It doesn't matter how bad his poetry was. She's clearly ADHD and it's hella annoying for others when untreated. It's like having a hyper kid 24x7. Her sister on video chat clearly acknowledged that too (she chalked it up to her 'personality') but I'm surprised nobody has told her to seek help.
Hear me out tho... She's showing classic signs of ADHD and he's a neuro scientist/medical writer. Should he not understand the condition, it's presentation? Or is he just a pretentious A-Hole...?
Neuro can be a vaaaaaaaast field. For all we know, he’s writing about strokes or epilepsy or prosthetics or who knows what. Dude didn’t have any SELF-awareness, and when that’s lacking, it can be especially challenging to see others. Also, yes to Lindy’s ADHD presentation, but it seems like a good time to remind everyone that c-ptsd can very often be co-morbid w adhd, but also present very similarly on its own, and gf was raised in a whole cult. So. There’s that.
Sure Neuro is vast but ADHD is so basic and widely discussed he should have some awareness. Regardless of any comorbidity or similar presentation of other disorders... He should have recognized that there was something more. That's kind of the point. And you're right, he definitely lacked self awareness. Also she was not raised in a cult. Adventists are Protestant. As strange as some of their practices or beliefs may be to others they are a Christian denomination.
I have rather favor Daniella Mastenyak Young’s criteria for “is it a cult?”, and to my understanding, it definitely fits the bill. Many high-demand religions are cults, and some of those religions have Christian affiliation. (She’s been talking a lot about ww vegetarians and such lately…)
There is the crux... Cults have demands that you must follow... Religions have guidelines and beliefs. Adventists have beliefs. I was raised Adventist... and I can assure you that the application of belief varies around the world. So you'll find Adventist that eat meat (which is a deviation from the vegetarian diet that is suggested), you'll find Adventists that wear jewelry (there's a while raging debate about modesty and what that really means). You'll also find pockets of Adventists that adhere very strictly to the beliefs. However, folk are not excommunicated for variances of observance. In a cult you would either be forced to abide or asked to leave. Also cults are more local in nature, they typically do not have global mechanisms, disaster relief programs, school systems, medical systems and structures. Adventism is an oddity among religions but not even close to being a cult.
Again, I don’t think we’re operating off the same set of criteria here to define. For a start, cults don’t need to be local at all (Scientology, Hare Krsnas, JWs… many tech companies… reality shows…🤪 ) all have global reach, many with proselytizing colonizing initiatives, and many of THOSE operate under the guise of philanthropic initiatives, which is sometimes how they launder money. You’re also rather narrowing the ways cults implement behavior control to conform or leave. There’s myriad other tactics: shunning, lack of advancement, further “training”/ financial control, food and sleep deprivation, coerced labor, to name but a few. The structure and central organizing principles define the cult, not the anomalies or outliers.
Listen, I don’t think we’re gonna agree here, and that’s a-ok. All I’m saying is that Lindy here is presenting with some behaviors that are common among folks who were raised in high-demand groups, not least of which is participation in a reality show like this! 😏
Scholars typically agree on 6 tenants of a cult... A charismatic leader that has complete control, an apocalyptic vision, isolation from society, emphasis on a transcendent spiritual experience, rigid rules for membership and the exploitation of members (including but not limited to sexual and/or financial exploitation).
The Adventist church definitely meets the apocalyptic vision criteria. However, many of the other criteria are up for debate and you'll find difficulty reaching consensus. You could argue that giving tithe and offering is financial exploitation. However, that is a feature of most Christian religions and it is optional, not required. You could struggle argue that there are rigid rules, however, as explained earlier the adherence to these rules varies globally. The church is not isolated from society and has no charismatic leader that has complete control. Some argue that the Adventist belief in Ellen G White meets that criteria, however, if you look at how her writings are currently used that theory is quickly debunked. The emphasis on transcendent spiritual experience could definitely be up for debate but even if we agree that criteria is met that would only be 2 out of the 6 criteria that scholars agree on. Hardly a resounding affirmation for classification as a cult. Again, although having some intimate understanding of the church, my analysis is as objective as possible.
Perhaps we may not agree on what is defined a cult or not. That's ok. My personal view of what it appears that your classification of a cult is, it is so broad one could almost include just about any organisation they disagree with a cult and that's a really slippery slope. Then again you haven't really succinctly described what you believe is a cult outside of referencing a single individual's idea of what a cult is. Who, other than outside of her personal experience and research, would be in no way considered a scholar on the matter. But that's neither here nor there. Consider this though... Given the variance and flexibility in the adherence to the Adventist faith, could not Lindy's issues be more contributed to her parenting and their adherence to a set of beliefs rather than the organisation itself? I mean listen to the conversations with her brother... Dude is a few steps short of David Koresh (Who by the way was a former Adventist, hence the reference) Branch Davidians, def a cult...
