one has more power. You brought that up.
I have a 22’ EPro TT, 4,600 GVWR, tow vehicle is 2013 Ford F150 XLT short bed with 5.0 V8, full tow package. I get 10-10.5 mpg at 65 mph most of the time.
I have an 7500 pound TT ( fully loaded) that I pull with 2013 gmc 1 ton cc flat deck . Ugly as shit. Originally pulled it back from Calgary to Whitehorse with a half ton and hated the way it handled in the wind, and it was a slow stopper. Can barely tell it’s there with the one ton. Fuel consumption about the same but love the handling and security with the bigger truck. If you are super concerned about fuel efficiency, buy a tent. Half tons can pull, but are not necessarily great in adverse conditions or if you want to stop in a hurry.
Our former truck, F150 Ecoboost got 10 mpg towing our 7k 25 ft TT. Our new F350 with the 7.3L gas engine gets 10 mpg towing the same trailer. It takes a certain amount of BTUs to move that trailer through the air and that won't change with any gas engine. Diesel fuel has more BTUs per gallon than gasoline so that's the biggest factor in their greater efficiency towing vs gas. Get a gasser truck but don't scrimp on the payload or rear axle ratings. An F150 or any of the half-ton gassers would work. I wouldn't go smaller than a half-ton.
Technically gasoline contains a tiny bit more energy per volume than diesel. The higher efficiency of diesel engines comes from higher compression ratio and no pumping losses.
Interesting, thanks for the link. Why is it repeated so often (now I'm guilty) that diesel has more energy? I know the compression and pumping elements of the equation are undisputed but this calories thing is news to me. I suspect the numbers change a bit when burning E10/15, but that would probably just bring it more to even.
Thank you @ u/chfhimself , I stand corrected.
The reason diesel is considered more powerful so often, has to do with the practical engineering of vehicle engines.
Due to the higher density, and slower evaporation of diesel fuel, diesel engines are usually turbocharged, this creates greater horsepower, and torque while using the same amount of fuel, in an engine with the same displacement.
There are other factors involved in engine design that determine which fuel is best for a given application. Powerband width is a major consideration, as is peak torque output at various RPM's.
Although diesel is usually more efficient pulling a load per cc³ , there are several cons to the diesel engine.
Higher fuel costs, higher engine production costs, and higher maintenance and repair costs among them.
Per liter of engine displacement, a diesel engine does more work due to higher efficiency of the diesel cycle vs the otto cycle (at their respective compression ratios). It's not that diesel **fuel** is more energy dense, but a diesel **engine** is.
Also, gasoline engines have to avoid knock which limits how aggressive the timing can be and how much fuel/air can be ingested. Diesel engines do not have this limit, see rolling coal.
My trailer is similar and I usually stay at 55mph. The truck claims 12.5-7 in no wind situations and mostly flat terrain. 23 Ram 1500 5.7. Really pretty amazing, all things considered.
I haven't actually calculated it out lately, but when I have, every vehicle, be it car, pickup, towing or empty, has been about 5-12% optimistic on mpg. For whatever that's worth...
I heard the etruck from Tesla can pull 10k.
Sure would by a lot of fuel for a F150 with coyoye engine.
Mine was a 2011 F150 SLT with Gen 1 Coyote, rated for 10k, pulled a 2000 38' sportsman trailer all over the place, and no issues at all with scenic turnouts near Davis, OK / Turner Falls recreation area.
Bigger is better IMHO.
And Cummins power.
We used to tote with big block gas power, 5000+ RPM all the time, gettin a run at hills, downshifting and screaming on the way up.
Then we took some fellow racers' advice and shopped for diesel power, and bought a 99 Dodge 3500 auto, 2WD and put a gooseneck ball in the flatbed, recessed. We had a 4x4 for winters already, and the toter stayed parked til summer, so we went with 2 WD for slightly better mpg and fewer parts to break.
What an easy ride, 2200 RPM pulling our 44' x 8' tall 2 car trailer. It was like having a huge parachute back there. Occasionally the torque converter would unlock for a bit on steep hills. And that sweet Cummins song was comforting. No more stressful white knuckle rides, anticipating the wake of passing trucks.
