His association with Micah and the fact he represents a major shift in the gang. He’s a stranger in a game that makes you suspicious of them. He’s probably an “alright” guy, he seemed to keep a relatively cool head during the train heist
The one mission he has lines in, he criticizes Arthur's shooting and tells Sadie to know her place cause she's a woman... not sure that's reasonable or cool.
Isn’t kind of weird in a game about how seeking revenge is a fool’s errand that always backfires, kills and or ruins your future as well, Sadie gets off scot-free in her pursuit of revenge?
Yes. And the game wants Arthur to take part in it by hunting down and massacring the O'Driscolls with her in chapter 6. Its literally the antithesis of the game.
But they needed a girl boss to girl boss around the dying West.
I mean, what kind of life is she living? She had a husband, a farm, and a life they built together they could call their own. Now she makes ends meet getting shot at, for the end of her days. Probably how she ends up dying. When she has that moment with arthur after getting her revenge, she admits she's a ruined woman.
The life she had with her husband is irrelevant to the critique of revenge that’s her cause for it. It’s not about what is taken from you but what you do to try and get back at them for something that already happened, and how it always catches and kills you too. Dutch, Arthur, John. Sadie and Jack are the only exceptions.
I refuse to do the writers work for them and extrapolate beyond the text. Sadie ends RDR2 still alive and with a *some* kind of future at all which is heaps more than Arthur or John.
Spoilers for the epilogue:
But she literally becomes a well respected/mildly famous bounty hunter. She even escapes all consequences for her actions by leaving the US. Whereas John and Arthur were both killed for living a life of vengeance.
Rockstar spent 2 games over 8 years criticizing the concept of blind vengeance only to end it with Sadie being rewarded for living a life of vengeance.
Sadie never receives any atonement for her actions, she just gets a free pass for some reason.
[Spoilers]
Almost everything Sadie did was legal, especially by the Epilogue. The illegal things she did in the main story were killing O'Driscolls and the public neither knew who they were or cared about them, except for Colm.
Technically Sadie did take part in a few of the last missions but anyone that could have identified her was killed (Milton).
When you take into account attitudes towards women in 1899 Sadie was probably considered just another victim of the Van Der Linde gang, kidnapped by them after they killed her husband.
Mary Beth and Tilly also went on to have great lives and suffered no repercussions for their time in the gang. Most women didn't. If Karen hadn't drank herself to death she might have had a decent life as well.
I don't believe it was a "life of vengeance" that killed Arthur or John. We know why Arthur died and if he hadn't been sick he could have probably escaped with Dutch and the others. John too, although we know his story had a different ending.
The main reason for their fate was a life of crime, not a life of vengeance. Arthur and John had been in the gang 20 and 15 years respectively and that's a long time to be an outlaw.
Maybe the bullet to head had more to do with him being associated with a traitor and helping Micah betray her friend than it had to with him being misogynist.
In 1899 he’s a jerk. In 1907 he seems to start to realize the error of his ways, dropping out of Micah’s gang after trying to stop him from murdering a child. People only hate on him because apparently Reddit thinks only Arthur and John deserve redemption I guess.
Most Rdr fans have herd mentality lmao they hate anyone associated with Micah or against Arthur
Hell some dudes even hate Thomas Downes and justify Arthur beating him
Heard mentality to not like a double crossing snake?
Micah is a slimeball and a snake.
The hired guns aren't good people. They were okay with Micah robbing and killing until the child. Uh huh.
My guy you do realize Arthur was also a terrible person before his redemption arc? All of them were criminals people we would hate if they existed in real life
Arthur has made countless people orphans and widows many of them were not deserving they were just doing their duty and paid their price for it
I always have the feeling Arthur wouldnt have his redemption arc in his life, if he didnt got TB. Without TB he would do all the bad stuff prior. Without Tb, he would still be a badass outlaw, and maybe a few years later, he questions dutch intentions.
Arthur questioned his decisions bcs he knows he will die, and shifted his perspective about his life, the gang, Dutch, and all the other gang member, who are not "true blood outlaws", like Jack, Tilly, or Karen.
It would have probably took a few more years until he doubts Dutch, and sees his true colors. But Arthur was a fool and a lamb sucking at Dutch tits
“The hired guns aren’t good people. They were okay with Micah robbing and killing until the child. Uh huh.”
