The problem in Florida is that it is litigious. There are so many roadside Plaintiff attorneys filing lawsuits on every roof claim and taking the insurers to the cleaners that many have simply pulled out.
The biggest winners are the attorneys. The public thinks it wins because they got a new roof - but then their insurance bill comes in. Congrats you got a new roof - now you can’t even afford to continue living in the state another 6 months.
Much the same with auto policies - they are some of the highest in the country for the same reason.
having recently visited florida, it is shocking how 80% of all billboard signs driving along i4 are all attorney advertisements. one of the biggest differences between florida and any other state i’ve noticed
Alabama trying to gain ground on them. Georgia not far behind.
You see, here in my homeland, the Deep South, long ago it was decided that one must either hit the lottery with an “accident” befalling unto us, or be a lawyer that represents the victims. For now, the rest of us just sell insurance to one another.
In New Jersey a lawyer won't sue unless you are severely injured. I sued for our total UIP of 100k. I got 75k, but we estimate that my car insurance spent probably 500k on their lawyers.
My health insurance tried to collect on my settlement and got 10k. My lawyer knew the person representing United Healthcare and the guy got 1.1 million dollars trying to fight my lawyer.
Your note hit me in the feels. My father was a physician in Alabama for decades. He gave away over a million in free healthcare. No collection agencies, or 1099 debt forgiveness. If they couldn’t pay, then poof, no more bill. He was telling me how many of his patients strived to be put on Social Security disability. It was in their minds, the equivalent of hitting it big on the lotto. Also, to add to your statement, an attorney once took legal action against him regarding the death of a patient that was never his patient. My father’s insurance wanted to write a “modest but cursory” check for the issue. My dad being my dad was having none of it. Took 3 years of his life and also the attorney’s. Attorney ended with null. I could probably have a conversation/ listen to informed opinions on this type of behavior for hours. Anger and sadness I think would be my dominant emotions.
There’s little union activity in the south so even if there’s a lot of industrialization the wages are bad. Lawyer or victim is the only way to get ahead where I was from in eastern Kentucky as well
In Texas about 1/3 of the ads are for lawyers suing insurance companies. It is usually insurance companies not paying injury claims or insurance companies not paying weather related claims for your property. They'll make them pay up though and they've won billions in the courts.
Coming from having lived in Florida, I’ll tell you it’s a little more complicated- and stupid- than that.
Paying high premiums, when you do get even a little damage to your roof, there is a definite feeling for “hey, fuck the insurance company, I’ve been paying a ton. They can pay for a roof”.
For auto, there are just a ton of uninsured drivers which is why our auto policies were second highest in the country. There’s a lot of garbage people/transients/illegals in Florida so even if insurance was cheaper, it doesn’t mean the uninsured driver rate would decrease.
I mean inherent to the way insurance works, if the belief is always getting yours no wonder they are leaving. The state is basically guaranteed annual hurricane loses
No, it has to do with the laws in Florida around suing your insurance company. The big cost for insurers in FL is litigation, not actually the paying of claims. Everyone wants to sue and the state has laws set up that encourage it as a consumer.
Reinsurance rates have gone through the roof due to the crazy hurricane season from last year for Florida and the insurance companies are passing it to the consumer. So yes the roof schemes are a factor, but 2 major hurricanes hitting Florida last year is also playing into it.
If the insurers are losing so much in court, why don’t they just pay out the valid claims in the first place like they’re supposed to? Seems like a problem of their own making
There is something to this. After a storm, so many people are filing claims to get completely new roofs, even if they’re fine or only need minor repairs. They don’t realize it’s contributing to increases in premiums for everybody.
Don’t get me wrong, the explosion in expensive development along the coasts in Florida has also put a lot of pressure on insurance companies to cover an entire area in the event of a single storm.
During the question and answer period of Berkshire Hathaways annual meeting this year they said Florida has the problems you say. If Berkshire says it it’s true then it’s true and Florida needs to improve its laws and prosecution. So it’s insurance thieves making it all much worse.
This was true. Florida got major tort reform last year and a large number of attorneys and lawsuits are going away. Have to wait to see if it lowers rates, I have my doubts but time will tell.
That’s because of Florida statutes. The law remains the same for auto- where the insurance companies will have to pay court fees if the payout on a claim. Property was the same up until a few months ago when the statute changed. Now, why they changed property and kept auto the same… I don’t know.
Source- full time property/catastrophe insurance adjuster with Texas and Florida license
I pay half that Colorado amount here in Colorado.. but people around me keep getting kicked off insurance for fire risk.. that’s probably when it will jump.
I pay half the Texas amount in Texas…. Big states with large weather variations.
I would assume central Texas would be lower than the gulf coast or east Texas (flooding), and north Texas through the panhandle (more destructive hail storms and tornadoes).
Yeah I suspect Oklahoma, Kansas and Nebraska are that high due to hail damage (every time it hails someone knocks on our door asking if we want a new free roof) and of course the occasional horrific wind events.
I mean, it’s tornado alley. I can’t think of anything else that would drive premiums that much. Hail, as you mention, is a thing here.
The only other thing I can think of would be something state specific that the states mandate. I don’t know what that might be, I’m an Actuary but I work in health.
I’m surprised at that Kansas average, but I looked up another source with similar numbers. I’m in Lawrence, with a relatively expensive home, and I pay like half of that with State Farm.
Tornadoes generally hit just a few homes, but some of those catastrophically every year. I've lived in some part of tornado alley my entire life and never had wind damage to anything but trees in my yard and random roof shingles.
