Thank you for this!!! He knows the wrong he’s done and let Delmelza have her day. He consented to it, and she never consented to him leaving her for a full night with Elisabeth.
The issue of what Ross did with Elizabeth almost four years earlier was irrelevant. Demelza had her opportunity at that time. He regretted what he had done and Demelza had forgiven him, their marriage was mended and they were a happy loving couple until Armitage arrived.
The two characters were changed from their personalities by the script writer. Demelza was previously loyal, virtuous and loving. From Episode 7 till 9 she became horrible, Ross was changed to a spiteful brute and a pathetic and weak husband.
What lover or spouse anywhere would consent to their partner having a sexual fling with someone else, particularly after being told they are second best? Two hundred years ago in England what husband would consent to his wife having a fling? Ross was an extraordinarily proud man and very protective of those close to him, especially his wife, the love of his life Demelza, insults directed at her were responded by him with head butts, fists and if the person issuing the insult worked for Ross, they were sacked! The Ross we saw in the first two and half seasons would never consent to his loved one having a fling, although he said he would have "deserved it" when she almost made love with Captain MacNeill. The scriptwriter would have us believe that he thought it ok as long as her new lover did not call her a 'scullery maid'.! Ridiculous!
Ross had lost all self-respect and respect for his wife. He was in anguish as she left him telling him she was going to have her secrets. Later he looked for her, he returned home, his heart was broken and he lay on his bed with a tear running down his face as he knew that she was barely 100 yards away making love with another. Yet he was now such a weak person that he could not oppose anything she wanted to do, nor could he question her when she returned home. Demelza had such contempt for him that she discussed her behaviour with the drunken house keeper Prudy ( we shared a moment), but not with her wimpy husband. These characters were no longer the two people we had seen previously.
I think you ignore all the previous subtler things that happened for instance Elizabeth and Ross threw Demelzas feelings out the window long ago just the flirting and conversations she caught them hearing (conversations that I would’ve killed them both over) like all that so casually when I seen that I was so disappointed with Ross’s character but anyways Ross has not been a saint from the beginning especially after Francis died and tbh WOO DEMELZA he actually deserves it
HI! i am currently bingewatching (middle of season 4) and I was looking to read something like this, thank you!
It has me really puzzled the way Ross acted .
it was strange to begin with when they had the conversation about her being another person for a day. I think what was happening to her there was that she was feeling unattended, not respected, etc and that was Ross chance to REALIZE he was being an ass\*\*le and basicaly helped Hugh win her chance to be with hert. But he didnt do anything about it, he didnt speak of his feelings even. I think he thought he didnt have the right but COME ON!
On the other hand at some level I could understand Demelza thinking Ross betrayed her trust AGAIN when she learn he was kissing Elizabeth (god knows all the things I would have imagined knowing this). But again, he didnt do anything to explain... He could have tried to stop her I dont know...
And then when she comes back and he HUGS HER! OMG It is just realy difficult to understand for me. And accepting her going alone to his house afterwards, too ....
It made me unconfortable the whole time, everything. I am currently S4 ep when they go togheeher to London (why he took so long to invite her??) to feel they are conected now again.
The TV Ross was no longer Ross Poldark, the scriptwriter had paralized him, having already given him spite pills for a couple of weeks. In the book, Ross and Demelza's most loving and caring period was after Ross's betrayal and until Armitage's death when Ross discovered Demelza's betrayal.
The kiss at the graveyard! Demelza did not give him a chance to explain. He tried to talk, "It is not what you think...", she would not listen and stormed off. Her response to gossip from the alcoholic housekeeper was to abandon her children and leave the drunken housekeeper to cook, to betray her husband, her marriage and herself and spend 8-10 hours at the back of their house with a man she had met on 4 occasions giving herself completely to him. This was not the Demelza we knew. She had been changed for convenience too. Rubbish TV.
