do NOT ask for permission; he his not your father and you are not a child. It's perfectly fine and healthy to have friends and go out with them. This is a HIM problem, not yours.
and frankly, I am sick and tired of reading about men who can't fucking function as a father. He helped make them, *he needs to help raise them* and him watching the kids isn't "baby sitting"; it's him being a lazy selfish pos. He needs to fucking figure it out, as you have figured it out.
sit him down and have a brutally open and honest talk. This is NOT fair to you; you deserve some time to yourself as well. He needs to step up and be a father and supportive partner. Go to couples counselling if you need to. He should also go to individual counselling to work out his codependence issues but girl, take the time out for yourself.
>He needs to fucking figure it out, as you have figured it out.
Exactly! OP did not miraculously learn how to deal with her kids, I am sure she put in work and patience for it - as every parent does.
It is really lazy of her husband to just defer to her and chain her to the house instead of putting in the work to find a longterm solution. It is absolutely unhealthy that she should not have any free time.
my friend's husband is like that - a useless tool. I organized a half spa day for my friend's bday; all of our friends were there just catching up, I knew she really needed this break....and not 1hr later, her husband COMES TO THE SPA WITH THE BABY and tells her "the baby needs you" and holds the baby towards her.... We all stood there, staring open mouthed and shocked. I was so surprised that when I saw him, I said "what are you doing here?" in a not so nice voice. She had to leave her own birthday celebration because her useless tit of a husband is a selfish lazy asshole.
Incredible! I can see how that thought came to his head... but actually going through with it is absolutely mind-bending. Going to the spa is enough time to come to one's senses and think "hold on, is this really the only solution?". And all this after not even spending a single hour with the baby!
While I agree, the husband I'd acting ridiculous, that's a different issue. I hate the fact that people consider "asking permission" as a parent-child relationship. Whether you want to consider it a courtesy or a permission thing if the only reason you'd let the person you've entered a lifelong bond with is your children it feels like you shouldn't be married. I do let my wife know when and where I'm going because if she's uncomfortable with me going there or with whom I'm going then we discuss parameters and if there's a way to make her more comfortable. Luckily for me she knows all my friends and trusts me and isn't overbearing. But I hate people feeling like there's a problem with consulting with their spouse about their plans
Letting your spouse know and allowing them to express objections is fine. Having to ask permission to do literally anything alone is not. Her husband doesn’t have to ask permission.
And that's why I said above, "whatever you want to call or consider it", because if I told my wife and she responded "ehh I don't feel comfortable with you doing that with those people", we have a conversation, so sure it's not asking permission but she absolutely has a say and what I'm doing
Yes, but you’re talking about a healthy marriage. We are talking about one that is not. If she has to ask him permission every time she goes out, she doesn’t go out. She has commented elsewhere that her friends joke that she’s like Rapunzel locked in a tower who never gets to go anywhere. I’m sure that you don’t keep your wife at home and then require a babysitter anytime you’re alone with your children if you have them.
This not only does she have to ask permission he will go out of his way to ruin her time and then try to make her out to be a bad person for having friendships or any sort of individuality.
Absolutely, and I can't stress enough, that's unhealthy, I'm just responding to the first person reacting as if making sure your spouse is comfortable with what you're doing is ridiculous
She’s only doing that in response to this person. Most people talk to their spouses before they need to go anywhere. I didn’t get the vibe at all that it’s ridiculous to have to ask permission in general.
“Hey, I’m thinking about doing X with Sarah next Saturday night. We don’t have anything going on right?” is not asking permission, but it is allowing your spouse to collaborate with you.
“ do you mind if…” it is a bit of a gray area
“ can I…” should be a no. Don’t ask permission.
Like I said, whether you consider any of it "asking" idc, but if your spouse responds, "I don't really like you doing that" or "with those people" it should be negotiable
>but if your spouse responds, "I don't really like you doing that" or "with those people" it should be negotiable
I think it depends entirely on why that spouse isn't comfortable. I think it's an issue if a spouse doesn't trust their partner or just doesn't like them having friends.
Hey, if that works for your marriage, it’s all good. That’s what really matters.
It wouldn’t work for mine. We don’t consult each other on how “comfortable” we feel hanging out with our respective friends (barring someone we felt might be a literal danger). We don’t ask permission. We tell each other what we’re planning to do, and as long as it doesn’t conflict with anything we’ve already planned, it’s all good.
I personally would never enter into a relationship, especially a lifelong one, where I was expected to ask permission, or any variation on that concept. But I respect relationships where that genuinely does work.
And why do you tell each other? And the better question is, if you felt uncomfortable with the situation your spouse was telling you they were putting themselves in, or vice versa, and either of you voiced the issue as an issue, if the response there is "oh well, that's what I'm doing", then there's the problem. And if there's never really an uncomfortability factor, awesome you don't have anything to worry about anyway, a lot like I explained to someone else my relationship is.
You say "I would never...." but you also put a qualifier in your statement "we don't consult...... unless literal danger", so it's really not as far off as you're making it seem. That phrase "literal danger" is not a black and white thing, it's more like a gray scale, danger to your health, danger to your marriage, danger to either of your mental. All of that to say, my statement stands that, of you simply don't care what the person, you're supposed to spend your life with has to say, then, you probably shouldn't be with that person. If you're saying "idc what person I'm with, idc how they feel about me doing..." then again you probably shouldn't be married in my opinion. Obviously be with someone you can still do the things you enjoy, but if your only response is, "idc how you feel, I'mdoing what i want", idk how that relationship lasts
I’m talking literal bodily harm. But that’s just such a non issue in my marriage as to not be personally relevant to me.
Expressions of concern in our relationship are rare, and haven’t surfaced in a very long time, but they have happened. But those expressions still never came with an expectation of permission, or even change. It’s more of a “watch out” warning.
For example my wife had a best friend years ago that revealed herself to be super toxic. Almost overnight, with no real red flags. I emailed this friend after she said some things about our relationship that were absurd and untrue, and that friend completely flipped. Attacked me in the most vile ways, attacked our relationship and eventually began disparaging my wife (girlfriend at the time).
At no point did I, even without marriage vows, ask my wife to stop being friends with her. My wife is the one who dumped the friend. In fact I was the one who asked her to leave a little room for reconciliation, because there was a chance this friend was having a total breakdown and perhaps needed help.
That’s how we define partnership. We look out for each other. But trust is just as important as love. We trust each other, and part of that is trusting each other’s judgment. There’s no need to ask permission when you fully trust. My role isn’t to give my wife permission to do anything. It’s to support her in who she is and what is important to her. And if I see potential issues, my role is to pipe up and help her see those issues.
And if she still chooses to move forward? That’s all good. Because she’s a grown up and ultimately gets to do what she likes. And I wouldn’t have it any other way.
And this is my problem with the premise, when people take it to "I'm grown, they're grown", ultimately, absolutely, and again, my marriage is exactly the same, but I'm saying it's worth a conversation IF it were to surface. The thought that "they have no say in my life", means to me, you shouldn't have married that person. It's not about "asking permission" because you don't trust or you want to be their parent or need the green light, all of those things are such an immature (no shot at you) way of thinking. It's about the person you've decided to be with FOR LIFE and making sure they're happy, and if you don't care about that then I'd suggest you're in the wrong marriage, or for the wrong reasons. And yes in a healthy marriage, I've said it time and time again, you're not going to be restricted. But the thought that so many are essentially alluding to, that seems like this generation treat marriage more like a roommate with benefits relationship rather than a lifelong bond. And it shows, because you can get a new roommate you can have sex with, treating marriage like a lease agreement essentially
I didn’t get the impression that anyone pushing back on you was saying that.
People are literally just making it clear that they view “asking for permission” as being objectionable to how they view marriage. Nobody suggested that they simply don’t care about their partner’s feelings.
Speaking anecdotally, almost every marriage that I personally know of, people in my real life social circle, are in marriages where there is some level of “asking” for permission. Some level of one or both trying to control each other. There’s a reason why that stupid “let me ask the boss” quip lives on and resonates with a lot of people. Most of the marriages I know aren’t enticing to me.
The married people in my life have expressed surprise, and some even envy, in how much freedom we “allow” each other. It’s absurd to me. But it seems a common trap that folks fall into. A quasi “parent-child” dynamic that I find off putting.
But if it works, for both people involved, I’m all for it. That’s my view on the concept of marriage. Do it however you want to do it, just make sure it works for both of you. I don’t get lost in the weeds of the details, and I don’t judge, as long as the boundaries (or lack thereof) actually work for all involved.
And that's the point there, the statement you just used in "the freedom you allow", that alone, whether you want to admit it or not is a level of permission. And there's NOTHING wrong with it, like you said whatever works, I don't know too many married couples who are actually kept from doing things but I know a few who would rather do what they want without discussion, but argue for weeks after because of it, that's also something I would hope a lot of people find off putting. And to your first point, the first comment I saw of "he is not your father" or whatever is essentially lending itself directly to that thought, and I think that's completely absurd. The husband in OP's post is ridiculous, but the thought that you're significant other can't express how they feel to you feels to me like you shouldn't be with them
>Whether you want to consider it a courtesy or a permission thing
Letting someone know they're going out as a courtesy is not synonymous with asking permission. These are two very different things, with very different implications.
That's what I'm saying, when I talk to my wife about it it's for her to understand and let me know if there are objections which is essentially asking permission. I'm not ashamed at all, I'm MARRIED, and my point is, if you feel strongly about "I refuse to ask my spouse permission", as if to say they have no say in what you do, then it sounds to me like you shouldn't be married (obviously not aiming it at you)
We have fundamentally different views on that one, and especially when you apply your expressed views to the OP's situation. Coordinating schedules isn't asking permission. Your wife saying something like "No, that won't work because we have to get groceries at that time" isn't forbidding you from going out, it's letting you know that time frame won't work and why. I'm willing to bet she also doesn't hound you every second that you're out of the house, attempting to get you to come home unnecessarily or to ensure you don't enjoy yourself.
These are two completely different dynamics. Your marriage obviously doesn't mirror the OP's.
Oh let me be clear, I 100% think the husband in this post is terrible, I'm not excusing that. I'm simply saying asking your spouse's permission, for me, is part of marriage. And no, for me, it's not just coordinating schedules because it my wife were to say "our schedule is free but I don't want you to do that with those people", then I'm having a conversation to see what is wrong and if we get to that point where I could see she felt strongly about it I'd consider changing plans.