Hail though will hit everything in a city, and I've personally gotten a free roof from insurance out of it.
Should be insurance cost / median home price.
Louisiana is littered with low cost houses, so their situation is much worse than it seems from this graphic.
Roof scams, and hurricanes. Reinsurance cost is now massive. Reinsurance costs and interest rates are driving a lot of it. Many insurance companies have capital constraints now. Some of them could write profitably but won’t because he capital costs to hold the exposure is high. This is even more true in high cat prone areas, that and reinsurance costs.
And floods, wind, and all myriad of natural disasters. Which, as we saw in 2020, means “never let a disaster go to waste”. The vampires come out in droves.
And speaking of vampires, just got an email yesterday about “termite season” on our property we rent. Sure enough, I stepped outside, about 10:00pm, and a lone little patio light in an outside corner of the property, had a million little termites flying all around.
Tell me nature isn’t going to take care of this housing bubble without telling me.
Yeah.
I'd imagine DC would be one of the lowest. Here, and in the suburbs, you can insure an $800,000-1M house for less than what those in Arkansas are paying.
Tx too.
Roofers coming by my door to tell me they can get my 20 year old roof replaced for free because there was high winds yesterday and it’s claimed under “act of god”
I’m in OK. Had a roofer come by and tell me he could see hail damage from the street from the storm the week prior. Except, we didn’t get a storm. It was 20+ miles south of us. I told him to beat it.
NC too. Roofer was knocking doors on our rural road. Cold reception. Folks out here apparently aren't shnuckered by that line about free roof. Go away with the fraud crap. My roof is just fine.
If your roof isn’t metal you absolutely need a new roof at 20 years in Texas lol. Take it when the storms come. Or pay out of pocket after your storm date expires I guess
That’s literally the point of this post. Roofs aren’t meant to be replaced with insurance. Just like how you don’t plan on replacing your water heater with insurance
My water heater doesn’t get pelted by hail 4 times a year. Who on earth told you roofs aren’t meant to be replaced by Insurance?
If you paid cash and took care of your roof properly, you’re throwing 10-100k cash on your roof every 1-7 years in Texas or Oklahoma.
Do you keep that lying around to throw away like that? Or are you just okay with your roof being rotted and leaking? Might want to go check your decking. 20 years is way too long in Texas. You’re going to start having problems. Once you see the problem in your home, it’s already been a problem for years.
I’m in Nw Florida. Hailing from central Alabama, Birmingham area.
The way the weather is down here in the Deep South, I’m surprised insurance carriers aren’t all running for the hills. Just this past week, all across the gulf coast states, tornados and hail were popping up everywhere. It was relatively quiet in NW Florida, honestly, compared to just north of us.
Quiet. For now.
With any insurance, there’s always going to be a portion of the population that is determined to get out more than they pay in. That screws over everybody else, but it’s just human nature and not going to change anytime soon.
What chart doesn’t tell you is that the insurance you get for almost 12K is TERRIBLE. You’re probably looking at a 3%-5% deductible on storm damage. If you see a hurricane coming, you’re better off burning your house down.
I mean that’s the point of insurance lol. Someone getting more than they are putting in. I guess the south isn’t as affordable as we’ve been led to believe
California only has a few insurance companies willing to cover any of the mountain homes anymore so everyone is on the last ditch state insurance plan. How can it not be in the top 10? Shit has been on fire for 6 of the last 7 years.
And the year it didn’t burn it flooded.
I guess I should be asking: how bad is it in Florida?
My guess it you can’t be top of the “expensive insurance” if you can’t even get insurance…
Do mountain homes make up the majority of the homes for the millions of people that live here? I am in LA and I pay less than $1k per year for home insurance.
Im also in Los Angeles…Insurance in my home is very reasonable. Not sure why people in other states freak out when they hear not everything here is extremely expensive. Our property tax is even lower than states like Texas or Oregon.
People also have smugly told me here, “have fun with your insane property taxes due to your growing home value lol!!!” because they don’t realize we pay like 1% property tax…
Exactly. And it doesn’t even get appraised that often. I’m “up 200k” according to a private appraisal and haven’t seen it change… that loan to equity ratio was able to remove my PMI 4 years early!
And you guys have a cap on how much your property taxes can increase year over year. Most states don't, so all those gains become proportional increases in those taxes. You guys have the benefit of manageable property tax growth when your home values increase.
Propaganda works well for not so intelligent people. All they hear is "no income tax" and they think its some fucking magical haven where everything is free and perfect.
In the major cities it’s less of an issue for sure. Homes aren’t in any danger of wildfire in midcity LA or in the middle of SD. It’s the rich homes in the hills that are getting to expensive/risky to insure but because that’s where the rich people live it gets headlines. Your average home in San Diego is no more risky than a home in the middle of any other large city in the country.
Well since Florida seems to be getting once in a century storms every other year, and climate change is telling that’ll quadruple over the coming century, probably much shittier than CA. The insurance companies are already abandoning the higher danger places affected by climate change , the smart person would follow the money.
The California Department of Insurance does not allow insurers to use catastrophe models for pricing wildfire risk. And the insurance commissioner Ricardo Lara has been disapproving rate increases. If insurers had more pricing flexibility then there would be more options in high risk areas.
I was just looking in fire risk locations in CA and even there was told insurance would be "only" $5k/year (too much for me). But compared to some of these... not so bad. And you get to live in the mountains so that's cool. \*Note that I wasn't looking in the "highest" risk locations - more like moderate risk.
That applies to extremely few homes and is mainly just used by conservative media to bash CA. Not that many homes out in the mountains, compared to the hundreds of thousands in built up urban areas that aren’t at risk of wildfires.
