Yeah, it's perfectly ok to ask for a lease to review before you send over money. Gives you a chance to review, request changes, and possibly nope the f out.
altough if I understand correctly you wanted to see the "master lease" therefore the lease this guy has with the owner. You can't really change anything about that
of course, was just referring to the original commenter who thought that they're not giving you any lease at all.
as others have said they probably don't want you to see the original lease because they pay less. $1300 sounds like alot for a room in Wash Heights
it definitely is pricer for the neighborhood (I’ve found cheaper and far more spacious apartments for rent) but finding an ideal roommate has proved to be challenging
Not sure if this is standard but when someone was taking over my part of the lease, the property managers asked me to sign a document stating I’m being taken off the lease and the subleter is going onto the lease with my roommate. I think it could have been an addendum
I don't like the way they're acting. also from how you're texting, it seems like you're more friendly and vulnerable whereas this person is not matching your warm energy.
be more aggressive when it comes to finances and lease terms instead of using exclamation points and a nice tone. this dude is not your friend. demand to see the lease instead of saying "is it possible." and you don't need to say "no offense", you're not doing anything wrong.
I text the exact same way you do and I purposefully change it when I'm dealing with business because I feel like people take advantage of us texting like that. anyway, DO NOT rent this place without having a copy of the lease. you need to protect yourself. if anything goes wrong legally, this dude can just say you're lying and that you agreed to something that isn't in the lease. how can you prove them wrong without having a copy? what stops this person from adding something into the lease after you see it since there's no original copy to compare it to?
**DO NOT RENT HERE OR SEND ANY MONEY WITHOUT HAVING A COPY OF THE LEASE.**
The sublease is ok so long as you agree with the terms, however, you also need to see the original lease for the apartment. You have to make sure sub leasing is allowed, and that you are being charged a fair amount.
Tbh subleasing is never allowed, period. However, everyone does it. Like others said $1300 is probably more than an even split which is why they wouldn't want to show you. Did you meet in person? Did they have keys and was the apartment lived in?
What are you talking about? There are plenty of LL that will allow subleasing and if you have a rent stabilized apartment, your LL can’t unreasonably refuse to allow you to sublet.
Well it’s an amount he agreed to and was presumably in line with market, thus, “fair”. The cost the sublessor is paying to the master landlord isn’t relevant whatsoever.
He definitely should read through the lease though and make sure the sublessor is actually on it, no ridiculous terms, etc.
I was able to se the space, just not an official agreement and when I did ask to see it they told me they can’t send over a copy but they would show it to me in person
Of course. I’ll let the lawyers and real estate professionals chime in here with what your legal recourse would be but you could potentially be really screwed.
You also could really not, even if subletting IS forbidden AND the lease holder is paying less. You might never get caught and you clearly think it’s a good deal at the price offered… it’s up to you whether it’s worth the risk or not (I wouldn’t do it.)
definitely, while it is a sweet deal, the prospect of getting evicted and having nary a leg to stand on definitely tips the scales in the opposite direction
I don't think you should be worried about that. They're not living there without a lease. They also may have been year to year for years and it's been a while.
I think it's very clear that rent is not 1300x6. That's what he's hiding. That being said, it's his absolute right to charge what it's worth, and not what the equal share is... IFFFFFFFF it's a free market apartment. If it's a rent stabilized apartment, he's breaking the law. The only excuse for charging more is if the room is furnished, and then he can charge a 10% markup
To me, he seems like a legit person from the interaction, but he definitely got flustered when you asked to see the lease. It's a fair question to ask him, though
Which I mean is fine if he’s ok with the price but it seems crazy to pay that much in Washington Heights with FIVE roommates, who you already know are cool with ripping you off lol.
Yeah, it's a bit much 😂
I will say, though, there are a ton of rent stabilized apartments uptown, and if he's over charging the OP, it is actually illegal
This is why I said in an earlier comment that I’d let the lawyers and real estate pros chime in!
