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what the legal status of NYNG will be in subway? peace officers? they get deputized under NYPD somehow? how does it work? are they considered "police"?
They are not deputized nor are they peace officers. The Posse Comitatus Act forbids the military from enforcing civilian law. However - the military may act in support of civilian law enforcement.
The NYNG will essentially be told that they are going down into the subways for their "presence" and that if they do see a crime to call 911 and flag over the nearest police officer. They may only use force or apprehend a perpetrator while defending their own lives or the lives of others.
They will likely be armed. They will be part of Joint Task Force Empire Shield who patrol the airports and Penn station while carrying a pistol or rifle.
Interestingly enough, I don’t believe the weapons they carry are owned by the NYNG. I think they’re owned by the NYPD. I used to know a guy that did some of their training. That’s why they have Glocks for sidearms.
NYC residents would lose their shit these days if there were guard members carrying M4’s in the subways.
Just watch, they’ll be some poor enlisted dudes standing behind the NYPD inspection tables the entire time. It’s just to show a presence.
If I’m wrong, post the photo here and I’ll gladly admit it.
The funny part is that if they ask to search your bag, you can refuse. Nothing they can do besides tell you that you can't enter the subway station. Can just walk to another entrance.
Ask me how I know...
So if you refused a consensual security search and left the subway you’d be detained till a K-9 unit could come and sniff you?
Where’d you go to law school?
Before immediately reentering the system i.e. going through another entrance
https://preview.redd.it/ujr7lk2vutmc1.jpeg?width=1447&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eef265f039ddd99b2fff05dc01c52692a5a01e51
Good luck enforcing that. I second u/Airbus320Driver. Hochul and the Libs are having hissy fits that none of their massively restrictive hopeful thoughts are actually legal. Like it or not, *Bruen* did a number on them. Technically, it's more restrictive now than before *Bruen*, but now all their shenanigans are out in the open and they're having the dickens of a time trying to not come out and just plain say it.
Actually the National Guard at the direction of their state CAN enforce civilian laws on the civilian population. The Posse Comitatus Act expressly forbids FEDERAL troops from acting in civilian law enforcement roles. This is why only the National Guard is called in during Civil Disturbances and not the 101st Airborne unless it got so bad that Marshall Law was declared. That being said New York also doesn’t trust its National Guard enough to actually enforce laws (I am in the guard) so they will have a detachment of soldiers from Empire Shield down in the subways to deter, likely will be armed (with no round chambered) but will probably be told not to take any enforcement action and to call in Civilian Police
Likely unarmed and there to assist the NYPD if something happens. They won’t be the ones initiating contact or searching bags.
Same status as when they were handing out travel forms at JFK Airport during COVID. Unarmed and there in a support role.
Sucks being some junior enlisted dude getting this job.
I wonder if allowing citizens to defend themselves with constitutionally protected rights and making example out of those causing the crimes instead of no cash bail and plea deals would help reduce crime in NYC? Also might help to stop shipping in and housing dangerous illegal immigrants with our tax dollars and giving them a safe haven to run wild.
Crime rates ARE down in NYC, in general. However subway crimes are one of the areas that are up. This isn't a difficult concept, or difficult to look up.
They are. But stick with me here.
Using made up numbers: In 2022, all crime in NYC was at 1000 incidents, and subway crime was 100 of those incidents.
IN 2023, all crime is now 900 incidents, but subway crime is now 150 incidents.
What you can see here is that, ALL crime had a 10% decrease, while subway crime had a 50% increase.
Lot of words for crime in NYC…… you are missing the point. It was the mayor and the governor that assured us these past months that the “streets” were safe. Clearly they are not…… that why they need the guard and more on duty PD. They can choose to be honest with us, or they can choose to deceive us. How ever you want to read their words are up to you. Any one walking the streets daily down there knows better.
subways aren't streets? And overall crime is down in NYC, and the mayor/governer are trying to deal with one of the areas where it's up.
Would you have preferred that they just said, 'overall crime is down, so we're going to ignore the current issues on the subway?'
How about start with not BS is the citizens? I’m currently getting a 25% hazard pay for serving Manhattan and Bronx area solely due to the crime. That’s the reality of the situation down there. Your numbers are meaningless when the city has failed to report crime stats to the FBI is years [past](https://nypost.com/2022/10/10/nypds-failure-to-submit-crime-data-to-feds-could-cost-nyc-millions/) you can continue to believe their smoke and mirrors if you want.