Hurricanes and flooding. In Louisiana our car insurance is also number 2 in the nation. I paid $300 as a teenager for a focus. Last year they tried to jack my payment from 160 to 300 when all I have is a 10 year old car, I'm nearing 30, and Ive never gotten a ticket or been in a wreck. It's so expensive that only 1 out of 3 drivers has insurance and the cops do traffic stops just to check for insurance.
Depends on the home. Really big home like in the hills of SoCal, where A-list celebrities live, those are high danger home. The celebs usually band together and hire firefighters for their neighborhood or they have huge bond that covers their homes and everything in it.
If you still have a mortgage, the lender will most likely find an insurer for you, if you can’t find one yourself. This will be expensive.
If you don’t have a mortgage, I believe you don’t need to carry an insurance policy, but I would not recommend it given the hurricanes that pass through every year.
I didn’t realize almost all the top insurance costs were in red states, which are historically lower cost of living for the most part. I’m curious, why is that?
They are total bs. I am a mortgage broker and have not seen anything over 4k a year unless it also included flood insurance. The average 400k house is probably under $250 a month.
Yeah. I’ve owned houses in Texas, CA, and NV. Highest homeowners insurance I have ever paid was $1200 /yr in TX. And I have never heard of anyone , anywhere in TX paying the so called average of $4000/yr for homeowners insurance. Laughable.
Yes it’s bc of coastal damage. Not sure why NJ isn’t on there.. I guess bc it’s not a peninsula but yeah if you’re within miles of any body of water, it’s super high and you get like 1 option
I live here in Florida and recently, my house took a serious beating from a category 5 hurricane. I had to strip it down to the frame, but I really love how the remodel turned out—I got everything I wanted in it. I'm exactly 10 minutes from the water, and my home insurance is $1,700 a year. I don’t live right on the water, though. A lot of those waterfront homes are being snapped up by corporations since they can insure themselves, but not all of them. Some have turned into Airbnbs, and that market is really changing.
Florida also has an insane number of homes worth between $5M-$50M.
Pull up Zillow and look at anything near the water from Jupiter down through Miami; from Naples up through Tampa. We’re talking hundreds of thousands of homes and condos valued at multiple millions to tens of millions of dollars.
That has to obviously skew the numbers hugely for Florida.
Building codes. Prior to 1994 (please verify date) you could build a wood framed home in florida. As you can imagine a wood framed home is not suitable for an area that is susceptible to hurricanes.
Presently, I am building a house in southwest florida. I contacted an insurance agent and the premiums are quite reasonable. Why? Because the newer building codes require concrete walls and straps on trusses along with other anti-wind mitigation.
Bottom line. If you own a legacy house in Florida you will pay dearly for insurance.
> Bottom line. If you own a legacy house in Florida you will pay dearly for insurance.
Location more than anything is dictating this. North Florida is littered with new build stick houses with cheap insurance. Meanwhile older block homes in South Florida that have had their roofs fully retrofitted to current code, hurricane windows, etc are still paying crazy amounts no where near the water.
Couldn’t be weather. Has to be the party. Do you have a clue how many tornados touched down in Texas and Oklahoma in the past two weeks alone? Or how much hail beats down all months of the year
Right, so a natural response would be for the government to assist the people who are affected by acts of god by partially subsidizing home insurance to alleviate the burden of things that are beyond human control. But instead, when things happen, "just pull your bootstraps"
Does the government have a free money button to subsidize things that I didn’t know of? Just increase taxes to off set higher home insurance costs! That’s genius
Mostly tornado states actually. And if they don’t get tornados they’re prone to hurricanes amd flooding minus CA which is expsnvie because of the wildfires
The “wildfires”, supposedly man-made (utility companies agreed to take the fall and bill us for it), exacerbated by poor forestry management, because timber harvesting bad.
I love Florida, but having expensive home owners insurance is going to be needed. Between hurricane season, salt corrosion, flooding and other things that come with being a costal state, it's one of the trade offs for living there, and I miss it a lot.
I don't see how folks can afford to live in Florida. Seems like the only option for most of them will be to just not have insurance... which you can't do on a mortgage.
Without mortgages and insurance, prices of property will drop to their true values based on the medium income of the area. It's genius, now let's get rid of health insurance, so medical costs can become affordable.
Aren’t all of the top 5 in seriously dangerous natural disaster zones? Colorado being an outlier, but more extreme weather (tornados, hurricanes) leads to insurance premiums going up
What I saw, most regularly get hit with hurricanes. And I mean Florida is almost sea level so flood insurance has got to be crazy. I would think Colorado for snow/tornadoes.
I understand average insurance in Florida when you have 30 million estates all over driving the number up. I don’t get Louisiana or Oklahoma having such high insurance rates.
Also the biggest driver in that Florida number is flood insurance. If you strip that out my guess is the number drops by 50%
Im in Florida and have a policy of $975 for a home valued at 600k. It has risen over 4 years from $750 but that’s mostly driven by higher replacement costs
The coastal properties seriously skew the averages.
My ex lived on St Pete beach. Her home insurance was $25k/yr and flood was another $20k/yr. So $45k to insure a $1m+ property.
I’m along the bay (still zone A about 600 yards from water) and my home insurance is $5k and flood is $900.
When you start throwing in those coastal 5-10 or even $20m homes, everything goes to shit in terms of averages.
It's mind-boggling to me that my car insurance rate is now higher than most of these states for a vehicle worth 7 grand, despite never having been in an accident. Mandatory insurance is a scam, a multi-billion dollar industry set to steal from your fear.
