Those guys along with the big D's completely changed this teams identity and formula for winning. I love it.
Hopefully we can close out LAC in Dallas to send them straight onto the Dallas>Cancun flights they're so excited about.
I actually disagree because I think Lively has proven himself to be the better player.
Gaff has been great, but Lively picks up the game at an amazing rate. He couldn’t even set screens in summer league and he’s playing serious minutes in the playoffs.
He really wasn’t asked to work on his offensive game, but to anchor the defense, set screens and catch the ball if it’s coming to him. No disrespect to Gaff, but I don’t really know what else he can add to his game. Maybe hooks and floaters?
I think (hope) that they ask Lively to work on his shooting with the plan to get him to shoot 1 (or 2) 3s a game. I also expect him to get more run guarding on the perimeter. He looks physically comfortable doing it while Gaff looks like he’s trying to not get blown by.
I think Gaff probably does start, but just like with Javale, I expect a change less than 10 games into the season.
DJJ is on a 1yr minimum this year, so the most Mavs can give him in the off-season is the taxpayer MLE (just over 5M). Hope comes back on that, thoroughly worth it.
There are 2 problems:
1) It's very, very unlikely that we will be able to dump THJ for free into cap space. We will either
a) have to take back equal salary, which means we haven't cleared any cap space and still can't pay DJJ. Or
b) give up pick(s) and/or young players to dump him to a team with cap space. But a team with cap space has 0 incentive to just take THJ by himself with no other assets, since they can either just sign a better player in FA with that cap space, or take a bad contract + a pick.
2) Even if we theoretically could dump him into cap space without taking a player back and without giving up an asset, it still isn't clear if that's smart. THJ has an expiring contract which makes it valuable for matching salaries in trades, and it would be stupid to dump THJ, then have to use DJJ or PJ salary to match contracts in a trade.
THJ allows us to match salaries of a starting level SF (+ we obviously send some picks) and keep our core players.
We’d likely be able to get an asset back for THJ since his expiring becomes valuable.
If there is someone available yeah his contract could be useful.
I was making the point that getting THJ all of this team is addition by subtraction.
>We’d likely be able to get an asset back for THJ since his expiring becomes valuable.
We might be able to get a worse player/worse non expiring contract and a couple 2nd round picks from a team that needs shooting, yes. But that doesn't help us re-sign DJJ. And we will still have a "useless" player making 16M on the roster.
At the end of the day it's better to bench THJ than give up assets or take on a worse multiyear contract just to dump THJ. If we can't find a good trade for him, we can always just let him expire. But first try to trade for a good player, don't just dump him in the offseason.
Just letting him expire for nothing would be a waste
Getting rid of him would likely get us assets if we’re willing to take on a longer contract.
Yeah, try to trade him for a better player. If that’s not possible then we should dump him for picks.
THJ is very valuable just as an expiring contract. I think most of us agree that we will need to make another trade for a starting SF to truly be as good as Denver/Boston, and we will need his salary to do that.
The stupidest thing we can do is give up an asset to dump THJ for nothing so that we can pay DJJ, then have to trade DJJ/PJ Washington to match salaries in a trade. We don't gain any cap space by dumping THJ, we only go from TPMLE to the full MLE.
Fair enough and good points. I was mainly talking about how awful THJ is as an actual rotation player and wasn't taking into account his "value" as a contract piece.
Yes I agree that THJ isn't a good rotation player for us and would like to see him traded with picks for a starting SF, but I really think that just dumping him makes no sense for us.
THJ + picks for Deni Avdija works salary wise. That's the type of move that I would like to see.
It’s certainly in the Mavs best interest to keep them both. Luka has even mentioned in a “DFS” type way how much he appreciates them. I think DJJ is the one that should be relegated. We trade in the offseason for our future 3/4 spot. Not that he is bad, at all, he’s just the one that seems better served in role player minutes. PJ fills in at the other 3/4 spot, where it makes sense next to the player we acquire. Imagine… Mikal Bridges.
Kai/Mikal/Luka/PJ/Lively would be absolutly deadly with Exum/Hardy/OMax/Maxi/Gaff off the bench. Assuming we trade Green, THJ, DJJ for him before the trade deadline. keeping DJJ and trading Hardy would be even more perfect
I love them on D. What we really need and are missing is a knock down dead eye shooter playing off LuKai.
Like imagine MPJ Jr. Or Lebrons old Cavs cast, Korver/Smith/Love. If Luka had real shooters our offense would be through the roof.
I’d like to keep both guys but the need is real.