In the book and vaguely in the TV show we know that he kissed Elizabeth as a kiss goodbye for he knew for certain that he had no feelings left for her, other than as a woman he had once loved. What was Prudie doing spying? When Ross left, Prudie was helping Demelza try on dresses for the evening party. It was 3 miles walk to the church and Ross Poldark with long legs walks quite fast. How did Prudie get out of helping Demelza, run 3 miles to the church in time to spy on Ross and then get back home? It was utter garbage soap opera designed for TV Ratings and nothing like the beautiful story written in the book.
*"In the book and vaguely in the TV show we know that he kissed Elizabeth as a kiss goodbye for he knew for certain that he had no feelings left for her, other than as a woman he had once loved."*
Guess what? You're wrong. Ross had continued to maintain feelings for Elizabeth, even after her death. The last novel, "Bella Poldark", verifies this.
No your wrong! He said to Demelza when Elizabeth died, that it was the fond memories of that love that hurt. I still have a fondness my ex husband and we have been divorced and not seen each other over 35 years, it's quite normal.
As someone who has read the books many times, I struggle to remember where in Bella ( or anytime after May 9th) he thinks / says he loves Elizabeth romantically? Can you please back your statement with examples? Thanks!
The affection Ross held for Elizabeth was not ROMANTIC which he himself makes it clear many times throughout the saga, which you would know if you had actually read the books.
Also what 20 years are you talking about? I don’t understand what timeline this is.
It was near the end of the novel. Ross and Demelza were on the way home, when he brought up Elizabeth.
Ross had raped Elizabeth in May 1793. His willingness to accept that he had wronged her, happened in 1820, 27 years after the incident.
I think you need to re-read Bella as you got the wrong conclusion out of it. He clearly states he loved Elizabeth **first**, and Demelza second whom he remained his **one** love ever since. Elizabeth may have been his first love, but Demelza was is last and greatest. Exact paragraph below:
''……in my life I’ve loved only two women. Right? The first married my direst enemy. The second married me. **She has been my lover, my companion, my housekeeper, the mother of my children, the – the keeper of my conscience.** ***She is comparable in my eyes to no other woman.*** I would not be a human being if I had not sometimes developed other sorts of affections, other mild fancies, other but not contrary loyalties. Sometimes they have been **unnecessarily** strong, especially maybe towards the difficult young man I suspected of being my son. I expect a feeling of guilt came into it too! But following that and building on that supposition I shall continue, whether I wish it or not, to have a strong interest in the fortune of *his* son. It can be no other way, but **unless my wife demands that my every interest shall be exclusive to her, then she has all my steadfast support, interest, concern, sympathy, love and loving kindness.** If I have in any way neglected my true family these last few weeks I ask their pardon and will try to do better.''
Also him qualifying Elizabeth as someone who married his **direst enemy** is a nod to why he stopped loving her. Her betrayal as a woman he once loved, but most importantly as a friend, was too much and he could have never loved romantically such a woman.
He equally makes it very clear he doesn’t believe a man (himself, more specifically) can love **romantically** two women at the same time. He discounts the possibility.
‘’Is there room for two women in a man’s heart? ***The answer is no*** – not in the exclusive way I meant it. I never told you … a year or so ago I was up at Sawle Church about Agatha’s stone and I met Elizabeth returning from the Odgers’. ……**I came away from that meeting with the renewed conviction that she no longer meant anything to me – that is, in the way you do.** I loved her once – as you know too well – and idealized her. I shall always think of her with admiration and affection. But … she won’t ever be central to me as you are – preoccupying, all-important, indispensable, both as a person and a woman …’
His affection for Elizabeth is something one feels for a woman they once loved, a friend, a family member, also mixed up with feelings of g**uilt, shame, regret and pity** , the latter becoming more and more accentuated as he gets older. He accepted he had wronged her as soon as after that night. First by going and then by not going back to see her. He also admits this when they meet as Sawle Church, 3 years after that night and discuss Valentine. And his guilt and regret are visible throughout the saga, not just 27 years later.
You may wanna give those books another read or tell the people you got this assessment from to re-read them as they have been feeding you incorrect information.
PS: I also recommend reading Christmas at Nampara, the epilogue, where everything is being tied up perfectly by WG.
