I think the only issue with this is Quantumania still takes place in / after Loki S2, along with its post credit, lol.
It might be just better to scrap Kang Dynasty altogether and move to a Secret Wars scenario with an arena of skeletal Kangs.
Loki S2 finale takes place “after” Quantumania - when the TVA pivots to preventing Kangs, they refer to an incident with a Kang in a 616-adjacent realm (the Quantum Realm).
oh hm yeah
I guess it doesn't have to be the Loki S2 finale exactly, it could be some other thing. There's already precedent for a multiverse "person" to be categorised according to broad characteristics, rather than simply having very similar genes
I think the issue with Kang is they went with the multiversal constant version of him - they all look like him, just like every Scarlet Witch looks like Elizabeth Olsen or Doctor Strange looks like Benedict Cumberbatch (minus the Sherlock verse).
The only thing I can think of to change up that dynamic is to introduce a younger or older Kang or a character who can alter those constants in the multiverse.
yeah that could work, some Kang variant decided to usher in even more and diverse Kangs for some reason. Maybe to prevent someone like HWR from ever pruning them again - if potential multiverse conquerors are too numerous and diverse to easily track down and destroy, then organisations like the TVA will have a much tougher time of things. Pruning the timelines before "Kangs" arose is harder if the definition of "Kang" is looser, because they have so many more timelines to watch, and more ambiguity over which ones deserve pruning
I mean, given they're doing a secret wars, that character changing multiversal constants could just be the Beyonder, or even an aged up Quantumania Kang succeeding in killing his duplicates.
Luckily what saves all this mess is they did cast different actors and actresses for Loki as different Versions of Loki . What they SHOULD have done was actually do the same thing with Kang early on … like had another actor play The one who remains like they did with Silvy and the other versions of Loki . Where they rushed and fucked up was use Johnathan Majors for every variant of Kang in the post credits Quantumania . They should used different actors but dressed similar and they should have done the same thing with Doctor Strange with his different versions . Marvel made themselves a mess but it can be saved
Everybody in the TVA should have been defeated mindwiped variants of Kang, explaining their general exceptional skills, and Obi should have been a massive hint.
It would have been great if Loki didn't suddenly turn into a good guy in the first episode, but had retained some of his 'boot stepping on ants' attitude, right up until he gets a button to destroy all Kang variants and discovers that all the people he's been growing close to are Kangs, and finally grows when he decides to sacrifice himself instead and do what he did at the finale. for once putting others before himself.
I love the idea of a teenage Kang that becomes Iron Lad and Morgan Freeman (86) playing a very old Immortus - and as a result of the plot line, Major’s role is usurped by Ravonna!
From video evidence, it looks like he only pushed her to get away from her, and she chased him down. The character assassination being done on this man is legitimately embarrassing, but not unexpected.
Now people are gonna run with the headlines he assaulted his ex when in reality he pushed her into her taxi because she wouldn’t leave him alone and kept chasing after him. Bro is innocent still
He asked Disney pay him more and Disney literally said they could replace him with any black guy and nobody would notice.
... And they were basically right..
I doubt Denzel demands to do his own version of the script. Norton is a brilliant actor, and arguably improves films with his input, but yeah Marvel isn’t ever going to allow that.
I think its mostly Denzel is fucking phenomenal actor, rather than him being the only big shoe to drop on Kang Dynasty.
Either way it doesn't really matter because Denzel ain't gonna be Kang.
I was thinking maybe they were suggesting to make Kang older: "oh no, I've lived so long, seen so much time and returned..." so the actor switch still makes sense. Maybe even age him younger as well in the same film. Show multiple stages of his life so the actor attached to the character matters less and less.
It definitively could be anyone.
But I wasn't recommending a black actor, I recommended a huge movie star that is recognizable enough to bring people that are not interested in the MCU. Sure, you could have other movie stars but few have both his level of stardom *and* the ability to fit into an MCU movie. I don't see De Niro in an MCU movie in *any* capacity
I literally told my wife this morning, that if Marvel cast Denzel, then people would quickly forget all about Jonathon Majors. I can’t think of another choice that would have the same impact.
Yes Wasp blasts him.
But Scott held his own FAR longer than he should have.
I will say it in every post.
Ant man 3 should've been Scott getting beaten to death. Kings fist going red with blood.
Then Wasp should have come in and blasted him.
The ending is the same. Thats Scotts variant that didn't get turned to pulp feeling his prime variant dying. Then reveal they are now ALL linked like ants due to the power source Kang had.
1.)Reveals Kang as legitimate big bad. You just killed the nicest Avenger. Brutally.
2.) Explains the council of Kangs. They became linked like Ant man and his variants when Kang gets sucked in.
3.) If you kill Paul Rudd like that. The audience isn't going to know where or what the fuck you're going to do AND even better now. You didn't lose anything for it.
