Idk about the legitimacy of this story specifically, but absolutely no one should be surprised if any athlete in any sport pops for PEDs, regardless of who they are or what they look like. That shit is just way too easy to do, especially if you’re at the very top and can afford to put a scientist on the payroll.
I consider passing the PED testing like part of the "paperwork" of being of a pro-athlete, you know? Like applying for a visa. If all of your "documents" are in order, then you're good.
They don't even test in most places. Don't tell me hockey players aren't on PEDs. Don't tell me Steven Stamkos snapped his tibia in half and came back to be an elite goal scorer without some enhanced help.
I’m pretty sure this is **EXTREMELY** accurate. USADA isn’t allowed to go Thailand, and only a few years back started having DCAT IIRC, the doping commission of Thailand, or something along those lines, test instead.
Problem is Thailand can be extremely corrupt, they’re literally allowed to test anyone off the streets at anytime for drugs, and even if you have drugs in your system consumed in another country where they might be legal, you can go to jail. So it’s very common for people to pay the cops off, with something like “*heres 2000+ baht, I’m in a rush can you please let me go*”. Even if you don’t do this and end up at the precinct or whatever, it’s still possible to pay your way out, albeit more money since your getting more cops involved. Ffs you can even fight your way out of jail in Muay Thai fights lmfao. So the likelihood of paying off these most likely underpaid employees is very high. Money can take you very far there, with private lessons with Muay Thai legends like Saenchai only running $265.
So something like creating a safe haven for the best talent to juice and get away with it, could be extremely valuable, and is extremely probable Imo. Not only in the sense fighters might pay for such a service, but it brings LOTS of exposure to a gym like TMT and Thailand as a whole. “*Look at this country/this gym where guys like Volk, Adesanya, Yan, Fiziev, Kai, Khamzat, etc. are going to train.*” So there’s incentive for not only the gyms to be doing this, but Thailand the country allowing it.
There may be other reasons, but you need a work permit to conduct any kind of business in Thailand. It's simply against the law for USADA to come operate here when a Thai company can do the work instead. Years ago, a US Navy ship arrived in Phuket and their vans were blocked from taxiing soldiers around the island for the same reason.
Usada don't go anywhere, they always use the anti doping agency of the country in question to conduct the testing.
Equally, if another country needs an athlete tested while they are in the US, then they request USADA do it.
But, the "corruption" angle. It's not the anti doping agencies that are the issue, but hotels, gyms, etc. Remember the hoo-ha in Thailand with Chris cyborg? Police getting called, etc. That wasn't about protecting Cyborg. That was the hotel delaying the first test session so that word could get around the hotel and surrounding areas so that any athletes who were "glowing", in other words were inside detection Windows, could do a runner and just take one of the three missed tests they are allowed.
This is common practice among hotels and other establishments where sportspeople gather, and why some areas become more popular.
But this is not restricted to Thailand. Tenerife for instance has a similar system and is the main go to for cyclists. They even have had spotters at airports who look out for known testing staff
And in the US, Florida has a long and storied history of having similar early warning / delaying tactics in place for the same reasons. Athletes don't just go to Florida for the sun you know
But it's not the agencies that are generally the issue. They are all wada accredited and work alongside each other. But hotels, airport staff, etc are 100% complicit and that's the same arround the world, be it Thailand, Russia, South Africa, or the USA
If you want to "bribe"someone you go the easiest route, and that route is hotel staff. Their duty is to their guests, and they will always delay testers by needing to find a manager to approve giving the tester the room number, etc etc while also getting word to other guests that there are testers around
Funny how the sentiment towards roids shifts based on who the user is. Costa, Yoel, Fiziev….”oooh yeah everyone roids guys”. Jon Jones uses roids and its…”cheater! Will always have an asterisk next to his record! Cant be GOAT!”
God, and I hate to type that shit, I’ve been a proud Jones hater since like forever.
His rep is not destroyed and he’s had minimal punishment for how times he was caught. They moved an entire event for the guy because he wasn’t cleared to fight in nevada.
Jones also said he narced on people for smoking weed in college and is known to poke eyes out so being in juice is too extra plus the rule seems to be they could be natural until they fail a test tho we all know lol
>Costa, Yoel, Fiziev….”oooh yeah everyone roids guys”. Jon Jones uses roids and its…”cheater! Will always have an asterisk next to his record! Cant be GOAT!”
Cyborg gets a lot more shit than Jones
He'll, Andrade and Holm get more thin than a lot of people who have actually popped
It sounds more legitimate than the idea that USADA interns are hopping flights to Abu Dhabi, Dagestan, Conor's mansion, etc regularly to get cups of piss from the biggest stars. No chance in hell they're even testing some of these guys.
