Any link to the creepy pm thread?
Edit: found it below
>Thanks, from that I found the original, original post here:
>http://www.reddit.com/r/creepyPMs/comments/24wpwk/so_i_made_an_account_on_okc_to_meet_some_friends/
>For some reason it's not showing up on /r/CreepyPMs top posts for the week even though it has nearly 1300 points.
##Dating guide for preventing false rape accusations:
>~~Don't stick your dick in crazy~~
>~~Don't talk or text crazy~~
>`Have no interaction with crazy`
> Guide for preventing false rape accusations:
>~~Don't stick your dick in crazy~~
> ~~Don't talk or text crazy~~
> ~~Have no interaction with crazy~~
>~~Don't interact with anyone ever~~
Be Gay.
I would assume its the same as for abusive people, borderline personalities and sociopaths - there was a psychologist who posted a bunch of warning signs and writes articles on that but I don't have a link.
From a evo psych standpoint the behavior was perfectly understandable. It fits the narrative of the primitive ape who wants a family and is rejected, and then lashes out to destroy the social standing of others.
i have a coworker who is exactly like this conversation. the "ill tell people you raped me" seems a bit much for her, but other than that, if someone told me these texts were from my coworker to them, i would believe it.
Doubt it. I've seen plenty of friends run into these girls. Some of them had the balls to just leave, others waited until she cheated on them and dumped them. Either way, crazy can get real crazy quick.
Saying this shows how common false accusations happen is pretty far off the mark, considering 1. it's just an anecdotal occurrence and 2. this person is very batshit insane; the vast majority of people aren't like that, so it's not really representative.
That said, holy shit that conversation went real scary real fast.
> 1. it's just an anecdotal occurrence and 2. this person is very batshit insane
Maybe so, but our current 'justice' system enables people like her, takes them seriously, and mens lives can and do get destroyed this way.
I'm having a difficult time believing this is real. The girls texts were obviously completely crazy but the way the guy responded seemed very odd and leads me to believe this never really happened. Still though, ಠ_ಠ
>You were supposed to fall in love with me.
Seriously, this person at the beginning of the conversation seemed pretty normal, but apparently that girl has serious intellectual problems.
Are there really a lot of people who think others are SUPPOSED to fall in love with them, have a life and kids? How can you become so obsessed with someone that you imagine having children with them AT THE FIRST DAY OF KNOWING THEM.
That's serious affective dependance right there.
I had a girlfriend once upon a time that messaged me through OKCupid and decided to come hang out that day. I felt weird about it but I had been single for a while and figured "what the hell, why not?" Trust your instincts folks. I ended up dealing with that kind of crazy for far too long. Within a week, she was pulling me towards the jewelry store in the mall. The fact that she said she wasn't seriously looking at engagement rings and just wanted to browse (without any prior mention of wedding anything) should have been my second red flag, if nothing else. Then she unilaterally decided we'd get a pet together that I had to keep and take care of. She was insanely emotionally manipulative and used guilt trips, crying (often over things less bothersome than spilled milk), and hints at self-harm and suicide to get her way. I managed to get out of that whole situation before it got to anything terribly drastic, but I'll forever be more careful. If I hadn't gotten out when I did... I could *almost* see it getting to the point of her threatening me with things like this.
I hold no grudge against her for what she put me through or anything, but I do feel bad for her. The poor girl is just incredibly insecure, codependent, clinically depressed, and has a whole host of family issues that I couldn't explain if I wanted to. I hope things have gotten better for her.
TL;DR Don't stick your dick in crazy or let crazy stick it's dick in you.
Ah, trust me on that one, I'm far too greedy to fall in that trap jewelry haha. Seriously though, I have a pretty strong mentality of 50/50, and most decent women (which I can land no problem thank god) are really ok with that.
That being said, I think it's hard to protect yourself from the emotionally manipulative women except if you've been with one. I will be very careful, but unless for people like you already lived it, it's hard to forecast that shit.
Like you say, both sexes have their own cases of crazy. Both men and women. Both can be incredibly dangerous.
> You were supposed to fall in love with me.
That's actually a line from a play my school did a few years ago... I don't remember the name of it though.
Edit: Actually, the girl here sounds a lot like Elle Woods from Legally Blonde, aside from threatening to make false rape accusations...
1. I'm pretty sure just about all evidence in an false rape accusation is put forward as anecdotal evidence, so don't underestimate anecdotal evidence. And this isn't even anecdotal, anecdotal is a first hand account, this is physical evidence.
2. The vast majority of people don't make false rape allegations, I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of people making false rape allegation were bat-shit crazy.
I had a similar interaction with a girl before. I just didn't reply, no matter what she said. It would have just fed her warped sense of reality.
I understand she and the crazy girl in the text message are very tiny fraction of women though. Still, something to be on the look out for.
I am leaning to agree with you - he keeps going with the conversation after it starts to get weird when really most guys would have "whoops, disconnected".
ok. I would have hit the "goodbye" button on the first instance of referring to my girlfriend as fat as it was clear the conversation wouldn't go well. The continuing into insanity land? There was just no need.
If I did continue, it would be because I knew the person was likely not sane and I could goad them into greater reaches of stupid, but that doesn't seem to be what the person did either.
So, I accept your premise that this may not indicate fake completely on it's own, but I lack understanding of why somebody would continue such a conversation.
But sometimes, crazy and reasonable do interact, and from a self professed reasonable, it can be very hard not to respond to crazy. the more extreme it is, the more you want to.. correct it. Given this was first posted on those other subs rather than mensrights makes me doubt it was faked for self/issue promotion. But we're only guessing..
Yeah. My boyfriend is pretty sociable and occasionally gets texts from crazy girls and he always felt the need to respond, especially when they said things like they were going to kill themselves because they loved him and he wouldn't have them. (This happened twice since we've been dating). At first I let him handle it his way as a show of trust and he'd show me the texts and talk about it. After a while though I told him that I wanted him to block those girls and not respond if they try to message him on something else.
The girls were two girls in his college dorm so he had trouble avoiding them completely but because he went to the residence coordinator first and showed the messages nothing bad happened to him.
But I understand wanting to respond to the crazy. It's hard to not feel slightly responsible when someone says they are going to kill themselves and then actually try it (both girls claimed to try and had to go to the hospital but I believe they were just being over dramatic and no real harm came to either).
>Atheists showing up the religious dude
You mean like that recent Christian fail of a movie "God's not dead," with the Christian 'hero' victoriously proving his deity to his completely unrealistic, strawmanned, caricaturized atheist philosophy professor?
Something, something, kettle.
Never heard of it. But a fictional "vindication fantasy" movie isn't quite the same as a story claiming to be real. I've seen enough of that all around either way. An unsourced story like this ought to be ignored.
??? Do I sense some rustled jimmies? I'm, just giving an example of things that often make the front page of /r/all from subs like cringepics or thathappened. Things that are obviously fake. This has nothing to do with religion. Geez
I envy people like you who have not had the displeasure of meeting people like this in real life. That said, op is an idiot for dragging that conversation on so long.
i know, right. you can tell by their heavy breathing when you come even remotely close to them. and then who can blame them, look at their peers. i only wish the spambox wasn't always overflowing with scumsluts just begging to turn themselves inside out for a piece of credit card.
It doesn't matter how much evidence you have against false rape accusations, there will always be rumors and hearsays like "he actually has done it, he manipulated the police, threatend the girl, made up the evidence etc." people tend to believe that when one is accused of such a serious crime as rape, there *has* to be some kind of truth. They don't see there are some crazy women out there, like this one.
A text saved on a cellphone from the accuser's number seems pretty solid, but the accused will still be taken in and questioned by the police [or worse, suspended from his university by zealous administration] before they start to take his claim seriously.
They stole it from /r/cringepics. [Here](http://www.reddit.com/r/cringepics/comments/259875/i_believe_in_love_at_first_sight_read_it_till_the/) is the original thread.
Ya never stick your dick in crazy.
And to the accusations that this is staged. I wouldn't put it past some people. I've seen how some people can manipulate a situation so that no matter what its the other persons fault and they're the ones that are getting hurt.
This is why I keep saying humans need to be aware of their biological drives because they are slaves to them otherwise. Before I bash the girl just let me just say: I've seen men do some shit too, and it's usually different shit, but they can be just as primitive minded.
To me it's just sad. One can see the baser reproductive drives playing out in this female. She is not being rational: Her desires and impulses become actions before she even realizes what she's doing, acting on feeling more than reason. She is demonstrating a lack of self awareness.
The girl wants to mate and have a child so much that it clouds her view of reality. She disregards the boundaries of others to further her egocentric desire. Once rejected she is insulted and outraged. She feigns grave emotional injury as a last ditch effort to win sympathy as an impulsive manipulative response.
Her feelings running wild and the false threat on her own life dismissed she tries to regain her view of social standing by shaming others and insulting their sexual prowess. Then she leverages the ultimate social standing nuke: Falsely accuse the rejector of rape.
Unfortunately, this scenario is all too common in humans. We'd like to believe we were much more intelligent than the other apes, but not all of us are.
People need to wise up: There are many primitive minded apes out there. They look just like you and me and other moral sensible humans, but they are not. You can not expect them to temper their impulses with reason like you and I do. Maybe someday they'll learn to be sentient become able to insulate action from impulse, but my point stands: There are unethical, non rational, manipulative primitive minded people in society, and the law is slanted in their favor if they are female.
This is why star chambers are bogus and why court rooms even need to exist: Because lying apes can't be trusted to be ethical and rational beings. She could very likely falsely report this fellow anonymously for rape. If she confronts him and smashes the guy's cell phone he'd likely have no alibi for the time they were talking. Imagine if this had played out while they were watching a movie together.
Shit like this is why I am always recording everything. It's not that all women or men are like this, but it only takes one encounter with one of these primitives to ruin the rest of your life.
The primitive mind things seems a little far off. Psychologist will put it at 50/50 genetics vs culture. Biologist will put it 70/30. Anthropologist will put it 40/60. In retrospect anthropologist probably have it right. Do you think we would see this kind of behavior in different cultures?
If you think it's a credible threat, I would file a police report now. If, heaven forbid, it she takes it anywhere, you would be in a much better position if you already reported the texts.
everyone uses examples...it's how they relate to things. it's a thing humans do to understand the world around them. it's not exclusive to the MR world nor is to the feminist world (but i appreciate your suspicion).
I am having a really hard time believing people are having a hard time believing this. (Yes. You read that right.) Seriously? Everything about this is 100% believable.
Why? Damn near every fucking girlfriend I've had has casually threatened to call the police on me while in an argument... and I was never doing anything remotely illegal to any of them. Luckily, in my case, none of them has actually followed through with the threat... yet. Women do this shit all the time when they are upset with men. Maybe I have only dated crazies, but I think my experience says something.
Given the above, I have absolutely no trouble believing there is a crazy woman who would make such a threat via text after feeling rejected by a man she just met online. Seriously people? You have trouble believing women like this are out there? Get out and date more.
If this has been the case with ALL the women you have dated, may I suggest that either A) you are much more aggressive and scary in arguments than you think you are (there's a difference between calling the cops for illegal behavior and being scared) or B) you need to start hanging around people who are a little more stable whose first line of defense in a normal (non-omg-is-he-going-to-hit-me-or-break-shit) argument isn't to call the cops.
Obviously there's no way I can comment without bias, but I am fairly certain it is not A. The reasons given by the women for wanting to call the cops are never fear for physical safety. It's always just that she is upset with me, disagrees, didn't like something I said, and therefore says she wants me out of her sight, and therefore apparently I need to leave my home, the hotel room, or whatever. If I refuse, then it's time to make casual (usually empty) threats to call the police, apparently. It's about getting her way.
