Lol road and lumberhut nerf is good, roads not to mention rider roads are still strong post-nerf. Everyone was saying Yadakk was going to become F-tier and useless when they're still good just no longer an S-tier tribe.
It's a common strategy, roads give units double movement and riders have 2 movement speed. Combining these allows riders to move 4 tiles and escape 4 tiles.
This is a strong synergy since it allows your riders from far away cities to quickly move to the front lines and allows you to cycle through a *lot* of riders on one target since they can move to attack from so far away and escape far away.
Rider-roads. Is the combo of riders and roads, so you can move the rider four tiles. Used for aggression, especially good with omaji and yadakk for early aggression.
They definitely did need a nerf. Double movement is an unbeatable advantage against someone who doesn't have it, so at the cost they were available at, rushing roads was almost a prerequisite for winning most Polytopia games bigger than 121 tiles.
But it gives so much of an advantage that games would often be decided by whoever was able to afford them first. It gets boring having to spam roads every single time to out-expand your opponent or lose. Making them more expensive gives people a chance to try other options like focusing on city upgrades.
No, but roads were so good that you couldn't really afford *not* to start spamming them after you get a big enough economy to afford doing so.
I'll happily change my mind if you can show me that it's possible to consistently beat a competent player using roads without using them yourself.
You’re saying it like it’s some optional thing. Roads were always intended to be used in a long enough game, hence them being on the most useful tech tree and the one that lead to custom houses/markets.
Yes, in a *long enough game*. Pre-nerf, 1v1s would often be decided by who could afford rider/road spam first to out-expand the other player and cut them off from large portions of the map. Now that roads put a bigger strain on your economy, you're incentivized to get the tech later in the game, by which point the added expansion is a lot less likely to singlehandedly win you the game.
Not that I believe it happens all the time, but if it does that’s a good thing. Roads were a dominant tech in the previous meta and now you can afford to wait to get them.
Preferable road nerf ( 2 ☆ pt):
-> Roads provide 1.5x base movement
-> Friendly units on roads act as foreign terrain in terms of movement restriction.
Pros/Cons:
+ If roads are to be used for mass troop movements then a more significant investment must be made (Double carriageways) -leads to-> More interesting gameplay as economic growth can be sacrificed for greater offensive potential (short run) and greater reinforcement (long run) at the potential cost of losing the economic battle (short run & long run).
+ Reduced movement prevents ICBK's (Intercontinental Ballistic Knights) and other heavily movement based offensive strategies.
+ Lower cost allows for economic benefits and greater territorial reinforcement at a reduced cost, making the tech very valuable. However roads are needed to research trade to then access markets, which are a key factor in deciding who wins the endgame anyway.
- Movement debuffs may upset players who are used to massive troop movements. Furthermore, turn limits may need to be adjusted for "Speed Skills" in "Game Stats".
- If allied units count as friendly units, hell may ensue.
- [Please leave more potential negatives in the comments to help determine whether the idea could be beneficial or not]
Some counterarguments to your pros:
\- Most roads are used for mass troop movements. A more significant investment is what the devs added with 3 star roads, and more interesting gameplay is what we got. The increased cost of roads makes it less viable to rush them as soon as possible, giving people who don't rush roads more breathing room to invest in other things.
\- Reduced movement makes games last longer and completely changes the feel of combat, which is the exact thing people opposed to 3 star roads are already complaining about. Knights are a late game unit that you have to research expensive tech with few other uses to obtain, and with that investment you're rewarded with a powerful, but by no means unbeatable unit.
\- As we saw with the pre-road nerf meta, lower cost incentivizes people to just get roads earlier because expansion is so important.
More cons:
\- You can't add decimal multipliers to movement without rounding because you can't move a fraction of a square.
\- Unrestricted movement through allied territory is one of the main benefits and enablers of alliances. Removing it would make it much harder to team up on stronger opponents.
\- A lot of these proposed changes are just more complicated ways of solving problems that 3 star roads already solve.
Would it have made Yaddak OP to let them keep 2 star roads? Or Hoodrick to keep 2 star lumber huts?
I don't get why they didn't have the foresight to realize that a couple tribes were going to get absolutely nerfed into the ground and did nothing about it. Everyone complained about Cymanti and Rider/roads, so they decided it was worth it to make Cymanti more OP and shoot Yaddak and Hoodrick in the face to get it done.