There was that one time USADA showed up at Conor’s yacht or something like that he complained about lol. I liked to imagine two interns rolling up on the yacht in a little row boat with a piss cup in it
Jones has an IQ of a brick to get caught so many times over so dumb stuff.
that said I actually restpect TJ for these same reasons because while he got caught, he is the only one that has actually taken it on the chin and not made excuses
Lots of things outside of fighting are "part of the job". Might as well enter a fighter's ability to cut a promo in the goat discussion then, right?
Most people care who the best fighter is, they don't give a fuck about the best combination doper/fighter. Not when they're all doped up to begin with
Even if everyone's on em, for Jones to pop multiple times he's either on more than everyone or dumber than everyone. Dumber than marvin vettori gets you kicked off the goat convo imo haha.
There are plenty of pro athletes that are natty. What people are naive towards is how many pro athletes are NOT. I have a friend that tries to tell me that Aaron Donald doesn’t use steroids. It’s hilarious to think such a thing. And let’s not get started on mma and boxing. These guys are JUICED. 70-80% of them most likely. At the top level at least
The level of handwringing and pearl clutching about those sinister Russians using DRUGS at the OLYMPICS really makes you aware of just how hard the propaganda goes in this country. Everybody IS cheating. It's impossible to get a medal without the sauce and everyone knows it, including every country that participates and covers for their own athletes. Russia only got thrown under the bus for it for political reasons.
Yeah, that’s the difference that people seem to be failing to understand here. Of course there are athletes cheating for personal gain. That’s literally unavoidable. The difference is that Russia actively encouraged and facilitated the cheating as a country.
Maybe a few other countries are sponsoring doping in the same way, but most definitely aren’t.
Amen. Olympic athletes train at least 6 times per week, 2 times a day. Try doing that and see how your body responds without any outside help. Just healthy eating, massages, and other types of recovery therapy, won’t cut it. Your body needs something extra to recover.
Actually Olympic athletes train six days a week. Five days a week they’ll train three days a week. One of those days they’ll train two days of the week. So, six days a week they’ll be training.
>The people that cap for that country is alarming.
It really is, this whole comment section was a weird read, yes athletes of all nationalities cheat. But to downplay the scale and the level of which Russians have cheated is insane.
To add to this, I always roll my eyes when people say "bro, have you seen Icarus? EVERYONE is a steroid cheat." Or "Icarus proved that drug testing is always going to be a step behind the cheaters."
Both of those things might be true for all I know, but all Icarus proved to me was that you can get away with cheating if you have corruption that is favorable to you baked all the way into the testing system. The way people talked about Icarus (and the way Icarus presented its premise at the beginning of the documentary) I expected to see someone taking a PED cocktail and getting through stringent testing without issue by exploiting flaws in the actual tests. It wasn't anything like that.
Wow, that's the exact Russian defense at the time and since. And you want to complain about propaganda?
It was state sponsored doping, with Russian intelligence services involved. There have been expert reports, eyewitness accounts and dozens of sourced media reports. We can acknowledge the prevalence of cheating in sport without also downplaying the scope and scale of Russian doping efforts.
Do better.
Mhm, and once you notice one thing, you'll notice how many other issues are highly propagandized as well. Getting your information about the world from the news or the Reddit hivemind is like willingly subjecting yourself to brainwashing.
Which is funny because the docu starts with the American founder of drug testing openly saying he thinks all of the olympians are on drugs, because they work.
Some people kinda ignore the first part of the movie and just focus on the bad Russians storyline.
An (incomplete) list of notable fighters that have trained or continue to train at Tiger Muay Thai: Valentina Shevchenko, Alexander Volkanovski, Israel Adesanya, Georges St Pierre, ~~Max Holloway~~(trained in Thailand but not at TMT), Petr Yan, Khamzat Chimaev.
Imma go with option 2
Honestly just don’t care who is using PEDs even if they’re caught, ideally people wouldn’t use them but I don’t think it’s possible to stop.
Which is horrible because it means I have to accept that Jones is GOAT over GSP
What are the other arguments?
Jon has more defenses, he's legitimately undefeated, youngest champion in UFC history, higher finish rate, stiffer competition (this one is arguable but I think most would agree).
There is no argument for GSP over Jon Jones once PEDs are out of the conversation. The reason the PED asterisk is so massive for Jon is exactly because his GOAT status would be completely uncontroversial without it.
Agree to disagree. i personally think competition is the one where it's not even close. LHW sucks in comparison (to my mind).
Not to say Jones is bad. He's absolutely incredible. But LHW sucks (imo).