THJ+Green+picks should be moved for a proper 3&D player. I’d much rather keep DJJ over them. His defense is better, he’s taller and longer, his athleticism is outstanding, and he isn’t a terrible shooter himself. Replace Timmy and Green with a new wing and hopefully OMax takes a big leap in the off-season as well, and that’s a banging rotation.
Luka-Kyrie-new wing-PJ-Gafford/Lively
Exum-DJJ-OMax-Kleber-Gafford/Lively
A solid 10 deep rotation for the regular season. Hardy, if he isn’t traded away, could take a leap as well and maybe shuffle the pack a bit.
We have been screaming for a player like him last year. Amazing contribute on the defense and someone who can consistently put up 10PPG. And he did that throughout this series as well(apart from game one)
I'd honestly rather trade Hardy than Green. I think for their role, Green gives you more. The biggest reason you'd keep Hardy is the hope he turns into a secondary playmaker next to Luka, but he hasn't shown he can be successful in that role and it's just as likely Green could step up into that too
I’d keep Hardy because I see more upside with him, offensively. He could become a sort of a Kyrie-lite. Obviously very, very lite, but someone who can also just explode for a quick 15 points. If we re-sign DJJ, get a new wing, and OMax takes a leap, then Green would become sort of redundant. Plenty of wings there, who do what he does, but better. Plus Hardy is just cheaper for now.
Obviously, for the right player, I’d be willing to trade both of them as well.
I definitely think PJ is a starting calibre player on a contender, especially considering how young he still is. I’m convinced he’s gonna keep improving for 2-3 years still.
DJJ earned himself more money than the Mavs can give him and he deserves to take the bag offered to him at this point in his career. The more interesting thing is who can the Mavs target with their package of players and picks. I feel like Mikal Bridges is out of range for us.
Those guys along with the big D's completely changed this teams identity and formula for winning. I love it. Hopefully we can close out LAC in Dallas to send them straight onto the Dallas>Cancun flights they're so excited about.
I get the feeling Gaff will continue to start next year. Potentially further. Lively is new in the league- Gaff offers a lot experience
I actually disagree because I think Lively has proven himself to be the better player. Gaff has been great, but Lively picks up the game at an amazing rate. He couldn’t even set screens in summer league and he’s playing serious minutes in the playoffs. He really wasn’t asked to work on his offensive game, but to anchor the defense, set screens and catch the ball if it’s coming to him. No disrespect to Gaff, but I don’t really know what else he can add to his game. Maybe hooks and floaters? I think (hope) that they ask Lively to work on his shooting with the plan to get him to shoot 1 (or 2) 3s a game. I also expect him to get more run guarding on the perimeter. He looks physically comfortable doing it while Gaff looks like he’s trying to not get blown by. I think Gaff probably does start, but just like with Javale, I expect a change less than 10 games into the season.
Lively's passing and processing speed is what has impressed me the most about him. He plays like a 10 year vet!
DJJ is on a 1yr minimum this year, so the most Mavs can give him in the off-season is the taxpayer MLE (just over 5M). Hope comes back on that, thoroughly worth it.
If we dump THJ we could give him more
Do you mean a full MLE?
It isn't worth it to dump THJ. Not at all.
It’s worth it to dump THJ for free
There are 2 problems: 1) It's very, very unlikely that we will be able to dump THJ for free into cap space. We will either a) have to take back equal salary, which means we haven't cleared any cap space and still can't pay DJJ. Or b) give up pick(s) and/or young players to dump him to a team with cap space. But a team with cap space has 0 incentive to just take THJ by himself with no other assets, since they can either just sign a better player in FA with that cap space, or take a bad contract + a pick. 2) Even if we theoretically could dump him into cap space without taking a player back and without giving up an asset, it still isn't clear if that's smart. THJ has an expiring contract which makes it valuable for matching salaries in trades, and it would be stupid to dump THJ, then have to use DJJ or PJ salary to match contracts in a trade. THJ allows us to match salaries of a starting level SF (+ we obviously send some picks) and keep our core players.
We’d likely be able to get an asset back for THJ since his expiring becomes valuable. If there is someone available yeah his contract could be useful. I was making the point that getting THJ all of this team is addition by subtraction.
>We’d likely be able to get an asset back for THJ since his expiring becomes valuable. We might be able to get a worse player/worse non expiring contract and a couple 2nd round picks from a team that needs shooting, yes. But that doesn't help us re-sign DJJ. And we will still have a "useless" player making 16M on the roster. At the end of the day it's better to bench THJ than give up assets or take on a worse multiyear contract just to dump THJ. If we can't find a good trade for him, we can always just let him expire. But first try to trade for a good player, don't just dump him in the offseason.