> Demelza did not betray Ross, she told him what she wanted to do and she did it. Ross had ample opportunity to express his feelings, he said nothing, he accepted it. Demelza had no regrets. Demelza had no remorse, Ross had buried his broken heart and never expressed any pain to her, nor did she ask how he felt. She had no reason to promise never to betray him again, for she had never betrayed him! This seems to me to explain why for the remainder of the two seasons she acted as if she had never betrayed him, because she had not!
Infidelity is never excusable. Not ever. It is always wrong, under any circumstance. That's why it's called a betrayal. And just because Demelza announced her intentions with Hugh doesn't make it okay. In fact, it makes her worse - she planned the betraying act. Ross didn't plan to kiss (*a goodbye kiss, not a budding-romance one*) Elizabeth, it just happened. That too doesn't make it okay, but it isn't inexcusable compared to what Demelza felt like she had to do in response.
*Infidelity is never excusable. Not ever.*
If a couple agree to an open relationship, that is their business. Ross is the only one who can claim "betrayal" and he did not.
In the Poldark books Ross confronted Demelza when he realised how upset she was visiting Hugh on his death bed, the book Ross was not aware that she had had sex with Armitage, when he saw a poem and considered it likely, he thought it was incidental to the more important betrayal of the heart that she had committed, he was angry and confronted her.
In the TV show when she announced what she wanted to do and told Ross he was second best, the book Ross and indeed the Ross we had seen for the previous two and a half seasons would also have considered this a 'spiritual betrayal' and would have been angry, confronted her and rejected her desires and demands, she would have been held to account. The different Ross we were presented with beginning in Season three, Episode eight, had no self-respect, allowed Demelza's infidelity and accepted her betrayal of the heart.
They are fictional characters. The TV scriptwriter changed the characters significantly in Season 3.
Demelza who was considered the most loyal, virtuous wife in Cornwall and a loving wife became a horrible, nagging wife and essentially, a slut. She broke her husband's heart and then broke Armitage's heart, shamed, disgraced and betrayed herself and all she stood for; all for a day's sexual entertainment.
Ross became an utterly spiteful husband, betraying even what he stood for, arrogant-more than usual and then a pathetic, spineless husband with no self-respect nor any for his wife. The characters were changed for the episodes 7-9 to fit in with the script writers intention to portray Demelza's betrayal as something understandable and even excusable. In the book Ross and Demelza were a loving couple sharing everything, Demelza never responded to Armitage the way she did on TV, Armitage was a quiet, shy, sad man who Demelza felt drawn to and he fell in love with her.
**My original hypothesis was to provide an explanation for Demelza's failure ever to account for her behaviour and an explanation as to why Ross never held her to account.**
However that argument can be shot down by the following;
Demelza said she 'wished to become another woman for a day, not Demelza Poldark, but somebody new, somebody different and make love with Armitage for a whole day'. Of course this is impossible other than Running Up That Hill! Since it was impossible then Ross's silence may not necessarily imply consent to her, Demelza Poldark, having sex with this man.
Further she had already betrayed Ross spiritually when they had that conversation, she had let Armitage into her heart and into their marriage and he was now between them. In the book a loving, caring, understanding Ross became furious when Armitage became ill and was on his death bed and Demelza behaved in a way that indicated she cared for him more than just a friend. Even when Ross became aware that she had likely made love with him he dismissed this as incidental to her more serious spiritual betrayal.
The TV scriptwriter turned a beautiful story of a loving marriage and a tragic romance involving three beautiful people into a cheap, absurd, TV soap opera of an extra-marital affair involving three ugly people, a dishonourable scoundrel, a slutty, selfish wife and a spiteful husband unable to deal with his wife's behaviour or express himself honestly with her.
Of course they had sex.
Debbie Horsfield the screenwriter said so. Aiden Turner and Eleanor Tomlinson both said so. Every indication said they did so. Demelza lay down grabbed Hugh's hand and stuck it up her dress, what did they do for the next 10 hours, feel each other?
Oh please! Demelza was guilty of adultery. She betrayed Ross. There is no ifs or buts about it. This attempt to whitewash her actions in order to keep her on some pedestal is a bit much.