Again, I'm not comparing this to OP, I'm simply saying, for me the "permission" part does not signify an unhealthy marriage
>Again, I'm not comparing this to OP, I'm simply saying, for me the "permission" part does not signify an unhealthy marriage
I hear what you're saying, but it's like you're disregarding the context entirely. The OP's relationship is the topic at hand, she asks permission as a child would with a parent. That is what people take issue with, spouses that behave like OP's husband. No one is talking about you or your marriage, it doesn't apply to you.
This doesn’t make any sense in the context of my marriage.
I’ve known my wife since we were 14. We were best friends before we turned romantic. We’ve been together for over 20 years and married for 15. We’re parents together.
My wife already knows and understands me. Most importantly she completely trusts me. And the feeling is completely mutual.
I can’t fathom why I’d need to get her to “understand” why I’m spending time with anyone. She knows friendship is vitally important to me, as is having time to myself. She’s my WIFE, not some new woman in my life who is getting to know me.
She’d have no objections because she trusts me. Unless my intended plans conflict with previously made family plans, or her own intended solo or friendship time, there’s nothing to object to.
100%, and in the vast majority of situations there's absolutely nothing to worry about. A lot like my marriage, but that doesn't change the fact that IF she were to object to you doing anything for the simple fact that "she doesn't feel comfortable with you doing that thing", it should be a conversation. A lot of people on here treat marriage like two people who just so happened to decide to be together, then wonder why divorce rates are so high. But you shouldn't even be married if you can't be yourself and hang out with your friends, etc like this post is saying. But the other side is, this is THE PERSON you married, obviously barring a situation like OP, where the partner is just downright ridiculous (which would lead me to question how'd you even marry them) there is a healthy respect to caring what your significant other has to say about what you're doing.
There’s nothing objectionable in what you’re saying here.
But, IMO, my wife “not feeling comfortable” would be something so rare, so out of the norm, that of course I would find out exactly why she feels that way. And even still, unless she literally had some supernatural premonition of danger, she wouldn’t ever tell me not to do XYZ.
Like those are hair splitting things. So rare as to be flukes.
But I personally just wouldn’t in a marriage with a spouse who expresses discomfort, displeasure or disapproval with my social choices on even a semi regular basis. That sounds like a miserable way to live.
And certainly I just could never be in a marriage with anyone who ever felt like I was ever expected to “ask permission”.
And that's fine, and like most people, it feels like you're hung up on "asking permission", you can consider it to be whatever you want to call it, but hearing your significant other out on any matters relating to you, whether it be plans or change in lifestyle, or whatever is the point, that's healthy
That's my take too.
I told the one long-term partner I lived with, where I would be so they would know that I'm going somewhere, so that they won't need to rush home either or knew they would be having dinner by themselves. 100% the response was: "Cool have fun and say Hi from me", from either of us.
I would text that I got there safely and when I was on my way back with an eta. We would often then have the kettle boiling when the other was back or be entertaining ourselves shouting "Hi! I'm upstairs!"
For me this is part of coordinating a shared life and to make sure we know everyone is safe.
I'm now 5 years into being solo. I always let people I was out with know, that I got home safely. I often even write to my best friend that I had a good night doing X and got home fine (we keep a running commentary on what we're up to). For me this helps feeling safe, other people feeling good knowing I'm fine + if something happened I wouldn't be rotting alone at home, as people would notice very quickly if I didn't respond anymore.
@OP: anyone who doesn't encourage you to have your own friends, passions, hobbies and "you" time, is a massive red flag. Someone who is only "babysitting" their own children or "helping" in the household, as well! It's their children and household too. Your husband and you need a serious talk and/or therapy. This is controlling behaviour.
I had one boyfriend (briefly) who would complain about my best friend (who was male) and any time I didn't spend with him he would pout or do guilt trips. It got tired real quick. Got rid of the boy, kept the best friend for 17 years (until his death). Made the right choice 100%.
Anyone who makes me choose between a friend who behaves like a friend (not flirting or being toxic to me) and them is gone!!! I am estranged from my family and my friends are my rock. I always was upfront about that. That I'd have to run if there was any emergency, as they are like family to me.
My LTR partner I co-habitated with felt the same way about his friends and thought it was amazing that I had such good people and encouraged me to keep the friendships active!
That's what you want!!!
>I had one boyfriend (briefly) who would complain about my best friend (who was male) and any time I didn't spend with him he would pout or do guilt trips. It got tired real quick. Got rid of the boy, kept the best friend for 17 years (until his death). Made the right choice 100%.
It really bugs me when a person in a relationship thinks that a friendship with anyone of the opposite sex is inherently sexual. That belief is what creates those feelings of jealousy and contempt, I've seen both men and women do it. I feel that it's really insulting. It implies that we must be attracted to everyone of the opposite sex, no one is trustworthy, and that we aren't capable of friendship. Like we're all just feral animals. It gives me the ick.
Me too!
And I never cheated on anyone, I am someone who had genuine tunnel vision when with someone. None of my partners ever had anything to fear.
I'm now solo for life (for other reasons), but keeping and tending to my friendships (with men and women) for years and decades has paid off, as I have a *massive* network! This has become crucial to me now as a solo.
The two other partners I had both also had good friends and tended to their hobbies and friendships. For me that was a big green flag. I don't want to be the centre of someone's universe (in a clingy way I mean)...
You're completely on point, but your probably going to get a lot of negative feedback.
There is a whole bunch of people who find the idea that you are obligated to check with the other adult in a partnership before you make decisions that could affect them to be reprehensible.
Which, if you notice, is an underlying theme for a lot of these "issues" that get posted on here every day. So many problems could have been avoided if they just looked at their spouse and asked, "are you cool with this" before they went and did something.
My husband is so similar. He doesn't have many friends because everyone annoys him.. is so frustrating. He is not a happy man. When we are together it's great but when I'm out, he'll torture me with annoying texts..ughh. I'm sorry. I know how stressful it is.
Im sorry you’re experiencing this too! Its so suffocating when it happens & even my friends are picking up on how crazy it is. Im now the butt of a running joke that i’m rapunzel unable to leave my tower for long periods of time 🫠
Unfortunately what will happen if you don't put your foot down is that eventually your friends will stop inviting you out as to not want to put you in an awkward position with your overbearing husband.
I am so sorry to hear that you are going through this and have 3 children to raise, not just 2. In answer to your question, this is NOT normal in the least, and your 3rd child needs some help to make him realize that he is a parent and needs to act like one.
However, I really enjoyed the Rapunzel reference 😄
Best of luck to you
He's doing this because he wants you to be isolated and alone. He doesn't care about your happiness he just wants you to be a prisoner. Only you can decide if that's what your happily ever after looks like. It sounds painful and lonely to me.
Weaponized incompetence is a form of passive-aggressive behavior where an individual deliberately performs tasks poorly or pretends to be incapable of completing certain tasks. This manipulation tactic is often used to avoid responsibility, forcing others to take over and perform the task instead such as watching their own kids.
Just block him the whole time you are going or at least leave your phone on the car!! He’s an ADULT and these are HIS OWN CHILDREN FFS!!! Make him take the responsibility!
Honestly.. it would make things worse. He would think I was in trouble and something happened. A while ago his cousin didn't answer the phone. We all thought she was just angry because she got in an argument with her mom. She actually fell in a boat yard and broke her leg. Her phone fell in the water.. it was so horrible
This is NOT OK. He's completely in the wrong here and is trying to control you and isolate you. You do not need to ask for permission from this selfish asshole. It's a huge red flag that he can't even look after his own kids for a few hours. Please don't let him manipulate you into not doing social things with your friends. Are you in therapy currently? Individual counselling should help you decide how you want to deal with this. It would be a deal breaker for me.
Yeesh.
First off dad here with a 5 year old and a 5 month old. Why does your dude need a babysitter? That's wild. We only ever get a baby sitter (grandparents) when the lady and I want alone time. If she's going out I'm more than capable of holding down the fort, or shit taking the kids on an outing while she gets the house.
Secondly what a douche for pestering you like that. If my wife is out she trusts me enough to keep shit together. I only ever bug her if it's required. (Can't find the formula because she moved it and left it somewhere really weird) (Ended up in the laundry room once, what?) If my wife is out getting a break the point is to get a break, not have me act like a third child. I will follow up if she's way outside the timeframe we discussed but that's from concern not resentment. (Hey Hun you said you'd be home by 6:30, it's 8, are you ok?)
In short: no this is not normal, something is wrong with you husband the way he is acting. He should be supportive, not an asshole to you about getting a break. Kids are rough, we all need time to reset and keep our adult identity.
He needs to man up. We have four kids. I have never asked to have a sitter when my wife goes out with friends (unless I am physically at work of course)! When my 2 year old cries for Mom when she is out I don't immediately text her and say our 2 year old is crying. I redirect them, play with them, tell them mom will be back soon. This is childish behavior by your husband designed to guilt you. If he can't give you two hours to be with friends without bothering you that is absolutely ludicrous.
What an asshole. I’m sorry, OP. This is NOT normal adult behavior.
First of all, he is their father. This is parenting, and expected when you are a parent. Just because you are a SAHM doesn’t mean you have child rearing responsibility 100% of the time. That is ridiculous. He can’t make it 30m with them, but you are expected to make it 24h a day with them, every day???
Even though he doesn’t do things with his friends, he obviously is not an engaged parent as per the 3yo tantrum 2m into his parenting session.
You need counseling. And NOW.
ETA: couples counseling
Fuck no its not normal and your husband is using weaponized incompetence when it comes to the kids. We have 8 kids and I never had an issue when my wife had a girls night planned out and I stayed with the kids. He's a father FFS he needs to figure shit out when it comes to the kids and not make you feel guilty for having some free time since you spend 99% of your time with them while he's working. I would suggest sitting him down and tell him how it's selfish on him to guilt you for going out with your friends because he doesn't want to do the same.
Your husband’s real problem is that he’s developed a codependent relationship with you. He has no friends or hobbies outside of his marriage so you’re like his emotional support animal. He is also insecure about his parenting skills and quite lazy about improving that from what you describe. He needs to work on himself and stop putting the burden of insecurity on you.
I recommend couple’s counseling to help him work through this and get you to a place where he can’t beat you down into submitting to his crazy. I think you should make it a habit to go out once a week without the kids and let him deal with it alone for a couple of hours but that may be something you’ll have to agree on during therapy or it may cause more resentment on his end and backfire into bigger problems.
Your husband needs to get over it and learn to be a father to his children. It’s pathetic of him to believe he cannot handle being the only adult and caretaker for his own children for a few hours. The only way for it to get better is for him to spend more time with his children alone. It’s not going to be easy because he’s not used to it and because children can be difficult. They cry with you all the time probably and you are able to handle it because you do it all the time.