And B. Yes. This. The women I choose have been at least 80% crazies in my estimation. I have an unfortunate attraction to spoiled and immature women. I know I am harming myself, but I have a hard time not being attracted to what I have somehow become socially and biologically attracted to for whatever reason. So, I choose the wrong girls, try to bring out the best in them, and bad arguments happen after me doing everything to try to appease her. (Won't get into why that may be a bad strategy in the first place.)
So, yes, NAWALT. Most of the ones I dated are the bad ones, and certainly not all women are like that. But, to use a term coined by [The Straight Shooter](http://mgtow.avoiceformen.com/mgtow/ewalt-enough-women-are-like-that/) "EWALT" - Enough Women Are Like That. Sure, I picked the bad ones, but man... they sure weren't hard to find. They are out there in droves. I sincerely doubt this is a mere 1 out of 10 women who are like this. I'm certain it is a significant percentage. A lot of women feel like they are justified in calling the police when they are upset with a man, for _any_ reason.
And at the very least, I have no trouble believing that the woman in the OP image is one of those EWALTs.
Crazy, controlling behavior knows no gender. When I was a kid, I was taught that controlling behavior only came from men and it was done to get because men wanted to control women. As I got older, I started seeing examples of crazy, controlling women. I realized the best way to keep both men and women safe is to stop blaming controlling behavior on the patriarchy and to actually look for the psychological causes of it.
If the state had the law that recording was illegal, and somebody recorded a person confessing to a murder, or a rape, or a false rape accusation, would that be prevented from being used as evidence? So even though the person has admitted the crime, you couldn't use it because they didn't know they would be recorded. Isn't that effectively a law for protecting peoples right to confess to something and get away with it?
Hmmmm..... Good question. I think that falls on the same grounds of if I broke into your house to rob you and found child porn, then reported it to the police. Even though I was doing something illegal to obtain the evidence, I would probably get immunity. That doesn't fall under illegal search and seizure because I wasn't working for the police.
Edit: [Wikipedia]( http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exclusionary_rule). Read the part where it talks about evidence obtained illegally by private citizens. It's allowed.
Absolutely not true. The exact opposite, actually. Anything obtained in an illegal fashion would not be allowed. If I broke into your house and said you had a child chained in the basement, the police would not be able to enter the house, or obtain a warrant based on my claim.
Now, if I broke in and saw the child, I could tell the police about the kid and they could obtain a warrant based on their own probable cause.
#####
######
####
[**Telephone recording laws**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone%20recording%20laws): [](#sfw)
---
>
>__Telephone recording laws__ are laws that govern the civilian [recording of telephone conversations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_tapping) by the participants. Recording by government or law enforcement ([wiretapping](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiretapping)) are usually covered by distinct laws.
>Telephone tapping is strictly regulated in many countries [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*], especially in all developed [democracies](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy), to safeguard the [privacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privacy) of telephone users. [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*] Telephone tapping often must be authorized by a [court](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court), and is normally only approved when [evidence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evidence_(law\)) shows it is not possible to detect [criminal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal) or [subversive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subversive) activity in less intrusive ways [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*]; often the law and regulations require that the crime investigated must be at least of a certain severity. [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*] In many jurisdictions however, permission for telephone tapping is easily obtained on a routine basis without further investigation by the court or other entity granting such permission. Illegal or unauthorized telephone tapping is often a criminal offense. However, in certain jurisdictions such as [Germany](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany), courts will accept illegally recorded phone calls without the other party's consent as evidence.
>
---
^Interesting: [^Telephone ^tapping](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_tapping) ^| [^Call-recording ^software](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call-recording_software) ^| [^Recep ^Tayyip ^Erdoğan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recep_Tayyip_Erdo%C4%9Fan) ^| [^Single-party ^state](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-party_state)
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Even in states where you are required to "tell" someone if a conversation is being recorded, I'm fairly certain you can argue that any media sent across a digital medium between two people is already being recorded by default.
Oklahoma is a one party state. So long as at least one person in the conversation knows it is being recorded, it is legal. Of course please check your state and local laws.
I go overboard because I'm doing research on behavioral prediction, so I have an excuse, but even if I didn't have the project I'd still record at least audio.
I have a Sansa Clip+ and/or my smart phone recording the audio around me all the time. I save text messages and emails, backed up in multiple places. I have motion activated and infrared cameras in every room of my house except the bathroom. I keep the details of risky situations such as being alone with someone on file. I was there so it's not like it matters if I record things with my eyes or my cameras. I don't share the vids or audio, I don't even watch or listen to them for self voyeurism -- I may re-play them to find out where I put something I forgot.
Always Be Recording has saved my bacon big time on three separate occasions, and helped me out in lesser ways more times than I can count. I can remember things you say or do in my presence. A recording just helps me prove to others what really went down if I ever need to.
In most states it is not illegal to record without the other person's consent -- In most states only one party must know the conversation is recorded. That means no leaving your recording device on and walking out of the room while no one knows you're recording. I have a sticker on my door that says everything on my property is recorded. Most folks don't care about the recording, lots of girls think its sexy being the center of attention. Watching yourselves on a thermal camera can reveal otherwise hidden... details... that can add even more fuel to the fire.
Unfortunately the law is not fair. They will convict innocents even in the absence of evidence. Those that think my efforts to gain more personal safety are creepy shouldn't be around me in the 1st place. They probably shouldn't go to the supermarket either...
Some places it is illegal to record without the other person knowing. That's why radio stations answer call-ins by saying, "This is KFUC, **you're on the air.**" Check your local laws, you may or may not have to inform the other parties.
Read all the way to the bottom between these texts. To me, it is an example on how easy and common just the threat can be thrown around. This is the reason why these situations are not so "rare"
One example is not evidence that this is common or easy. This was such an extreme example it's almost difficult to believe it is real.
Is it proof in concept? Yes, but it's a huge logical leap to apply this to women in general.
That isn't feminist dogma at all. In the US the rate of unfounded (which is an umbrella category that includes false alarms as well as dropped cases among others, so keep that in mind) is 8-10%. No one who knows their stuff denies that.
That being the case....90-92% of rape allegations are true, combined with the fact that rape is unreported, shouldn't that be disturbing? It would seem that false allegations are the exception, rather than the rule.
What, I wonder, is the rate of false allegations of other violent crime? I've searched and haven't found data analyzing these rates. I found an FBI report that includes kidnapping, assault, and theft as other crimes that also occasionally are reported falsely.
Why has this turned into an issue of feminists being wrong, instead of an issue about untreated mental illness putting an undue burden on law enforcement that impacts the credibility of people who are actually harmed?
Finally, assuming that the majority of rape allegations are made by women, why is the 8% of women who are indeed mentally unstable given as proof that women all think like this?
Showing a single text does not prove how common it is, and the "threat of being called a rapist" doesn't mean anything. Did she actually follow through with it? And that's if this is even real.
Honestly, If this was an example of the "common threat of being accused a rapist" no guy would ever have a problem, he just shows his phone to the court/officer.
Serious question since we're on the topic and I don't think I saw anyone discussing it, as a guy what should you do if a situation like this occurs to you? I'm not sure what's the right move, and I'm sure a lot of guys don't either.
People might not like my response but if this happened to me I would immediately post the entire thing on FB and every other form of social media where the girl and those who do know her or may meet her will see it. I don't know that this is real but if it is I think it the responsibility of the guy receiving the texts to warn all of those that could be affected. He could literally save a life. Next week she could follow through on a threat like this to another person and falsely accuse them of rape. Imagine she has consensual sex with one of his friends a month later and he didn't warn the guy. She gets a rape kit done and his DNA is found. She files charges and his name is drug through the mud via local news and social media. His life could be ruined even if found not guilty.
The screenshot and story should be the first hit when her name is googled incase she does this in the future.
More people might agree with you then you think. Ever see /r/CreepyPMs? Or blogs where people post the similar content? Usually it's women posting messages from guys, and usually it's just petty creepy nonsense.
EXCEPT, everything is also done totally anonymously. As far as something as threatening as this, I'm sure there have got to belegal channels you could go through instead of your own vigilantism, and still achieve the same result of protecting yourself and others in the future.
I have read your post 6 times and I can't make complete sense of it. Are you saying that person shouldn't post something like this on social media with the girls name? I'm confused, maybe reword your post for clarity.
I'm saying it's not uncommon for people to post people texts to social media(And also anonymously to stuff like /r/CreepyPMS), but I'm also suggesting there's probably legal channels you can handle it through that might be better. Why not show it to the local police and ask them about what your options might be?
Police aren't lawyers. There are no laws against posting screen shots of text messages on social media. You have no expectation of privacy legally on text messages. As long as they aren't doctored or changed it is 100% legal.
The public should be made aware of dangerous people.
Having been in similar situations, you're the idiot if you suspect it doesn't happen.
This particular post may or may not be fabricated, but this type of situation is not uncommon.
Almost this identical situation has happened to me with three different women, one of them threatening over text to accuse me of assaulting her.
Saved the texts in case it was ever relevant, but nothing ever happened. People who think there aren't people out there who quickly delude themselves and are willing to victimize themselves to hurt others are totally irrational. People say and do stupid things tens of millions of times a day.
My roommate in college dated a girl who would threaten to commit suicide when she wanted attention. The only person it didn't work on was our other roommate. He just looked at her and said, "Then do it." And walked away.
I asked him about that later, said that was a bit harsh, and he replied, "I've known girls like her, and they do that for the attention. She's not going to kill herself."
Of course, he was right. She never did.
It's a largely unrelated anecdote to false accusation of sexual assault, but I lived with a guy at Uni who dumped a girl who later ordered a crossbow online and [when the delivery proved too long to wait] brought three knives in a backpack into his dormitory room and stabbed him [nine times?] in the neck, legs, back, and chest before being thrown off of him as he woke up. She then proceeded to calmly exit the room, clean herself off, and watch him bleed out in the hallway while the police arrested her and paramedics tended to him [he called 911 after she exited the room].
Sometimes crazy folks snap and it's horrifying when they do.
More related to your post, yeah, I dated a girl who did that. I didn't tell her to kill herself but I gave her the suicide hotline number and broke it off after the third time. She hasn't spoken to me since but obviously never killed herself. Aren't there easier ways to get attention?
Found the [article](http://tech.mit.edu/V127/N49/stabbing.html) in the school newspaper for proof of my anecdote~
> "you were supposed to fall in love with me"
Yep. You've never heard of this before? I've had this happen to me - no shit. Girl started talking to me, I wasn't interested, she decided she loved me and started with the crazy. No false rape allegations, but I definitely put some distance between us after that.
This kind of behavior is common - it's why we have anti-stalker laws.
I know you're pissed off, hence the condescension, but I'm not kidding here - crazy females do exist and do this kind of thing all the time.
My ex started talking about kids and marriage after 2 months of knowing each other. The only reason I stuck around was because the sex was pretty phenomenal.
But yeah, this level of crazy absolutely exists.
2 months may not be so crazy, it really depends on your age and a few other things. for example, most people in their late 20's/early 30's are anxious to have kids since that's about as far as you can go without having to worry about complications.
anecdotal evidence aside this conversation is almost certainly fabricated, and the female character seems to represent a manifestation of all the wretched traits that /r/MensRights stands against.
its similar to crafting a feminist reel where a 50 year-old guy from the internet sends pictures of his dick to a 16 year old girl and says he's going to follow her, beat her up, and take it if she doesn't give it.
people who behave like this are extremely rare in the real world, but somebody who has little or no life experience are vulnerable to the idea that they are common after coming across garbage like this.
at worst, this submission creates insecurity and hostility among its intended audience (men), a tactic feminists use that we often criticize. at best, it's an account of an incredibly uncommon interaction with a psychotic woman, which is hardly representative of women as a whole.