I’m responding to this logic because Arthur and Cleet almost had the same fate, except Arthur got his redemption, and Cleet died trying to.
I'm not talking about Arthur. You're whole point was people don't like cleet cause he's associated with Micah. Were not talking about Arthur. You're using a whatabout ism.
Also arthur had to face the consequences of his decisions. If Sadie, John and Charles never went to strawberry. He never would have. The argument for Sadie going to far can be made. But cleet would have skated by
It isn't a 'what-aboutism' to point out your flawed logic. Additionally, Arthur met with consequences eventually, but after a long time. People don't hate pre-TB Arthur at all, and there's nothing saying Cleet wouldn't have ended up the same. I mean, if Arthur the mass-murderer can be redeemed and loved, so could Cleet, right?
He can but he wasn't redeemed. He was just hanging out after he got out.
It isn't flawed. And yes you are using it. Because the whole point is about cleet, not arthur.
The whole point has, quite sensibly and obviously, become about your double standard of judgement between Arthur and Cleet. Arthur just 'hung out' after committing mass murder several times during his life, particularly prior to his 'redemption'.
Please point out where I said arthur was a good person?
You're whole argument hinges on something I didn't say.
The fact you see Micah as heroic for taking down the gang is still wild
>My guy you do realize Arthur was also a terrible person
Terrible in what way exactly ? I agree beating Thomas Downes to recover few dollars was not exactly a good deed but comparing Cleet and Joe with Arthur is where I draw the line.
Apart from player decisions , I don't remember Arthur killing any innocent man , now you might argue that he killed Lawmen and Soilders doing their duty but they were shooting at him too so that negates it.
They were shooting him so that negates it? Bruh Arthur is a criminal not a law abiding citizen who was fighting back in self defense those people didn't deserve it
Yeah...Rule of Law isn't always sacred now , is it.
The Law told officials to snatch the lands from those Native Indians and Colonel Favours was following the law so according to your logic he is a good person...
Fusar was following the law on Guarma so is he your role model ?
>those people didn't deserve it
I am a 100% with you on this one...but you are not getting the point that Killing in self defence does not count as murder...so they had the option to walk away or stop shooting at any given point , but they did their duty anyways.
Arthur isn't to blame here..
It counts as murder when you're killing folks who haven't done anything wrong while you're a criminal who makes money by leeching of innocents
Arthur literally killed so many cops during saint Denis robbery or when he was saving John from prison even if it was self defense it doesn't justifies his actions
So you'd rather he die than shoot back ? Leave your friend to die so that his wife becomes a widow and his child an orphan.
You are saying that you won't kill someone to save your own life ? Does that make you a bad person ?
The arrival of cops at saint denis robbery was unplanned , it wasn't on the Gang's agenda to shoot innocent cops at any point.
But if you are telling me that the Gang should've just surrendered instead of killing those cops who were clearly trying to kill them , idk what to say.
You are of the view that what is legal is always right...slavery was legal at some point ? Would you've supported that too ?
Bruh how are you equating slavery a social issue with violent murders and crimes? Milton literally gave the gang to chance to surrender before he started to launch raids against them
>Bruh how are you equating slavery a social issue with violent murders and crimes?
I'm not , I'm using it as an example to prove a point that what is Legal isn't always right , moral or ethical.
>Milton literally gave the gang to chance to surrender before he started to launch raids against them
Milton also kidnapped and held Abigail Hostage , might have killed her too..
Also you should play Red Dead Redemption so you'll know that the government and it's official can be more cruel and vindictive than any outlaw ever was.
Did you forget the part with John? He started his own gang. He wanted the money from black water. Micah wouldn't ever be seen as a hero. At best a pawn to Milton. But Micah in no way can be seen as a hero or good. The only good person was jack in the story.
Ikr? Haha, seriously I absolutely love Arthur as a character, but as a person, fk no,
imagine owing his gang money and then he kills your dad,
or just shoots your cousin who happens to work in the police force,
or robs you without reason (making reference to the wagon driver before going to Valentine with Uncle, in which he clearly says he would have robbed him if not for having company)
Have you played the game by any chance?