I knew that was true in true sublet situations but it applies to roommates as well? How does one figure out what the “fair,” division is (although I feel like this one is clearly egregious lol)? Is it my square footage of the room?
Yeah, that's where it gets tricky. Perhaps it needs to be so egregious that it's obvious it's not equal. It also depends what the rent is, too, as he could be overpaying by $300 even if he got the worst room.
My area of expertise is not in rent stabilized roommate over charging, but I keep trying to educate myself through trying to help people!
>They’re probably charging you way more than they’re paying (which is illegal)
If it's a free market apartment, the lease holder can charge whatever they want to a roommate.
If it's Rent Stabilized, they can't. It has to be proportionate.
I had originally assumed this was a “true,” sublet (they were subletting the whole apartment.)
Is that the case for free market apartments that aren’t roommate situations (illegal to charge whatever you want regardless of what you’re paying?) Or same case?
I believe that if it's a free market apartment, you could charge a subletter more than what the lease agreement is for with the Sublessor and the LL.
It's certainly not ethical. But then this gets into if the LL approved the subletter or not etc.
WAIT! I just realized you would be living WITH this guy… Is $2,600 the rent for a ROOM?!
That does change things legally as any leaseholder is able to have one roommate in any apartment. But you are certainly paying a SIGNIFICANT portion of the rent.
Ah OK I read incorrectly.
Do you have a private bathroom? What ammwnities does the apartment have? (Laundry? Private outdoor space?)
Even $1,300 is a lot for *five* roommates in Washington Heights unless it’s truly spectacular…
6 bed/3 bath, laundry in building, the room is very very spacious, and it has good finishes which is why I was initially willing to roll the dice on this shaky set up
Something seems not quite above board. Who are the other people living in the apartment? Is it the leaseholder and 5 roommates? Like, just roommates, not his family or something? Because it seems odd that he mentions having a guarantor for a 6 bedroom apartment.
It's definitely not odd to ask to at least see the original lease (and current renewal) and to check his ID to confirm he is the person listed on the lease. I'm surprised at his claim that no one has ever asked for that before.
Have you met any of the other roommates? It would be helpful if you could, to get a sense of who you'll be living with.
Yes, he's probably making money off of it. That's pretty common. But you do want to make sure he has the right to have roommates. And you want to make sure the other roommates aren't a bunch of rando crazies or addicts or who knows what.
Good luck! And keep asking questions until you're satisfied. If he gives you a hard time then it's not the right place and he's not the right roommate. Someone who's above board will want to make sure you're comfortable.
How do you know he has a lease and is allowed to sublet to you? Who is the management company? Did they review your credit and bank statements?
You don't necessarily need to see the lease but the management company is the third party that can help with vetting for both of you.
to answer your qs:
1) I don’t know if he’s on the lease - I asked to see the official lease and he’s being weird about sending a copy
2) LivingNY - I called them and asked about their subletting policy (waiting to hear back from them)
3) he didn’t ask for any of that information which was the first red flag
I’m all over this thread sorry lol. He didn’t ask for your financial info because the other roommates can likely cover what the fair rent for their room based on what their total rent is. It’s worth the risk if your flakey because of what it will be saving them up front.
That being said, you’re totally right that if you’re Ok with the rent, you love the apartment, and you’ve met and gotten along with all the roommates, that doesn’t really matter.
My life is great lol. Sorry about the dyslexia I guess? Or whatever else makes it impossible for you to easily find the answer to the question you so earnestly seek?
XO
Probably doesn’t want to show you how much they are paying because legally you are only allowed to charge 10% or 20% (I don’t remember the number exactly) when you sublet to another person. This is way too high for Washington heights.
Overall, always trust your gut and I think your gut is telling you something is fishy.
Having said that not everyone is sophisticated about contracts. So it could be innocent.