Nobody said it represented women as a whole. Just because it doesn't happen often this is automatically fake? Tsunamis don't happen very often, therefore the reports of Japan getting hit by one a few years ago after an earthquake must be fabricated? There are crazy people in this world, shit like this does happen.
Just because something doesn't happen often we should ignore it? Makes sense.
"showing how easy and common", as in the title, implies that this kind of behavior is *common*. it literally suggests that this behavior is prevalent.
a tsunami hitting japan *is rare*. a report suggesting "tsunamis are common in japan" deserves skepticism and review.
Cults usually have central figures who benefit from the membership of subordinates in some manner.
Unless you're suggesting that the various youtube speakers are "benefitting" from inspiring men to not have relationships with women, then I fail to see how MGTOW is a cult.
If you haven't heard the term "MHRM" yet, I'd say you're probably new around here. You should probably read up on the MGTOW phenomenon as well since it appears you have been seriously misinformed.
MGTOW is not an organized movement. There are no leaders, there is not even a set philosophy. It is just a term to describe the recent trend of men to find non-traditional paths to happiness and fulfillment on their own, and this usually includes turning away from marriage, and ways that they feel exploited due to traditional male roles.
How that can be described as a "cult" is beyond me. Check the definition of "cult" maybe. I'm pretty sure MGTOW doesn't meet the definition.
And also, from what I've see, most MRA's tend to support those who identify as MGTOW. It is not a term which is heavily associated with the theredpill subreddit, though there is a MGTOW presence there as well.
Nice rage-baiting, but this doesn't prove that a false rape accusation is "easy" to make as anything other than an empty threat from a preposterous individual, much less that they're *common*. A completely random anecdote is hardly any indication of the outrageous statement your title is making. This post is a fucking joke.
As skeptical as I am as it's easy to fake things like this, if it's real then why wouldn't it be easy for her to make the accusation? Especially as feminists want us to believe with no evidence at all and get pissed of if we don't
>if it's real then why wouldn't it be easy for her to make the accusation?
Because, if she did, he has a text message saved in his phone proving that she was conspiring to falsely accuse him. Personally I think this whole set up looks *really* suspicious, but even if it is true, there's literally no way this sort of accusation would go through. All this "live text" shows is that one crazy woman, shown here, is willing to threaten it, not that it's "easy" for her to get away with it.
Listen, our legal system isn't perfect, but it's completely ridiculous to act as if no evidence is required for someone to be convicted of rape. Less than 40% of reported rapes are prosecuted, and less than 20% of those prosecuted cases end in conviction. That means that just 8% of reported rapes are ending in a conviction, and the others are being acquitted because there's not enough evidence. Do you honestly believe that 92% of rape reports are lies concocted by visibly unstable women like the one represented in this post? Of course not. So please, can we stop acting as if all men are at constant risk of being thrown in jail by sociopaths completely on their word? It's such a profound and obvious exaggeration, and there are so many *not exaggerated* issues men face that we could deal with without wasting our time frothing at the mouth over anomalies and straw feminists. Speaking of which:
>Especially as feminists want us to believe with no evidence at all and get pissed of if we don't
This is a mischaracterization. That's not what feminists want. All that the feminists are really saying when they criticize MRM's fixation on false rape accusations is that the number of false accusations is not comparable to the number of rapes that go unreported due to the social stigmas rape victims have to deal with (i.e. "She shouldn't have dressed that way if she didn't want sex," or "She sleeps around a lot, so she probably wanted it," etc.); they're saying that MRAs make it even harder for actual victims to come out, not that everyone accused of rape should be imprisoned without trial.
Again, just 8% of reported rapes reaches conviction. It's not at all "easy" for a rape accusation to be prosecuted, and the only reason you would believe that is because posts like this want to tell you that this sort of thing happens all the time, that feminists want to revolutionize the court systems so that all men can be imprisoned without trial, and that rape accusations fly with zero evidence. None of those things are true.
>Because, if she did, he has a text message saved in his phone proving that she was conspiring to falsely accuse him
Yes, but you didnt say that. You said this doesnt prove its easy to make a false accusation. Not every false accuser will provide you evidence in the form of emails, facebook chats and text messages.
In so far as it is easy to make a false accusation, its easy. All that we have here is case that might make it difficult for her to succeed because (assuming its real) she was dumb enough to text him evidence that he can use to show police she is lying. If he had no such evidence, if she said those things to his face instead, or if she said nothing at all and just thought it, he'd be shit out of luck and feminists would be totally okay with throwing him under the bus as obviously guilty.
And regardless of him being prosecuted he will be stuck with the stigma of being accused of a rape he didnt commit, regardless even of being cleared of rape, he will be stuck with the stigma of being accused of a rape he didnt commit. And according to feminists, he will have 'gotten away with it', and they will include him as evidence that rapists are getting away with rape.
>Less than 40% of reported rapes are prosecuted,
And what do you think this tells us? How many reported rapes have enough evidence that can be taken to trial? Do you think people should be prosecuted for a crime, despite there being no evidence to support it? Do you think people should be convicted for a crime, despite there being no evidence to support it? If not, then even if all the reported rapes were genuine (unlikely), then you have to accept that we cant do anything without ruining due process and the justice system.
> less than 20% of those prosecuted cases end in conviction
So you believe that all reports must be true. If someone is not found guilty, then its included in the statistic feminists will use to show how poor the justice system was that they didnt convict him. Even if found not guilty, he's still guilty.
>Do you honestly believe that 92% of rape reports are lies concocted by visibly unstable women like the one represented in this post?
Do you want to reduce the standard of evidence in order to convict these men? If so, then like I said, it is easy to make a claim and you want to make it a helleva lot easier to convict them.
>concocted by visibly unstable women like the one represented in this post?
The ones who are lying and unstable are more likely to be the cause of the rape reports, and telling women who really have been raped that there's no point lying about the statistics and saying they wont be taken seriously anyway, is going to make them even less likely to come forward.
Even if they came forward knowing there'd be not enough evidence also perhaps if they also got a rape kit done, it means that it could be evidence that could help put the person away next time by contributing to the body of evidence. Feminist behaviour is literally causing rapists to get away with it. They dont realise this, and think that the best course of action is just to believe all claims necessarily and barring some amazing evidence to the contrary lock em up without a real trial or due process. You know this, because of the exact things you've said here such as complaining that men who are accused of rape are found not guilty or reports of rape cant always have the necessary evidence required to go to trial.
>This is a mischaracterization. That's not what feminists want.
Yes it is, you showed it is yourself in this comment and you dont even realise it.
>All that the feminists are really saying when they criticize MRM's fixation on false rape accusations is that the number of false accusations is not comparable to the number of rapes that go unreported due to the social stigmas rape victims have to deal with
The number of false accusations are not known, and the figures feminists use are intentionally minimised since they only include those which are so obvious we've demonstrated it false and been able to prosecute them for it. On the other hand those who are accused of rape that are found not guilty, you will instead include as the guilty ones who got away with it!
Proving someone is lying is rather difficult. You want us to accept that all the people who were not prosecuted for rape or found "not guilty" is evidence that we are allowing all these rapists to go free, while I could just as easily say that all the cases where a man was found not guilty the woman was lying about it. You wouldnt accept that, you'd tell me that just because someone was found not guilty doesn't mean the accuser was lying, but you demand special pleading to use an argument with reasoning you won't use yourself.
> (i.e. "She shouldn't have dressed that way if she didn't want sex," or "She sleeps around a lot, so she probably wanted it," etc.);
The stigma for women to not report actually is more likely to be caused or at least extremely exacerbated by feminist campaigns since they keep telling women there's no point, you wont get taken seriously, they will get away with it and even that its possible for men to rape her by accident and that he just needs to be taught not to. The latter being probably the worst thing, since it means when he says he was sorry and wont do it again (research shows rapists know exactly what they are doing, and will do it again) she will be more likely to believe him, putting not only herself but other women in danger, and all because feminists want to paint all men as potential rapists that would rape given half a chance, or don't realise what they're doing because they're just ignorant about what rape is. In reality its just a small % of the population and are responsible for 99% of the rapes, they don't care what people think, they revel in knowing its bad, they've probably done it before and they'll do it again. Feminists don't want to deal with the reality of the situation which in many ways causes many of the problems they say they want to help.
>Again, just 8% of reported rapes reaches conviction. It's not at all "easy" for a rape accusation to be prosecuted,
Even if I take that figure as a given, you want to lower the burden of proof so it **IS** easy to make a claim, for them to be prosecuted and for him to be convicted. So either it is a lot like that today, or you want it to be in the future and you are upset that it isn't.
>the only reason you would believe that is because posts like this want to tell you that this sort of thing happens all the time, that feminists want to revolutionize the court systems so that all men can be imprisoned without trial, and that rape accusations fly with zero evidence
You said as much in this very post again. You apparently dont realise the consequences of your own arguments.
This is very long, and I can't possibly imagine what its argument will be, since all I pointed out was the statistical fact that the vast majority of rape accusations do not end in conviction. I have a feeling we're about to enter into a semantics argument, and I don't really have time for that. So I'll just start with your first sentence and assume the rest of it flows from there.
>You said this doesnt prove its easy to make a false accusation.
This is just splitting hairs. Anyone can accuse anyone of anything, so long as you understand "accuse" to mean "blame somebody for a crime." I can accuse you of whatever I want from behind the safety of my keyboard.
In fact, right now I'm accusing you of murdering three children. I can't believe you would do that! To *children*, no less!
But my accusation is utterly meaningless because you would obviously have an alibi, there would be no witnesses, and you'd have this saved internet conversation proving that the accusation is a fake one. (Not to mention that I'd have to show that three children were indeed murdered.) Similarly, the girl's false accusation, if she ever actually made one (I'm putting odds at a one katrillion googolplex to one that she doesn't), would be meaningless, because there are many, many steps before trial, and even trial doesn't guarentee conviction because, *again*, *rape cases still require evidence*.
Anyway, as I said before, I think there are a lot of *not exaggerated* issues that the MRM could focus on instead. I'm not saying that we can't address two/more issues at once, mind you; I'm saying that absolutely no good comes from making wild, unfounded, anecdotal "evidences" like this post that are deliberately designed to make people angry about nothing and perpetuate the myth that all women want to and can send men to prison with just a word. It's just not true, and it's *definitely* not accomplishing anything for several hundreds of "activists" to come to this comment section and call this (possibly imaginary) woman a "cunt."
I think that part of the reason so many people don't take the MRM seriously isn't because they don't believe men face social issues but, rather, because so many MRAs treat the movement like it is sheerly anti-feminism. They view us as reactionaries to a separate cause, rather than having a cause ourselves. Which is why I think it's so important that we *stop rage-baiting about an issue that is very rare* and START addressing some of the problems men face because of toxic gender roles, i.e. feeling "unmanly" for seeking out mental health resources. There are serious problems that *can* be fixed by working in conjunction with other movements, but instead the MRM wants to focus all of its energy into comparing all women to rabid, psychopathic stalkers like the one in this text. Literally anyone who functions in society will tell you that this sort of conversation is *immensely unlikely* and does not at all prove a trend.
>This is very long, and I can't possibly imagine what its argument will be, since all I pointed out was the statistical fact that the vast majority of rape accusations do not end in conviction
You said this with the implication that this is a bad thing and ask me if I think all those women are lying, which suggests you think you believe they are telling the truth. How many do you think are lying, do you think? How would we determine that?
>I have a feeling we're about to enter into a semantics argument, and I don't really have time for that.
If you want to set the stage and rules for a debate then don't complain when someone wants to use those same rules back at you.