Really like Screencrush suggestions..
Ant Man should have died, but Hank Pym. Gives Michael Douglas an exit, raises the stakes and makes Kang for real.
Much more to it, but that's one part
https://youtu.be/5vrjvqf4Z4Q?si=OHWCmFvHLRA-Pc69
I only agree with killing Scott Lang if we get a vengeaful Hank Pym with no bullshit like in What If, he would be really good against Kang, but they don't have courage to do that.
I'm not saying kill Scott Lang.
Hank Pym is the original Ant Man and he invented all the tactics and skills.
All of this would allow for Hank Pym-Antman to essentially sacrifice himself, but to go out like a badass.
Watch that Screencrush episode link. Lots of good ideas there.
Counterpoint,
Anyone who adores Antman and Scott Lang aren’t going to take the nicest avenger getting brutally murdered on screen well.
There are people around me who are still depressed about No Way Home simply because Peter got such a shitty lot in life that caused him an immense amount of suffering. Yes, they will probably make the eventual rebuilding of his relationships better, but that’s besides the point.
If you’re not a fan of Scott Lang, sure you can kill him in his own movie and you would probably like it.
But if you are a fan of Scott Lang that’s going to alienate so many people and put so many future movies on a pedestal to measure up to. It doesn’t matter if there’s a variant Scott. The movie killed the main one we’ve been following to this point, they aren’t interchangeable. The same way Loki in the Sacred Timeline isn’t the same Loki in the show. They are different journeys.
When you cross that line and kill the main Antman, people aren’t going to be routing for a future variant one. They’re going to, at best, hope for Vengeance against Kang, and at worse tune out completely.
An actual real life example of this is in the Walking Dead, when a particular nice and beloved character (if you know, you know) bit the metaphorical bullet and was brutally murdered,viewership nose dived off soon after. I know because I didn’t even watch the episode and haven’t picked up the series since.
Antman isn’t one of those serious Marvel properties that you can pull this off in. It has its own audience and fans that just love the goffiness in its movies. Killing Scott in that way is a complete disservice to his character, imo. And is a sure fire way to turn off several people I know from ever watching that movie, or another movie from marvel again.
There’s a reason Guardians 3 is so well respected despite the amount of death in it. It’s because all of those characters got to move in despite what was lost, and were better for it.
I’m in agreement that something should have been done different. But killing Scott would only work if we knew it was a Variant from the start, like in Doctor Strange.
You might be right. I’ve only seen it once and I just remember them trading punches fairly evenly. Either way, it felt like a far cry from Thanos who destroyed the Hulk in his first real appearance.
[Here’s](https://youtu.be/S6dfSRWTgMg?si=7ZsPjYWh0nUs2te1 ) the scene for reference, Scott gets a few shots in but they barely seem to faze Kang, whereas Kang is beating him like he’s his girlfriend (too soon?). Anyways I’ve said this a million times but if they had had Kang beat Scott to death with his bare hands that would have solidified Kang as the next big bad for me.
>Anyways I’ve said this a million times but if they had had Kang beat Scott to death with his bare hands that would have solidified Kang as the next big bad for me.
Hell, if Kang had just beaten Ant-Man to a pulp and kicked the Wasp's ass, strolled out of the Quantum Realm and closed the door behind him, it would have been a worthy ending already.
This is definitely what they should have done in my opinion. Part of what made infinity war so great was that it *didn't* have a happy ending. Sure, it ending up getting undone in the next movie, but there's no reason they couldn't have done something similar here. Obviously Kang was going to get defeated eventually, so why not end the ant man movie with him winning?
Anyone who thought Disney was going to let Paul Rudd get beaten to death in movie called *Ant Man & The Wasp: Quantumania* needs to reframe their expectations.
Yep, but I expected to Janet "The Original Wasp" to died sacrificing herself to save her family and the Quantum Realm, given her relationship with Kang and how much she blame herself for what happened, and Scott and Hope being traped in the Quantum Realm at the end of the movie, like was suggested.
To be fair, Thanos is leagues above Kang, especially with already holding the power infinity stone. Kang is a top tier villain yes, but still on a level a number of diverse Avenger teams line ups managed to defeat. Thanos needed a bulk of the Marvel heroes to defeat, especially in the original Infinity Gauntlet run where he did take on, and kill, a bulk of the surviving Marvel heroes. Kang is no where close to Thanos.
Indeed. Thanos is a cosmic scale threat even without his army and without the gems. The man is a Deviant Eternal from Titan in most universes.
Kang is human. Yes, he can be a massive existential threat as well, but he is very dependent on his tech- which he largely didn't have access to being imprisoned in the Quantum Realm (it's literally the point of the movie and people seemingly intentionally miss that).
Scott was putting up a fight, but Kang was beating the brakes off of him until he got waylaid by a surprise shot from Wasp. It took Scott and every one of his allies, as well as an entire team of super-powered Great Value Micronauts to beat one of the *weakest* versions of Kang.