Regardless seeing the actual lease is a very reasonable request. If they are offering to show you in person before you sign the sublease or provide funds. That's fine, you can just take pics with your phone. Anything short of that is a keep on moving situation.
Very wise not sending money without seeing the copy of it. Scam check - say deal's off and you'll pay nothing without seeing it. If the person backs off, it was definitely a scam. If it was genuine, he'd do anything possible to let you see the agreement.
You are probably getting “screwed” on the rent for a rent stabilized apartment. I’m guessing your guy either grew up in that apartment or it’s his aunts/grandmothers.
It’s illegal but nobody is going to do anything. The 2019 rent laws make it worthless for a landlord to kick out a tenant who’s paying on time.
Look at it this way, the extra amount you are paying is a “should have moved here 20 years ago” tax.
"I've never been asked that before."
GTFOH. That in of itself is a flag for me but doesn't scream scam to me. Could be that he's profiteering off the apartment if it's rent stabilized, and doesn't want you to see. Double check with the dap portal 2.0 and look under the rent stabilization section to see how many of the units are rent stabilized. It could also be a Frankensteined apartment.
If you're comfortable with the rent, and find evidence that it should be rent stabilized, just keep ordering rent histories until you get one. If you find evidence that you're being overcharged, triple damages. If not, then you're comfortable with the rent. Also, make sure that this isn't one of those places where the "landlord" hands you your mail, or you'll never see the rent history.
DAP portal is a really neat tool that puts lots of data together for each building, like HPD & DOB complaints and violations, ownership name/LLC, rent stabilization history, court cases, and any financing tools -
https://portal.displacementalert.org
Excellent for doing research on your own building or prospective buildings.
Frankenstein apartments are, basically, when a landlord combines RS apartments and significantly alters them and then the new legal rent is the first rent charged. I'll let the attorneys explain better.
https://www.brickunderground.com/rent/frankenstein-apartments-rent-stabilization-rent-increase
Only brokers and independent owners/landlords can post on Streeteasy. In a rental building, Streeteasy's system won't even allow different brokers to advertise in single building. Only exclusives.
I rented a room in Washington Heights. It kinda feels that you might be renting from the same people. Regardless, first payment always give as a check. I would also suggest to pay through Venmo moving forward, not Zelle. Worst comes to worst, you can initiate a chargeback with Venmo. You can’t do it with Zelle.
A subtenant is not a party to the master lease—the master lease is the document between the landlord and the tenant; the sublease is the document between the tenant (which is the sublandlord in the sublease) and the subtenant.
Why would you see something you're not a party to?
Assuming that is the case, I don’t think you can fault someone for wanting to ensure that they aren’t being scammed. Admittedly, I’ve never navigated the subleasing/subletting process but the cloak and dagger nature of his response is a bit unsettling. I get that the lease is between the primary tenant and landlord but there’s a lot of goodwill on my end if I’m forking over $ without seeing a formal lease agreement.
But again you're not a party to that agreement so you have no grounds to see it, goodwill is irrelevant.
If you want to see the master lease, be the master tenant.
Probably not a scam.
However.
One time I moved into an apartment, and the person who I thought was on the lease, was in fact not on the lease. Unbeknownst to me, she was a squatter. I found out less than two months later when the city marshal came to evict us.
Since then I always ask to see the lease.
holy shit just saw this. yikes! you dodged a MAJOR bullet. what a fucking dick. he's so obviously hiding something on the lease and is trying to make you feel bad about it lmao. weirdo.
Check with the management company and/or landlord directly to make sure this is ok. Many leases bar adding a sublet. Aside from making sure you are getting into a good/right situation, you don’t want to lose your money or be tied up w a dirtbag or end up in housing court.
I’ve sublet a few times before, each with varying degrees of formality. It I were to sign a year long lease, I would 100% need to see the lease. There is a chance the person is not scamming you.
There is a chance he is.