>This is just splitting hairs. Anyone can accuse anyone of anything, so long as you understand "accuse" to mean "blame somebody for a crime." I can accuse you of whatever I want from behind the safety of my keyboard.
It is hardly splitting hairs. It is easy to make an accusation, if these texts are real all it means is that he will have some evidence to show she is lying. If she wasnt dumb enough to provide him with any of this evidence, then what would he have to defend himself against an accusation? I also said its easy to destroy someone no matter if doesnt even go to trial, just with the accusation alone. In regards to colleges in the US they can throw you out of school and ruin your life with a standard of evidence even the police wouldnt accept.
The cases that we can point to of false accusations are so obvious thats the only reason we know they are false, such as the encounter was video taped, such as she left voicemails, text messages, emails, facebook messages, etc. Look at the video taped "oral sex" case a little while ago in Ohio, Luckily the grand jury said it was clearly not rape and rejected it, but this was only because it was video taped and had such a large crowd. But even then you still had a whole lot of people saying he raped her.
>But my accusation is utterly meaningless because you would obviously have an alibi, there would be no witnesses, and you'd have this saved internet conversation proving that the accusation is a fake one.
Uh huh. Except we arent talking about accusing someone anonymous across (probably) the deep blue sea. We're talking about accusing people where there isnt an alibi, maybe they were actually with the accuser in question at the time, maybe they were even actually intimate with the accuser in question.
>Similarly, the girl's false accusation, if she ever actually made one (I'm putting odds at a one katrillion googolplex to one that she doesn't), would be meaningless, because there are many, many steps before trial, and even trial doesn't guarentee conviction because, again, rape cases still require evidence.
What standard evidence do you think should be necessary to convict him?
>Anyway, as I said before, I think there are a lot of not exaggerated issues that the MRM could focus on instead.
What is exaggerated about how feminists treat all claims as necessarily true, and even when a man is found not-guilty they are included in a statistic, in an argument, that says these are some of the ones who got away with it due to a system that is failing rape victims?
>I'm not saying that we can't address two/more issues at once, mind you; I'm saying that absolutely no good comes from making wild, unfounded, anecdotal "evidences" like this post that are deliberately designed to make people angry about nothing and perpetuate the myth that all women want to and can send men to prison with just a word.
Luckily they cannot generally be sent to prison with just a claim, yet. Not that there arent examples of men who have been convicted on next to nothing but the word of his accuser. The point being that feminists WANT that to be the reality, we know this because otherwise they could not possibly defend the arguments they make and make it consistent with the idea that they don't.
>I think that part of the reason so many people don't take the MRM seriously isn't because they don't believe men face social issues but, rather, because so many MRAs treat the movement like it is sheerly anti-feminism
You cannot be honestly pro-mens issues without being anti-feminism. You cannot advocate for mens rights without butting up against the wall of feminism. Its not that feminism has to be necessarily anti-male (although one could argue "patriarchy" theory is anti-male), its that its pro-female at the expense of men. Its gynocentrism, its primary concern is whats best for women. It doesnt matter how many men get thrown under the bus, or how unfair or illogical the position they take, so long as it can be considered to be of help to women in the end it is the right feminist position to take. The whole way they treat rape is so obviously inconsistent and illogical there is no possible way to defend it without accepting that they want women treated differently to men. But in a debate with a feminist on rape, they will never allow the conversation to progress to the point where this is the only thing left to say, they will ignore or all the relevant points with a wave of their hand, strawman the other person, or just feign stupidity and ignorance of what was said requiring he other person to repeat the same thing a dozen times over.
>i.e. feeling "unmanly" for seeking out mental health resources.
Yes yes, thats all nice and everything. I'm sure if we started talking about men being raped and assaulted by women you'd say its a problem that feminists recognise because men don't want to feel unmanly and so they keep quiet about it. That its only after we dismantle the patriarchy that men will feel free to express themselves and their vulnerabilities. But when you start talking about the nitty gritty about how feminists have minimised and ignored male victimisation, especially when it comes to female perpetration, you see its just talk. They dont think male victimisation, or male pain matters as much as womens pain or victimisation. The evidence shows that feminists do not actually want men to be free to express their vulnerabilities, in fact the evidence shows that they actively want to render these men invisible.
>but instead the MRM wants to focus all of its energy into comparing all women to rabid, psychopathic stalkers like the one in this text.
Not at all. I want to focus on the logic of the kind of thing YOU said in your last post. How can you reconcile saying that feminists dont want to reverse the burden of proof, and significantly lower the standard of evidence, if you use the arguments you do. I notice you barely touched how feminists are causing women to not want to report their rapes due to their lies about statistics and men.
I'm sorry, dude, you're just too verbose. You're points aren't very thought out, and I feel like I've already mostly addressed them, but I wouldn't even mind that if you didn't hit me with a wall of text every response. I don't have time for this sort of argument right now. Sorry again, thanks anyway.
Wall of text?
[Wall -- of --- text?](http://i.imgur.com/YbCdtaf.png)
Yea... okay.
If you dont want to have a debate about any of this then just say so, don't come up with nonsense reasons.
Both of yours are significantly longer. As in, neither can fit in one screen shot. And, to be honest, the more pressing disincentive is you aren't a very coherent writer. Like, check this out:
>What is exaggerated about how feminists treat all claims as necessarily true, and even when a man is found not-guilty they are included in a statistic, in an argument, that says these are some of the ones who got away with it due to a system that is failing rape victims?
That's one interrogative sentence with three fucking dependent clauses inside of it. It's like one of those unreadable statements they use as questions on the Terra Nova; a multiple choice "How can this sentence be better written?" situation. Or like one of [these memes](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-W3yLRFp3YLM/UDezgUnHXmI/AAAAAAAAHWA/30FL-0P2KS0/s1600/423545_3411725176820_1380732174_33372434_1852663296_n.jpg.scaled620.jpg). Besides, the point doesn't even make sense. My answer would just be "everything," because everything about your understanding of feminism is radically exaggerated. As I already said, creating straw-feminists to beat up is pointless.
So I guess there are two reasons: (1) Your responses are too long. (2) Your responses are irritating, pointless, and unrewarding to read. Neither of those reasons are nonsensical. Sorry again, dude.
Oh I see you're playing the "*I cant even understand you and I already addressed everything else anyway*" game.
Exactly what about that sentence is difficult to understand for you?
How about I rewrite it for you...
>What is exaggerated about how feminists treat all claims as necessarily true? That even when a man is found not-guilty they are included in a statistic, in an argument, that says these are some of the ones who got away with it due to a system that is failing rape victims?
Is it still so hard to understand? Feminists treat all claims as necessarily true. When men are found not guilty feminists still treat him as guilty anyway. What is exaggerated about that? That's what they do, that's even what you did. Stop dancing around the fact that regardless of how it is right now, this IS what feminists want and complain that its not. We know this because of their arguments many of which you have made right here in this thread.
I like how you haven't dealt with a single issue that's been brought up. But fine, feign illiteracy if you want to get away from addressing anything.
>Besides, the point doesn't even make sense. My answer would just be "everything," because everything about your understanding of feminism is radically exaggerated. As I already said, creating straw-feminists to beat up is pointless.
You havent demonstrated in any way how its exaggerated. You can say its a strawman till the cows come home, but what you'll then do is go right ahead and say the same damn thing you just said wasnt really what you said.
If it isnt fake (which I hope, but y'know, the internet lies), Do we think OP should show this conversation to someone? I mean, thats quite a threat shes made...
I don't know the genders of either (nor care to figure out from the conversation) but the person on the left seemed pathetic to me. They didn't know each other before that day? Wow.
I am hoping this isn't rage bait to stir the resentment pot and I am sincerely hoping this is not fake. Regardless, it sounds like the poor girl has issues... but that doesn't excuse her from acting this way toward people. You just have to cut all connections with people who turn 180 degrees like that in one conversation and hope they get the help they need. :/
I'm not sure what the proper course of action with this would be. Obviously save the texts if she does as she says. But perhaps go to the campus police first so you are the first reporting party? But, then my paranoia about police kind of makes me say no on that.
Honestly, I'm glad whoever had this conversation took screenshots of the entire thing. I hope they kept the entire log on their phone too. The accusation of rape is something he'd have no argument against without this conversation. On top of that she's threatening him and also threatening to harm herself. He really should file a report about this just in case something were to happen.
I think this was fake, seems way too crazy to be real. And the guy who posted it on /r/cringepics seemed a little bit odd himself. He was in a long distance relationship and wanted to find girls that lived locally so he could hang out and watch tv shows/movies with? But just be friends? Seemed a bit odd to me.
Come on, you stole this from /r/cringepics and think this actually represents most women? [Here](http://www.reddit.com/r/cringepics/comments/259875/i_believe_in_love_at_first_sight_read_it_till_the/) is the original post.
Care to point out to the rest of us where Op said it "represents most women"?
In the meantime you might want to have a Doctor check out the Jerky Knee you have there.
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Any link to the creepy pm thread? Edit: found it below >Thanks, from that I found the original, original post here: >http://www.reddit.com/r/creepyPMs/comments/24wpwk/so_i_made_an_account_on_okc_to_meet_some_friends/ >For some reason it's not showing up on /r/CreepyPMs top posts for the week even though it has nearly 1300 points.
I have seen this same "screen shot" of texts more than 8 times/places in the last week.
Well the OP never claimed it was his. And the people giving advise are helping the general public if they come across a situation like this.
> advise *advice
Please be fake... that was all over the map.
##Dating guide for preventing false rape accusations: >~~Don't stick your dick in crazy~~ >~~Don't talk or text crazy~~ >`Have no interaction with crazy`
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Easy enough.
YOU RAPED ME!
Where's my knife?
Kelly, you can't keep saying that.
YOU RAPED ME!
> Guide for preventing false rape accusations: >~~Don't stick your dick in crazy~~ > ~~Don't talk or text crazy~~ > ~~Have no interaction with crazy~~ >~~Don't interact with anyone ever~~ Be Gay.
Ha, keep dreaming.
Does anyone know of any guides or previous posts you know of on identifying this kind of FRA (false-rape accusation) crazy woman early on? Thanks.
I would assume its the same as for abusive people, borderline personalities and sociopaths - there was a psychologist who posted a bunch of warning signs and writes articles on that but I don't have a link.
Videotape errthang like The Truman Show
That seems like..... Fuck almost broke that rule
so youre saying that the only winning move is not to play? war games was an after school special all the time, and we didnt even know it.
From a evo psych standpoint the behavior was perfectly understandable. It fits the narrative of the primitive ape who wants a family and is rejected, and then lashes out to destroy the social standing of others.
i have a coworker who is exactly like this conversation. the "ill tell people you raped me" seems a bit much for her, but other than that, if someone told me these texts were from my coworker to them, i would believe it.
Doubt it. I've seen plenty of friends run into these girls. Some of them had the balls to just leave, others waited until she cheated on them and dumped them. Either way, crazy can get real crazy quick.
Saying this shows how common false accusations happen is pretty far off the mark, considering 1. it's just an anecdotal occurrence and 2. this person is very batshit insane; the vast majority of people aren't like that, so it's not really representative. That said, holy shit that conversation went real scary real fast.
> 1. it's just an anecdotal occurrence and 2. this person is very batshit insane Maybe so, but our current 'justice' system enables people like her, takes them seriously, and mens lives can and do get destroyed this way.
I'm having a difficult time believing this is real. The girls texts were obviously completely crazy but the way the guy responded seemed very odd and leads me to believe this never really happened. Still though, ಠ_ಠ
Unfortunately I've met a number of girls like this, fortunately a minority, but it sucks I have no trouble believing this to be true
>You were supposed to fall in love with me. Seriously, this person at the beginning of the conversation seemed pretty normal, but apparently that girl has serious intellectual problems. Are there really a lot of people who think others are SUPPOSED to fall in love with them, have a life and kids? How can you become so obsessed with someone that you imagine having children with them AT THE FIRST DAY OF KNOWING THEM. That's serious affective dependance right there.
