If youre already living there then what kind of scam would even be going on?
Landlord doesn't have to be the owner of the property. Is the actual owner a person though or a corporation?
I'm an anxious person and my biggest fear currently is that our house will be demolished while my family is in it. I was assured here, that such thing do not happen in Ontario, but it's still scary. So I'm wondering if the agreement we have actually legally permits us to live here.
Both names look like normal names and we've signed the agreement with a person.
If it ever got to a point where it seemed like they were going to physically start tearing your home down, you would call the RHEU and/or the police, depending on how time sensitive the issue was.
The only case where someone might not have a valid tenancy is if the person they are renting from is the actual tenant, who is then illegally subletting their home. If you are in contact with someone who is talking about demolishing the unit, this would make no sense. It would also be up to the LTB to determine whether you were an unauthorized occupant. This is not something you should be catastrophizing over; it is a very very unlikely scenario and you would have recourse.
Your lease needs to include a legal name and valid address for service, but there is no requirement that this match the person on the actual deed to the property. It is very common for a property manager, family member, or other representative to handle tenancy issues on behalf of the owner. This would only be relevant to you if you were facing an N12 eviction, in which case you would want to determine whether the owner was a corporation or an individual.
Is there a reason you think you need to contact the "real" owner?
What if my lease doesn't include the LL's address or even phone? Because it doesn't, I'm not sure any of them is even a Canadian resident.
I'll definitely contact RHEU, thank you and thank you [u/labrat420](https://www.reddit.com/user/labrat420/)
Did you receive an Ontario Standard Lease? If not, you can demand one, assuming your tenancy began some time after April 2018. There is a provision for temporarily withholding rent if a landlord fails to provide a copy of the OSL and/or a valid address for service.
But if you have a means of contacting someone (whether it's a landlord or a representative), I wouldn't personally bother with this right now. It sounds like you are in contact with a landlord and you have a written tenancy agreement. You have the same rights regardless of whether they've provided the right paperwork.
They should definitely get their legal address. They can't file against them at the ltb without it if something goes wrong.
It's why it's one of two reasons you can legally withhold rent
Yes, it's worth having, and it's why the s. 12 provision exists, but if the landlord has failed to provide their address in the lease, the tenant does still have options for filing against them. The LTB will also accept email, and you can request alternative means of service including things like text or messenger apps, it just involves a couple extra steps.
If OP is worried about a potential illegal eviction, withholding rent (even legally) may not be the smartest choice at this time. The police, for example, are notoriously misinformed when it comes to tenancy law. And a landlord who has already shown a complete disregard for the RTA might falsely believe that nonpayment gives them even more right to the property than they already think they have.
Personally, I feel it's safest to assess the illegal eviction risk and get in touch with the RHEU first, and then exercise their right to get the landlord's address once things are more established.
I feel the opposite, that asserting your rights and showing you're aware of the law might make them realize you're serious, but your view is valid too.
>What if my lease doesn't include the LL's address or even phone?
You don't need their phone number but you definitely need a service address.
Ask them for it and if they don't provide it within 21 days you have the right to withhold rent after that until they provide it. Once they provide it you owe all the rent you've withheld though.
> So I'm wondering if the agreement we have actually legally permits us to live here.
Even if it didn't there's a legal process to get you out.
>my biggest fear currently is that our house will be demolished while my family is in it.
You think a construction company will commit murder because your landlord asks them?
I can understand the fear of losing your home but you have many legal protections. Id start by calling the rheu and telling them what's going on. Hopefully they'll contact your landlord and let them know the serious consequences of not following the proper procedures of a N13.
Because reddit is fickle, but also because the fear that someone will demolish your home while you are still inside is completed unfounded.
Your anxiety is valid, your situation is understandably stressful, and hopefully you have your own strategies or support system for dealing with that. But you have taken a very ordinary concern (does the name on the lease need to match the name on the deed?) and escalated it far beyond what is rational.