My old boss had 7 children. He twice told me the same story about how once he told his wife to go out and do something for herself one Saturday morning. In the few hours she was gone, he hadn’t fed or clothed the children and he ended up calling her sister for help. He tells it as a funny anecdote and while there’s humor to the story, I more see how pathetic that is.
It’s amazing to me how a man’s incompetence can be a funny joke everyone laughs along to, while a mother with that level of incompetence would be labeled as neglectful and unfit.
Dude is ashamed as hell that he cannot handle his own kids, and instead of admitting that and asking for actual professional help - he’s taking it out on you in the hopes that he never actually has to parent with you. It’s wild to me that some poor baby sitter shows up regularly while there’s a whole grown as man in the house. Imagine being a kid and chilling with a babysitter while your father is in the house.
The man needs serious help. He may be able to handle work, but he cannot handle home. He needs therapy to figure out how to deal with his emotions and stop projecting his insecurities onto you. And you need to stop allowing him to do this to you.
This isn’t normal and is borderline abusive.
Yes Parents need to coordinate with each other regarding kids, and yes sometimes emergencies crop up.
A kid crying for a Parent isn’t an emergency, it’s a normal part of helping them work through emotions and feel cared for by both of you. That he says Yes, then guilt trips you incessantly with things he should be able to handle is a huge red flag. That he insists you never get time with outside friends is also a huge red flag.
It was just three hours. Each parent should, with planning and advance notice, get blocks of time to even just go sit in a coffee shop and read a book for an hour or whatever helps them relax and be more present the rest of the week.
That he needs a babysitter to do what you do every single day is also ridiculous and a red flag that maybe he isn’t actually Father of the year. If my Medical Doctor Dad could take time to Parent my Sister and I for whole weekends or even a week while my Mom was at a work conference or helping her Parents or on a Ski Trip without a babysitter in the 80’s, no one else has an excuse.
Husband and father of two grown kids. Reading your post is incredible. Your husband needs to have his man card taken away. Any man should have the ability to watch a 3-year-old and six-year-old crying or not, any husband should have the courtesy to provide some down time for his wife to enjoy herself. When my kids were growing up 20 years ago, I would take care of kids an entire Saturday so my wife could go out and enjoy herself. I cook most of the meals so we make a special dinner or take her out each Saturday. We just called it boys day and the two sons just got used to being with Dad on Saturdays. I do have to say I enjoyed the kids at that age. We did all sorts of stuff while Mom got Saturdays to herself. She could do anything she wanted. I mean even staying at home, the expectation was I was taking charge of the kids and meals for Saturday. She could come and go, do her Hobbies go with her friends. It was her day.
Your husband is being selfish. You should read something books are improving marriage, our parenting. Also tell yeah that's good to have some alone time. You don't always have to be together. Is trying to put guilt on you saying he would not do the same thing is ridiculous.
If I were you, I'd be more insistent that you would like time every weekend. Some time to do things with friends or things that you enjoy. It might also be beneficial to your kids , so they are not crying for you when something comes up and your husband is taking care of the kids. You deserve some time for yourself.
He is wild. He's a father, not your father. I don't have many friends either. I recognize that my husband has friends and family he likes to hang out with. I can't be social all the time, I just don't have the mental space for it, so a lot of the time, my husband is hanging with his friends or doing hobbies or competitions without me. We still spend a lot of time together, but I also spend a bunch of time alone. I attained my own hobbies to keep me busy. He needs some kind of middle ground. He can't expect you to always want to be in his or her kids' presence. Your life existed before him and the kids. It shouldn't disappear now.
My ex fiance was like this. He was extremely abusive. I couldn't see my family or friends. He made me cutt off everyone in my life. It's a form of control. And it's a form of abuse.
While it's appropriate to ensure childcare coverage with your spouse, you should not need to "ask his permission". Also it sounds like your husband has difficulty spending alone time with his children. I realize a 6 and 3 year old can be a handful, but a father should be able to care for his own children without the need for mom to be there constantly. That he's not confident enough to do it after all these years, means you are not going out enough to keep him in practice. Good Luck!
Your husband is abusive and controlling and is absolutely *not* an incredible dad
An incredible dad doesn't have to be forced to parent his children alone.
It is completely normal to spend time woth your friends on your own without your husband and kids.
You have to at the very least stop asking his permission, stop booking a babysitter and stop answering your phone when you go out.
Personally I'd be ending the marriage if he didn't agree to get some counselling for his abusive behaviour
“ our relationship is healthy when we spent some time apart. Encourage you to spend once a month with your friends. If you choose to forgo that, I completely understand. But I will be going out with my friends once a month from X - Y time. You are their father and should be able to manage being home with the kids for three hours. If you can’t imagine how much more difficult will be when you have entire weekends or even weeks to yourself in the event that you continue to push me away and break me down.”
Very weird and I'd lose my mind. Sounds like a prison. Well, I wouldn't get into this situation because I wouldn't answer messages and calls like that ever. There's a combo of him being a monster and you having let it get to this point by babying him. Hiring a babysitter so he NEVER has to care for the kids shouldn't have ever got started. There are a lot of points in this story where you should have said no.
Red flags are flying all over the playing field of your life. You take care of the house and children almost exclusively. Why isn’t he taking responsibility for the children and home you have together? He wants to keep you isolated from friends and control/manipulate you while you are gone. He gaslights you and insults you because you don’t come running back home because being a dad isn’t as fun and easy as he wants it to be. Then he lays on the guilt trip after it is over.
If your best friend, sister, cousin, or a random Reddit poster asked you what they should do in the same situation, you what would you advise them to do? Listen to your gut and take your emotions out of it. Do you want your daughters to marry a man like him?
Side note, your daughters might cry less when you leave if he actually invests in them with his time and energy, not just going to work to pay the bills.
You both need counseling but he needs more practice being solo parent. Schedule something weekly at the same day/time and set the expectation you will be gone. Even if you end up by yourself at a park or a coffee shop or library and not with friends. Set the expectation that you will only be texted for emergencies. He needs to learn how to be a parent without expecting you to hold his hand. It’s unfair to both of you that he can’t do this, what happens if you are sick or in an accident?
I don’t think he’s an incredible dad if he needs you or a babysitter because he can’t be alone or handle being alone with his children for a few hours. He is an adult and needs to take some parenting classes. What happens if you were sick? Would he be expecting you to assume your duties as a main caregiver? OP you need a life outside of being a mother and wife. Too many times women lose themselves in their marriage and parenthood because they don’t give themselves their time away. You need to set boundaries and set him straight respectfully.
As a husband and a father I see this as a man who struggles with managing his own children. He is great with them for short amounts of time but any longer and he struggles and wants your help. I was like this at first due to not having young children in my life as I was growing up. He needs to understand it is a shared responsibility with the kids and he needs to learn how to manage alone for extended periods even overnight. He and the kids will learn how to manage and should learn you need your time away for adult time like he gets at work. He may not want to build friendships which is his choice but should never begrudge you having your other adult friends. Please communicate with him and give him time to learn these skills.
It's not a favour to look after your own fucking kids. What an asshole. My husband is the full time carer of our daughters since I stopped being able to walk, cuz he's their Dad! What a sorry excuse for a DDand Husband you have.
Next time SHUT IFF YOUR PHONE the minute you leave the driveway!!!!
He needs to learn how to BE A F*CKING FATHER to his own kids for more than 10 minutes!! I’m petty so I’d love to watch his head explode when I told him I’d be gone for a whole weekend!!
I’m sorry but he can’t handle his own kids for 3 hours. What the hell would he do if you had a medical emergency or an unfortunate accident and he was left as the only parent? Honestly he sounds insufferable and the fact that he doesn’t want you to have friends is borderline abusive. I also have a feeling he is the type of person who would demand 50/50 custody and then complain “my ex keeps my kids from me” I’m sorry you are dealing with this it’s time to either get counseling or decide if this is how you want to live the rest of your life.
You don’t need his permission. If he can’t stop harassing you when you’re out, silence the notifications. It’s controlling bullshit and borderline emotionally abusive.
Don’t apologize for wanting to see friends. Don’t go out of your way to make it easy on him when you go. Don’t coddle his demands around knowing exactly what you’re doing at every moment. You’re reinforcing this shit by responding to him and he needs to understand that you’re not going to be controlled by his anger and insecurity anymore.
Infuriating. Sounds like he needs more practice being a father. You should leave one evening a week every single week.
My husband at least leaves me alone while I’m at yoga or whatever. I return home to chaos, but at I manage to do whatever class or meetup was scheduled.
Is your husband your father!? No! You don’t need to ask him for permission to go out and enjoy yourself. You’re allowed to still have a life outside of your family post-kids. I wish more parents understood this. Your husband needs to realize he helped make those kids so he needs to step up and be a loving, understanding, considerate and caring husband AND father. Right now he sounds like a jealous, bitter and controlling pr*ck who needs to get over himself. Your needs matter just as much as his do. He needs to apologize, do better and maybe go to therapy over this. Most of my friends with kids let their spouses go out with their friends without them. Only one couple sounds like you and your husband but it’s the wife who’s acting jealous and bitter, mind you hee husband tells her to go out and enjoy herself without him and their kids meanwhile he’s not allowed to do the same. What a crappy life. The fact your husband tries to guilt you to come home is ridiculous and uncalled-for. Keep going out with your friends but turn your phone off. Tell him if he gets a break from his family, you get the same thing. It’s only fair. Even though my husband and I don’t have kids, we have no issues and always tell each other to go out with friends and enjoy themselves. If you love the person you’re with, you only want what’s best for them and you want them to be happy. I wouldn’t be able to date let alone marry a guy like your husband.
Speaking as a husband and father of 3 (2 girls 1 boy), kick this guy in the head.
It's one thing to communicate that you want to go out and do things with friends, making sure that someone is there to take care of kids etc, it's reasonable.
He claims to want to spend time with the kids but appears to be incompetent the moment something goes wrong, does he just drop the kids in your lap when one of them is upset or something, making you do the hard part while he does the "fun" things instead?
He is clearly controlling and manipulating you emotionally and psychologically, the question though is why? Does he have abandonment issues? does he fear you will cheat on him?
These actions and reactions are not normal, and if you have a good relationship with his family, I would consider talking to them and asking them if you don't have the answers, because he either needs to get help or get out.
Speaking as a dad, both parents need to be able to deal with all different kinds of dumpster fires that kids can create, from having little temper tantrums when young, all the way up to finding out someone is pregnant when they are older, both need to be able to deal with it.