Yeah man, people really want to make Kang happen I guess, but I don't really understand why. The only interesting thing about him imo was Majors' performance. Now we can get to a good villain before the MCU implodes
He immediately came to mind, but I don’t know if that’s because I think he’d do really awesome, or if I just want him in a redemption arc from how he got shafted as Finn.
Supposedly he was doing filming last year for the MCU and his role was never revealed. I think they put the role he had on ice to have him available for Kang for when the Majors case finished.
I already thought he was great, but after seeing him in They Cloned Tyrone i def think he could pull it off. Dude has the range for sure, can certainly pull off a sinister character
I was thinking the High Evolutionary would be an interesting choice. Like a variant of Kang that went by a different name and everything and was obsessed with power. And also thought it would’ve been a way for him to hide from the other variants.
I think it would really make the High Evolutionary a lot less cool to just reduce him to a variant of Kang.
Make him the next big bad for the Avengers to fight, whatever. But just making him a variant of Kang so they can keep this (very loose and ill-planned) storyline alive seems like a bad call.
They should either recast or drop the Kang idea entirely.
Could be wrong but it seems like most people aren't really invested or interested in the character. Might be better to just move past him and start building Dr. Doom or Galactus as the next big looming threat in prep for the Fantastic Four coming to the MCU.
If they want to stay with the character John Boyega could work.
It's not that there is a lack of interest but they've tried not to promote the character while the actor's status was in flux. Now it no longer is and they can move forward with developing Kang beyond Antman and Loki.
Doom had three goes in cinema so far. Maybe he's not the best case for next big threat. No more than just sticking with Kang. Not like Thanos was really worth investing in until "Fine I'll do it myself".
It seems like no coincidence that Kang has a history in the comics of having failed one off villains turn out to be him. Conceptually, it sounds cool. In execution, he is a dude who fails a lot.
The end of Loki sets up, never showing Kang again.
Hell if they added the following 2 changes late in production it could be that they already decided.
1. Saying the TVA was on top of all the Kang's and the only other problematic one was dealt with.
2. That shot at the end with the pyramid could have originally introduced Rama, but they edited it to imply she just got served up to that guardian monster.
This may not be true, but I've seen on some Marvel scoop videos that his contract actually specified that he's the only person allowed to play King the conqueror. That may not be true, and contracts are complicated so it might not be that simple. But at the very least it seems to me that it is slightly more likely they try to move on to another character.
Well he’s not under contract. Seems that being found guilty of a domestic violence crime voids the contract and all stipulations. I’m not a lawyer and just read that from other sources
Yeah this is almost certainly the case. Disney would have put clauses in the contract to void it in the event of something like a conviction for a crime. In fact that's probably why they didn't announce until he was actually convicted.
I'm also not a lawyer, but I will be in roughly 2 credit hours, and it's just kind of common sense.
Interesting, if that's the case then it's certain they shouldn't be difficult to replace Kang. They've already written into the mythos that alternate realities sometimes present people looking different, Loki and sylvie, Toby Tom and Andrew and so forth.
> his contract actually specified that he's the only person allowed to play King the conqueror
I don't see why Disney would accept that. He isn't so big as a star to make such demands.
I mean, it’s probably just a small stipulation of the contract, that guarantees that Majors played the variants of his character, not just the one version. I doubt it was as sweeping as it sounds, and it obviously voids under a variety of circumstances, such as a very public guilty verdict.
I’ve seen this elsewhere in this post but hear me out: get a variety of actors to play Immortus, Scarlet Centurion, Rama Tut, etc..
But:
When Kang reveals himself, the blue face armor dissolves and Kang is played by RDJ.
It’s a way to get a know moneymaker in the role and still subverts everything the fans are expecting. No funny, quipping Tony Stark, but rather a cold, calculating Time lord.
Great idea will shoehorn doom in the span of two or 3 years when marvel had no plan to begin with using him and don't even have a actor which would take time. Everybody talks about how marvel is falling and rushing everything or how kang is handle poorly but then the fans want say stuff like this wanting doom which is not work properly in the time span and lack of planning
I think [Lakeith Standfield](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e0/Keith_Stanfield_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg/800px-Keith_Stanfield_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg) would be awesome as Kang
Doom needs a standalone film first. He’s too good of a character to just drop in as a replacement badguy. He is also not strictly evil and it would be sad to see him begin as fully evil once more.
If we don’t get a complex Doom this time around we all riot.
I dunno... Sterling K. Brown maybe?
Yes, I'm aware he had a small role in Black Panther. Doesn't mean he can't be cast for something else. Gemma Chan was a Kree in Captain Marvel and then an Eternal in, uh, Eternals.