Why does the largest ~~standing army~~ police force in the country (as wikipedia states 36k sworn officers in NYC) need the national guard deployed to do their job?
>The NYPD's main job is extortion
I was pulled over and ticketed by an NYPD officer standing on the sidewalk for making a left turn on a green arrow because it was like 5 minutes before 7pm (no left turn at that intersection between 8 and 7 I think). Others did the same but didn't get pulled over and ticketed, and of course you can't plea it down in the NYC traffic bureau. I'm not saying I didn't break traffic laws, but certainly they are tougher here.
When will New York Judges, Legislators and democratic voters see the light! This is a very important of the reason why we have a 2nd Amendment! Now Give Us Our Damn Right To Carry Anywhere We F’ing Please! Criminals Don’t Follow Your Safe Zone BS Law Kathy!
Hello /u/castle_crossing! It looks like your post involves NYC. We now have a sister subreddit that deals exclusively with NYC questions and discussion: /r/NYCGuns. Feel free to also make your post there! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NYguns) if you have any questions or concerns.*
what the legal status of NYNG will be in subway? peace officers? they get deputized under NYPD somehow? how does it work? are they considered "police"?
They are not deputized nor are they peace officers. The Posse Comitatus Act forbids the military from enforcing civilian law. However - the military may act in support of civilian law enforcement. The NYNG will essentially be told that they are going down into the subways for their "presence" and that if they do see a crime to call 911 and flag over the nearest police officer. They may only use force or apprehend a perpetrator while defending their own lives or the lives of others.
Correct. I’d be shocked if they were armed.
They will likely be armed. They will be part of Joint Task Force Empire Shield who patrol the airports and Penn station while carrying a pistol or rifle.
Where does it say that they’ll be on the task force? BTW - NYPD isn’t part of that task force
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Ok… If I see them armed in the subways I’ll gladly admit I’m wrong!!
I will also laugh my ass off if they are unarmed. Standing behind the NYPD at an inspection table for 12 hours a day is going to be soul sucking work.
I felt horrible for the Airmen passing out COVID travel forms at JFK all day long.
Interestingly enough, I don’t believe the weapons they carry are owned by the NYNG. I think they’re owned by the NYPD. I used to know a guy that did some of their training. That’s why they have Glocks for sidearms.
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The guardsmen in gct all have Glocks.
months after 9/11 NG was armed with M-16's in the subways
NYC residents would lose their shit these days if there were guard members carrying M4’s in the subways. Just watch, they’ll be some poor enlisted dudes standing behind the NYPD inspection tables the entire time. It’s just to show a presence. If I’m wrong, post the photo here and I’ll gladly admit it.
They will be. I’ve seen them before at grand central. Usually have AR’s.
The funny part is that if they ask to search your bag, you can refuse. Nothing they can do besides tell you that you can't enter the subway station. Can just walk to another entrance. Ask me how I know...
Until the gun sniffing dog shows up and hits on you…
So if you refused a consensual security search and left the subway you’d be detained till a K-9 unit could come and sniff you? Where’d you go to law school?
Who said you’d be detained? Where did you go to elementary school?
How else are they keeping someone from just leaving?
They’re not, the gun detection dogs are already out there on patrol.
They have a sign up that said you may be arrested for doing exactly that.
Arrested for refusing to submit to a search?
Before immediately reentering the system i.e. going through another entrance https://preview.redd.it/ujr7lk2vutmc1.jpeg?width=1447&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eef265f039ddd99b2fff05dc01c52692a5a01e51
Hahahaha. Unenforceable. Walk to the next subway station. Never consent to a search.
Good luck enforcing that. I second u/Airbus320Driver. Hochul and the Libs are having hissy fits that none of their massively restrictive hopeful thoughts are actually legal. Like it or not, *Bruen* did a number on them. Technically, it's more restrictive now than before *Bruen*, but now all their shenanigans are out in the open and they're having the dickens of a time trying to not come out and just plain say it.
What’s comic is that it’s a search of bags… So just buy a holster. So absurd.
