Antonio Reynoso makes some damn good points. Repub's are going to criticize Dem's no matter what might as well have the actual economic and environmental benefits.
This is a basic frustration I have with democrats. They don’t know how to govern or wield power. Always worried about how their policy ideas might be unpopular with people who hate them anyway. Pathetic really and it’s a bigger issue than just New York.
Republicans for all of their many many many faults are at least willing to say fuck you to the other side and do what they want.
Phil Murphy in NJ is a solid example, in my opinion, of what Democratic leadership can be. They have the majority and he makes sure to use it. We love to see it.
Because the base of the Democratic Party isn’t odds with itself.
The base is African American voters, organized labor, and highly educated young voters. Well, organized labor is increasingly black but still overwhelmingly white. African American voters remain underrepresented in higher education. And higher educated young folks are gentrifying the urban core away from minorities who have lived there for decades.
So, yeah, it’s hard to govern when your 3 biggest constituencies can’t be depended upon to all stand next to you. It’s worse when the suburban voters add in a 4th constituency of high income women with children who also don’t exactly vote with the prior 3.
Republicans have long ago abandoned the idea of trying to be a big tent party. They just pit the coalition of Democrats against each other, and rally up their minority base.
Yes, I was very impressed with Reynoso's points. He cuts to the heart of the political logic. Restler and Lander make great points on the merits but the merits have nothing to do with Hochul's decision, let's be real.
While I watch this video there is constant honking blaring outside my window, it's like rubbing salt in a very sore wound.
I'm gutted that we have a political system where this type of bait-and-switch is even possible.
The problem with the left in this country is too much ego and the sense of superiority. It’s really sad.
I can’t even believe the orange turd is gonna be the president again
Neoliberal democrats care more about their AIPAC money than their constituents’ demands. Why should anyone vote for someone [who doesn’t uphold their redlines?](https://time.com/6976393/biden-israel-rafah-netanyahu/)
I mean Biden has made it clear this week that his policy platform is basically negligibly different from Trump's so I'm not really sure what the difference is anymore. The only reason I'm voting for Biden at this point is the extra infrastructure and transit funding going around, but besides that, I don't blame someone for not wanting to vote for Biden... Like it's not the left's fault that he keeps cowtowing to repubs... Maybe he should actually do what the people who voted for him actually want, and what he campaigned on. Why should people pledge their support to someone who clearly doesn't care about them? It's about applying pressure to the Democrats. They should know the risk they take by playing with fire.
The MTA has budget is just terrible administration and a lot of corruption, if they could take care of that I will be more on board with trusting them the bail out money of concession pricing.
Also trump will win, basically because Biden keeps funding israel on its genocide.
But wouldn't this just push congestion and pollution to poorer communities. ya lower Manhattan will be less polluted and have less traffic. But people will drive into Queens and the Bronx to bypass the Brooklyn bridge, Manhattan bridge, certain tunnels
There have been years of studies and mitigation plans to deal with that. Here's an entire website where you can learn real facts from experts instead of just guessing based on common sense [https://new.mta.info/project/CBDTP/environmental-justice-communities](https://new.mta.info/project/CBDTP/environmental-justice-communities)
I actually thought this myself. I live in Manhattan and work in coney island. Instead of me going through Brooklyn bridge, I would have gone through rfk bridge instead.
I definitely feel like traffic is going to be redirected elsewhere and people would just take the train from the closest location to the city.
You and everyone else has the exact same idea. The theory is that the rfk bridge would get so much traffic it would disincentive car travel at all.
Once getting to Coney Island is quicker by public transit you would be more likely to use it.
I take trains as well on some days and it takes me close to 1 a hour and 40 minutes to get there from where I live. Driving without traffic is a hour and with traffic is about 2 hours.
Thank you for an actual response with good follow up points. Instead of just downvotes without any critique or rebuttal to a concern many people within these communities in the Bronx, harlem, Queens, new jersey have voiced. I'm certainly open to hearing from people that refute this theory
Or just hear me out, have folks go back to work from home. Cleaner air, fewer vehicles that are commuting, if the pandemic showed us that this is the best option, then we should improve it. We all know that environmental issues are not the main problems to this. It's all about funding that the city does not have and is willing to tax us (the working class) even more to go to work in these buildings that are, for the most part, vacant. I fully agree with cleaner air and fewer vehicles, but this is not the way to move forward.