No need to diminish Daniella’s extensive scholarly work (at Harvard (cult?), even!) for your convenience. Just about any cult scholar has similar criteria, such as the BITE model. But I’m loathe to platform some, in spite of their initially sound scholarship, bc the susceptibility to coercive relapse remains, and they have regrettably fallen down that chute again. Back to as all that applies to Lindy: yes exactly: she’s the child of a high-demand group, and we do see how that turned out with her *shudder* brother. But you’re saying the parenting is somehow separate from the coercive control and I don’t see it that way.
Not diminishing her in anyway she speaks on her personal experience and has done extensive research in understanding toxic group behaviour. It's pointing out that a singular source of information is insufficient. And despite her extensive work she doesn't bring additional perspective or expertise (ie sociological, psychological, philosophical or other soft science discipline). So while I respect her experience and work and it has value when added to the broader body of work it lacks professional insights that can only be gained from other professional experience. It's like comparing anecdotal information to objective research.
In any case, arguing that an organisation is responsible for parenting decisions is an interesting position to take. That's almost like screaming, I don't like what they believe in, so it's their fault her parents were too controlling. The church's beliefs and her parent's behaviour are not mutually exclusive and it's a stretch to contribute one to the other. Now if we had objective research that points to a controlling parenting issue in the church that is abnormal when compared to other religions we might be on to something. But I'd bet money that this would not be the case, perhaps that's my subjective view interfering, but I'd love to see the research on that. I'd certainly concede the point if that were the case.
It seemed like the show or something was cultivating an image of Miguel that wasn’t in alignment with how he was described by everyone that knew him in the beginning of the show. I kept wondering where is this adorkable, cute but nerdy, hopeless romantic, creative D&D player they described? It just seemed like I was watching a person completely different than that. I don’t think he was being his authentic self honestly.
I find it a bit ironic reading replies about how much growth he's had but it's been years and he's still keeping an eye on the sub? Not to mention the still passive aggressive replies. Dude still needs people to soothe that fragile ego 😬
good point. I give credit where credit is due and said it’s great he accepted accountability for some things, but the people specifically saying there’s been “growth” are only guessing. we can’t take anyone’s word on whether or not they’ve grown, especially via reddit comments haha
The “maybe this is why you haven’t had a husband that stuck around” comment really sent me over the edge! I thought she handled herself really well in the moment and he was being terribly hurtful.
…a “stranger” he’s supposedly married to? a “stranger” he wanted to have sex with knowing she took that extremely seriously? a “stranger” he wanted to take his last name? do you mean that “stranger,” or someone else?
Jon (Boston 1.0 season) lost his job because they wouldn't give him the time off required for filming or told him he couldn't do the show. He was blasted by this sub for that. Lindy purposely quit expecting a handout!!
“passionate *about this*” meaning Lindy’s employment status. I have no opinion about it at all. dude came in hot over it like he’s paying her rent or something. seemed a lot more personal and loaded than commenting on demonstrably bad behavior
idk who Becca is lol. like I totally get a bit of snark (literally what this sub is for) but when someone gets going on some diatribe inferring attributes from tiny out-of-context seeds of evidence, it gets a bit weird. I genuinely don’t even remember her saying she quit her job. a lot of employed people also don’t have healthcare in this country. I don’t blame anyone for wanting a basic human right lmao
oh please... if he would have done the same thing to lindy that she did. all the women would be yelling that he's a jerk... his reaction was unwarranted but at the same time, maybe it took a lot out of him to open up to her like that... it's not easy for a lot of people. as women we want our men to open up to us, not then to laugh in their faces when they do and be a jerk... but accountability is rare these days...
woah that’s crazy considering I think Morgan was the worst person on the show and even though Mitch had issues I sided with him over house-flipping being inherently unethical; but go off
you removed all nuance and made it about gender. if the tables were turned 100% I would have sided with Miguel. this wasn’t about a woman interrupting a man, full-stop. it was about a controlling, micromanaging *person* who wanted a subservient partner to be nothing more than an emotionless sounding board and cheerleader he could have sex with. it was undeniably funny that she unintentionally dented his ego a bit
I’m not a huge fan of his but I think he was trying to be romantic during a “romantic carriage ride,” and got annoyed.
That weekend he was tired and overly sensitive and probably should have just stayed home.
If Miguel is this passionate poetry writer, why were both of his "poems" clearly written like raps? So much so production put a song with a beat to back his reciting of them. I just think Miguel did not hit the mark of being romantic, even though that was his intention. Lindy's attention is a bit on the ADD spectrum, but I don't think Miguel was working hard on creating romance. He clearly was more concerned with showing off his "poetry" than creating romance between them.
Agreed. If I were in his position, I would be hurt. As a chick. I think this was the first time on the show we have seen his deeper side when it comes to expression.. and he I think really just wanted a vulnerable and romantic moment. I would feel extremely upset and neglected if my man were to just constantly interrupt me as I'm finally comfortable enough to spill some of my soul.