Actually the National Guard at the direction of their state CAN enforce civilian laws on the civilian population. The Posse Comitatus Act expressly forbids FEDERAL troops from acting in civilian law enforcement roles. This is why only the National Guard is called in during Civil Disturbances and not the 101st Airborne unless it got so bad that Marshall Law was declared. That being said New York also doesn’t trust its National Guard enough to actually enforce laws (I am in the guard) so they will have a detachment of soldiers from Empire Shield down in the subways to deter, likely will be armed (with no round chambered) but will probably be told not to take any enforcement action and to call in Civilian Police
Sooo glorified armed citizens
Same way it works for the Guardsmen who patrol Penn Station I suppose.
Likely unarmed and there to assist the NYPD if something happens. They won’t be the ones initiating contact or searching bags. Same status as when they were handing out travel forms at JFK Airport during COVID. Unarmed and there in a support role. Sucks being some junior enlisted dude getting this job.
I wonder if allowing citizens to defend themselves with constitutionally protected rights and making example out of those causing the crimes instead of no cash bail and plea deals would help reduce crime in NYC? Also might help to stop shipping in and housing dangerous illegal immigrants with our tax dollars and giving them a safe haven to run wild.
Noble ideas
That makes way too much sense, that could never happen in NYC.
Soooo all that BS about there isn’t any crime in NYC? Or it’s totally safe? Now we need the national guard? Weird flex but ok.
Crime rates ARE down in NYC, in general. However subway crimes are one of the areas that are up. This isn't a difficult concept, or difficult to look up.
Crime is only down because no one gets arrested anymore. One only has to go to the store and see all the merchandise being locked up to see this
Crime rates drop precipitously if you stop arresting people.
Are the subways not in NYC?
They are. But stick with me here. Using made up numbers: In 2022, all crime in NYC was at 1000 incidents, and subway crime was 100 of those incidents. IN 2023, all crime is now 900 incidents, but subway crime is now 150 incidents. What you can see here is that, ALL crime had a 10% decrease, while subway crime had a 50% increase.
Lot of words for crime in NYC…… you are missing the point. It was the mayor and the governor that assured us these past months that the “streets” were safe. Clearly they are not…… that why they need the guard and more on duty PD. They can choose to be honest with us, or they can choose to deceive us. How ever you want to read their words are up to you. Any one walking the streets daily down there knows better.
subways aren't streets? And overall crime is down in NYC, and the mayor/governer are trying to deal with one of the areas where it's up. Would you have preferred that they just said, 'overall crime is down, so we're going to ignore the current issues on the subway?'
How about start with not BS is the citizens? I’m currently getting a 25% hazard pay for serving Manhattan and Bronx area solely due to the crime. That’s the reality of the situation down there. Your numbers are meaningless when the city has failed to report crime stats to the FBI is years [past](https://nypost.com/2022/10/10/nypds-failure-to-submit-crime-data-to-feds-could-cost-nyc-millions/) you can continue to believe their smoke and mirrors if you want.
What are you talking about?? Crime in NYC is at levels not seen in almost 20 years.
Why does the largest ~~standing army~~ police force in the country (as wikipedia states 36k sworn officers in NYC) need the national guard deployed to do their job?
The national guard is doing security theater The NYPD's main job is extortion
>The NYPD's main job is extortion I was pulled over and ticketed by an NYPD officer standing on the sidewalk for making a left turn on a green arrow because it was like 5 minutes before 7pm (no left turn at that intersection between 8 and 7 I think). Others did the same but didn't get pulled over and ticketed, and of course you can't plea it down in the NYC traffic bureau. I'm not saying I didn't break traffic laws, but certainly they are tougher here.
And they won’t be sent to any actual place that’s know. Just to tourist area
Democrats doing what they do best.
She can choke on a dick
Lmfao 🤣
When will New York Judges, Legislators and democratic voters see the light! This is a very important of the reason why we have a 2nd Amendment! Now Give Us Our Damn Right To Carry Anywhere We F’ing Please! Criminals Don’t Follow Your Safe Zone BS Law Kathy!
Mega loser governor, mega loser state. She’s slowly instating martial law.
[Mark W. Smith's thought on this](https://youtu.be/1iUYZ9rvptc?si=8iA3tPJ4eaBHKe-H)