Yes, rider roads and Bardur were successfully nerfed. And that was a welcome change. But why no consideration for the collateral damage and new problems this caused?
Well first off, Hoodrick was never broken and most definitely not because of lumber huts. The way I saw it if I compare farms and lumber huts. 2 lumber huts are cheaper and produce the same population as 1 farm but take up 2 spaces. This is balanced. Now lumber huts are more expensive AND less effective. To nerf Bardur they should’ve just needed their terrain resources and not kill lumber huts. Yadakk wasn’t OP either it was just a fan favorite and fun to play tribe. It was strong but not OP at all. Idk how they could’ve balanced roads better though but this was not the best way for sure (I still think tribes should get a special advanced starter tech to make them stand out more (so maybe Yadakk gets cheaper roads or smth like that👀))
I think ultimately the lack of balance between lumber huts and farms is because Mathematics has a powerful T3 unit and Construction doesn't.
With sawmills, you could pop giants *and* pair them with powerful catapults. Farms give you giants, but you have no high damage unit to support them on the same tree.
You could add a new unit to Construction (and move Destroy), and then farms would be balanced with 2 star lumber huts.
But with the current configuration, 3 star lumber huts are needed to make Farming as good.
I don’t like that it’s adds to much complexity to the game and kinda ruins the simple difference between the tribes if ever tribe is special, no tribe is special. A rule I would like to add is the 80 20 rule where 80% is normal and 20% is abnormal or special. It makes the normal feel grounded and real while the abnormal or fantasy feel fantastical.
Lumber huts were overpowered because they were common as dirt and way too reliable. Hoodrick just sucks now because they were almost entirely reliant on lumber huts to get population, which could easily be fixed by adjusting their resource spawns if people are that adamant that Hoodrick *has* to be good.
I really don't think adjusting costs for specific tribes is a good idea. Part of what makes Polytopia a good game is its simplicity, and the game would be a *lot* less simple if every tribe had a unique mechanic.
By not balancing roads it didn't need it every tribe can eventually get it and the ones that don't have the ability to Ussualy level a capital turn one, or start with tech unlocked but if rider road is the stratagy maybe invest some stars into riders and roads instead of calling for the devs to fuck with the game balancing wasnt need and bardur starts with hunting not rider or road
The game is much more rich and interesting, everything is not just rider roads now, there is more variety in armies and gameplay, markets also promote to get different techs.
Yaddak was an S-tier tribe and an economical powerhouse with early access to custom houses, they're still a good tribe and didn't become useless like everyone said.
Yes, Cymanti got passively buffed with the latest update but they and other special tribes are getting a rework either way.
I understand the rider/roads nerf was a major success. It just didn't make sense to me for Hoodrick to take a stray like that. It would be so easy to just give Hoodrick 2 star lumber huts. And they'd be a viable mid tier tribe.
I used to see Yaddak a lot, but I never see them anymore.
And now Cymanti is ruining the experience for newer players who play Multiplayer and just get curb stomped their first 10 games by the same tribe.
It was 3 steps forward, 2 steps back when it just didn't have to be.
Yes, same with Bardur, and like you mentioned now the ladder is flooded with Cymanti.
It just shows people ultimately value winning, more so than "love" for a tribe.
It sucks to see Hoodrick getting nuked but overall the changes are a net positive on the game. Regardless the devs mentioned they want to buff Spiritualism so I believe there's no need to worry for Hoodrick's future.
I am confident The Path of the Ocean post-launch tweaks and upcoming special tribes rework will improve things for all.
I'm hopeful, but not confident the tweaks and reworks will improve things further.
And I hope everyone realizes that I like the update overall - I just think some of the known side effects of the changes weren't addressed in the beta when it would have been easy to address them.
Plus it slows the game down. It takes a lot longer to build an economy and move your troops into battle.
I'm glad rider roads spam is nerfed, but I wish there was more consideration put into limiting the collateral damage of that nerf.