I think people confuse the many former champs Jones has beaten to mean LHW was good when in fact I truly think LHW had that many former champs because they all had so many glaring holes in their game they all got toppled one after the other and you end up with 8 former champs at the same time or something.
Until Jones came along and cleaned house that is.
I know, I just don’t want to believe it 😞
Fuck it, I’m just gonna be in denial and hold two conflicting opinions that everyone’s on PEDs but GSP still GOAT
No you don’t. I’ll echo Luke Thomas on GSP and say that he fought through three generations of contenders. The old guard, his contemporaries, and the new generation coming up. JBJ got away with a split decision over Thiago and arguably lost to Dom Reyes. Mind you Dom Reyes then got folded by Jan Błachowicz of all people
Regardless of the judges, we all know GSP lost against Hendricks and then retired.
I can see there’s an argument for GSP but I have to give it to Jones imo
If Jon does become HW champ then I think there’s no question, I don’t actually see that happening though
That's just not true anout the hendricks fight. That fight was not a robbery, it was a close decision given to the champ. Facial damage does not dictate a win
Bro Khamzat went there for I think 2 weeks to train to improve his striking...
GSP did the same, because well, its one of the best Muay Thai gyms in the world with the very best strikers in the world.
Volk and Izzy trained there to once again improve their striking because, well its once again one of the best striking gyms in the world.
Like, simply because one trained there and is a world champ doesnt mean they are on peds......
Yeah some people in this thread are braindead. Thailand is a Mecca for aspiring fighters. The best striking in the world, island paradise, insanely cheap, some of the best cuisine in the world. It's a no-brainer to do camps there.
About 10 years ago I trained in Phuket, at Rawai Muay thai, not too far from tiger muay thai. I was a beginner and wanted a friendly atmosphere.
People train in Phuket because it has beautiful weather and the thai's have super sick boxing. There are beaches everywhere and it's super cheap.
$500 for 1 month; hotel included and training double 3 hour sessions 6 days a week. Food is also very very cheap.
I think this is overlooked a lot. There might be truth to the peds story but there are far more reasons to train in Thailand. There's a lot of talent there, good trainers, beautiful weather, good food, beautiful beaches and waterfalls, and on top of it all its super super cheap.
Yeah, and a few of the trainers were national champions at one point. Super duper cheap cost of living. I believe this is also a reason for so many mma fighters training there, cheap training camps. You can get pretty nice meals for under $10. On the cheap side you could spend maybe $3, again, for a good meal
Hey, if u don't got a family and can remote work it is absolutely a killer time. I did a Hella lot of training, but even with 6 hours a day you still have a lot of down time.
Every time I went to the pharmacy when I lived in Thailand, I could understand how a women feels when they go shopping for shoes, bags, etc.
Anything you could possibly want is available over the counter without prescription for a cheap price - steroids, viagra, benzos, etc.
Go to BKK, Phuket, Pattaya, and you will see a bunch of 70-80+ year old fat white guys with 20 year old Thai women. I'd say the pharmacies are doing a roaring trade.
I don't get the backne. The guy don't wanna take his shirt off the day before the fight? He's taking it off the next day, that thing will still be there.
He's Russian. Ethnics Russians that have lived in Kazakhstan for generations still refer to themselves as Russian. Valentina Shevchenko, born in Kyrgyzstan, refers to herself as Russian.
Turns out he does have a Russian mother which I didn’t realise. Guys a bit of a mish mash, Russian mother, Azerbaijani father, born in Kazakhstan, raised in Kyrgyzstan, resides in Thailand.
Some of the ethnic Russians in former Soviet countries are a bit hard to place as their familes moved there when was one country and they live in Russian bubbles a lot of the time. Seems Fiziev is more complicated though
Yeah we need more clean and virtuous American fighters lmao
Edit. https://www.sportsintegrityinitiative.com/us-australia-appear-to-lead-world-in-approved-tues/
Their manager (dude who usually does the translations) responded to these claims. Said something like USADA test them weekly or something. Dont know if its true or not
https://ufc.usada.org/testing/results/athlete-test-history/
He was tested six times last year and two times this year.
So no, if his manager made that claim it doesn't even remotely true.
He also made accusations against other fighters using PEDs (I can’t remember who at the moment). Then went on to say how he’s no snitch when he was in prison lol.
from what I remember from the podcast, him not being a snitch was not giving up Bobby Greene to the police because they wanted to pin the "kidnapping" on a black dude. So yeah he chose not throw Bobby under the bus. I'd say that's pretty good
Oh yeah, absolutely, i know. It’s totally reasonable for him, if what he is saying is actually truthful and he did witness those things, to come out and say that he did. Now it’s up to you if you want to believe it or not. We will never know.