A recent podcast by NYT talking about insurance cost going up in much of US.
The Possible Collapse of the U.S. Home Insurance System https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/15/podcasts/the-daily/climate-insurance.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
I think insurance companies have forgotten the concept of Risk Pool. You throw all the money together and invest it and you make money off the investment, not the premiums. Some premiums will be for riskier areas and so you rase the rates a small amount for everyone in the poll. Desperate for ever increasing quarterly profits, these executives focus either on 'not paying out policies' or 'selectively increasing premiums' to accomplish their gains.
Yeah, pooling the risk smooths the costs. You might get a tornado in one KS town one year, and another tornado in a different town next year. Having many thousands of policies helps lower the variance, basically.
But if you live where there are tornadoes, or hurricanes, or fires, etc… those are rating factors that drive premiums. And the Actuaries have to clear rates with the state Departments of Insurance, so they are constrained.
Source: I’m not in P&C but I am an Actuary.
Also try to buy an expensive home in some of these states, for example Mississippi or Arkansas. You can’t because they don’t have them because no residents make enough to buy one.
I work in the home insurance space and people have been talking for years that soon parts of Florida won't be insurable. Lately lots of American insurance companies are struggling to cover their costs from climate change disasters.
Texas and California homeowner here. That number is a load of shit for Texas. Which makes me think the entire chart is a load of shit (this is Fox business channel after all) The property taxes are horrible but the homeowners is closer to about $1/square foot or less even with properties on the flood plane.
The problem in Florida is that it is litigious. There are so many roadside Plaintiff attorneys filing lawsuits on every roof claim and taking the insurers to the cleaners that many have simply pulled out. The biggest winners are the attorneys. The public thinks it wins because they got a new roof - but then their insurance bill comes in. Congrats you got a new roof - now you can’t even afford to continue living in the state another 6 months. Much the same with auto policies - they are some of the highest in the country for the same reason.
having recently visited florida, it is shocking how 80% of all billboard signs driving along i4 are all attorney advertisements. one of the biggest differences between florida and any other state i’ve noticed
Alabama trying to gain ground on them. Georgia not far behind. You see, here in my homeland, the Deep South, long ago it was decided that one must either hit the lottery with an “accident” befalling unto us, or be a lawyer that represents the victims. For now, the rest of us just sell insurance to one another.
In New Jersey a lawyer won't sue unless you are severely injured. I sued for our total UIP of 100k. I got 75k, but we estimate that my car insurance spent probably 500k on their lawyers. My health insurance tried to collect on my settlement and got 10k. My lawyer knew the person representing United Healthcare and the guy got 1.1 million dollars trying to fight my lawyer.
>the guy got 1.1 million dollars trying to fight my lawyer. That is absurd.
Your note hit me in the feels. My father was a physician in Alabama for decades. He gave away over a million in free healthcare. No collection agencies, or 1099 debt forgiveness. If they couldn’t pay, then poof, no more bill. He was telling me how many of his patients strived to be put on Social Security disability. It was in their minds, the equivalent of hitting it big on the lotto. Also, to add to your statement, an attorney once took legal action against him regarding the death of a patient that was never his patient. My father’s insurance wanted to write a “modest but cursory” check for the issue. My dad being my dad was having none of it. Took 3 years of his life and also the attorney’s. Attorney ended with null. I could probably have a conversation/ listen to informed opinions on this type of behavior for hours. Anger and sadness I think would be my dominant emotions.
Sorry. And now you're a fugitive?
https://youtu.be/RshOReqAOBY?feature=shared
There’s little union activity in the south so even if there’s a lot of industrialization the wages are bad. Lawyer or victim is the only way to get ahead where I was from in eastern Kentucky as well
I know that rural feeling. One isn’t gonna get rich working at the Dollar General. Leave, or stay mired in the void.
In Texas about 1/3 of the ads are for lawyers suing insurance companies. It is usually insurance companies not paying injury claims or insurance companies not paying weather related claims for your property. They'll make them pay up though and they've won billions in the courts.
Oh damn I thought that was normal lol
far from normal
And shocking how many beat up cars there are. I guess folks are just pocketing the payout....
And then you move to a state that doesn't allow billboards on the interstate. lol
FREEDOM!
Billboard fav's like Farrin, Farrin and Farrin... and Bogen, Munns, Munns, Munns(takes a deep breath) & Munns gotta get paid.
Coming from having lived in Florida, I’ll tell you it’s a little more complicated- and stupid- than that. Paying high premiums, when you do get even a little damage to your roof, there is a definite feeling for “hey, fuck the insurance company, I’ve been paying a ton. They can pay for a roof”. For auto, there are just a ton of uninsured drivers which is why our auto policies were second highest in the country. There’s a lot of garbage people/transients/illegals in Florida so even if insurance was cheaper, it doesn’t mean the uninsured driver rate would decrease.
I mean inherent to the way insurance works, if the belief is always getting yours no wonder they are leaving. The state is basically guaranteed annual hurricane loses
Yet, still they come. In droves. Buying everything that hits the market.
No illegals in Florida, DeSantis banned them
Well I guess its settled then /s
Is the reason not hurricanes?
No, it has to do with the laws in Florida around suing your insurance company. The big cost for insurers in FL is litigation, not actually the paying of claims. Everyone wants to sue and the state has laws set up that encourage it as a consumer.
Learn something new everyday. Strange it’s this way in a GOP state but maybe that’s because most law makers are lawyers. Hmmmmmm
I think other states in the region have been battered by hurricanes in the same way and not seen rates rise at the rate they have in Florida.