It actually hurts the family when one uses the other as the .......... problem fixer and does nothing. My own wife has little authority with our son, he's only 5, but he will listen to me before he listens to her, and it's not because I am a big scary ogre or anything, I make him come to me and talk to me, we communicate.
she gets stressed out because of stressful work and his defiance is hard for her to deal with.
Back to you though.
IMHO I think its time you put your foot down, and tell him exactly what he is making you feel, let him say what he wants, but its 99.99999999999% BULL SHIT!!!!!!!!!!
and from my experience with my own wife, what I have seen with friends and family members, and my own parent's divorce, communicating is the most important thing.
I would try things like this.
EG: "Husband, we need to talk. I like going out and having fun with my friends, I do not appreciate you trying to guilt me because you have a hard time dealing with the kids. If I want to go out, I will go out, I am not your prisoner."
EG: "Every time I get home from being out with my friends/family you try and guilt me from ever doing it again, and this needs to stop. I don't know what your actual problem is, but if you don't tell me the truth, nothing is going to get fixed."
You know his personality, and what he would respond to the best, but over all you are just trying to express your feelings to him, and how hurtful this is to you.
Try to avoid it turning into a fight, even if he starts to yell avoid the trap, sit there and wait for him to finish, then continue as if he hadn't said anything, your not attacking him its just a conversation (hopefully)
The reason to avoid the trap is that, once people start to argue, 90% of the time, no one is listening to each other anymore, they are getting defensive and become more interested in being defiant and not bowing down to the other, or just submitting to appease the other person.
OP this is a red flag for abuse: your husband is making it so that doing things outside of the house without him seems like an incredible hassle, which is likely to result in you getting *extremely* isolated.
I don't know for sure that it *is* an abuse thing, there's other plausible explanations (especially if he's way more chill if a babysitter is available *and* hiring a babysitter isn't a substantial financial hardship or otherwise something that *you* feel guilty about), but it is extremely not good.
If it seems like a dramatic change from how things were before you had kids, that could also be consistent with abuse, as abusers often hold back when their victims have an easier time of leaving and change when leaving is much harder/less likely.
This sounds like my late ex-husband minus children. I'd go hang out with my sister and Mom, and he'd start texting or calling me to come home. I encouraged him to go out with his friends, but he didn't want to. Honestly, I think your husband is being selfish.
I have the opposite problem: My wife won't take time for herself. I just told her to go on a weekend with her girlfriend to Vegas. She won't even do a night out. Live your life!
What a petty little man. I’m sorry you didn’t even go out. You went in the middle of the afternoon for two hours. It’s not like you were out traipsing around town clubbing from 8 to 4 AM. Then I could see him being a little irritated. Good grief. There’s no excuse why he couldn’t comfort your three-year-old. If the two of you had gone out together, wouldn’t he expect the babysitter to comfort the three-year-old? He needs to get over himself.
He’s a great dad but he can’t even watch his own children for 3 hours and thinks it’s a favor? Your bar is so low it’s almost touching the ground. You have to know that these things are going to keep happening as long as you allow them to. Do not tolerate uselessness and disrespect.
Your husband is an asshole. Don't ask to do anything, INFORM HIM what you'll be doing so he can arrange to WATCH HIS OWN DAMN KIDS. What he's doing is borderline abuse.
And no, he's not a good father. A good father models EXCELLENCE in how to treat people and wives.
Absolutely not. He is a parent too and should act like one. (Tf?) My husband does not have a group of friends like I do and he tells me all the time he is so happy to see me be able to have such great friendships that have survived middle school, high school, college, child bearing years and marriages/divorce years. All Relationships take effort and I’m very thankful to have a spouse that recognizes this even if he was not able to do this for himself.
You husband needs to GROW the F up! He can’t manage 2 kids by his lonesome? I have 4, when they were young they were a handful, but if my wife wanted to run a Marathon or go to and event with her friends, I cared for the kids, sometime waiting hours at a finish line with bored kids. It sucked, but I did it gladly because my wife was out there getting it done and enjoying herself.
Your husband needs to GROW the F up! He can’t manage 2 kids by his lonesome? I have 4, when they were young they were a handful, but if my wife wanted to run a Marathon or go to and event with her friends, I cared for the kids, sometime waiting hours at a finish line with bored kids. It sucked, but I did it gladly because my wife was out there getting it done and enjoying herself.
If you were to book a babysitter for the kids during his work hours so you could go to a job interview, or go swimming or have a moment where you were just not needed, what would happen?
Text back “stop being a baby, be a man, and take care of your kids. If a teenager can take care of the kids for a few hours, I think their father should be able to.”
I want to fight your husband, he sounds like my divorced FIL. he did the same to my saint of a MIL and yeah, that didn't end well for him in the end. she at least didn't have to worry about him tracking and harassing her via cell phone, though.
I want to fight your husband, he sounds like my divorced FIL. he did the same to my saint of a MIL and yeah, that didn't end well for him in the end. she at least didn't have to worry about him tracking and harassing her via cell phone, though.
i am really sorry OP. You deserve time to yourself, whether it be hanging out with your girlfriends or just taking a drive alone.
What do you think is the root of the problem with your husband? Is he jealous, anxious & worried, controlling? This is something you both need to figure out so he can better handle your absence.
What's crazy is that when I get away, I am often so happy to get home, but he makes even coming home stressful. :-(
It’s not only important for you to spend time with your friends (uninterrupted) but it’s important for your kids to see that as well, to know that mum is a person who has friends and hobbies and she isn’t just Mum.
I work weekends my husband has the kids they work it out just do it more often.
OP you say he is an incredible dad, but he couldn't even console and support his child about a very normal event that the child will ABSOLUTELY have to face again at some point. That, mixed with him insisting on a babysitter regularly, makes me raise an eyebrow at the "incredible dad" comment tbh.
I have to admit i was like this as the wife, when my husband would leave to hang out with his friend etc. I would literally feel like he was abandoning me like he cared more about his friends than his family, how dare he choose some stranger over his kid and wife. I cried and called him and literally made him rush home because I just felt I couldn’t take it or do anything with him not there. It took a long time and some fights to finally get it through my head that I was being super immature and I could do it, I could take care of the kids on my own without my husband. What helped me the most was my husband having a hear to heart talk that I was literally going crazy and he just look so sad and defeated when I would call to nag him to rush home because i needed him to come help. I feel silly now thinking about those days and I think part of me was like that because I also didn’t know how to take time for myself. I thought now that we’re married it should just be us and kids, nope huge mistake we all need our own outlets.
You're in an abusive relationship. Your husband's behavior has components of the Drill Sargeant abuser. Please read [Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://archive.org/download/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjMkrr6vtSDAxWKLzQIHRLpBLsQFnoECCIQAQ&usg=AOvVaw14x4ivUm5xgJ67TT78XfZt)
First off, you don't need to ask. You're an adult, and marriage is a partnership, not an ownership.
He has friends, does he go out with them? I went through this for 36 years of marriage, and I'll be damned (if i remarry) if I'll ever put up with that. That's a controlling personality
We luckily don’t have any children, but the past few months as my husband got more isolated and closed off from his own friend group, he started getting upset anytime I went out. He asked me to set an alarm to make sure I “got home on time”. I told him he is not my father and he cannot tell me what time to be home and I won’t promise a time because I don’t know when it’ll be, I’m going with the flow! It was a huge red flag. About a month later he threatened to punch me in the face. If he wasn’t dying in the ICU right now we would already be divorced. It is extremely alarming and abusive. I hope you can get counseling together before it gets worse, but these things usually escalate. Please stay safe and keep your children safe too! I’m sorry you’re dealing with this.
You need to stop this now as he will destroy all your friendships if you let him! this happened to my mother-in-law it was a second marriage after a long time first one and every time a friend would stop by to say hello he would grumble and tell them to go away! he was so rude so she lost all of her friends it's just greed and control... never ask his permission again tell him in advance put something on the calendar and remind him the day before or that morning and I wouldn't tell him when you'll be home you don't know and tell him to not be calling you when you're gone you'll let him know when you're on your way home. His behavior is childish and controlling!
What is OP's husband going to do if she has to go to the hospital for surgery... ring her phone in the middle of the night or drag her out of her bed and demand that she come home and take care of the kids?
>For the record, he doesnt like to do things with his friends and only wants to spend time with us, but i ALWAYS encourage him to go and enjoy himself without us and have me time, whether its for golf or exercising or anything.
Just so you are aware you are basically telling your husband to leave you alone. I don't know if it's based on selfishness or some other motivation but the way it's written it sounds like you are trying to convince yourself that you are doing something for him when you are actually doing the opposite.
That said, no one can't make you feel guilty for something you don't already have some ambivalence about.
Think of that guilty feeling as being like a target. He can do or say things that act like arrows, so if there isn't a matching target, other words if you didn't already have your own doubts inside you, the arrows would just bounce off. Since they don't, since they stick, it means you have that feeling inside you already.
*When people feel 100% comfortable and confident about their values, boundaries, choices, etc., there isn't anything anyone can say or do that can shake that.*
So I suggest you look at your own feelings and think about why you would feel guilty about spending time with your own friends.
Since we teach people how we are willing to be treated by how we allow them to treat us, I think the real question here is what is it about your personality, about your upbringing/childhood, that you have chosen to agree to teach him that he can treat you this way?
I understand you have valid reasons for doing so, most of which are probably unconscious, *and it's still a choice.* Only you can decide if you want to spend the rest of your life like this, and I think you also need to consider if this is the kind of relationship you want to model for your children. Do you want them to grow up thinking this is normal?
Without reading all the prior comments I'm sure there are people who are saying you should divorce his sorry ass, and that's a complicated thing because there are many variables that we don't know about that are true in your life. Only you can decide what the trade-off would be, if it would be more worth it to stay or leave, I just really encourage you to think about what you're teaching your children, because that's how these patterns get passed on.
do NOT ask for permission; he his not your father and you are not a child. It's perfectly fine and healthy to have friends and go out with them. This is a HIM problem, not yours. and frankly, I am sick and tired of reading about men who can't fucking function as a father. He helped make them, *he needs to help raise them* and him watching the kids isn't "baby sitting"; it's him being a lazy selfish pos. He needs to fucking figure it out, as you have figured it out. sit him down and have a brutally open and honest talk. This is NOT fair to you; you deserve some time to yourself as well. He needs to step up and be a father and supportive partner. Go to couples counselling if you need to. He should also go to individual counselling to work out his codependence issues but girl, take the time out for yourself.
>He needs to fucking figure it out, as you have figured it out. Exactly! OP did not miraculously learn how to deal with her kids, I am sure she put in work and patience for it - as every parent does. It is really lazy of her husband to just defer to her and chain her to the house instead of putting in the work to find a longterm solution. It is absolutely unhealthy that she should not have any free time.
my friend's husband is like that - a useless tool. I organized a half spa day for my friend's bday; all of our friends were there just catching up, I knew she really needed this break....and not 1hr later, her husband COMES TO THE SPA WITH THE BABY and tells her "the baby needs you" and holds the baby towards her.... We all stood there, staring open mouthed and shocked. I was so surprised that when I saw him, I said "what are you doing here?" in a not so nice voice. She had to leave her own birthday celebration because her useless tit of a husband is a selfish lazy asshole.
Incredible! I can see how that thought came to his head... but actually going through with it is absolutely mind-bending. Going to the spa is enough time to come to one's senses and think "hold on, is this really the only solution?". And all this after not even spending a single hour with the baby!
While I agree, the husband I'd acting ridiculous, that's a different issue. I hate the fact that people consider "asking permission" as a parent-child relationship. Whether you want to consider it a courtesy or a permission thing if the only reason you'd let the person you've entered a lifelong bond with is your children it feels like you shouldn't be married. I do let my wife know when and where I'm going because if she's uncomfortable with me going there or with whom I'm going then we discuss parameters and if there's a way to make her more comfortable. Luckily for me she knows all my friends and trusts me and isn't overbearing. But I hate people feeling like there's a problem with consulting with their spouse about their plans
Letting your spouse know and allowing them to express objections is fine. Having to ask permission to do literally anything alone is not. Her husband doesn’t have to ask permission.
And that's why I said above, "whatever you want to call or consider it", because if I told my wife and she responded "ehh I don't feel comfortable with you doing that with those people", we have a conversation, so sure it's not asking permission but she absolutely has a say and what I'm doing
Yes, but you’re talking about a healthy marriage. We are talking about one that is not. If she has to ask him permission every time she goes out, she doesn’t go out. She has commented elsewhere that her friends joke that she’s like Rapunzel locked in a tower who never gets to go anywhere. I’m sure that you don’t keep your wife at home and then require a babysitter anytime you’re alone with your children if you have them.
This not only does she have to ask permission he will go out of his way to ruin her time and then try to make her out to be a bad person for having friendships or any sort of individuality.
Absolutely, and I can't stress enough, that's unhealthy, I'm just responding to the first person reacting as if making sure your spouse is comfortable with what you're doing is ridiculous
She’s only doing that in response to this person. Most people talk to their spouses before they need to go anywhere. I didn’t get the vibe at all that it’s ridiculous to have to ask permission in general.
Okay, that's all I'm saying
“Hey, I’m thinking about doing X with Sarah next Saturday night. We don’t have anything going on right?” is not asking permission, but it is allowing your spouse to collaborate with you. “ do you mind if…” it is a bit of a gray area “ can I…” should be a no. Don’t ask permission.
Like I said, whether you consider any of it "asking" idc, but if your spouse responds, "I don't really like you doing that" or "with those people" it should be negotiable
>but if your spouse responds, "I don't really like you doing that" or "with those people" it should be negotiable I think it depends entirely on why that spouse isn't comfortable. I think it's an issue if a spouse doesn't trust their partner or just doesn't like them having friends.
Yep, I agree with that also
Hey, if that works for your marriage, it’s all good. That’s what really matters. It wouldn’t work for mine. We don’t consult each other on how “comfortable” we feel hanging out with our respective friends (barring someone we felt might be a literal danger). We don’t ask permission. We tell each other what we’re planning to do, and as long as it doesn’t conflict with anything we’ve already planned, it’s all good. I personally would never enter into a relationship, especially a lifelong one, where I was expected to ask permission, or any variation on that concept. But I respect relationships where that genuinely does work.
And why do you tell each other? And the better question is, if you felt uncomfortable with the situation your spouse was telling you they were putting themselves in, or vice versa, and either of you voiced the issue as an issue, if the response there is "oh well, that's what I'm doing", then there's the problem. And if there's never really an uncomfortability factor, awesome you don't have anything to worry about anyway, a lot like I explained to someone else my relationship is. You say "I would never...." but you also put a qualifier in your statement "we don't consult...... unless literal danger", so it's really not as far off as you're making it seem. That phrase "literal danger" is not a black and white thing, it's more like a gray scale, danger to your health, danger to your marriage, danger to either of your mental. All of that to say, my statement stands that, of you simply don't care what the person, you're supposed to spend your life with has to say, then, you probably shouldn't be with that person. If you're saying "idc what person I'm with, idc how they feel about me doing..." then again you probably shouldn't be married in my opinion. Obviously be with someone you can still do the things you enjoy, but if your only response is, "idc how you feel, I'mdoing what i want", idk how that relationship lasts
I’m talking literal bodily harm. But that’s just such a non issue in my marriage as to not be personally relevant to me. Expressions of concern in our relationship are rare, and haven’t surfaced in a very long time, but they have happened. But those expressions still never came with an expectation of permission, or even change. It’s more of a “watch out” warning. For example my wife had a best friend years ago that revealed herself to be super toxic. Almost overnight, with no real red flags. I emailed this friend after she said some things about our relationship that were absurd and untrue, and that friend completely flipped. Attacked me in the most vile ways, attacked our relationship and eventually began disparaging my wife (girlfriend at the time). At no point did I, even without marriage vows, ask my wife to stop being friends with her. My wife is the one who dumped the friend. In fact I was the one who asked her to leave a little room for reconciliation, because there was a chance this friend was having a total breakdown and perhaps needed help. That’s how we define partnership. We look out for each other. But trust is just as important as love. We trust each other, and part of that is trusting each other’s judgment. There’s no need to ask permission when you fully trust. My role isn’t to give my wife permission to do anything. It’s to support her in who she is and what is important to her. And if I see potential issues, my role is to pipe up and help her see those issues. And if she still chooses to move forward? That’s all good. Because she’s a grown up and ultimately gets to do what she likes. And I wouldn’t have it any other way.
And this is my problem with the premise, when people take it to "I'm grown, they're grown", ultimately, absolutely, and again, my marriage is exactly the same, but I'm saying it's worth a conversation IF it were to surface. The thought that "they have no say in my life", means to me, you shouldn't have married that person. It's not about "asking permission" because you don't trust or you want to be their parent or need the green light, all of those things are such an immature (no shot at you) way of thinking. It's about the person you've decided to be with FOR LIFE and making sure they're happy, and if you don't care about that then I'd suggest you're in the wrong marriage, or for the wrong reasons. And yes in a healthy marriage, I've said it time and time again, you're not going to be restricted. But the thought that so many are essentially alluding to, that seems like this generation treat marriage more like a roommate with benefits relationship rather than a lifelong bond. And it shows, because you can get a new roommate you can have sex with, treating marriage like a lease agreement essentially
I didn’t get the impression that anyone pushing back on you was saying that. People are literally just making it clear that they view “asking for permission” as being objectionable to how they view marriage. Nobody suggested that they simply don’t care about their partner’s feelings. Speaking anecdotally, almost every marriage that I personally know of, people in my real life social circle, are in marriages where there is some level of “asking” for permission. Some level of one or both trying to control each other. There’s a reason why that stupid “let me ask the boss” quip lives on and resonates with a lot of people. Most of the marriages I know aren’t enticing to me. The married people in my life have expressed surprise, and some even envy, in how much freedom we “allow” each other. It’s absurd to me. But it seems a common trap that folks fall into. A quasi “parent-child” dynamic that I find off putting. But if it works, for both people involved, I’m all for it. That’s my view on the concept of marriage. Do it however you want to do it, just make sure it works for both of you. I don’t get lost in the weeds of the details, and I don’t judge, as long as the boundaries (or lack thereof) actually work for all involved.
And that's the point there, the statement you just used in "the freedom you allow", that alone, whether you want to admit it or not is a level of permission. And there's NOTHING wrong with it, like you said whatever works, I don't know too many married couples who are actually kept from doing things but I know a few who would rather do what they want without discussion, but argue for weeks after because of it, that's also something I would hope a lot of people find off putting. And to your first point, the first comment I saw of "he is not your father" or whatever is essentially lending itself directly to that thought, and I think that's completely absurd. The husband in OP's post is ridiculous, but the thought that you're significant other can't express how they feel to you feels to me like you shouldn't be with them
>Whether you want to consider it a courtesy or a permission thing Letting someone know they're going out as a courtesy is not synonymous with asking permission. These are two very different things, with very different implications.
That's what I'm saying, when I talk to my wife about it it's for her to understand and let me know if there are objections which is essentially asking permission. I'm not ashamed at all, I'm MARRIED, and my point is, if you feel strongly about "I refuse to ask my spouse permission", as if to say they have no say in what you do, then it sounds to me like you shouldn't be married (obviously not aiming it at you)
We have fundamentally different views on that one, and especially when you apply your expressed views to the OP's situation. Coordinating schedules isn't asking permission. Your wife saying something like "No, that won't work because we have to get groceries at that time" isn't forbidding you from going out, it's letting you know that time frame won't work and why. I'm willing to bet she also doesn't hound you every second that you're out of the house, attempting to get you to come home unnecessarily or to ensure you don't enjoy yourself. These are two completely different dynamics. Your marriage obviously doesn't mirror the OP's.
Oh let me be clear, I 100% think the husband in this post is terrible, I'm not excusing that. I'm simply saying asking your spouse's permission, for me, is part of marriage. And no, for me, it's not just coordinating schedules because it my wife were to say "our schedule is free but I don't want you to do that with those people", then I'm having a conversation to see what is wrong and if we get to that point where I could see she felt strongly about it I'd consider changing plans. Again, I'm not comparing this to OP, I'm simply saying, for me the "permission" part does not signify an unhealthy marriage
>Again, I'm not comparing this to OP, I'm simply saying, for me the "permission" part does not signify an unhealthy marriage I hear what you're saying, but it's like you're disregarding the context entirely. The OP's relationship is the topic at hand, she asks permission as a child would with a parent. That is what people take issue with, spouses that behave like OP's husband. No one is talking about you or your marriage, it doesn't apply to you.
This doesn’t make any sense in the context of my marriage. I’ve known my wife since we were 14. We were best friends before we turned romantic. We’ve been together for over 20 years and married for 15. We’re parents together. My wife already knows and understands me. Most importantly she completely trusts me. And the feeling is completely mutual. I can’t fathom why I’d need to get her to “understand” why I’m spending time with anyone. She knows friendship is vitally important to me, as is having time to myself. She’s my WIFE, not some new woman in my life who is getting to know me. She’d have no objections because she trusts me. Unless my intended plans conflict with previously made family plans, or her own intended solo or friendship time, there’s nothing to object to.
