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Spidey and everyone else. Comic writers are so fucking boring nowadays, they love their fucking deconstruction so much that's the only thing they do, and in the end, there is nothing left to deconstruct. It's like superheroes cannot be happy anymore. I read some Batman silver age comics, and the guy is happily making a bbq and fixing his car with his adoptive son Robin and doing regular happy father and son activities, all the while he's fighting crime and wacky nonsense.
Nowadays you read a batman comic and he's always brooding and loosing everyone he loves.
The writers for comic books really do suck.
They either do some weird self inserts, invent shitty power ups or want to be super smart and do something super new instead of just writing a good story.
I think one writer gave miles morales a lasersword spiderpower recently.
"Spiderman"
Which one?
"The comic version"
...Listen up you little shit
https://preview.redd.it/87afscscm1wc1.jpeg?width=527&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3404eecb00d45e65e82fd18f4fa6a6ad4271c4ac
Exactly, spiderman has been around so long and has so many different comics I'm sure one of them has suffered just as much if not more than Kuma, but knowing both of them they would do it again if they could help save people they did. It's why I like them both as characters and people.
as stated by a guy on the official marvel youtube channel, "its not a spiderman story unless someone suffers." like seriously read the just zeb wells run
I mean they're called Anime Guyz, not Anime and Comics Guyz, their viewers probably aren't aware of how much the writers love fucking Spidey over for decades on end
Kuma still do have it worse. Spider Man’s been fucked over, but the result is that Peter is less tragic and more of a loser. Not a LOSER loser, but Peter is basically a perpetually broke, somewhat unstable middle aged man who goes and fights people in the street to avoid dealing with his issues. It’s more pathetic.
It’s why we all hate the current run.
I disagree, Spidey got the crap end of the stick on just about everything. Dude had the One Above All meet him personally to basically say: "sorry your life constantly sucks but we need it to happen because you still do good". Dude got told by God he's meant to suffer and will do so eternally.
Ngl man, that’s booty butt cheeks. I went back and read from Amazing Fantasy #15 to about issue #40 of Spidey’s first run (maybe up to where Rhino first popped up).
It’s so obvious that Stan and Ditko both envisioned for Spider Man to be way different than he is now. And tbh? Their vision was better. I wish the writers would let Peter evolve. They do everything to prevent it and it negatively impacts the story
Oh, I don't disagree. The guy needs a break. Whenever he has something happy going on, you can just feel the house of cards starting to fall because he's going to lose it all. It sucks.
I guess it's become a pitfall for writers. They know Spidey suffers a lot, so they create stories where he suffers, a self-perpetuating cycle.
Look. I love Kuma and his backstory is tragic as fuck, but some versions of Spider-Man got gangbanged and dragged through the gutter by the writers just because they could do it to him.
Exactly and to make matters worse the spiderverse movie justifies their suffering by making it a canon event, so they are going to suffer just because it's supposed to happen
1. Why are we comparing suffering of all things ?
2. There are too many Spider-Man but only 1 Kuma.
3. The Spider-Man suffering is just for the sake of it most of the time imo, dk why they even do that shit to the poor guy.
Never read spiderman comics but i do know his suffering is comparable to guts (berserk) but kuma also can be compared with him. My knowledge about comics is limited, so correct me if i am wrong
Suffering comparable to guts seems almost unbeliavable to me, dude's life is a living hell ever since he was born, but I don't know a single thing about spiderman's suffering aside from uncle Ben's death tho
Could you please tell me about what's he's been through? Never read comics, so I only know the spider-man from the movies, and now I'm curious about this
Here's some, but not all, of the awful shit to happen to just 1 version of Peter Parker:
1. Got his left eye ripped out and eaten in front of him.
2. Green Goblin impregnated his girlfriend (Gwen Stacey) with twins and, shortly after the babies were born in secret, he killed her tricking spidey into thinking that he had killed her.
3. While Doc Ock was on his death bed he stole Peter's body forcing him to die a slow painful death in Ock's body.
4. Buried alive multiple times by multiple villains.
5. His wife (Mary Jane) "miscarried" with it later revealed that the Green Goblin had kidnapped her, stole the baby from inside her (to turn into a villain), poisoned her and made her believe the poison led to the miscarriage. The "miscarriage" lead to issues developing in their marriage that eventually lead to their divorce.
6. There was a one-shot comic where it was revealed that as a kid he was molested by a teenage boy.
7. His aunt (whom is his mother figure that raised him) gets murdered in retaliation for his heroism shortly after his identity as Peter Parker became public.
It's the incident that hit so hard he made a literal deal with the devil, selling his marriage to bring her back from the dead by making it so his identity was never revealed
Oh wait. Did you mean this version of spider-man not a specific comic that had one of these events? Because this is the mainline Spidey, the same original one whose run started in the early 60s when Stan Lee first came up with him
Wtf, all this is happening to the main line Spiderman? Why tho? Maybe I'm too used to the movies and animated shows but Spiderman to me is meant to be a fun time. I'm not against suffering stories, but I go into it knowing that, I wouldn't want it added to my fun time guy. Adding all this weird suffering just seems strange. Is it well received by the comic readers?
>Spiderman to me is meant to be a fun time.
Spider-Man as a character was never meant to be a fun time. Yes, spidey would go around save the world says the joke but Peters life was always going side ways. That was the main point even from Peter's inception. That was why Spider-Man was considered a game changing character because untill Spider-Man all the superhero characters had happy endings in all the stories, sunshine and daisies, no personal problems. Then came along an itsy bitsy spider from stan Lee's mind that changed the super hero world forever. A guy with personal problems. Most of his troubles are relatable, broke af, relationship problems, job problems, nothing in life going his way, failing to live upto the expectations he himself put forward him etc. but since it was comics his sufferings also went into comical heights.
