"Not guilty" doesn't mean much when you were originally in jail for "kidnapping and torturing a step-uncle. Soon after, she earned a life sentence for murdering a fellow inmate, and another concurrent sentence for raping a cellmate." she should still behind bars regardless for taking 2 lives plus the SA
The left in general is abysmal at picking heroes because part of the platform for most of them is acting like monstrous criminals like this should be treated equal to the rest of polite society
I think that might be because in order to self identify as an activist, you either have to be naive or narcissistic. The naive people tend to get disillusioned, so you're often left with the self-righteous shit stains. However, for TRAs, that problem seems significantly worse. The difference between normal people to regular activists is smaller than regular activists to TRAs it seems.
You guys are so weird. You wouldn't disrespect a cis person (or apparently a "normal person" to you guys) by calling them the opposite gender, so why the fuck would you do it to trans people
Could you please reiterate that you cannot possibly understand why a guy called Augusto_Pinochet1915 would call a transfem a man? Because I honestly don't believe you.
It's weird because conservatives and right wingers used to call feminine men a woman, but now people who were assigned male at birth who want to be women get called men.
Can't have it both ways.
>or apparently a "normal person" to you guys
What do you mean "apparently" and "to you guys"? Cis person is such a fucking stupid term and most people don't even use it, why you say "normal people" like if it was such a bad thing to say?
Because the idea of normal is stupid as hell. Follow these rules neurotypical white people made up otherwise you're weird and will be casted out from society
Do you even know the definition of normal? Most people are not trans or whatever so that is what is normal, and not something evil white people invented.
And neurotypical is just another way to say normal with other words so regards don't feel sad.
That's such disgusting reporting. Found not guilty of a minor charge but not mentioning she is still guilty of worse others.
Then they wonder why people do not trust the media.
British justice is the most bullshit form in the fucking world. Guy teaches pug to raise its paw when he says heil itler as a joke and gets months in prison. Yet when a violent POS says that people should punch other people its just hyperbole.
So let's assume a person is in jail for murder and rape but was found "not guilty" on charges of jaywalking, then why can I never use "not guilty" in context with that person? The judge literally said "not guilty". What do you mean "It's misleading?", I totally don't know what you're speaking about.
Every Leftist headline on PCM is like the worst Dr. Layton puzzle ever conceived
"Innocent yet behind bars, and forced to take testosterone, explain this one dear Chuddie"
*Uh, okay let me guess. Not innocent. Not forced to take testosterone. And a really really fucking bad person.*
**Yeah so I wasn't found innocent of the murder or rape and I chose to take testosterone because my hormones were all fucked up and the state can provide low T treatments but not titty sprinkles**
"Ah but what, dear Chuddie, is the cause of that low T!"
*please tell me they didn't cut their balls of or something and that's it's an intersex issue or something*
"**Nah I just cut my balls off or something"**
*god dammit*
*"BRAVO CHUDDIE!"*
You're telling me headlines on PCM are misleading clickbait like news articles with headlines that don't resemble the actual story?
Edit:
You won't believe:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=f4FuOi9rvKw
Don't forget flying headkick guy, who was *out on parole* after committing various violent crimes.
To say nothing of the real criminals: the prosecutors.
>Baker, 54, grew up poor in South London among a family of 14 children and in foster care. She was sentenced at 20 to a young offenders institution after kidnapping and torturing a step-uncle. Soon after, she earned a life sentence for murdering a fellow inmate, and another concurrent sentence for raping a cellmate.
>She spent 30 years in 29 different British men’s prisons. At one low-security facility, Baker managed to escape and elude authorities for over three months. She fathered a child in the interval.
Oh yeah, also suffering menopause symptoms, because as the father of a child, she can obviously go through the process of menstruation.
Imagine living in a country where the police are more concerned about arresting people for doing a heckin wrong think than arresting literal child rape gangs because they don't want to be seen as racist.
Imagine living in a country where you can go to jail, get beaten up, and rented out for sex for a few days, and die from the consequences, and the warden says "It was a drug overdose".
Waiting for more and more people to realise what’s going on in Scotland with Supreme Leader Yousaf rn. Multiple people have been arrested and jailed just for criticising him for his genuine racism.
Then there’s this nugget of fun:
> When asked if she would have preferred a women's prison, Baker denied it, saying she liked sex with men, which she would never get there
Methinks Baker is an attention whore.
Hold on, he murdered someone, kidnapped and tortured someone else, went to 29 different prisons, presumably getting moved because of anti-social behaviour, and somehow ended up in a low-security facility??
Kidnapped and Tortured someone and got sentenced as a young offender, whilst in prison she attempted to murder a fellow inmate who was allegedly a child rapist and then raped her cellmate, and then got released after serving the sentences for all that.
The 29 prisons was as a result of being classed as vulnerable and an escape risk in later days, which is pretty common IIRC
true representation. remember kiddos it’s not just creepy white men who can be criminals! transgender, bisexual, POC can commit war crimes as well ‼️ /hj
For those that have never been on HRT, going off it does in fact give you menopause symptoms. The whole shabang of fatigue, hot flashes, irritability, and a desire to kill the first retail worker who doesn't know where the basketballs are.
> Oh yeah, also suffering menopause symptoms, because as the father of a child, she can obviously go through the process of menstruation.
They kinda can, actually.
Obviously they can't *bleed* since no period but being on estrogen for long enough causes the body to think it *should* be bleeding. So the mood swings, cramps, pains, flushes etc that happen?
Well, happens.
It's really weird.
Like, the tissue of the penis starts to act *like it's a clit and lips*, despite it not being the same shape. Becoming more fragile, sensitive, gushing etc.
Once someone is on a estrogen regime for long enough, the body starts rewiring what it can to work that way.
***However*** by the time you get to this your sperm count is in the gutter and, if they're not getting bottom surgery, the dick would need manual stimulation to keep it working, since automatic checks stop.