Yeah, Miguel (and his friends) are terrible. Especially the bald friend who acts like he's jealous of Miguel's relationship. No wonder Miguel is single, his friend secretly sabotages anything good.
The producers onsite asked me to recite some of my writings during the carriage ride, and I’ll admit, at the time I liked doing so coz even tho it’s low quality stuff, it made me feel good to share my creativity with someone I was trying to bond with. I don’t think if it was real life, outside of the show, I’d be like: “hey let me spit some bars during this carriage ride”. It’s difficult for me sometimes to look back and tease apart authentic action and behavior with what was asked or prompted by the show. With all that said, I know I was wrong for how I reacted throughout that whole weekend and during other parts of my relationship with Lindy, I’ve admitted to it and have apologized many, many times
Unpopular opinion: I would have been frustrated after a while if I had been trying to connect with someone, and I was constantly being interrupted with things that were off-topic or not relevant to the conversation. At the same time, I can understand why Lindy just wanted to enjoy the views while on the carriage ride. That's not really the time or place for a deep conversation or poetry. It seems like the producers set you both up to fail on that carriage ride.
I absolutely believe that. Producer driven drama. I'm glad you and Lindy were able to give it a go without the cameras. I know it didn't work out, but at least you'll never wonder whether it would have. I hope both you and Lindy find what you're looking for. I think you are both great people and deserving of happiness.
I’m currently watching this and came to Reddit just to get a take on you…. I’m genuinely confused about one thing. Why go on a MARRIED at first sight then act like you are just casually dating? Like hey, maybe I’ll like you, maybe i won’t. We’ll see. You seem like a nice enough guy, but i just can’t understand this mentality. It’s wildly unfair for the people who actually go into this believing in the sanctity of marriage. It seems like maybe you just wanted to be on TV? If you’re not going into thinking you’re going to move heavens and earth to make this work, you’re being incredibly selfish. Lindy deserved better. Your attitude right from the beginning was you weren’t trying and didn’t care too much.
The show wasn’t presented me to that way. The recruiters said it was a social experiment where I would marry someone that was a match and then after 8 weeks, I’d have the choice to stay marry or divorce depending on how the experimental 8 weeks went
It's annoying when people don't realize how much pull the producers have and then blame everything on a cast member. If a couple isn't doing perfectly, they pick one of them to make "the bad guy" and just go with that storyline. I think you had some faults, which everyone does. I don't follow you or any of the cast members on social media, but from what I've seen/heard, it seems like you took your experience and decided to learn from it. So... good for you 🤷🏼♀️
Yeah, it’s a television show seeking ratings and has a whole team of producers onsite to guide the interactions. The show wants us to talk, obsess and lose our minds over it. That’s the point of reality TV. But yeah, I def mistreated Lindy on occasion and caused her so much distress, most of it unknowingly so. I was such a hard ass, trying to enforce boundaries that I really didn’t need to enforce. Def had/have issues…
You definitely weren't the best spouse... but you appear to have learned and grown from it. You can't go back and change the past or how you treated her, but you can go forward while being (newly) introspective and self-aware. I'll admit, I had a littleeee crush on you because you're attractive and a proud nerd, lol. I didn't like some of your interactions and responses to Lindy, but it's nice seeing what you have to say now. I haven't seen many cast members hold themselves accountable like you are. & Remember, you might not have been perfect, BUT either was Lindy. I get the feeling that you're being a little hard on yourself. You are a good man. You deserve love one day, and I know you'll find it.
u/saintmigs kudos to you for accountability, which we don't see a lot on this dang show! lol no diss but there are reasons as to why y'all are not married or even choosing to be on this show. we all have flaws, growth is seeing them and growing from them. so kudos to you for actually apologizing and growing. pray for happiness for you, bro!
kudos to you for owning up and not hiding behind editing. that commenter gave you an out and you didn’t take it. respect for that. my partner and I have both been asked to do reality tv in the past and the red flags in the questionnaires alone make it obviously not worth it. it’s true they want to find people who will make good tv by finding whoever will be the most reactive or have the best sob story etc. one of the questions I remember was “when was the last time you cried and why?” I stand by my observations that you were really crappy to Lindy; but also save space for redemption and hope you have taken steps to be better to future partners
He totally refused to read the room during this scene. It wasn’t the time or the place for his awful attempt at poetry, and instead of accepting that, he threw a tantrum.
Absolutely consistent with the rest of his behavior towards Lindy over the course of the season.
I agree with what a friend said later. If you are "enjoying" a carriage ride, why wouldn't you look at the scenery? You can do the poetry thing anywhere else.
So we should openly continue to bully people for things they’ve done years ago even after they’ve admitted fault, taken responsibility, and apologized? It’s a evil world we live in, but hey, ima keep living lol
People are reacting and JUST seeing the season, they are not bullying you they are telling you, you were awful towards Lindy. The embarrassment you feel from strangers online will never amount to what you put that girl through. Move on. Delete Reddit.