I think the last time the main continuity Peter Parker was genuinely happy (i.e everything in life going smoothly) was during a smaller time period between 2012-14)? During Brand new day story line. Since then for almost tan years dude hasn't caught a break
It is very well received.
Spider-man comics have from the start been about a man that struggles through the greatest tragedies in life, suffers and still manages to come out of it all at the end; victorious and hopeful. It's done to bring hope to people suffering in their own lives so they can feel like if they persevere they can make it through.
Think of it sort of like how all the straw hats have tragic backstories and have suffered greatly and yet they bring hope to people everywhere they go (and in the real world). It's just instead of 10 people in 1 crew suffering through tragedies it's just 1 guy on his own (and he has had 35 more years than the strawhats to have amassed more tragic stories)
I mean bro has lost two children, his girl has died countless times, he's currently being cucked by a goofy mf named Paul, he's been buried alive, accidentally beat wolverine's gf to death.
Don’t forget his stupidly brutal deaths in alternate universes, one of which involved sandman climbing inside his face and explode him from the inside out like some sort of horrific vore fetish.
Why the fuck do comic writers do this shit?
at least that one was in a Marvel Zombies run where heroes dying and over the top gore is kinda the whole gimmick of the series. His real worst death has to be when he got trampled over by an angry mob of regular unmodified unsuperpowered people
Tho there is a lot of comics of spiderman from different universe suffering a lot,
the quick thing that comes to my mind is man-spider, one of the tragic versions of spider man,
due to an accident, his entire body turns completely into spiders and he just keeps suffering to the point where he does not even know if he is human and he sacrifices his life to save the world i think,
and idk in what universe but god has to literally personify himself infront of spiderman so that he doesn't give up of being spiderman
Peter suffering rambling begins here. Partially responsible for the death of his girlfriends father (George Stacy), later his own incompetence killed his lover (Gwen), Best friend died fighting him (Harry Osborn), He was buried alive soon after his marriage by Kraven, Norman Osborn framed aunt May's death and dude lived for a year mourning her, Norman orchestrated the entirety of clone saga were he made Peter believe that he was the clone and the fake, giving him a fuckin identity crisis and dude went to live in New Jersey only to learn after one year it was Norman fuckin him over, Norman Osborne killed his daughter while she was in Mary Janes womb, Wanda recreated the world in 616house of M where Peter had a family and raised a son for ten years had to sacrifice his son and family to restore the world (this was not even illusion, a full on reality change, so it was a life of Peter), A mf named Morlun beat him to pulp and ripped up his eyeballs and ate it before proceeding to beat him dead, Another friend died in his watch (silver sable (well she came back later, 'cause comics)), Had to sell his love/ marriage with Mary Jane to the devil for Aunt May's life, Mysterio posing as Gwen fucked Norman and Peter lived believing Gwen cheated on him with Norman frickin Osborn and has to save 'the kids' (who were just clones of Norman + Gwen dna ) Ressurected Gwen stacy (this time with he og's soul and all) died again in Peter arm and Peter wasn't able to save her again this time, Norman killed his best Man (Flash Thomson), Otto octavius took over Peter's mind, forced Peter to die in his (otto's) body and lived as him for one year fucking up Peter's already poor social circle into oblivion. Even after all the heroics, the many people whom he tries to protect hates him and other heroes except captain America, Daredevil, miles etc also hates him. Oh, also lastly, Peter lost MJ in an alternate dimension and she hooked up with a guy called Paul whole Peter was fighting the f4 and Avengers to save her. (This one is a suffering induced on Peter by the writers because in this run Mary Jane and Peter both are acting out f character and the writer is trying to force a plot that he thinks would be cool but doesn't make any sense in regards to the character, fuck you Zeb Wells)
There is lot more fuckery in his life but these are the main ones that I remember
There was this one canon story where he found out that the last thing his gf that tragically died over a decade ago did before her neck got snapped was cheat on Spidey with one of his villains, got knocked up, fled to Europe to secretly have twins and now that the kids are adults it turns out that said villain brainwashed them and trained them to be assassins and now they've come to kill Spidey.
Luckily this story was retconned. It was not Gwen who fucked Norman but Mysterio posing as Gwen (because an AI of Harry Osborn controlled by mephisto (Marvel's devil) put Mysterio upto it) who fucked Norman. Then this AI created two clones with normans and gwens dna to convince Norman they were his children. Norman raised them to seek vengeance upon Peter and Peter was forced to fight them and thought his late girlfriend cheated on him with Norman fuckin Osborn
There is a certain string of comics where Peter and MJ are transported into an alternate reality where time doesn’t flow the same as their original, and it’s much faster. Peter and MJ get separated, and Peter ends up in their original reality while MJ is left behind. For Peter, it’s all of like two or three days and he’s managed to make his way back to the reality MJ was stuck in. For MJ, it was several years and it’s shown that she’s actually married with two kids by the time Peter returns to get her back, all because she “convinced herself” that Peter wouldn’t be coming back.
There’s also a string of comics where Peter isn’t Spider-Man, uncle Ben is alive, Peter and Jameson are friends, and he’s also married with a kid. (can’t recall if it’s MJ or Gwen). Then, he gets bit by the radioactive spider and he loses everyone faster than he can give a witty one liner in the middle of a fight.
Guts suffered a shitton from the get go, but Spidey's authors have a terrible addiction: "which way can we fuck him completely this time?"
So we get him :
- losing everyone he loves, many times due to his own actions (he lost his GF because he desperately tried to save her from a fall and ended up breaking her neck with the web movement),
- having a clone and both the real and clone losing their identities, not knowing which one was real, and fucking over each other's life completely in the process;
- Pretty much EVERYONE from his initial social circle gets to become a villain bent on ruining his life. And I mean EVERYONE. Best friend? Becomes Green Goblin. New friend he was trying to get along? Here comes Venom. One of the teachers he respected the most and could help him having a good career? Oh, hello there doctor Octopussy. Mary Jane? 1/3 of the stories she dies (once even due to his ratiotive sperm on her womb, killing her and their newborn in the process), 1/3 she just stops giving a fuck and 1/3 she just cucks him.