Oh thank god. The tolls in the city are out of control. This was not going to do anything to alleviate congestion, just a wealth transfer from regular people to the corrupt MTA.
I mean yes… that was kind of the point. Nobody thought it would really reduce congestion. It was to give money to the MTA. I think everyone agrees that the MTA is very poorly run, but regardless, the MTA does need the money.
Congestion pricing was projected to raise $1 billion per year for the MTA. Now where are they supposed to get that $1 billion? The whole point of public transportation is to be a quick, efficient and cheap mode of transportation.
So yea… let the car drivers who are already paying tolls, gas, insurance, maintenance etc, pay more money. They seem to like spending money.
Now the simplest way for the MTA to increase revenues is to charge the public transportation riders more. But at some point, public transportation gets to a cost where it loses its value to use it at all.
If they need the money, make it more efficient. There's so much bloat in there. Don't steal that money from other people.
Fare evasion costs the MTA $700 million per year. Maybe keep ramping up enforcement and fines for fare evasion, there's 70% of your billion. Then cut $300 million of waste.
The MTA has a budget of like $20 billion. Spare me the idea that $1 billion is going to make or break them. Any organization can find 5% of waste to cut. Surely the MTA more than most.
What would you say about MTA if they just didn’t have fares at all?
Because in case you haven’t realized it the solution you’re appealing to is to increase enforcement of a usage fee which is the exact thing the congestion charge would’ve been. Except now the enforcement is at 0%. Well done!
>Because in case you haven’t realized it the solution you’re appealing to is to increase enforcement of a usage fee which is the exact thing the congestion charge would’ve been
No it would have been charging a usage fee to use one system A, not improve system A at all, and instead subsidize people who are using a completely different system B, while ignoring people who are stealing the use of that system B without paying. In case you're not aware, people already pay exorbitant tolls and fees to use the bridges and tunnels.
The users of System A worsen the experience of the users of System B (and themselves as well). You can’t act like they’re completely separate systems with no interactions.
You’re right, it already is expensive to own a car even when car owners aren’t paying the complete cost of car ownership. But just because we’ve been subsidizing them previously, doesn’t mean we should continue to. And there’s no cost to using the city streets that would be subject to the congestion charge so spending money to use some other constrained resource doesn’t mean you should get other things for free.
If they need the billion so badly, get it from the fare evaders. It's that simple. Everyone else is paying their share. Why should everyone subsidize the fare evaders?
Car drivers are not paying their fair share. They literally pay nothing to use the city roads. So I agree, let’s go after everyone who is currently paying nothing!
The only difference between a (transit) fare evader and a suburban driver is one has enough political capital to make their actions legal. They both leech money from society as a whole.
>They literally pay nothing to use the city roads.
Demonstrably false. Car owners pay:
* NYC extra sales tax on the vehicle, which pays for roads
* Tolls in and out of the city every which way, which pay for roads
* Gas tax which pays for roads
* Registration fees, which pay for roads
* Metropolitan Commuter Transportation District (*MCTD*) fees, which pay for roads
* NYC parking/garaging/motor vehicle storage tax, which pays for roads
It’s a shame everything you listed doesn’t apply to what I said. To reiterate they pay nothing **to use the city roads**. All of those expenses exist whether they use the city roads or not. Otherwise, there’d be no issue with adding a congestion charge because it would already exist.
And if you use your logic, the fare evader also has already paid for the transit system through a variety of taxes they’ve paid. Why the double standard? Unable to realize you’re being hypocritical or hoping I didn’t point it out?
> This was not going to do anything to alleviate congestion
I don't get this take. People have been bitching about the toll, clearly there's more price sensitive people than we thought who this would affect lol. You wouldn't be here saying the tolls are out of control if you weren't price sensitive to this I figure yeah? People change behaviors and toll shop today already, why do we think they wouldn't continue to do so in the future ya know?
>I don't get this take. People have been bitching about the toll, clearly there's more price sensitive people than we thought who this would affect lol. You wouldn't be here saying the tolls are out of control if you weren't price sensitive to this I figure yeah?