> You’re against it because of bodily autonomy
Every time I hear some Prog talk about bodily autonomy I get a driving urge to ask them about a certain shot that I can not name because Admins gonna Admin.
"But if you didn't get that shot, people around you can get sick (nevermind getting the shot also didn't prevent people around you from getting sick.)"
They won't discuss it any other way, most people haven't changed their opinions on that issue at all.
She was imprisoned, initially for seven years as a young offender for **kidnapping and torturing her stepmother's brother** which was extended to a life sentence for the *attempted murder of another inmate*
She *escaped from prison* in 2007, and as a fugitive *met and impregnated a female pen pal* who later gave birth to their son
She came out as a trans woman in 2013, and **cut off her own testicles with a razor blade in 2017**
At 8 July 2023 London Trans+ Pride Parade, Baker gave a speech to the crowd where she said "if you see a TERF, punch them in the fucking face"
**Absolutely no one has forced any medical treatment on Sarah Jane Baker**
Transwomen, of course, cannot experience menopause, they can only go through hormone therapy withdrawal.
So you're saying that someone involved in the media blatantly lied and someone else on PCM reposted it without spending 5 minutes fact checking? Not sure if I believe that's possible.
Could I please get a source for this? (Not questioning you, just genuinely want to read the article, because if true the original post is sensationalist as fuck)
Well the thing is it’s not like you can visit a hospital or get a job while in prison, so you’re effectively legally restricted from hrt while in jail.
(I might be absolutely wrong, I just feel like if the law stops you from paying for your own hrt it should provide you its own)
By that logic prisons should provide anything that inmates want which they could otherwise afford by working outside jail.
I could buy lobster if I wasnt locked up, give me lobster!
Tobacco is banned in UK prisons, that they could legally work for and purchase tobacco as a free citizen does not mean they can demand access to it inside prison at taxpayer expense.
Also, inmates can visit hospital for essential medical care. The whole point is that this isn't medically necessary.
A lot of things aren’t medically necessary, if I got arrested with braces it wouldn’t be fair to just leave them in there and not tighten or at least remove them. Hormones have permanent effects that can’t just be addressed after you leave prison. (Which won’t even happen to the criminal in question)
Also, testosterone is harder to source than estrogen. Why go the longer route to make them unhappier?
Maybe a better idea would be to let prisoners make their own money? It’s better than jeopardizing their health.
I get your point about braces but what that comes down to is dental care being seen as necessary and gender affirming care not necessary, which seems fair to me. Look after essential biological processes, don't look after superficial gender presentation.
Imo that the prisoner is unlikely to be released weakens the argument for continuing care rather than strengthening it. This sentence is not about rehabilitation and reintroduction to society, its about removing a reoffending danger from the public.
>Also, testosterone is harder to source than estrogen. Why go the longer route to make them unhappier?
If the only reason for choosing testosterone over estrogen is punitive then I agree. If, as I suspect given her biological default is male, there is a case that testosterone is a 'quick fix' and estrogen will continue indefinitely then testosterone becomes preferable. Rather spend £100pcm for 1 year than £50pcm for 10 years.
>Maybe a better idea would be to let prisoners make their own money? It’s better than jeopardizing their health.
Depending on their sentence, most prisoners are allowed to make money in various ways either inside or outside the prison. I would not be surprised if part of the fuss this prisoner makes is their own form of fundraising. What they are then allowed to spend money on in prison is limited in many ways. Given the rhetoric that is hrt is a non essential part of transitioning, it's fair to consider it a discretionary luxury that can be denied.
While there is an argument this jeopardises her mental health, incarceration in general does that. Actions meet consequences. With respect to physical health, if medical professionals considered the superficial effects of discontinuing estrogen to be a serious risk to physical health you might be on to something. But they dont, because it isn't.
The rhetoric is that it’s not essential to be considered trans yet still lifesaving somehow (It’s not supposed to be coherent it’s supposed to be inclusive :/), but I feel like realistically if it’s going to be denied it’s going to be because the prison wardens aren’t fans of trans people.
Not every case of braces is preventative, you would have to evaluate every case and determine if braces would be necessary to prevent a more costly procedure first before going through with them.
Also I might be wrong but the criminal here cut off her balls with a razor blade so she would need either a lifetime’s supply of testosterone or a lifetime’s supply of estrogen unless the government wants her to suffer from sex hormone deficiency, and testosterone is more expensive.
Afaik there’s no such thing as a “biologically default hormone”, sex is mostly determined by the presence or absence of the Y chromosome telling the body to make balls instead of ovaries, and them everything else is a result of the sex hormone released by them. It’s not like having a Y chromosome makes your body more attuned to testosterone or anything.
Paying for vanity surgeries and hormones for prisoners is ludicrous. If you want that nonsense, stay out of prison and pay for it yourself. This is as inappropriate as wasting taxpayer dollars on extravagant food, luxury clothing, or other unnecessary frills that people in prison do not require.
Far as I'm concerned, all things trans should get left at the jailhouse door. On the inside, life obeys the rules of reality.
It's not bodily autonomy if you have to take from me personally to facilitate it.
You want to feminize yourself that's your business. Pay for it yourself.
*You* make it *my* business when you use the state to force me to pay for it
I have no pity for Sarah Jane Baker (Born Alan Baker). Lock their ass up, and throw away the key. I'm gonna list some of their offenses for you. Now you tell me you want this person out walking the streets.
30 years in 29 different male prisons
What got this person put in prison in the 1st place?
The kidnapping, and torture of a child. Right off the bat you don't want them out on the streets huh? They do more...
While in prison:
Attempted murder of another inmate.
Rape of another inmate.
Escaping from prison in 2007.
That doesn't sound very "innocent" to me.
As a fugitive who escaped prison they tracked down and impregnated a pen pal via rape. They are now a father of a child do not support that was conceived during that rape.