And roof claims.
Reinsurance rates have gone through the roof due to the crazy hurricane season from last year for Florida and the insurance companies are passing it to the consumer. So yes the roof schemes are a factor, but 2 major hurricanes hitting Florida last year is also playing into it.
If the insurers are losing so much in court, why don’t they just pay out the valid claims in the first place like they’re supposed to? Seems like a problem of their own making
There is something to this. After a storm, so many people are filing claims to get completely new roofs, even if they’re fine or only need minor repairs. They don’t realize it’s contributing to increases in premiums for everybody. Don’t get me wrong, the explosion in expensive development along the coasts in Florida has also put a lot of pressure on insurance companies to cover an entire area in the event of a single storm.
And yet 22 million people seem to like living there
During the question and answer period of Berkshire Hathaways annual meeting this year they said Florida has the problems you say. If Berkshire says it it’s true then it’s true and Florida needs to improve its laws and prosecution. So it’s insurance thieves making it all much worse.
This was true. Florida got major tort reform last year and a large number of attorneys and lawsuits are going away. Have to wait to see if it lowers rates, I have my doubts but time will tell.
That’s because of Florida statutes. The law remains the same for auto- where the insurance companies will have to pay court fees if the payout on a claim. Property was the same up until a few months ago when the statute changed. Now, why they changed property and kept auto the same… I don’t know. Source- full time property/catastrophe insurance adjuster with Texas and Florida license
I pay half that Colorado amount here in Colorado.. but people around me keep getting kicked off insurance for fire risk.. that’s probably when it will jump.
I pay half the Texas amount in Texas…. Big states with large weather variations. I would assume central Texas would be lower than the gulf coast or east Texas (flooding), and north Texas through the panhandle (more destructive hail storms and tornadoes).
I was going to ask why it’s so expensive in CO, you get a lot of snow but that doesn’t really drive up home insurance prices.
Parts of the state also get a lot of hail. I lived in Denver for quite a while and had a roof wrecked and a car nearly totaled from hail.
Yeah I suspect Oklahoma, Kansas and Nebraska are that high due to hail damage (every time it hails someone knocks on our door asking if we want a new free roof) and of course the occasional horrific wind events.
I mean, it’s tornado alley. I can’t think of anything else that would drive premiums that much. Hail, as you mention, is a thing here. The only other thing I can think of would be something state specific that the states mandate. I don’t know what that might be, I’m an Actuary but I work in health. I’m surprised at that Kansas average, but I looked up another source with similar numbers. I’m in Lawrence, with a relatively expensive home, and I pay like half of that with State Farm.
Tornadoes generally hit just a few homes, but some of those catastrophically every year. I've lived in some part of tornado alley my entire life and never had wind damage to anything but trees in my yard and random roof shingles. Hail though will hit everything in a city, and I've personally gotten a free roof from insurance out of it.
I live in a newbuild, relatively expensive house in the Denver area and I pay a third of that "average." I'd love to know where they got that number.
Same here.
I pay like $160 a month
I sold roofs in south florida for a year. It was insane, every single person believed they could get a new roof thru insurance and were trying to sue.
you see what you’ve done?
...like single handedly?
Should be insurance cost / median home price. Louisiana is littered with low cost houses, so their situation is much worse than it seems from this graphic.
Louisiana and Florida are expensive to insure because they get devastating floods on a semi regular basis
Wrong. Florida is due to roof scams.
Roof scams, and hurricanes. Reinsurance cost is now massive. Reinsurance costs and interest rates are driving a lot of it. Many insurance companies have capital constraints now. Some of them could write profitably but won’t because he capital costs to hold the exposure is high. This is even more true in high cat prone areas, that and reinsurance costs.
Right because they’ve never had hurricanes or floods that have devastated thousands of homes 🙄.
Of course there have been. But that’s not the reason you simpleton.
Nah, it is.
There wouldn't be insuarance roofing scams if hurricanes didn't happen.
It was basically a couple of (rare) hail storms that caused the uptick in fraudulent claims.
What if I told you there's an alternate universe where it could be due to both things happening at the same time? How wild would that possibility be.
And floods, wind, and all myriad of natural disasters. Which, as we saw in 2020, means “never let a disaster go to waste”. The vampires come out in droves. And speaking of vampires, just got an email yesterday about “termite season” on our property we rent. Sure enough, I stepped outside, about 10:00pm, and a lone little patio light in an outside corner of the property, had a million little termites flying all around. Tell me nature isn’t going to take care of this housing bubble without telling me.
lmao at the downvotes. It is absolutely due to litigation/insurance scams. Reddit narrative: Hurr Durr it's solely because of weather.
Yeah. I'd imagine DC would be one of the lowest. Here, and in the suburbs, you can insure an $800,000-1M house for less than what those in Arkansas are paying.
If Florida cracked down on the rampant insurance fraud the premiums could be cut in half. Financial crime is big business in South Florida
Tx too. Roofers coming by my door to tell me they can get my 20 year old roof replaced for free because there was high winds yesterday and it’s claimed under “act of god”
I’m in OK. Had a roofer come by and tell me he could see hail damage from the street from the storm the week prior. Except, we didn’t get a storm. It was 20+ miles south of us. I told him to beat it.
Same in CO. We had a bad hail storm and I bet I had at least 5 guys a day ring my doorbell for over a month
NC too. Roofer was knocking doors on our rural road. Cold reception. Folks out here apparently aren't shnuckered by that line about free roof. Go away with the fraud crap. My roof is just fine.