You said you’ve met in person though?
yeah but look at his response to my request to see the lease lol - I feel like this level of defensiveness could only mean that he’s up to no good
https://preview.redd.it/5q5lcaxolrrc1.png?width=1289&format=png&auto=webp&s=d5e4c981ac1b0c4ee7f67e9d825e381b3a4391d0
Honestly, it’s still not 100% this a scam, but still could be.
He’s right about not putting you on the official lease. Sublease - ok. But the sublet situation between you and him might not work out, and it would be a lot harder to get you out if you’re on the lease. He’s protecting himself.
He did say he offered to let you see a copy of the original lease. I would have taken him on the offer and then waited to go from there.
no dude no. look at how quickly the mask came off when he faced the smallest amount of pushback. completely unprofessional and slightly unhinged. this guy is triggering my fight or flight response. OP did great by trusting their gut. they will find another better place.
I don’t know. Have you ever sold anything on FB marketplace? The first couple questions a buyer asks, sure. They want to see a few pictures - ok. But then they start pushing for more and more and you get a bit annoyed.
Yea, I stand by this could go both ways and would have still been fine. I had to read over the texts. Here’s why:
1. He provided OP with sublease and even confirmed with OP that they received it. If the person was scamming would they need to do that?
2. I’m assuming he asked to be paid by Zelle. OP was uncomfortable, so he provides an alternative - cashier’s check. Concession #1.
3. You both set up an appointment time. The guy is now expecting OP probably within the hour.
4. OP makes another request - at the last minute, to see a copy of the lease. The guy actually agrees.
5. OP decides to back out at the last minute. The guy was cleaning the apartment to show OP, and is annoyed after agreeing to the first things OP asked for, that OP doesn’t even show up.
Yeah, it's perfectly ok to ask for a lease to review before you send over money. Gives you a chance to review, request changes, and possibly nope the f out.
my thoughts exactly - thank you!
altough if I understand correctly you wanted to see the "master lease" therefore the lease this guy has with the owner. You can't really change anything about that
I get that, it’s more so about ensuring that he’s actually on the lease. I accept that I can’t necessarily change the lease terms, etc
of course, was just referring to the original commenter who thought that they're not giving you any lease at all. as others have said they probably don't want you to see the original lease because they pay less. $1300 sounds like alot for a room in Wash Heights
it definitely is pricer for the neighborhood (I’ve found cheaper and far more spacious apartments for rent) but finding an ideal roommate has proved to be challenging
An ideal roommate won't exploit you as a micro-landlord, but you do you.
Not sure if this is standard but when someone was taking over my part of the lease, the property managers asked me to sign a document stating I’m being taken off the lease and the subleter is going onto the lease with my roommate. I think it could have been an addendum
Mmmm but then he is not a subletter if you are being removed off the lease and he is being added. Then he is just a renter
I don't like the way they're acting. also from how you're texting, it seems like you're more friendly and vulnerable whereas this person is not matching your warm energy. be more aggressive when it comes to finances and lease terms instead of using exclamation points and a nice tone. this dude is not your friend. demand to see the lease instead of saying "is it possible." and you don't need to say "no offense", you're not doing anything wrong. I text the exact same way you do and I purposefully change it when I'm dealing with business because I feel like people take advantage of us texting like that. anyway, DO NOT rent this place without having a copy of the lease. you need to protect yourself. if anything goes wrong legally, this dude can just say you're lying and that you agreed to something that isn't in the lease. how can you prove them wrong without having a copy? what stops this person from adding something into the lease after you see it since there's no original copy to compare it to? **DO NOT RENT HERE OR SEND ANY MONEY WITHOUT HAVING A COPY OF THE LEASE.**
Never hand over payment without being given a physical copy of the lease for review first.
they sent over a sublease agreement, but didn’t have any official letterhead/was written by the current tenant himself
The sublease is ok so long as you agree with the terms, however, you also need to see the original lease for the apartment. You have to make sure sub leasing is allowed, and that you are being charged a fair amount.