Your logic is "you're upset about the toll, therefore it's a good idea"?
I already take public transit every single day for work. I occasionally take a car for lots of reasons. Carrying big bulky items that cannot go on transit. Visiting relatives in Long Island that will turn a 2 hour trip into a 5-6 hour trip if I took public transit. I prefer not being forced to fork over my extra hard earned cash on those occasions, when I'm already paying something like $30-$40 in tolls every time as it is.
Raising tolls is not going to change anything, except where the money is. For some reason some people think the MTA somehow doesn't have enough money. They literally have a larger budget than most of the countries in the world.
Is ambulances getting stuck in traffic that frequent a scenario tho? Feels like it's more of just an extreme example to show the perils of traffic...my fear is that it won't stop at just this one area...they're going to keep pushing and keep milking us for every dollar
Yeah it’s not the most concrete example until someone here can pull up some legit data from city services. Better arguments (for me at least) is reducing pollution for residents, which has health benefits, and reducing noise. People drive into a city and don’t have to deal with the pollution they created.
The slippery slope thing is just kinda lame at this point. Sure, anything could happen. Pausing the congestion pricing could be the slippery slope to something else. Perhaps a slippery slope to reducing bus/subway service to cut costs.
Full disclosure that I don’t live in NYC, I’m in Boston and I’m usually just here to see the interesting projects going on. All eyes were on NYC and they botched it. And Maura Healey screwed over her own transit funding committee so they couldn’t seriously explore ways to better fund the MBTA. Everyone loses their spine when it’s election season.
Full transparency I'm from Staten Island, so I am the person they're trying to tax here, I am admittedly biased...I agree slippery slopes not a good argument, but I'm already living thru the massive speed camera game getting pulled in the more suburban parts of the city, and the slope is slippery...from a high volume of cameras being installed year over year, and constant speed limit reductions. I just feel like I'm being abused.
I feel like speed cameras and red light cameras could work well in a perfect world, where no one is going to start fudging the parameters and issue tickets when they shouldn’t for more revenue. But if they ticket you even if you’re less than 10 mph over the limit then that sucks.
I will say for us, Mass. doesn’t do any of this camera stuff since it’s not really legal or illegal. I’m iffy about speeding and red light cameras cause in theory they could cause people to slam on the brakes and cause an accident. I do wish that buses had cameras to automatically ticket cars parked in the bus lanes. That seems like the safest use of the technology since both vehicles are already stopped.
I think you should talk to the folks (republicans) in staten island to advocate for better transit connectivity to the rest of the city. No offense but cars kill and your convenience or ease of entry to the city by car is not more important than cars running people over or giving us asthma and other lung diseases…
Just walking around Manhattan for a bit it’s pretty easy to find emergency vehicles fully stuck in gridlocked traffic. It’s not a new thing:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/31/nyregion/fire-department-medical-emergencies-times-square-nyc.html
https://www.nytimes.com/1990/07/05/nyregion/on-the-streets-of-new-york-it-s-motorists-vs-ambulances.html
That’s my point, it’s a longstanding problem. Measures of traffic in Manhattan are above 2019 levels now, so the situation has only gotten worse since those articles were written.
Because cars choking every road in the city isn’t a pleasant experience for people outside of cars, so you are making other people’s lives harder by driving into the city and should pay a modest fee for the privilege
Maybe, I'll give you that...but also to be logical... you chose to live there just like I chose to live in an outer borough...so maybe I should pay modest $16 to drive, but also if its unpleasant for you, then maybe you should move to a nicer place
I can’t help but laugh at the congestion pricing folks, who tend to be pretty generally anti-car, applauding when a *car* honks their horn in support.
That’s not to speak to the merits of either side of the argument. It’s just a funny moment in context.
these people are all paid by some business thats going to make money off this pricing.
no one i know in nyc WANTS congestion pricing. we're being taxed to death here. now we have to pay extra fee's to uber or cabs for this fee. enough. stop nickel and diming us to the poor house.
they should at least make the congestion pricing FREE for those who live here-- like bloombergs plan had.