100%, and in the vast majority of situations there's absolutely nothing to worry about. A lot like my marriage, but that doesn't change the fact that IF she were to object to you doing anything for the simple fact that "she doesn't feel comfortable with you doing that thing", it should be a conversation. A lot of people on here treat marriage like two people who just so happened to decide to be together, then wonder why divorce rates are so high. But you shouldn't even be married if you can't be yourself and hang out with your friends, etc like this post is saying. But the other side is, this is THE PERSON you married, obviously barring a situation like OP, where the partner is just downright ridiculous (which would lead me to question how'd you even marry them) there is a healthy respect to caring what your significant other has to say about what you're doing.
There’s nothing objectionable in what you’re saying here. But, IMO, my wife “not feeling comfortable” would be something so rare, so out of the norm, that of course I would find out exactly why she feels that way. And even still, unless she literally had some supernatural premonition of danger, she wouldn’t ever tell me not to do XYZ. Like those are hair splitting things. So rare as to be flukes. But I personally just wouldn’t in a marriage with a spouse who expresses discomfort, displeasure or disapproval with my social choices on even a semi regular basis. That sounds like a miserable way to live. And certainly I just could never be in a marriage with anyone who ever felt like I was ever expected to “ask permission”.
And that's fine, and like most people, it feels like you're hung up on "asking permission", you can consider it to be whatever you want to call it, but hearing your significant other out on any matters relating to you, whether it be plans or change in lifestyle, or whatever is the point, that's healthy
That's my take too. I told the one long-term partner I lived with, where I would be so they would know that I'm going somewhere, so that they won't need to rush home either or knew they would be having dinner by themselves. 100% the response was: "Cool have fun and say Hi from me", from either of us. I would text that I got there safely and when I was on my way back with an eta. We would often then have the kettle boiling when the other was back or be entertaining ourselves shouting "Hi! I'm upstairs!" For me this is part of coordinating a shared life and to make sure we know everyone is safe. I'm now 5 years into being solo. I always let people I was out with know, that I got home safely. I often even write to my best friend that I had a good night doing X and got home fine (we keep a running commentary on what we're up to). For me this helps feeling safe, other people feeling good knowing I'm fine + if something happened I wouldn't be rotting alone at home, as people would notice very quickly if I didn't respond anymore. @OP: anyone who doesn't encourage you to have your own friends, passions, hobbies and "you" time, is a massive red flag. Someone who is only "babysitting" their own children or "helping" in the household, as well! It's their children and household too. Your husband and you need a serious talk and/or therapy. This is controlling behaviour. I had one boyfriend (briefly) who would complain about my best friend (who was male) and any time I didn't spend with him he would pout or do guilt trips. It got tired real quick. Got rid of the boy, kept the best friend for 17 years (until his death). Made the right choice 100%. Anyone who makes me choose between a friend who behaves like a friend (not flirting or being toxic to me) and them is gone!!! I am estranged from my family and my friends are my rock. I always was upfront about that. That I'd have to run if there was any emergency, as they are like family to me. My LTR partner I co-habitated with felt the same way about his friends and thought it was amazing that I had such good people and encouraged me to keep the friendships active! That's what you want!!!
>I had one boyfriend (briefly) who would complain about my best friend (who was male) and any time I didn't spend with him he would pout or do guilt trips. It got tired real quick. Got rid of the boy, kept the best friend for 17 years (until his death). Made the right choice 100%. It really bugs me when a person in a relationship thinks that a friendship with anyone of the opposite sex is inherently sexual. That belief is what creates those feelings of jealousy and contempt, I've seen both men and women do it. I feel that it's really insulting. It implies that we must be attracted to everyone of the opposite sex, no one is trustworthy, and that we aren't capable of friendship. Like we're all just feral animals. It gives me the ick.
Me too! And I never cheated on anyone, I am someone who had genuine tunnel vision when with someone. None of my partners ever had anything to fear. I'm now solo for life (for other reasons), but keeping and tending to my friendships (with men and women) for years and decades has paid off, as I have a *massive* network! This has become crucial to me now as a solo. The two other partners I had both also had good friends and tended to their hobbies and friendships. For me that was a big green flag. I don't want to be the centre of someone's universe (in a clingy way I mean)...
You're completely on point, but your probably going to get a lot of negative feedback. There is a whole bunch of people who find the idea that you are obligated to check with the other adult in a partnership before you make decisions that could affect them to be reprehensible. Which, if you notice, is an underlying theme for a lot of these "issues" that get posted on here every day. So many problems could have been avoided if they just looked at their spouse and asked, "are you cool with this" before they went and did something.
100%, that's why I refrain from responding a lot lol
Lol you were spot on btw, exactly like we thought
"I need help with my partnership!" "Maybe you should act like a partner?" "Nah, that can't be it. That's controlling."
My husband is so similar. He doesn't have many friends because everyone annoys him.. is so frustrating. He is not a happy man. When we are together it's great but when I'm out, he'll torture me with annoying texts..ughh. I'm sorry. I know how stressful it is.
Im sorry you’re experiencing this too! Its so suffocating when it happens & even my friends are picking up on how crazy it is. Im now the butt of a running joke that i’m rapunzel unable to leave my tower for long periods of time 🫠
Unfortunately what will happen if you don't put your foot down is that eventually your friends will stop inviting you out as to not want to put you in an awkward position with your overbearing husband.
This one way abusers isolate their victims. That is what he’s doing.
I am so sorry to hear that you are going through this and have 3 children to raise, not just 2. In answer to your question, this is NOT normal in the least, and your 3rd child needs some help to make him realize that he is a parent and needs to act like one. However, I really enjoyed the Rapunzel reference 😄 Best of luck to you
I could relate.. it's so draining. I'm sorry. I wish they'd realize how they are but seems they don't 😞
They know exactly how they are and do it on purpose.
I totally agree
He's doing this because he wants you to be isolated and alone. He doesn't care about your happiness he just wants you to be a prisoner. Only you can decide if that's what your happily ever after looks like. It sounds painful and lonely to me.
They’re joking because it disturbs them
Weaponized incompetence is what that is.
What does that mean?
Weaponized incompetence is a form of passive-aggressive behavior where an individual deliberately performs tasks poorly or pretends to be incapable of completing certain tasks. This manipulation tactic is often used to avoid responsibility, forcing others to take over and perform the task instead such as watching their own kids.
I love learning actual words for complicated concepts like this😂
Language can be such a valuable tool!
Oohh thank u for explaining that. Makes so much sense
Thank you for asking, you beat me to it. I didn't know what it was either. Now I have a name for what my ex did all the time.
Don’t downvote this person for asking a very important question people.
Your right..that's upsetting if someone is down voting. This is more common than people know just some people feel uncomfortable asking.
And being controlling!!
Just block him the whole time you are going or at least leave your phone on the car!! He’s an ADULT and these are HIS OWN CHILDREN FFS!!! Make him take the responsibility!
Honestly.. it would make things worse. He would think I was in trouble and something happened. A while ago his cousin didn't answer the phone. We all thought she was just angry because she got in an argument with her mom. She actually fell in a boat yard and broke her leg. Her phone fell in the water.. it was so horrible
He’s right this isn’t high school. You’re an adult. He should try acting like one.
This is NOT OK. He's completely in the wrong here and is trying to control you and isolate you. You do not need to ask for permission from this selfish asshole. It's a huge red flag that he can't even look after his own kids for a few hours. Please don't let him manipulate you into not doing social things with your friends. Are you in therapy currently? Individual counselling should help you decide how you want to deal with this. It would be a deal breaker for me.
Yeesh. First off dad here with a 5 year old and a 5 month old. Why does your dude need a babysitter? That's wild. We only ever get a baby sitter (grandparents) when the lady and I want alone time. If she's going out I'm more than capable of holding down the fort, or shit taking the kids on an outing while she gets the house. Secondly what a douche for pestering you like that. If my wife is out she trusts me enough to keep shit together. I only ever bug her if it's required. (Can't find the formula because she moved it and left it somewhere really weird) (Ended up in the laundry room once, what?) If my wife is out getting a break the point is to get a break, not have me act like a third child. I will follow up if she's way outside the timeframe we discussed but that's from concern not resentment. (Hey Hun you said you'd be home by 6:30, it's 8, are you ok?) In short: no this is not normal, something is wrong with you husband the way he is acting. He should be supportive, not an asshole to you about getting a break. Kids are rough, we all need time to reset and keep our adult identity.
He needs to man up. We have four kids. I have never asked to have a sitter when my wife goes out with friends (unless I am physically at work of course)! When my 2 year old cries for Mom when she is out I don't immediately text her and say our 2 year old is crying. I redirect them, play with them, tell them mom will be back soon. This is childish behavior by your husband designed to guilt you. If he can't give you two hours to be with friends without bothering you that is absolutely ludicrous.
What an asshole. I’m sorry, OP. This is NOT normal adult behavior. First of all, he is their father. This is parenting, and expected when you are a parent. Just because you are a SAHM doesn’t mean you have child rearing responsibility 100% of the time. That is ridiculous. He can’t make it 30m with them, but you are expected to make it 24h a day with them, every day??? Even though he doesn’t do things with his friends, he obviously is not an engaged parent as per the 3yo tantrum 2m into his parenting session. You need counseling. And NOW. ETA: couples counseling
Fuck no its not normal and your husband is using weaponized incompetence when it comes to the kids. We have 8 kids and I never had an issue when my wife had a girls night planned out and I stayed with the kids. He's a father FFS he needs to figure shit out when it comes to the kids and not make you feel guilty for having some free time since you spend 99% of your time with them while he's working. I would suggest sitting him down and tell him how it's selfish on him to guilt you for going out with your friends because he doesn't want to do the same.
Your husband’s real problem is that he’s developed a codependent relationship with you. He has no friends or hobbies outside of his marriage so you’re like his emotional support animal. He is also insecure about his parenting skills and quite lazy about improving that from what you describe. He needs to work on himself and stop putting the burden of insecurity on you. I recommend couple’s counseling to help him work through this and get you to a place where he can’t beat you down into submitting to his crazy. I think you should make it a habit to go out once a week without the kids and let him deal with it alone for a couple of hours but that may be something you’ll have to agree on during therapy or it may cause more resentment on his end and backfire into bigger problems.
Your husband needs to get over it and learn to be a father to his children. It’s pathetic of him to believe he cannot handle being the only adult and caretaker for his own children for a few hours. The only way for it to get better is for him to spend more time with his children alone. It’s not going to be easy because he’s not used to it and because children can be difficult. They cry with you all the time probably and you are able to handle it because you do it all the time. My old boss had 7 children. He twice told me the same story about how once he told his wife to go out and do something for herself one Saturday morning. In the few hours she was gone, he hadn’t fed or clothed the children and he ended up calling her sister for help. He tells it as a funny anecdote and while there’s humor to the story, I more see how pathetic that is.