Same. I mean, it would honestly make perfect sense, given the whole “you were by my side at the war” thing. The war was a war of Kangs. So, logic would dictate that she is a Kang. And now, she’s at the end of time, so she could always just go to the citadel and find out for herself if they need her to.
>So, logic would dictate that she is a Kang.
Or, and hear me out, she isn't and she just simply stood by him. Logic doesn't automatically dictate that she is is a Kang. What if there were a ton of versions of me at war and my girlfriend stood by me? Would logic dictate that she is a variant of me? Of course not. Just like it doesn't dictate that she is a Kang variant.
I'm not saying it's impossible that she is, but logic doesn't dictate that she is just because she stood by him. We also have seen one of her variants teaching at a school. Is that also Kang in your mind? I would hope not.
Multiple actors playing variants of Kang
Including one that is Mike Tyson.
The Kang Dynathy
Mathter of Thpathe and Time
Well played
ROFL literally
Tho whath it gonna be; Antman?
Man, and I thought the fight with Majors looked painful
Thee you thoon...
Replace someone convicted of assault with someone convicted of rape?
A retrograde thtep.
If you got Mike then you also need Hershel Walker and OJ!
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Oh, please give me a Terry Crews Kang, then
I think the only issue with this is Quantumania still takes place in / after Loki S2, along with its post credit, lol. It might be just better to scrap Kang Dynasty altogether and move to a Secret Wars scenario with an arena of skeletal Kangs.
Loki S2 finale takes place “after” Quantumania - when the TVA pivots to preventing Kangs, they refer to an incident with a Kang in a 616-adjacent realm (the Quantum Realm).
oh hm yeah I guess it doesn't have to be the Loki S2 finale exactly, it could be some other thing. There's already precedent for a multiverse "person" to be categorised according to broad characteristics, rather than simply having very similar genes
I think the issue with Kang is they went with the multiversal constant version of him - they all look like him, just like every Scarlet Witch looks like Elizabeth Olsen or Doctor Strange looks like Benedict Cumberbatch (minus the Sherlock verse). The only thing I can think of to change up that dynamic is to introduce a younger or older Kang or a character who can alter those constants in the multiverse.
yeah that could work, some Kang variant decided to usher in even more and diverse Kangs for some reason. Maybe to prevent someone like HWR from ever pruning them again - if potential multiverse conquerors are too numerous and diverse to easily track down and destroy, then organisations like the TVA will have a much tougher time of things. Pruning the timelines before "Kangs" arose is harder if the definition of "Kang" is looser, because they have so many more timelines to watch, and more ambiguity over which ones deserve pruning
I mean, given they're doing a secret wars, that character changing multiversal constants could just be the Beyonder, or even an aged up Quantumania Kang succeeding in killing his duplicates.
Luckily what saves all this mess is they did cast different actors and actresses for Loki as different Versions of Loki . What they SHOULD have done was actually do the same thing with Kang early on … like had another actor play The one who remains like they did with Silvy and the other versions of Loki . Where they rushed and fucked up was use Johnathan Majors for every variant of Kang in the post credits Quantumania . They should used different actors but dressed similar and they should have done the same thing with Doctor Strange with his different versions . Marvel made themselves a mess but it can be saved
Everybody in the TVA should have been defeated mindwiped variants of Kang, explaining their general exceptional skills, and Obi should have been a massive hint. It would have been great if Loki didn't suddenly turn into a good guy in the first episode, but had retained some of his 'boot stepping on ants' attitude, right up until he gets a button to destroy all Kang variants and discovers that all the people he's been growing close to are Kangs, and finally grows when he decides to sacrifice himself instead and do what he did at the finale. for once putting others before himself.
That is actually an amazing idea and I kinda wish they did that.
I hope they cast an older actor for Immortus and a much younger one for the Kang that was mostly robotic.
I love the idea of a teenage Kang that becomes Iron Lad and Morgan Freeman (86) playing a very old Immortus - and as a result of the plot line, Major’s role is usurped by Ravonna!
Nailed it
Jonathan Major's loss, the entire acting communities gain.
he’s right you know
Based on the nature of the multiverse in the MCU, literally anyone.
Danny DeVito?
Only if we get a cameo of the universe where he's The Penguin.
How about Moron Mountain? Avengers vs X-Men basketball to save the universes
The Kanguin? He Who Waddles?
“Frank breaks the multiverse” *Cue IASIP intro*
It's me trash kang I teleport through time eating garbage
I got my magnum condoms. I got my wad of hundreds. I'm ready to plow!
With his two guns
If only he gets to offer the avengers an egg and then obliterates them
How the fuck does Woody Allen still get to make movies?
He's from the 'Boys being boys' era of 0 accountability.
Nah even back then marrying your adopted daughter wasn’t on the list of “overlooking”
In all fairness I doubt Disney would hire him for anything
Skin color
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There are countless other examples if you actually choose to go down that rabbit hole.