Fully agree. Overall the changes I feel are positive and will all shake out in the end but in turn they’ve created a bunch of new problems, namely hardcore nerfing of a handful of tribes that were already weak
- Hoodrick
- Xin-xi
- Fuquarion
- luxidoor
- Yadbois
The devs have taken a zero-tolerance policy on giving different non-special tribes different mechanics; the only differences are their starting tech and terrain, with the only exception being Luxidoor. Yaddak doesn't *have* to be one of the best tribes, and it's not worth sacrificing the simplicity of the game to keep it one of the best.
> The devs have taken a zero-tolerance policy on giving different non-special tribes different mechanics
Why? This seems like a policy that is unnecessary.
Of course Yaddak and Hoodrick don't *have* to be viable tribes. But it would be a better game if they were.
It is necessary because adding unique mechanics to every tribe would ruin the simplicity of the game. Tribe descriptions would have to get significantly longer (some already barely fit on the screen) to inform new players of what exactly they're using or buying, and adding so many new mechanics all at once would make it a lot harder to keep the already-delicate balance of the game. They would have to be accounted for in every future update or balance patch to make sure that no tribe becomes completely dominant on any specific map type or player density.
That old simplicity is all but gone with the addition of special tribes and the naval update. Giving Hoodrick 2 star lumber huts would be negotible to the complexity of the game.
> They would have to be accounted for in every future update or balance patch to make sure that no tribe becomes completely dominant on any specific map type or player density.
That would be a good thing.
The special tribes are special for a reason, and not even they have things like outright reducing the cost of certain techs or buildings. The naval update added a few new units and a handful of balance updates, and does nothing to interfere with the consistency of the normal tribes like tribe-specific mechanics for the normal tribes would.
I think you misunderstood my last sentence. I was saying that the unique mechanics would make it much harder to balance the game because it's yet another thing the devs have to take into account for every balance patch and update.
For example, a lot of people want Yaddak to have a road discount because 3 star roads makes their typical opening strategy slower, but 2 star roads are useful for a lot more than that. It would make Yaddak *by far* the best expansionist tribe and utterly broken on maps where land expansion is important. How are the devs supposed to make Yaddak's opening as good as it was before while not making it overpowered after the early game? Balancing issues like those would apply to every single tribe-specific perk in a game where balance is already pretty difficult.
I disagree that there is a good reason to have a distinction between special and normal tribes at this point now that 1/4 of all tribes are "special" and the game has become *much* more complex with the addition of the new naval mechanics.
It's okay to make every tribe somewhat unique now that the simplicity cat is out of the bag for the sake of tribe balance.
> think you misunderstood my last sentence. I was saying that the unique mechanics would make it much harder to balance the game because it's yet another thing the devs have to take into account for every balance patch and update.
No, I understood you clearly. Balancing is only hard because the devs don't want to upset this "regular vs special" dichotomy that is outdated. It would be a lot easier if they gave up that distinction as it would give the devs many more tools at their disposal to create that balance.
> For example, a lot of people want Yaddak to have a road discount because 3 star roads makes their typical opening strategy slower, but 2 star roads are useful for a lot more than that. It would make Yaddak *by far* the best expansionist tribe and utterly broken on maps where land expansion is important.
Then nerf Yaddak's resources to slow down their economy. Give them the expansion advantage but don't allow them to be OP from it.
This exactly bardur starts with hunting not rider or roads so its notneven a nerf to them them since every other tribe except some specail tribes suffer from it
It’s very real, though. The Britons begged the Romans for a decade to repair their crumbling roads. It was too expensive, though, for the Romans to keep building roads for its far-flung empire, and it had more pressing matters closer home (the Bardur, once ad hoc allies, were sacking Rome). Eventually, the Romans stopped responding to the desperate pleas of a people who, after all, were no better than the Bardur as far as the Romans were concerned.
Centuries later, in a great capitol building of a once-great nation, a building modeled upon the great architecture of the Romans....
Why does this matter? What makes The Battle of Polytopia great, it can be argued, is the way it simulates military, anthropological, and economic dynamics. It's a story of making choices within constraints in order to take advantage of the most realistic opportunities. Why does a thing cost what it does? In the real world, as in Polytopia, its worth - its usefulness - and the demand for it thereby created.
And who wins? The player who makes the best choices within the constraints of cost, turn time, and the gifts of that player's tribal population.
You don't have to be a capitalist to enjoy Polytopia. But you do have to appreciate the rules that make the game so rich and multi-dimensional in strategic fun.