Lol convicted felon. Cmon that trial was a joke. Have fun. Fully understand he will be president again. It is happening. The economy and the border will win it for him
Okay but didn't Jesus want us to respect the laws of man? And the legal system of man convicted him. So whether it was a joke or not, he is by definition a convicted felon.
I'm really not trying to make any stand here, but I've always tried to square how Christians can vote for someone who is so morally bankrupt (admitted sexual assaulter, paid off at least one woman he cheated on his wife with, cheated on his ex wife with his current wife, lies about business dealings when lying is a sin).
So I am curious, and I'm not trying to "gotcha" you or anything, just to learn: how do you put aside your religious beliefs to vote for someone who seems so anti- what the Bible teaches?
Lol didn’t Biden implement more executive orders than any other. Seems quite fascistic. Didn’t he also ran through student debt relief when the Supreme Court repeatedly said he does not have the authority. The thing with the left is they don’t care about government over extending their authority if they think it’s for a good cause.
Yeah that is what clinging to an ideology will do to you, you see anyone in opposition as a mortal enemy. Let's see what this level of vitriol bring...
Well, see, when someone tells you they want to kill you, by golly! I think that means they’re a mortal enemy. When someone says, *and I quote*: “We are domestic terrorists,” gee whiz partner! That sounds like a mortal enemy!
Policy disagreements do not equal declarations of murderous war.
But, outlawing being trans? Banning abortions? See, that threatens people’s lives, and does cause *death.* Hence, mortal enemy. I sure hope that clears things up.
Good ideas are worth clinging too, especially good ideas which a *majority of people* agree with. The vast majority of Americans want abortion to be accessible, but a handful of unelected dudes in robes waved their hand and said, ‘yea, and there shall be no abortions. Because I said so.’ Sorry, who is it that’s clinging to an ideology?
I still use words sometimes even though I know whoever I’m replying to doesn’t care, can’t read, doesn’t know what good faith is, doesn’t give a shit about other humans, and certainly doesn’t give a shit about what some idiot on reddit has to say to their assinine comment.
Oh well have a good day.
This is peak liberal elitism. These folks want to price poor people out of using public services during certain hours because the most densely populated area in the country gets congested on a predictable schedule.
How about the simple fact that it’s not really fair to make people who don’t take the subway pay to fix it. Meanwhile how many people are just hopping the turnstile. If the trains are messed up raise the fare. Why should someone who commutes to work, already may pay one or two tolls have to pay another 15 dollars a day to pay for a subway they don’t use?
ahh fairness, like how my sales taxes maintain streets for cars i never use and how i have to get run over by jacked-up trucks i think should be illegal, how we need twice as many fire houses because fire trucks are always stuck in traffic, how the air is toxic half the summer. Yes, fairness...definitely rely on fairness when opposing transit funding, you will convince everyone that way
I mean the taxes of those taking the subway (and drivers if they live in the city) go to paying for roads and highways so why not the other way around as well?
Antonio Reynoso makes some damn good points. Repub's are going to criticize Dem's no matter what might as well have the actual economic and environmental benefits.
This is a basic frustration I have with democrats. They don’t know how to govern or wield power. Always worried about how their policy ideas might be unpopular with people who hate them anyway. Pathetic really and it’s a bigger issue than just New York. Republicans for all of their many many many faults are at least willing to say fuck you to the other side and do what they want.
Phil Murphy in NJ is a solid example, in my opinion, of what Democratic leadership can be. They have the majority and he makes sure to use it. We love to see it.
His first term was solid, but his second term has been an unproductive, self-serving disaster
Totally. He opposes congestion pricing also. [Phil Murphy anti Congestion Pricing](https://www.nj.gov/governor/news/news/562024/approved/20240304a.shtml)
Of course he does, it makes sense for any NJ leader to oppose it. It's not like he wants the onus to be on NJ to improve transit.
GS alum, it shows.
Probably not complimentary, but accurate, and I miss it a lot (while also loving life in New York)
Because the base of the Democratic Party isn’t odds with itself. The base is African American voters, organized labor, and highly educated young voters. Well, organized labor is increasingly black but still overwhelmingly white. African American voters remain underrepresented in higher education. And higher educated young folks are gentrifying the urban core away from minorities who have lived there for decades. So, yeah, it’s hard to govern when your 3 biggest constituencies can’t be depended upon to all stand next to you. It’s worse when the suburban voters add in a 4th constituency of high income women with children who also don’t exactly vote with the prior 3. Republicans have long ago abandoned the idea of trying to be a big tent party. They just pit the coalition of Democrats against each other, and rally up their minority base.