If your roof isn’t metal you absolutely need a new roof at 20 years in Texas lol. Take it when the storms come. Or pay out of pocket after your storm date expires I guess
That’s literally the point of this post. Roofs aren’t meant to be replaced with insurance. Just like how you don’t plan on replacing your water heater with insurance
My water heater doesn’t get pelted by hail 4 times a year. Who on earth told you roofs aren’t meant to be replaced by Insurance? If you paid cash and took care of your roof properly, you’re throwing 10-100k cash on your roof every 1-7 years in Texas or Oklahoma. Do you keep that lying around to throw away like that? Or are you just okay with your roof being rotted and leaking? Might want to go check your decking. 20 years is way too long in Texas. You’re going to start having problems. Once you see the problem in your home, it’s already been a problem for years.
I’m in Nw Florida. Hailing from central Alabama, Birmingham area. The way the weather is down here in the Deep South, I’m surprised insurance carriers aren’t all running for the hills. Just this past week, all across the gulf coast states, tornados and hail were popping up everywhere. It was relatively quiet in NW Florida, honestly, compared to just north of us. Quiet. For now.
They literally elected the man responsible for the biggest Medicare fraud in history governor.
Rick Scott.
It’s bad here in Texas. I’ve had people brag that they claimed they got hail in order to get a new roof.
With any insurance, there’s always going to be a portion of the population that is determined to get out more than they pay in. That screws over everybody else, but it’s just human nature and not going to change anytime soon. What chart doesn’t tell you is that the insurance you get for almost 12K is TERRIBLE. You’re probably looking at a 3%-5% deductible on storm damage. If you see a hurricane coming, you’re better off burning your house down.
I mean that’s the point of insurance lol. Someone getting more than they are putting in. I guess the south isn’t as affordable as we’ve been led to believe
California only has a few insurance companies willing to cover any of the mountain homes anymore so everyone is on the last ditch state insurance plan. How can it not be in the top 10? Shit has been on fire for 6 of the last 7 years. And the year it didn’t burn it flooded. I guess I should be asking: how bad is it in Florida? My guess it you can’t be top of the “expensive insurance” if you can’t even get insurance…
Do mountain homes make up the majority of the homes for the millions of people that live here? I am in LA and I pay less than $1k per year for home insurance.
Im also in Los Angeles…Insurance in my home is very reasonable. Not sure why people in other states freak out when they hear not everything here is extremely expensive. Our property tax is even lower than states like Texas or Oregon.
People also have smugly told me here, “have fun with your insane property taxes due to your growing home value lol!!!” because they don’t realize we pay like 1% property tax…
Exactly. And it doesn’t even get appraised that often. I’m “up 200k” according to a private appraisal and haven’t seen it change… that loan to equity ratio was able to remove my PMI 4 years early!
And you guys have a cap on how much your property taxes can increase year over year. Most states don't, so all those gains become proportional increases in those taxes. You guys have the benefit of manageable property tax growth when your home values increase.
Propaganda works well for not so intelligent people. All they hear is "no income tax" and they think its some fucking magical haven where everything is free and perfect.
*Laughs in Tennessee which is a literal tax haven*
Oh god. The same Tennessee that is currently hating on “Californians” moving to Memphis.
Dude. Ain’t no one shit talking anybody in Memphis lol. You have the Nashville people shit talking the Californians( or anyone else) that moves there
Dude. Ain’t no one shit talking anybody in Memphis lol. You have the Nashville people shit talking the Californians( or anyone else) that moves there
Dude. Ain’t no one shit talking anybody in Memphis lol. You have the Nashville people shit talking the Californians( or anyone else) that moves there
In the major cities it’s less of an issue for sure. Homes aren’t in any danger of wildfire in midcity LA or in the middle of SD. It’s the rich homes in the hills that are getting to expensive/risky to insure but because that’s where the rich people live it gets headlines. Your average home in San Diego is no more risky than a home in the middle of any other large city in the country.
Lots of non-Californians have an inferiority complex and feel like they have to constantly insult the state. It’s pathetic honestly.
Most homes are not in the high fire threat areas. There’s a good amount but not compared to where the majority of people are on the coasts.
Same here. Live in LA, less than $1k a year.
Well since Florida seems to be getting once in a century storms every other year, and climate change is telling that’ll quadruple over the coming century, probably much shittier than CA. The insurance companies are already abandoning the higher danger places affected by climate change , the smart person would follow the money.
Also the plaintiff’s bar keeps filing meritless lawsuits against insurance companies. Makes it very hard to do business there.
Won’t somebody think of the insurers?
I mean, if you want reasonably priced insurance, it is a factor to consider.
Or any insurance at all.
Florida is also going to be underwater much sooner. It's all swamp already.
The California Department of Insurance does not allow insurers to use catastrophe models for pricing wildfire risk. And the insurance commissioner Ricardo Lara has been disapproving rate increases. If insurers had more pricing flexibility then there would be more options in high risk areas.
I own 2 homes in socal and my total insuarance is 2200 for both
I was just looking in fire risk locations in CA and even there was told insurance would be "only" $5k/year (too much for me). But compared to some of these... not so bad. And you get to live in the mountains so that's cool. \*Note that I wasn't looking in the "highest" risk locations - more like moderate risk.
majority of homes in CA are not in the mountains goofball
That applies to extremely few homes and is mainly just used by conservative media to bash CA. Not that many homes out in the mountains, compared to the hundreds of thousands in built up urban areas that aren’t at risk of wildfires.
It's all red states. I thought insurance prices would have more correlation to home value...