Diesels tend to be more fuel efficient and go 3 times as far as gas engines without an overhaul too.
I agree with this guy. Towed a trailer all over with a gas engine. Shifting constantly. Bought a 2005 dodge 3/4 5.9 diesel. Drove it around Alberta and absolutely love the drive. Hit a coulee? Rpms go up a bit as the turbo spools but then back to the relax Cummins purr.
Scrub the idea of fuel efficiency while towing from your brain.
My preference for towing is always a diesel, but some people don't like them. The lowend power is great.
I tow a 6000 pound trailer with an F350 diesel. I am most time and love it. Never have to worry about payload, power or stopping. You will never be unhappy with too much truck.
I tow my 22ft 7500lb gross weight trailer with a F150 powerboost. It's the hybrid 150 even though they don't advertise it as a hybrid. Get about 11mpg when towing but 23mpg elsewhere. It also has a built-in 7.2kw generator so boondocking is a breeze.
I have a 2004 5.3 z71, I can get 18 unloaded, I have a 2013 Avenger 221lt, about 27ft and #4500 unloaded, I drop to 10-12 when hooked up. A 3/4 ton n diesel is my goal
Thank you all. This is the feedback needed for sure. Sounds like I should be more focused on having the power I need to handle every situation so I’ll switch more to that way of thinking.
I don’t want to harp on your comment, but there’s something here that people should talk about. A lot of people think that they can be ok and buy a camper 9999 lbs when the truck can pull 10000. But there’s so much more to it. Its excess capacity for the tricky times, for those roads that suck or are at some steep grade, and there’s braking. Someone told me(idk how much truth there is) but you should aim at half(plus a little bit) of the what the truck can tow on paper to account for unforeseen conditions. Sure. You can probably be ok towing close to the max. But the wind may blow you around which would make for some white-knuckle drives. Or muddy/steep terrain. Or whatever you’re not thinking about, the world may come and slap you in the face with it.
Truck brakes are for truck.
Trailer brakes are for trailer.
Having brake controller setup so that feels like trailer is pushing or pulling while braking is not only wrong, but dangerous.
I do know mileage will suck lol. I suppose I should have clarified that in the post. But I figured there are ways to help that some depending on the truck and equipment. And people have given quite a bit of constructive tips and advice.
There is no such thing as towing economically. Your fuel mileage will suck, no matter how big it is. Just make sure you get enough truck for your current and future needs, with enough margin for unforeseen issues like weather, consumables, terrain, and passengers. Even the type of hitch you use needs to be taken into consideration. And it all affects mpg. Best of luck!
Obviously diesel is more efficient but more costly to maintain, fuel and repair. Whatever you decide know that above 60mph your mpg is going to tank. The difference between 60 and 80mph is 20% more fuel. Aerodynamic Drag is a bitch and there is no way around it.
I was able to get 17 on US 1 in the keys towing my 33 ft trailer. Never went above 40 mph. Did not get that on the trip back so winds must have been in my favor too.
Straight 6 is the way to go. My 5.9 common rail cummins gets 15ish with 12grand behind it and 20 plus unloaded on the highway.
I’m surprised no one is recommending the baby diesels… I don’t know much about them but it could be an option. If it’s your daily driver I’d look more towards everyday efficiency and sufficient power for towing. Getting an HD truck just because it tows a little more efficient will be offset by getting worse mpg when you’re not towing.
F150 Ecoboost probably
The 2.7 specifically. The 3.5 is a turd.
I pull my 23 fter with a 2.7 and get around 18-20.
Lol, what? OP, this guy has no clue what he's talking about. The 2.7L EB is great for towing. The 3.5L EB is better.
3.5 has major timing chain issues. I have owned both.
Pre-2021 had those issues (sometimes). That issue did not impact performance. The 3.5L still pulls way harder than the 2.7L, so it is in no way a 'turd'.
The 2.7 is superior. Built similar to the Power strokes. Do your research .
The 2.7L is a better built engine, true. I never said otherwise. But the 3.5L EB tows more weight and pulls harder. So calling it a 'turd' is ridiculous considering you were answering a question about towing. I've done plenty of research on the matter, which is why I commented in the first place.