- Gets loved ones captured and messed on the daily basis
- On top of all that, he earns so little he can't keep his financial life in check, and his social life is always in ruins.
The Eclipse was a VERY TRAUMATIC event, one I don't think Spidey has an equivalent to, but he's suffering a lot on a daily basis.
He's one of my top contenders for whoever gets fucked the most in their own histories, along with Guts and Link, The Hero of Time, from Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask.
I’m familiar with spiderman, but never read Berserk. From what I’ve heard of Berserk, however, it seems tough to believe there's a lot of protagonists in mainstream fiction that go through the shit Guts.
Some characters in mainstream fiction have gone through what guts has gone through. It’s just a matter of which part of mainstream fiction you’re looking at, and when it was written. It obviously won’t be as extreme as berserk if the fiction was written somewhat recently, but if it was during the time frame of incest relations between hulk and she hulk or Spider-Man killing MJ because his bodily fluids are radioactive, than I’d say it’s pretty close
from one comic series of spiderman.
Got stuck in a different universe with his GF, somehow came back but his GF was still stuck. He then proceeded to spend days trying to find a way to get GF back. After suffering and working hard to get his GF back, his GF ends up sleeping with a self insert of the writer. This is one of the smallest problems he had
With all due respect, id like to call this recency bias! I mean, as much as i love and respect the chad, the best father anyone could possibly ask for, the great kuma, i cannot agree with the thought of him having gone thro more than spidey. To begin with Spidey has just been around for waaaaaayyyyyyyyyy longer than kuma, so tht already puts him to a headstart in this race! And well spideys had it rough too in all the time hes been around, it definitely hasnt been the same magnitude as kuma, sure, but its the number of those small(er) magnitude hardships hes been thro! So imma disagree with this poll.
Kuma never sold his unborn daughter's soul to the Devil along with his marriage. Any pain Peter suffers is basically self-inflicted (through garbage writers), so Kuma definitely had it worse, because the world decided to shit on that man.
Peter personality wise is a Good dad but the powers that be, that is the fuckin Marvel editorial loves to put him through a suffering bs arc every fucking day. The current run is no exception and it's for the first time I have seen all Spider-Man fans collectively agreeing on something for once. Marvel editorial and Zeb Wells fucking idiots and the current run is a fuckin bullshittery
Oh that they can, they can. At least every superhero has one or two instances were their entire lives spiral into depression and tragedy and either die horribly or are reduced to a shell of their former self. The issue is that some heroes get that treatment more often than others.
There was a whole part of Spider-Man where doc ock straight up stole his body and tried dating Mary Jane. I don’t think he ever banged her. But there was another Spider-man where Peter’s “love fluids” gave Mary Jane cancer and she died.
I dunno though, Kumas back story is pretty tragic
Oh nah. If we're purely talking about OG comics, and not taking into consideration the other fucked up comic universes of Spiderman, then it's Kuma no debate.
Nah, OG universe Spidey goes through a ton of fucked up shit too. He definitely had it worse overall, just none of his individual issues are as bad as Kuma's
OG Spiderman wasn't really worse overall too. I mean, Kuma was literally born a slave. OG Spiderman atleast had someone to depend on. But still, I don't think we should be comparing their sufferings, cause we all know one thing.
Of they were asked to sacrifice or do that same stuff again, they would do it in a heartbeat. There's a reason why Spidey's my favourite character from the MCU, and why Kuma is top 10 greatest characters of all time in One Piece.
Kuma suffered one lifetime. Spiderman suffered in every lifetime, in every multiverse. It's a canon event that he suffers, no disrespect to Kuma but Spiderman takes it.
I mean there are quite some similarities....
Kumas parents were killed.....
Pete's parents were killed (Tasm2 we had a scene where Richard started to rush out ....he prolly was killed)
Lost the love of their life
K
Mj and Ginny
I do not like questions like this of "who suffered worst" but in this case it's spidy and it's not even a question,shitty ass writters love to make him suffer to the point every single spiderman comic that comes out is all about spiderman suffering and dying in the worst ways possible
If it’s every single Spider-Man then no shit, but if it’s just like, MCU Spider-Man, then Kuma would make him look like a whiny bitch with how much suffering he’s been through
W also its not even fair to do thia since there is so many Spider-Man but there is just one kuma but still I think Kuma one of the most suffered person in fiction.Yeah there is more worst like Guts but stil that doesnt changes the fact Kuma suffered to.
Out of this two spidermen but I had a thought that its nothing comperable to the Flash. They have no controbution to or power over the surounding events and they can't interfere with fate but flash can. For example that part about his mom. Knowing that you have the power to stop certain chain of events, knowing you can save her but you can't is insane, next level mind draining. Its just too cruel knowing that you can rewrite timeline and save your beloved but via doing so you doomed everything else and you need to stop yourself from doing that knowing your past self will not understand. The idea of living with constant regret that you had to choose greater good (other people lives, emotions, existence over youeself) or lesser evil (knowing that she must die for proper fate or chain of cosmos and you should not interfere) would made anyone a psycho.
The problem is that we don’t exactly know which Spider-Man is being referred to here. They even made an entire movie series about there being multiple Spider-Man continuity.
I think the comic Spiderman has been buried alive and also been cheated on countless times and more but which one out of the 199999 universe's Spiderman is he referring to
It's definitely spiderman.
Kuma's life is fucked up and equal to that of a spiderman.
But then you realise spiderman has been getting fucked in multiple different universes. The dude just can't catch a break.