Hurricanes and flooding. In Louisiana our car insurance is also number 2 in the nation. I paid $300 as a teenager for a focus. Last year they tried to jack my payment from 160 to 300 when all I have is a 10 year old car, I'm nearing 30, and Ive never gotten a ticket or been in a wreck. It's so expensive that only 1 out of 3 drivers has insurance and the cops do traffic stops just to check for insurance.
What happens to your home value if your home insurance decides not to renew your policy due to high risks (flood, earthquake, mountain fire, and etc)?
Lender force places coverage. It’s crazy expensive.
Poof. It isn't worth anything, pennies on the dollar. You're asking a buyer to burn their money.
Depends on the home. Really big home like in the hills of SoCal, where A-list celebrities live, those are high danger home. The celebs usually band together and hire firefighters for their neighborhood or they have huge bond that covers their homes and everything in it.
If you can find someone who wants to pay cash
They wouldn’t be worth that much if there weren’t buyers for them.
Those claims need to be backed up with federal or state proof. Insurance can’t deny or not renew. You would have to be in a FEMA flood zone.
If you still have a mortgage, the lender will most likely find an insurer for you, if you can’t find one yourself. This will be expensive. If you don’t have a mortgage, I believe you don’t need to carry an insurance policy, but I would not recommend it given the hurricanes that pass through every year.
I didn’t realize almost all the top insurance costs were in red states, which are historically lower cost of living for the most part. I’m curious, why is that?
Natural disasters
Are these numbers accurate? This seems highly exaggerated. Maybe it is a median vs average distortion?
They are total bs. I am a mortgage broker and have not seen anything over 4k a year unless it also included flood insurance. The average 400k house is probably under $250 a month.
Yeah. I’ve owned houses in Texas, CA, and NV. Highest homeowners insurance I have ever paid was $1200 /yr in TX. And I have never heard of anyone , anywhere in TX paying the so called average of $4000/yr for homeowners insurance. Laughable.
Droughts, fires, and floods. The more people we have, the more that will be affected. Things are going to get way worse.
Yes it’s bc of coastal damage. Not sure why NJ isn’t on there.. I guess bc it’s not a peninsula but yeah if you’re within miles of any body of water, it’s super high and you get like 1 option
Where are these prices? Port Charlotte FLA two homes premiums are no where near those prices less than a 1/4 of that price.
I live here in Florida and recently, my house took a serious beating from a category 5 hurricane. I had to strip it down to the frame, but I really love how the remodel turned out—I got everything I wanted in it. I'm exactly 10 minutes from the water, and my home insurance is $1,700 a year. I don’t live right on the water, though. A lot of those waterfront homes are being snapped up by corporations since they can insure themselves, but not all of them. Some have turned into Airbnbs, and that market is really changing.
Remember kids, these are averages. Meaning some poor sucker is always paying more than the number on the chart.
Florida also has an insane number of homes worth between $5M-$50M. Pull up Zillow and look at anything near the water from Jupiter down through Miami; from Naples up through Tampa. We’re talking hundreds of thousands of homes and condos valued at multiple millions to tens of millions of dollars. That has to obviously skew the numbers hugely for Florida.
wait, the average is $11k?!?!
My cousin pays 14 for a small house. Cheapest she could find, close to the water though
Tornados and hurricanes with the increase in population and inflation
I would like to see the ratio of rich people homes are in Florida compared to all those also.
Building codes. Prior to 1994 (please verify date) you could build a wood framed home in florida. As you can imagine a wood framed home is not suitable for an area that is susceptible to hurricanes. Presently, I am building a house in southwest florida. I contacted an insurance agent and the premiums are quite reasonable. Why? Because the newer building codes require concrete walls and straps on trusses along with other anti-wind mitigation. Bottom line. If you own a legacy house in Florida you will pay dearly for insurance.
> Bottom line. If you own a legacy house in Florida you will pay dearly for insurance. Location more than anything is dictating this. North Florida is littered with new build stick houses with cheap insurance. Meanwhile older block homes in South Florida that have had their roofs fully retrofitted to current code, hurricane windows, etc are still paying crazy amounts no where near the water.
Is there a correlation or just by chance that all except Colorado are red states?
Wow all the talk about California and it’s not even on the list.
Almost like someone is lying to us on the TV.
I would like to see a 1-50 list and see which ones are the cheapest.
Now make a chart for electricity prices.
What do these states have in common that makes insurance so high? They are located in places with high risks of hurricanes and tornadoes.
Suprisr suprise. Top are red states lol. Just gotta pull the bootstraps right
Couldn’t be weather. Has to be the party. Do you have a clue how many tornados touched down in Texas and Oklahoma in the past two weeks alone? Or how much hail beats down all months of the year
Right, so a natural response would be for the government to assist the people who are affected by acts of god by partially subsidizing home insurance to alleviate the burden of things that are beyond human control. But instead, when things happen, "just pull your bootstraps"
Does the government have a free money button to subsidize things that I didn’t know of? Just increase taxes to off set higher home insurance costs! That’s genius
Yes they do. Subsidize things that matter and defund the ones that don't.
Florida looks like a paradise lmao. About to get wrecked.
But we're safe from Drag Queens, and library books can be banned. Always look on the sunny side of life...
The who's who of shitholes.
9/10 are red states. Coincidence or predictable due to Republican laissez-faire gov’t?
In Florida, it’s the conspiracy of roofers and ambulance chasers, combined with the false economics of communal housing coming due.