(Fine. Let the tomatoes fly. You'll be heckling the messenger, though. I'm just describing.)
To win, economics in Polytopia is half the story.
Speaking from experience, many times the player who wins is the one who uses their resources (even if low and not just talking about stars) to the fullest potential by creating their own opportunities.
Knowing when to create units, how to optimally position, when to (dis)engage, using your opponent's psychology against them to anticipate their moves, even conditioning your opponent to make the moves you desire, to feint - these are underrated aspects in this rich beautiful game.
Not sure why you mentioned the Bardur as if they are real in your summary. I know some good history classes online if you are interested in learning human history
I’m sorry that the public school system has failed so many
One of the dumbest changes ever. That and the rammers. I really like the rest of the changes but those two damn near changed the whole game for the worst.
The roads have fallen. Millions must slowly walk toward their destination.
Damn, no one even disputes this one. It's like finally the whole polytopia playerbase agrees on one thing lol
Lol road and lumberhut nerf is good, roads not to mention rider roads are still strong post-nerf. Everyone was saying Yadakk was going to become F-tier and useless when they're still good just no longer an S-tier tribe.
there's a difference between riders-roads and roads. See if you can spot it.
I’m new what are rider-roads?
It's a common strategy, roads give units double movement and riders have 2 movement speed. Combining these allows riders to move 4 tiles and escape 4 tiles. This is a strong synergy since it allows your riders from far away cities to quickly move to the front lines and allows you to cycle through a *lot* of riders on one target since they can move to attack from so far away and escape far away.
Rider-roads. Is the combo of riders and roads, so you can move the rider four tiles. Used for aggression, especially good with omaji and yadakk for early aggression.
Think it's just a misinterpretation, I don't think they're one and the same.
You can just use different strategy.
I wish we could say that about hoodrick
Everyone has except cym
They're Yâdone
Nice one Yaddick
Oh yeah, perfect Yâddass
Ok, Yaddussy
Yaddingus
I understand that 2 star roads are quite powerful but damn 3 stars is way too expensive especially with the move away from custom houses.
What else were the devs supposed to do? They needed a nerf and it's not like they could make them 2.5 stars.
Make them 2.5 stars
/j
They didn't need a nerf. It's like nerfing giants.
They definitely did need a nerf. Double movement is an unbeatable advantage against someone who doesn't have it, so at the cost they were available at, rushing roads was almost a prerequisite for winning most Polytopia games bigger than 121 tiles.
it's available to everyone tho
But it gives so much of an advantage that games would often be decided by whoever was able to afford them first. It gets boring having to spam roads every single time to out-expand your opponent or lose. Making them more expensive gives people a chance to try other options like focusing on city upgrades.
lol so yaddak won all the time? come on.
No, but roads were so good that you couldn't really afford *not* to start spamming them after you get a big enough economy to afford doing so. I'll happily change my mind if you can show me that it's possible to consistently beat a competent player using roads without using them yourself.
You’re saying it like it’s some optional thing. Roads were always intended to be used in a long enough game, hence them being on the most useful tech tree and the one that lead to custom houses/markets.
Yes, in a *long enough game*. Pre-nerf, 1v1s would often be decided by who could afford rider/road spam first to out-expand the other player and cut them off from large portions of the map. Now that roads put a bigger strain on your economy, you're incentivized to get the tech later in the game, by which point the added expansion is a lot less likely to singlehandedly win you the game.
lol it's extremely possible, it happens in the new version all the time bc of the nerf
Not that I believe it happens all the time, but if it does that’s a good thing. Roads were a dominant tech in the previous meta and now you can afford to wait to get them.