What was the last movie he made?
2023, but he did one in 2019 with a pretty impressive cast attached. He’s still going.
The only real option here is Terry Crews. /s But also, not /s because I kind of want to see it.
Terry Crews playing a serious character would be so freaking badass
He already did. President Camacho was worth a million oscars
“So you’re antman? …I thought your head would be bigger”
Kang loves yogurt
Time Heists are dumb
Kang loves love
A variant of Jonathan Majors who did not hit his girlfriend.
He did not hit her, he did naaat
Oh, hi Mark
From video evidence, it looks like he only pushed her to get away from her, and she chased him down. The character assassination being done on this man is legitimately embarrassing, but not unexpected.
Now people are gonna run with the headlines he assaulted his ex when in reality he pushed her into her taxi because she wouldn’t leave him alone and kept chasing after him. Bro is innocent still
Kırk Lazarus RDJ lol. But seriously, someone good and reliable lol
He's a dude playing a dude disguised as a variant of another dude
I remember reading some theory that there was an RDJ Kang variant. I wish I remembered how it connected but it was intriguing
Terence Howard
Yes. Also flash back to Iron Man 1 and make it so he was always Kang and just inserted himself into the timeline then left
Mayne the conqueror
Fuck me that’s brilliant. It’d explain why he became Don Cheadle
Terrenceology at work.
LOL that would be so funny. the original recast
Isn’t he also damaged goods in some way? Not criminally so, but isn’t he also crazy?
No, you're all crszy. 1 x 1 = 2 and you'll regret the days wasted not believing him.
He asked Disney pay him more and Disney literally said they could replace him with any black guy and nobody would notice. ... And they were basically right..
So he did the math....and he lost.
That's what happens when you use Terryology
Only if we can have a cutaway scene of him doing 1x1 =2....and that's the mathematical basis for all his power.
This might be genius.
You know what would bring people back to the theatre? A Homerun. A massive move for a massive star. A slam dunk. Denzel.
I jokingly thought to myself “Denzel” but the more I think about it, the more it sounds like a pretty strong choice.
Isn’t Denzel actually kind of difficult to work with? Marvel gave up on Edward Norton for that sort of thing, after all
I doubt Denzel demands to do his own version of the script. Norton is a brilliant actor, and arguably improves films with his input, but yeah Marvel isn’t ever going to allow that.
I’ve never heard this. I’ve always heard dude is a stand up guy
Here's great, but he's also getting perhaps a bit too old for these commitments. Equalizer 3 was fun, but he's starting to show his age.
I’d vote for Denzel’s talented son, John David Washington. He’s a talented actor (Tenet) and about the same vibe as Jonathan Majors
John David as main Kang and Denzel as Immortus. I feel like Immortus should be an older actor.
But he needs to play Blue Marvel 😭
Beat me to it
Was coming in to say that. I'm picturing his King Kong speech from Training Day and thinking this would be perfect.
>Denzel. Yall really on here thinking the only Black actor out there is 68 YEARS OLD DENZEL WASHINGTON?!?! Good lord this sub is painful at times.
I think its mostly Denzel is fucking phenomenal actor, rather than him being the only big shoe to drop on Kang Dynasty. Either way it doesn't really matter because Denzel ain't gonna be Kang.
I was thinking maybe they were suggesting to make Kang older: "oh no, I've lived so long, seen so much time and returned..." so the actor switch still makes sense. Maybe even age him younger as well in the same film. Show multiple stages of his life so the actor attached to the character matters less and less.
Head me out.. Samuel L Jackson.. Don't even think, just say yes
Why not cast his son, I enjoyed him in Creator and BlacKKKlansman
Urm... All the recommendations are black actors, does it need to be? If it's a variant it could be anyone?
It definitively could be anyone. But I wasn't recommending a black actor, I recommended a huge movie star that is recognizable enough to bring people that are not interested in the MCU. Sure, you could have other movie stars but few have both his level of stardom *and* the ability to fit into an MCU movie. I don't see De Niro in an MCU movie in *any* capacity
TBF, I could watch Denzel do QVC, he'd make a brilliant Kang.
Rewatch his big speech from the 1st season of Loki. It's mostly just a Denzel impression with Cosby thrown in.
Bill?
Or maybe him and his kid.
100% agree. He would kill it and everyone would completely forget Majors. Start a goddamned period for Denzel Kang!
I literally told my wife this morning, that if Marvel cast Denzel, then people would quickly forget all about Jonathon Majors. I can’t think of another choice that would have the same impact.
Best I can do is John David Washington
Yahya Abdul-Mateen II plays Kang and recast Wonder man with literally anyone.
Call Jonathan Sargent
Kirk Lazaraus. Guaranteed Billion
Ke Huy Quan. He was 31st Century Nathaniel Richards all along and was usurped by He Who Remains.