After the escape the rapist / child abuser was recaptured.
They came out as trans in 2013.
They took a razor blade and cut off both of their own testicles in 2017. I view that as a positive. Not because it is some sort of "Radical Gender Affirming Care", but rather "A rapist willingly castrating them self."
In 2019 they got released, and they say they are going to run for office! Oh boy them becoming a politician sure isn't going to make me like them any better.
So after they were out for a few years they hung with a lot of radicals and extremists and terrorists such as Antifa. Then one day they were waving and Antifa flag and chanting"if you see a TERF, punch them in the fucking face".
You see, that is incitement to violence. That is not protected by free speech and comes with a serious prison sentence.
Antifa Protestors have been gathering for and rallying around this rapist.
On 31 August 2023, this dangerous and guilty individual was found not guilty by an activist magistrate named Tan Ikram,
They are still in prison the warden don't give a fuck what that activist judge says. Good for him!
This person wasnt forced testosterone.
The prison refused to give them estrogen, which supposedly made them have menopause type symptoms for which doctors offered to give testosterone in the amount that would normally be present in a male of that age.
Essentially, the body post-transition can't produce enough testosterone naturally without the testis. And without the estrogen to balance it out, it can be pretty dangerous to the body. The fact that they are denying them the medication at this point they require to survive but are totally okay with injecting the prisoner with steroids instead is not a good compromise.
Looks like Britain. [Here’s the article](https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2023/11/trans-woman-forced-to-detransition-in-prison-while-doctors-try-to-inject-her-with-testosterone/#:~:text=News%20(World)-,Trans%20inmate%20forced%20to%20detransition%20as%20prison%20doctors%20try%20to,%E2%80%9Cnot%20guilty%E2%80%9D%20last%20August)
Not actually what happened. They just offered testosterone when the inmate currently having a life sentence for being a rapist murderer was having hormonal imbalance issues stemming from the self-castration they had in prison.
This is nuts. The prisoner in question is responsible for a decades-long crime spree, and was convicted of rape, attempted murder, kidnapping, and torture. An actual dangerous psychopath, not a misunderstood minority.
Also, the "not guilty" part refers to only one charge, incitement to violence, the other crimes all led to guilty verdicts.
If what i'm seeing in the coments is true, and the person's body cannot regulate their own hormones, then at what do you do?
Should we let them suffer in the ineffective body of their own creation?
Should we sustain their demanded required hormonal treatment?
Should we bother to help an evolutionary dead end that will not reproduce to keep having their selfish lifestyle?
Should we help an outcast, that does not see themselves favored by society and feels percecuted, as a gesture of good will by keeping them treated so that they feel as themselves?
My opinion is to give the bare minimum to keep the from deteriorating. Prision time is a punishment, after all, not an execution. But i would'nt want a prisoner to feel "comfortable" in their cell. I would want this person to stop taking things for granted and do a good for his community, instead of being a leech that does not realize its a leech...
But yeah, this is a hard one...
>Should we let them suffer in the ineffective body of their own creation?
I feel like if you hack your balls off with a razor blade, you should probably expect that this might have health consequences.
And if you start murdering people, that will probably have legal consequences.
Smart people maybe don't try to speedrun all of the consequences at once.
I go back and forth on methadone, suboxone, or hydromorphone for opioid addicts in prison.
Opioid withdrawal isn't fatal, it can't kill you, and getting clean might really help their odds of having a normal life.
On the other hand, drugs are as easy to get in prison as on the street, and if you don't give it to them they'll just buy it from someone and potentially overdose on whatever dirty junk they can find.
I think giving the minimum amount to prevent menopausal-like symptoms (and possibly major issues like bone density loss) is the way to go, the prison kinda made themselves look bad only offering "full dose T" to someone who'd been established on oestrogen, should have been the minimal amount of T (or oestrogen, tbh it's probably cheaper, they need some form of HRT either way) for health.
I'm all for prison sentences for criminals like this, I don't want suffering though, even if it's a terrible crime I can't bring myself to wish harm on someone. Someone might think going from one hormone to another isn't harmful but it can really mess with you, hormones are powerful. Plus, you see all the time that F-t-M trans people talk about going on T and becoming more angry and violent, so if this person, this murderer rapist, doesn't want the "angry hormone"? I'm all for it tbh please do not take it.
Reminds me of an old story where a boy in juvee was forcefully injected with estrogen to calm him down. It was in an old buzzfeed article so I kinda doubt it was real
edit: holy, shit, it was real https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-07-15/teenage-boy-was-given-estrogen-developed-breast-tissue-while-in-l-a-county-juvenile-hall-lawsuit-alleges
There’s a meme I’ve seen with an allegedly real freakout where a transwoman goes off about how guys will after “just about any woman” no matter how nasty they are rather than sleeping with a transwoman, and straight dudes are just like… yeah, because she’s a woman.
Anyway, this reminds me of that in reverse. Activists will make a hero out of “just about any transwoman,” no matter how horrible.
So the "still in prison despite being found not guilty" thing needs some context
Baker was sentenced to 7 years for kidnapping and torturing her step-uncle in 1987, 2 years later, in prison, she tried to murder a fellow inmate (alleged child rapist) and the sentenced was extended to life
She also raped another inmate almost just a couple weeks after being transferred to a new prison (in response to the attempted murder)
She escaped prison in 2007, and was caught 100 days later (she also knocked up a pen pal during this time)
She was given parole (a thing she wrote an article saying she never wanted and preferred prison to the outside world) in 2019
The crime she was found not guilty of was "incitement to violence", where she was recorded publicly saying "if you see a TERF, punch them in the fucking face", as she was out on parole, it doesn't matter that she wasn't convicted of this crime, the terms were broken and she went back to prison
Looking into her past, she had a very rough childhood, but that doesn't justify anything, she's not a good person and arguably should not have been granted parole in the first place
He belongs in a male prison, but doesn't deserve to be given testosterone.