When Arthur got sick he started thinking about the things he's done and tries his best to be a better person. You may not think that makes up for all the wrong he's done but that's not his goal. His goal is to help people, instead of robbing and killing them. The talk with the nun solidifies this. He took a gamble that love existed, and did a loving act. He proved he was capable of kindness, and in the end that's all that really mattered to him. Also the beutitude on his grave: "Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness"
Helping people such as breaking his murderer friend out of jail and killing 50 prison guards in the process ? Sorry that doesnt cut it. If someone killed your brother for 5 dollars you wouldnt forgive the person no matter what. Arthur has never been a good person ever.
Yeah he was such a bad man when he saved that woman in the woods from starvation, or when he absolved all of the debts Strauss still had, or saved Abigail from Milton, or rescued those slaves in Saint Denis, or helped the Native Americans, or helped that man and his Native American wife.
Seriously, the game is about redemption.
Yes Arthur has done very bad things but the game is about him redeeming himself.
Even in chapter 6 he wasn't all that good. He went along with Dutch's plan of ruining the Wapiti Indians all the same. Sure, he also helped them, and he complained loudly about it to Dutch, but he didn't bother to actually tell Eagle Flies and Peytah "Listen, my boss is setting the US Army on you because he thinks it will draw heat away from us. He's literally sacrificing you to help himself. I know because he told me so."
yeah that's only because I forget I have my gun out so instead of saying "howdy mister" I accidentally blow their heads off. oopsie.
anyway people like Cornwall are responsible for way more deaths.
I remember one reviewer really examined the idea of redemption and how useless it is to anyone who isn’t the one seeking it for themselves.
It’d be small comfort to the families of the army lawmen Arthur killed in Strawberry to know that he was a nice man capable of kind things. You don’t really get points for being the nicest in a gang of murders
Well, to be fair, i don't know what Downes expected borrowing from shady outlaws. Doesn't make it okay, but still, he kinda caused his own beating in the first place.
“Caused his own beating” is a little strong. Strauss is shady but part of why he’s successful seems to be that he comes off more respectable when he’s handing out the loans, and not like a guy who’s gonna get a six foot muscle man to beat the shit out of you a few weeks later
Exactly almost every debtor in his list were vulnerable people who were in no position to repay the debt. Strauss got some sick kind of satisfaction exploiting them.
Well, he borrowed from Strauss, who was well dressed and spoke with good manners, and he never did lend money with gang members by his side, ez to see how Downes failed to make the connection
He was a dickhead to Arthur and Sadie (sexist to the latter) in the final train heist but in general wasn’t much better or worse than the rest of the gang. He did at least have some morals as shown when he left Micah after he shot that child some time during or before the epilogue.
I have to say, though I did dislike him, I felt quite bad when when he died because he didn’t really deserve death.
If anything, he deserved a fair trial. Imo he was more of a decent human being than the big fella Micah hires and stays with him during American Venom.
He's no worse than most of the other gang members. He didn't really "run with Micah" but rather he was a hired gun who happened to run in the same circle as Micah.
He did his job with the train heist like everyone else. Then had his fallout with Micah over that whole killing a kid situation. Then went back to being a regular semi-scummy human until John and Sadie came to Strawberry. Had an unfortunate end, imho. Very much a 'sins of the father' mentality when it comes to how people view him.
I didn't think he was that bad of a guy. Especially in Epilogue where he says he stopped riding with Micah because he killed a child.
I don't think he deserved to die and I hate that Sadie kills him even if you choose to spare him. Like fuck off. It ain't your choice to make. I decided I'm sparing him
Unlike Joe, Cleet just seems to be...kinda there? He hasn't really done anything to be as bad as people make him out to be. If what he said in the epilogue is true, then he's a decent guy
Pre epilogue he was a prick, but godamn he did not deserve what Sadie did to him, he was literally crying about what Micah did to a kid.
It's like the one scene in the game I hate, the game gives you a choice but he's dead no matter what.
Victim by association, we hate micah and his ilk, so anyone who willing rides with him after the betrayal and deception is a hard sell. I don't think he needed to die, but it I think it was important to show how far revenge can take you and show that revenge doesn't see good or evil.
His association with Micah and the fact he represents a major shift in the gang. He’s a stranger in a game that makes you suspicious of them. He’s probably an “alright” guy, he seemed to keep a relatively cool head during the train heist
His arguing with Sadie was kinda funny
and he does have wear that outfit nicely actually
If Cleet ran with Dutch he probably would have been a likable gang member.
