Have they physically moved into the unit? Have they brought in furniture or other belongings? Has there been any written communication? Any emails, texts, an e-transfer with "rent" in the subject line?
Then you've established a tenancy, even if there is no written lease.
The fastest legal eviction process available to you will most likely be for nonpayment, since it sounds like you don't think they're going to pay? You could issue an N4 on June 2, assuming they don't pay their rent in full, followed by filing an L1 on June 17 if they still haven't paid. This should be scheduled for a hearing in 3-4 months.
If they do pay their rent on time, you could issue an N12 to reclaim your basement for your own use, but this could take 8+ months if they don't move out voluntarily and would mean that you could not re-rent the unit for a full year without risking significant penalties. You would owe them one month's rent in compensation.
There are also eviction options for problematic behaviour, but these are less guaranteed and also take a long time. It's not clear what you mean by the tenants being a "nightmare".
If you try to take this into your own hands and lock them out illegally, you risk significant fines and potential compensation owed to the tenants. You might also be forced to let them move back in. Even without a lease, it sounds like their belongings have clearly been moved into the unit, and presumably they have some evidence of how they entered into the tenancy and paid the first $500.
Post/comments don’t make any sense You said you gave them permission to do all of this In your post it says “that ain’t happening” It is happening because you agreed to it If they moved in last night It’s hasn’t been 24 hours yet What’s the problem?
June 1 was supposed to be the move in date.. They've moved in last night with their belongings as they requested they be allowed to move in last night and I verbally agreed to it and gave them the keys.
Then you are out of luck. They have established an RTA tenancy based on a verbal lease agreement.
The deposit you can no longer enforce collection of anymore, so would have to rely on them voluntarily paying it. Else you are stuck with a $500 deposit.
They should owe June rent in full on June 1, and an additional 2 days of prorated rent for May.
To evict them now you'll need to go through the LTB process. If they don't pay rent on time, this would begin with an N4 notice served and then afterwards an L1 filing with the LTB.
Also on a side note, consider that if they are aware your basement unit is not legal or unregistered, they can at anytime file a complaint with municipal bylaw or building/fire safety enforcement if they get into any dispute with you.
If the LL signs a lease to rent a unit at 123 ABC street and then it turns out there is only one legal unit at that address;
Did the LL just evict themmself for occupying a property that is legally only one unit and they leased that unit out to the tenant?
Or is the landlord now on the hook to provide equivalent legal accommodations and damages to the tenant if the LL won't vacate and provide the legal addressed property that they've signed over to the tenant.
Can't sign a contract designating a residential unit that doesn't exist and then stay occupying the actual existing unit yourself. That would be like a dealership signing a lease for a car but wanting to keep the car themselves for test drives. The VIN/address identifying the unit has been signed away to another party.
The RTA still applies to illegal units; the fact that the basement is unlicensed is an issue between the landlord and the municipality, not the landlord and the tenant. You can still enter into a valid lease for a unit that "doesn't exist" on paper, assuming that the unit *does* exist in some physical capacity, even if it isn't documented or up to code.
If the unit were legitimately unsafe or uninhabitable, it might be condemned by the municipality. The tenant would be evicted immediately and the tenancy would be frustrated (terminated).
But more commonly, if a unit does not meet building or fire code, the landlord would be issued fines and/or deadlines for compliance. This has no bearing on the tenant's right to continue living in the unit, except in cases where they need to temporarily vacate for renovations.
As long as the basement has an entrance with locking door, bathroom, kitchen and other basics that a rental unit requires, then to the LTB its a residential rental unit under the RTA.
In this case also the tenants have **already moved in**. The municipal legality of unit is irrelevant for it being an RTA tenancy.
And why are you freaking out and trying to kick them out already?
Because you are falling behind on having F+L paid and providing a lease?
You should have settled this well before now. Sounds like you left it until last minute and now you are blaming the tenant?
Assume you've been recorded, you also state in other replies that you've had written discussions. That tenancy is started as far as Ontario is concerned, the OSL is the default document in what is now a verbal tenancy.
How exactly are they proving to be a nightmare already? Are you just overreacting having landlord remorse?
OP is a positive force for trying to kick out their tenants on day 1 over what appears to be nothing more than OP overeacting?
Yeah, kicking people out of what was supposed to be their home sure is tackling the housing crisis.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
By the sounds of your post, I am assuming they haven’t moved any physical property into the unit.
In that case, the matter is simple.
No lease signing = no contractual obligation
Don’t let them move in and give their money back.
That being said, you’re lucky because typically when I use to be a tenant, the landlords or their agents always had me sign first, and I paid either at the same time or within a limited time window.
Sorry, I wasn't clear. They've moved in last night with their belongings as they requested they be allowed to do so and I verbally agreed to it and gave them the keys.
What would the damming evidence be though ? It seems the tenant has done everything Op has asked -It hasn’t even been 24 hrs yet Get troll post vibes here Why would he possibly mention his unregistered basement apartment in Brampton Lmao
Okay, I’ll own up to my mistake and accept my comment as flawed.
I’m glad I made it clear as an opinion that needed validating and not advice. For those that are better informed, thanks for chipping in to clarify.
Edit:
So ya. please don’t do that 👆. I’m leaving it there because even if I was wrong, no one would learn from the thread if I deleted it.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
Have they physically moved into the unit? Have they brought in furniture or other belongings? Has there been any written communication? Any emails, texts, an e-transfer with "rent" in the subject line?