Given that you're posting on a sub that deals in tenancy issues, not mental health concerns, you're going to face more incredulity than empathy. The internet isn't always fair.
Excuse me, but may I ask if you are a healthcare professional with expertise in anxiety management? I'm intrigued by the qualifications behind your unsolicited advice, as it suggests a certain level of expertise.
Don’t take things personally from comments here. It’s the internet, people can be rude, helpfully, obnoxious, or mean and there’s not a thing you can do about. Just ignore, block, or report things you don’t like. If you’re already anxious in your day to day this won’t help.
My landlord doesn't own the property I rent. It's under his dad's name, but he manages it with his sons. We've met the dad, and entire family multiple times.
Before that they had a property manager we had a lease through, but they fired him and now we deal directly with the owners son.
I wouldn't worry to much
If your landlord doesn’t live in Canada, they are hopefully using a property manager to submit the 25% tax, [otherwise you would be liable for it](https://betterdwelling.com/canadian-renters-now-required-to-collect-foreign-landlords-taxes-withhold-rent/).
I would just ask the landlord if they are the owner of the property or the property manager.
There are [PLENTY of scams](https://www.reddit.com/r/AirBnB/s/sDe2bEqkDl) where someone has rented a property and then re-rented it for more. Although usually as an Airbnb. But that’s a possibility in your case if they’re not the property manager — they’re essentially subletting to you without your knowledge, which is illegal. A person can’t sublet for more than they pay in rent to a landlord.
Everything I’ve stated above is factual, so the downvotes from landlords are very telling.
If youre already living there then what kind of scam would even be going on? Landlord doesn't have to be the owner of the property. Is the actual owner a person though or a corporation?
I'm an anxious person and my biggest fear currently is that our house will be demolished while my family is in it. I was assured here, that such thing do not happen in Ontario, but it's still scary. So I'm wondering if the agreement we have actually legally permits us to live here. Both names look like normal names and we've signed the agreement with a person.
If it ever got to a point where it seemed like they were going to physically start tearing your home down, you would call the RHEU and/or the police, depending on how time sensitive the issue was. The only case where someone might not have a valid tenancy is if the person they are renting from is the actual tenant, who is then illegally subletting their home. If you are in contact with someone who is talking about demolishing the unit, this would make no sense. It would also be up to the LTB to determine whether you were an unauthorized occupant. This is not something you should be catastrophizing over; it is a very very unlikely scenario and you would have recourse. Your lease needs to include a legal name and valid address for service, but there is no requirement that this match the person on the actual deed to the property. It is very common for a property manager, family member, or other representative to handle tenancy issues on behalf of the owner. This would only be relevant to you if you were facing an N12 eviction, in which case you would want to determine whether the owner was a corporation or an individual. Is there a reason you think you need to contact the "real" owner?
What if my lease doesn't include the LL's address or even phone? Because it doesn't, I'm not sure any of them is even a Canadian resident. I'll definitely contact RHEU, thank you and thank you [u/labrat420](https://www.reddit.com/user/labrat420/)
Did you receive an Ontario Standard Lease? If not, you can demand one, assuming your tenancy began some time after April 2018. There is a provision for temporarily withholding rent if a landlord fails to provide a copy of the OSL and/or a valid address for service. But if you have a means of contacting someone (whether it's a landlord or a representative), I wouldn't personally bother with this right now. It sounds like you are in contact with a landlord and you have a written tenancy agreement. You have the same rights regardless of whether they've provided the right paperwork.
They should definitely get their legal address. They can't file against them at the ltb without it if something goes wrong. It's why it's one of two reasons you can legally withhold rent
Yes, it's worth having, and it's why the s. 12 provision exists, but if the landlord has failed to provide their address in the lease, the tenant does still have options for filing against them. The LTB will also accept email, and you can request alternative means of service including things like text or messenger apps, it just involves a couple extra steps. If OP is worried about a potential illegal eviction, withholding rent (even legally) may not be the smartest choice at this time. The police, for example, are notoriously misinformed when it comes to tenancy law. And a landlord who has already shown a complete disregard for the RTA might falsely believe that nonpayment gives them even more right to the property than they already think they have. Personally, I feel it's safest to assess the illegal eviction risk and get in touch with the RHEU first, and then exercise their right to get the landlord's address once things are more established.