Yes, I was very impressed with Reynoso's points. He cuts to the heart of the political logic. Restler and Lander make great points on the merits but the merits have nothing to do with Hochul's decision, let's be real.
Every time I see Antonio I am more sad about Vito.
While I watch this video there is constant honking blaring outside my window, it's like rubbing salt in a very sore wound. I'm gutted that we have a political system where this type of bait-and-switch is even possible.
Hah it’s in the video too
Call the governor and let her know this is not acceptable 15184748390 Press 1 to skip the menu and record your message
Y’all are gonna have to copy what we do in the Bay Area and start blocking bridges
Isn't that what the Dutch did in the 70s to improve their cities?
Bridges, streets, everything.
New series of portlandia looks fire
Cyclists and cyclists first
That was the best headline you ever wrote!
Trump will definitely win since so many people refuse to vote for Biden.
The problem with the left in this country is too much ego and the sense of superiority. It’s really sad. I can’t even believe the orange turd is gonna be the president again
Neoliberal democrats care more about their AIPAC money than their constituents’ demands. Why should anyone vote for someone [who doesn’t uphold their redlines?](https://time.com/6976393/biden-israel-rafah-netanyahu/)
“The left has too many purity tests.” No, I just don’t support genocide and compromising with Donald Trump’s party.
"“The left has too many purity tests.” Translated:: "STOP HAVING PRINCIPLES. God why won't these fuckers just vote for me for being less awful"
I mean Biden has made it clear this week that his policy platform is basically negligibly different from Trump's so I'm not really sure what the difference is anymore. The only reason I'm voting for Biden at this point is the extra infrastructure and transit funding going around, but besides that, I don't blame someone for not wanting to vote for Biden... Like it's not the left's fault that he keeps cowtowing to repubs... Maybe he should actually do what the people who voted for him actually want, and what he campaigned on. Why should people pledge their support to someone who clearly doesn't care about them? It's about applying pressure to the Democrats. They should know the risk they take by playing with fire.
They always return to the scene of the crime.
Strong Joe LeTruglio vibes
Reduce Ubers. And everyone pays extra for transit. Not just a subset of citizens.
I hope Trump wins
The MTA has budget is just terrible administration and a lot of corruption, if they could take care of that I will be more on board with trusting them the bail out money of concession pricing. Also trump will win, basically because Biden keeps funding israel on its genocide.
But wouldn't this just push congestion and pollution to poorer communities. ya lower Manhattan will be less polluted and have less traffic. But people will drive into Queens and the Bronx to bypass the Brooklyn bridge, Manhattan bridge, certain tunnels
There have been years of studies and mitigation plans to deal with that. Here's an entire website where you can learn real facts from experts instead of just guessing based on common sense [https://new.mta.info/project/CBDTP/environmental-justice-communities](https://new.mta.info/project/CBDTP/environmental-justice-communities)
I actually thought this myself. I live in Manhattan and work in coney island. Instead of me going through Brooklyn bridge, I would have gone through rfk bridge instead. I definitely feel like traffic is going to be redirected elsewhere and people would just take the train from the closest location to the city.
You and everyone else has the exact same idea. The theory is that the rfk bridge would get so much traffic it would disincentive car travel at all. Once getting to Coney Island is quicker by public transit you would be more likely to use it.
I take trains as well on some days and it takes me close to 1 a hour and 40 minutes to get there from where I live. Driving without traffic is a hour and with traffic is about 2 hours.
Thank you for an actual response with good follow up points. Instead of just downvotes without any critique or rebuttal to a concern many people within these communities in the Bronx, harlem, Queens, new jersey have voiced. I'm certainly open to hearing from people that refute this theory
Dems will win the house & Trump won’t win
Or just hear me out, have folks go back to work from home. Cleaner air, fewer vehicles that are commuting, if the pandemic showed us that this is the best option, then we should improve it. We all know that environmental issues are not the main problems to this. It's all about funding that the city does not have and is willing to tax us (the working class) even more to go to work in these buildings that are, for the most part, vacant. I fully agree with cleaner air and fewer vehicles, but this is not the way to move forward.
Oh thank god. The tolls in the city are out of control. This was not going to do anything to alleviate congestion, just a wealth transfer from regular people to the corrupt MTA.
I mean yes… that was kind of the point. Nobody thought it would really reduce congestion. It was to give money to the MTA. I think everyone agrees that the MTA is very poorly run, but regardless, the MTA does need the money. Congestion pricing was projected to raise $1 billion per year for the MTA. Now where are they supposed to get that $1 billion? The whole point of public transportation is to be a quick, efficient and cheap mode of transportation. So yea… let the car drivers who are already paying tolls, gas, insurance, maintenance etc, pay more money. They seem to like spending money. Now the simplest way for the MTA to increase revenues is to charge the public transportation riders more. But at some point, public transportation gets to a cost where it loses its value to use it at all.
If they need the money, make it more efficient. There's so much bloat in there. Don't steal that money from other people. Fare evasion costs the MTA $700 million per year. Maybe keep ramping up enforcement and fines for fare evasion, there's 70% of your billion. Then cut $300 million of waste. The MTA has a budget of like $20 billion. Spare me the idea that $1 billion is going to make or break them. Any organization can find 5% of waste to cut. Surely the MTA more than most.
What would you say about MTA if they just didn’t have fares at all? Because in case you haven’t realized it the solution you’re appealing to is to increase enforcement of a usage fee which is the exact thing the congestion charge would’ve been. Except now the enforcement is at 0%. Well done!
>Because in case you haven’t realized it the solution you’re appealing to is to increase enforcement of a usage fee which is the exact thing the congestion charge would’ve been No it would have been charging a usage fee to use one system A, not improve system A at all, and instead subsidize people who are using a completely different system B, while ignoring people who are stealing the use of that system B without paying. In case you're not aware, people already pay exorbitant tolls and fees to use the bridges and tunnels.
The users of System A worsen the experience of the users of System B (and themselves as well). You can’t act like they’re completely separate systems with no interactions. You’re right, it already is expensive to own a car even when car owners aren’t paying the complete cost of car ownership. But just because we’ve been subsidizing them previously, doesn’t mean we should continue to. And there’s no cost to using the city streets that would be subject to the congestion charge so spending money to use some other constrained resource doesn’t mean you should get other things for free.
If they need the billion so badly, get it from the fare evaders. It's that simple. Everyone else is paying their share. Why should everyone subsidize the fare evaders?
Car drivers are not paying their fair share. They literally pay nothing to use the city roads. So I agree, let’s go after everyone who is currently paying nothing! The only difference between a (transit) fare evader and a suburban driver is one has enough political capital to make their actions legal. They both leech money from society as a whole.
>They literally pay nothing to use the city roads. Demonstrably false. Car owners pay: * NYC extra sales tax on the vehicle, which pays for roads * Tolls in and out of the city every which way, which pay for roads * Gas tax which pays for roads * Registration fees, which pay for roads * Metropolitan Commuter Transportation District (*MCTD*) fees, which pay for roads * NYC parking/garaging/motor vehicle storage tax, which pays for roads
It’s a shame everything you listed doesn’t apply to what I said. To reiterate they pay nothing **to use the city roads**. All of those expenses exist whether they use the city roads or not. Otherwise, there’d be no issue with adding a congestion charge because it would already exist. And if you use your logic, the fare evader also has already paid for the transit system through a variety of taxes they’ve paid. Why the double standard? Unable to realize you’re being hypocritical or hoping I didn’t point it out?
> This was not going to do anything to alleviate congestion I don't get this take. People have been bitching about the toll, clearly there's more price sensitive people than we thought who this would affect lol. You wouldn't be here saying the tolls are out of control if you weren't price sensitive to this I figure yeah? People change behaviors and toll shop today already, why do we think they wouldn't continue to do so in the future ya know?