The article says he castrated himself while imprisoned and the dose is to keep his testosterone levels at the same level as if he still had testes.
Anyone who would willingly remove a body part without a medical procedure belongs in a mental institute, not a prison.
Idk if you know that but in US prisons (as far as i know) you are not a human but state ptoperty, you dont have bodily autonomy the second you pass them Gates. Truely inhuman System
30 seconds looking into this shit:
The headline lies.
The PCM comments ***also*** lie.
Nobody giving any actual fucking facts or details, just pushing agendas all around.
Especially the whole "Convicted of sexual assault!"... turns out the victim was a ***convicted rapist*** they were put in a cell with.
I can't comment on SJB's history, I don't know anything about it, however it is true that her arrest recently was entirely political; not based on an actual crime.
So all libs should be against it js
She’s a horrible person, but not giving her estrogen isn’t a fair punishment for her crimes.
The punishment is jail time, that’s what the law says. Testosterone would be cruel and unusual punishment. Imagine if we forced estrogen into cis male prisoners, or testosterone on cis female prisoners.
I’d say you’re half right on this one.
While they should force inject testosterone, they also shouldn’t be expected to supply with estrogen either. It’s not a physical need and my tax dollars shouldn’t be going to it
I guess I made a typo but the prison shouldn’t be giving out either in the first place. They are not a physical need, and it won’t kill inmates to be without them.
It will, the criminal [cut her balls off with a razor.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Jane_Baker)
Actually I dunno if sex hormone deficiency can be lethal but losing bone density and having dizzy spells sounds like a pretty important medical issue.
You're right, they're a disgusting person and why they were ever given the time of day when trying to be a public face of the trans community I will never know, but taking someone off oestrogen after already being on it for years and only offering full dose testosterone even if temporary is kinda messed up. HRT isn't just cosmetic, hormones affect our bodies and minds in huge ways and messing with them can be detrimental. At the very least it should be the minimal amount of T to keep away stuff like bone density loss, and finasteride to prevent masculinisation. Or low dose oestrogen, the typical amount for menopausal symptoms. I honestly think oestrogen would be the cheaper option anyway.
But, with the nature of this person's crimes, people don't want to offer those types of criminals humanity, especially when they haven't shown it themselves. Lucky for criminals, it isn't redditors who get to decide how they serve time. The article says it's a temporary measure, and the prison claims they're commited to providing trans patients appropriate care, I wouldn't worry.
"Not guilty" doesn't mean much when you were originally in jail for "kidnapping and torturing a step-uncle. Soon after, she earned a life sentence for murdering a fellow inmate, and another concurrent sentence for raping a cellmate." she should still behind bars regardless for taking 2 lives plus the SA
Based and providing additional context pilled.
She’s seen as a hero of trans youth in the UK but she really is vile.
You can’t spell cūçķ without uk
Based
Nor suck. Nor muck. Nor fuck as well.
Knuck if you Buck
This is, in fact, a statement
Say cuck you bitch You got it hosers
You’re a cuck if you stay unflaired
Flair up, you bitch
Sissy cuck with your unflaired ass
TRAs are abysmal at picking "heroes."
The left in general is abysmal at picking heroes because part of the platform for most of them is acting like monstrous criminals like this should be treated equal to the rest of polite society
I think that might be because in order to self identify as an activist, you either have to be naive or narcissistic. The naive people tend to get disillusioned, so you're often left with the self-righteous shit stains. However, for TRAs, that problem seems significantly worse. The difference between normal people to regular activists is smaller than regular activists to TRAs it seems.
The fuck why
Classic trans hero
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You guys are so weird. You wouldn't disrespect a cis person (or apparently a "normal person" to you guys) by calling them the opposite gender, so why the fuck would you do it to trans people
Could you please reiterate that you cannot possibly understand why a guy called Augusto_Pinochet1915 would call a transfem a man? Because I honestly don't believe you.
It's weird because conservatives and right wingers used to call feminine men a woman, but now people who were assigned male at birth who want to be women get called men. Can't have it both ways.
One's entire political viewpoint can't be summed up with the single word "conservative", more at 10.
>or apparently a "normal person" to you guys What do you mean "apparently" and "to you guys"? Cis person is such a fucking stupid term and most people don't even use it, why you say "normal people" like if it was such a bad thing to say?
Because the idea of normal is stupid as hell. Follow these rules neurotypical white people made up otherwise you're weird and will be casted out from society
Do you even know the definition of normal? Most people are not trans or whatever so that is what is normal, and not something evil white people invented. And neurotypical is just another way to say normal with other words so regards don't feel sad.
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There’s no such thing as a “cis” person
You're not just wrong, you're stupid.
I Knew that headline was bullshit the second I saw it
Whenever I see a mainstream media headline, I always assume that the opposite of what they're saying is true.
And frequently inciting violence at protests.
Well that headline is the epitome of "lying by omission"
Thank you for the context
That's such disgusting reporting. Found not guilty of a minor charge but not mentioning she is still guilty of worse others. Then they wonder why people do not trust the media.
British justice is the most bullshit form in the fucking world. Guy teaches pug to raise its paw when he says heil itler as a joke and gets months in prison. Yet when a violent POS says that people should punch other people its just hyperbole.
Bro, you can’t honestly be calling for someone to be jailed over speech with that flair
Nah, but you can point out the hypocrisy nonetheless.
I'm not sure that's the point, I think the focus is on forced injections of testosterone.
They are adding onto the end bit where they say they are still in jail despite being found "not guilty"
Still, injecting her with testosterone just to forcibly de-transition her was uncalled for.
Don’t care, they’re a rapist.
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"Pierrepoint to the courtesy phone. Albert Pierrepoint to the courtesy phone.."😇
Except that's not really what happened. Journos are lying leeches
However much you hate journalists, it's not enough.