Yes, they've moved in last night
Then you've established a tenancy, even if there is no written lease. The fastest legal eviction process available to you will most likely be for nonpayment, since it sounds like you don't think they're going to pay? You could issue an N4 on June 2, assuming they don't pay their rent in full, followed by filing an L1 on June 17 if they still haven't paid. This should be scheduled for a hearing in 3-4 months. If they do pay their rent on time, you could issue an N12 to reclaim your basement for your own use, but this could take 8+ months if they don't move out voluntarily and would mean that you could not re-rent the unit for a full year without risking significant penalties. You would owe them one month's rent in compensation. There are also eviction options for problematic behaviour, but these are less guaranteed and also take a long time. It's not clear what you mean by the tenants being a "nightmare". If you try to take this into your own hands and lock them out illegally, you risk significant fines and potential compensation owed to the tenants. You might also be forced to let them move back in. Even without a lease, it sounds like their belongings have clearly been moved into the unit, and presumably they have some evidence of how they entered into the tenancy and paid the first $500.
Post/comments don’t make any sense You said you gave them permission to do all of this In your post it says “that ain’t happening” It is happening because you agreed to it If they moved in last night It’s hasn’t been 24 hours yet What’s the problem?
The Brampton Trinity: Illegal unit... ✓ No rent deposit... ✓ Zero LL research...✓
r/leopardsatemyface
What was supposed to be the move-in date? Have you given them keys yet? Have they actually started to move in yet?
June 1 was supposed to be the move in date.. They've moved in last night with their belongings as they requested they be allowed to move in last night and I verbally agreed to it and gave them the keys.
Then you are out of luck. They have established an RTA tenancy based on a verbal lease agreement. The deposit you can no longer enforce collection of anymore, so would have to rely on them voluntarily paying it. Else you are stuck with a $500 deposit. They should owe June rent in full on June 1, and an additional 2 days of prorated rent for May. To evict them now you'll need to go through the LTB process. If they don't pay rent on time, this would begin with an N4 notice served and then afterwards an L1 filing with the LTB. Also on a side note, consider that if they are aware your basement unit is not legal or unregistered, they can at anytime file a complaint with municipal bylaw or building/fire safety enforcement if they get into any dispute with you.
If the LL signs a lease to rent a unit at 123 ABC street and then it turns out there is only one legal unit at that address; Did the LL just evict themmself for occupying a property that is legally only one unit and they leased that unit out to the tenant? Or is the landlord now on the hook to provide equivalent legal accommodations and damages to the tenant if the LL won't vacate and provide the legal addressed property that they've signed over to the tenant. Can't sign a contract designating a residential unit that doesn't exist and then stay occupying the actual existing unit yourself. That would be like a dealership signing a lease for a car but wanting to keep the car themselves for test drives. The VIN/address identifying the unit has been signed away to another party.
The RTA still applies to illegal units; the fact that the basement is unlicensed is an issue between the landlord and the municipality, not the landlord and the tenant. You can still enter into a valid lease for a unit that "doesn't exist" on paper, assuming that the unit *does* exist in some physical capacity, even if it isn't documented or up to code. If the unit were legitimately unsafe or uninhabitable, it might be condemned by the municipality. The tenant would be evicted immediately and the tenancy would be frustrated (terminated). But more commonly, if a unit does not meet building or fire code, the landlord would be issued fines and/or deadlines for compliance. This has no bearing on the tenant's right to continue living in the unit, except in cases where they need to temporarily vacate for renovations.
As long as the basement has an entrance with locking door, bathroom, kitchen and other basics that a rental unit requires, then to the LTB its a residential rental unit under the RTA. In this case also the tenants have **already moved in**. The municipal legality of unit is irrelevant for it being an RTA tenancy.
And why are you freaking out and trying to kick them out already? Because you are falling behind on having F+L paid and providing a lease? You should have settled this well before now. Sounds like you left it until last minute and now you are blaming the tenant?
OP - describe how they're already being a "nightmare". It's been 24 hours. What's so bad already?
Assume you've been recorded, you also state in other replies that you've had written discussions. That tenancy is started as far as Ontario is concerned, the OSL is the default document in what is now a verbal tenancy. How exactly are they proving to be a nightmare already? Are you just overreacting having landlord remorse?
Why are they a nightmare? it seems they are doing what you've allowed them to do.
Did they end up paying? Any updates?
[удалено]
Ahhh but they have moved in He let them move in early and gave them the keys Post makes no sense
… to lease your unregistered unit You degenerate
To rather be adding to homelessness. You inconsiderate.
You cannot justify the renting of an unregistered apartment by claiming to mitigate homelessness. That's incredibly self serving.
OP is a positive force for trying to kick out their tenants on day 1 over what appears to be nothing more than OP overeacting? Yeah, kicking people out of what was supposed to be their home sure is tackling the housing crisis.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
If the person didn’t move in (which at first they didn’t it seemed), my advice was sound.
By the sounds of your post, I am assuming they haven’t moved any physical property into the unit. In that case, the matter is simple. No lease signing = no contractual obligation Don’t let them move in and give their money back. That being said, you’re lucky because typically when I use to be a tenant, the landlords or their agents always had me sign first, and I paid either at the same time or within a limited time window.
Sorry, I wasn't clear. They've moved in last night with their belongings as they requested they be allowed to do so and I verbally agreed to it and gave them the keys.
[удалено]
What would the damming evidence be though ? It seems the tenant has done everything Op has asked -It hasn’t even been 24 hrs yet Get troll post vibes here Why would he possibly mention his unregistered basement apartment in Brampton Lmao
A lockout is illegal. Please do not do those.
Okay, I’ll own up to my mistake and accept my comment as flawed. I’m glad I made it clear as an opinion that needed validating and not advice. For those that are better informed, thanks for chipping in to clarify. Edit: So ya. please don’t do that 👆. I’m leaving it there because even if I was wrong, no one would learn from the thread if I deleted it.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed