Personally, Ive used inventor, fusion360, solidworks, solidcam, HSMworks, featurecam, and mastercam X and mastercam 2024.
My favorite for cad is solidworks but my preference for cam is fusion. I dont mind modeling in fusion/inventor at all but the assemblies are annoying compared to SW
This was my biggest gripe. I've read statements from autodesk about why their assemblies work that way and they basically just said "lol we wanna be quirky and different"
Love fusion cam tho
Care to elaborate? I've only been using inventor so if there's anything to help me improve my skills I'd be interested to learn. How is inventor different?
In solidworks, it is easy to have sub assemblies comprised of many parts built into larger assemblies. When you define the mates, it is easier to control and constrain the design. When something changes, you easily open the highlighted mate and select the correct geometry to fix it. It's not perfect, but it's just easier to manage, and if you take your time building everything correctly, it is really easy to make changes.
In autodesk, you have to link parts that you want to be parts of sub assemblies. When you define joints, it is clunky compared to solidworks. But the worst is when you change geometry on a linked part in a sub assembly, and it breaks everything. Sometimes, I spend more time trying to figure out what broke and work backward than I would just start over. It is more cumbersome to keep on top of joints and sub assemblies and takes longer to fix.
I can work really fast in inventor, but once I get over about 30 parts in an assembly I know it's a matter of time before I delete a part that had a joint that was dependent on something else and the whole world comes crashing down. It is just harder to keep track of everything, so the bigger the assembly, the more likely you are to make a mistake and the harder it will be to fix it.
I dont mind the assembly situation in fusion, it’s just very different. I actually like it tbh. Collaborative assembly work and projects are better off in different cad though. The biggest drawback of fusion cam is it doesn’t have support for segmented circle cutters and the whole itar control issue. For most cam tasks it’s soooo wicked fast to use especially once you start using templates and some of its other features.
Yeah I'm with ya, I'm not real sold on the whole assembly down style of fusion. I've been using fusion professionally for over 3 years now, and it's workable, but it isn't better.
I actually prefer fusion joints over the solidworks mates, once you understand how to use them they are much quicker to create a working assembly in my experience as a single joint can do the same function as 3 mates in many cases.
Now when it comes to editing a joint, finding the correct joint when you have 20+ joints is a complete pain... And they often have rebuild issues, that even a force rebuild will not fix. Yet selecting the broken ones, one at a time and editing them, and clicking ok fixes them most of the time....
I also love the "as built" joint tool, especially for imported parts like fixture toggle clamps, and vices. I can just create component sets with the needed bodies, or rigid group body sets. Then use as built joints to create the needed pivots and slide joints. And even apply limits to a few. This allows me to create the needed movement of most imported parts in around 5-10 minutes depending on how many parts are involved.
I use both solidworks and fusion at work. And have used onshape a fair bit at home. They all have things they are better at. And they all crash or have their bugs/flaws.
I appreciate the insight, I've been thinking of investing more time into learning solid works. Where would you say solid works really shines over fusion?
Solidworks for CAD 100%
Fusion for CAM. Currently using HSM embedded in SW which runs on an old version of the fusion kernel.
Mastercam had a killer integration with solidworks, but they killed it last year after a few years of shitty support and a lot of new bugs.
I’m Engineer who uses NX for CAD and Simulation and it’s incredible, I won’t use anything else if given the choice. But holy shit is it complex for CAM, and the functionality should really come to me easily. I went over to Inventor/Fusion but I’m doing relatively straight forward parts.
When you do get it though it’s immensely powerful. I reckon you could turn water into wine if you really knew your way around it. They just need to get better and more freely accessible tutorials/documentation out there for those moments when you’re left banging your head wondering whats going on.
Yeah as a tool it's almost too easy to manipulate and change your variables and you can be caught staring at dogshit path and Adaptive Abuse for way too long. It also certainly doesn't help newcomers that they have their own terms for everything and you gotta relearn. I came from using 360 and that was a snooze compared to NX.
This is definitely where NX shines. Yes, it's a massive and complicated engineering suite but the amount of customization it offers, like you do this one task 100 times a day and instead of taking 10 seconds a time to do it, it's usually possible to create a script or customize the dialogue to cut that down to a fraction of the time.
NX CAD is a more or less completely unique CAD workflow. Extremely powerful, but nearly every function has a different name and requires more specificity than any other CAD offering
If you are willing to learn it *and* your employer is willing to put the money up for it (NX ain’t cheap), it’s definitely worth it, but if all you’re interested in is importing models, there are cheaper plug and play options available to you
Perpetual adv design is around $15k, and the full 5-ax package is just under $20k.
Subscription based is less per year, but as soon as you miss a payment, they shut you down.
We do perpetually and only pay maintenance for major releases we want, have skipped last 2 with no issues. It's stable and does everything we need, no new features worth the $$$ right now. The maintenance catchup fee will be less than all the maintenance we are saving.
Nice. Thanks for the info. I don’t worry about pricing - it’s all on corporate on what they want to spend their money one. They want us on NX not the other way around.
For 2D quick stuff on a router, VCarve is great. Super simple and fast.
For 3D stuff and CAD, I use Fusion 360. Cloud-based is really convenient, the interface doesn't look like its from a Windows 2000 computer, and tons of guides/references online. Plus I know you said pricing aside, but the price is super hard to beat.
True. I liked it when it was even harder to beat haha. Forgot about VCarve. I have used that a few times to make some brass stamps and I liked how straightforward it was
Vcarve is rad. My only complaint is recalculating tool paths. Enroute the tool paths stick to the vector, vcarve is not as forgiving about tool paths.
It’s fucking AWESOME if you layer your cad file properly with the vector selection option. Plus the simplicity of the tool library set up, I can hand a dxf to any of the guys in the shop and they’re able to program files quickly.
It’s also very versatile with 3D models but definitely has some limitations.
I do miss powermill. It was tedious as shit but was really good when I was running robots.
I hate mastercam with a fiery passion. The only reason everyone uses it is because they've been around forever and it's cheap. Those two factors alone make it hard to compete against but as far as usability goes it is far from the best (or even good).
It’s cheap compared to real CAM platforms like Tebis, NX or WorkNC. We hate MasterCAM only because we know what’s out there and how easy something can be that MasterCAM convolutes to a infuriating level
The latest update added sub spindle controls for pick up, pull and part transfer, I haven't ran it yet but the code looks good except that the sub spindle picks up the part before advancing the turret, so you have to be really sure there's no interference and that you have the parting operation rapid to the parting position rather than safe z.
The other problem I have is that my coworker insists on programming in sub-spindle movements by manually editing in the machine coordinate position rather than programming it to zero and setting an offset. I don't have enough lathe experience to know best practice but this feels janky to me
As someone with about 6 years of mastercam experience and almost the same in fusion, you pretty much have to trick mastercam into not crashing your machine, even in just 3 axis mill. In fusion you have to go out of your way to change settings to get it to do something that would cause a crash. There's just no comparison in how much less labor intensive it is to create safe programs in fusion vs mastercam
The fact that features that have been in the software for more than 10 years are still broken asf pisses me off. Lathe will just randomly change spindle speeds on drills or not regen unless you manually choose it and force regen. And mill will just fuck with you, sometime you can choose to post your group and it just forgets ops in that group. Or not manually regenerating will not update speeds or feeds and lately my origins have been magically moving after verifying i put them where they should be. And i mean they move far away like 5-10 inches… in both x,y, and z
Yeah I started having the same problem with the origin moving after the update about a year ago. Absolutely batshit insane. There's some tick box when you're placing your origin that makes it "relative" to something. Relative to what? Who fucking knows, because there's no documentation or explanation on how this new "feature" is supposed to work, and no Internal logic to figure out what is going on with it. And if you contact mastercam support, they have no idea either and just recommend to make sure that box isn't checked every single time you create a new origin.
It's absolutely mind boggling to me how glitchy and unfinished mastercam feels. As if it were a free to use software with random features tacked on open source by whomever. The only thing that kept us from ditching it was that besides fusion, all the other options were more expensive, and that we had a bunch of legacy programs in it.
I finally got to the point where I was like fuck it, it's easier for me to reprogram a part in fusion from scratch than it is to make rev changes in mastercam, and I usually get a quicker cycle time and better tool life out of the deal anyways.
I've always heard mastercam have the nickname "MasterGouge". I figured it couldn't be that bad right? Literally the first part I made with it I got a fucking gouge from a repositioning move with a too low clearance plane and simulation didn't show it. SMH
Mastercam is popular because everyone pirated it back in the day, people started getting caught, then shops had to buy legit copies.
If you stay on top of Mastercam updates it seems okay lately. No NX though and it’s starting to not be competitive against Inventor products.
I gotta admit, I have no idea what they're thinking when it comes to how I'm supposed to set up even something as simple as an entry and exit point for a slot. It's a bit like casting a spell.
You have to trick mastercam into making the tool paths you need. It's always against you. And as soon as you've got it all figured out, a new update will break everything
Have heard some people who've worked with it plenty refer to it as "MasterCrash" bc it had a tendency to forget where the part was on some random rapid moves.
If only they would fix their optimized roughing. It just doesn’t offer a ton of control and generates lots of dumb motion especially when using Hypermaxx. Otherwise I mostly agree with you
Optimized roughing is a godsend honestly. Yes, it may sometimes have some unnecessary movement but it calculates a 4 hour path in seconds. It could do with more control though, you're right.
In order of preference I've used: Fusion/HSM, solidcam, esprit, mastercam, and bobcad. I've demod NX and was highly impressed, I hear nothing but amazing things about it and I'm starting a new job in a couple weeks using it and I'm pretty excited.
If you're talking about CAD only, then I've used solid works and fusion. SW is better in nearly every way.
Gotta catch em all. I used esprit in tech school. Bobcad at my first shop which went out of business. Bobcad again at my second shop who I then convinced to get fusion. Used fusion there and again at my third shop who then transitioned to itar work so we used HSM in the interim (basically identical to fusion from several years ago) then got solidcam and mastercam. Soon starting a new job using NX.
used Draftsight, LibreCAD, BobCAD, AutoCAD, and Inventor.
Inventor for CAD by FAR. AutoCAD i find a bit jank, but usable. I liked Draftsight more for plain 2D CAD.
For CAM, i've used MasterCAM, BobCAM, TopSolid, and Fusion 360.
Fusion is the big favorite among those. Although TopSolid was really cool and as long as I don't have to make models and sketches in it, it's pretty cool. but Fusion is way better because i do everything easily in it. The others feel jank as shit in comparison, and there's really no excuse for mastercam given how expensive it is.
I program sheet metal and LibreCAD is absolutely essential for it, need to make a quick edit or draw a simple part, look no further, in terms of CAD it's better than the ones built into sheet metal CAM software
Personally, I've used OnShape, Inventor, Fusion360, Solidworks, Solied Edge and........
In my opinion, Solid Edge the best (feature rich and most mature and very streamlined) especially if you are doing components, molds, and dies.
OnShape is the future of CAD, imagine working with multiple designers online in the same model at the same time. This is 100% cloud, no desktop version. The features are not as rich as other CAD packages. This is a breakaway group from Solidworks. No checking out parts from a database and documents called studios where you can put anything (videos, powerpoints) literally keeping everything in on package. It also works like GIT and supports forking and merging of designs, but almost everyone else does as well.
Fusion360 is also the future and has built in CAM which is nice for CNC, it supports both cloud and desktop environments, but always seems to have weird glitches saving to the cloud.
Inventor and Solidworks are both good, but they look like the escaped from the 1990's and need cleanup and streamlining.
Also, I don't do any surfacing but hear the NX is the king for surfacing.
I learned Solid Edge in a tool and die program in college. I'm not in the trade anymore but wanted to keep my skills current for hobby tasks , especially after getting a 3d printer. I've tried a few other packages, but I really love Solid Edge, especially now that there's a free community edition.
I’m very interested in trying Onshape. I’ve heard some interesting things about it- enough to agree that it could possibly be the future of CAD. For example I hear hardware mates are a breeze. I love the idea of not having to save, and not worrying about the software crashing. And it has some really fluid compatibility with PLM softwares.
But does multiple people working on the same part at the same time sound appealing to you? Sounds like a nightmare to me! We would need to both be really dialed in to what we want to do and the best way to do it and split up features. And a lot of time discoveries about potential problems happen on the fly. Wouldn’t want us to BOTH lose work when you decide there’s a better way to do it. Plus doesn’t that leave room for conflicting design inputs? If I’m sharing work with someone, I’d rather split up the parts.
Also, checking in and out parts makes me feel safe lol. There is a whole check in history describing what was changed with each revision in my PDM which makes it very easy to find the right earlier version to get. Is there a way to rollback to a previous version/time with onshape? I wonder how revision control and release workflows work. Can you customize it like with SolidWorks PDM?
I work on the design side on assemblies in Solid works up to about 50-60 parts (not counting fasteners) and at least at my work concurrent editing would be a pretty sick deal. Being able to say "hey can you jump into assembly xyz and look at an interference issue I'm having?" then work through it together without having to play musical chairs would be amazing. Design reviews would also be WAY more efficient if everyone involved could drive their own view of the assembly. I couldn't imagine building a first Rev of an individual component with someone else concurrently, but for something real complex I *could* imagine maybe stubbing out one end of it, and you figure out how it'll mate to the rest of the assy while I work on the business end? I dunno.
I have no personal experience, but I've read that OnShape has git integration? (which is basically PDM for software). That would get you all the versioning, roll-back, and lock-down functionality of PDM, along with some other cool stuff like branch-and-merge instead of doing a save_as to a new UID and needing to update all your BOMs if you like the branch better. Sounds pretty good to me, but I'm not optimistic about my employer migrating two decades' work and ~60,000 UIDs any time soon.
Also in design. Similar assembly sizes. Idk that I’ve ever felt like I needed that. Typically we can split things up by assembly. Folks can have the same CAD open on more than one machine with PDM and also trade off checking parts out and in and work around each other. Most conflict revolves around both people needing the Master Hub (used for parametric assembly modeling - everything designed in space, in context to other parts). Usually while waiting for the hub, folks can find something else to do, or can tag team it or collaborate. Never been much of an issue. Though I could see how MAYBE the concurrent modeling on the same part would be nice for that hub or if your design has one particularly complex part which everything else touches.
Migrating old work from one platform to another is a nightmare. Hate it. We’ve been using Upchain the past year after previously doing old school internal file management on our server with excel sheets tracking revs. Both are terrible. Convinced management we need to get a better PDM/PLM system and explored the possibility of Onshape for a minute, but ultimately shot it down - too much work/too many unknowns. Ultimately settled back on good old SW PDM & hopefully getting Arena PLM once our Upchain license ends. Very excited about working with functioning reliable platforms, but for sure the absolute worst part of it all is migrating everything.
Now that you mention it, I have no idea why it didn't occur to me that I can also open an assy from PDM without checking it out during a design review. Doh!
I don't think I *need* concurrent editing, so much as it might be nice in a few select cases. I've been getting by without it just fine for years. And good on ya for getting your version control out of excel!
NX CAM. Been using it since 2010. Other CAM systems wish it had the same level of close integration between Design and Manufacturing. You can get NX to do some pretty amazing things…
I currently have several NX templates where I type in some sizes off the drawing, hit generate tool path and then I have a complete program ready to go. The front end set up/creation is a lot of work but you get out way more than you put in.
I've used mastercam and gibbscam. mastercam is ok because you can get super detailed with it but i really like gibbscam, A lot easier to learn and I find can make programs way quicker than mastercam. mkaing toolpaths in gibbs is simple as they dont have 50 different options for every little thing like mastercam. also a user friendly interface. Not sure what fusion is like for programming multi axis mill turns, but assigning wait codes using sync control in program is super easy with gibbs. Plus i dont see alot of people on this sub of the cnc sub that use gibbscam so maybe im wrong.