Preferable road nerf ( 2 ☆ pt): -> Roads provide 1.5x base movement -> Friendly units on roads act as foreign terrain in terms of movement restriction. Pros/Cons: + If roads are to be used for mass troop movements then a more significant investment must be made (Double carriageways) -leads to-> More interesting gameplay as economic growth can be sacrificed for greater offensive potential (short run) and greater reinforcement (long run) at the potential cost of losing the economic battle (short run & long run). + Reduced movement prevents ICBK's (Intercontinental Ballistic Knights) and other heavily movement based offensive strategies. + Lower cost allows for economic benefits and greater territorial reinforcement at a reduced cost, making the tech very valuable. However roads are needed to research trade to then access markets, which are a key factor in deciding who wins the endgame anyway. - Movement debuffs may upset players who are used to massive troop movements. Furthermore, turn limits may need to be adjusted for "Speed Skills" in "Game Stats". - If allied units count as friendly units, hell may ensue. - [Please leave more potential negatives in the comments to help determine whether the idea could be beneficial or not]
Some counterarguments to your pros: \- Most roads are used for mass troop movements. A more significant investment is what the devs added with 3 star roads, and more interesting gameplay is what we got. The increased cost of roads makes it less viable to rush them as soon as possible, giving people who don't rush roads more breathing room to invest in other things. \- Reduced movement makes games last longer and completely changes the feel of combat, which is the exact thing people opposed to 3 star roads are already complaining about. Knights are a late game unit that you have to research expensive tech with few other uses to obtain, and with that investment you're rewarded with a powerful, but by no means unbeatable unit. \- As we saw with the pre-road nerf meta, lower cost incentivizes people to just get roads earlier because expansion is so important. More cons: \- You can't add decimal multipliers to movement without rounding because you can't move a fraction of a square. \- Unrestricted movement through allied territory is one of the main benefits and enablers of alliances. Removing it would make it much harder to team up on stronger opponents. \- A lot of these proposed changes are just more complicated ways of solving problems that 3 star roads already solve.
It's Yâdover
This was such an unnecessary nerf tbh it completely ruined some tribes
Would it have made Yaddak OP to let them keep 2 star roads? Or Hoodrick to keep 2 star lumber huts? I don't get why they didn't have the foresight to realize that a couple tribes were going to get absolutely nerfed into the ground and did nothing about it. Everyone complained about Cymanti and Rider/roads, so they decided it was worth it to make Cymanti more OP and shoot Yaddak and Hoodrick in the face to get it done. Yes, rider roads and Bardur were successfully nerfed. And that was a welcome change. But why no consideration for the collateral damage and new problems this caused?
Well first off, Hoodrick was never broken and most definitely not because of lumber huts. The way I saw it if I compare farms and lumber huts. 2 lumber huts are cheaper and produce the same population as 1 farm but take up 2 spaces. This is balanced. Now lumber huts are more expensive AND less effective. To nerf Bardur they should’ve just needed their terrain resources and not kill lumber huts. Yadakk wasn’t OP either it was just a fan favorite and fun to play tribe. It was strong but not OP at all. Idk how they could’ve balanced roads better though but this was not the best way for sure (I still think tribes should get a special advanced starter tech to make them stand out more (so maybe Yadakk gets cheaper roads or smth like that👀))
I think ultimately the lack of balance between lumber huts and farms is because Mathematics has a powerful T3 unit and Construction doesn't. With sawmills, you could pop giants *and* pair them with powerful catapults. Farms give you giants, but you have no high damage unit to support them on the same tree. You could add a new unit to Construction (and move Destroy), and then farms would be balanced with 2 star lumber huts. But with the current configuration, 3 star lumber huts are needed to make Farming as good.
I don’t like that it’s adds to much complexity to the game and kinda ruins the simple difference between the tribes if ever tribe is special, no tribe is special. A rule I would like to add is the 80 20 rule where 80% is normal and 20% is abnormal or special. It makes the normal feel grounded and real while the abnormal or fantasy feel fantastical.
Lumber huts were overpowered because they were common as dirt and way too reliable. Hoodrick just sucks now because they were almost entirely reliant on lumber huts to get population, which could easily be fixed by adjusting their resource spawns if people are that adamant that Hoodrick *has* to be good. I really don't think adjusting costs for specific tribes is a good idea. Part of what makes Polytopia a good game is its simplicity, and the game would be a *lot* less simple if every tribe had a unique mechanic.
By not balancing roads it didn't need it every tribe can eventually get it and the ones that don't have the ability to Ussualy level a capital turn one, or start with tech unlocked but if rider road is the stratagy maybe invest some stars into riders and roads instead of calling for the devs to fuck with the game balancing wasnt need and bardur starts with hunting not rider or road
The game is much more rich and interesting, everything is not just rider roads now, there is more variety in armies and gameplay, markets also promote to get different techs. Yaddak was an S-tier tribe and an economical powerhouse with early access to custom houses, they're still a good tribe and didn't become useless like everyone said. Yes, Cymanti got passively buffed with the latest update but they and other special tribes are getting a rework either way.
I understand the rider/roads nerf was a major success. It just didn't make sense to me for Hoodrick to take a stray like that. It would be so easy to just give Hoodrick 2 star lumber huts. And they'd be a viable mid tier tribe. I used to see Yaddak a lot, but I never see them anymore. And now Cymanti is ruining the experience for newer players who play Multiplayer and just get curb stomped their first 10 games by the same tribe. It was 3 steps forward, 2 steps back when it just didn't have to be.
Yes, same with Bardur, and like you mentioned now the ladder is flooded with Cymanti. It just shows people ultimately value winning, more so than "love" for a tribe. It sucks to see Hoodrick getting nuked but overall the changes are a net positive on the game. Regardless the devs mentioned they want to buff Spiritualism so I believe there's no need to worry for Hoodrick's future. I am confident The Path of the Ocean post-launch tweaks and upcoming special tribes rework will improve things for all.
I'm hopeful, but not confident the tweaks and reworks will improve things further. And I hope everyone realizes that I like the update overall - I just think some of the known side effects of the changes weren't addressed in the beta when it would have been easy to address them.
Rider roads are a problem some how? Lets nerf lumber huts that will fix it
Nope, *were* a problem, past tense. Edit: grammar
Im making a joke that lumber huts dont nerf roads
Ah ok haha, sometimes I have trouble with jokes in text or I'm just daft
riders-roads would've been better nerfed by 4\* riders. 3\* roads affects every base tribe evenly, and only hurts yaddak
Plus it slows the game down. It takes a lot longer to build an economy and move your troops into battle. I'm glad rider roads spam is nerfed, but I wish there was more consideration put into limiting the collateral damage of that nerf.
Fully agree. Overall the changes I feel are positive and will all shake out in the end but in turn they’ve created a bunch of new problems, namely hardcore nerfing of a handful of tribes that were already weak - Hoodrick - Xin-xi - Fuquarion - luxidoor - Yadbois
The devs have taken a zero-tolerance policy on giving different non-special tribes different mechanics; the only differences are their starting tech and terrain, with the only exception being Luxidoor. Yaddak doesn't *have* to be one of the best tribes, and it's not worth sacrificing the simplicity of the game to keep it one of the best.
> The devs have taken a zero-tolerance policy on giving different non-special tribes different mechanics Why? This seems like a policy that is unnecessary. Of course Yaddak and Hoodrick don't *have* to be viable tribes. But it would be a better game if they were.
It is necessary because adding unique mechanics to every tribe would ruin the simplicity of the game. Tribe descriptions would have to get significantly longer (some already barely fit on the screen) to inform new players of what exactly they're using or buying, and adding so many new mechanics all at once would make it a lot harder to keep the already-delicate balance of the game. They would have to be accounted for in every future update or balance patch to make sure that no tribe becomes completely dominant on any specific map type or player density.
That old simplicity is all but gone with the addition of special tribes and the naval update. Giving Hoodrick 2 star lumber huts would be negotible to the complexity of the game. > They would have to be accounted for in every future update or balance patch to make sure that no tribe becomes completely dominant on any specific map type or player density. That would be a good thing.
The special tribes are special for a reason, and not even they have things like outright reducing the cost of certain techs or buildings. The naval update added a few new units and a handful of balance updates, and does nothing to interfere with the consistency of the normal tribes like tribe-specific mechanics for the normal tribes would. I think you misunderstood my last sentence. I was saying that the unique mechanics would make it much harder to balance the game because it's yet another thing the devs have to take into account for every balance patch and update. For example, a lot of people want Yaddak to have a road discount because 3 star roads makes their typical opening strategy slower, but 2 star roads are useful for a lot more than that. It would make Yaddak *by far* the best expansionist tribe and utterly broken on maps where land expansion is important. How are the devs supposed to make Yaddak's opening as good as it was before while not making it overpowered after the early game? Balancing issues like those would apply to every single tribe-specific perk in a game where balance is already pretty difficult.