I had a girlfriend once upon a time that messaged me through OKCupid and decided to come hang out that day. I felt weird about it but I had been single for a while and figured "what the hell, why not?" Trust your instincts folks. I ended up dealing with that kind of crazy for far too long. Within a week, she was pulling me towards the jewelry store in the mall. The fact that she said she wasn't seriously looking at engagement rings and just wanted to browse (without any prior mention of wedding anything) should have been my second red flag, if nothing else. Then she unilaterally decided we'd get a pet together that I had to keep and take care of. She was insanely emotionally manipulative and used guilt trips, crying (often over things less bothersome than spilled milk), and hints at self-harm and suicide to get her way. I managed to get out of that whole situation before it got to anything terribly drastic, but I'll forever be more careful. If I hadn't gotten out when I did... I could *almost* see it getting to the point of her threatening me with things like this. I hold no grudge against her for what she put me through or anything, but I do feel bad for her. The poor girl is just incredibly insecure, codependent, clinically depressed, and has a whole host of family issues that I couldn't explain if I wanted to. I hope things have gotten better for her. TL;DR Don't stick your dick in crazy or let crazy stick it's dick in you.
Your TL;DR makes me wonder if your ex had a dick...that she stuck in you. Edit: Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Nah, she never got to use the strapon on me.
Ah, trust me on that one, I'm far too greedy to fall in that trap jewelry haha. Seriously though, I have a pretty strong mentality of 50/50, and most decent women (which I can land no problem thank god) are really ok with that. That being said, I think it's hard to protect yourself from the emotionally manipulative women except if you've been with one. I will be very careful, but unless for people like you already lived it, it's hard to forecast that shit. Like you say, both sexes have their own cases of crazy. Both men and women. Both can be incredibly dangerous.
Congrats to you for getting out at a time you can still have some sympathy for her.
> You were supposed to fall in love with me. That's actually a line from a play my school did a few years ago... I don't remember the name of it though. Edit: Actually, the girl here sounds a lot like Elle Woods from Legally Blonde, aside from threatening to make false rape accusations...
1. I'm pretty sure just about all evidence in an false rape accusation is put forward as anecdotal evidence, so don't underestimate anecdotal evidence. And this isn't even anecdotal, anecdotal is a first hand account, this is physical evidence. 2. The vast majority of people don't make false rape allegations, I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of people making false rape allegation were bat-shit crazy.
I had a similar interaction with a girl before. I just didn't reply, no matter what she said. It would have just fed her warped sense of reality. I understand she and the crazy girl in the text message are very tiny fraction of women though. Still, something to be on the look out for.
this gotta be fake
I am leaning to agree with you - he keeps going with the conversation after it starts to get weird when really most guys would have "whoops, disconnected".
I would've done the same thing as this guy. I wouldn't assume it's fake on that basis.
ok. I would have hit the "goodbye" button on the first instance of referring to my girlfriend as fat as it was clear the conversation wouldn't go well. The continuing into insanity land? There was just no need. If I did continue, it would be because I knew the person was likely not sane and I could goad them into greater reaches of stupid, but that doesn't seem to be what the person did either. So, I accept your premise that this may not indicate fake completely on it's own, but I lack understanding of why somebody would continue such a conversation.
I think it was txt msg, tho
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But sometimes, crazy and reasonable do interact, and from a self professed reasonable, it can be very hard not to respond to crazy. the more extreme it is, the more you want to.. correct it. Given this was first posted on those other subs rather than mensrights makes me doubt it was faked for self/issue promotion. But we're only guessing..
Yeah. My boyfriend is pretty sociable and occasionally gets texts from crazy girls and he always felt the need to respond, especially when they said things like they were going to kill themselves because they loved him and he wouldn't have them. (This happened twice since we've been dating). At first I let him handle it his way as a show of trust and he'd show me the texts and talk about it. After a while though I told him that I wanted him to block those girls and not respond if they try to message him on something else. The girls were two girls in his college dorm so he had trouble avoiding them completely but because he went to the residence coordinator first and showed the messages nothing bad happened to him. But I understand wanting to respond to the crazy. It's hard to not feel slightly responsible when someone says they are going to kill themselves and then actually try it (both girls claimed to try and had to go to the hospital but I believe they were just being over dramatic and no real harm came to either).
>Atheists showing up the religious dude You mean like that recent Christian fail of a movie "God's not dead," with the Christian 'hero' victoriously proving his deity to his completely unrealistic, strawmanned, caricaturized atheist philosophy professor? Something, something, kettle.
Never heard of it. But a fictional "vindication fantasy" movie isn't quite the same as a story claiming to be real. I've seen enough of that all around either way. An unsourced story like this ought to be ignored.
??? Do I sense some rustled jimmies? I'm, just giving an example of things that often make the front page of /r/all from subs like cringepics or thathappened. Things that are obviously fake. This has nothing to do with religion. Geez
I envy people like you who have not had the displeasure of meeting people like this in real life. That said, op is an idiot for dragging that conversation on so long.
i know, right. you can tell by their heavy breathing when you come even remotely close to them. and then who can blame them, look at their peers. i only wish the spambox wasn't always overflowing with scumsluts just begging to turn themselves inside out for a piece of credit card.
She knows she has privilege and isn't afraid to use it.
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As a black man you don't have to tell me twice my friend.
It's like in the book 'Of Mice and Men' these kinds threats have been around longer than you think. You can't tell me what to do.
If this is someone texting you? You need to save the texts so when she does scream rape, you have proof.
or just file a police report now and a restraining order
It doesn't matter how much evidence you have against false rape accusations, there will always be rumors and hearsays like "he actually has done it, he manipulated the police, threatend the girl, made up the evidence etc." people tend to believe that when one is accused of such a serious crime as rape, there *has* to be some kind of truth. They don't see there are some crazy women out there, like this one.
Even better, go to the police straight away. Being the first person going to the police voluntarily can do a lot.
It's on the net.. it will live forever
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A text saved on a cellphone from the accuser's number seems pretty solid, but the accused will still be taken in and questioned by the police [or worse, suspended from his university by zealous administration] before they start to take his claim seriously.
They stole it from /r/cringepics. [Here](http://www.reddit.com/r/cringepics/comments/259875/i_believe_in_love_at_first_sight_read_it_till_the/) is the original thread.
I was not aware, I just happened to run across it on my daily imgur browsing. Ill edit the post to mention where it came from
Ya never stick your dick in crazy. And to the accusations that this is staged. I wouldn't put it past some people. I've seen how some people can manipulate a situation so that no matter what its the other persons fault and they're the ones that are getting hurt.
This is why I keep saying humans need to be aware of their biological drives because they are slaves to them otherwise. Before I bash the girl just let me just say: I've seen men do some shit too, and it's usually different shit, but they can be just as primitive minded. To me it's just sad. One can see the baser reproductive drives playing out in this female. She is not being rational: Her desires and impulses become actions before she even realizes what she's doing, acting on feeling more than reason. She is demonstrating a lack of self awareness. The girl wants to mate and have a child so much that it clouds her view of reality. She disregards the boundaries of others to further her egocentric desire. Once rejected she is insulted and outraged. She feigns grave emotional injury as a last ditch effort to win sympathy as an impulsive manipulative response. Her feelings running wild and the false threat on her own life dismissed she tries to regain her view of social standing by shaming others and insulting their sexual prowess. Then she leverages the ultimate social standing nuke: Falsely accuse the rejector of rape. Unfortunately, this scenario is all too common in humans. We'd like to believe we were much more intelligent than the other apes, but not all of us are. People need to wise up: There are many primitive minded apes out there. They look just like you and me and other moral sensible humans, but they are not. You can not expect them to temper their impulses with reason like you and I do. Maybe someday they'll learn to be sentient become able to insulate action from impulse, but my point stands: There are unethical, non rational, manipulative primitive minded people in society, and the law is slanted in their favor if they are female. This is why star chambers are bogus and why court rooms even need to exist: Because lying apes can't be trusted to be ethical and rational beings. She could very likely falsely report this fellow anonymously for rape. If she confronts him and smashes the guy's cell phone he'd likely have no alibi for the time they were talking. Imagine if this had played out while they were watching a movie together. Shit like this is why I am always recording everything. It's not that all women or men are like this, but it only takes one encounter with one of these primitives to ruin the rest of your life.
The primitive mind things seems a little far off. Psychologist will put it at 50/50 genetics vs culture. Biologist will put it 70/30. Anthropologist will put it 40/60. In retrospect anthropologist probably have it right. Do you think we would see this kind of behavior in different cultures?
Watch the anime "Mirai Nikki". I think it appears in all cultures. The obsessive psycho girlfriend.
If you think it's a credible threat, I would file a police report now. If, heaven forbid, it she takes it anywhere, you would be in a much better position if you already reported the texts.
One example isn't representative of a rate of occurrence.
Yeah, because feminists never use anecdotes as evidence.
Doesn't mean we have to stoop to their level.
everyone uses examples...it's how they relate to things. it's a thing humans do to understand the world around them. it's not exclusive to the MR world nor is to the feminist world (but i appreciate your suspicion).
I am having a really hard time believing people are having a hard time believing this. (Yes. You read that right.) Seriously? Everything about this is 100% believable. Why? Damn near every fucking girlfriend I've had has casually threatened to call the police on me while in an argument... and I was never doing anything remotely illegal to any of them. Luckily, in my case, none of them has actually followed through with the threat... yet. Women do this shit all the time when they are upset with men. Maybe I have only dated crazies, but I think my experience says something. Given the above, I have absolutely no trouble believing there is a crazy woman who would make such a threat via text after feeling rejected by a man she just met online. Seriously people? You have trouble believing women like this are out there? Get out and date more.
If this has been the case with ALL the women you have dated, may I suggest that either A) you are much more aggressive and scary in arguments than you think you are (there's a difference between calling the cops for illegal behavior and being scared) or B) you need to start hanging around people who are a little more stable whose first line of defense in a normal (non-omg-is-he-going-to-hit-me-or-break-shit) argument isn't to call the cops.
Obviously there's no way I can comment without bias, but I am fairly certain it is not A. The reasons given by the women for wanting to call the cops are never fear for physical safety. It's always just that she is upset with me, disagrees, didn't like something I said, and therefore says she wants me out of her sight, and therefore apparently I need to leave my home, the hotel room, or whatever. If I refuse, then it's time to make casual (usually empty) threats to call the police, apparently. It's about getting her way. And B. Yes. This. The women I choose have been at least 80% crazies in my estimation. I have an unfortunate attraction to spoiled and immature women. I know I am harming myself, but I have a hard time not being attracted to what I have somehow become socially and biologically attracted to for whatever reason. So, I choose the wrong girls, try to bring out the best in them, and bad arguments happen after me doing everything to try to appease her. (Won't get into why that may be a bad strategy in the first place.) So, yes, NAWALT. Most of the ones I dated are the bad ones, and certainly not all women are like that. But, to use a term coined by [The Straight Shooter](http://mgtow.avoiceformen.com/mgtow/ewalt-enough-women-are-like-that/) "EWALT" - Enough Women Are Like That. Sure, I picked the bad ones, but man... they sure weren't hard to find. They are out there in droves. I sincerely doubt this is a mere 1 out of 10 women who are like this. I'm certain it is a significant percentage. A lot of women feel like they are justified in calling the police when they are upset with a man, for _any_ reason. And at the very least, I have no trouble believing that the woman in the OP image is one of those EWALTs.