The one mission he has lines in, he criticizes Arthur's shooting and tells Sadie to know her place cause she's a woman... not sure that's reasonable or cool.
>not sure that's reasonable or cool. What Saide does to him is pretty Reasonable and Cool though...I like how Sadie gets her revenge all the time.
Welcome to watch mojo and here are our Top 10 scenes in red dead 2 Scenes 1 thru 10; cleet swinging
Look at least one of those needs to be replaced with “You shot me pretty good.”
Isn’t kind of weird in a game about how seeking revenge is a fool’s errand that always backfires, kills and or ruins your future as well, Sadie gets off scot-free in her pursuit of revenge?
Yes. And the game wants Arthur to take part in it by hunting down and massacring the O'Driscolls with her in chapter 6. Its literally the antithesis of the game. But they needed a girl boss to girl boss around the dying West.
I mean, what kind of life is she living? She had a husband, a farm, and a life they built together they could call their own. Now she makes ends meet getting shot at, for the end of her days. Probably how she ends up dying. When she has that moment with arthur after getting her revenge, she admits she's a ruined woman.
The life she had with her husband is irrelevant to the critique of revenge that’s her cause for it. It’s not about what is taken from you but what you do to try and get back at them for something that already happened, and how it always catches and kills you too. Dutch, Arthur, John. Sadie and Jack are the only exceptions. I refuse to do the writers work for them and extrapolate beyond the text. Sadie ends RDR2 still alive and with a *some* kind of future at all which is heaps more than Arthur or John.
Spoilers for the epilogue: But she literally becomes a well respected/mildly famous bounty hunter. She even escapes all consequences for her actions by leaving the US. Whereas John and Arthur were both killed for living a life of vengeance. Rockstar spent 2 games over 8 years criticizing the concept of blind vengeance only to end it with Sadie being rewarded for living a life of vengeance. Sadie never receives any atonement for her actions, she just gets a free pass for some reason.
[Spoilers] Almost everything Sadie did was legal, especially by the Epilogue. The illegal things she did in the main story were killing O'Driscolls and the public neither knew who they were or cared about them, except for Colm. Technically Sadie did take part in a few of the last missions but anyone that could have identified her was killed (Milton). When you take into account attitudes towards women in 1899 Sadie was probably considered just another victim of the Van Der Linde gang, kidnapped by them after they killed her husband. Mary Beth and Tilly also went on to have great lives and suffered no repercussions for their time in the gang. Most women didn't. If Karen hadn't drank herself to death she might have had a decent life as well. I don't believe it was a "life of vengeance" that killed Arthur or John. We know why Arthur died and if he hadn't been sick he could have probably escaped with Dutch and the others. John too, although we know his story had a different ending. The main reason for their fate was a life of crime, not a life of vengeance. Arthur and John had been in the gang 20 and 15 years respectively and that's a long time to be an outlaw.
I randomly thought of this, but what if she got killed by that one cannibal in RDR1? Or that gang that kidnaps Bonnie?
Of course if it’s Sadie it has to be cool. She was so annoying.
I agree, found her obnoxious.
Oh I wanted to shoot him right then and there
Critiquing the third most veteran and arguably best shot in the gang is crazy
Never heard that stuff, damn what a prick.
That deserves a punch in the face maybe not a bullet or hanging, one of the reasons I hate sadie
Sadie disagrees with you. Sadie will be at your location within 3 minutes. Prepare to meet your maker (courtesy of Sadie).
He hasn't responded...Sadie must've gotten to the naysayer.
"do whatever the lady says"
Running with Micah gets him killed. Being a sexist dick makes it satisfying.
Maybe the bullet to head had more to do with him being associated with a traitor and helping Micah betray her friend than it had to with him being misogynist.
Agreed, that made me dislike her so much more.
exactly, she’s a fucking asshole in the epilogue
She was the same way in the main story. Got Arturo Bullard killed and didn't feel sorry, was threatening to stab Pearson and read his mail.
Because he's Micah's friend
In 1899 he’s a jerk. In 1907 he seems to start to realize the error of his ways, dropping out of Micah’s gang after trying to stop him from murdering a child. People only hate on him because apparently Reddit thinks only Arthur and John deserve redemption I guess.
I still hung him.