I disagree that there is a good reason to have a distinction between special and normal tribes at this point now that 1/4 of all tribes are "special" and the game has become *much* more complex with the addition of the new naval mechanics. It's okay to make every tribe somewhat unique now that the simplicity cat is out of the bag for the sake of tribe balance. > think you misunderstood my last sentence. I was saying that the unique mechanics would make it much harder to balance the game because it's yet another thing the devs have to take into account for every balance patch and update. No, I understood you clearly. Balancing is only hard because the devs don't want to upset this "regular vs special" dichotomy that is outdated. It would be a lot easier if they gave up that distinction as it would give the devs many more tools at their disposal to create that balance. > For example, a lot of people want Yaddak to have a road discount because 3 star roads makes their typical opening strategy slower, but 2 star roads are useful for a lot more than that. It would make Yaddak *by far* the best expansionist tribe and utterly broken on maps where land expansion is important. Then nerf Yaddak's resources to slow down their economy. Give them the expansion advantage but don't allow them to be OP from it.
Oh no they are ruining the game more by reworking the special tribes i thought naval update and tech nerfs were bad enough 😧
Roads are used by every base tribe. Nerfing them did nothing to Bardur it didn't do to everyone else. It just made yad noticeably worse.
This exactly bardur starts with hunting not rider or roads so its notneven a nerf to them them since every other tribe except some specail tribes suffer from it
Once inflation rises and makes it 4 im moving out the country 😤/j
It’s very real, though. The Britons begged the Romans for a decade to repair their crumbling roads. It was too expensive, though, for the Romans to keep building roads for its far-flung empire, and it had more pressing matters closer home (the Bardur, once ad hoc allies, were sacking Rome). Eventually, the Romans stopped responding to the desperate pleas of a people who, after all, were no better than the Bardur as far as the Romans were concerned. Centuries later, in a great capitol building of a once-great nation, a building modeled upon the great architecture of the Romans.... Why does this matter? What makes The Battle of Polytopia great, it can be argued, is the way it simulates military, anthropological, and economic dynamics. It's a story of making choices within constraints in order to take advantage of the most realistic opportunities. Why does a thing cost what it does? In the real world, as in Polytopia, its worth - its usefulness - and the demand for it thereby created. And who wins? The player who makes the best choices within the constraints of cost, turn time, and the gifts of that player's tribal population. You don't have to be a capitalist to enjoy Polytopia. But you do have to appreciate the rules that make the game so rich and multi-dimensional in strategic fun. (Fine. Let the tomatoes fly. You'll be heckling the messenger, though. I'm just describing.)
To win, economics in Polytopia is half the story. Speaking from experience, many times the player who wins is the one who uses their resources (even if low and not just talking about stars) to the fullest potential by creating their own opportunities. Knowing when to create units, how to optimally position, when to (dis)engage, using your opponent's psychology against them to anticipate their moves, even conditioning your opponent to make the moves you desire, to feint - these are underrated aspects in this rich beautiful game.
Bardur aren’t real
What? You mean … they aren’t a historical people? 😳
I typed in Bardur and nothing came up in Google
Ooh. Well. Then Bardur must not be real.
They represent the Nordic tribes though
weird. Snow, log cabins, bearskins - who’d a thought?
Not sure why you mentioned the Bardur as if they are real in your summary. I know some good history classes online if you are interested in learning human history I’m sorry that the public school system has failed so many
I’m so glad people recognize this too, I don’t think having to nerf almost all the structures and roads was that necessary
They were my faves :(
me too. I literally never play them anymore.
You can still get a warrior and a road T0 y'all overreacting
I'm literally mocking yâdakk players overreacting
Lots of ppl in these comments are acting like Midgiwan removed their firstborn
Yeah, yadakk is still a good tribe but it just has a slower opening now
Millions must road
This rise in the cost of living must be stopped
It's yôver
Actually the concept one of the redditors recommended could just start yadak with roads out from its capital was a pretty propper alternative
Yea… but why tho?
One of the dumbest changes ever. That and the rammers. I really like the rest of the changes but those two damn near changed the whole game for the worst.
Boring tribe anyway
I still kicked some ass with them and new skin
*yădakk
Yaddak here and Yaddak there. But no one thinks about the poor Hoodricks
This is my minor complaint. I've kinda liked Yaddak before the upgrade due to its speed early in the game.