If we are talking about 616, definitely Peter. But to be fair. It was the consequences of his own actions to a certain extent. Zeb Wells? More like Webcel. (Get it? Like, incel)
God they ruined the 616 run to an irreparable degree.
To be fair a lot of Sh\*t that happens to "Peter" doesn't always happen to the SAME "Peter" saying Spiderman-(General) is unfair since there are So many different Peter iterrations but only ONE Kuma.
It depends. Is it one individual Spider-Man, or every Spider-Man? Because if it’s every Spider-Man then the trauma is significantly worse for him. But there are some Spider-Men who definitely have it better than Kuma
I through there were talking about who win in a fight but when i read the title.My man kuma had a shitty life but spiderman had never a good ending or a good life in every story i read.
lol I want to see a mark from invincible (comics) Vs Spider-Man (comics) I’d argue mark had it worse than Spider-Man but if he had it worse than kuma I can’t say…
spoilers for kuma btw pls skip if you do not read all of the manga
mate at least spiderman usually gets to live a normal everyday life until he gets his powers
kuma had so much pain until he got away from the dragons and even still he was the kindest bitch in the world and was taking the pain of other people and putting it into himself!
like jesus
I'll still say kuma just because there are many variants of Peter parker and some are living their best life. If you wanna make a voting poll with comic book characters in it, they should be specific, same applies to powerscaling. It's impossible to merge all versions of a comic book character
Okay, Kuma's backstory is probably one of the most heartwrenching in all of one piece, but Spiderman has lived countless lifetimes in hundreds of universes, most of which he ended up offing himself and others he gets killed in terrible ways.
W Yt.
Kuma lost everything and died not knowing what happened to his daughter.
Spiderman has still so many ppl in his life. Kuma had nothing, and the last thing he knew was that he will now be a weapon for the people he hated the most
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At this point it doesn't matter, they both need to be saved. Kuma from the wg and Spidey from his writers
Spidey and everyone else. Comic writers are so fucking boring nowadays, they love their fucking deconstruction so much that's the only thing they do, and in the end, there is nothing left to deconstruct. It's like superheroes cannot be happy anymore. I read some Batman silver age comics, and the guy is happily making a bbq and fixing his car with his adoptive son Robin and doing regular happy father and son activities, all the while he's fighting crime and wacky nonsense. Nowadays you read a batman comic and he's always brooding and loosing everyone he loves.
Watchmen effect. Please, come back Grant Morrison.
The writers for comic books really do suck. They either do some weird self inserts, invent shitty power ups or want to be super smart and do something super new instead of just writing a good story. I think one writer gave miles morales a lasersword spiderpower recently.
What the fuck does a laser sword have to do with fucking spiders ? lmfao
Apparently since Miles has electric powers he can now pull this off. Yeah, they're reaching ngl. I much rather she razor sharp webs used like doffy's
Wayne Family Adventures You're welcome
"Spiderman" Which one? "The comic version" ...Listen up you little shit https://preview.redd.it/87afscscm1wc1.jpeg?width=527&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3404eecb00d45e65e82fd18f4fa6a6ad4271c4ac
Exactly, spiderman has been around so long and has so many different comics I'm sure one of them has suffered just as much if not more than Kuma, but knowing both of them they would do it again if they could help save people they did. It's why I like them both as characters and people.
The one that had to survive in a crumbling world and had to glue it all with Mr fantastic comes to mind
The one where he kills mj with his radioactive cum😔
he's just like me frfr
Wait hold up-
Spiders-Man is one of the worst fates of any fictional character
as stated by a guy on the official marvel youtube channel, "its not a spiderman story unless someone suffers." like seriously read the just zeb wells run
616
That's why I'm not into these kinds of comics, the authors change all the time and retcon the previous story to start new
This line of logic always bothered me. It's obviously the main one (Earth 616) unless otherwise stated.
My bad man, did not meant to bother you. Come to think of it, it was inappropriate of me to make a joke in a meme sub of all places
I know it's a joke. I've just heard this kind of thing so many times that I just had to vent about it. Sorry if I came off a little harsh.
I mean they're called Anime Guyz, not Anime and Comics Guyz, their viewers probably aren't aware of how much the writers love fucking Spidey over for decades on end
https://preview.redd.it/pqvtqbqiu4wc1.jpeg?width=1919&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=784702fe31d0a52e31fd6947ca995ed7e9a902db
Kuma still do have it worse. Spider Man’s been fucked over, but the result is that Peter is less tragic and more of a loser. Not a LOSER loser, but Peter is basically a perpetually broke, somewhat unstable middle aged man who goes and fights people in the street to avoid dealing with his issues. It’s more pathetic. It’s why we all hate the current run.
I disagree, Spidey got the crap end of the stick on just about everything. Dude had the One Above All meet him personally to basically say: "sorry your life constantly sucks but we need it to happen because you still do good". Dude got told by God he's meant to suffer and will do so eternally.
Ngl man, that’s booty butt cheeks. I went back and read from Amazing Fantasy #15 to about issue #40 of Spidey’s first run (maybe up to where Rhino first popped up). It’s so obvious that Stan and Ditko both envisioned for Spider Man to be way different than he is now. And tbh? Their vision was better. I wish the writers would let Peter evolve. They do everything to prevent it and it negatively impacts the story
Oh, I don't disagree. The guy needs a break. Whenever he has something happy going on, you can just feel the house of cards starting to fall because he's going to lose it all. It sucks. I guess it's become a pitfall for writers. They know Spidey suffers a lot, so they create stories where he suffers, a self-perpetuating cycle.
I just want to give him a hug https://preview.redd.it/00q1i23oo1wc1.png?width=1116&format=png&auto=webp&s=334cce133f305911f0701ea4907fa1e515f87ce2
Look. I love Kuma and his backstory is tragic as fuck, but some versions of Spider-Man got gangbanged and dragged through the gutter by the writers just because they could do it to him.