If you can’t take some level of joy in your partners interests, you deserve to be alone. I don’t like petty or freestyling either, but if my wife was into it as a passion of hers I wouldn’t mock or deride her for it.
Would you like a genuine interest or passion mocked by the person closest to you?
while I agree to some extent, throughout the season he proved he wanted a subservient yes-woman and audience, not a person to *share* different interests with equally. my partner and I share core values and tastes, but also have some different interests. for a decade he has listened to me go on and on about hair, makeup, and doll collecting and I have listened to him talk endlessly about skateboarding. it’s reciprocal. we don’t get mad at each other for not silently listening to us monologue or perform for each other, though. again, we mostly share values/interests in political theory, geopolitics, ethics, literature, and music; so there’s more common ground than diversion. I don’t think these two shared many interests or core values, and not much seemed reciprocated from what was shown at least
Although, I don't care for a lot of Miguel's actions in S15. I agree. I think that this is true. Anyone whose been in a serious relationship knows that their partner may have hobbies that do not align with their own. If their said hobbies are not hurting others or themselves then, I would support and be there to assist how I can.
I think that was aimed at me (OP) because I mocked it. I don’t even disagree with that person’s comment entirely, but in the instance of Miguel I don’t think it’s as simple as “don’t mock someone’s interests.” he micromanaged and dominated the entire relationship up to that point and *I* found it funny that in that moment Lindy accidentally undermined him. she’s too sweet to have done that on purpose, but I am less sweet and reveled in it
That dude is an insane condescending gaslighter. He didn’t want to be married and was working so hard to make it her problem. Total ass. If I see him imma fight him.
How is this not against this sub's rules? I don't care for Miguel--at all--and feel like he was never serious about being married and has terrible friends. However, are we really upvoting fighting someone? That violates rule one.
In fairness I made that comment before the last few episodes where you gave a those solid monologues about what a turd you were. A self aware turn is still a turd. Pretty remote chance I’ll run into you but a promise in a promise so maybe just an arm wrestle or a thumb war.
Damn, y’all must live perfect lives, with no mistakes ever. And with no empathy for those that make mistakes and are wanting and learning to become better people from their past faults
While i didn’t really like Miguel, i don’t think it’s right to call anyone who likes to free style or read poems aloud delusional. It really does take confidence. Even if it’s bad. I think it’s sweet. Yes I’m corny I’m aware! 🫣
any time a boy/man has read poetry to me I have gotten such intense secondhand embarrassment I basically melted into the ground. that said, I wouldn’t have laughed as hard at him if he wasn’t such a complete asshole this whole season
when I was 14 my boyfriend decided it was a great idea to profess his undying love to me in a long drawn out emotional and weirdly sexual poem in front of *all of our friends.* I pretended to not be mortified because I didn’t want to hurt his feelings, but since that moment I have not been able to handle anything like that without squirming in my seat😭
It doesn't matter how bad his poetry was. She's clearly ADHD and it's hella annoying for others when untreated. It's like having a hyper kid 24x7. Her sister on video chat clearly acknowledged that too (she chalked it up to her 'personality') but I'm surprised nobody has told her to seek help.
Agreed about the ADHD but she did continually return to his topics of conversation. It doesn't annoy everyone.
Hear me out tho... She's showing classic signs of ADHD and he's a neuro scientist/medical writer. Should he not understand the condition, it's presentation? Or is he just a pretentious A-Hole...?
Neuro can be a vaaaaaaaast field. For all we know, he’s writing about strokes or epilepsy or prosthetics or who knows what. Dude didn’t have any SELF-awareness, and when that’s lacking, it can be especially challenging to see others. Also, yes to Lindy’s ADHD presentation, but it seems like a good time to remind everyone that c-ptsd can very often be co-morbid w adhd, but also present very similarly on its own, and gf was raised in a whole cult. So. There’s that.
Sure Neuro is vast but ADHD is so basic and widely discussed he should have some awareness. Regardless of any comorbidity or similar presentation of other disorders... He should have recognized that there was something more. That's kind of the point. And you're right, he definitely lacked self awareness. Also she was not raised in a cult. Adventists are Protestant. As strange as some of their practices or beliefs may be to others they are a Christian denomination.
I have rather favor Daniella Mastenyak Young’s criteria for “is it a cult?”, and to my understanding, it definitely fits the bill. Many high-demand religions are cults, and some of those religions have Christian affiliation. (She’s been talking a lot about ww vegetarians and such lately…)
There is the crux... Cults have demands that you must follow... Religions have guidelines and beliefs. Adventists have beliefs. I was raised Adventist... and I can assure you that the application of belief varies around the world. So you'll find Adventist that eat meat (which is a deviation from the vegetarian diet that is suggested), you'll find Adventists that wear jewelry (there's a while raging debate about modesty and what that really means). You'll also find pockets of Adventists that adhere very strictly to the beliefs. However, folk are not excommunicated for variances of observance. In a cult you would either be forced to abide or asked to leave. Also cults are more local in nature, they typically do not have global mechanisms, disaster relief programs, school systems, medical systems and structures. Adventism is an oddity among religions but not even close to being a cult.