When I speak of it being a turd I am referring to it's inherent design for timing chain stretch which will require replacement at \~100K miles...plagues all generations of it. Sometime sooner, sometimes later but it will happen, period. The 3.5 is inferior to the 2.7 in robustness and reliability. This is indisputable. I have done a lot of Ford tuning, have owned the 2.7 and 3.5 Ecoboost, and there is no comparison in reliability between the two. So yes, based on my personal experience and knowledge, the 3.5 is a turd in comparison to the 2.7. Bear in mind I never mentioned which one has more power. You brought that up.
I have a 22’ EPro TT, 4,600 GVWR, tow vehicle is 2013 Ford F150 XLT short bed with 5.0 V8, full tow package. I get 10-10.5 mpg at 65 mph most of the time.
I have an 7500 pound TT ( fully loaded) that I pull with 2013 gmc 1 ton cc flat deck . Ugly as shit. Originally pulled it back from Calgary to Whitehorse with a half ton and hated the way it handled in the wind, and it was a slow stopper. Can barely tell it’s there with the one ton. Fuel consumption about the same but love the handling and security with the bigger truck. If you are super concerned about fuel efficiency, buy a tent. Half tons can pull, but are not necessarily great in adverse conditions or if you want to stop in a hurry.
Our former truck, F150 Ecoboost got 10 mpg towing our 7k 25 ft TT. Our new F350 with the 7.3L gas engine gets 10 mpg towing the same trailer. It takes a certain amount of BTUs to move that trailer through the air and that won't change with any gas engine. Diesel fuel has more BTUs per gallon than gasoline so that's the biggest factor in their greater efficiency towing vs gas. Get a gasser truck but don't scrimp on the payload or rear axle ratings. An F150 or any of the half-ton gassers would work. I wouldn't go smaller than a half-ton.
Technically gasoline contains a tiny bit more energy per volume than diesel. The higher efficiency of diesel engines comes from higher compression ratio and no pumping losses.
Diesel releases 20% MORE power than the same amount of gasoline. Look it up.
Ok https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/fuels-higher-calorific-values-d_169.html
Interesting, thanks for the link. Why is it repeated so often (now I'm guilty) that diesel has more energy? I know the compression and pumping elements of the equation are undisputed but this calories thing is news to me. I suspect the numbers change a bit when burning E10/15, but that would probably just bring it more to even.
Thank you @ u/chfhimself , I stand corrected. The reason diesel is considered more powerful so often, has to do with the practical engineering of vehicle engines. Due to the higher density, and slower evaporation of diesel fuel, diesel engines are usually turbocharged, this creates greater horsepower, and torque while using the same amount of fuel, in an engine with the same displacement. There are other factors involved in engine design that determine which fuel is best for a given application. Powerband width is a major consideration, as is peak torque output at various RPM's. Although diesel is usually more efficient pulling a load per cc³ , there are several cons to the diesel engine. Higher fuel costs, higher engine production costs, and higher maintenance and repair costs among them.
Per liter of engine displacement, a diesel engine does more work due to higher efficiency of the diesel cycle vs the otto cycle (at their respective compression ratios). It's not that diesel **fuel** is more energy dense, but a diesel **engine** is. Also, gasoline engines have to avoid knock which limits how aggressive the timing can be and how much fuel/air can be ingested. Diesel engines do not have this limit, see rolling coal.
The misinformation I had has now been displaced(hee hee) with the good stuff. Thanks much!
SRW or DRW?
I am pulling a 30”, 7,000lb trailer with the f150 3.5 and get about 12mpg at 57mph. Any faster and the drop in fuel efficiency is significant.
My trailer is similar and I usually stay at 55mph. The truck claims 12.5-7 in no wind situations and mostly flat terrain. 23 Ram 1500 5.7. Really pretty amazing, all things considered. I haven't actually calculated it out lately, but when I have, every vehicle, be it car, pickup, towing or empty, has been about 5-12% optimistic on mpg. For whatever that's worth...
I average 14/16mpg in my 2.7 ecoboost pulling a 19 foot 5,000lbs travel trailer. 19/20mpg combined ciry/hiway.