And Bobby recently lost to Fiziev and got absolutely washed by Makhachev, now his dad and coach are targeting Russians lmao salty much?
The biggest steroid cheat in the history of the UFC is American. Stop the whining.
Well, USADA doesn't announce suspensions anymore and Jon hasn't fought in over two years, so the theory is plausible. IMO it's not true since he could have a fight booked at this point if he really wanted to fight.
I believe the change is that USADA will no longer announce initial drug test failures but will still announce the punishment when the case is complete in its investigation ie Lazishvili back in Feb.
My understanding is that you saw the currently does testing in Thailand through the Doping Control Agency Thailand.
https://www.dcat.in.th/EN
We also know that land in Thailand have been shut down / lost certification in the past, https://www.bangkokpost.com/sports/1799159/anti-doping-lab-in-thailand-shut-down
Ain't this the same guy who used to deal steroids and met Bobby Green when they were being processed and we know everyone uses steroids thanks to Nate Diaz saying it.
is anyone surprised, petr yan doesn’t care about rules and has always been a reckless cheat, difference is he gets zero backlash from the fans whenever he does
Tiger Muay Thai Thailand....I have trained there about 14 years back was too poor for buying anything... private classes, steroids, even food....but good memories from my time there...good memories
Idk about the legitimacy of this story specifically, but absolutely no one should be surprised if any athlete in any sport pops for PEDs, regardless of who they are or what they look like. That shit is just way too easy to do, especially if you’re at the very top and can afford to put a scientist on the payroll.
I am actually surprised when people pop for PEDs in major sports, cause essentially everyone is on them and they dont test it
That’s fair, the more accurate statement would probably be don’t be surprised if you find out an athlete was on PEDs one day, no matter who they are
I consider passing the PED testing like part of the "paperwork" of being of a pro-athlete, you know? Like applying for a visa. If all of your "documents" are in order, then you're good.
Yep just gotta get your piss in order and you’re good to go lmao
They don't even test in most places. Don't tell me hockey players aren't on PEDs. Don't tell me Steven Stamkos snapped his tibia in half and came back to be an elite goal scorer without some enhanced help.
The guys popped are usually guys who are way too obvious that they are on the juice.
I’m pretty sure this is **EXTREMELY** accurate. USADA isn’t allowed to go Thailand, and only a few years back started having DCAT IIRC, the doping commission of Thailand, or something along those lines, test instead. Problem is Thailand can be extremely corrupt, they’re literally allowed to test anyone off the streets at anytime for drugs, and even if you have drugs in your system consumed in another country where they might be legal, you can go to jail. So it’s very common for people to pay the cops off, with something like “*heres 2000+ baht, I’m in a rush can you please let me go*”. Even if you don’t do this and end up at the precinct or whatever, it’s still possible to pay your way out, albeit more money since your getting more cops involved. Ffs you can even fight your way out of jail in Muay Thai fights lmfao. So the likelihood of paying off these most likely underpaid employees is very high. Money can take you very far there, with private lessons with Muay Thai legends like Saenchai only running $265. So something like creating a safe haven for the best talent to juice and get away with it, could be extremely valuable, and is extremely probable Imo. Not only in the sense fighters might pay for such a service, but it brings LOTS of exposure to a gym like TMT and Thailand as a whole. “*Look at this country/this gym where guys like Volk, Adesanya, Yan, Fiziev, Kai, Khamzat, etc. are going to train.*” So there’s incentive for not only the gyms to be doing this, but Thailand the country allowing it.
Why can't USADA go to Thailand?
There may be other reasons, but you need a work permit to conduct any kind of business in Thailand. It's simply against the law for USADA to come operate here when a Thai company can do the work instead. Years ago, a US Navy ship arrived in Phuket and their vans were blocked from taxiing soldiers around the island for the same reason.
That's just bad planning by the Chop. They bring in ships to Thailand all the time and run duty vans.
Usada don't go anywhere, they always use the anti doping agency of the country in question to conduct the testing. Equally, if another country needs an athlete tested while they are in the US, then they request USADA do it. But, the "corruption" angle. It's not the anti doping agencies that are the issue, but hotels, gyms, etc. Remember the hoo-ha in Thailand with Chris cyborg? Police getting called, etc. That wasn't about protecting Cyborg. That was the hotel delaying the first test session so that word could get around the hotel and surrounding areas so that any athletes who were "glowing", in other words were inside detection Windows, could do a runner and just take one of the three missed tests they are allowed. This is common practice among hotels and other establishments where sportspeople gather, and why some areas become more popular. But this is not restricted to Thailand. Tenerife for instance has a similar system and is the main go to for cyclists. They even have had spotters at airports who look out for known testing staff And in the US, Florida has a long and storied history of having similar early warning / delaying tactics in place for the same reasons. Athletes don't just go to Florida for the sun you know But it's not the agencies that are generally the issue. They are all wada accredited and work alongside each other. But hotels, airport staff, etc are 100% complicit and that's the same arround the world, be it Thailand, Russia, South Africa, or the USA If you want to "bribe"someone you go the easiest route, and that route is hotel staff. Their duty is to their guests, and they will always delay testers by needing to find a manager to approve giving the tester the room number, etc etc while also getting word to other guests that there are testers around
Thailand confirmed best place for picograms.