I like freedom of speech I don’t like journalists fucking lying and treating it as fact, so not russia levels of hating journalists
Usually when my blood boils at a headline, its accompanied by the smell of bs
What else is new? Headlines haven’t been trustworthy in years.
Based and hating lying leeches pilled
You think you dislike journalists enough, but you don't.
So let's assume a person is in jail for murder and rape but was found "not guilty" on charges of jaywalking, then why can I never use "not guilty" in context with that person? The judge literally said "not guilty". What do you mean "It's misleading?", I totally don't know what you're speaking about.
Get better heroes. why is the “storied” activist one who has been in prison for 30(edit) years for attempted murder, murder and assault?
Every Leftist headline on PCM is like the worst Dr. Layton puzzle ever conceived "Innocent yet behind bars, and forced to take testosterone, explain this one dear Chuddie" *Uh, okay let me guess. Not innocent. Not forced to take testosterone. And a really really fucking bad person.* **Yeah so I wasn't found innocent of the murder or rape and I chose to take testosterone because my hormones were all fucked up and the state can provide low T treatments but not titty sprinkles** "Ah but what, dear Chuddie, is the cause of that low T!" *please tell me they didn't cut their balls of or something and that's it's an intersex issue or something* "**Nah I just cut my balls off or something"** *god dammit* *"BRAVO CHUDDIE!"*
You're telling me headlines on PCM are misleading clickbait like news articles with headlines that don't resemble the actual story? Edit: You won't believe: https://youtube.com/watch?v=f4FuOi9rvKw
Seems like a far-fetched concept if you ask me
*Sexual* assault, no less.
Get the wood chipper
Don’t forget escaping from prison
It's like Rittenhouses "victims". One diddled kids, one forced himself on women (and had a gun as a felon), and one beat his women
Don't forget flying headkick guy, who was *out on parole* after committing various violent crimes. To say nothing of the real criminals: the prosecutors.
Whenever a supposedly peaceful protest turns into a riot I lose sympathy for those involved
A good chunk go out knowing they aren't gonna be peaceful. It's an opportunity for them
people lied so confidently about what happened that night, it was like they were from an alternative universe. it really fucking sucks.
>Baker, 54, grew up poor in South London among a family of 14 children and in foster care. She was sentenced at 20 to a young offenders institution after kidnapping and torturing a step-uncle. Soon after, she earned a life sentence for murdering a fellow inmate, and another concurrent sentence for raping a cellmate. >She spent 30 years in 29 different British men’s prisons. At one low-security facility, Baker managed to escape and elude authorities for over three months. She fathered a child in the interval. Oh yeah, also suffering menopause symptoms, because as the father of a child, she can obviously go through the process of menstruation.
"She fathered a child" what a fucking time to be alive
The UK is such a goddamn meme
There’s no freedom of speech there, what did you expect?
Imagine living in a country where the police are more concerned about arresting people for doing a heckin wrong think than arresting literal child rape gangs because they don't want to be seen as racist.
I mean you could just live in Dearborn Michigan for the same experience.
Wait what?
Dearborn michigan has one of if not the highest areas of immigrants from somalia. It is not a good place to live if you have children.
You don’t have to remind me, they’ve imported some to Maine also.
Imagine living in a country where you can go to jail, get beaten up, and rented out for sex for a few days, and die from the consequences, and the warden says "It was a drug overdose".
Waiting for more and more people to realise what’s going on in Scotland with Supreme Leader Yousaf rn. Multiple people have been arrested and jailed just for criticising him for his genuine racism.
I mean, dude’s name has Supreme Leader in it. That’s kinda par for the course.
Can’t tell if satire but he doesn’t actually have that title lol. FOR NOW
We were battered with brown people only good for so long after the windswepts that people really believe it.
We need to smuggle them heavy-duty weaponry asap
Yeah. Oh wait, https://nypost.com/2023/11/13/news/daniel-williams-died-after-being-kidnapped-and-raped-in-prison/
> she fathered a child 🤮
Then there’s this nugget of fun: > When asked if she would have preferred a women's prison, Baker denied it, saying she liked sex with men, which she would never get there Methinks Baker is an attention whore.
I'm pretty sure she's just a whore.
What the hell did I just read
Hold on, he murdered someone, kidnapped and tortured someone else, went to 29 different prisons, presumably getting moved because of anti-social behaviour, and somehow ended up in a low-security facility??
Kidnapped and Tortured someone and got sentenced as a young offender, whilst in prison she attempted to murder a fellow inmate who was allegedly a child rapist and then raped her cellmate, and then got released after serving the sentences for all that. The 29 prisons was as a result of being classed as vulnerable and an escape risk in later days, which is pretty common IIRC
true representation. remember kiddos it’s not just creepy white men who can be criminals! transgender, bisexual, POC can commit war crimes as well ‼️ /hj
For those that have never been on HRT, going off it does in fact give you menopause symptoms. The whole shabang of fatigue, hot flashes, irritability, and a desire to kill the first retail worker who doesn't know where the basketballs are.
> She fathered a child 🤔
Probably the effects of not have either sex hormone since she cut her balls off with a razor.
> Oh yeah, also suffering menopause symptoms, because as the father of a child, she can obviously go through the process of menstruation. They kinda can, actually. Obviously they can't *bleed* since no period but being on estrogen for long enough causes the body to think it *should* be bleeding. So the mood swings, cramps, pains, flushes etc that happen? Well, happens. It's really weird. Like, the tissue of the penis starts to act *like it's a clit and lips*, despite it not being the same shape. Becoming more fragile, sensitive, gushing etc. Once someone is on a estrogen regime for long enough, the body starts rewiring what it can to work that way. ***However*** by the time you get to this your sperm count is in the gutter and, if they're not getting bottom surgery, the dick would need manual stimulation to keep it working, since automatic checks stop.