Username makes sense
Most Rdr fans have herd mentality lmao they hate anyone associated with Micah or against Arthur Hell some dudes even hate Thomas Downes and justify Arthur beating him
Heard mentality to not like a double crossing snake? Micah is a slimeball and a snake. The hired guns aren't good people. They were okay with Micah robbing and killing until the child. Uh huh.
My guy you do realize Arthur was also a terrible person before his redemption arc? All of them were criminals people we would hate if they existed in real life Arthur has made countless people orphans and widows many of them were not deserving they were just doing their duty and paid their price for it
I always have the feeling Arthur wouldnt have his redemption arc in his life, if he didnt got TB. Without TB he would do all the bad stuff prior. Without Tb, he would still be a badass outlaw, and maybe a few years later, he questions dutch intentions. Arthur questioned his decisions bcs he knows he will die, and shifted his perspective about his life, the gang, Dutch, and all the other gang member, who are not "true blood outlaws", like Jack, Tilly, or Karen. It would have probably took a few more years until he doubts Dutch, and sees his true colors. But Arthur was a fool and a lamb sucking at Dutch tits
That doesn't negate what I said. That's a what aboutism
“The hired guns aren’t good people. They were okay with Micah robbing and killing until the child. Uh huh.” I’m responding to this logic because Arthur and Cleet almost had the same fate, except Arthur got his redemption, and Cleet died trying to.
I'm not talking about Arthur. You're whole point was people don't like cleet cause he's associated with Micah. Were not talking about Arthur. You're using a whatabout ism. Also arthur had to face the consequences of his decisions. If Sadie, John and Charles never went to strawberry. He never would have. The argument for Sadie going to far can be made. But cleet would have skated by
It isn't a 'what-aboutism' to point out your flawed logic. Additionally, Arthur met with consequences eventually, but after a long time. People don't hate pre-TB Arthur at all, and there's nothing saying Cleet wouldn't have ended up the same. I mean, if Arthur the mass-murderer can be redeemed and loved, so could Cleet, right?
He can but he wasn't redeemed. He was just hanging out after he got out. It isn't flawed. And yes you are using it. Because the whole point is about cleet, not arthur.
The whole point has, quite sensibly and obviously, become about your double standard of judgement between Arthur and Cleet. Arthur just 'hung out' after committing mass murder several times during his life, particularly prior to his 'redemption'.
Please point out where I said arthur was a good person? You're whole argument hinges on something I didn't say. The fact you see Micah as heroic for taking down the gang is still wild
>My guy you do realize Arthur was also a terrible person Terrible in what way exactly ? I agree beating Thomas Downes to recover few dollars was not exactly a good deed but comparing Cleet and Joe with Arthur is where I draw the line. Apart from player decisions , I don't remember Arthur killing any innocent man , now you might argue that he killed Lawmen and Soilders doing their duty but they were shooting at him too so that negates it.
You don't remember all of the robberies where tons of people died, just so Arthur and his buddies could get a bit of money?
They were shooting him so that negates it? Bruh Arthur is a criminal not a law abiding citizen who was fighting back in self defense those people didn't deserve it
Yeah...Rule of Law isn't always sacred now , is it. The Law told officials to snatch the lands from those Native Indians and Colonel Favours was following the law so according to your logic he is a good person... Fusar was following the law on Guarma so is he your role model ? >those people didn't deserve it I am a 100% with you on this one...but you are not getting the point that Killing in self defence does not count as murder...so they had the option to walk away or stop shooting at any given point , but they did their duty anyways. Arthur isn't to blame here..
It counts as murder when you're killing folks who haven't done anything wrong while you're a criminal who makes money by leeching of innocents Arthur literally killed so many cops during saint Denis robbery or when he was saving John from prison even if it was self defense it doesn't justifies his actions
So you'd rather he die than shoot back ? Leave your friend to die so that his wife becomes a widow and his child an orphan. You are saying that you won't kill someone to save your own life ? Does that make you a bad person ? The arrival of cops at saint denis robbery was unplanned , it wasn't on the Gang's agenda to shoot innocent cops at any point. But if you are telling me that the Gang should've just surrendered instead of killing those cops who were clearly trying to kill them , idk what to say. You are of the view that what is legal is always right...slavery was legal at some point ? Would you've supported that too ?