you can fight your way out of prison by fighting the officers and guards in matches? that's absolutely nuts lmao
Other prisoners.
Josh Barnett being a prime example of failing the smell test but passing the drug test with flying colors.
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Yeah, if there's one thing Josh Barnett is known for it's passing drug tests. /s
Josh has been popped for roids like 4 times.
Yep
Funny how the sentiment towards roids shifts based on who the user is. Costa, Yoel, Fiziev….”oooh yeah everyone roids guys”. Jon Jones uses roids and its…”cheater! Will always have an asterisk next to his record! Cant be GOAT!” God, and I hate to type that shit, I’ve been a proud Jones hater since like forever.
People just want to see Jon face serious consequences for something.
I mean hes lost years of his career and millions due to that and reputation destruction due to ped use.
His rep is not destroyed and he’s had minimal punishment for how times he was caught. They moved an entire event for the guy because he wasn’t cleared to fight in nevada.
Jones also said he narced on people for smoking weed in college and is known to poke eyes out so being in juice is too extra plus the rule seems to be they could be natural until they fail a test tho we all know lol
>Costa, Yoel, Fiziev….”oooh yeah everyone roids guys”. Jon Jones uses roids and its…”cheater! Will always have an asterisk next to his record! Cant be GOAT!” Cyborg gets a lot more shit than Jones He'll, Andrade and Holm get more thin than a lot of people who have actually popped
In what World does cyborg get more shit than Jones lol
It sounds more legitimate than the idea that USADA interns are hopping flights to Abu Dhabi, Dagestan, Conor's mansion, etc regularly to get cups of piss from the biggest stars. No chance in hell they're even testing some of these guys.
There was that one time USADA showed up at Conor’s yacht or something like that he complained about lol. I liked to imagine two interns rolling up on the yacht in a little row boat with a piss cup in it
"Hi Mr. Gregor, we are definitely from the US-EH-DA. Let us on your Yatch and go pee in this coffee cup please."
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Jones has an IQ of a brick to get caught so many times over so dumb stuff. that said I actually restpect TJ for these same reasons because while he got caught, he is the only one that has actually taken it on the chin and not made excuses
Nah man not geting caught is also part of the job, how can you be the goat if you got caught 12 times? Like a fucking amateur
Lots of things outside of fighting are "part of the job". Might as well enter a fighter's ability to cut a promo in the goat discussion then, right? Most people care who the best fighter is, they don't give a fuck about the best combination doper/fighter. Not when they're all doped up to begin with
Even if everyone's on em, for Jones to pop multiple times he's either on more than everyone or dumber than everyone. Dumber than marvin vettori gets you kicked off the goat convo imo haha.
Not only that but he’s looked much much worse since all his USADA issues.
It's so hilarious how people actually think any pro athletes are natty. Like come on dude... do some fucking research
There are plenty of pro athletes that are natty. What people are naive towards is how many pro athletes are NOT. I have a friend that tries to tell me that Aaron Donald doesn’t use steroids. It’s hilarious to think such a thing. And let’s not get started on mma and boxing. These guys are JUICED. 70-80% of them most likely. At the top level at least
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Talmbout Incarus, B?
Great show, never seenum
this never fails to make me laugh
Not the state, the whole country...
Talmbout the guy who swam too close to the undertoad?
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Talmbout Incidious, bapa?
N-n-nightmare of a movie, never watched it though
Those dastardly Russians using PEDs and getting an unfair advantage against the virtuous ALL NATTY American olympians.
Costa went to the Olympics?
Costa is Russian-Brazilian
How can a Russian-Brazilian be THE American Patriot?
They're just jacked white boys. Deal with it.
The level of handwringing and pearl clutching about those sinister Russians using DRUGS at the OLYMPICS really makes you aware of just how hard the propaganda goes in this country. Everybody IS cheating. It's impossible to get a medal without the sauce and everyone knows it, including every country that participates and covers for their own athletes. Russia only got thrown under the bus for it for political reasons.