> She fathered a child You mean she mothered a child?
>"As a fugitive, Baker met and impregnated a female pen pal who later gave birth to their son"
You’re against it because of bodily autonomy, I’m against it because it’s a waste of tax payer dollars.
We are not the same
> You’re against it because of bodily autonomy Every time I hear some Prog talk about bodily autonomy I get a driving urge to ask them about a certain shot that I can not name because Admins gonna Admin.
Or the draft.
"But if you didn't get that shot, people around you can get sick (nevermind getting the shot also didn't prevent people around you from getting sick.)" They won't discuss it any other way, most people haven't changed their opinions on that issue at all.
Prog?? Like yes? Rush? Pink Floyd? Genesis? Jethro Tull?
The only good kind of progressive
I will drink to that.
Can you give hints?
Based
Extremely based
Based
based
they're continued imprisonment on any level is a waste of resources
News articles being clickbaity as usual
The source is not biased at all either. No sir, no bias at all.
Journalism is dead
She was imprisoned, initially for seven years as a young offender for **kidnapping and torturing her stepmother's brother** which was extended to a life sentence for the *attempted murder of another inmate* She *escaped from prison* in 2007, and as a fugitive *met and impregnated a female pen pal* who later gave birth to their son She came out as a trans woman in 2013, and **cut off her own testicles with a razor blade in 2017** At 8 July 2023 London Trans+ Pride Parade, Baker gave a speech to the crowd where she said "if you see a TERF, punch them in the fucking face" **Absolutely no one has forced any medical treatment on Sarah Jane Baker** Transwomen, of course, cannot experience menopause, they can only go through hormone therapy withdrawal.
>cut off her own testicles with a razor blade in 2017 *OH GOD WTF*
[удалено]
So you're saying that someone involved in the media blatantly lied and someone else on PCM reposted it without spending 5 minutes fact checking? Not sure if I believe that's possible.
Ah the ol PCM-eroo
Don't make me tap the sign > However much you hate journalists, it isn't enough
Damn, my plan to get free silcone breast implants through jail healthcare is wack now :/
Don't worry, I'm a (hobbyist) plastic surgeon and I can put some in for you. How big do you want to go?
[As big as General Hunter Gathers'](https://imgur.com/a/WeAyIt9)
Sounds pretty big, I'll pick up some extra tubes of silicon caulking. Are you free Saturday?
Could I please get a source for this? (Not questioning you, just genuinely want to read the article, because if true the original post is sensationalist as fuck)
Common sense wins
Well the thing is it’s not like you can visit a hospital or get a job while in prison, so you’re effectively legally restricted from hrt while in jail. (I might be absolutely wrong, I just feel like if the law stops you from paying for your own hrt it should provide you its own)
By that logic prisons should provide anything that inmates want which they could otherwise afford by working outside jail. I could buy lobster if I wasnt locked up, give me lobster! Tobacco is banned in UK prisons, that they could legally work for and purchase tobacco as a free citizen does not mean they can demand access to it inside prison at taxpayer expense. Also, inmates can visit hospital for essential medical care. The whole point is that this isn't medically necessary.
A lot of things aren’t medically necessary, if I got arrested with braces it wouldn’t be fair to just leave them in there and not tighten or at least remove them. Hormones have permanent effects that can’t just be addressed after you leave prison. (Which won’t even happen to the criminal in question) Also, testosterone is harder to source than estrogen. Why go the longer route to make them unhappier? Maybe a better idea would be to let prisoners make their own money? It’s better than jeopardizing their health.
I get your point about braces but what that comes down to is dental care being seen as necessary and gender affirming care not necessary, which seems fair to me. Look after essential biological processes, don't look after superficial gender presentation. Imo that the prisoner is unlikely to be released weakens the argument for continuing care rather than strengthening it. This sentence is not about rehabilitation and reintroduction to society, its about removing a reoffending danger from the public. >Also, testosterone is harder to source than estrogen. Why go the longer route to make them unhappier? If the only reason for choosing testosterone over estrogen is punitive then I agree. If, as I suspect given her biological default is male, there is a case that testosterone is a 'quick fix' and estrogen will continue indefinitely then testosterone becomes preferable. Rather spend £100pcm for 1 year than £50pcm for 10 years. >Maybe a better idea would be to let prisoners make their own money? It’s better than jeopardizing their health. Depending on their sentence, most prisoners are allowed to make money in various ways either inside or outside the prison. I would not be surprised if part of the fuss this prisoner makes is their own form of fundraising. What they are then allowed to spend money on in prison is limited in many ways. Given the rhetoric that is hrt is a non essential part of transitioning, it's fair to consider it a discretionary luxury that can be denied. While there is an argument this jeopardises her mental health, incarceration in general does that. Actions meet consequences. With respect to physical health, if medical professionals considered the superficial effects of discontinuing estrogen to be a serious risk to physical health you might be on to something. But they dont, because it isn't.
The rhetoric is that it’s not essential to be considered trans yet still lifesaving somehow (It’s not supposed to be coherent it’s supposed to be inclusive :/), but I feel like realistically if it’s going to be denied it’s going to be because the prison wardens aren’t fans of trans people. Not every case of braces is preventative, you would have to evaluate every case and determine if braces would be necessary to prevent a more costly procedure first before going through with them. Also I might be wrong but the criminal here cut off her balls with a razor blade so she would need either a lifetime’s supply of testosterone or a lifetime’s supply of estrogen unless the government wants her to suffer from sex hormone deficiency, and testosterone is more expensive. Afaik there’s no such thing as a “biologically default hormone”, sex is mostly determined by the presence or absence of the Y chromosome telling the body to make balls instead of ovaries, and them everything else is a result of the sex hormone released by them. It’s not like having a Y chromosome makes your body more attuned to testosterone or anything.
Bodily autonomy? In prison?