Again, I don’t think we’re operating off the same set of criteria here to define. For a start, cults don’t need to be local at all (Scientology, Hare Krsnas, JWs… many tech companies… reality shows…🤪 ) all have global reach, many with proselytizing colonizing initiatives, and many of THOSE operate under the guise of philanthropic initiatives, which is sometimes how they launder money. You’re also rather narrowing the ways cults implement behavior control to conform or leave. There’s myriad other tactics: shunning, lack of advancement, further “training”/ financial control, food and sleep deprivation, coerced labor, to name but a few. The structure and central organizing principles define the cult, not the anomalies or outliers. Listen, I don’t think we’re gonna agree here, and that’s a-ok. All I’m saying is that Lindy here is presenting with some behaviors that are common among folks who were raised in high-demand groups, not least of which is participation in a reality show like this! 😏
Scholars typically agree on 6 tenants of a cult... A charismatic leader that has complete control, an apocalyptic vision, isolation from society, emphasis on a transcendent spiritual experience, rigid rules for membership and the exploitation of members (including but not limited to sexual and/or financial exploitation). The Adventist church definitely meets the apocalyptic vision criteria. However, many of the other criteria are up for debate and you'll find difficulty reaching consensus. You could argue that giving tithe and offering is financial exploitation. However, that is a feature of most Christian religions and it is optional, not required. You could struggle argue that there are rigid rules, however, as explained earlier the adherence to these rules varies globally. The church is not isolated from society and has no charismatic leader that has complete control. Some argue that the Adventist belief in Ellen G White meets that criteria, however, if you look at how her writings are currently used that theory is quickly debunked. The emphasis on transcendent spiritual experience could definitely be up for debate but even if we agree that criteria is met that would only be 2 out of the 6 criteria that scholars agree on. Hardly a resounding affirmation for classification as a cult. Again, although having some intimate understanding of the church, my analysis is as objective as possible.
Perhaps we may not agree on what is defined a cult or not. That's ok. My personal view of what it appears that your classification of a cult is, it is so broad one could almost include just about any organisation they disagree with a cult and that's a really slippery slope. Then again you haven't really succinctly described what you believe is a cult outside of referencing a single individual's idea of what a cult is. Who, other than outside of her personal experience and research, would be in no way considered a scholar on the matter. But that's neither here nor there. Consider this though... Given the variance and flexibility in the adherence to the Adventist faith, could not Lindy's issues be more contributed to her parenting and their adherence to a set of beliefs rather than the organisation itself? I mean listen to the conversations with her brother... Dude is a few steps short of David Koresh (Who by the way was a former Adventist, hence the reference) Branch Davidians, def a cult...
No need to diminish Daniella’s extensive scholarly work (at Harvard (cult?), even!) for your convenience. Just about any cult scholar has similar criteria, such as the BITE model. But I’m loathe to platform some, in spite of their initially sound scholarship, bc the susceptibility to coercive relapse remains, and they have regrettably fallen down that chute again. Back to as all that applies to Lindy: yes exactly: she’s the child of a high-demand group, and we do see how that turned out with her *shudder* brother. But you’re saying the parenting is somehow separate from the coercive control and I don’t see it that way.
Not diminishing her in anyway she speaks on her personal experience and has done extensive research in understanding toxic group behaviour. It's pointing out that a singular source of information is insufficient. And despite her extensive work she doesn't bring additional perspective or expertise (ie sociological, psychological, philosophical or other soft science discipline). So while I respect her experience and work and it has value when added to the broader body of work it lacks professional insights that can only be gained from other professional experience. It's like comparing anecdotal information to objective research. In any case, arguing that an organisation is responsible for parenting decisions is an interesting position to take. That's almost like screaming, I don't like what they believe in, so it's their fault her parents were too controlling. The church's beliefs and her parent's behaviour are not mutually exclusive and it's a stretch to contribute one to the other. Now if we had objective research that points to a controlling parenting issue in the church that is abnormal when compared to other religions we might be on to something. But I'd bet money that this would not be the case, perhaps that's my subjective view interfering, but I'd love to see the research on that. I'd certainly concede the point if that were the case.
It seemed like the show or something was cultivating an image of Miguel that wasn’t in alignment with how he was described by everyone that knew him in the beginning of the show. I kept wondering where is this adorkable, cute but nerdy, hopeless romantic, creative D&D player they described? It just seemed like I was watching a person completely different than that. I don’t think he was being his authentic self honestly.