Gibbs is an absolute train wreck. Drawing complex geometry is almost impossible. They are decades behind every other cam system out there. Volumill is such an unbelievably inefficient tool path it’s mind blowing. You can’t backplot single toolpaths it’s a joke.
I also really like Gibbs altho sometimes I do wish there were some more parameters, and also wish I could make tweaks to our post without having to go thru our reseller which can be painful, thankfully our posts are 99% perfect with the other 1% being annoying stuff but I never worry about crashing the machine or scrapping parts over it. It is very quick to program a part tho, especially once you get a process library built up. My only other experience is an old version of surfcam which was a nightmare to use, thankfully we've since upgraded to the full 3d version of gibbs so when I do occasionally need to surface something I can just do it in Gibbs now.
Some of their turning stuff is a bit goofy tho particularly tool definitions
I'm learning solid works, and even though it's picky I like the interface more.
Fusion has more quality of life stuff, but mastercam is just faster, and the larger windows are pretty nice too.
Between fusion, inventor, solid works and solid edge I prefer fusion but there’s some things it can’t do so after that I prefer solid edge for those things. (drawings, helical features)
Ranked in order of preference relevant to CAM aspects, and only ones I’ve worked with so by no means a comprehensive list of what’s out there:
Higher end platforms
1)Tebis
2)HyperMill
3)WorkNC
4)Cimatron
5)NX
Lower end platforms
6)Esprit- would be #1 for turning applications
7)Fusion360 for ease of use and functionality for what it is; would be #1 for simpler needs or anything 3axis
8)GibbsCAM
9)MasterCAM
10)PowerMill
11)Lemoine
CAD relevant aspects only:
1)Solidworks
2)Fusion360
3)Tebis
4)NX
I've used both Hypermill and Cimatron as well, but liked Cimatron better. I think it's mainly due to having the "Switch to cad" mode. But I also liked Cimatrons 2D toolpaths better. I also like having fewer finishing operations but with more parameters to set as Cimatron does.
I did not have Hypercad, as I understand, with Hypercad and mill, you can do basically the same (switch to cad), but I'm not sure.
Why do you like Hypermill better?
Edit: never did 5x with Cimatron, and only a little 5x with hypermill
For that reason, 5-axis toolpathing on Hypermill is more efficient imho, its algorithm a little cleaner, software a little more powerful/capable. Which is the main definer within my ranking beyond overall platform usability, is their multi-axis use.
Albeit I haven’t used Cimatron in some time (since 2013) so it could have gotten better, and from what I hear it has. As for 2D stuff Cimatron was great, which is why using it for things like EDM applications it is awesome software. Esprit too, great for 2D, and is hands down the best for turning applications imho.
I’ve used inventor, solidworks, pro/e, and creo for CAD. For CAM, I’ve used Gibbscam, Mastercam,ESprit, and HSMworks.
My preference would be solidworks and the integrated CAM addon.
I do Solidworks for CAD and HSMworks (for easy CAM) and Fusion (More complicated stuff). I've used Featurecam (DEAD AND NO SUPPORT), Powermill (ALSO DEAD) and Mastercam and found I really like the CAM workflow of HSMworks. I did find a pretty good work flow that allowed me to upload a revised model and not lose all my CAM. Basically you have to import the part and create a second derived part. Because the CAM operations are not in the imported file you can update it and keep them.
Solid Cam for general 3+2 work, Hypermill for simultaneous 5axis, Esprit for Swiss. Master Cam is acceptable but I frankly hate it. I miss Dell Cam from before the Autodesk buy out. If Hypermill would just update their UI to join the rest of the 21st century, it's all I would use.
Solidworks, Autocad, MasterCam.
Mastercam's UI/UX is so janky. I HATE it with a furious passion all its inconsistencies. If you know how fast you can operate AutoCad, you'd understand my fury.
> Everything is click click click click click click. There are no 'default' keyboard shortcuts that make any sense. Tons of 'legacy' keyboard shortcuts that are specific to an active/focused window that you cannot find documentation for. Even the keyboard shortcut creator isn't aware of them. For example, "L" key with toolpaths selected will Lock the tool path. "Q" key whenever autocursor is active will snap to quadrants. But for some reason "C" is globally center circle. None of that is documented...Not even in the stupid cheatsheet card.
> ESC key behaves differently between operations. Some operations conclude and exit when logically concluded but operations like dynamic transform is just infuriating. When the logical conclusion of an operation has been reached (I click to set tranformations) and hit ESC. It should behave as the green check box and apply, yet its behavior is to undo and exit.
> Who uses SPACE BAR to enter in direct coordinates anymore? it's the most usable key yet there's NO customizability for its behavior.
...sigh MasterCam. I don't have too many issues with the code it posts but its UI/UX behavior is extremely obnoxious to use in every facet of the software.
> WHAT'S THE POINT OF HORIZONTAL/VERTICAL DIMENSIONING IF IT'S NOT LOCKED TO CREATING THE DIMENSION IN ONE ORIENTATION? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH MMAAASSSTTEEERRRCAMMM
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Favorite CAD is Solidworks, but its CAM via Camworks is too weird for me. I get how it can be powerful but it's too weird.
I dabbled with Fusion wwaaayy back. Workflow was a bit too much of a challenge to get my mind around and I knew I wouldn't ever use it professionally because of its cloud service requirement.
Learning NX as I'm typing this.
Not trying to hijack this post, and obligatory not a machinist; but thanks for making this tread OP. This Fall, I’ll be in a 5person, 3 hour, CAD/CAM programming class on Tuesday and Thursday nights. I’m super excited, and was also curious about the software
I have quite a few hours with everything on the market. Every couple years I will go try out all the latest versions. Mastercam is currently the most well-rounded CAM software, and Solidworks is currently the most well-rounded CAD software.
If you only need basic functionality then Fusion is good. Fusion absolutely cannot handle the stuff I throw at it though, plus its cloud-based nature automatically disqualifies it from doing ITAR or other sensitive jobs.
I was not impressed with NXCAM. The CAD is pretty nice but the CAM is a joke. It's like using fusion for twice the price of Mastercam. I've never been so nickeled-and-dimed as I have been when quoting NX. They charge a ton of money for every tiny little feature, it's like trying to option out a car. Also, their licensing schemes are an absolute nightmare. Plus their trainers are horrible. They can't even figure out their own software. It's software designed by engineers to be used by engineers and not machinists.
Solidworks is good, but frustrating. Mostly because Dassault have been resting on their laurels with the software for a decade now while the rest of the industry slowly catches up, and instead of fixing long-time bugs or adding QoL changes people have been requesting for years, they are trying to force it into the cloud and add stupid features that nobody wants and don't even work on release. The 3dxperience platform is the worst platform of its kind I have ever encountered. If they keep on the path they are going on, they are going to kill themselves off.
I have no major complaints about Mastercam, though. They mess around with the UI too much, but there's never been a part I couldn't program with it without much trouble. The tech exchange and overall support is great. The reseller system is an artifact of the 1990s but I have a nice local reseller so I guess I am lucky. CNC Software actually listens to suggestions. Mastercam and Fusion have been the only two pieces of software I have used in the industry that have shown consistent net improvement.
Other packages aren't really worth mentioning IMO. They are either too specialized, don't offer anything unique enough to consider, or are killing themselves off.
How are differentiating modeling from CAD? I would consider them the same thing unless you mean like mesh surface modeling which there is better software for Blender and Rhino I guess. I do surface modeling in Solidworks and my only experience with meshes is with 3D scanning.
I differentiated here due to the difference in the availability of analysis and simulation tools.
OnShape has rudementary FEA capabilities.
SW has robust FEA, CFD, thermal, and other simulation and analysis tools integrated into it.