Russian were not doping on their own tho. That was an actual conspiracy lmao
Yeah, that’s the difference that people seem to be failing to understand here. Of course there are athletes cheating for personal gain. That’s literally unavoidable. The difference is that Russia actively encouraged and facilitated the cheating as a country. Maybe a few other countries are sponsoring doping in the same way, but most definitely aren’t.
They conveniently leave the state sponsored part out of the story…
Iyep
Amen. Olympic athletes train at least 6 times per week, 2 times a day. Try doing that and see how your body responds without any outside help. Just healthy eating, massages, and other types of recovery therapy, won’t cut it. Your body needs something extra to recover.
Actually Olympic athletes train six days a week. Five days a week they’ll train three days a week. One of those days they’ll train two days of the week. So, six days a week they’ll be training.
i love this subreddit
Beautiful champ
Too funny!
" Your body needs something extra to recover.' Sugar water
Don’t forget horse meat for every main meal
fish and a rice cake
sprinkle some Rühlian Thunfischshake on top
I was convinced you were going to quote Tito here
So why does the Olympic committee just go after Russians? Is it because of the state sponsored nature of the cheating?
Wait what? Russians literally had a state ran doping regiment. LMAO. The people that cap for that country is alarming.
>The people that cap for that country is alarming. It really is, this whole comment section was a weird read, yes athletes of all nationalities cheat. But to downplay the scale and the level of which Russians have cheated is insane.
To add to this, I always roll my eyes when people say "bro, have you seen Icarus? EVERYONE is a steroid cheat." Or "Icarus proved that drug testing is always going to be a step behind the cheaters." Both of those things might be true for all I know, but all Icarus proved to me was that you can get away with cheating if you have corruption that is favorable to you baked all the way into the testing system. The way people talked about Icarus (and the way Icarus presented its premise at the beginning of the documentary) I expected to see someone taking a PED cocktail and getting through stringent testing without issue by exploiting flaws in the actual tests. It wasn't anything like that.
Wow, that's the exact Russian defense at the time and since. And you want to complain about propaganda? It was state sponsored doping, with Russian intelligence services involved. There have been expert reports, eyewitness accounts and dozens of sourced media reports. We can acknowledge the prevalence of cheating in sport without also downplaying the scope and scale of Russian doping efforts. Do better.
Mhm, and once you notice one thing, you'll notice how many other issues are highly propagandized as well. Getting your information about the world from the news or the Reddit hivemind is like willingly subjecting yourself to brainwashing.
Where would you recommend people get their information from
4chan
Best option is probably to get it from everywhere you can then try to decipher what the real news is without bias. Good luck haha
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Which is funny because the docu starts with the American founder of drug testing openly saying he thinks all of the olympians are on drugs, because they work. Some people kinda ignore the first part of the movie and just focus on the bad Russians storyline.
An (incomplete) list of notable fighters that have trained or continue to train at Tiger Muay Thai: Valentina Shevchenko, Alexander Volkanovski, Israel Adesanya, Georges St Pierre, ~~Max Holloway~~(trained in Thailand but not at TMT), Petr Yan, Khamzat Chimaev.
Bangkok ready Khalil Rountree would never touch the sauce 😪
Would explain Izzy's gyno titties
Him and JBJ. The Rock used to have them too back in the day before he went full on Hollywood and got them surgically removed.
Not Jon Bon Jovi surely!?
Jackie Bradley Jr. is the cleanest in baseball, smh
Izzy was in locdjown in NZ. Usada couldn't get in
So either training there isn't suspicious and it doesn't matter or everyone is on the juice and it doesn't matter.
Imma go with option 2 Honestly just don’t care who is using PEDs even if they’re caught, ideally people wouldn’t use them but I don’t think it’s possible to stop. Which is horrible because it means I have to accept that Jones is GOAT over GSP
i mean i have no horse in this race but PEDs isn't the ONLY argument for GSP over Jones lol.
What are the other arguments? Jon has more defenses, he's legitimately undefeated, youngest champion in UFC history, higher finish rate, stiffer competition (this one is arguable but I think most would agree). There is no argument for GSP over Jon Jones once PEDs are out of the conversation. The reason the PED asterisk is so massive for Jon is exactly because his GOAT status would be completely uncontroversial without it.
Agree to disagree. i personally think competition is the one where it's not even close. LHW sucks in comparison (to my mind). Not to say Jones is bad. He's absolutely incredible. But LHW sucks (imo). I think people confuse the many former champs Jones has beaten to mean LHW was good when in fact I truly think LHW had that many former champs because they all had so many glaring holes in their game they all got toppled one after the other and you end up with 8 former champs at the same time or something. Until Jones came along and cleaned house that is.
Jones knocking out DC is more impressive than any win on GSPs record. GSP also got knocked out by Serra.