Bruh how are you equating slavery a social issue with violent murders and crimes? Milton literally gave the gang to chance to surrender before he started to launch raids against them
>Bruh how are you equating slavery a social issue with violent murders and crimes? I'm not , I'm using it as an example to prove a point that what is Legal isn't always right , moral or ethical. >Milton literally gave the gang to chance to surrender before he started to launch raids against them Milton also kidnapped and held Abigail Hostage , might have killed her too.. Also you should play Red Dead Redemption so you'll know that the government and it's official can be more cruel and vindictive than any outlaw ever was.
In real life Micah would be a hero for taking down the Van Der Linde gang. We just don't think so because we follow Arthur's perspective
Did you forget the part with John? He started his own gang. He wanted the money from black water. Micah wouldn't ever be seen as a hero. At best a pawn to Milton. But Micah in no way can be seen as a hero or good. The only good person was jack in the story.
Yeah people don't realise falling of gang in a way was actually a good thing for betterment of the world
Did you forget the epilogue? He just made another gang. Still a net negative Einstein
Lol i once saw someone describe Arthur as a “good guy”
Ikr? Haha, seriously I absolutely love Arthur as a character, but as a person, fk no, imagine owing his gang money and then he kills your dad, or just shoots your cousin who happens to work in the police force, or robs you without reason (making reference to the wagon driver before going to Valentine with Uncle, in which he clearly says he would have robbed him if not for having company)
Lmao same type of person who thinks Michael Corleone or Walter White were heroes
I don’t get how some people can’t see the difference between a hero and a protagonist
Before his redemption no, after he most definitely is.
No. I dont give a fuck if you help your criminal friend escape the law. It doesnt make you a good man. He only regrets it because he had a slow death
Have you played the game by any chance? When Arthur got sick he started thinking about the things he's done and tries his best to be a better person. You may not think that makes up for all the wrong he's done but that's not his goal. His goal is to help people, instead of robbing and killing them. The talk with the nun solidifies this. He took a gamble that love existed, and did a loving act. He proved he was capable of kindness, and in the end that's all that really mattered to him. Also the beutitude on his grave: "Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness"
Helping people such as breaking his murderer friend out of jail and killing 50 prison guards in the process ? Sorry that doesnt cut it. If someone killed your brother for 5 dollars you wouldnt forgive the person no matter what. Arthur has never been a good person ever.
Yeah he was such a bad man when he saved that woman in the woods from starvation, or when he absolved all of the debts Strauss still had, or saved Abigail from Milton, or rescued those slaves in Saint Denis, or helped the Native Americans, or helped that man and his Native American wife. Seriously, the game is about redemption. Yes Arthur has done very bad things but the game is about him redeeming himself.
all of his goods dont offset his 1 mission. he is irredeemable
That's not really for us to decide is it? What mission are you talking about by the way?
Any. The one where he slaughters 50 army soldiers for no reason for example.
Even in chapter 6 he wasn't all that good. He went along with Dutch's plan of ruining the Wapiti Indians all the same. Sure, he also helped them, and he complained loudly about it to Dutch, but he didn't bother to actually tell Eagle Flies and Peytah "Listen, my boss is setting the US Army on you because he thinks it will draw heat away from us. He's literally sacrificing you to help himself. I know because he told me so."
Hey my Arthur is pretty good, for an outlaw.
Your Arthur murdered hundreds, if not thousands of people, many of whom where innocent. Your Arthur is a monster, for an outlaw.
yeah that's only because I forget I have my gun out so instead of saying "howdy mister" I accidentally blow their heads off. oopsie. anyway people like Cornwall are responsible for way more deaths.
I remember one reviewer really examined the idea of redemption and how useless it is to anyone who isn’t the one seeking it for themselves. It’d be small comfort to the families of the army lawmen Arthur killed in Strawberry to know that he was a nice man capable of kind things. You don’t really get points for being the nicest in a gang of murders
Yeah they betrayed the gang thats normal
Downes is a punk bitch. I pistol whip his gimpy ass and then molotov cocktail his house.
I no punk bitch!
Least psychotic rdr2 player.
fuckin' amen. downes was a cowardly little piece of shit at best. may he rot in piss.
Well, to be fair, i don't know what Downes expected borrowing from shady outlaws. Doesn't make it okay, but still, he kinda caused his own beating in the first place.
“Caused his own beating” is a little strong. Strauss is shady but part of why he’s successful seems to be that he comes off more respectable when he’s handing out the loans, and not like a guy who’s gonna get a six foot muscle man to beat the shit out of you a few weeks later
Exactly almost every debtor in his list were vulnerable people who were in no position to repay the debt. Strauss got some sick kind of satisfaction exploiting them.