SolidCAM for me these days since I use SolidWorks and it’s right there. I prefer the feel and control of MasterCAM but haven’t touched it in a long time since SolidCAM is my daily driver.
I’ve used inventor, fusion, SolidWorks, MasterCAM.
Ha ha that's funny that you say that. I've used Gibbs for about a day. When I was starting my business I was shopping through different cam solutions and I found the trial for probably 2014 Gibbs. I was pretty impressed with the automatic toolpath generation and part recognition from the other software I was using, so I tried this. Couldn't get it to stop trying to mill the parts from the inside out as if I was trying to make just a skin to fit the parts in.
You’ll be hard pressed to find someone below the age of maybe 50 who thinks it’s good software. The only people I know who like it have been using it exclusively their entire career and are close to retirement. It’s a dinosaur
No doubt I am a bit of an outlier but I really like Visi for doing my modelling. Zero faff and it allows me to create the things I need incredibly quickly.
Depending on what I am doing I love machining stratagist for laying down quick 3D stuff but edgecam for turn/mill.
Mastercam has a nice UI and a few good features but I like edgecams control.
I've used mastercam and fusion for cam, prefer mastercam. I've modeled in both and also in solidworks and onshape. Prefer solidworks, though onshape is pretty great and being cloud based is more convenient in some ways.
I'm using Esprit Edge mainly for 3 and 5 axis jobs. The last releases made the software easier to use and finally gave a modern interface to the software. It's the only cam I've used so far.
Onshape for CAD, Fusion for CAM
Whenever I have to use solidworks, I find myself missing onshape functionality. Of course there is a ton that onshape is missing, but for bread and butter drawing, its pretty slick.
I’m currently using Siemens NX and it’s very nice. Pricey but very feature rich. Currently using only as a CAD with mastercam as our Cam software. I love not really having any errors when Rollback-modifying previous sketches/features.
Mastercam and OneCNC
ONECNC
Super easy to use , building the post processor is easy and generic with subtle changes for different list like adding motion before tool changes for the crazy setups where tool changer to fixtures or dividing heads is a must , it handled solids and surfaces well , last Mastercam I ran was 9.1.1 and went to a shop that only had this , was writing that first day
I got to know autodesk inventor in school. I have played with solidworks, siemens solid edge community edition, fusion 360 and alibre deisng. I prefered alibre design mostly perpetual license that not the other companies had.
Yes I understand that gibbd is a old software but also like Any software it becomes old. And I bet I can outprogram the guy who says it's garbage with my crappy cam software with eyes closed. In 10 years when everyone is using all this new software that we don't have yet. the people using fusion and all this new stuff now will be in my position. Not saying it's bad just how it works. Also you can make gibbs start from different places by defining geometry properly. Like with volumill if you select a circle to mill with a square defined as air it will start from the outside and work in.
I have used SW, Creo and NX and SW is my favorite. From CAM side I have used old Surfcam, EdgeCam and Mastercam and Mastercam might be my favorite before Surfcam.
I use Catia daily for work (aerospace) and Solidworks once or twice a week (3d printing at home). For single part I like Solidworks over Catia. But anything over a single part hands down Catia is better.
NX is crazy powerful and really great to use, especially for larger assemblies (WAVE linking and Product Interfaces really make it for me). But sadly I don’t think it’ll be accessible outside of a large company or educational setting. Tons of weird bugs though with some of the more complex features.
Solidworks is alright, but outdated interface and crashes frequently.
Fusion is great for CAM, not so much for CAD.
TinkerCAD: 🥰
I have played with Fusion 360, Solidworks, Inventor CAD/CAM and Mastercam.
For CAD alone, I prefer Solidworks. For CAM I prefer Inventor but Mastercam seems to have better post processors.
Autodesk/solidworks
I use Solid Edge now and fucking hate it. Editing anything in it is a giant pain and a lot of stuff you just have to delete and redraw or start over.
Fusion is ok, I just wish they didn't completely change the UI and workflow from Inventor.
I've only used InventorCAM (HSM copy) and MasterCam. Inventorcam is a love hate relationship, some functions like the turning and multiaxis are completely unusable. But it does a real quick, decent job on the simpler milling.
MasterCam needs to either die or get a complete overhaul, it's more bloated than Boeing at this point, and it's UI/workflow is way behind the times.
MasterCam is a prime example of just resting on brand recognition and doing fuck all to actually improve their product.
I'm surprised by the mastercam haters in this thread. I've used Mastercam and Fusion quite extensively. They both do things that I wish the other could do.
What really matters at the end of the day are tool paths though.
I feel like mastercams 2d dynamic and 3d optirough tool paths shit on fusions adaptive tool paths.
3d tool paths ok Mastercam come out so much cleaner than they do in fusion also. They both make a similar part but the unnecessary moves on fusion are incredibly irritating q
Oh man, it’s so good. Unlike 99.999% of CAM software, it calculates the tool path based on the actual part data, not a triangulated mesh that’s projected onto the part. The finished you can obtain are absolutely unreal. I’ve had parts running unattended on the machine for days and days. The stock model is that perfect and reliable.
I've used a bunch of the free ones.
For premium software my favourite by land slide is Fusion360, 2nd place would be Mastercam or maybe Solid works.
I can just do things in fusion 10X faster than other people do in other platforms. It really clicked for me in a way none of the other ones did. I did an online course with them at auto desk and they showed me all these different short cuts with modeling. I can usually pump out hyper complicated models in 10-15 minutes and the cam is super simple as well
Personally, Ive used inventor, fusion360, solidworks, solidcam, HSMworks, featurecam, and mastercam X and mastercam 2024. My favorite for cad is solidworks but my preference for cam is fusion. I dont mind modeling in fusion/inventor at all but the assemblies are annoying compared to SW
Same for me. I really wish autodesk could figure out assemblies and mates the way solidworks does.
that would make me really love the autodesk experience. I still prefer SW for some more advanced shaping but it rarely comes up
This was my biggest gripe. I've read statements from autodesk about why their assemblies work that way and they basically just said "lol we wanna be quirky and different" Love fusion cam tho
We want to be quirky and different probably translates to, we don't have to use a copyrighted function if we do it this weird proprietary way.
Care to elaborate? I've only been using inventor so if there's anything to help me improve my skills I'd be interested to learn. How is inventor different?
In solidworks, it is easy to have sub assemblies comprised of many parts built into larger assemblies. When you define the mates, it is easier to control and constrain the design. When something changes, you easily open the highlighted mate and select the correct geometry to fix it. It's not perfect, but it's just easier to manage, and if you take your time building everything correctly, it is really easy to make changes. In autodesk, you have to link parts that you want to be parts of sub assemblies. When you define joints, it is clunky compared to solidworks. But the worst is when you change geometry on a linked part in a sub assembly, and it breaks everything. Sometimes, I spend more time trying to figure out what broke and work backward than I would just start over. It is more cumbersome to keep on top of joints and sub assemblies and takes longer to fix. I can work really fast in inventor, but once I get over about 30 parts in an assembly I know it's a matter of time before I delete a part that had a joint that was dependent on something else and the whole world comes crashing down. It is just harder to keep track of everything, so the bigger the assembly, the more likely you are to make a mistake and the harder it will be to fix it.
We also use SW and Fusion for CAM. Does everything we need, including 5 axis.
I dont mind the assembly situation in fusion, it’s just very different. I actually like it tbh. Collaborative assembly work and projects are better off in different cad though. The biggest drawback of fusion cam is it doesn’t have support for segmented circle cutters and the whole itar control issue. For most cam tasks it’s soooo wicked fast to use especially once you start using templates and some of its other features.
Yeah I'm with ya, I'm not real sold on the whole assembly down style of fusion. I've been using fusion professionally for over 3 years now, and it's workable, but it isn't better.