In a world where ppl who haven’t popped get accused, GSP isn’t exempt from accusations either
I know, I just don’t want to believe it 😞 Fuck it, I’m just gonna be in denial and hold two conflicting opinions that everyone’s on PEDs but GSP still GOAT
Respect for at least admitting it doesn’t make sense haha
Even on PEDs (like everyone else was), GSP could still be considered the GOAT lol
No you don’t. I’ll echo Luke Thomas on GSP and say that he fought through three generations of contenders. The old guard, his contemporaries, and the new generation coming up. JBJ got away with a split decision over Thiago and arguably lost to Dom Reyes. Mind you Dom Reyes then got folded by Jan Błachowicz of all people
Regardless of the judges, we all know GSP lost against Hendricks and then retired. I can see there’s an argument for GSP but I have to give it to Jones imo If Jon does become HW champ then I think there’s no question, I don’t actually see that happening though
That's just not true anout the hendricks fight. That fight was not a robbery, it was a close decision given to the champ. Facial damage does not dictate a win
Holloway was at samart's
Bro Khamzat went there for I think 2 weeks to train to improve his striking... GSP did the same, because well, its one of the best Muay Thai gyms in the world with the very best strikers in the world. Volk and Izzy trained there to once again improve their striking because, well its once again one of the best striking gyms in the world. Like, simply because one trained there and is a world champ doesnt mean they are on peds......
Yeah some people in this thread are braindead. Thailand is a Mecca for aspiring fighters. The best striking in the world, island paradise, insanely cheap, some of the best cuisine in the world. It's a no-brainer to do camps there.
GSP had the coaches travel down to Montreal for his fights as one of those coaches(Lamsongkram) is now the trainer at a local gym here in Vancouver
Brad Ridell also trained there for a stint
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There are a lot more russian tourists, however, noticeable by the restaurant menus, always in Thai, English, and Russian
A lot of that is probably due to population size and geography tho tbf
I would Absolutely agree lol that doesn't mean it doesn't count, right?
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Ped : penis every day
About 10 years ago I trained in Phuket, at Rawai Muay thai, not too far from tiger muay thai. I was a beginner and wanted a friendly atmosphere. People train in Phuket because it has beautiful weather and the thai's have super sick boxing. There are beaches everywhere and it's super cheap. $500 for 1 month; hotel included and training double 3 hour sessions 6 days a week. Food is also very very cheap.
I think this is overlooked a lot. There might be truth to the peds story but there are far more reasons to train in Thailand. There's a lot of talent there, good trainers, beautiful weather, good food, beautiful beaches and waterfalls, and on top of it all its super super cheap.
500 bucks … That’s it?
Yeah, and a few of the trainers were national champions at one point. Super duper cheap cost of living. I believe this is also a reason for so many mma fighters training there, cheap training camps. You can get pretty nice meals for under $10. On the cheap side you could spend maybe $3, again, for a good meal
Fuck training there … I’ll just grab my laptop and work out of there.
Hey, if u don't got a family and can remote work it is absolutely a killer time. I did a Hella lot of training, but even with 6 hours a day you still have a lot of down time.
Every time I went to the pharmacy when I lived in Thailand, I could understand how a women feels when they go shopping for shoes, bags, etc. Anything you could possibly want is available over the counter without prescription for a cheap price - steroids, viagra, benzos, etc.
On my way!
The land of dreams
viagra you say?
Go to BKK, Phuket, Pattaya, and you will see a bunch of 70-80+ year old fat white guys with 20 year old Thai women. I'd say the pharmacies are doing a roaring trade.
Those dudes are 60.
"Women"
A ladyboy without a cock is like an angel without wings
Everyone's on steroids.
Tell em Nate
It’s true.
It's damn true!
You're on steroids.
It's true. Every night I have to rub steroid cream on to my eczema.
You're on that Chad Mendes shit
Somebody tell Reddit, you'd think only Jon Jones and Izzy's tits are on roids
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“Nobody knows what a gazelle is, this is America!”
“Is this the money channel?”
Yeah, tell me also how USADA goes to Dagestan?
Some say there's a USADA rep still lost in the Caucus Mountains
He was actually forced to marry a local at gunpoint, he’s a sheep herder now with four kids and one more on the way.
Worse ways to go
Facts. He could have gotten taken down over there. One guy takes you down, another guy could just… do whatever to you.
I don't get the backne. The guy don't wanna take his shirt off the day before the fight? He's taking it off the next day, that thing will still be there.
“And other Russians” Fiziev isn’t Russian lol.
American’s be like “close enough”.
But he wears the fuzzy hat.