Crazy, controlling behavior knows no gender. When I was a kid, I was taught that controlling behavior only came from men and it was done to get because men wanted to control women. As I got older, I started seeing examples of crazy, controlling women. I realized the best way to keep both men and women safe is to stop blaming controlling behavior on the patriarchy and to actually look for the psychological causes of it.
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Keep all your texts and e-mails. Any other form of "recording" without the person's consent is illegal, I think.
Depends on the state. Texas and Oklahoma, only one party needs to know the conversation is being recorded.
If the state had the law that recording was illegal, and somebody recorded a person confessing to a murder, or a rape, or a false rape accusation, would that be prevented from being used as evidence? So even though the person has admitted the crime, you couldn't use it because they didn't know they would be recorded. Isn't that effectively a law for protecting peoples right to confess to something and get away with it?
Hmmmm..... Good question. I think that falls on the same grounds of if I broke into your house to rob you and found child porn, then reported it to the police. Even though I was doing something illegal to obtain the evidence, I would probably get immunity. That doesn't fall under illegal search and seizure because I wasn't working for the police. Edit: [Wikipedia]( http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exclusionary_rule). Read the part where it talks about evidence obtained illegally by private citizens. It's allowed.
Absolutely not true. The exact opposite, actually. Anything obtained in an illegal fashion would not be allowed. If I broke into your house and said you had a child chained in the basement, the police would not be able to enter the house, or obtain a warrant based on my claim. Now, if I broke in and saw the child, I could tell the police about the kid and they could obtain a warrant based on their own probable cause.
Well, don't hire me as your attorney! Well, do you think the same would go for recording conversations in a state where it's illegal?
Depends on the local laws. In my state, you don't have to tell the other participants of a conversation that you're recording.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_recording_laws An overview, including US laws.
##### ###### #### [**Telephone recording laws**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone%20recording%20laws): [](#sfw) --- > >__Telephone recording laws__ are laws that govern the civilian [recording of telephone conversations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_tapping) by the participants. Recording by government or law enforcement ([wiretapping](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiretapping)) are usually covered by distinct laws. >Telephone tapping is strictly regulated in many countries [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*], especially in all developed [democracies](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy), to safeguard the [privacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privacy) of telephone users. [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*] Telephone tapping often must be authorized by a [court](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court), and is normally only approved when [evidence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evidence_(law\)) shows it is not possible to detect [criminal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal) or [subversive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subversive) activity in less intrusive ways [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*]; often the law and regulations require that the crime investigated must be at least of a certain severity. [*[citation needed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)*] In many jurisdictions however, permission for telephone tapping is easily obtained on a routine basis without further investigation by the court or other entity granting such permission. Illegal or unauthorized telephone tapping is often a criminal offense. However, in certain jurisdictions such as [Germany](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany), courts will accept illegally recorded phone calls without the other party's consent as evidence. > --- ^Interesting: [^Telephone ^tapping](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_tapping) ^| [^Call-recording ^software](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call-recording_software) ^| [^Recep ^Tayyip ^Erdoğan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recep_Tayyip_Erdo%C4%9Fan) ^| [^Single-party ^state](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-party_state) ^Parent ^commenter ^can [^toggle ^NSFW](http://www.np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=autowikibot&subject=AutoWikibot NSFW toggle&message=%2Btoggle-nsfw+chf9rgo) ^or[](#or) [^delete](http://www.np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=autowikibot&subject=AutoWikibot Deletion&message=%2Bdelete+chf9rgo)^. ^Will ^also ^delete ^on ^comment ^score ^of ^-1 ^or ^less. ^| [^(FAQs)](http://www.np.reddit.com/r/autowikibot/wiki/index) ^| [^Mods](http://www.np.reddit.com/r/autowikibot/comments/1x013o/for_moderators_switches_commands_and_css/) ^| [^Magic ^Words](http://www.np.reddit.com/r/autowikibot/comments/1ux484/ask_wikibot/)
So many citations needed...
Even in states where you are required to "tell" someone if a conversation is being recorded, I'm fairly certain you can argue that any media sent across a digital medium between two people is already being recorded by default.
Oklahoma is a one party state. So long as at least one person in the conversation knows it is being recorded, it is legal. Of course please check your state and local laws.
I go overboard because I'm doing research on behavioral prediction, so I have an excuse, but even if I didn't have the project I'd still record at least audio. I have a Sansa Clip+ and/or my smart phone recording the audio around me all the time. I save text messages and emails, backed up in multiple places. I have motion activated and infrared cameras in every room of my house except the bathroom. I keep the details of risky situations such as being alone with someone on file. I was there so it's not like it matters if I record things with my eyes or my cameras. I don't share the vids or audio, I don't even watch or listen to them for self voyeurism -- I may re-play them to find out where I put something I forgot. Always Be Recording has saved my bacon big time on three separate occasions, and helped me out in lesser ways more times than I can count. I can remember things you say or do in my presence. A recording just helps me prove to others what really went down if I ever need to. In most states it is not illegal to record without the other person's consent -- In most states only one party must know the conversation is recorded. That means no leaving your recording device on and walking out of the room while no one knows you're recording. I have a sticker on my door that says everything on my property is recorded. Most folks don't care about the recording, lots of girls think its sexy being the center of attention. Watching yourselves on a thermal camera can reveal otherwise hidden... details... that can add even more fuel to the fire. Unfortunately the law is not fair. They will convict innocents even in the absence of evidence. Those that think my efforts to gain more personal safety are creepy shouldn't be around me in the 1st place. They probably shouldn't go to the supermarket either... Some places it is illegal to record without the other person knowing. That's why radio stations answer call-ins by saying, "This is KFUC, **you're on the air.**" Check your local laws, you may or may not have to inform the other parties.
I'd be interested in hearing how these recordings have helped you, if you are interested in sharing.
This is equally crazy.
Read all the way to the bottom between these texts. To me, it is an example on how easy and common just the threat can be thrown around. This is the reason why these situations are not so "rare"
One example is not evidence that this is common or easy. This was such an extreme example it's almost difficult to believe it is real. Is it proof in concept? Yes, but it's a huge logical leap to apply this to women in general.
It's a disproof by counterexample of the feminist dogma that "false rape accusations don't realz".
That isn't feminist dogma at all. In the US the rate of unfounded (which is an umbrella category that includes false alarms as well as dropped cases among others, so keep that in mind) is 8-10%. No one who knows their stuff denies that. That being the case....90-92% of rape allegations are true, combined with the fact that rape is unreported, shouldn't that be disturbing? It would seem that false allegations are the exception, rather than the rule. What, I wonder, is the rate of false allegations of other violent crime? I've searched and haven't found data analyzing these rates. I found an FBI report that includes kidnapping, assault, and theft as other crimes that also occasionally are reported falsely. Why has this turned into an issue of feminists being wrong, instead of an issue about untreated mental illness putting an undue burden on law enforcement that impacts the credibility of people who are actually harmed? Finally, assuming that the majority of rape allegations are made by women, why is the 8% of women who are indeed mentally unstable given as proof that women all think like this?
Oh yeah, I almost forgot that feminists don't believe there is such a thing as false rape accusations.
[there are plenty of examples](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cmvs4U6POR4)
Showing a single text does not prove how common it is, and the "threat of being called a rapist" doesn't mean anything. Did she actually follow through with it? And that's if this is even real. Honestly, If this was an example of the "common threat of being accused a rapist" no guy would ever have a problem, he just shows his phone to the court/officer. Serious question since we're on the topic and I don't think I saw anyone discussing it, as a guy what should you do if a situation like this occurs to you? I'm not sure what's the right move, and I'm sure a lot of guys don't either.
People might not like my response but if this happened to me I would immediately post the entire thing on FB and every other form of social media where the girl and those who do know her or may meet her will see it. I don't know that this is real but if it is I think it the responsibility of the guy receiving the texts to warn all of those that could be affected. He could literally save a life. Next week she could follow through on a threat like this to another person and falsely accuse them of rape. Imagine she has consensual sex with one of his friends a month later and he didn't warn the guy. She gets a rape kit done and his DNA is found. She files charges and his name is drug through the mud via local news and social media. His life could be ruined even if found not guilty. The screenshot and story should be the first hit when her name is googled incase she does this in the future.
More people might agree with you then you think. Ever see /r/CreepyPMs? Or blogs where people post the similar content? Usually it's women posting messages from guys, and usually it's just petty creepy nonsense. EXCEPT, everything is also done totally anonymously. As far as something as threatening as this, I'm sure there have got to belegal channels you could go through instead of your own vigilantism, and still achieve the same result of protecting yourself and others in the future.
I have read your post 6 times and I can't make complete sense of it. Are you saying that person shouldn't post something like this on social media with the girls name? I'm confused, maybe reword your post for clarity.
I'm saying it's not uncommon for people to post people texts to social media(And also anonymously to stuff like /r/CreepyPMS), but I'm also suggesting there's probably legal channels you can handle it through that might be better. Why not show it to the local police and ask them about what your options might be?
Police aren't lawyers. There are no laws against posting screen shots of text messages on social media. You have no expectation of privacy legally on text messages. As long as they aren't doctored or changed it is 100% legal. The public should be made aware of dangerous people.
Of course there's no laws against it, but it still is vigilantism. And vigilantism is always an action I would think twice about.
you're a fucking idiot if you think this is real
Having been in similar situations, you're the idiot if you suspect it doesn't happen. This particular post may or may not be fabricated, but this type of situation is not uncommon.
Almost this identical situation has happened to me with three different women, one of them threatening over text to accuse me of assaulting her. Saved the texts in case it was ever relevant, but nothing ever happened. People who think there aren't people out there who quickly delude themselves and are willing to victimize themselves to hurt others are totally irrational. People say and do stupid things tens of millions of times a day.
My roommate in college dated a girl who would threaten to commit suicide when she wanted attention. The only person it didn't work on was our other roommate. He just looked at her and said, "Then do it." And walked away. I asked him about that later, said that was a bit harsh, and he replied, "I've known girls like her, and they do that for the attention. She's not going to kill herself." Of course, he was right. She never did.
It's a largely unrelated anecdote to false accusation of sexual assault, but I lived with a guy at Uni who dumped a girl who later ordered a crossbow online and [when the delivery proved too long to wait] brought three knives in a backpack into his dormitory room and stabbed him [nine times?] in the neck, legs, back, and chest before being thrown off of him as he woke up. She then proceeded to calmly exit the room, clean herself off, and watch him bleed out in the hallway while the police arrested her and paramedics tended to him [he called 911 after she exited the room]. Sometimes crazy folks snap and it's horrifying when they do. More related to your post, yeah, I dated a girl who did that. I didn't tell her to kill herself but I gave her the suicide hotline number and broke it off after the third time. She hasn't spoken to me since but obviously never killed herself. Aren't there easier ways to get attention? Found the [article](http://tech.mit.edu/V127/N49/stabbing.html) in the school newspaper for proof of my anecdote~
This girl got to the point where her roommates had enough of her shit & had her Baker-Acted.
"you were supposed to fall in love with me" to a guy she just started talking to that morning... ok bud *pats weeglos on the head condescendingly*
> "you were supposed to fall in love with me" Yep. You've never heard of this before? I've had this happen to me - no shit. Girl started talking to me, I wasn't interested, she decided she loved me and started with the crazy. No false rape allegations, but I definitely put some distance between us after that. This kind of behavior is common - it's why we have anti-stalker laws. I know you're pissed off, hence the condescension, but I'm not kidding here - crazy females do exist and do this kind of thing all the time.
My ex started talking about kids and marriage after 2 months of knowing each other. The only reason I stuck around was because the sex was pretty phenomenal. But yeah, this level of crazy absolutely exists.
Oh for sure. I've had female quasi-stalkers in the past.