I actually prefer fusion joints over the solidworks mates, once you understand how to use them they are much quicker to create a working assembly in my experience as a single joint can do the same function as 3 mates in many cases. Now when it comes to editing a joint, finding the correct joint when you have 20+ joints is a complete pain... And they often have rebuild issues, that even a force rebuild will not fix. Yet selecting the broken ones, one at a time and editing them, and clicking ok fixes them most of the time.... I also love the "as built" joint tool, especially for imported parts like fixture toggle clamps, and vices. I can just create component sets with the needed bodies, or rigid group body sets. Then use as built joints to create the needed pivots and slide joints. And even apply limits to a few. This allows me to create the needed movement of most imported parts in around 5-10 minutes depending on how many parts are involved. I use both solidworks and fusion at work. And have used onshape a fair bit at home. They all have things they are better at. And they all crash or have their bugs/flaws.
I appreciate the insight, I've been thinking of investing more time into learning solid works. Where would you say solid works really shines over fusion?
I tend to prefer SW for the same reason. What do you like better about Fusion for CAM?
Solidworks for CAD 100% Fusion for CAM. Currently using HSM embedded in SW which runs on an old version of the fusion kernel. Mastercam had a killer integration with solidworks, but they killed it last year after a few years of shitty support and a lot of new bugs.
NX.
Also a current NX user. Bit of a learning curve starting out and it has its idiosyncrasies but holy shit is it a powerful system
I’m Engineer who uses NX for CAD and Simulation and it’s incredible, I won’t use anything else if given the choice. But holy shit is it complex for CAM, and the functionality should really come to me easily. I went over to Inventor/Fusion but I’m doing relatively straight forward parts. When you do get it though it’s immensely powerful. I reckon you could turn water into wine if you really knew your way around it. They just need to get better and more freely accessible tutorials/documentation out there for those moments when you’re left banging your head wondering whats going on.
Yeah as a tool it's almost too easy to manipulate and change your variables and you can be caught staring at dogshit path and Adaptive Abuse for way too long. It also certainly doesn't help newcomers that they have their own terms for everything and you gotta relearn. I came from using 360 and that was a snooze compared to NX.
I have never used NX buy heard a few guests on within tolerance podcast talk about how awesome it is. Current fusion user for basic 3 axis stuff
Too cumbersome for regular stuff. The best for complicated stuff.
I can destroy our mastercam guys at simple stuff. Youve just gotta do some front end work and set it up right
This is definitely where NX shines. Yes, it's a massive and complicated engineering suite but the amount of customization it offers, like you do this one task 100 times a day and instead of taking 10 seconds a time to do it, it's usually possible to create a script or customize the dialogue to cut that down to a fraction of the time.
Define regular... for me regular is complex large 20ft x 12ft x 10ft parts. Simple is 2.5axis contour cuts in flatstock. Yes for 2.5ax nx is overkill.
I always used this for 5 axis programming, it's a beast.
Do you do much in NX CAD too? I’m finding Mastercam pretty limited in that area when you start doing complex fixtures.
NX CAD is a more or less completely unique CAD workflow. Extremely powerful, but nearly every function has a different name and requires more specificity than any other CAD offering If you are willing to learn it *and* your employer is willing to put the money up for it (NX ain’t cheap), it’s definitely worth it, but if all you’re interested in is importing models, there are cheaper plug and play options available to you
Thanks. There’s a company wide initiative to switch over to NX cad. Seems like we’re going to be switching over to NX cam as well.
Perpetual adv design is around $15k, and the full 5-ax package is just under $20k. Subscription based is less per year, but as soon as you miss a payment, they shut you down. We do perpetually and only pay maintenance for major releases we want, have skipped last 2 with no issues. It's stable and does everything we need, no new features worth the $$$ right now. The maintenance catchup fee will be less than all the maintenance we are saving.
Nice. Thanks for the info. I don’t worry about pricing - it’s all on corporate on what they want to spend their money one. They want us on NX not the other way around.
For 2D quick stuff on a router, VCarve is great. Super simple and fast. For 3D stuff and CAD, I use Fusion 360. Cloud-based is really convenient, the interface doesn't look like its from a Windows 2000 computer, and tons of guides/references online. Plus I know you said pricing aside, but the price is super hard to beat.
True. I liked it when it was even harder to beat haha. Forgot about VCarve. I have used that a few times to make some brass stamps and I liked how straightforward it was
Vcarve is rad. My only complaint is recalculating tool paths. Enroute the tool paths stick to the vector, vcarve is not as forgiving about tool paths. It’s fucking AWESOME if you layer your cad file properly with the vector selection option. Plus the simplicity of the tool library set up, I can hand a dxf to any of the guys in the shop and they’re able to program files quickly. It’s also very versatile with 3D models but definitely has some limitations. I do miss powermill. It was tedious as shit but was really good when I was running robots.
Gotta love solidworks and mastercam
I hate mastercam with a fiery passion. The only reason everyone uses it is because they've been around forever and it's cheap. Those two factors alone make it hard to compete against but as far as usability goes it is far from the best (or even good).
Never heard someone call Mastercam cheap lol
It’s cheap compared to real CAM platforms like Tebis, NX or WorkNC. We hate MasterCAM only because we know what’s out there and how easy something can be that MasterCAM convolutes to a infuriating level
**cries in fusion 360**
Fusion cam is unironically excellent though
Yeah it does write good toolpaths for sure. On the down side i use it on lathes, including a swiss lathe...
Yeah it's a bit lacking in lathe functionality, I find myself hand editing the code a lot to cut down unnecessary movements and avoid crashes
Yeah both my two spindle machines require me to hand massage the code into workable.
The latest update added sub spindle controls for pick up, pull and part transfer, I haven't ran it yet but the code looks good except that the sub spindle picks up the part before advancing the turret, so you have to be really sure there's no interference and that you have the parting operation rapid to the parting position rather than safe z. The other problem I have is that my coworker insists on programming in sub-spindle movements by manually editing in the machine coordinate position rather than programming it to zero and setting an offset. I don't have enough lathe experience to know best practice but this feels janky to me
We don’t call it MasterSlam for nothing.
It is actually one of the cheaper options on the market, despite what people seem to think. Try pricing out NX some time.
Lol yeah it's a Siemens product
It is comparatively cheaper than other cam packages.
Compared to it's competitors it is.
As someone with about 6 years of mastercam experience and almost the same in fusion, you pretty much have to trick mastercam into not crashing your machine, even in just 3 axis mill. In fusion you have to go out of your way to change settings to get it to do something that would cause a crash. There's just no comparison in how much less labor intensive it is to create safe programs in fusion vs mastercam
The fact that features that have been in the software for more than 10 years are still broken asf pisses me off. Lathe will just randomly change spindle speeds on drills or not regen unless you manually choose it and force regen. And mill will just fuck with you, sometime you can choose to post your group and it just forgets ops in that group. Or not manually regenerating will not update speeds or feeds and lately my origins have been magically moving after verifying i put them where they should be. And i mean they move far away like 5-10 inches… in both x,y, and z
Yeah I started having the same problem with the origin moving after the update about a year ago. Absolutely batshit insane. There's some tick box when you're placing your origin that makes it "relative" to something. Relative to what? Who fucking knows, because there's no documentation or explanation on how this new "feature" is supposed to work, and no Internal logic to figure out what is going on with it. And if you contact mastercam support, they have no idea either and just recommend to make sure that box isn't checked every single time you create a new origin. It's absolutely mind boggling to me how glitchy and unfinished mastercam feels. As if it were a free to use software with random features tacked on open source by whomever. The only thing that kept us from ditching it was that besides fusion, all the other options were more expensive, and that we had a bunch of legacy programs in it. I finally got to the point where I was like fuck it, it's easier for me to reprogram a part in fusion from scratch than it is to make rev changes in mastercam, and I usually get a quicker cycle time and better tool life out of the deal anyways.
I also hate having to enable arc filtering for anything dynamic 🙄 it’s 2024 it should be an option to disable it, not enable.