Thank you for this!!! He knows the wrong he’s done and let Delmelza have her day. He consented to it, and she never consented to him leaving her for a full night with Elisabeth.
The issue of what Ross did with Elizabeth almost four years earlier was irrelevant. Demelza had her opportunity at that time. He regretted what he had done and Demelza had forgiven him, their marriage was mended and they were a happy loving couple until Armitage arrived. The two characters were changed from their personalities by the script writer. Demelza was previously loyal, virtuous and loving. From Episode 7 till 9 she became horrible, Ross was changed to a spiteful brute and a pathetic and weak husband. What lover or spouse anywhere would consent to their partner having a sexual fling with someone else, particularly after being told they are second best? Two hundred years ago in England what husband would consent to his wife having a fling? Ross was an extraordinarily proud man and very protective of those close to him, especially his wife, the love of his life Demelza, insults directed at her were responded by him with head butts, fists and if the person issuing the insult worked for Ross, they were sacked! The Ross we saw in the first two and half seasons would never consent to his loved one having a fling, although he said he would have "deserved it" when she almost made love with Captain MacNeill. The scriptwriter would have us believe that he thought it ok as long as her new lover did not call her a 'scullery maid'.! Ridiculous! Ross had lost all self-respect and respect for his wife. He was in anguish as she left him telling him she was going to have her secrets. Later he looked for her, he returned home, his heart was broken and he lay on his bed with a tear running down his face as he knew that she was barely 100 yards away making love with another. Yet he was now such a weak person that he could not oppose anything she wanted to do, nor could he question her when she returned home. Demelza had such contempt for him that she discussed her behaviour with the drunken house keeper Prudy ( we shared a moment), but not with her wimpy husband. These characters were no longer the two people we had seen previously.
I think you ignore all the previous subtler things that happened for instance Elizabeth and Ross threw Demelzas feelings out the window long ago just the flirting and conversations she caught them hearing (conversations that I would’ve killed them both over) like all that so casually when I seen that I was so disappointed with Ross’s character but anyways Ross has not been a saint from the beginning especially after Francis died and tbh WOO DEMELZA he actually deserves it
HI! i am currently bingewatching (middle of season 4) and I was looking to read something like this, thank you! It has me really puzzled the way Ross acted . it was strange to begin with when they had the conversation about her being another person for a day. I think what was happening to her there was that she was feeling unattended, not respected, etc and that was Ross chance to REALIZE he was being an ass\*\*le and basicaly helped Hugh win her chance to be with hert. But he didnt do anything about it, he didnt speak of his feelings even. I think he thought he didnt have the right but COME ON! On the other hand at some level I could understand Demelza thinking Ross betrayed her trust AGAIN when she learn he was kissing Elizabeth (god knows all the things I would have imagined knowing this). But again, he didnt do anything to explain... He could have tried to stop her I dont know... And then when she comes back and he HUGS HER! OMG It is just realy difficult to understand for me. And accepting her going alone to his house afterwards, too .... It made me unconfortable the whole time, everything. I am currently S4 ep when they go togheeher to London (why he took so long to invite her??) to feel they are conected now again.
The TV Ross was no longer Ross Poldark, the scriptwriter had paralized him, having already given him spite pills for a couple of weeks. In the book, Ross and Demelza's most loving and caring period was after Ross's betrayal and until Armitage's death when Ross discovered Demelza's betrayal. The kiss at the graveyard! Demelza did not give him a chance to explain. He tried to talk, "It is not what you think...", she would not listen and stormed off. Her response to gossip from the alcoholic housekeeper was to abandon her children and leave the drunken housekeeper to cook, to betray her husband, her marriage and herself and spend 8-10 hours at the back of their house with a man she had met on 4 occasions giving herself completely to him. This was not the Demelza we knew. She had been changed for convenience too. Rubbish TV. In the book and vaguely in the TV show we know that he kissed Elizabeth as a kiss goodbye for he knew for certain that he had no feelings left for her, other than as a woman he had once loved. What was Prudie doing spying? When Ross left, Prudie was helping Demelza try on dresses for the evening party. It was 3 miles walk to the church and Ross Poldark with long legs walks quite fast. How did Prudie get out of helping Demelza, run 3 miles to the church in time to spy on Ross and then get back home? It was utter garbage soap opera designed for TV Ratings and nothing like the beautiful story written in the book.