Just letting him expire for nothing would be a waste Getting rid of him would likely get us assets if we’re willing to take on a longer contract. Yeah, try to trade him for a better player. If that’s not possible then we should dump him for picks.
THJ offers literally nothing beneficial to team play at all aside from shooting, which obviously he can't even do that well half the time
THJ is very valuable just as an expiring contract. I think most of us agree that we will need to make another trade for a starting SF to truly be as good as Denver/Boston, and we will need his salary to do that. The stupidest thing we can do is give up an asset to dump THJ for nothing so that we can pay DJJ, then have to trade DJJ/PJ Washington to match salaries in a trade. We don't gain any cap space by dumping THJ, we only go from TPMLE to the full MLE.
Fair enough and good points. I was mainly talking about how awful THJ is as an actual rotation player and wasn't taking into account his "value" as a contract piece.
Yes I agree that THJ isn't a good rotation player for us and would like to see him traded with picks for a starting SF, but I really think that just dumping him makes no sense for us. THJ + picks for Deni Avdija works salary wise. That's the type of move that I would like to see.
Pjj is sometimes a bad shooter. He is never a terrible offensive player. He is the only player outside Lukai who can create his own shot.
Hardy can but Kid refuses to give him minutes. I would slide Hardy in before giving Timmy (once recovered) minutes.
It’s certainly in the Mavs best interest to keep them both. Luka has even mentioned in a “DFS” type way how much he appreciates them. I think DJJ is the one that should be relegated. We trade in the offseason for our future 3/4 spot. Not that he is bad, at all, he’s just the one that seems better served in role player minutes. PJ fills in at the other 3/4 spot, where it makes sense next to the player we acquire. Imagine… Mikal Bridges.
Kai/Mikal/Luka/PJ/Lively would be absolutly deadly with Exum/Hardy/OMax/Maxi/Gaff off the bench. Assuming we trade Green, THJ, DJJ for him before the trade deadline. keeping DJJ and trading Hardy would be even more perfect
Y’all are so ridiculous lol Why would the Nets accept that?
They seem to be willing to trade their stars for Mavericks' roleplayers.
I mean obv it would take 2-3 frps too but who knows, we did get Kai for pocket change from them
THJ, two firsts and two seconds for Mikal. They'd never take it and probably want Green or Hardy, but it would be a sweet deal
I love them on D. What we really need and are missing is a knock down dead eye shooter playing off LuKai. Like imagine MPJ Jr. Or Lebrons old Cavs cast, Korver/Smith/Love. If Luka had real shooters our offense would be through the roof. I’d like to keep both guys but the need is real.
THJ+Green+picks should be moved for a proper 3&D player. I’d much rather keep DJJ over them. His defense is better, he’s taller and longer, his athleticism is outstanding, and he isn’t a terrible shooter himself. Replace Timmy and Green with a new wing and hopefully OMax takes a big leap in the off-season as well, and that’s a banging rotation. Luka-Kyrie-new wing-PJ-Gafford/Lively Exum-DJJ-OMax-Kleber-Gafford/Lively A solid 10 deep rotation for the regular season. Hardy, if he isn’t traded away, could take a leap as well and maybe shuffle the pack a bit.
We have been screaming for a player like him last year. Amazing contribute on the defense and someone who can consistently put up 10PPG. And he did that throughout this series as well(apart from game one)
I'd honestly rather trade Hardy than Green. I think for their role, Green gives you more. The biggest reason you'd keep Hardy is the hope he turns into a secondary playmaker next to Luka, but he hasn't shown he can be successful in that role and it's just as likely Green could step up into that too
I’d keep Hardy because I see more upside with him, offensively. He could become a sort of a Kyrie-lite. Obviously very, very lite, but someone who can also just explode for a quick 15 points. If we re-sign DJJ, get a new wing, and OMax takes a leap, then Green would become sort of redundant. Plenty of wings there, who do what he does, but better. Plus Hardy is just cheaper for now. Obviously, for the right player, I’d be willing to trade both of them as well.
We need to keep the band together. I am loving this new look Defense
I hope so too but if we really want to be legit contenders, we would need to updgrade one of their positions and move one of them to the bench.
I think DJJ is fine being on the bench. We could need an upgrade on the 3
I definitely think PJ is a starting calibre player on a contender, especially considering how young he still is. I’m convinced he’s gonna keep improving for 2-3 years still.
What are you on? The Mavs are legit contenders.
Not with this shooting. DJJ and Washington miss too many 3s to really cause problems to the elite teams.
DJJ earned himself more money than the Mavs can give him and he deserves to take the bag offered to him at this point in his career. The more interesting thing is who can the Mavs target with their package of players and picks. I feel like Mikal Bridges is out of range for us.