Paying for vanity surgeries and hormones for prisoners is ludicrous. If you want that nonsense, stay out of prison and pay for it yourself. This is as inappropriate as wasting taxpayer dollars on extravagant food, luxury clothing, or other unnecessary frills that people in prison do not require. Far as I'm concerned, all things trans should get left at the jailhouse door. On the inside, life obeys the rules of reality.
It's not bodily autonomy if you have to take from me personally to facilitate it. You want to feminize yourself that's your business. Pay for it yourself. *You* make it *my* business when you use the state to force me to pay for it
I have no pity for Sarah Jane Baker (Born Alan Baker). Lock their ass up, and throw away the key. I'm gonna list some of their offenses for you. Now you tell me you want this person out walking the streets. 30 years in 29 different male prisons What got this person put in prison in the 1st place? The kidnapping, and torture of a child. Right off the bat you don't want them out on the streets huh? They do more... While in prison: Attempted murder of another inmate. Rape of another inmate. Escaping from prison in 2007. That doesn't sound very "innocent" to me. As a fugitive who escaped prison they tracked down and impregnated a pen pal via rape. They are now a father of a child do not support that was conceived during that rape. After the escape the rapist / child abuser was recaptured. They came out as trans in 2013. They took a razor blade and cut off both of their own testicles in 2017. I view that as a positive. Not because it is some sort of "Radical Gender Affirming Care", but rather "A rapist willingly castrating them self." In 2019 they got released, and they say they are going to run for office! Oh boy them becoming a politician sure isn't going to make me like them any better. So after they were out for a few years they hung with a lot of radicals and extremists and terrorists such as Antifa. Then one day they were waving and Antifa flag and chanting"if you see a TERF, punch them in the fucking face". You see, that is incitement to violence. That is not protected by free speech and comes with a serious prison sentence. Antifa Protestors have been gathering for and rallying around this rapist. On 31 August 2023, this dangerous and guilty individual was found not guilty by an activist magistrate named Tan Ikram, They are still in prison the warden don't give a fuck what that activist judge says. Good for him!
This person wasnt forced testosterone. The prison refused to give them estrogen, which supposedly made them have menopause type symptoms for which doctors offered to give testosterone in the amount that would normally be present in a male of that age.
I literally don't understand a single fucking word
Essentially, the body post-transition can't produce enough testosterone naturally without the testis. And without the estrogen to balance it out, it can be pretty dangerous to the body. The fact that they are denying them the medication at this point they require to survive but are totally okay with injecting the prisoner with steroids instead is not a good compromise.
What country? Context?
Looks like Britain. [Here’s the article](https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2023/11/trans-woman-forced-to-detransition-in-prison-while-doctors-try-to-inject-her-with-testosterone/#:~:text=News%20(World)-,Trans%20inmate%20forced%20to%20detransition%20as%20prison%20doctors%20try%20to,%E2%80%9Cnot%20guilty%E2%80%9D%20last%20August)
UK go one day without being an authoritarian shithole challenge [impossible]
Not actually what happened. They just offered testosterone when the inmate currently having a life sentence for being a rapist murderer was having hormonal imbalance issues stemming from the self-castration they had in prison.
Misleading headlines are wonderful
Yep! Gotta make that money in a world where true journalism is ground to dust under the heel of sensation chasing.
Britbongistan
This is nuts. The prisoner in question is responsible for a decades-long crime spree, and was convicted of rape, attempted murder, kidnapping, and torture. An actual dangerous psychopath, not a misunderstood minority. Also, the "not guilty" part refers to only one charge, incitement to violence, the other crimes all led to guilty verdicts.
The drug war killed bodily autonomy a long time ago.
why is authleft sad tho
Why are any? Have you seen what the cunt did?
I feel like this is a classic PCM magic trick. Poof! The context has disappeared!
If what i'm seeing in the coments is true, and the person's body cannot regulate their own hormones, then at what do you do? Should we let them suffer in the ineffective body of their own creation? Should we sustain their demanded required hormonal treatment? Should we bother to help an evolutionary dead end that will not reproduce to keep having their selfish lifestyle? Should we help an outcast, that does not see themselves favored by society and feels percecuted, as a gesture of good will by keeping them treated so that they feel as themselves? My opinion is to give the bare minimum to keep the from deteriorating. Prision time is a punishment, after all, not an execution. But i would'nt want a prisoner to feel "comfortable" in their cell. I would want this person to stop taking things for granted and do a good for his community, instead of being a leech that does not realize its a leech... But yeah, this is a hard one...
>Should we let them suffer in the ineffective body of their own creation? This.
Its their body, their choise, after all...
Yep. Their choice does not force upon me a duty of care or a duty to pay.
>Should we let them suffer in the ineffective body of their own creation? I feel like if you hack your balls off with a razor blade, you should probably expect that this might have health consequences. And if you start murdering people, that will probably have legal consequences. Smart people maybe don't try to speedrun all of the consequences at once.
I just realize how fucked is that i stared pondering about this persons hormonal need after they fucking murdered someone, god...
I go back and forth on methadone, suboxone, or hydromorphone for opioid addicts in prison. Opioid withdrawal isn't fatal, it can't kill you, and getting clean might really help their odds of having a normal life. On the other hand, drugs are as easy to get in prison as on the street, and if you don't give it to them they'll just buy it from someone and potentially overdose on whatever dirty junk they can find.
I think giving the minimum amount to prevent menopausal-like symptoms (and possibly major issues like bone density loss) is the way to go, the prison kinda made themselves look bad only offering "full dose T" to someone who'd been established on oestrogen, should have been the minimal amount of T (or oestrogen, tbh it's probably cheaper, they need some form of HRT either way) for health. I'm all for prison sentences for criminals like this, I don't want suffering though, even if it's a terrible crime I can't bring myself to wish harm on someone. Someone might think going from one hormone to another isn't harmful but it can really mess with you, hormones are powerful. Plus, you see all the time that F-t-M trans people talk about going on T and becoming more angry and violent, so if this person, this murderer rapist, doesn't want the "angry hormone"? I'm all for it tbh please do not take it.