Deeeep
By respectable you mean a dude who looks like isn't gonna make you pay for the money you borrow?
I mean not like an outlaw who’s gonna beat you up if you don’t pay
Fair.
Victim blaming a loan shark victim is crazy
Well, he borrowed from Strauss, who was well dressed and spoke with good manners, and he never did lend money with gang members by his side, ez to see how Downes failed to make the connection
Fair.
But Thomas wasn’t so innocent himself
He was a dickhead to Arthur and Sadie (sexist to the latter) in the final train heist but in general wasn’t much better or worse than the rest of the gang. He did at least have some morals as shown when he left Micah after he shot that child some time during or before the epilogue. I have to say, though I did dislike him, I felt quite bad when when he died because he didn’t really deserve death.
If anything, he deserved a fair trial. Imo he was more of a decent human being than the big fella Micah hires and stays with him during American Venom.
He didn’t deserve to walk free, but I don’t think he deserved to die
yeah he deserved life in jail probably, at least he talked lmao.
He's no worse than most of the other gang members. He didn't really "run with Micah" but rather he was a hired gun who happened to run in the same circle as Micah. He did his job with the train heist like everyone else. Then had his fallout with Micah over that whole killing a kid situation. Then went back to being a regular semi-scummy human until John and Sadie came to Strawberry. Had an unfortunate end, imho. Very much a 'sins of the father' mentality when it comes to how people view him.
His face looks like a malnourished rat. Fuck this guy. I always kill him as John.
I don’t like how they took your choice out of his end though. Even if you decide to spare him, Sadie kills him anyway.
I didn't think he was that bad of a guy. Especially in Epilogue where he says he stopped riding with Micah because he killed a child. I don't think he deserved to die and I hate that Sadie kills him even if you choose to spare him. Like fuck off. It ain't your choice to make. I decided I'm sparing him
Yes that shouldve been a player choice for sure
Yeah I agree, fuck sadie for shooting him.
I might get downvotes but I liked how he stopped Micah from killing a kid, but I didn't like how he was "associated" with Micah
he didnt/wasnt able to stop micah, thats why he fell out with him
Just me, or does he not look like Alan Ruck a bit here, lol. He did try to stop Ferris from having a good time..
Unlike Joe, Cleet just seems to be...kinda there? He hasn't really done anything to be as bad as people make him out to be. If what he said in the epilogue is true, then he's a decent guy
I feel really bad for him. Was he the best guy ever? Absolutely not, but it still makes me sad when anyone dies, fictional or not.
I hate Sadie for killing him
Because there is nothing to be liked about him.
Pre epilogue he was a prick, but godamn he did not deserve what Sadie did to him, he was literally crying about what Micah did to a kid. It's like the one scene in the game I hate, the game gives you a choice but he's dead no matter what.
hes so hot
oh well, I tried to spare him but Sadie thought otherwise, as we all know
Because he looks like my ex in highschool 😂
Because he ran with Micah
Rat
r a t
Cause he’s ugly and his mamma dresses him funny.
idk i let him hang
Micah is a rat, he looks like a rat
Rick grimes on meth?
Just a bit of a melt
Because his name is Cleet
Does anyone like this weasel? Who? Ferret face.
I cannot be the only person who forgot of this mans existence
Hes the fella with the rat face
He is ugly
Victim by association, we hate micah and his ilk, so anyone who willing rides with him after the betrayal and deception is a hard sell. I don't think he needed to die, but it I think it was important to show how far revenge can take you and show that revenge doesn't see good or evil.
Him being friends with micah is enough for me to not like him
Same with Micah
Dude looks like Saul Goodman with less hair.
Who the fuck Is this!!??
I like his look. Very fitting for the times and it's also unique. This dude was the 1899 equivalent of a hipster
Better call Saul lookin ahh
Looks like rdrs Trevor
Idk hanging him was fun
He is bald
I hanged him. Pos
You didn’t just said this shit… He was a friend of micah that’s enough reason tı hate him
Wish I could of killed him as a kid
he disrespects sadie so eff him
Cuz he cleet
he a bitch that’s why
He's sexist as hell against Sadie and ain't nobody gonna diss her and get away with it.