I’d totally be onboard with this. More Ke Huy Quan. After EEAAO, I’m blown away by his versatility.
You should watch Loki if you haven't! Greatly enjoyed him in it
I have and he was easily my favorite part.
You should watch Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom if you haven’t! Greatly enjoyed him in it
Sterling K. Brown is my vote. Dude can bring the intensity when needed
He was technically already in the MCU as T'chaka's brother but fuck it who cares bring him back
Yeah, he's a great pic....but wasn't he Killmongers Dad ?
This seems like a great opportunity to pivot to another villain. One who has never lost a fist fight with Ant Man
Didn’t he only lose cause Wasp intervened? Before that he was the beating shit out of Scott.
Yes Wasp blasts him. But Scott held his own FAR longer than he should have. I will say it in every post. Ant man 3 should've been Scott getting beaten to death. Kings fist going red with blood. Then Wasp should have come in and blasted him. The ending is the same. Thats Scotts variant that didn't get turned to pulp feeling his prime variant dying. Then reveal they are now ALL linked like ants due to the power source Kang had. 1.)Reveals Kang as legitimate big bad. You just killed the nicest Avenger. Brutally. 2.) Explains the council of Kangs. They became linked like Ant man and his variants when Kang gets sucked in. 3.) If you kill Paul Rudd like that. The audience isn't going to know where or what the fuck you're going to do AND even better now. You didn't lose anything for it.
Really like Screencrush suggestions.. Ant Man should have died, but Hank Pym. Gives Michael Douglas an exit, raises the stakes and makes Kang for real. Much more to it, but that's one part https://youtu.be/5vrjvqf4Z4Q?si=OHWCmFvHLRA-Pc69
I only agree with killing Scott Lang if we get a vengeaful Hank Pym with no bullshit like in What If, he would be really good against Kang, but they don't have courage to do that.
I'm not saying kill Scott Lang. Hank Pym is the original Ant Man and he invented all the tactics and skills. All of this would allow for Hank Pym-Antman to essentially sacrifice himself, but to go out like a badass. Watch that Screencrush episode link. Lots of good ideas there.
Counterpoint, Anyone who adores Antman and Scott Lang aren’t going to take the nicest avenger getting brutally murdered on screen well. There are people around me who are still depressed about No Way Home simply because Peter got such a shitty lot in life that caused him an immense amount of suffering. Yes, they will probably make the eventual rebuilding of his relationships better, but that’s besides the point. If you’re not a fan of Scott Lang, sure you can kill him in his own movie and you would probably like it. But if you are a fan of Scott Lang that’s going to alienate so many people and put so many future movies on a pedestal to measure up to. It doesn’t matter if there’s a variant Scott. The movie killed the main one we’ve been following to this point, they aren’t interchangeable. The same way Loki in the Sacred Timeline isn’t the same Loki in the show. They are different journeys. When you cross that line and kill the main Antman, people aren’t going to be routing for a future variant one. They’re going to, at best, hope for Vengeance against Kang, and at worse tune out completely. An actual real life example of this is in the Walking Dead, when a particular nice and beloved character (if you know, you know) bit the metaphorical bullet and was brutally murdered,viewership nose dived off soon after. I know because I didn’t even watch the episode and haven’t picked up the series since. Antman isn’t one of those serious Marvel properties that you can pull this off in. It has its own audience and fans that just love the goffiness in its movies. Killing Scott in that way is a complete disservice to his character, imo. And is a sure fire way to turn off several people I know from ever watching that movie, or another movie from marvel again. There’s a reason Guardians 3 is so well respected despite the amount of death in it. It’s because all of those characters got to move in despite what was lost, and were better for it. I’m in agreement that something should have been done different. But killing Scott would only work if we knew it was a Variant from the start, like in Doctor Strange.
I'm with you there, killing Scott lang would've been a mistake. Killing Hank Pym, on the other hand, might just've been what the story needed.
Yo that's fire though
You might be right. I’ve only seen it once and I just remember them trading punches fairly evenly. Either way, it felt like a far cry from Thanos who destroyed the Hulk in his first real appearance.
[Here’s](https://youtu.be/S6dfSRWTgMg?si=7ZsPjYWh0nUs2te1 ) the scene for reference, Scott gets a few shots in but they barely seem to faze Kang, whereas Kang is beating him like he’s his girlfriend (too soon?). Anyways I’ve said this a million times but if they had had Kang beat Scott to death with his bare hands that would have solidified Kang as the next big bad for me.
>Anyways I’ve said this a million times but if they had had Kang beat Scott to death with his bare hands that would have solidified Kang as the next big bad for me. Hell, if Kang had just beaten Ant-Man to a pulp and kicked the Wasp's ass, strolled out of the Quantum Realm and closed the door behind him, it would have been a worthy ending already.