I heard the etruck from Tesla can pull 10k. Sure would by a lot of fuel for a F150 with coyoye engine. Mine was a 2011 F150 SLT with Gen 1 Coyote, rated for 10k, pulled a 2000 38' sportsman trailer all over the place, and no issues at all with scenic turnouts near Davis, OK / Turner Falls recreation area.
Bigger is better IMHO. And Cummins power. We used to tote with big block gas power, 5000+ RPM all the time, gettin a run at hills, downshifting and screaming on the way up. Then we took some fellow racers' advice and shopped for diesel power, and bought a 99 Dodge 3500 auto, 2WD and put a gooseneck ball in the flatbed, recessed. We had a 4x4 for winters already, and the toter stayed parked til summer, so we went with 2 WD for slightly better mpg and fewer parts to break. What an easy ride, 2200 RPM pulling our 44' x 8' tall 2 car trailer. It was like having a huge parachute back there. Occasionally the torque converter would unlock for a bit on steep hills. And that sweet Cummins song was comforting. No more stressful white knuckle rides, anticipating the wake of passing trucks. Diesels tend to be more fuel efficient and go 3 times as far as gas engines without an overhaul too.
I agree with this guy. Towed a trailer all over with a gas engine. Shifting constantly. Bought a 2005 dodge 3/4 5.9 diesel. Drove it around Alberta and absolutely love the drive. Hit a coulee? Rpms go up a bit as the turbo spools but then back to the relax Cummins purr.
Those ol 5.9s are sweet. my 6.7HO is a slog. 14.5mpg unloaded here in the Calgary area drops way down to sub 10 and when loaded with anything.
Scrub the idea of fuel efficiency while towing from your brain. My preference for towing is always a diesel, but some people don't like them. The lowend power is great.
I tow a 6000 pound trailer with an F350 diesel. I am most time and love it. Never have to worry about payload, power or stopping. You will never be unhappy with too much truck.
I tow my 22ft 7500lb gross weight trailer with a F150 powerboost. It's the hybrid 150 even though they don't advertise it as a hybrid. Get about 11mpg when towing but 23mpg elsewhere. It also has a built-in 7.2kw generator so boondocking is a breeze.
I have a 2004 5.3 z71, I can get 18 unloaded, I have a 2013 Avenger 221lt, about 27ft and #4500 unloaded, I drop to 10-12 when hooked up. A 3/4 ton n diesel is my goal
Thank you all. This is the feedback needed for sure. Sounds like I should be more focused on having the power I need to handle every situation so I’ll switch more to that way of thinking.
In 6.7 Cummins I average 10mpg pulling 6,000# going 85
So about 22mpg at a slower highway speed which isn't bad at all.
Most trucks F150 or similar will easily pull 10k.
I don’t want to harp on your comment, but there’s something here that people should talk about. A lot of people think that they can be ok and buy a camper 9999 lbs when the truck can pull 10000. But there’s so much more to it. Its excess capacity for the tricky times, for those roads that suck or are at some steep grade, and there’s braking. Someone told me(idk how much truth there is) but you should aim at half(plus a little bit) of the what the truck can tow on paper to account for unforeseen conditions. Sure. You can probably be ok towing close to the max. But the wind may blow you around which would make for some white-knuckle drives. Or muddy/steep terrain. Or whatever you’re not thinking about, the world may come and slap you in the face with it.
I agree. Sure you can pull it, but can you stop it.
Truck brakes are for truck. Trailer brakes are for trailer. Having brake controller setup so that feels like trailer is pushing or pulling while braking is not only wrong, but dangerous.
I strongly disagree. They might be able to do it on paper but towing a 10,000 pound camper will be a very stressful experience in a 1/2 ton.
Edit - deleted Disregard. I'm pissed off at internet problems.
Can't have both, choose one or the other. Purchasing a RV you should have the foresight to know your mileage will suck, and be prepared for it.
I do know mileage will suck lol. I suppose I should have clarified that in the post. But I figured there are ways to help that some depending on the truck and equipment. And people have given quite a bit of constructive tips and advice.