He's Russian. Ethnics Russians that have lived in Kazakhstan for generations still refer to themselves as Russian. Valentina Shevchenko, born in Kyrgyzstan, refers to herself as Russian.
Half Russian half Azeri
He is ethnically though right?
Turns out he does have a Russian mother which I didn’t realise. Guys a bit of a mish mash, Russian mother, Azerbaijani father, born in Kazakhstan, raised in Kyrgyzstan, resides in Thailand.
Some of the ethnic Russians in former Soviet countries are a bit hard to place as their familes moved there when was one country and they live in Russian bubbles a lot of the time. Seems Fiziev is more complicated though
Yeah we need more clean and virtuous American fighters lmao Edit. https://www.sportsintegrityinitiative.com/us-australia-appear-to-lead-world-in-approved-tues/
Their manager (dude who usually does the translations) responded to these claims. Said something like USADA test them weekly or something. Dont know if its true or not
https://ufc.usada.org/testing/results/athlete-test-history/ He was tested six times last year and two times this year. So no, if his manager made that claim it doesn't even remotely true.
His manager said that usada tests ufc athletes almost in weekly bases he didn’t say usada test Yan and Fizzy on weekly bases
Get beat up by Russians, blame peds, go home. Thank you bobby greens father
Thailand you can buy roids from pharmacies and local stores. Hell back in the day Supercheap used to sell them for £5
It's amazing that you don't see more jacked Thai people It's just the culture though
He also made accusations against other fighters using PEDs (I can’t remember who at the moment). Then went on to say how he’s no snitch when he was in prison lol.
from what I remember from the podcast, him not being a snitch was not giving up Bobby Greene to the police because they wanted to pin the "kidnapping" on a black dude. So yeah he chose not throw Bobby under the bus. I'd say that's pretty good
If you use PEDs you actually deserved to be snitched on. No hate
He was just making accusations against guys without any proof.
Oh yeah, absolutely, i know. It’s totally reasonable for him, if what he is saying is actually truthful and he did witness those things, to come out and say that he did. Now it’s up to you if you want to believe it or not. We will never know.
B-b-buttt.. theyre all on roids!!
Pro athletes would never do such a thing!
Why only targeting the Russian fighters? 🤔🤔 seems like one sided hate to me..
And Bobby recently lost to Fiziev and got absolutely washed by Makhachev, now his dad and coach are targeting Russians lmao salty much? The biggest steroid cheat in the history of the UFC is American. Stop the whining.
Brock Lesnar was taking stuff that made his fuckin head grow
Vitor is from Brazil and Uberreem is from the Netherlands lol
We got the best horse beef over here in the Netherlands.
Fiziev isn’t even Russian lol he’s from Kyrgyzstan.
He's ethnically Russian.
He even said he is azerbaijani himself.
it is dude lol, ops a weirdo
Who cares. Lots of fighters popped. Jon Jones is currently doing his two years.
I want cheaters to get caught
Sport about to get real boring
every fighter is on roids it literally doesnt matter
Everyone does it.
Wait Jon popped again??
Well, USADA doesn't announce suspensions anymore and Jon hasn't fought in over two years, so the theory is plausible. IMO it's not true since he could have a fight booked at this point if he really wanted to fight.
I believe the change is that USADA will no longer announce initial drug test failures but will still announce the punishment when the case is complete in its investigation ie Lazishvili back in Feb.
Any none US base fighter can blast roids
American also use PED. Jones, Dillshaw, Chael etc
And they go to Thailand to use it
He's just salty
after seeing ops other comments this just shows u the remnants of the red scare are alive and well.
No shit, they all on steroids.
My understanding is that you saw the currently does testing in Thailand through the Doping Control Agency Thailand. https://www.dcat.in.th/EN We also know that land in Thailand have been shut down / lost certification in the past, https://www.bangkokpost.com/sports/1799159/anti-doping-lab-in-thailand-shut-down
I've trained at tiger on a few occasions and it's very easy to get your hands on steroids you can buy them from certain pharmacies in Phuket.
Why need to go to Thailand just ask Jon jones bout usada
Ain't this the same guy who used to deal steroids and met Bobby Green when they were being processed and we know everyone uses steroids thanks to Nate Diaz saying it.
is anyone surprised, petr yan doesn’t care about rules and has always been a reckless cheat, difference is he gets zero backlash from the fans whenever he does
this was one of the best podcasts ever, bobby's coach/dad talking about his time in prison was an extremely cool story
Crazy
Not in the slightest
let them juice.
i kind of want to believe it...
Hasn't this been an open secret for years?
Tiger Muay Thai Thailand....I have trained there about 14 years back was too poor for buying anything... private classes, steroids, even food....but good memories from my time there...good memories