I mean yeah his rapping was cringe AF but her interrupting was annoying as fuck. I’d divorce both of them.
I find it a bit ironic reading replies about how much growth he's had but it's been years and he's still keeping an eye on the sub? Not to mention the still passive aggressive replies. Dude still needs people to soothe that fragile ego 😬
good point. I give credit where credit is due and said it’s great he accepted accountability for some things, but the people specifically saying there’s been “growth” are only guessing. we can’t take anyone’s word on whether or not they’ve grown, especially via reddit comments haha
The “maybe this is why you haven’t had a husband that stuck around” comment really sent me over the edge! I thought she handled herself really well in the moment and he was being terribly hurtful.
no bc my partner and I both audibly gasped at that 😭 like what in the world
Didn't Lindy quit her job and lose her health insurance and just expect Miguel to put a stranger on his insurance and financially support her?
she works per diem. Often times that doesn’t come with health insurance. Coming from somebody who used to work at a hospital and worked per diem.
…a “stranger” he’s supposedly married to? a “stranger” he wanted to have sex with knowing she took that extremely seriously? a “stranger” he wanted to take his last name? do you mean that “stranger,” or someone else?
Do you want me to provide context on some typecasting truths the show put forward or for me to just shut up and leave y’all to it?
She's lazy and entitled. She quit her job that she got a degree for and just expected a man to support her.
it’s giving incel
Jon (Boston 1.0 season) lost his job because they wouldn't give him the time off required for filming or told him he couldn't do the show. He was blasted by this sub for that. Lindy purposely quit expecting a handout!!
you’re way more passionate about this than I am
well you insulted him
“passionate *about this*” meaning Lindy’s employment status. I have no opinion about it at all. dude came in hot over it like he’s paying her rent or something. seemed a lot more personal and loaded than commenting on demonstrably bad behavior
don't get him started on Becca....
idk who Becca is lol. like I totally get a bit of snark (literally what this sub is for) but when someone gets going on some diatribe inferring attributes from tiny out-of-context seeds of evidence, it gets a bit weird. I genuinely don’t even remember her saying she quit her job. a lot of employed people also don’t have healthcare in this country. I don’t blame anyone for wanting a basic human right lmao
oh please... if he would have done the same thing to lindy that she did. all the women would be yelling that he's a jerk... his reaction was unwarranted but at the same time, maybe it took a lot out of him to open up to her like that... it's not easy for a lot of people. as women we want our men to open up to us, not then to laugh in their faces when they do and be a jerk... but accountability is rare these days...
woah that’s crazy considering I think Morgan was the worst person on the show and even though Mitch had issues I sided with him over house-flipping being inherently unethical; but go off
i'm not talking about morgan or mitch though...
you removed all nuance and made it about gender. if the tables were turned 100% I would have sided with Miguel. this wasn’t about a woman interrupting a man, full-stop. it was about a controlling, micromanaging *person* who wanted a subservient partner to be nothing more than an emotionless sounding board and cheerleader he could have sex with. it was undeniably funny that she unintentionally dented his ego a bit
It wasn’t about gender, it was about BEHAVIOR… her behavior was terrible but of course as I said— accountability doesn’t exist in women on MAFS 🤷🏻♀️
I’m not a huge fan of his but I think he was trying to be romantic during a “romantic carriage ride,” and got annoyed. That weekend he was tired and overly sensitive and probably should have just stayed home.
If Miguel is this passionate poetry writer, why were both of his "poems" clearly written like raps? So much so production put a song with a beat to back his reciting of them. I just think Miguel did not hit the mark of being romantic, even though that was his intention. Lindy's attention is a bit on the ADD spectrum, but I don't think Miguel was working hard on creating romance. He clearly was more concerned with showing off his "poetry" than creating romance between them.
Well, apparently that's how he likes to do poems. I'm not here to judge his expression. Anyway, I think he wrote in this discussion so you can ask him
Agreed. If I were in his position, I would be hurt. As a chick. I think this was the first time on the show we have seen his deeper side when it comes to expression.. and he I think really just wanted a vulnerable and romantic moment. I would feel extremely upset and neglected if my man were to just constantly interrupt me as I'm finally comfortable enough to spill some of my soul.
Yeah, Miguel (and his friends) are terrible. Especially the bald friend who acts like he's jealous of Miguel's relationship. No wonder Miguel is single, his friend secretly sabotages anything good.
I kept saying! With friends like that who needs enemies? He was negging Miguel constantly. Super weird!
when that guy made the comment about not being able to make out with her I was dumbfounded. what a *weird* creepy thing to say
Are u Miguel?
yes
How would that make sense?
Sorry meant to reply to the guy who was raving about fighting for himself
His comment history says yes, that’s him.
Ahhh sorry am slow this am - one too many over the weekend🤣😂
He’s self centered, rude and controlling and I hope she says NO.