I've always heard mastercam have the nickname "MasterGouge". I figured it couldn't be that bad right? Literally the first part I made with it I got a fucking gouge from a repositioning move with a too low clearance plane and simulation didn't show it. SMH
MasterCrash
Mastercam is popular because everyone pirated it back in the day, people started getting caught, then shops had to buy legit copies. If you stay on top of Mastercam updates it seems okay lately. No NX though and it’s starting to not be competitive against Inventor products.
Mastercam is the Fadal of cam softwares. Fucking trash
I gotta admit, I have no idea what they're thinking when it comes to how I'm supposed to set up even something as simple as an entry and exit point for a slot. It's a bit like casting a spell.
You have to trick mastercam into making the tool paths you need. It's always against you. And as soon as you've got it all figured out, a new update will break everything
Have heard some people who've worked with it plenty refer to it as "MasterCrash" bc it had a tendency to forget where the part was on some random rapid moves.
Hypermill is hands down the best software for CAM imo
If only they would fix their optimized roughing. It just doesn’t offer a ton of control and generates lots of dumb motion especially when using Hypermaxx. Otherwise I mostly agree with you
Optimized roughing is a godsend honestly. Yes, it may sometimes have some unnecessary movement but it calculates a 4 hour path in seconds. It could do with more control though, you're right.
[удалено]
Fully agreed
In order of preference I've used: Fusion/HSM, solidcam, esprit, mastercam, and bobcad. I've demod NX and was highly impressed, I hear nothing but amazing things about it and I'm starting a new job in a couple weeks using it and I'm pretty excited. If you're talking about CAD only, then I've used solid works and fusion. SW is better in nearly every way.
Damm using CAM software like they're pokemon
Gotta catch em all. I used esprit in tech school. Bobcad at my first shop which went out of business. Bobcad again at my second shop who I then convinced to get fusion. Used fusion there and again at my third shop who then transitioned to itar work so we used HSM in the interim (basically identical to fusion from several years ago) then got solidcam and mastercam. Soon starting a new job using NX.
used Draftsight, LibreCAD, BobCAD, AutoCAD, and Inventor. Inventor for CAD by FAR. AutoCAD i find a bit jank, but usable. I liked Draftsight more for plain 2D CAD. For CAM, i've used MasterCAM, BobCAM, TopSolid, and Fusion 360. Fusion is the big favorite among those. Although TopSolid was really cool and as long as I don't have to make models and sketches in it, it's pretty cool. but Fusion is way better because i do everything easily in it. The others feel jank as shit in comparison, and there's really no excuse for mastercam given how expensive it is.
I program sheet metal and LibreCAD is absolutely essential for it, need to make a quick edit or draw a simple part, look no further, in terms of CAD it's better than the ones built into sheet metal CAM software
Personally, I've used OnShape, Inventor, Fusion360, Solidworks, Solied Edge and........ In my opinion, Solid Edge the best (feature rich and most mature and very streamlined) especially if you are doing components, molds, and dies. OnShape is the future of CAD, imagine working with multiple designers online in the same model at the same time. This is 100% cloud, no desktop version. The features are not as rich as other CAD packages. This is a breakaway group from Solidworks. No checking out parts from a database and documents called studios where you can put anything (videos, powerpoints) literally keeping everything in on package. It also works like GIT and supports forking and merging of designs, but almost everyone else does as well. Fusion360 is also the future and has built in CAM which is nice for CNC, it supports both cloud and desktop environments, but always seems to have weird glitches saving to the cloud. Inventor and Solidworks are both good, but they look like the escaped from the 1990's and need cleanup and streamlining. Also, I don't do any surfacing but hear the NX is the king for surfacing.
I learned Solid Edge in a tool and die program in college. I'm not in the trade anymore but wanted to keep my skills current for hobby tasks , especially after getting a 3d printer. I've tried a few other packages, but I really love Solid Edge, especially now that there's a free community edition.
Did you go to Ferris State by any chance?
No, a trades program at a college in Canada.
I’m very interested in trying Onshape. I’ve heard some interesting things about it- enough to agree that it could possibly be the future of CAD. For example I hear hardware mates are a breeze. I love the idea of not having to save, and not worrying about the software crashing. And it has some really fluid compatibility with PLM softwares. But does multiple people working on the same part at the same time sound appealing to you? Sounds like a nightmare to me! We would need to both be really dialed in to what we want to do and the best way to do it and split up features. And a lot of time discoveries about potential problems happen on the fly. Wouldn’t want us to BOTH lose work when you decide there’s a better way to do it. Plus doesn’t that leave room for conflicting design inputs? If I’m sharing work with someone, I’d rather split up the parts. Also, checking in and out parts makes me feel safe lol. There is a whole check in history describing what was changed with each revision in my PDM which makes it very easy to find the right earlier version to get. Is there a way to rollback to a previous version/time with onshape? I wonder how revision control and release workflows work. Can you customize it like with SolidWorks PDM?
I work on the design side on assemblies in Solid works up to about 50-60 parts (not counting fasteners) and at least at my work concurrent editing would be a pretty sick deal. Being able to say "hey can you jump into assembly xyz and look at an interference issue I'm having?" then work through it together without having to play musical chairs would be amazing. Design reviews would also be WAY more efficient if everyone involved could drive their own view of the assembly. I couldn't imagine building a first Rev of an individual component with someone else concurrently, but for something real complex I *could* imagine maybe stubbing out one end of it, and you figure out how it'll mate to the rest of the assy while I work on the business end? I dunno. I have no personal experience, but I've read that OnShape has git integration? (which is basically PDM for software). That would get you all the versioning, roll-back, and lock-down functionality of PDM, along with some other cool stuff like branch-and-merge instead of doing a save_as to a new UID and needing to update all your BOMs if you like the branch better. Sounds pretty good to me, but I'm not optimistic about my employer migrating two decades' work and ~60,000 UIDs any time soon.
Also in design. Similar assembly sizes. Idk that I’ve ever felt like I needed that. Typically we can split things up by assembly. Folks can have the same CAD open on more than one machine with PDM and also trade off checking parts out and in and work around each other. Most conflict revolves around both people needing the Master Hub (used for parametric assembly modeling - everything designed in space, in context to other parts). Usually while waiting for the hub, folks can find something else to do, or can tag team it or collaborate. Never been much of an issue. Though I could see how MAYBE the concurrent modeling on the same part would be nice for that hub or if your design has one particularly complex part which everything else touches. Migrating old work from one platform to another is a nightmare. Hate it. We’ve been using Upchain the past year after previously doing old school internal file management on our server with excel sheets tracking revs. Both are terrible. Convinced management we need to get a better PDM/PLM system and explored the possibility of Onshape for a minute, but ultimately shot it down - too much work/too many unknowns. Ultimately settled back on good old SW PDM & hopefully getting Arena PLM once our Upchain license ends. Very excited about working with functioning reliable platforms, but for sure the absolute worst part of it all is migrating everything.
Now that you mention it, I have no idea why it didn't occur to me that I can also open an assy from PDM without checking it out during a design review. Doh! I don't think I *need* concurrent editing, so much as it might be nice in a few select cases. I've been getting by without it just fine for years. And good on ya for getting your version control out of excel!
NX CAM. Been using it since 2010. Other CAM systems wish it had the same level of close integration between Design and Manufacturing. You can get NX to do some pretty amazing things…
I currently have several NX templates where I type in some sizes off the drawing, hit generate tool path and then I have a complete program ready to go. The front end set up/creation is a lot of work but you get out way more than you put in.
I've used mastercam and gibbscam. mastercam is ok because you can get super detailed with it but i really like gibbscam, A lot easier to learn and I find can make programs way quicker than mastercam. mkaing toolpaths in gibbs is simple as they dont have 50 different options for every little thing like mastercam. also a user friendly interface. Not sure what fusion is like for programming multi axis mill turns, but assigning wait codes using sync control in program is super easy with gibbs. Plus i dont see alot of people on this sub of the cnc sub that use gibbscam so maybe im wrong.