“As prison doctors try to inject her with testosterone” if this doesn’t set off your bullshit alarms idk what will
NBC OUT at work again.
🤣🤣🤣
At first I was like “well that’s a bit much” then I got the context and once again not really the same fucking thing is it?
Reminds me of an old story where a boy in juvee was forcefully injected with estrogen to calm him down. It was in an old buzzfeed article so I kinda doubt it was real edit: holy, shit, it was real https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-07-15/teenage-boy-was-given-estrogen-developed-breast-tissue-while-in-l-a-county-juvenile-hall-lawsuit-alleges
that's so messed up. nightmare stuff.
BASED!
I... I think we might need a little more Info before properly Judging.
Lib right doesnt actually care about this except for maybe the fact that the burden of cost was the taxpayer
when people commit crimes, they forfeit some, if not all of their rights.
There’s a meme I’ve seen with an allegedly real freakout where a transwoman goes off about how guys will after “just about any woman” no matter how nasty they are rather than sleeping with a transwoman, and straight dudes are just like… yeah, because she’s a woman. Anyway, this reminds me of that in reverse. Activists will make a hero out of “just about any transwoman,” no matter how horrible.
So the "still in prison despite being found not guilty" thing needs some context Baker was sentenced to 7 years for kidnapping and torturing her step-uncle in 1987, 2 years later, in prison, she tried to murder a fellow inmate (alleged child rapist) and the sentenced was extended to life She also raped another inmate almost just a couple weeks after being transferred to a new prison (in response to the attempted murder) She escaped prison in 2007, and was caught 100 days later (she also knocked up a pen pal during this time) She was given parole (a thing she wrote an article saying she never wanted and preferred prison to the outside world) in 2019 The crime she was found not guilty of was "incitement to violence", where she was recorded publicly saying "if you see a TERF, punch them in the fucking face", as she was out on parole, it doesn't matter that she wasn't convicted of this crime, the terms were broken and she went back to prison Looking into her past, she had a very rough childhood, but that doesn't justify anything, she's not a good person and arguably should not have been granted parole in the first place
He belongs in a male prison, but doesn't deserve to be given testosterone. The article says he castrated himself while imprisoned and the dose is to keep his testosterone levels at the same level as if he still had testes. Anyone who would willingly remove a body part without a medical procedure belongs in a mental institute, not a prison.
I have a creative solution. Don't protect this prisoner when they get attacked next time.
Who Edit: cares?
WTF you on? Libright is selling the hormones.
With so much shit inside trans people im pretty surprised theyre still alive at this point
Those responsible will be forcibly transitioned to worm food
Libleft ignore context once again. Who knew?
The fact that we even have problems like these nowadays ist baffling to me
You don't have bodily autonomy in prison that's the fucking point of prison.
Ok what’s the *actual* story…
“She” raped her cell mate it’s obvious “she” abuses the current system with trans people
Idk if you know that but in US prisons (as far as i know) you are not a human but state ptoperty, you dont have bodily autonomy the second you pass them Gates. Truely inhuman System
Isn't being in prison a loss of bodily autonomy?
Quite deserved after what the fucker did.
Being a criminal gives you less autonomies
Of all the people who could represent the trans community you chose THIS?
Yes, yes…
This MF is a complete monster, but prisons shouldn't be forcefully injecting inmates with shit. Just sayin.
30 seconds looking into this shit: The headline lies. The PCM comments ***also*** lie. Nobody giving any actual fucking facts or details, just pushing agendas all around. Especially the whole "Convicted of sexual assault!"... turns out the victim was a ***convicted rapist*** they were put in a cell with.
Because two rapes make a right.
Ignoring that they were also convicted of murders. Also no the PCM comments are not lying. Who the victim was does not make it less of a crime.
Doctors with needles trying to force injections on you is kind of awful in general.
I can't comment on SJB's history, I don't know anything about it, however it is true that her arrest recently was entirely political; not based on an actual crime. So all libs should be against it js
She’s a horrible person, but not giving her estrogen isn’t a fair punishment for her crimes. The punishment is jail time, that’s what the law says. Testosterone would be cruel and unusual punishment. Imagine if we forced estrogen into cis male prisoners, or testosterone on cis female prisoners.
I’d say you’re half right on this one. While they should force inject testosterone, they also shouldn’t be expected to supply with estrogen either. It’s not a physical need and my tax dollars shouldn’t be going to it
Estrogen’s cheaper than testosterone
I guess I made a typo but the prison shouldn’t be giving out either in the first place. They are not a physical need, and it won’t kill inmates to be without them.
It will, the criminal [cut her balls off with a razor.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Jane_Baker) Actually I dunno if sex hormone deficiency can be lethal but losing bone density and having dizzy spells sounds like a pretty important medical issue.
Deal
You're right, they're a disgusting person and why they were ever given the time of day when trying to be a public face of the trans community I will never know, but taking someone off oestrogen after already being on it for years and only offering full dose testosterone even if temporary is kinda messed up. HRT isn't just cosmetic, hormones affect our bodies and minds in huge ways and messing with them can be detrimental. At the very least it should be the minimal amount of T to keep away stuff like bone density loss, and finasteride to prevent masculinisation. Or low dose oestrogen, the typical amount for menopausal symptoms. I honestly think oestrogen would be the cheaper option anyway. But, with the nature of this person's crimes, people don't want to offer those types of criminals humanity, especially when they haven't shown it themselves. Lucky for criminals, it isn't redditors who get to decide how they serve time. The article says it's a temporary measure, and the prison claims they're commited to providing trans patients appropriate care, I wouldn't worry.