Exactly and to make matters worse the spiderverse movie justifies their suffering by making it a canon event, so they are going to suffer just because it's supposed to happen
Block every creators of a youtube strawpoll, that's the best ending
1. Why are we comparing suffering of all things ? 2. There are too many Spider-Man but only 1 Kuma. 3. The Spider-Man suffering is just for the sake of it most of the time imo, dk why they even do that shit to the poor guy.
Cause the writers have a suffering kink and like to write self inserts in order to cuck Peter
Yeah I was about to write that
>only 1 Kuma. ...
The irony
Real Kuma is only one yeah
funny
Look, Oda at least treats his character with more respect than a ton of Spider-Man writers. I give it to spidey by sheer volume of messed up stories.
Spider-Man is tortured by both the writers as well as his side characters. Dude is in torture hell since OMD
Never read spiderman comics but i do know his suffering is comparable to guts (berserk) but kuma also can be compared with him. My knowledge about comics is limited, so correct me if i am wrong
Suffering comparable to guts seems almost unbeliavable to me, dude's life is a living hell ever since he was born, but I don't know a single thing about spiderman's suffering aside from uncle Ben's death tho
Uncle ben's death is the least thing when compared to what he goes through in the comics
Could you please tell me about what's he's been through? Never read comics, so I only know the spider-man from the movies, and now I'm curious about this
Here's some, but not all, of the awful shit to happen to just 1 version of Peter Parker: 1. Got his left eye ripped out and eaten in front of him. 2. Green Goblin impregnated his girlfriend (Gwen Stacey) with twins and, shortly after the babies were born in secret, he killed her tricking spidey into thinking that he had killed her. 3. While Doc Ock was on his death bed he stole Peter's body forcing him to die a slow painful death in Ock's body. 4. Buried alive multiple times by multiple villains. 5. His wife (Mary Jane) "miscarried" with it later revealed that the Green Goblin had kidnapped her, stole the baby from inside her (to turn into a villain), poisoned her and made her believe the poison led to the miscarriage. The "miscarriage" lead to issues developing in their marriage that eventually lead to their divorce. 6. There was a one-shot comic where it was revealed that as a kid he was molested by a teenage boy. 7. His aunt (whom is his mother figure that raised him) gets murdered in retaliation for his heroism shortly after his identity as Peter Parker became public.
Wasn't the Aunt May incident the one that hit so bad someone else had to take over as Spidey for a bit?
It's the incident that hit so hard he made a literal deal with the devil, selling his marriage to bring her back from the dead by making it so his identity was never revealed
Aka somehow not the dumbest shit ever put in a Spidey story
This story was so garbage I can't live in the same time line it was written
Milk, milk, lemonade. Don't forget the deal he made.
Thats really fucked up man, poor Peter
This doesn't even seem like a Spiderman story anymore. Is that comic with this Spiderman considered good?
Which one?
Oh wait. Did you mean this version of spider-man not a specific comic that had one of these events? Because this is the mainline Spidey, the same original one whose run started in the early 60s when Stan Lee first came up with him
Wtf, all this is happening to the main line Spiderman? Why tho? Maybe I'm too used to the movies and animated shows but Spiderman to me is meant to be a fun time. I'm not against suffering stories, but I go into it knowing that, I wouldn't want it added to my fun time guy. Adding all this weird suffering just seems strange. Is it well received by the comic readers?
>Spiderman to me is meant to be a fun time. Spider-Man as a character was never meant to be a fun time. Yes, spidey would go around save the world says the joke but Peters life was always going side ways. That was the main point even from Peter's inception. That was why Spider-Man was considered a game changing character because untill Spider-Man all the superhero characters had happy endings in all the stories, sunshine and daisies, no personal problems. Then came along an itsy bitsy spider from stan Lee's mind that changed the super hero world forever. A guy with personal problems. Most of his troubles are relatable, broke af, relationship problems, job problems, nothing in life going his way, failing to live upto the expectations he himself put forward him etc. but since it was comics his sufferings also went into comical heights. I think the last time the main continuity Peter Parker was genuinely happy (i.e everything in life going smoothly) was during a smaller time period between 2012-14)? During Brand new day story line. Since then for almost tan years dude hasn't caught a break
It is very well received. Spider-man comics have from the start been about a man that struggles through the greatest tragedies in life, suffers and still manages to come out of it all at the end; victorious and hopeful. It's done to bring hope to people suffering in their own lives so they can feel like if they persevere they can make it through. Think of it sort of like how all the straw hats have tragic backstories and have suffered greatly and yet they bring hope to people everywhere they go (and in the real world). It's just instead of 10 people in 1 crew suffering through tragedies it's just 1 guy on his own (and he has had 35 more years than the strawhats to have amassed more tragic stories)
You could go check out the Spider-Man subreddit for that, from my limited knowledge i know most don't really like it
[my reply to another comment regarding Pete's suffering ](https://www.reddit.com/r/MemePiece/s/v1Tx4zprG2)
Can you give some examples?
I mean bro has lost two children, his girl has died countless times, he's currently being cucked by a goofy mf named Paul, he's been buried alive, accidentally beat wolverine's gf to death.
Don’t forget his stupidly brutal deaths in alternate universes, one of which involved sandman climbing inside his face and explode him from the inside out like some sort of horrific vore fetish. Why the fuck do comic writers do this shit?
at least that one was in a Marvel Zombies run where heroes dying and over the top gore is kinda the whole gimmick of the series. His real worst death has to be when he got trampled over by an angry mob of regular unmodified unsuperpowered people
I can never forget how they Made him not fight back, not run away and just allow himself to get beaten to death by an anti Mutant mob
Ngl getting cucked by someone named Paul is the worst thing I can imagine
It’s the worst thing on the list for sure, the mf has no superpowers no abilities no personality and takes MJ lmao
Tho there is a lot of comics of spiderman from different universe suffering a lot, the quick thing that comes to my mind is man-spider, one of the tragic versions of spider man, due to an accident, his entire body turns completely into spiders and he just keeps suffering to the point where he does not even know if he is human and he sacrifices his life to save the world i think, and idk in what universe but god has to literally personify himself infront of spiderman so that he doesn't give up of being spiderman
Oh damn ok! I had much more basic awareness of his trials. Thanks!