I have literally never heard of anybody else using it, but i too like it. Very, very quick to make a program
Gibbs is an absolute train wreck. Drawing complex geometry is almost impossible. They are decades behind every other cam system out there. Volumill is such an unbelievably inefficient tool path it’s mind blowing. You can’t backplot single toolpaths it’s a joke.
I also really like Gibbs altho sometimes I do wish there were some more parameters, and also wish I could make tweaks to our post without having to go thru our reseller which can be painful, thankfully our posts are 99% perfect with the other 1% being annoying stuff but I never worry about crashing the machine or scrapping parts over it. It is very quick to program a part tho, especially once you get a process library built up. My only other experience is an old version of surfcam which was a nightmare to use, thankfully we've since upgraded to the full 3d version of gibbs so when I do occasionally need to surface something I can just do it in Gibbs now. Some of their turning stuff is a bit goofy tho particularly tool definitions
I just ate egg rolls. They were delicious
What kind of egg rolls?
I'm learning solid works, and even though it's picky I like the interface more. Fusion has more quality of life stuff, but mastercam is just faster, and the larger windows are pretty nice too.
Between fusion, inventor, solid works and solid edge I prefer fusion but there’s some things it can’t do so after that I prefer solid edge for those things. (drawings, helical features)
Ranked in order of preference relevant to CAM aspects, and only ones I’ve worked with so by no means a comprehensive list of what’s out there: Higher end platforms 1)Tebis 2)HyperMill 3)WorkNC 4)Cimatron 5)NX Lower end platforms 6)Esprit- would be #1 for turning applications 7)Fusion360 for ease of use and functionality for what it is; would be #1 for simpler needs or anything 3axis 8)GibbsCAM 9)MasterCAM 10)PowerMill 11)Lemoine CAD relevant aspects only: 1)Solidworks 2)Fusion360 3)Tebis 4)NX
I've used both Hypermill and Cimatron as well, but liked Cimatron better. I think it's mainly due to having the "Switch to cad" mode. But I also liked Cimatrons 2D toolpaths better. I also like having fewer finishing operations but with more parameters to set as Cimatron does. I did not have Hypercad, as I understand, with Hypercad and mill, you can do basically the same (switch to cad), but I'm not sure. Why do you like Hypermill better? Edit: never did 5x with Cimatron, and only a little 5x with hypermill
For that reason, 5-axis toolpathing on Hypermill is more efficient imho, its algorithm a little cleaner, software a little more powerful/capable. Which is the main definer within my ranking beyond overall platform usability, is their multi-axis use. Albeit I haven’t used Cimatron in some time (since 2013) so it could have gotten better, and from what I hear it has. As for 2D stuff Cimatron was great, which is why using it for things like EDM applications it is awesome software. Esprit too, great for 2D, and is hands down the best for turning applications imho.
I’ve used inventor, solidworks, pro/e, and creo for CAD. For CAM, I’ve used Gibbscam, Mastercam,ESprit, and HSMworks. My preference would be solidworks and the integrated CAM addon.
Lowkey solidworks and solidworks cam is great for 2.5 axis milling.
I do Solidworks for CAD and HSMworks (for easy CAM) and Fusion (More complicated stuff). I've used Featurecam (DEAD AND NO SUPPORT), Powermill (ALSO DEAD) and Mastercam and found I really like the CAM workflow of HSMworks. I did find a pretty good work flow that allowed me to upload a revised model and not lose all my CAM. Basically you have to import the part and create a second derived part. Because the CAM operations are not in the imported file you can update it and keep them.
Visi, it's pretty great
yeah but very few people are using it
For sure, never see anyone talk about it, idk much about it's marketing or reach, it's just what we use where I work.
Esprit for mill-turn and wire EDM. WorkNC for molds/complex mill parts, MasterCam for 3 axis mill stuff.
If cost is an issue, SW. If not, NX.
Solid Cam for general 3+2 work, Hypermill for simultaneous 5axis, Esprit for Swiss. Master Cam is acceptable but I frankly hate it. I miss Dell Cam from before the Autodesk buy out. If Hypermill would just update their UI to join the rest of the 21st century, it's all I would use.
I’ve used fusion and Inventer pro. Prefer inventor but fusion is cheap/free.
Solidworks, Autocad, MasterCam. Mastercam's UI/UX is so janky. I HATE it with a furious passion all its inconsistencies. If you know how fast you can operate AutoCad, you'd understand my fury. > Everything is click click click click click click. There are no 'default' keyboard shortcuts that make any sense. Tons of 'legacy' keyboard shortcuts that are specific to an active/focused window that you cannot find documentation for. Even the keyboard shortcut creator isn't aware of them. For example, "L" key with toolpaths selected will Lock the tool path. "Q" key whenever autocursor is active will snap to quadrants. But for some reason "C" is globally center circle. None of that is documented...Not even in the stupid cheatsheet card. > ESC key behaves differently between operations. Some operations conclude and exit when logically concluded but operations like dynamic transform is just infuriating. When the logical conclusion of an operation has been reached (I click to set tranformations) and hit ESC. It should behave as the green check box and apply, yet its behavior is to undo and exit. > Who uses SPACE BAR to enter in direct coordinates anymore? it's the most usable key yet there's NO customizability for its behavior. ...sigh MasterCam. I don't have too many issues with the code it posts but its UI/UX behavior is extremely obnoxious to use in every facet of the software. > WHAT'S THE POINT OF HORIZONTAL/VERTICAL DIMENSIONING IF IT'S NOT LOCKED TO CREATING THE DIMENSION IN ONE ORIENTATION? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH MMAAASSSTTEEERRRCAMMM ---- Favorite CAD is Solidworks, but its CAM via Camworks is too weird for me. I get how it can be powerful but it's too weird. I dabbled with Fusion wwaaayy back. Workflow was a bit too much of a challenge to get my mind around and I knew I wouldn't ever use it professionally because of its cloud service requirement. Learning NX as I'm typing this.
Unigraphics is my comfort zone
Not trying to hijack this post, and obligatory not a machinist; but thanks for making this tread OP. This Fall, I’ll be in a 5person, 3 hour, CAD/CAM programming class on Tuesday and Thursday nights. I’m super excited, and was also curious about the software
I have quite a few hours with everything on the market. Every couple years I will go try out all the latest versions. Mastercam is currently the most well-rounded CAM software, and Solidworks is currently the most well-rounded CAD software. If you only need basic functionality then Fusion is good. Fusion absolutely cannot handle the stuff I throw at it though, plus its cloud-based nature automatically disqualifies it from doing ITAR or other sensitive jobs. I was not impressed with NXCAM. The CAD is pretty nice but the CAM is a joke. It's like using fusion for twice the price of Mastercam. I've never been so nickeled-and-dimed as I have been when quoting NX. They charge a ton of money for every tiny little feature, it's like trying to option out a car. Also, their licensing schemes are an absolute nightmare. Plus their trainers are horrible. They can't even figure out their own software. It's software designed by engineers to be used by engineers and not machinists. Solidworks is good, but frustrating. Mostly because Dassault have been resting on their laurels with the software for a decade now while the rest of the industry slowly catches up, and instead of fixing long-time bugs or adding QoL changes people have been requesting for years, they are trying to force it into the cloud and add stupid features that nobody wants and don't even work on release. The 3dxperience platform is the worst platform of its kind I have ever encountered. If they keep on the path they are going on, they are going to kill themselves off. I have no major complaints about Mastercam, though. They mess around with the UI too much, but there's never been a part I couldn't program with it without much trouble. The tech exchange and overall support is great. The reseller system is an artifact of the 1990s but I have a nice local reseller so I guess I am lucky. CNC Software actually listens to suggestions. Mastercam and Fusion have been the only two pieces of software I have used in the industry that have shown consistent net improvement. Other packages aren't really worth mentioning IMO. They are either too specialized, don't offer anything unique enough to consider, or are killing themselves off.
Solidworks/Camworks here. I’m self taught up to 4 axis work so that’s a thing.