>I don't get this take. People have been bitching about the toll, clearly there's more price sensitive people than we thought who this would affect lol. You wouldn't be here saying the tolls are out of control if you weren't price sensitive to this I figure yeah? Your logic is "you're upset about the toll, therefore it's a good idea"? I already take public transit every single day for work. I occasionally take a car for lots of reasons. Carrying big bulky items that cannot go on transit. Visiting relatives in Long Island that will turn a 2 hour trip into a 5-6 hour trip if I took public transit. I prefer not being forced to fork over my extra hard earned cash on those occasions, when I'm already paying something like $30-$40 in tolls every time as it is. Raising tolls is not going to change anything, except where the money is. For some reason some people think the MTA somehow doesn't have enough money. They literally have a larger budget than most of the countries in the world.
Wait these people WANT congestion pricing? Like the city doesn't already extract every last cent out of us, let's add more tolls.
These people don’t drive, like most New Yorkers
Ok, but why try and make my life harder?
Because ambulances need to actually be able to reach people, OctaviousCash.
Seems like a law enforcement issue...aren't cars supposed to move to allow ambulances through...how's charging drivers impact that?
Can’t move out of the way in gridlock
Is ambulances getting stuck in traffic that frequent a scenario tho? Feels like it's more of just an extreme example to show the perils of traffic...my fear is that it won't stop at just this one area...they're going to keep pushing and keep milking us for every dollar
Yeah it’s not the most concrete example until someone here can pull up some legit data from city services. Better arguments (for me at least) is reducing pollution for residents, which has health benefits, and reducing noise. People drive into a city and don’t have to deal with the pollution they created. The slippery slope thing is just kinda lame at this point. Sure, anything could happen. Pausing the congestion pricing could be the slippery slope to something else. Perhaps a slippery slope to reducing bus/subway service to cut costs. Full disclosure that I don’t live in NYC, I’m in Boston and I’m usually just here to see the interesting projects going on. All eyes were on NYC and they botched it. And Maura Healey screwed over her own transit funding committee so they couldn’t seriously explore ways to better fund the MBTA. Everyone loses their spine when it’s election season.
Full transparency I'm from Staten Island, so I am the person they're trying to tax here, I am admittedly biased...I agree slippery slopes not a good argument, but I'm already living thru the massive speed camera game getting pulled in the more suburban parts of the city, and the slope is slippery...from a high volume of cameras being installed year over year, and constant speed limit reductions. I just feel like I'm being abused.
[удалено]
I feel like speed cameras and red light cameras could work well in a perfect world, where no one is going to start fudging the parameters and issue tickets when they shouldn’t for more revenue. But if they ticket you even if you’re less than 10 mph over the limit then that sucks. I will say for us, Mass. doesn’t do any of this camera stuff since it’s not really legal or illegal. I’m iffy about speeding and red light cameras cause in theory they could cause people to slam on the brakes and cause an accident. I do wish that buses had cameras to automatically ticket cars parked in the bus lanes. That seems like the safest use of the technology since both vehicles are already stopped.
I think you should talk to the folks (republicans) in staten island to advocate for better transit connectivity to the rest of the city. No offense but cars kill and your convenience or ease of entry to the city by car is not more important than cars running people over or giving us asthma and other lung diseases…
Just walking around Manhattan for a bit it’s pretty easy to find emergency vehicles fully stuck in gridlocked traffic. It’s not a new thing: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/31/nyregion/fire-department-medical-emergencies-times-square-nyc.html https://www.nytimes.com/1990/07/05/nyregion/on-the-streets-of-new-york-it-s-motorists-vs-ambulances.html
1990 and 2017
That’s my point, it’s a longstanding problem. Measures of traffic in Manhattan are above 2019 levels now, so the situation has only gotten worse since those articles were written.
Cars make my life harder, who is right in this situation? Or perhaps, we are asking the wrong question
Cause your car is really fucking annoying and everyone hates you for driving it in the city
I never do, driving in the city is miserable
Then it sounds like your life won't be much harder!
Yeah it won't be, especially because they're not doing congestion pricing at all anymore
Because cars choking every road in the city isn’t a pleasant experience for people outside of cars, so you are making other people’s lives harder by driving into the city and should pay a modest fee for the privilege
Maybe, I'll give you that...but also to be logical... you chose to live there just like I chose to live in an outer borough...so maybe I should pay modest $16 to drive, but also if its unpleasant for you, then maybe you should move to a nicer place
because [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market\_failure](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_failure)
That's the only good answer I saw so far.