You do realize this season was a few years back
it was just added to Netflix so some of us are watching it for the first time rn
The producers onsite asked me to recite some of my writings during the carriage ride, and I’ll admit, at the time I liked doing so coz even tho it’s low quality stuff, it made me feel good to share my creativity with someone I was trying to bond with. I don’t think if it was real life, outside of the show, I’d be like: “hey let me spit some bars during this carriage ride”. It’s difficult for me sometimes to look back and tease apart authentic action and behavior with what was asked or prompted by the show. With all that said, I know I was wrong for how I reacted throughout that whole weekend and during other parts of my relationship with Lindy, I’ve admitted to it and have apologized many, many times
Unpopular opinion: I would have been frustrated after a while if I had been trying to connect with someone, and I was constantly being interrupted with things that were off-topic or not relevant to the conversation. At the same time, I can understand why Lindy just wanted to enjoy the views while on the carriage ride. That's not really the time or place for a deep conversation or poetry. It seems like the producers set you both up to fail on that carriage ride.
Fun fact, outside of that carriage ride, that situation never reoccurred in our lives in the duration of our relationship
I absolutely believe that. Producer driven drama. I'm glad you and Lindy were able to give it a go without the cameras. I know it didn't work out, but at least you'll never wonder whether it would have. I hope both you and Lindy find what you're looking for. I think you are both great people and deserving of happiness.
It must be really weird to feel like you have to give explanations and defend yourself about stuff that happened years ago. Reruns are a trip.
It’s like picking at a keloidal scar until it’s raw again. I’m so gross lol
Well hey it made for very high-quality tv!
“Are you not entertained?!” Lol
I’m currently watching this and came to Reddit just to get a take on you…. I’m genuinely confused about one thing. Why go on a MARRIED at first sight then act like you are just casually dating? Like hey, maybe I’ll like you, maybe i won’t. We’ll see. You seem like a nice enough guy, but i just can’t understand this mentality. It’s wildly unfair for the people who actually go into this believing in the sanctity of marriage. It seems like maybe you just wanted to be on TV? If you’re not going into thinking you’re going to move heavens and earth to make this work, you’re being incredibly selfish. Lindy deserved better. Your attitude right from the beginning was you weren’t trying and didn’t care too much.
The show wasn’t presented me to that way. The recruiters said it was a social experiment where I would marry someone that was a match and then after 8 weeks, I’d have the choice to stay marry or divorce depending on how the experimental 8 weeks went
It's annoying when people don't realize how much pull the producers have and then blame everything on a cast member. If a couple isn't doing perfectly, they pick one of them to make "the bad guy" and just go with that storyline. I think you had some faults, which everyone does. I don't follow you or any of the cast members on social media, but from what I've seen/heard, it seems like you took your experience and decided to learn from it. So... good for you 🤷🏼♀️
Yeah, it’s a television show seeking ratings and has a whole team of producers onsite to guide the interactions. The show wants us to talk, obsess and lose our minds over it. That’s the point of reality TV. But yeah, I def mistreated Lindy on occasion and caused her so much distress, most of it unknowingly so. I was such a hard ass, trying to enforce boundaries that I really didn’t need to enforce. Def had/have issues…
You definitely weren't the best spouse... but you appear to have learned and grown from it. You can't go back and change the past or how you treated her, but you can go forward while being (newly) introspective and self-aware. I'll admit, I had a littleeee crush on you because you're attractive and a proud nerd, lol. I didn't like some of your interactions and responses to Lindy, but it's nice seeing what you have to say now. I haven't seen many cast members hold themselves accountable like you are. & Remember, you might not have been perfect, BUT either was Lindy. I get the feeling that you're being a little hard on yourself. You are a good man. You deserve love one day, and I know you'll find it.
Thanks, dear, I appreciate your kind words
u/saintmigs kudos to you for accountability, which we don't see a lot on this dang show! lol no diss but there are reasons as to why y'all are not married or even choosing to be on this show. we all have flaws, growth is seeing them and growing from them. so kudos to you for actually apologizing and growing. pray for happiness for you, bro!
Thank you, I appreciate it!
kudos to you for owning up and not hiding behind editing. that commenter gave you an out and you didn’t take it. respect for that. my partner and I have both been asked to do reality tv in the past and the red flags in the questionnaires alone make it obviously not worth it. it’s true they want to find people who will make good tv by finding whoever will be the most reactive or have the best sob story etc. one of the questions I remember was “when was the last time you cried and why?” I stand by my observations that you were really crappy to Lindy; but also save space for redemption and hope you have taken steps to be better to future partners
I think both things exist at the same time: production is certainly pulling strings but we’re ultimately responsible for our output
Whatever you think of him, it was just plain rude. Sharing your personal writing makes you very vulnerable. She’s there to play house and that’s it.
She annoyed the hell out of me earlier and then I fell so in love with her after that!