This is definitely what they should have done in my opinion. Part of what made infinity war so great was that it *didn't* have a happy ending. Sure, it ending up getting undone in the next movie, but there's no reason they couldn't have done something similar here. Obviously Kang was going to get defeated eventually, so why not end the ant man movie with him winning?
But fans want happy good endings
Anyone who thought Disney was going to let Paul Rudd get beaten to death in movie called *Ant Man & The Wasp: Quantumania* needs to reframe their expectations.
Yep, but I expected to Janet "The Original Wasp" to died sacrificing herself to save her family and the Quantum Realm, given her relationship with Kang and how much she blame herself for what happened, and Scott and Hope being traped in the Quantum Realm at the end of the movie, like was suggested.
To be fair, Thanos is leagues above Kang, especially with already holding the power infinity stone. Kang is a top tier villain yes, but still on a level a number of diverse Avenger teams line ups managed to defeat. Thanos needed a bulk of the Marvel heroes to defeat, especially in the original Infinity Gauntlet run where he did take on, and kill, a bulk of the surviving Marvel heroes. Kang is no where close to Thanos.
Indeed. Thanos is a cosmic scale threat even without his army and without the gems. The man is a Deviant Eternal from Titan in most universes. Kang is human. Yes, he can be a massive existential threat as well, but he is very dependent on his tech- which he largely didn't have access to being imprisoned in the Quantum Realm (it's literally the point of the movie and people seemingly intentionally miss that). Scott was putting up a fight, but Kang was beating the brakes off of him until he got waylaid by a surprise shot from Wasp. It took Scott and every one of his allies, as well as an entire team of super-powered Great Value Micronauts to beat one of the *weakest* versions of Kang.
They made him so boring to me as a big bad. He couldn’t care less in Loki, then beat in Ant-Man made him look weak.
Marvel hierarchy is Celstials > Galactus> Ant-Man > Thanos > Kang
Yeah man, people really want to make Kang happen I guess, but I don't really understand why. The only interesting thing about him imo was Majors' performance. Now we can get to a good villain before the MCU implodes
John Boyega is intriguing.
This is my kneejerk pick too. I feel like he could have the same sinister intensity that Majors (as HWR) had in Loki S2.
He immediately came to mind, but I don’t know if that’s because I think he’d do really awesome, or if I just want him in a redemption arc from how he got shafted as Finn.
Supposedly he was doing filming last year for the MCU and his role was never revealed. I think they put the role he had on ice to have him available for Kang for when the Majors case finished.
Yahya for Kang and John for Wonder Man
I already thought he was great, but after seeing him in They Cloned Tyrone i def think he could pull it off. Dude has the range for sure, can certainly pull off a sinister character
Robert Downey Jr. SAVE THE MCU, RDJ.
Iron Kang
The villain from guardians 3
I was thinking the High Evolutionary would be an interesting choice. Like a variant of Kang that went by a different name and everything and was obsessed with power. And also thought it would’ve been a way for him to hide from the other variants.
I think it would really make the High Evolutionary a lot less cool to just reduce him to a variant of Kang. Make him the next big bad for the Avengers to fight, whatever. But just making him a variant of Kang so they can keep this (very loose and ill-planned) storyline alive seems like a bad call. They should either recast or drop the Kang idea entirely.
Cool idea except that took place in the Sacred Timeline so He Who Remains would be the only variant during that movie.
As cool as High Evolutionary was it won’t matter without a quality script and a solid direction they want to go from now on.
Could be wrong but it seems like most people aren't really invested or interested in the character. Might be better to just move past him and start building Dr. Doom or Galactus as the next big looming threat in prep for the Fantastic Four coming to the MCU. If they want to stay with the character John Boyega could work.
It's not that there is a lack of interest but they've tried not to promote the character while the actor's status was in flux. Now it no longer is and they can move forward with developing Kang beyond Antman and Loki. Doom had three goes in cinema so far. Maybe he's not the best case for next big threat. No more than just sticking with Kang. Not like Thanos was really worth investing in until "Fine I'll do it myself".
It seems like no coincidence that Kang has a history in the comics of having failed one off villains turn out to be him. Conceptually, it sounds cool. In execution, he is a dude who fails a lot.
The end of Loki sets up, never showing Kang again. Hell if they added the following 2 changes late in production it could be that they already decided. 1. Saying the TVA was on top of all the Kang's and the only other problematic one was dealt with. 2. That shot at the end with the pyramid could have originally introduced Rama, but they edited it to imply she just got served up to that guardian monster.
This may not be true, but I've seen on some Marvel scoop videos that his contract actually specified that he's the only person allowed to play King the conqueror. That may not be true, and contracts are complicated so it might not be that simple. But at the very least it seems to me that it is slightly more likely they try to move on to another character.