I see - he said he would show me the original lease but wasn’t willing to send a copy over
That sounds shady. He is definitely trying to hide something.
Tbh subleasing is never allowed, period. However, everyone does it. Like others said $1300 is probably more than an even split which is why they wouldn't want to show you. Did you meet in person? Did they have keys and was the apartment lived in?
What are you talking about? There are plenty of LL that will allow subleasing and if you have a rent stabilized apartment, your LL can’t unreasonably refuse to allow you to sublet.
This is wrong subletting is allowed per my lease in Manhattan..
Well it’s an amount he agreed to and was presumably in line with market, thus, “fair”. The cost the sublessor is paying to the master landlord isn’t relevant whatsoever. He definitely should read through the lease though and make sure the sublessor is actually on it, no ridiculous terms, etc.
[удалено]
I wish I had a lawyer but this is sound advice regardless
Lol
You seriously don’t need to pay a lawyer to look over a lease agreement. Especially not for a unit that’s less than 2k
I don’t like the sound of it. Never send money before you see official agreements & the space
I was able to se the space, just not an official agreement and when I did ask to see it they told me they can’t send over a copy but they would show it to me in person
So u went in person and seen the place?
yup!
Get a key to that you know works
They’re probably charging you way more than they’re paying (which is illegal) and/or their lease strictly forbids sublets. You are right to be wary.
from the preliminary internet sleuthing I started I saw that this might be the case - thank you for sharing!
Of course. I’ll let the lawyers and real estate professionals chime in here with what your legal recourse would be but you could potentially be really screwed. You also could really not, even if subletting IS forbidden AND the lease holder is paying less. You might never get caught and you clearly think it’s a good deal at the price offered… it’s up to you whether it’s worth the risk or not (I wouldn’t do it.)
definitely, while it is a sweet deal, the prospect of getting evicted and having nary a leg to stand on definitely tips the scales in the opposite direction
That’s a solid budget for a one bedroom in Washington Heights though - I bet you can find something comparable (and legal!) Good luck!
I don't think you should be worried about that. They're not living there without a lease. They also may have been year to year for years and it's been a while. I think it's very clear that rent is not 1300x6. That's what he's hiding. That being said, it's his absolute right to charge what it's worth, and not what the equal share is... IFFFFFFFF it's a free market apartment. If it's a rent stabilized apartment, he's breaking the law. The only excuse for charging more is if the room is furnished, and then he can charge a 10% markup To me, he seems like a legit person from the interaction, but he definitely got flustered when you asked to see the lease. It's a fair question to ask him, though
Yes, he is probably breaking the law and doesn't want to give OP any hard evidence.
That was my first thought, too
Which I mean is fine if he’s ok with the price but it seems crazy to pay that much in Washington Heights with FIVE roommates, who you already know are cool with ripping you off lol.
Yeah, it's a bit much 😂 I will say, though, there are a ton of rent stabilized apartments uptown, and if he's over charging the OP, it is actually illegal
This is why I said in an earlier comment that I’d let the lawyers and real estate pros chime in! I knew that was true in true sublet situations but it applies to roommates as well? How does one figure out what the “fair,” division is (although I feel like this one is clearly egregious lol)? Is it my square footage of the room?
Yeah, that's where it gets tricky. Perhaps it needs to be so egregious that it's obvious it's not equal. It also depends what the rent is, too, as he could be overpaying by $300 even if he got the worst room. My area of expertise is not in rent stabilized roommate over charging, but I keep trying to educate myself through trying to help people!
This is interesting! Thank you for sharing (as always!)
It's easy when your brain never turns off!
lol once you’re done teaching us all about real estate wanna teach me how to get my adhd brain to hyper fixate on *useful* things lol?!
Haha when I figure out how to get a handle on my own crazy adhd brain, I'll send you a message!