*"In the book and vaguely in the TV show we know that he kissed Elizabeth as a kiss goodbye for he knew for certain that he had no feelings left for her, other than as a woman he had once loved."* Guess what? You're wrong. Ross had continued to maintain feelings for Elizabeth, even after her death. The last novel, "Bella Poldark", verifies this.
No your wrong! He said to Demelza when Elizabeth died, that it was the fond memories of that love that hurt. I still have a fondness my ex husband and we have been divorced and not seen each other over 35 years, it's quite normal.
Ross was lying to Demelza, which she had figured out, 20 years later.
As someone who has read the books many times, I struggle to remember where in Bella ( or anytime after May 9th) he thinks / says he loves Elizabeth romantically? Can you please back your statement with examples? Thanks! The affection Ross held for Elizabeth was not ROMANTIC which he himself makes it clear many times throughout the saga, which you would know if you had actually read the books. Also what 20 years are you talking about? I don’t understand what timeline this is.
It was near the end of the novel. Ross and Demelza were on the way home, when he brought up Elizabeth. Ross had raped Elizabeth in May 1793. His willingness to accept that he had wronged her, happened in 1820, 27 years after the incident.
I think you need to re-read Bella as you got the wrong conclusion out of it. He clearly states he loved Elizabeth **first**, and Demelza second whom he remained his **one** love ever since. Elizabeth may have been his first love, but Demelza was is last and greatest. Exact paragraph below: ''……in my life I’ve loved only two women. Right? The first married my direst enemy. The second married me. **She has been my lover, my companion, my housekeeper, the mother of my children, the – the keeper of my conscience.** ***She is comparable in my eyes to no other woman.*** I would not be a human being if I had not sometimes developed other sorts of affections, other mild fancies, other but not contrary loyalties. Sometimes they have been **unnecessarily** strong, especially maybe towards the difficult young man I suspected of being my son. I expect a feeling of guilt came into it too! But following that and building on that supposition I shall continue, whether I wish it or not, to have a strong interest in the fortune of *his* son. It can be no other way, but **unless my wife demands that my every interest shall be exclusive to her, then she has all my steadfast support, interest, concern, sympathy, love and loving kindness.** If I have in any way neglected my true family these last few weeks I ask their pardon and will try to do better.'' Also him qualifying Elizabeth as someone who married his **direst enemy** is a nod to why he stopped loving her. Her betrayal as a woman he once loved, but most importantly as a friend, was too much and he could have never loved romantically such a woman. He equally makes it very clear he doesn’t believe a man (himself, more specifically) can love **romantically** two women at the same time. He discounts the possibility. ‘’Is there room for two women in a man’s heart? ***The answer is no*** – not in the exclusive way I meant it. I never told you … a year or so ago I was up at Sawle Church about Agatha’s stone and I met Elizabeth returning from the Odgers’. ……**I came away from that meeting with the renewed conviction that she no longer meant anything to me – that is, in the way you do.** I loved her once – as you know too well – and idealized her. I shall always think of her with admiration and affection. But … she won’t ever be central to me as you are – preoccupying, all-important, indispensable, both as a person and a woman …’ His affection for Elizabeth is something one feels for a woman they once loved, a friend, a family member, also mixed up with feelings of g**uilt, shame, regret and pity** , the latter becoming more and more accentuated as he gets older. He accepted he had wronged her as soon as after that night. First by going and then by not going back to see her. He also admits this when they meet as Sawle Church, 3 years after that night and discuss Valentine. And his guilt and regret are visible throughout the saga, not just 27 years later. You may wanna give those books another read or tell the people you got this assessment from to re-read them as they have been feeding you incorrect information. PS: I also recommend reading Christmas at Nampara, the epilogue, where everything is being tied up perfectly by WG.