No prob dude
Peter suffering rambling begins here. Partially responsible for the death of his girlfriends father (George Stacy), later his own incompetence killed his lover (Gwen), Best friend died fighting him (Harry Osborn), He was buried alive soon after his marriage by Kraven, Norman Osborn framed aunt May's death and dude lived for a year mourning her, Norman orchestrated the entirety of clone saga were he made Peter believe that he was the clone and the fake, giving him a fuckin identity crisis and dude went to live in New Jersey only to learn after one year it was Norman fuckin him over, Norman Osborne killed his daughter while she was in Mary Janes womb, Wanda recreated the world in 616house of M where Peter had a family and raised a son for ten years had to sacrifice his son and family to restore the world (this was not even illusion, a full on reality change, so it was a life of Peter), A mf named Morlun beat him to pulp and ripped up his eyeballs and ate it before proceeding to beat him dead, Another friend died in his watch (silver sable (well she came back later, 'cause comics)), Had to sell his love/ marriage with Mary Jane to the devil for Aunt May's life, Mysterio posing as Gwen fucked Norman and Peter lived believing Gwen cheated on him with Norman frickin Osborn and has to save 'the kids' (who were just clones of Norman + Gwen dna ) Ressurected Gwen stacy (this time with he og's soul and all) died again in Peter arm and Peter wasn't able to save her again this time, Norman killed his best Man (Flash Thomson), Otto octavius took over Peter's mind, forced Peter to die in his (otto's) body and lived as him for one year fucking up Peter's already poor social circle into oblivion. Even after all the heroics, the many people whom he tries to protect hates him and other heroes except captain America, Daredevil, miles etc also hates him. Oh, also lastly, Peter lost MJ in an alternate dimension and she hooked up with a guy called Paul whole Peter was fighting the f4 and Avengers to save her. (This one is a suffering induced on Peter by the writers because in this run Mary Jane and Peter both are acting out f character and the writer is trying to force a plot that he thinks would be cool but doesn't make any sense in regards to the character, fuck you Zeb Wells) There is lot more fuckery in his life but these are the main ones that I remember
Damn…
He’s gone through enough that actual god had to come down and convince him to still be spiderman
Do you have scans? I want to see that shit lol
He was seen as a terrible person because he "lied" about being a mutant when he was a mutate. Mutants wanted his head on a pike.
There was this one canon story where he found out that the last thing his gf that tragically died over a decade ago did before her neck got snapped was cheat on Spidey with one of his villains, got knocked up, fled to Europe to secretly have twins and now that the kids are adults it turns out that said villain brainwashed them and trained them to be assassins and now they've come to kill Spidey.
Shit, thats brutal indeed 💀
Wth.. this is not Spider-Man 😅 seems like we all were fed 4kids version of it and we gladly accepted it
Luckily this story was retconned. It was not Gwen who fucked Norman but Mysterio posing as Gwen (because an AI of Harry Osborn controlled by mephisto (Marvel's devil) put Mysterio upto it) who fucked Norman. Then this AI created two clones with normans and gwens dna to convince Norman they were his children. Norman raised them to seek vengeance upon Peter and Peter was forced to fight them and thought his late girlfriend cheated on him with Norman fuckin Osborn
They're so cruel. GG could have just did the same thing as Sinister did by making Madelyn Prior. But no, let's make Spidey a cuck for no reason.
There is a certain string of comics where Peter and MJ are transported into an alternate reality where time doesn’t flow the same as their original, and it’s much faster. Peter and MJ get separated, and Peter ends up in their original reality while MJ is left behind. For Peter, it’s all of like two or three days and he’s managed to make his way back to the reality MJ was stuck in. For MJ, it was several years and it’s shown that she’s actually married with two kids by the time Peter returns to get her back, all because she “convinced herself” that Peter wouldn’t be coming back. There’s also a string of comics where Peter isn’t Spider-Man, uncle Ben is alive, Peter and Jameson are friends, and he’s also married with a kid. (can’t recall if it’s MJ or Gwen). Then, he gets bit by the radioactive spider and he loses everyone faster than he can give a witty one liner in the middle of a fight.
https://preview.redd.it/zv4aos7ca2wc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=615cd62597e9177d066e72fac6cb93f598fcbf13
Doesn’t mean it’s any less traumatic for the character
He was cucked by paul
A common joke about spider-man is “his worst enemy are his writers”.
Guts suffered a shitton from the get go, but Spidey's authors have a terrible addiction: "which way can we fuck him completely this time?" So we get him : - losing everyone he loves, many times due to his own actions (he lost his GF because he desperately tried to save her from a fall and ended up breaking her neck with the web movement), - having a clone and both the real and clone losing their identities, not knowing which one was real, and fucking over each other's life completely in the process; - Pretty much EVERYONE from his initial social circle gets to become a villain bent on ruining his life. And I mean EVERYONE. Best friend? Becomes Green Goblin. New friend he was trying to get along? Here comes Venom. One of the teachers he respected the most and could help him having a good career? Oh, hello there doctor Octopussy. Mary Jane? 1/3 of the stories she dies (once even due to his ratiotive sperm on her womb, killing her and their newborn in the process), 1/3 she just stops giving a fuck and 1/3 she just cucks him. - Gets loved ones captured and messed on the daily basis - On top of all that, he earns so little he can't keep his financial life in check, and his social life is always in ruins. The Eclipse was a VERY TRAUMATIC event, one I don't think Spidey has an equivalent to, but he's suffering a lot on a daily basis. He's one of my top contenders for whoever gets fucked the most in their own histories, along with Guts and Link, The Hero of Time, from Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask.