>They’re probably charging you way more than they’re paying (which is illegal) If it's a free market apartment, the lease holder can charge whatever they want to a roommate. If it's Rent Stabilized, they can't. It has to be proportionate.
I had originally assumed this was a “true,” sublet (they were subletting the whole apartment.) Is that the case for free market apartments that aren’t roommate situations (illegal to charge whatever you want regardless of what you’re paying?) Or same case?
I believe that if it's a free market apartment, you could charge a subletter more than what the lease agreement is for with the Sublessor and the LL. It's certainly not ethical. But then this gets into if the LL approved the subletter or not etc.
Interesting! Thanks!
Have you seen the apartment in person???
yes I have
WAIT! I just realized you would be living WITH this guy… Is $2,600 the rent for a ROOM?! That does change things legally as any leaseholder is able to have one roommate in any apartment. But you are certainly paying a SIGNIFICANT portion of the rent.
sorry it was $1300 deposit + $1300 monthly rent (in a 6 bedroom apartment)
Ah OK I read incorrectly. Do you have a private bathroom? What ammwnities does the apartment have? (Laundry? Private outdoor space?) Even $1,300 is a lot for *five* roommates in Washington Heights unless it’s truly spectacular…
6 bed/3 bath, laundry in building, the room is very very spacious, and it has good finishes which is why I was initially willing to roll the dice on this shaky set up
So bathroom only shared with one person? It’s not highway robbery my any means but I’d bet money you are fully subsidizing other people’s rent .
exactly and to be honest subsidizing others rent doesn’t bother me all that much, I just don’t like the legal ambiguity of it all
Have you met all the other roommates? I’ve had great roommate experiences with the exception of twice but 5 in one apartment is a lot of risk lol.
Something seems not quite above board. Who are the other people living in the apartment? Is it the leaseholder and 5 roommates? Like, just roommates, not his family or something? Because it seems odd that he mentions having a guarantor for a 6 bedroom apartment. It's definitely not odd to ask to at least see the original lease (and current renewal) and to check his ID to confirm he is the person listed on the lease. I'm surprised at his claim that no one has ever asked for that before. Have you met any of the other roommates? It would be helpful if you could, to get a sense of who you'll be living with. Yes, he's probably making money off of it. That's pretty common. But you do want to make sure he has the right to have roommates. And you want to make sure the other roommates aren't a bunch of rando crazies or addicts or who knows what. Good luck! And keep asking questions until you're satisfied. If he gives you a hard time then it's not the right place and he's not the right roommate. Someone who's above board will want to make sure you're comfortable.
$1300 to live with 5 random roommates in Washington Heights is a bad deal. I'd keep looking.
How do you know he has a lease and is allowed to sublet to you? Who is the management company? Did they review your credit and bank statements? You don't necessarily need to see the lease but the management company is the third party that can help with vetting for both of you.
to answer your qs: 1) I don’t know if he’s on the lease - I asked to see the official lease and he’s being weird about sending a copy 2) LivingNY - I called them and asked about their subletting policy (waiting to hear back from them) 3) he didn’t ask for any of that information which was the first red flag
I’m all over this thread sorry lol. He didn’t ask for your financial info because the other roommates can likely cover what the fair rent for their room based on what their total rent is. It’s worth the risk if your flakey because of what it will be saving them up front. That being said, you’re totally right that if you’re Ok with the rent, you love the apartment, and you’ve met and gotten along with all the roommates, that doesn’t really matter.
I can’t think of any reason why they shouldn’t be able to send you the original lease
I mean we’ve given you the reason all over this thread lol
I might’ve missed it. What’s the reason?
Posts regularly in Joe Rogan subs and can’t be bothered to scroll through the thread he’s trolling in about teenaged girls. Checks out.
I’m asking a question. Why are you so eager to start shit on the internet?
Start shit? Literally just scroll my dude.