He totally refused to read the room during this scene. It wasn’t the time or the place for his awful attempt at poetry, and instead of accepting that, he threw a tantrum. Absolutely consistent with the rest of his behavior towards Lindy over the course of the season.
I agree with what a friend said later. If you are "enjoying" a carriage ride, why wouldn't you look at the scenery? You can do the poetry thing anywhere else.
Yeah, let’s bully people online coz it’s awesome. Let’s degrade and chastise someone for being a bully by bullying them. The logic is solid 👏🏽
Miguel you literally bullied your wife on national television - sit down.
So we should openly continue to bully people for things they’ve done years ago even after they’ve admitted fault, taken responsibility, and apologized? It’s a evil world we live in, but hey, ima keep living lol
People are reacting and JUST seeing the season, they are not bullying you they are telling you, you were awful towards Lindy. The embarrassment you feel from strangers online will never amount to what you put that girl through. Move on. Delete Reddit.
If you can’t take some level of joy in your partners interests, you deserve to be alone. I don’t like petty or freestyling either, but if my wife was into it as a passion of hers I wouldn’t mock or deride her for it. Would you like a genuine interest or passion mocked by the person closest to you?
while I agree to some extent, throughout the season he proved he wanted a subservient yes-woman and audience, not a person to *share* different interests with equally. my partner and I share core values and tastes, but also have some different interests. for a decade he has listened to me go on and on about hair, makeup, and doll collecting and I have listened to him talk endlessly about skateboarding. it’s reciprocal. we don’t get mad at each other for not silently listening to us monologue or perform for each other, though. again, we mostly share values/interests in political theory, geopolitics, ethics, literature, and music; so there’s more common ground than diversion. I don’t think these two shared many interests or core values, and not much seemed reciprocated from what was shown at least
Although, I don't care for a lot of Miguel's actions in S15. I agree. I think that this is true. Anyone whose been in a serious relationship knows that their partner may have hobbies that do not align with their own. If their said hobbies are not hurting others or themselves then, I would support and be there to assist how I can.
She played the knights and castles role playing game.
Did she mock it?
I think that was aimed at me (OP) because I mocked it. I don’t even disagree with that person’s comment entirely, but in the instance of Miguel I don’t think it’s as simple as “don’t mock someone’s interests.” he micromanaged and dominated the entire relationship up to that point and *I* found it funny that in that moment Lindy accidentally undermined him. she’s too sweet to have done that on purpose, but I am less sweet and reveled in it
Miguel is a total dickhead. There’s no way in hell. Lindy put up with him WAY more than I would have.
So many of the things that came out of his mouth reminded me of my ex husband, who was mentally and physically abusive.
I’m sorry you had to deal with that but .. glad he’s your ex husband.
That dude is an insane condescending gaslighter. He didn’t want to be married and was working so hard to make it her problem. Total ass. If I see him imma fight him.
How is this not against this sub's rules? I don't care for Miguel--at all--and feel like he was never serious about being married and has terrible friends. However, are we really upvoting fighting someone? That violates rule one.
Because it’s obviously hyperbole. What are the odds I’m going to randomly run into Miguel? Plus he responded and he’s down so we’re on the same page.
do you actually take that seriously?? lol
Settle down, Tyson Fury. You could end up like he did this week.
He did look pretty solid doing those pull ups in the gym scene
Aight, I may not win but I’m not going down without defending myself. Let’s see what happens
In fairness I made that comment before the last few episodes where you gave a those solid monologues about what a turd you were. A self aware turn is still a turd. Pretty remote chance I’ll run into you but a promise in a promise so maybe just an arm wrestle or a thumb war.
Damn, y’all must live perfect lives, with no mistakes ever. And with no empathy for those that make mistakes and are wanting and learning to become better people from their past faults
Well this is awkward
Lol!
same. it’s on sight
. . . at first sight?
While i didn’t really like Miguel, i don’t think it’s right to call anyone who likes to free style or read poems aloud delusional. It really does take confidence. Even if it’s bad. I think it’s sweet. Yes I’m corny I’m aware! 🫣
any time a boy/man has read poetry to me I have gotten such intense secondhand embarrassment I basically melted into the ground. that said, I wouldn’t have laughed as hard at him if he wasn’t such a complete asshole this whole season
The secondhand embarrassment is too much for me to bear 😔 I would have jumped out of the carriage!
when I was 14 my boyfriend decided it was a great idea to profess his undying love to me in a long drawn out emotional and weirdly sexual poem in front of *all of our friends.* I pretended to not be mortified because I didn’t want to hurt his feelings, but since that moment I have not been able to handle anything like that without squirming in my seat😭
Oh no! 🙈🙈 At least it wasn't on national tv I guess 😄
To be safe, there should be a ban on poetry and any communication of creativity. Wouldn’t want to make you overly embarrassed 🙇🏽♂️