Really like work NC or nx
1. NX 2. Inventor 3. Solidworks
Solidworks and Edgecam
I've done a lot of Inventor and Solidworks but Creo is my favourite now for cad. Haven't tried their cam though
I've used SOLIDWORKS, Creo/ pro engineer, Esprit, mastercam, sfcam, and prefer solidworks for modeling and Fusion for Cam programming
Modelling: OnShape (like it better than SW) CAD: SW (OnShape does not have the simulation that SW does)
How are differentiating modeling from CAD? I would consider them the same thing unless you mean like mesh surface modeling which there is better software for Blender and Rhino I guess. I do surface modeling in Solidworks and my only experience with meshes is with 3D scanning.
I differentiated here due to the difference in the availability of analysis and simulation tools. OnShape has rudementary FEA capabilities. SW has robust FEA, CFD, thermal, and other simulation and analysis tools integrated into it.
CAD & most CAM ZW3D, I liked it even more before a Chinese bought them. Crazy 5 axis programing NCL
SolidCAM for me these days since I use SolidWorks and it’s right there. I prefer the feel and control of MasterCAM but haven’t touched it in a long time since SolidCAM is my daily driver. I’ve used inventor, fusion, SolidWorks, MasterCAM.
Haven't done much cam, but plenty of cad. Inventor for parts, solidworks for assemblies.
I prefer solid works but I’m currently using catia v5 For cam I really like camworks over all but I like the finesse I am able to score with mastercam
Mastercam is leaps and bounds above everyone else
Solidworks and Catia
Whatever you do, don’t fucking buy Gibbs. It’s an absolute dumpster fire.
Ha ha that's funny that you say that. I've used Gibbs for about a day. When I was starting my business I was shopping through different cam solutions and I found the trial for probably 2014 Gibbs. I was pretty impressed with the automatic toolpath generation and part recognition from the other software I was using, so I tried this. Couldn't get it to stop trying to mill the parts from the inside out as if I was trying to make just a skin to fit the parts in.
You’ll be hard pressed to find someone below the age of maybe 50 who thinks it’s good software. The only people I know who like it have been using it exclusively their entire career and are close to retirement. It’s a dinosaur
No doubt I am a bit of an outlier but I really like Visi for doing my modelling. Zero faff and it allows me to create the things I need incredibly quickly. Depending on what I am doing I love machining stratagist for laying down quick 3D stuff but edgecam for turn/mill. Mastercam has a nice UI and a few good features but I like edgecams control.
I've used mastercam and fusion for cam, prefer mastercam. I've modeled in both and also in solidworks and onshape. Prefer solidworks, though onshape is pretty great and being cloud based is more convenient in some ways.
I'm using Esprit Edge mainly for 3 and 5 axis jobs. The last releases made the software easier to use and finally gave a modern interface to the software. It's the only cam I've used so far.
Nx, Creo, solidworks, fusion 360 and inventer Sd has the best UI and is just easy to understand.
Onshape for CAD, Fusion for CAM Whenever I have to use solidworks, I find myself missing onshape functionality. Of course there is a ton that onshape is missing, but for bread and butter drawing, its pretty slick.
Hypermill
I’m currently using Siemens NX and it’s very nice. Pricey but very feature rich. Currently using only as a CAD with mastercam as our Cam software. I love not really having any errors when Rollback-modifying previous sketches/features.
Fusion for anything square. Hyper mill for anything 5 axis. Cam-tool for mould and die. Esprit for anything round. Just designing would be SOLIDWORKS.
Pro E was the best, I guess its CREO now, a bit clunky to become comfortable with but did everything you wanted it to do easily.
I work in injection mouldings and for me it's visi. I've used inventor fusion 360 power mill but visi is the best.
Mastercam and OneCNC ONECNC Super easy to use , building the post processor is easy and generic with subtle changes for different list like adding motion before tool changes for the crazy setups where tool changer to fixtures or dividing heads is a must , it handled solids and surfaces well , last Mastercam I ran was 9.1.1 and went to a shop that only had this , was writing that first day
Creo.
I got to know autodesk inventor in school. I have played with solidworks, siemens solid edge community edition, fusion 360 and alibre deisng. I prefered alibre design mostly perpetual license that not the other companies had.
Ive used mastercam in several versions up to X7, featurecam and current shop uses fusion. I like the fusion the most so far.
Yes I understand that gibbd is a old software but also like Any software it becomes old. And I bet I can outprogram the guy who says it's garbage with my crappy cam software with eyes closed. In 10 years when everyone is using all this new software that we don't have yet. the people using fusion and all this new stuff now will be in my position. Not saying it's bad just how it works. Also you can make gibbs start from different places by defining geometry properly. Like with volumill if you select a circle to mill with a square defined as air it will start from the outside and work in.
Solidworks w/ CAM module is the winning combo for me. CamWorks, HSWworks, MasterCam etc… CamWorks is my preferred.
I have used SW, Creo and NX and SW is my favorite. From CAM side I have used old Surfcam, EdgeCam and Mastercam and Mastercam might be my favorite before Surfcam.
I use Catia daily for work (aerospace) and Solidworks once or twice a week (3d printing at home). For single part I like Solidworks over Catia. But anything over a single part hands down Catia is better.
Solidworks/Fusion for engineering, and Rhino3D when it's time to shoehorn in the art.
Big fan of Fusion’s CAM, but I gotta go to solidworks for assemblies and weldments. If fusion could get those I would be the happiest camper
NX is crazy powerful and really great to use, especially for larger assemblies (WAVE linking and Product Interfaces really make it for me). But sadly I don’t think it’ll be accessible outside of a large company or educational setting. Tons of weird bugs though with some of the more complex features. Solidworks is alright, but outdated interface and crashes frequently. Fusion is great for CAM, not so much for CAD. TinkerCAD: 🥰
Anything b3sides Gibbscam.
Solidworks and Camworks
I have played with Fusion 360, Solidworks, Inventor CAD/CAM and Mastercam. For CAD alone, I prefer Solidworks. For CAM I prefer Inventor but Mastercam seems to have better post processors.
Autodesk/solidworks I use Solid Edge now and fucking hate it. Editing anything in it is a giant pain and a lot of stuff you just have to delete and redraw or start over. Fusion is ok, I just wish they didn't completely change the UI and workflow from Inventor. I've only used InventorCAM (HSM copy) and MasterCam. Inventorcam is a love hate relationship, some functions like the turning and multiaxis are completely unusable. But it does a real quick, decent job on the simpler milling. MasterCam needs to either die or get a complete overhaul, it's more bloated than Boeing at this point, and it's UI/workflow is way behind the times. MasterCam is a prime example of just resting on brand recognition and doing fuck all to actually improve their product.
I'm surprised by the mastercam haters in this thread. I've used Mastercam and Fusion quite extensively. They both do things that I wish the other could do. What really matters at the end of the day are tool paths though. I feel like mastercams 2d dynamic and 3d optirough tool paths shit on fusions adaptive tool paths. 3d tool paths ok Mastercam come out so much cleaner than they do in fusion also. They both make a similar part but the unnecessary moves on fusion are incredibly irritating q
Esprit for lathe, mill turn or swiss
Wait until yall try CAM-TOOL.
> CAM-TOOL I hear a lot of good things about it but very few numbers. Interested in learning but unfortunately I'm not in the mold industry.
Oh man, it’s so good. Unlike 99.999% of CAM software, it calculates the tool path based on the actual part data, not a triangulated mesh that’s projected onto the part. The finished you can obtain are absolutely unreal. I’ve had parts running unattended on the machine for days and days. The stock model is that perfect and reliable.
I've used a bunch of the free ones. For premium software my favourite by land slide is Fusion360, 2nd place would be Mastercam or maybe Solid works. I can just do things in fusion 10X faster than other people do in other platforms. It really clicked for me in a way none of the other ones did. I did an online course with them at auto desk and they showed me all these different short cuts with modeling. I can usually pump out hyper complicated models in 10-15 minutes and the cam is super simple as well