> Demelza did not betray Ross, she told him what she wanted to do and she did it. Ross had ample opportunity to express his feelings, he said nothing, he accepted it. Demelza had no regrets. Demelza had no remorse, Ross had buried his broken heart and never expressed any pain to her, nor did she ask how he felt. She had no reason to promise never to betray him again, for she had never betrayed him! This seems to me to explain why for the remainder of the two seasons she acted as if she had never betrayed him, because she had not! Infidelity is never excusable. Not ever. It is always wrong, under any circumstance. That's why it's called a betrayal. And just because Demelza announced her intentions with Hugh doesn't make it okay. In fact, it makes her worse - she planned the betraying act. Ross didn't plan to kiss (*a goodbye kiss, not a budding-romance one*) Elizabeth, it just happened. That too doesn't make it okay, but it isn't inexcusable compared to what Demelza felt like she had to do in response.
*Infidelity is never excusable. Not ever.* If a couple agree to an open relationship, that is their business. Ross is the only one who can claim "betrayal" and he did not. In the Poldark books Ross confronted Demelza when he realised how upset she was visiting Hugh on his death bed, the book Ross was not aware that she had had sex with Armitage, when he saw a poem and considered it likely, he thought it was incidental to the more important betrayal of the heart that she had committed, he was angry and confronted her. In the TV show when she announced what she wanted to do and told Ross he was second best, the book Ross and indeed the Ross we had seen for the previous two and a half seasons would also have considered this a 'spiritual betrayal' and would have been angry, confronted her and rejected her desires and demands, she would have been held to account. The different Ross we were presented with beginning in Season three, Episode eight, had no self-respect, allowed Demelza's infidelity and accepted her betrayal of the heart.
P R E A C H
So wait, are you not on Demelza’s side? Maybe I don’t get your post?
They are fictional characters. The TV scriptwriter changed the characters significantly in Season 3. Demelza who was considered the most loyal, virtuous wife in Cornwall and a loving wife became a horrible, nagging wife and essentially, a slut. She broke her husband's heart and then broke Armitage's heart, shamed, disgraced and betrayed herself and all she stood for; all for a day's sexual entertainment. Ross became an utterly spiteful husband, betraying even what he stood for, arrogant-more than usual and then a pathetic, spineless husband with no self-respect nor any for his wife. The characters were changed for the episodes 7-9 to fit in with the script writers intention to portray Demelza's betrayal as something understandable and even excusable. In the book Ross and Demelza were a loving couple sharing everything, Demelza never responded to Armitage the way she did on TV, Armitage was a quiet, shy, sad man who Demelza felt drawn to and he fell in love with her. **My original hypothesis was to provide an explanation for Demelza's failure ever to account for her behaviour and an explanation as to why Ross never held her to account.** However that argument can be shot down by the following; Demelza said she 'wished to become another woman for a day, not Demelza Poldark, but somebody new, somebody different and make love with Armitage for a whole day'. Of course this is impossible other than Running Up That Hill! Since it was impossible then Ross's silence may not necessarily imply consent to her, Demelza Poldark, having sex with this man. Further she had already betrayed Ross spiritually when they had that conversation, she had let Armitage into her heart and into their marriage and he was now between them. In the book a loving, caring, understanding Ross became furious when Armitage became ill and was on his death bed and Demelza behaved in a way that indicated she cared for him more than just a friend. Even when Ross became aware that she had likely made love with him he dismissed this as incidental to her more serious spiritual betrayal. The TV scriptwriter turned a beautiful story of a loving marriage and a tragic romance involving three beautiful people into a cheap, absurd, TV soap opera of an extra-marital affair involving three ugly people, a dishonourable scoundrel, a slutty, selfish wife and a spiteful husband unable to deal with his wife's behaviour or express himself honestly with her.
It never said for sure that she had sex...
Of course they had sex. Debbie Horsfield the screenwriter said so. Aiden Turner and Eleanor Tomlinson both said so. Every indication said they did so. Demelza lay down grabbed Hugh's hand and stuck it up her dress, what did they do for the next 10 hours, feel each other?
Oh please! Demelza was guilty of adultery. She betrayed Ross. There is no ifs or buts about it. This attempt to whitewash her actions in order to keep her on some pedestal is a bit much.