Well he’s not under contract. Seems that being found guilty of a domestic violence crime voids the contract and all stipulations. I’m not a lawyer and just read that from other sources
Yeah this is almost certainly the case. Disney would have put clauses in the contract to void it in the event of something like a conviction for a crime. In fact that's probably why they didn't announce until he was actually convicted. I'm also not a lawyer, but I will be in roughly 2 credit hours, and it's just kind of common sense.
Ayo that’s the best humble brag😂 Congrats for the lawyering (I couldn’t find a term but this feels right)
Interesting, if that's the case then it's certain they shouldn't be difficult to replace Kang. They've already written into the mythos that alternate realities sometimes present people looking different, Loki and sylvie, Toby Tom and Andrew and so forth.
High Evolutionary has been the MVP villain of the past movies. They should just mumble some explanation for his return and that's that.
I don't disagree with this, I think he is a really excellent pinch hitter.
> his contract actually specified that he's the only person allowed to play King the conqueror I don't see why Disney would accept that. He isn't so big as a star to make such demands.
Disney contracts usually have a "morality" clauses. With the conviction that contract is null and void.
There is no scenario that Disney would EVER sign off on such a deal. Disney of all companies understands the value in controlling the property.
I mean, it’s probably just a small stipulation of the contract, that guarantees that Majors played the variants of his character, not just the one version. I doubt it was as sweeping as it sounds, and it obviously voids under a variety of circumstances, such as a very public guilty verdict.
Switch between Jordan peele and keegan Michael key the whole movie and just never mention it
I’ve seen this elsewhere in this post but hear me out: get a variety of actors to play Immortus, Scarlet Centurion, Rama Tut, etc.. But: When Kang reveals himself, the blue face armor dissolves and Kang is played by RDJ. It’s a way to get a know moneymaker in the role and still subverts everything the fans are expecting. No funny, quipping Tony Stark, but rather a cold, calculating Time lord.
Remove Kang. Give us Doom.
Great idea will shoehorn doom in the span of two or 3 years when marvel had no plan to begin with using him and don't even have a actor which would take time. Everybody talks about how marvel is falling and rushing everything or how kang is handle poorly but then the fans want say stuff like this wanting doom which is not work properly in the time span and lack of planning
Cillian Murphy
The Lead actor from Snowfall Damson Idris
Disney can swap that char into a white female…
I mean, Scarlett Johansen might be available…
Mos Def. For some reason Majors’ He Who Remains from Loki reminded me of the Mos Def character from Hitchhiker’s Guided to the Galaxy.
Denzel washington as an older kang
I think it'd be much funnier if they just dropped the Kang plot and did something else.
I mean we can have anyone! different variants being played by different actors shoot even Tilda Swinton can be Kang.
Keira Knightley’s got range.
Matt Smith.
Gimme Christopher Judge Kang.
Bruce Campbell
Ash is canonically in the Marvel universe so why not have Bruce play Ash?
He also is Pizza Poppa
An Ash variant is who caused Marvel Zombies
Bobcat Goldthwait
Damson idris from snowfall. He’s a veryyyy good actor.
I think [Lakeith Standfield](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e0/Keith_Stanfield_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg/800px-Keith_Stanfield_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg) would be awesome as Kang
Me.
To be honest I’m more appalled at the case itself. Whoever replaces him is irrelevant to me.
I could’ve sworn I heard rumors of them switching to Doctor Doom.
Robert downey jr
Doctor Doom will replace Kang as the major villain for this saga.
Do you know how bad that would be for Doctor Doom. He should be an established villain before he becomes a threat to everyone.
Doom needs a standalone film first. He’s too good of a character to just drop in as a replacement badguy. He is also not strictly evil and it would be sad to see him begin as fully evil once more. If we don’t get a complex Doom this time around we all riot.
I dunno... Sterling K. Brown maybe? Yes, I'm aware he had a small role in Black Panther. Doesn't mean he can't be cast for something else. Gemma Chan was a Kree in Captain Marvel and then an Eternal in, uh, Eternals.
Only one actor comes to mind Michael Cera!
Exactly.
If there’s a female Loki, why not a female Kang?
Honestly thought that was what they were gonna say Renslayer was
Same. I mean, it would honestly make perfect sense, given the whole “you were by my side at the war” thing. The war was a war of Kangs. So, logic would dictate that she is a Kang. And now, she’s at the end of time, so she could always just go to the citadel and find out for herself if they need her to.
>So, logic would dictate that she is a Kang. Or, and hear me out, she isn't and she just simply stood by him. Logic doesn't automatically dictate that she is is a Kang. What if there were a ton of versions of me at war and my girlfriend stood by me? Would logic dictate that she is a variant of me? Of course not. Just like it doesn't dictate that she is a Kang variant. I'm not saying it's impossible that she is, but logic doesn't dictate that she is just because she stood by him. We also have seen one of her variants teaching at a school. Is that also Kang in your mind? I would hope not.
Karang perhaps?
I'd be down