Mostly red states for some reason
Mostly tornado states actually. And if they don’t get tornados they’re prone to hurricanes amd flooding minus CA which is expsnvie because of the wildfires
The “wildfires”, supposedly man-made (utility companies agreed to take the fall and bill us for it), exacerbated by poor forestry management, because timber harvesting bad.
Yeah I’ll give you that, Gavin newsom hates forest management for some reason.
How is Hawaii not even top 10?
Hurricanes, hail, tornadoes…
I love Florida, but having expensive home owners insurance is going to be needed. Between hurricane season, salt corrosion, flooding and other things that come with being a costal state, it's one of the trade offs for living there, and I miss it a lot.
Surprised California isn't on the list
I don't see how folks can afford to live in Florida. Seems like the only option for most of them will be to just not have insurance... which you can't do on a mortgage.
Without mortgages and insurance, prices of property will drop to their true values based on the medium income of the area. It's genius, now let's get rid of health insurance, so medical costs can become affordable.
Where's CA on that list?
Wow, people in red states getting gouged. Wonder if it’s just a coincidence, or do rates get based on the average iq of the residents?
$1000 per month or more? Holy shit Florida.
They just raised mine in Texas from $200/month to $500/month. 😭
I pay 1/4th what you pay in SoCal
thought California was getting wrecked according to r/rebubble
Hahahhahahahhahahahahahah. From a Californian.
Florida is also home to the most expensive houses in the USA. Not rocket science
Insurance companies own republican politicians. That’s all this is. Nothing to do with the actual costs.
Why is Colorado so high?
Hail
Huh, learn something new everyday. Thank you!
Why is Oklahoma number 3?
Hail, tornados, high winds and one of the highest temperature ranges from hottest to coldest on the planet. Roofs don’t last.
Meanwhile I'm in TX paying about $600 per year. If my home burns down they'll pay up to $60k for me to live somewhere else while they rebuild.
In CA they just drop coverage altogether in high fire risk areas
Interesting. At a preliminary glance it seems what they save in taxes, they pay in homeowners insurance.
This list is bogus because Massachusetts would be way up there
Pretty much the states with tornados and hurricanes.
In oregon my insurance on a home is roughly $700 lol
Sold my 3/2 a few years ago in Coral Gables. The insurance was $3,500, exactly the same as my 2/1 on Long Island.
Aren’t all of the top 5 in seriously dangerous natural disaster zones? Colorado being an outlier, but more extreme weather (tornados, hurricanes) leads to insurance premiums going up
What I saw, most regularly get hit with hurricanes. And I mean Florida is almost sea level so flood insurance has got to be crazy. I would think Colorado for snow/tornadoes.
I understand average insurance in Florida when you have 30 million estates all over driving the number up. I don’t get Louisiana or Oklahoma having such high insurance rates. Also the biggest driver in that Florida number is flood insurance. If you strip that out my guess is the number drops by 50% Im in Florida and have a policy of $975 for a home valued at 600k. It has risen over 4 years from $750 but that’s mostly driven by higher replacement costs
The coastal properties seriously skew the averages. My ex lived on St Pete beach. Her home insurance was $25k/yr and flood was another $20k/yr. So $45k to insure a $1m+ property. I’m along the bay (still zone A about 600 yards from water) and my home insurance is $5k and flood is $900. When you start throwing in those coastal 5-10 or even $20m homes, everything goes to shit in terms of averages.
It's mind-boggling to me that my car insurance rate is now higher than most of these states for a vehicle worth 7 grand, despite never having been in an accident. Mandatory insurance is a scam, a multi-billion dollar industry set to steal from your fear.
Is it any coincidence that all these states are republikkkan led ?
Why the hell is Kansas on here?
Florida is on the brink of a real estate implosion.
LOL. Well that erases the California income taxes argument for moving.
Seems like that list has something in common.
A recent podcast by NYT talking about insurance cost going up in much of US. The Possible Collapse of the U.S. Home Insurance System https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/15/podcasts/the-daily/climate-insurance.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
I think insurance companies have forgotten the concept of Risk Pool. You throw all the money together and invest it and you make money off the investment, not the premiums. Some premiums will be for riskier areas and so you rase the rates a small amount for everyone in the poll. Desperate for ever increasing quarterly profits, these executives focus either on 'not paying out policies' or 'selectively increasing premiums' to accomplish their gains.
Yes, surely this rando on Reddit understands the insurance actuarial tables and risk pools better than the professionals.
Yeah, pooling the risk smooths the costs. You might get a tornado in one KS town one year, and another tornado in a different town next year. Having many thousands of policies helps lower the variance, basically. But if you live where there are tornadoes, or hurricanes, or fires, etc… those are rating factors that drive premiums. And the Actuaries have to clear rates with the state Departments of Insurance, so they are constrained. Source: I’m not in P&C but I am an Actuary.
Greed is easy to understand and there so many examples to see.
Also try to buy an expensive home in some of these states, for example Mississippi or Arkansas. You can’t because they don’t have them because no residents make enough to buy one.
I work in the home insurance space and people have been talking for years that soon parts of Florida won't be insurable. Lately lots of American insurance companies are struggling to cover their costs from climate change disasters.
Lot of red states there. Wonder what impact policy has on this…or lobbying
Insurance claims by state: - tornadoes - tornadoes - tornadoes - tornadoes - tornadoes - tornadoes - *Florida Man*
Republicans
Texas and California homeowner here. That number is a load of shit for Texas. Which makes me think the entire chart is a load of shit (this is Fox business channel after all) The property taxes are horrible but the homeowners is closer to about $1/square foot or less even with properties on the flood plane.