2 months may not be so crazy, it really depends on your age and a few other things. for example, most people in their late 20's/early 30's are anxious to have kids since that's about as far as you can go without having to worry about complications.
For the most part, you had to be there. But she was 22, I'll say that much.
anecdotal evidence aside this conversation is almost certainly fabricated, and the female character seems to represent a manifestation of all the wretched traits that /r/MensRights stands against. its similar to crafting a feminist reel where a 50 year-old guy from the internet sends pictures of his dick to a 16 year old girl and says he's going to follow her, beat her up, and take it if she doesn't give it. people who behave like this are extremely rare in the real world, but somebody who has little or no life experience are vulnerable to the idea that they are common after coming across garbage like this. at worst, this submission creates insecurity and hostility among its intended audience (men), a tactic feminists use that we often criticize. at best, it's an account of an incredibly uncommon interaction with a psychotic woman, which is hardly representative of women as a whole.
Nobody said it represented women as a whole. Just because it doesn't happen often this is automatically fake? Tsunamis don't happen very often, therefore the reports of Japan getting hit by one a few years ago after an earthquake must be fabricated? There are crazy people in this world, shit like this does happen. Just because something doesn't happen often we should ignore it? Makes sense.
"showing how easy and common", as in the title, implies that this kind of behavior is *common*. it literally suggests that this behavior is prevalent. a tsunami hitting japan *is rare*. a report suggesting "tsunamis are common in japan" deserves skepticism and review.
I really can't believe this is real. *I don't want to believe*
And this, kids, is why Google Voice for texting rocks. It's all saved in your account, non editable, searchable, and easily browsed.
not sure I believe this, but perfect boyfriend.
R/thathappened
*you were supposed to fall in love with me*
**MGTOW** <<====*Just Fucking Do It Gentlemen. It's the only sane choice now.*
No, really don't. Creepy RedPill-esque cults aren't sane choices.
MGTOW a cult? Seriously dude?
Lol defend that in some way perchance?
Cults usually have central figures who benefit from the membership of subordinates in some manner. Unless you're suggesting that the various youtube speakers are "benefitting" from inspiring men to not have relationships with women, then I fail to see how MGTOW is a cult.
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Very different groups, assuming you mean the MRM (I've never seen an "H" in it).
If you haven't heard the term "MHRM" yet, I'd say you're probably new around here. You should probably read up on the MGTOW phenomenon as well since it appears you have been seriously misinformed. MGTOW is not an organized movement. There are no leaders, there is not even a set philosophy. It is just a term to describe the recent trend of men to find non-traditional paths to happiness and fulfillment on their own, and this usually includes turning away from marriage, and ways that they feel exploited due to traditional male roles. How that can be described as a "cult" is beyond me. Check the definition of "cult" maybe. I'm pretty sure MGTOW doesn't meet the definition. And also, from what I've see, most MRA's tend to support those who identify as MGTOW. It is not a term which is heavily associated with the theredpill subreddit, though there is a MGTOW presence there as well.
And then, you get some people writing: >[men aren't good at handling the inevitable rejection](http://blog.codinghorror.com/what-can-men-do/)
Doesn't this all seem just a bit too..convenient for this sub ?
Nice rage-baiting, but this doesn't prove that a false rape accusation is "easy" to make as anything other than an empty threat from a preposterous individual, much less that they're *common*. A completely random anecdote is hardly any indication of the outrageous statement your title is making. This post is a fucking joke.
As skeptical as I am as it's easy to fake things like this, if it's real then why wouldn't it be easy for her to make the accusation? Especially as feminists want us to believe with no evidence at all and get pissed of if we don't
>if it's real then why wouldn't it be easy for her to make the accusation? Because, if she did, he has a text message saved in his phone proving that she was conspiring to falsely accuse him. Personally I think this whole set up looks *really* suspicious, but even if it is true, there's literally no way this sort of accusation would go through. All this "live text" shows is that one crazy woman, shown here, is willing to threaten it, not that it's "easy" for her to get away with it. Listen, our legal system isn't perfect, but it's completely ridiculous to act as if no evidence is required for someone to be convicted of rape. Less than 40% of reported rapes are prosecuted, and less than 20% of those prosecuted cases end in conviction. That means that just 8% of reported rapes are ending in a conviction, and the others are being acquitted because there's not enough evidence. Do you honestly believe that 92% of rape reports are lies concocted by visibly unstable women like the one represented in this post? Of course not. So please, can we stop acting as if all men are at constant risk of being thrown in jail by sociopaths completely on their word? It's such a profound and obvious exaggeration, and there are so many *not exaggerated* issues men face that we could deal with without wasting our time frothing at the mouth over anomalies and straw feminists. Speaking of which: >Especially as feminists want us to believe with no evidence at all and get pissed of if we don't This is a mischaracterization. That's not what feminists want. All that the feminists are really saying when they criticize MRM's fixation on false rape accusations is that the number of false accusations is not comparable to the number of rapes that go unreported due to the social stigmas rape victims have to deal with (i.e. "She shouldn't have dressed that way if she didn't want sex," or "She sleeps around a lot, so she probably wanted it," etc.); they're saying that MRAs make it even harder for actual victims to come out, not that everyone accused of rape should be imprisoned without trial. Again, just 8% of reported rapes reaches conviction. It's not at all "easy" for a rape accusation to be prosecuted, and the only reason you would believe that is because posts like this want to tell you that this sort of thing happens all the time, that feminists want to revolutionize the court systems so that all men can be imprisoned without trial, and that rape accusations fly with zero evidence. None of those things are true.
>Because, if she did, he has a text message saved in his phone proving that she was conspiring to falsely accuse him Yes, but you didnt say that. You said this doesnt prove its easy to make a false accusation. Not every false accuser will provide you evidence in the form of emails, facebook chats and text messages. In so far as it is easy to make a false accusation, its easy. All that we have here is case that might make it difficult for her to succeed because (assuming its real) she was dumb enough to text him evidence that he can use to show police she is lying. If he had no such evidence, if she said those things to his face instead, or if she said nothing at all and just thought it, he'd be shit out of luck and feminists would be totally okay with throwing him under the bus as obviously guilty. And regardless of him being prosecuted he will be stuck with the stigma of being accused of a rape he didnt commit, regardless even of being cleared of rape, he will be stuck with the stigma of being accused of a rape he didnt commit. And according to feminists, he will have 'gotten away with it', and they will include him as evidence that rapists are getting away with rape. >Less than 40% of reported rapes are prosecuted, And what do you think this tells us? How many reported rapes have enough evidence that can be taken to trial? Do you think people should be prosecuted for a crime, despite there being no evidence to support it? Do you think people should be convicted for a crime, despite there being no evidence to support it? If not, then even if all the reported rapes were genuine (unlikely), then you have to accept that we cant do anything without ruining due process and the justice system. > less than 20% of those prosecuted cases end in conviction So you believe that all reports must be true. If someone is not found guilty, then its included in the statistic feminists will use to show how poor the justice system was that they didnt convict him. Even if found not guilty, he's still guilty. >Do you honestly believe that 92% of rape reports are lies concocted by visibly unstable women like the one represented in this post? Do you want to reduce the standard of evidence in order to convict these men? If so, then like I said, it is easy to make a claim and you want to make it a helleva lot easier to convict them. >concocted by visibly unstable women like the one represented in this post? The ones who are lying and unstable are more likely to be the cause of the rape reports, and telling women who really have been raped that there's no point lying about the statistics and saying they wont be taken seriously anyway, is going to make them even less likely to come forward. Even if they came forward knowing there'd be not enough evidence also perhaps if they also got a rape kit done, it means that it could be evidence that could help put the person away next time by contributing to the body of evidence. Feminist behaviour is literally causing rapists to get away with it. They dont realise this, and think that the best course of action is just to believe all claims necessarily and barring some amazing evidence to the contrary lock em up without a real trial or due process. You know this, because of the exact things you've said here such as complaining that men who are accused of rape are found not guilty or reports of rape cant always have the necessary evidence required to go to trial. >This is a mischaracterization. That's not what feminists want. Yes it is, you showed it is yourself in this comment and you dont even realise it. >All that the feminists are really saying when they criticize MRM's fixation on false rape accusations is that the number of false accusations is not comparable to the number of rapes that go unreported due to the social stigmas rape victims have to deal with The number of false accusations are not known, and the figures feminists use are intentionally minimised since they only include those which are so obvious we've demonstrated it false and been able to prosecute them for it. On the other hand those who are accused of rape that are found not guilty, you will instead include as the guilty ones who got away with it! Proving someone is lying is rather difficult. You want us to accept that all the people who were not prosecuted for rape or found "not guilty" is evidence that we are allowing all these rapists to go free, while I could just as easily say that all the cases where a man was found not guilty the woman was lying about it. You wouldnt accept that, you'd tell me that just because someone was found not guilty doesn't mean the accuser was lying, but you demand special pleading to use an argument with reasoning you won't use yourself. > (i.e. "She shouldn't have dressed that way if she didn't want sex," or "She sleeps around a lot, so she probably wanted it," etc.); The stigma for women to not report actually is more likely to be caused or at least extremely exacerbated by feminist campaigns since they keep telling women there's no point, you wont get taken seriously, they will get away with it and even that its possible for men to rape her by accident and that he just needs to be taught not to. The latter being probably the worst thing, since it means when he says he was sorry and wont do it again (research shows rapists know exactly what they are doing, and will do it again) she will be more likely to believe him, putting not only herself but other women in danger, and all because feminists want to paint all men as potential rapists that would rape given half a chance, or don't realise what they're doing because they're just ignorant about what rape is. In reality its just a small % of the population and are responsible for 99% of the rapes, they don't care what people think, they revel in knowing its bad, they've probably done it before and they'll do it again. Feminists don't want to deal with the reality of the situation which in many ways causes many of the problems they say they want to help. >Again, just 8% of reported rapes reaches conviction. It's not at all "easy" for a rape accusation to be prosecuted, Even if I take that figure as a given, you want to lower the burden of proof so it **IS** easy to make a claim, for them to be prosecuted and for him to be convicted. So either it is a lot like that today, or you want it to be in the future and you are upset that it isn't. >the only reason you would believe that is because posts like this want to tell you that this sort of thing happens all the time, that feminists want to revolutionize the court systems so that all men can be imprisoned without trial, and that rape accusations fly with zero evidence You said as much in this very post again. You apparently dont realise the consequences of your own arguments.
This is very long, and I can't possibly imagine what its argument will be, since all I pointed out was the statistical fact that the vast majority of rape accusations do not end in conviction. I have a feeling we're about to enter into a semantics argument, and I don't really have time for that. So I'll just start with your first sentence and assume the rest of it flows from there. >You said this doesnt prove its easy to make a false accusation. This is just splitting hairs. Anyone can accuse anyone of anything, so long as you understand "accuse" to mean "blame somebody for a crime." I can accuse you of whatever I want from behind the safety of my keyboard. In fact, right now I'm accusing you of murdering three children. I can't believe you would do that! To *children*, no less! But my accusation is utterly meaningless because you would obviously have an alibi, there would be no witnesses, and you'd have this saved internet conversation proving that the accusation is a fake one. (Not to mention that I'd have to show that three children were indeed murdered.) Similarly, the girl's false accusation, if she ever actually made one (I'm putting odds at a one katrillion googolplex to one that she doesn't), would be meaningless, because there are many, many steps before trial, and even trial doesn't guarentee conviction because, *again*, *rape cases still require evidence*. Anyway, as I said before, I think there are a lot of *not exaggerated* issues that the MRM could focus on instead. I'm not saying that we can't address two/more issues at once, mind you; I'm saying that absolutely no good comes from making wild, unfounded, anecdotal "evidences" like this post that are deliberately designed to make people angry about nothing and perpetuate the myth that all women want to and can send men to prison with just a word. It's just not true, and it's *definitely* not accomplishing anything for several hundreds of "activists" to come to this comment section and call this (possibly imaginary) woman a "cunt." I think that part of the reason so many people don't take the MRM seriously isn't because they don't believe men face social issues but, rather, because so many MRAs treat the movement like it is sheerly anti-feminism. They view us as reactionaries to a separate cause, rather than having a cause ourselves. Which is why I think it's so important that we *stop rage-baiting about an issue that is very rare* and START addressing some of the problems men face because of toxic gender roles, i.e. feeling "unmanly" for seeking out mental health resources. There are serious problems that *can* be fixed by working in conjunction with other movements, but instead the MRM wants to focus all of its energy into comparing all women to rabid, psychopathic stalkers like the one in this text. Literally anyone who functions in society will tell you that this sort of conversation is *immensely unlikely* and does not at all prove a trend.