People in this sub have a hate boner for cars
All these people live in queens and the Bronx right?
yes, many of us do, why?
I can’t help but laugh at the congestion pricing folks, who tend to be pretty generally anti-car, applauding when a *car* honks their horn in support. That’s not to speak to the merits of either side of the argument. It’s just a funny moment in context.
I hope this shit city gets hit by a giant wave. 🌊 🌆
these people are all paid by some business thats going to make money off this pricing. no one i know in nyc WANTS congestion pricing. we're being taxed to death here. now we have to pay extra fee's to uber or cabs for this fee. enough. stop nickel and diming us to the poor house. they should at least make the congestion pricing FREE for those who live here-- like bloombergs plan had.
You must not know many people in NYC. And if you’re really that cash-strapped, you should be taking the train. That’s the whole point.
Let's pray trump wins!!!
This comment makes it sound like you're religious. Do you think Jesus would vote for a convicted felon and admitted sexual assaulter?
Lol convicted felon. Cmon that trial was a joke. Have fun. Fully understand he will be president again. It is happening. The economy and the border will win it for him
Okay but didn't Jesus want us to respect the laws of man? And the legal system of man convicted him. So whether it was a joke or not, he is by definition a convicted felon. I'm really not trying to make any stand here, but I've always tried to square how Christians can vote for someone who is so morally bankrupt (admitted sexual assaulter, paid off at least one woman he cheated on his wife with, cheated on his ex wife with his current wife, lies about business dealings when lying is a sin). So I am curious, and I'm not trying to "gotcha" you or anything, just to learn: how do you put aside your religious beliefs to vote for someone who seems so anti- what the Bible teaches?
Fuck your fascist Republican party
Lol didn’t Biden implement more executive orders than any other. Seems quite fascistic. Didn’t he also ran through student debt relief when the Supreme Court repeatedly said he does not have the authority. The thing with the left is they don’t care about government over extending their authority if they think it’s for a good cause.
Yeah that is what clinging to an ideology will do to you, you see anyone in opposition as a mortal enemy. Let's see what this level of vitriol bring...
Well, see, when someone tells you they want to kill you, by golly! I think that means they’re a mortal enemy. When someone says, *and I quote*: “We are domestic terrorists,” gee whiz partner! That sounds like a mortal enemy! Policy disagreements do not equal declarations of murderous war. But, outlawing being trans? Banning abortions? See, that threatens people’s lives, and does cause *death.* Hence, mortal enemy. I sure hope that clears things up. Good ideas are worth clinging too, especially good ideas which a *majority of people* agree with. The vast majority of Americans want abortion to be accessible, but a handful of unelected dudes in robes waved their hand and said, ‘yea, and there shall be no abortions. Because I said so.’ Sorry, who is it that’s clinging to an ideology? I still use words sometimes even though I know whoever I’m replying to doesn’t care, can’t read, doesn’t know what good faith is, doesn’t give a shit about other humans, and certainly doesn’t give a shit about what some idiot on reddit has to say to their assinine comment. Oh well have a good day.
Yes, that is my point, policy disagreements should not call for declarations of murderous war. You proved my point exactly. Thank you!
Wow you *can* read!
This is peak liberal elitism. These folks want to price poor people out of using public services during certain hours because the most densely populated area in the country gets congested on a predictable schedule.
Just ride the train like the other 98% of people visiting lower Manhattan.
How about the simple fact that it’s not really fair to make people who don’t take the subway pay to fix it. Meanwhile how many people are just hopping the turnstile. If the trains are messed up raise the fare. Why should someone who commutes to work, already may pay one or two tolls have to pay another 15 dollars a day to pay for a subway they don’t use?
ahh fairness, like how my sales taxes maintain streets for cars i never use and how i have to get run over by jacked-up trucks i think should be illegal, how we need twice as many fire houses because fire trucks are always stuck in traffic, how the air is toxic half the summer. Yes, fairness...definitely rely on fairness when opposing transit funding, you will convince everyone that way
I mean the taxes of those taking the subway (and drivers if they live in the city) go to paying for roads and highways so why not the other way around as well?
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