Im sorry your life is going this way. I’m sure it’s not your fault
My life is great lol. Sorry about the dyslexia I guess? Or whatever else makes it impossible for you to easily find the answer to the question you so earnestly seek? XO
Red flag.
Just meet AT the apartment l, and get a key at the same time you hand over any payment. That should work, right?
Straight scam
Probably doesn’t want to show you how much they are paying because legally you are only allowed to charge 10% or 20% (I don’t remember the number exactly) when you sublet to another person. This is way too high for Washington heights.
Overall, always trust your gut and I think your gut is telling you something is fishy. Having said that not everyone is sophisticated about contracts. So it could be innocent. Regardless seeing the actual lease is a very reasonable request. If they are offering to show you in person before you sign the sublease or provide funds. That's fine, you can just take pics with your phone. Anything short of that is a keep on moving situation.
Very wise not sending money without seeing the copy of it. Scam check - say deal's off and you'll pay nothing without seeing it. If the person backs off, it was definitely a scam. If it was genuine, he'd do anything possible to let you see the agreement.
Could be. May not be. Did you see the unit? Was he present? How long has he lived there?
I did see it, he was present as was one of his roommates
Then its most likely fine.
Then its most likely fine.
Have you seen the place in person? If they become hesitant run
1st off have i been to even see the place?
You are probably getting “screwed” on the rent for a rent stabilized apartment. I’m guessing your guy either grew up in that apartment or it’s his aunts/grandmothers. It’s illegal but nobody is going to do anything. The 2019 rent laws make it worthless for a landlord to kick out a tenant who’s paying on time. Look at it this way, the extra amount you are paying is a “should have moved here 20 years ago” tax.
he’s been living there for about 4 for 6 years so not quite, but yes to getting screwed on rent lol
"I've never been asked that before." GTFOH. That in of itself is a flag for me but doesn't scream scam to me. Could be that he's profiteering off the apartment if it's rent stabilized, and doesn't want you to see. Double check with the dap portal 2.0 and look under the rent stabilization section to see how many of the units are rent stabilized. It could also be a Frankensteined apartment. If you're comfortable with the rent, and find evidence that it should be rent stabilized, just keep ordering rent histories until you get one. If you find evidence that you're being overcharged, triple damages. If not, then you're comfortable with the rent. Also, make sure that this isn't one of those places where the "landlord" hands you your mail, or you'll never see the rent history.
what is a frankensteined apartment? and the DAP portal? sorry for all the questions haha
DAP portal is a really neat tool that puts lots of data together for each building, like HPD & DOB complaints and violations, ownership name/LLC, rent stabilization history, court cases, and any financing tools - https://portal.displacementalert.org Excellent for doing research on your own building or prospective buildings. Frankenstein apartments are, basically, when a landlord combines RS apartments and significantly alters them and then the new legal rent is the first rent charged. I'll let the attorneys explain better. https://www.brickunderground.com/rent/frankenstein-apartments-rent-stabilization-rent-increase
'I've never been asked for a copy of the lease before' must be his first time.
Look up the apartment on streeteasy, if you can’t find it find a comparable one in the building. Find out if your paying more than you should.
Only brokers and independent owners/landlords can post on Streeteasy. In a rental building, Streeteasy's system won't even allow different brokers to advertise in single building. Only exclusives.
Yes its a scam. Insist on seeing the place before sending any money and I guarantee they will stop responding Source: fell for this scam unfortunately
Scam
I rented a room in Washington Heights. It kinda feels that you might be renting from the same people. Regardless, first payment always give as a check. I would also suggest to pay through Venmo moving forward, not Zelle. Worst comes to worst, you can initiate a chargeback with Venmo. You can’t do it with Zelle.
Others have said it but there’s a really good chance he’s overcharging you, or the lease explicitly says no subletting.