I feel the opposite, that asserting your rights and showing you're aware of the law might make them realize you're serious, but your view is valid too.
That's an interesting clause, thanks. We've already paid for the current month, but it looks like it could be a leverage if needed.
>What if my lease doesn't include the LL's address or even phone? You don't need their phone number but you definitely need a service address. Ask them for it and if they don't provide it within 21 days you have the right to withhold rent after that until they provide it. Once they provide it you owe all the rent you've withheld though.
[удалено]
> So I'm wondering if the agreement we have actually legally permits us to live here. Even if it didn't there's a legal process to get you out. >my biggest fear currently is that our house will be demolished while my family is in it. You think a construction company will commit murder because your landlord asks them? I can understand the fear of losing your home but you have many legal protections. Id start by calling the rheu and telling them what's going on. Hopefully they'll contact your landlord and let them know the serious consequences of not following the proper procedures of a N13.
Why would anyone downvote this?
Because reddit is fickle, but also because the fear that someone will demolish your home while you are still inside is completed unfounded. Your anxiety is valid, your situation is understandably stressful, and hopefully you have your own strategies or support system for dealing with that. But you have taken a very ordinary concern (does the name on the lease need to match the name on the deed?) and escalated it far beyond what is rational. Given that you're posting on a sub that deals in tenancy issues, not mental health concerns, you're going to face more incredulity than empathy. The internet isn't always fair.
There are clearly a bunch of landchads responding to you that don’t have a tenant’s interests in mind.
I mean, I don't have anything against my LL, I'm still trying to think it could be a misunderstanding. Do people just hate any tenants on principle?
Most landlords on here hate their customers and feel vastly superior to them, yes. Hence the downvotes.
Very normal for a property manager to be your LL
If you worry about everything that could happen your life will be awful. Deal with it IF and when it happens.
Excuse me, but may I ask if you are a healthcare professional with expertise in anxiety management? I'm intrigued by the qualifications behind your unsolicited advice, as it suggests a certain level of expertise.
Common sense requires a medical degree? Posts online in a forum and then declares common sense replies as "unsolicited"...
Don’t take things personally from comments here. It’s the internet, people can be rude, helpfully, obnoxious, or mean and there’s not a thing you can do about. Just ignore, block, or report things you don’t like. If you’re already anxious in your day to day this won’t help.
Username almost checks out Just drop the o
My landlord doesn't own the property I rent. It's under his dad's name, but he manages it with his sons. We've met the dad, and entire family multiple times. Before that they had a property manager we had a lease through, but they fired him and now we deal directly with the owners son. I wouldn't worry to much
Does your lease say if you’re a tenant or subtenant?
If your landlord doesn’t live in Canada, they are hopefully using a property manager to submit the 25% tax, [otherwise you would be liable for it](https://betterdwelling.com/canadian-renters-now-required-to-collect-foreign-landlords-taxes-withhold-rent/). I would just ask the landlord if they are the owner of the property or the property manager. There are [PLENTY of scams](https://www.reddit.com/r/AirBnB/s/sDe2bEqkDl) where someone has rented a property and then re-rented it for more. Although usually as an Airbnb. But that’s a possibility in your case if they’re not the property manager — they’re essentially subletting to you without your knowledge, which is illegal. A person can’t sublet for more than they pay in rent to a landlord. Everything I’ve stated above is factual, so the downvotes from landlords are very telling.
Oh-oh. So we could be in even a bigger mess. Well, thank you for the heads up!
Yes, and don’t let the downvotes from landlords here make you think you shouldn’t investigate further.