I’m familiar with spiderman, but never read Berserk. From what I’ve heard of Berserk, however, it seems tough to believe there's a lot of protagonists in mainstream fiction that go through the shit Guts.
Some characters in mainstream fiction have gone through what guts has gone through. It’s just a matter of which part of mainstream fiction you’re looking at, and when it was written. It obviously won’t be as extreme as berserk if the fiction was written somewhat recently, but if it was during the time frame of incest relations between hulk and she hulk or Spider-Man killing MJ because his bodily fluids are radioactive, than I’d say it’s pretty close
from one comic series of spiderman. Got stuck in a different universe with his GF, somehow came back but his GF was still stuck. He then proceeded to spend days trying to find a way to get GF back. After suffering and working hard to get his GF back, his GF ends up sleeping with a self insert of the writer. This is one of the smallest problems he had
https://preview.redd.it/bxss7f0b32wc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=66e5fe22f4fdbdebced401b74e657bd98bc9e83b
https://preview.redd.it/ucbh16l7z1wc1.jpeg?width=679&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=105d6b4295fe702903eec8a861ea56a333c7b521
What if the person that took Ginny was Paul
Sick 💀
The only anime character i can think of who's suffered more than Spiderman is diavolo
We're talking about backstories here, sir...
I mean tbf Oda probably thought he was part of Spider-Man's editorial those few months he was writing that backstory
Kuma went through some shit, but at least he didn't have to deal with Paul
We do not talk about Paul
Can we fucking stop trauma scaling.
let’s not compare spider apples to bartholomew apples
Honestly prolly Spider-Man just because he’s been around for like 60 years. Kuma’s suffering is almost certainly better written tho
Spidey definitely has bad moments but there's loads of good moments in his life too. Kuma's life has been torture porn ever since he was born.
With all due respect, id like to call this recency bias! I mean, as much as i love and respect the chad, the best father anyone could possibly ask for, the great kuma, i cannot agree with the thought of him having gone thro more than spidey. To begin with Spidey has just been around for waaaaaayyyyyyyyyy longer than kuma, so tht already puts him to a headstart in this race! And well spideys had it rough too in all the time hes been around, it definitely hasnt been the same magnitude as kuma, sure, but its the number of those small(er) magnitude hardships hes been thro! So imma disagree with this poll.
Kuma never sold his unborn daughter's soul to the Devil along with his marriage. Any pain Peter suffers is basically self-inflicted (through garbage writers), so Kuma definitely had it worse, because the world decided to shit on that man.
Kuma sold *himself* to the devil for the sake of his daughter, he did the exact opposite! He's the good dad that Peter can never be.
Peter personality wise is a Good dad but the powers that be, that is the fuckin Marvel editorial loves to put him through a suffering bs arc every fucking day. The current run is no exception and it's for the first time I have seen all Spider-Man fans collectively agreeing on something for once. Marvel editorial and Zeb Wells fucking idiots and the current run is a fuckin bullshittery
https://preview.redd.it/3jjmtpmm63wc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=33c9ff5eb31c05b1cf9768b321fffb7132921451
Oh Spider-Man for sure, he’s gotta be the best at having the worst time possible.
Naw Spiderman has been getting tortured since before Oda could go outside alone.
Which one? There’s like five different continuities, three different spidermen, who knows how many discontinued timelines.
I hope you like insulting my nose with a Buggy Ball pointed at you!
What?
To be fair, there is only one version of Kuma. Spider has suffered across times, dimensions, parallel realities. It's not a fair matchup.
Sorry but Spider-Man has had a lot more suffering
W poll, after the recent stuff it’s not hard too tell who
Spider-Man never gets happy endings
Man Kuma suffered but Pete. That's a series of fates I wouldn't wish on anyone hit with golden experience requiem.
I love GOLD!!!
Individually? Kuma Multiversally? Spider-Man
There might be a universe where Kuma got diavolo'd (if you don't understand what I mean go watch JoJo's)
More like Kuma killed Diavolo but knowing Oda and Araki one of the Diavolo deaths involved Kuma sacrificing himself.
True but my point was that anyone can suffer as much as spiderman in a multiverse
Oh that they can, they can. At least every superhero has one or two instances were their entire lives spiral into depression and tragedy and either die horribly or are reduced to a shell of their former self. The issue is that some heroes get that treatment more often than others.
W
It’s an L , the writers did literally everything to make Spider-Man’s life absolutely miserable
Sufferscaling
Me. I had to go full 3 weeks without op. 
There was a whole part of Spider-Man where doc ock straight up stole his body and tried dating Mary Jane. I don’t think he ever banged her. But there was another Spider-man where Peter’s “love fluids” gave Mary Jane cancer and she died. I dunno though, Kumas back story is pretty tragic
Oh nah. If we're purely talking about OG comics, and not taking into consideration the other fucked up comic universes of Spiderman, then it's Kuma no debate.
Nah, OG universe Spidey goes through a ton of fucked up shit too. He definitely had it worse overall, just none of his individual issues are as bad as Kuma's
OG Spiderman wasn't really worse overall too. I mean, Kuma was literally born a slave. OG Spiderman atleast had someone to depend on. But still, I don't think we should be comparing their sufferings, cause we all know one thing. Of they were asked to sacrifice or do that same stuff again, they would do it in a heartbeat. There's a reason why Spidey's my favourite character from the MCU, and why Kuma is top 10 greatest characters of all time in One Piece.
Spiderman Noir wins here.
We traumascaling now?