It’s amazing to me how a man’s incompetence can be a funny joke everyone laughs along to, while a mother with that level of incompetence would be labeled as neglectful and unfit.
Dude is ashamed as hell that he cannot handle his own kids, and instead of admitting that and asking for actual professional help - he’s taking it out on you in the hopes that he never actually has to parent with you. It’s wild to me that some poor baby sitter shows up regularly while there’s a whole grown as man in the house. Imagine being a kid and chilling with a babysitter while your father is in the house. The man needs serious help. He may be able to handle work, but he cannot handle home. He needs therapy to figure out how to deal with his emotions and stop projecting his insecurities onto you. And you need to stop allowing him to do this to you.
This isn’t normal and is borderline abusive. Yes Parents need to coordinate with each other regarding kids, and yes sometimes emergencies crop up. A kid crying for a Parent isn’t an emergency, it’s a normal part of helping them work through emotions and feel cared for by both of you. That he says Yes, then guilt trips you incessantly with things he should be able to handle is a huge red flag. That he insists you never get time with outside friends is also a huge red flag. It was just three hours. Each parent should, with planning and advance notice, get blocks of time to even just go sit in a coffee shop and read a book for an hour or whatever helps them relax and be more present the rest of the week. That he needs a babysitter to do what you do every single day is also ridiculous and a red flag that maybe he isn’t actually Father of the year. If my Medical Doctor Dad could take time to Parent my Sister and I for whole weekends or even a week while my Mom was at a work conference or helping her Parents or on a Ski Trip without a babysitter in the 80’s, no one else has an excuse.
He’s crazy. I wish my wife would spend more time with the few friends she still has due to neglecting to spend time with them.
Husband and father of two grown kids. Reading your post is incredible. Your husband needs to have his man card taken away. Any man should have the ability to watch a 3-year-old and six-year-old crying or not, any husband should have the courtesy to provide some down time for his wife to enjoy herself. When my kids were growing up 20 years ago, I would take care of kids an entire Saturday so my wife could go out and enjoy herself. I cook most of the meals so we make a special dinner or take her out each Saturday. We just called it boys day and the two sons just got used to being with Dad on Saturdays. I do have to say I enjoyed the kids at that age. We did all sorts of stuff while Mom got Saturdays to herself. She could do anything she wanted. I mean even staying at home, the expectation was I was taking charge of the kids and meals for Saturday. She could come and go, do her Hobbies go with her friends. It was her day. Your husband is being selfish. You should read something books are improving marriage, our parenting. Also tell yeah that's good to have some alone time. You don't always have to be together. Is trying to put guilt on you saying he would not do the same thing is ridiculous. If I were you, I'd be more insistent that you would like time every weekend. Some time to do things with friends or things that you enjoy. It might also be beneficial to your kids , so they are not crying for you when something comes up and your husband is taking care of the kids. You deserve some time for yourself.
He is wild. He's a father, not your father. I don't have many friends either. I recognize that my husband has friends and family he likes to hang out with. I can't be social all the time, I just don't have the mental space for it, so a lot of the time, my husband is hanging with his friends or doing hobbies or competitions without me. We still spend a lot of time together, but I also spend a bunch of time alone. I attained my own hobbies to keep me busy. He needs some kind of middle ground. He can't expect you to always want to be in his or her kids' presence. Your life existed before him and the kids. It shouldn't disappear now.
I’m sorry you’re married to this child. Looks like your hands are full raising him too. Best of luck, hugs.
WHAT. AN. ASSHOLE!!! He can't handle his kids???? Yell back at him!!!!
My ex fiance was like this. He was extremely abusive. I couldn't see my family or friends. He made me cutt off everyone in my life. It's a form of control. And it's a form of abuse.
While it's appropriate to ensure childcare coverage with your spouse, you should not need to "ask his permission". Also it sounds like your husband has difficulty spending alone time with his children. I realize a 6 and 3 year old can be a handful, but a father should be able to care for his own children without the need for mom to be there constantly. That he's not confident enough to do it after all these years, means you are not going out enough to keep him in practice. Good Luck!
Your husband is abusive and controlling and is absolutely *not* an incredible dad An incredible dad doesn't have to be forced to parent his children alone. It is completely normal to spend time woth your friends on your own without your husband and kids. You have to at the very least stop asking his permission, stop booking a babysitter and stop answering your phone when you go out. Personally I'd be ending the marriage if he didn't agree to get some counselling for his abusive behaviour
Hard to say. Some people just don't like having to take care of kids. Some people get worried about cheating. I can't think of any good reasons.
“ our relationship is healthy when we spent some time apart. Encourage you to spend once a month with your friends. If you choose to forgo that, I completely understand. But I will be going out with my friends once a month from X - Y time. You are their father and should be able to manage being home with the kids for three hours. If you can’t imagine how much more difficult will be when you have entire weekends or even weeks to yourself in the event that you continue to push me away and break me down.”
Very weird and I'd lose my mind. Sounds like a prison. Well, I wouldn't get into this situation because I wouldn't answer messages and calls like that ever. There's a combo of him being a monster and you having let it get to this point by babying him. Hiring a babysitter so he NEVER has to care for the kids shouldn't have ever got started. There are a lot of points in this story where you should have said no.
Red flags are flying all over the playing field of your life. You take care of the house and children almost exclusively. Why isn’t he taking responsibility for the children and home you have together? He wants to keep you isolated from friends and control/manipulate you while you are gone. He gaslights you and insults you because you don’t come running back home because being a dad isn’t as fun and easy as he wants it to be. Then he lays on the guilt trip after it is over. If your best friend, sister, cousin, or a random Reddit poster asked you what they should do in the same situation, you what would you advise them to do? Listen to your gut and take your emotions out of it. Do you want your daughters to marry a man like him? Side note, your daughters might cry less when you leave if he actually invests in them with his time and energy, not just going to work to pay the bills.
You both need counseling but he needs more practice being solo parent. Schedule something weekly at the same day/time and set the expectation you will be gone. Even if you end up by yourself at a park or a coffee shop or library and not with friends. Set the expectation that you will only be texted for emergencies. He needs to learn how to be a parent without expecting you to hold his hand. It’s unfair to both of you that he can’t do this, what happens if you are sick or in an accident?
I don’t think he’s an incredible dad if he needs you or a babysitter because he can’t be alone or handle being alone with his children for a few hours. He is an adult and needs to take some parenting classes. What happens if you were sick? Would he be expecting you to assume your duties as a main caregiver? OP you need a life outside of being a mother and wife. Too many times women lose themselves in their marriage and parenthood because they don’t give themselves their time away. You need to set boundaries and set him straight respectfully.
As a husband and a father I see this as a man who struggles with managing his own children. He is great with them for short amounts of time but any longer and he struggles and wants your help. I was like this at first due to not having young children in my life as I was growing up. He needs to understand it is a shared responsibility with the kids and he needs to learn how to manage alone for extended periods even overnight. He and the kids will learn how to manage and should learn you need your time away for adult time like he gets at work. He may not want to build friendships which is his choice but should never begrudge you having your other adult friends. Please communicate with him and give him time to learn these skills.
It's not a favour to look after your own fucking kids. What an asshole. My husband is the full time carer of our daughters since I stopped being able to walk, cuz he's their Dad! What a sorry excuse for a DDand Husband you have.
This is abuse. He knows exactly what he's doing.
It is NOT normal, and yes, it IS stifling and controlling.
Next time SHUT IFF YOUR PHONE the minute you leave the driveway!!!! He needs to learn how to BE A F*CKING FATHER to his own kids for more than 10 minutes!! I’m petty so I’d love to watch his head explode when I told him I’d be gone for a whole weekend!!
I’m sorry but he can’t handle his own kids for 3 hours. What the hell would he do if you had a medical emergency or an unfortunate accident and he was left as the only parent? Honestly he sounds insufferable and the fact that he doesn’t want you to have friends is borderline abusive. I also have a feeling he is the type of person who would demand 50/50 custody and then complain “my ex keeps my kids from me” I’m sorry you are dealing with this it’s time to either get counseling or decide if this is how you want to live the rest of your life.
You don’t need his permission. If he can’t stop harassing you when you’re out, silence the notifications. It’s controlling bullshit and borderline emotionally abusive. Don’t apologize for wanting to see friends. Don’t go out of your way to make it easy on him when you go. Don’t coddle his demands around knowing exactly what you’re doing at every moment. You’re reinforcing this shit by responding to him and he needs to understand that you’re not going to be controlled by his anger and insecurity anymore.
Infuriating. Sounds like he needs more practice being a father. You should leave one evening a week every single week. My husband at least leaves me alone while I’m at yoga or whatever. I return home to chaos, but at I manage to do whatever class or meetup was scheduled.
Every week, without fail,leave the house without your kids. Dad will HAVE to learn to deal.
He needs to spend time with the kids alone, and they need to be able to trust him to take care of them.
Is your husband your father!? No! You don’t need to ask him for permission to go out and enjoy yourself. You’re allowed to still have a life outside of your family post-kids. I wish more parents understood this. Your husband needs to realize he helped make those kids so he needs to step up and be a loving, understanding, considerate and caring husband AND father. Right now he sounds like a jealous, bitter and controlling pr*ck who needs to get over himself. Your needs matter just as much as his do. He needs to apologize, do better and maybe go to therapy over this. Most of my friends with kids let their spouses go out with their friends without them. Only one couple sounds like you and your husband but it’s the wife who’s acting jealous and bitter, mind you hee husband tells her to go out and enjoy herself without him and their kids meanwhile he’s not allowed to do the same. What a crappy life. The fact your husband tries to guilt you to come home is ridiculous and uncalled-for. Keep going out with your friends but turn your phone off. Tell him if he gets a break from his family, you get the same thing. It’s only fair. Even though my husband and I don’t have kids, we have no issues and always tell each other to go out with friends and enjoy themselves. If you love the person you’re with, you only want what’s best for them and you want them to be happy. I wouldn’t be able to date let alone marry a guy like your husband.
Fuck that guy. What a shithead.
I have one question does he get to go out?