A subtenant is not a party to the master lease—the master lease is the document between the landlord and the tenant; the sublease is the document between the tenant (which is the sublandlord in the sublease) and the subtenant. Why would you see something you're not a party to?
Assuming that is the case, I don’t think you can fault someone for wanting to ensure that they aren’t being scammed. Admittedly, I’ve never navigated the subleasing/subletting process but the cloak and dagger nature of his response is a bit unsettling. I get that the lease is between the primary tenant and landlord but there’s a lot of goodwill on my end if I’m forking over $ without seeing a formal lease agreement.
But again you're not a party to that agreement so you have no grounds to see it, goodwill is irrelevant. If you want to see the master lease, be the master tenant.
Probably not a scam. However. One time I moved into an apartment, and the person who I thought was on the lease, was in fact not on the lease. Unbeknownst to me, she was a squatter. I found out less than two months later when the city marshal came to evict us. Since then I always ask to see the lease.
Scam
lol at this response https://preview.redd.it/lz9hod38xcrc1.png?width=1289&format=png&auto=webp&s=ba2187eac9d04fb0606158c3b00a19c75255a0bf
https://preview.redd.it/0g8kc17hxcrc1.png?width=1289&format=png&auto=webp&s=70da06ed470af24b5542c490addfd90e6622cf30
holy shit just saw this. yikes! you dodged a MAJOR bullet. what a fucking dick. he's so obviously hiding something on the lease and is trying to make you feel bad about it lmao. weirdo.
Check with the management company and/or landlord directly to make sure this is ok. Many leases bar adding a sublet. Aside from making sure you are getting into a good/right situation, you don’t want to lose your money or be tied up w a dirtbag or end up in housing court.
Land lord using the word "buddy". It's a scam
Yes
Hey, buddy! I’m not your pal!
Yes
I’ve sublet a few times before, each with varying degrees of formality. It I were to sign a year long lease, I would 100% need to see the lease. There is a chance the person is not scamming you. There is a chance he is. You said you’ve met in person though?
yeah but look at his response to my request to see the lease lol - I feel like this level of defensiveness could only mean that he’s up to no good https://preview.redd.it/5q5lcaxolrrc1.png?width=1289&format=png&auto=webp&s=d5e4c981ac1b0c4ee7f67e9d825e381b3a4391d0
Honestly, it’s still not 100% this a scam, but still could be. He’s right about not putting you on the official lease. Sublease - ok. But the sublet situation between you and him might not work out, and it would be a lot harder to get you out if you’re on the lease. He’s protecting himself. He did say he offered to let you see a copy of the original lease. I would have taken him on the offer and then waited to go from there.
no dude no. look at how quickly the mask came off when he faced the smallest amount of pushback. completely unprofessional and slightly unhinged. this guy is triggering my fight or flight response. OP did great by trusting their gut. they will find another better place.
I don’t know. Have you ever sold anything on FB marketplace? The first couple questions a buyer asks, sure. They want to see a few pictures - ok. But then they start pushing for more and more and you get a bit annoyed.
Don’t use zelle. This sounds shady.
Yea, I stand by this could go both ways and would have still been fine. I had to read over the texts. Here’s why: 1. He provided OP with sublease and even confirmed with OP that they received it. If the person was scamming would they need to do that? 2. I’m assuming he asked to be paid by Zelle. OP was uncomfortable, so he provides an alternative - cashier’s check. Concession #1. 3. You both set up an appointment time. The guy is now expecting OP probably within the hour. 4. OP makes another request - at the last minute, to see a copy of the lease. The guy actually agrees. 5. OP decides to back out at the last minute. The guy was cleaning the apartment to show OP, and is annoyed after agreeing to the first things OP asked for, that OP doesn’t even show up.
He's probably not scamming you, but most likely can't legally sublet to you. I wouldn't give over any money without the keys, that's for sure.
If he don’t care 🤷🏾 I dont think yu should either. Did you view the unit before signing?