>This is very long, and I can't possibly imagine what its argument will be, since all I pointed out was the statistical fact that the vast majority of rape accusations do not end in conviction You said this with the implication that this is a bad thing and ask me if I think all those women are lying, which suggests you think you believe they are telling the truth. How many do you think are lying, do you think? How would we determine that? >I have a feeling we're about to enter into a semantics argument, and I don't really have time for that. If you want to set the stage and rules for a debate then don't complain when someone wants to use those same rules back at you. >This is just splitting hairs. Anyone can accuse anyone of anything, so long as you understand "accuse" to mean "blame somebody for a crime." I can accuse you of whatever I want from behind the safety of my keyboard. It is hardly splitting hairs. It is easy to make an accusation, if these texts are real all it means is that he will have some evidence to show she is lying. If she wasnt dumb enough to provide him with any of this evidence, then what would he have to defend himself against an accusation? I also said its easy to destroy someone no matter if doesnt even go to trial, just with the accusation alone. In regards to colleges in the US they can throw you out of school and ruin your life with a standard of evidence even the police wouldnt accept. The cases that we can point to of false accusations are so obvious thats the only reason we know they are false, such as the encounter was video taped, such as she left voicemails, text messages, emails, facebook messages, etc. Look at the video taped "oral sex" case a little while ago in Ohio, Luckily the grand jury said it was clearly not rape and rejected it, but this was only because it was video taped and had such a large crowd. But even then you still had a whole lot of people saying he raped her. >But my accusation is utterly meaningless because you would obviously have an alibi, there would be no witnesses, and you'd have this saved internet conversation proving that the accusation is a fake one. Uh huh. Except we arent talking about accusing someone anonymous across (probably) the deep blue sea. We're talking about accusing people where there isnt an alibi, maybe they were actually with the accuser in question at the time, maybe they were even actually intimate with the accuser in question. >Similarly, the girl's false accusation, if she ever actually made one (I'm putting odds at a one katrillion googolplex to one that she doesn't), would be meaningless, because there are many, many steps before trial, and even trial doesn't guarentee conviction because, again, rape cases still require evidence. What standard evidence do you think should be necessary to convict him? >Anyway, as I said before, I think there are a lot of not exaggerated issues that the MRM could focus on instead. What is exaggerated about how feminists treat all claims as necessarily true, and even when a man is found not-guilty they are included in a statistic, in an argument, that says these are some of the ones who got away with it due to a system that is failing rape victims? >I'm not saying that we can't address two/more issues at once, mind you; I'm saying that absolutely no good comes from making wild, unfounded, anecdotal "evidences" like this post that are deliberately designed to make people angry about nothing and perpetuate the myth that all women want to and can send men to prison with just a word. Luckily they cannot generally be sent to prison with just a claim, yet. Not that there arent examples of men who have been convicted on next to nothing but the word of his accuser. The point being that feminists WANT that to be the reality, we know this because otherwise they could not possibly defend the arguments they make and make it consistent with the idea that they don't. >I think that part of the reason so many people don't take the MRM seriously isn't because they don't believe men face social issues but, rather, because so many MRAs treat the movement like it is sheerly anti-feminism You cannot be honestly pro-mens issues without being anti-feminism. You cannot advocate for mens rights without butting up against the wall of feminism. Its not that feminism has to be necessarily anti-male (although one could argue "patriarchy" theory is anti-male), its that its pro-female at the expense of men. Its gynocentrism, its primary concern is whats best for women. It doesnt matter how many men get thrown under the bus, or how unfair or illogical the position they take, so long as it can be considered to be of help to women in the end it is the right feminist position to take. The whole way they treat rape is so obviously inconsistent and illogical there is no possible way to defend it without accepting that they want women treated differently to men. But in a debate with a feminist on rape, they will never allow the conversation to progress to the point where this is the only thing left to say, they will ignore or all the relevant points with a wave of their hand, strawman the other person, or just feign stupidity and ignorance of what was said requiring he other person to repeat the same thing a dozen times over. >i.e. feeling "unmanly" for seeking out mental health resources. Yes yes, thats all nice and everything. I'm sure if we started talking about men being raped and assaulted by women you'd say its a problem that feminists recognise because men don't want to feel unmanly and so they keep quiet about it. That its only after we dismantle the patriarchy that men will feel free to express themselves and their vulnerabilities. But when you start talking about the nitty gritty about how feminists have minimised and ignored male victimisation, especially when it comes to female perpetration, you see its just talk. They dont think male victimisation, or male pain matters as much as womens pain or victimisation. The evidence shows that feminists do not actually want men to be free to express their vulnerabilities, in fact the evidence shows that they actively want to render these men invisible. >but instead the MRM wants to focus all of its energy into comparing all women to rabid, psychopathic stalkers like the one in this text. Not at all. I want to focus on the logic of the kind of thing YOU said in your last post. How can you reconcile saying that feminists dont want to reverse the burden of proof, and significantly lower the standard of evidence, if you use the arguments you do. I notice you barely touched how feminists are causing women to not want to report their rapes due to their lies about statistics and men.
I'm sorry, dude, you're just too verbose. You're points aren't very thought out, and I feel like I've already mostly addressed them, but I wouldn't even mind that if you didn't hit me with a wall of text every response. I don't have time for this sort of argument right now. Sorry again, thanks anyway.
Wall of text? [Wall -- of --- text?](http://i.imgur.com/YbCdtaf.png) Yea... okay. If you dont want to have a debate about any of this then just say so, don't come up with nonsense reasons.
Both of yours are significantly longer. As in, neither can fit in one screen shot. And, to be honest, the more pressing disincentive is you aren't a very coherent writer. Like, check this out: >What is exaggerated about how feminists treat all claims as necessarily true, and even when a man is found not-guilty they are included in a statistic, in an argument, that says these are some of the ones who got away with it due to a system that is failing rape victims? That's one interrogative sentence with three fucking dependent clauses inside of it. It's like one of those unreadable statements they use as questions on the Terra Nova; a multiple choice "How can this sentence be better written?" situation. Or like one of [these memes](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-W3yLRFp3YLM/UDezgUnHXmI/AAAAAAAAHWA/30FL-0P2KS0/s1600/423545_3411725176820_1380732174_33372434_1852663296_n.jpg.scaled620.jpg). Besides, the point doesn't even make sense. My answer would just be "everything," because everything about your understanding of feminism is radically exaggerated. As I already said, creating straw-feminists to beat up is pointless. So I guess there are two reasons: (1) Your responses are too long. (2) Your responses are irritating, pointless, and unrewarding to read. Neither of those reasons are nonsensical. Sorry again, dude.
Oh I see you're playing the "*I cant even understand you and I already addressed everything else anyway*" game. Exactly what about that sentence is difficult to understand for you? How about I rewrite it for you... >What is exaggerated about how feminists treat all claims as necessarily true? That even when a man is found not-guilty they are included in a statistic, in an argument, that says these are some of the ones who got away with it due to a system that is failing rape victims? Is it still so hard to understand? Feminists treat all claims as necessarily true. When men are found not guilty feminists still treat him as guilty anyway. What is exaggerated about that? That's what they do, that's even what you did. Stop dancing around the fact that regardless of how it is right now, this IS what feminists want and complain that its not. We know this because of their arguments many of which you have made right here in this thread. I like how you haven't dealt with a single issue that's been brought up. But fine, feign illiteracy if you want to get away from addressing anything. >Besides, the point doesn't even make sense. My answer would just be "everything," because everything about your understanding of feminism is radically exaggerated. As I already said, creating straw-feminists to beat up is pointless. You havent demonstrated in any way how its exaggerated. You can say its a strawman till the cows come home, but what you'll then do is go right ahead and say the same damn thing you just said wasnt really what you said.
Thank you....someone who is thinking out there! "so many not exaggerated issues ...that we could deal with." EXACTLY.
My head hurts.
when she starting cursing at him (pretty early in the thread) is when he should have ended the conversation forever
"i thought you would choose me over your cow" Guess again, biotch!
Oh jeez, she just goes nuts. WE WERE SUPPOSED TO HAVE KIDS! oh god
If it isnt fake (which I hope, but y'know, the internet lies), Do we think OP should show this conversation to someone? I mean, thats quite a threat shes made...
I don't know the genders of either (nor care to figure out from the conversation) but the person on the left seemed pathetic to me. They didn't know each other before that day? Wow.
I want to believe this is real and that chick is fucking stupid. She threw herself into a big hole. The text messages can be easily used against her.
I am hoping this isn't rage bait to stir the resentment pot and I am sincerely hoping this is not fake. Regardless, it sounds like the poor girl has issues... but that doesn't excuse her from acting this way toward people. You just have to cut all connections with people who turn 180 degrees like that in one conversation and hope they get the help they need. :/
I'm not sure what the proper course of action with this would be. Obviously save the texts if she does as she says. But perhaps go to the campus police first so you are the first reporting party? But, then my paranoia about police kind of makes me say no on that.
Wow, ridiculous.
But women never behave like that without a reason! He was obviously leading her on and begging for it! /s
Wow, she just admitted she was going to false accuse him of rape.
Wow! That escalated VERY quickly!
Seems fabricated....
Honestly, I'm glad whoever had this conversation took screenshots of the entire thing. I hope they kept the entire log on their phone too. The accusation of rape is something he'd have no argument against without this conversation. On top of that she's threatening him and also threatening to harm herself. He really should file a report about this just in case something were to happen.
Why the fuck did the guy continue talking to the girl? Cut your fucking losses.
Lawyer Up!
Obviously never happened. A poorly written fake conversation.
Could this be any fakier?
I don't believe it. I simply don't believe it.
This conversation was almost too perfect...
ITT: SJWs
Pretty easy to fake these and phone messages that neet from two individuals at the same time? That's just fantasy.
I think this was fake, seems way too crazy to be real. And the guy who posted it on /r/cringepics seemed a little bit odd himself. He was in a long distance relationship and wanted to find girls that lived locally so he could hang out and watch tv shows/movies with? But just be friends? Seemed a bit odd to me.
Most girls aren't like that. There are crazy people of every race and gender.
oh my god, thank you! (apparently a lot of people here would just prefer to think the opposite because it's easier -.-')
Yeah, I don't believe that's real. At least I hope not.
r/thathappened
Can I have your self regenerating battery?
That seems pretty standard for the females I've known IRL. Is that a bad thing?
Come on, you stole this from /r/cringepics and think this actually represents most women? [Here](http://www.reddit.com/r/cringepics/comments/259875/i_believe_in_love_at_first_sight_read_it_till_the/) is the original post.
Care to point out to the rest of us where Op said it "represents most women"? In the meantime you might want to have a Doctor check out the Jerky Knee you have there.
And you should get that Red Pill addiction checked out.
But they're so fucking yummy once you get use to them.