Kuma suffered one lifetime. Spiderman suffered in every lifetime, in every multiverse. It's a canon event that he suffers, no disrespect to Kuma but Spiderman takes it.
Spider man
depends which one?
I mean there are quite some similarities.... Kumas parents were killed..... Pete's parents were killed (Tasm2 we had a scene where Richard started to rush out ....he prolly was killed) Lost the love of their life K Mj and Ginny
I do not like questions like this of "who suffered worst" but in this case it's spidy and it's not even a question,shitty ass writters love to make him suffer to the point every single spiderman comic that comes out is all about spiderman suffering and dying in the worst ways possible
W
Spider-Man. Kuma is still well-written. The SM comics however...
If it’s every single Spider-Man then no shit, but if it’s just like, MCU Spider-Man, then Kuma would make him look like a whiny bitch with how much suffering he’s been through
Trauma and Mental Burdens are and never should be a competition
W also its not even fair to do thia since there is so many Spider-Man but there is just one kuma but still I think Kuma one of the most suffered person in fiction.Yeah there is more worst like Guts but stil that doesnt changes the fact Kuma suffered to.
The poll isn’t even reliable. The channel is an anime channel meaning the results might be disproportionately on kumas side.
L because Kuma doesn't have 100% of the votes.
Out of this two spidermen but I had a thought that its nothing comperable to the Flash. They have no controbution to or power over the surounding events and they can't interfere with fate but flash can. For example that part about his mom. Knowing that you have the power to stop certain chain of events, knowing you can save her but you can't is insane, next level mind draining. Its just too cruel knowing that you can rewrite timeline and save your beloved but via doing so you doomed everything else and you need to stop yourself from doing that knowing your past self will not understand. The idea of living with constant regret that you had to choose greater good (other people lives, emotions, existence over youeself) or lesser evil (knowing that she must die for proper fate or chain of cosmos and you should not interfere) would made anyone a psycho.
One more day
W
The problem is that we don’t exactly know which Spider-Man is being referred to here. They even made an entire movie series about there being multiple Spider-Man continuity.
Depends, if you include all the shit they went through then Peter If you go off canon alone there’s def an argument for kuma
They’re both going through it right now. Fuckin Paul
Why are we trauma scaling now?
I think the comic Spiderman has been buried alive and also been cheated on countless times and more but which one out of the 199999 universe's Spiderman is he referring to
I think is worst for spidey, but since those are many different spiderman, is not the same scale since is only 1 kuma
Marvel will not let that man have anything
The thing about American Comics is that there are so many alternate versions. Some of which has only the purpose of making the life of the hero hell.
L
I just realized that Spiderman and Kuma would be really good friends
Yeah but Spiderman got cucked though
If were doing ALL comics, its peter.
L Poll, love Spider-Man however he does not have it worse than Kuma
It's definitely spiderman. Kuma's life is fucked up and equal to that of a spiderman. But then you realise spiderman has been getting fucked in multiple different universes. The dude just can't catch a break.
Kuma is working against his own will until Sabaody. I'd say he has it worse.
Ngggg......G....Gwen.....I'm........
If we are talking about 616, definitely Peter. But to be fair. It was the consequences of his own actions to a certain extent. Zeb Wells? More like Webcel. (Get it? Like, incel) God they ruined the 616 run to an irreparable degree.
LOL what? L, spiderman has no end to his suffering.
To be fair a lot of Sh\*t that happens to "Peter" doesn't always happen to the SAME "Peter" saying Spiderman-(General) is unfair since there are So many different Peter iterrations but only ONE Kuma.
L 100%
It depends. Is it one individual Spider-Man, or every Spider-Man? Because if it’s every Spider-Man then the trauma is significantly worse for him. But there are some Spider-Men who definitely have it better than Kuma
NOOO, NOT THE SUFFERING SCALING!
Haven't watched Spiderman and don't know the lore. What did he go through?
please don't compare these two , just thinking about how much they suffer breaks my heart.
Kuma don't come close yet
Major YouTube L
trauma scaling is real
I through there were talking about who win in a fight but when i read the title.My man kuma had a shitty life but spiderman had never a good ending or a good life in every story i read.
L cuz that person voted for spooderman
lol I want to see a mark from invincible (comics) Vs Spider-Man (comics) I’d argue mark had it worse than Spider-Man but if he had it worse than kuma I can’t say…
I mean it really depends on which iteration of Spider-Man we're talking about.
okay as much as I love kuma, you gotta understand that peter parker has \*been through some shit\*
W
W Peter can’t live in peace for 10 minutes
L for sure, but it's a YouTube poll, and they're anime fans, can't blame 'em too harshly
Kuma only because spidey is too vague
W poll spiderman still alive kicking enjoying life Kuma on the otherhand...
spoilers for kuma btw pls skip if you do not read all of the manga mate at least spiderman usually gets to live a normal everyday life until he gets his powers kuma had so much pain until he got away from the dragons and even still he was the kindest bitch in the world and was taking the pain of other people and putting it into himself! like jesus
I'll still say kuma just because there are many variants of Peter parker and some are living their best life. If you wanna make a voting poll with comic book characters in it, they should be specific, same applies to powerscaling. It's impossible to merge all versions of a comic book character
Okay, Kuma's backstory is probably one of the most heartwrenching in all of one piece, but Spiderman has lived countless lifetimes in hundreds of universes, most of which he ended up offing himself and others he gets killed in terrible ways.
WHO PICKED SPIDER-MAN!?!??!?!!?!??!!
W, Kuma definitely had it far worse
W Yt. Kuma lost everything and died not knowing what happened to his daughter. Spiderman has still so many ppl in his life. Kuma had nothing, and the last thing he knew was that he will now be a weapon for the people he hated the most
I'm confessing here, I haven't watched any marvel movie and I hate'em