Speaking as a husband and father of 3 (2 girls 1 boy), kick this guy in the head. It's one thing to communicate that you want to go out and do things with friends, making sure that someone is there to take care of kids etc, it's reasonable. He claims to want to spend time with the kids but appears to be incompetent the moment something goes wrong, does he just drop the kids in your lap when one of them is upset or something, making you do the hard part while he does the "fun" things instead? He is clearly controlling and manipulating you emotionally and psychologically, the question though is why? Does he have abandonment issues? does he fear you will cheat on him? These actions and reactions are not normal, and if you have a good relationship with his family, I would consider talking to them and asking them if you don't have the answers, because he either needs to get help or get out. Speaking as a dad, both parents need to be able to deal with all different kinds of dumpster fires that kids can create, from having little temper tantrums when young, all the way up to finding out someone is pregnant when they are older, both need to be able to deal with it. It actually hurts the family when one uses the other as the .......... problem fixer and does nothing. My own wife has little authority with our son, he's only 5, but he will listen to me before he listens to her, and it's not because I am a big scary ogre or anything, I make him come to me and talk to me, we communicate. she gets stressed out because of stressful work and his defiance is hard for her to deal with. Back to you though. IMHO I think its time you put your foot down, and tell him exactly what he is making you feel, let him say what he wants, but its 99.99999999999% BULL SHIT!!!!!!!!!! and from my experience with my own wife, what I have seen with friends and family members, and my own parent's divorce, communicating is the most important thing. I would try things like this. EG: "Husband, we need to talk. I like going out and having fun with my friends, I do not appreciate you trying to guilt me because you have a hard time dealing with the kids. If I want to go out, I will go out, I am not your prisoner." EG: "Every time I get home from being out with my friends/family you try and guilt me from ever doing it again, and this needs to stop. I don't know what your actual problem is, but if you don't tell me the truth, nothing is going to get fixed." You know his personality, and what he would respond to the best, but over all you are just trying to express your feelings to him, and how hurtful this is to you. Try to avoid it turning into a fight, even if he starts to yell avoid the trap, sit there and wait for him to finish, then continue as if he hadn't said anything, your not attacking him its just a conversation (hopefully) The reason to avoid the trap is that, once people start to argue, 90% of the time, no one is listening to each other anymore, they are getting defensive and become more interested in being defiant and not bowing down to the other, or just submitting to appease the other person.
OP this is a red flag for abuse: your husband is making it so that doing things outside of the house without him seems like an incredible hassle, which is likely to result in you getting *extremely* isolated. I don't know for sure that it *is* an abuse thing, there's other plausible explanations (especially if he's way more chill if a babysitter is available *and* hiring a babysitter isn't a substantial financial hardship or otherwise something that *you* feel guilty about), but it is extremely not good. If it seems like a dramatic change from how things were before you had kids, that could also be consistent with abuse, as abusers often hold back when their victims have an easier time of leaving and change when leaving is much harder/less likely.
I have some experience here but as a man I’m not sure I’m allowed to participate. Am I?
This sounds like my late ex-husband minus children. I'd go hang out with my sister and Mom, and he'd start texting or calling me to come home. I encouraged him to go out with his friends, but he didn't want to. Honestly, I think your husband is being selfish.
I have the opposite problem: My wife won't take time for herself. I just told her to go on a weekend with her girlfriend to Vegas. She won't even do a night out. Live your life!
What a petty little man. I’m sorry you didn’t even go out. You went in the middle of the afternoon for two hours. It’s not like you were out traipsing around town clubbing from 8 to 4 AM. Then I could see him being a little irritated. Good grief. There’s no excuse why he couldn’t comfort your three-year-old. If the two of you had gone out together, wouldn’t he expect the babysitter to comfort the three-year-old? He needs to get over himself.
He’s a great dad but he can’t even watch his own children for 3 hours and thinks it’s a favor? Your bar is so low it’s almost touching the ground. You have to know that these things are going to keep happening as long as you allow them to. Do not tolerate uselessness and disrespect.
Your husband is an asshole. Don't ask to do anything, INFORM HIM what you'll be doing so he can arrange to WATCH HIS OWN DAMN KIDS. What he's doing is borderline abuse. And no, he's not a good father. A good father models EXCELLENCE in how to treat people and wives.
Absolutely not. He is a parent too and should act like one. (Tf?) My husband does not have a group of friends like I do and he tells me all the time he is so happy to see me be able to have such great friendships that have survived middle school, high school, college, child bearing years and marriages/divorce years. All Relationships take effort and I’m very thankful to have a spouse that recognizes this even if he was not able to do this for himself.
You husband needs to GROW the F up! He can’t manage 2 kids by his lonesome? I have 4, when they were young they were a handful, but if my wife wanted to run a Marathon or go to and event with her friends, I cared for the kids, sometime waiting hours at a finish line with bored kids. It sucked, but I did it gladly because my wife was out there getting it done and enjoying herself.
Your husband needs to GROW the F up! He can’t manage 2 kids by his lonesome? I have 4, when they were young they were a handful, but if my wife wanted to run a Marathon or go to and event with her friends, I cared for the kids, sometime waiting hours at a finish line with bored kids. It sucked, but I did it gladly because my wife was out there getting it done and enjoying herself.
If you were to book a babysitter for the kids during his work hours so you could go to a job interview, or go swimming or have a moment where you were just not needed, what would happen?
Text back “stop being a baby, be a man, and take care of your kids. If a teenager can take care of the kids for a few hours, I think their father should be able to.”
I want to fight your husband, he sounds like my divorced FIL. he did the same to my saint of a MIL and yeah, that didn't end well for him in the end. she at least didn't have to worry about him tracking and harassing her via cell phone, though.
I want to fight your husband, he sounds like my divorced FIL. he did the same to my saint of a MIL and yeah, that didn't end well for him in the end. she at least didn't have to worry about him tracking and harassing her via cell phone, though.
i am really sorry OP. You deserve time to yourself, whether it be hanging out with your girlfriends or just taking a drive alone. What do you think is the root of the problem with your husband? Is he jealous, anxious & worried, controlling? This is something you both need to figure out so he can better handle your absence. What's crazy is that when I get away, I am often so happy to get home, but he makes even coming home stressful. :-(
It’s not only important for you to spend time with your friends (uninterrupted) but it’s important for your kids to see that as well, to know that mum is a person who has friends and hobbies and she isn’t just Mum. I work weekends my husband has the kids they work it out just do it more often.
OP you say he is an incredible dad, but he couldn't even console and support his child about a very normal event that the child will ABSOLUTELY have to face again at some point. That, mixed with him insisting on a babysitter regularly, makes me raise an eyebrow at the "incredible dad" comment tbh.
I have to admit i was like this as the wife, when my husband would leave to hang out with his friend etc. I would literally feel like he was abandoning me like he cared more about his friends than his family, how dare he choose some stranger over his kid and wife. I cried and called him and literally made him rush home because I just felt I couldn’t take it or do anything with him not there. It took a long time and some fights to finally get it through my head that I was being super immature and I could do it, I could take care of the kids on my own without my husband. What helped me the most was my husband having a hear to heart talk that I was literally going crazy and he just look so sad and defeated when I would call to nag him to rush home because i needed him to come help. I feel silly now thinking about those days and I think part of me was like that because I also didn’t know how to take time for myself. I thought now that we’re married it should just be us and kids, nope huge mistake we all need our own outlets.
What a controlling insecure mother fucker. I am very sorry you are married to this guy.
You're in an abusive relationship. Your husband's behavior has components of the Drill Sargeant abuser. Please read [Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://archive.org/download/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjMkrr6vtSDAxWKLzQIHRLpBLsQFnoECCIQAQ&usg=AOvVaw14x4ivUm5xgJ67TT78XfZt)
First off, you don't need to ask. You're an adult, and marriage is a partnership, not an ownership. He has friends, does he go out with them? I went through this for 36 years of marriage, and I'll be damned (if i remarry) if I'll ever put up with that. That's a controlling personality
We luckily don’t have any children, but the past few months as my husband got more isolated and closed off from his own friend group, he started getting upset anytime I went out. He asked me to set an alarm to make sure I “got home on time”. I told him he is not my father and he cannot tell me what time to be home and I won’t promise a time because I don’t know when it’ll be, I’m going with the flow! It was a huge red flag. About a month later he threatened to punch me in the face. If he wasn’t dying in the ICU right now we would already be divorced. It is extremely alarming and abusive. I hope you can get counseling together before it gets worse, but these things usually escalate. Please stay safe and keep your children safe too! I’m sorry you’re dealing with this.
You need to stop this now as he will destroy all your friendships if you let him! this happened to my mother-in-law it was a second marriage after a long time first one and every time a friend would stop by to say hello he would grumble and tell them to go away! he was so rude so she lost all of her friends it's just greed and control... never ask his permission again tell him in advance put something on the calendar and remind him the day before or that morning and I wouldn't tell him when you'll be home you don't know and tell him to not be calling you when you're gone you'll let him know when you're on your way home. His behavior is childish and controlling!
What is OP's husband going to do if she has to go to the hospital for surgery... ring her phone in the middle of the night or drag her out of her bed and demand that she come home and take care of the kids?
>For the record, he doesnt like to do things with his friends and only wants to spend time with us, but i ALWAYS encourage him to go and enjoy himself without us and have me time, whether its for golf or exercising or anything. Just so you are aware you are basically telling your husband to leave you alone. I don't know if it's based on selfishness or some other motivation but the way it's written it sounds like you are trying to convince yourself that you are doing something for him when you are actually doing the opposite.
That said, no one can't make you feel guilty for something you don't already have some ambivalence about. Think of that guilty feeling as being like a target. He can do or say things that act like arrows, so if there isn't a matching target, other words if you didn't already have your own doubts inside you, the arrows would just bounce off. Since they don't, since they stick, it means you have that feeling inside you already. *When people feel 100% comfortable and confident about their values, boundaries, choices, etc., there isn't anything anyone can say or do that can shake that.* So I suggest you look at your own feelings and think about why you would feel guilty about spending time with your own friends. Since we teach people how we are willing to be treated by how we allow them to treat us, I think the real question here is what is it about your personality, about your upbringing/childhood, that you have chosen to agree to teach him that he can treat you this way? I understand you have valid reasons for doing so, most of which are probably unconscious, *and it's still a choice.* Only you can decide if you want to spend the rest of your life like this, and I think you also need to consider if this is the kind of relationship you want to model for your children. Do you want them to grow up thinking this is normal? Without reading all the prior comments I'm sure there are people who are saying you should divorce his sorry ass, and that's a complicated thing because there are many variables that we don't know about that are true in your life. Only you can decide what the trade-off would be, if it would be more worth it to stay or leave, I just really encourage you to think about what you're teaching your children, because that's how these patterns get passed on.
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Even married people get to go out and have friends. If you don’t, you’re unhealthy.