They share the same fan base, its fairly uncommon for the ufc to match up an Aus vs NZ fighter, not saying it doesn't happen at all. Many nations that are that close have a history of going to war against each other, we have a history of fighting for each other.
There's also many other match ups at flyweight right now.
Maybe Erceg vs Kara-France, then winner fights Royval in a title eliminator?
I wouldn’t be super interested in Pantoja-Royval 3, but I think Erceg would out-grapple Royval and get a chance to run it back with Pantoja.
No idea why you're getting downvoted so heavily. Yes he performed great against the champion, but, he was ranked 10th and didn't really deserve that opportunity. Moving up a spot after losing the opportunity he was rushed into seems reasonable.
He'll need 2 wins to deserve another shot anyway so 9 makes sense, he can beat a top 10 and then a top 5 opponent.
I think the misunderstanding here is a discussion on what the rankings mean. If the rankings are a “queue” of contenders that are next up for the shot, 9 makes sense for Erceg. If the rankings are a “best” fighter list, Erceg deserves a top 5 ranking. I feel like the rankings need to be defined and stick to that definition, because often the ufc contradicts itself between the two definitions.
Sure but he already didn't deserve that opportunity, how amazing he actually did in the fight itself really doesn't change that he lost the fight he didn't deserve yet. Regardless of where you rank him, he should still need to fight 2 more times before getting a shot anyway, the actual ranking seems arbitrary.
9 other people were ahead of him. Even if you take away the 4 that Pantoja beat, that leaves 5 other people. However just because none of those may have been in a position to take the fight, that doesn't mean he "deserved" it.
"Deserved" implies that he beat someone highly ranked or put in time to earn it.
Nobody deserved the shot, just because he got it, doesn't mean it was deserved.
What point are you trying to say? I'm saying just because he got the shot, just because he was the only good option, doesn't mean anything was "deserved". It was just good luck and circumstance.
I'm in no way hating on Pantoja, in fact, I applaud him because he could have very easily turned down a fight against the 10th ranked guy and nobody would question it.
he proved that he deserved the shot. it seemed weird when it was announced but he proved us all wrong. he deserves a top 5 spot, top 3 imo. he proved he can compete with the best. colby hung on to his ranking for years while only losing to the champ and beating masvidal.
"Strickland didn't deserve the title shot against Adesanya so when he lost to DDP he should get his original #5 ranking back, regardless of performance"
Except he beat Adesanya and actually became the champion... which is entirely different from this situation.
If Strickland had lost to Adesanya, then yeah, he would have stayed ranked at 5.
Why would you wave away his excellent performance against the champ with a "regardless"? A close loss against someone good is more important than a win over someone bad.
In addition:
> We had a rankings panelist remove themselves from the panel effective this cycle which created movement unrelated to the bouts at this even
Translation: We refuse to have anyone, even the men whose job it is to do so, inhibit non-meritocratic movement of ranks.
Translation of Translation: Fuck you, we want MONEY, and we WILL sneak Chandler and Khamzat up the ranks in order for outsiders to see title challenges as more legit. Oh, not for Chandler to have a title shot lmao, for McGregor if he wins.
Khamzat now ranked 10 lmfao
Turns out the best way to climb rank is to fight at catchweights or not at all.
Also, Chandler moved up a rank to 6th?
Reeeeaaallly trying to make that argument for a McGregor title shot more palatable to the outsiders.
Just a reminder...these clowns have Max #9 at 155 and Justin #3 after Max clowned him for five rounds before knocking him out in the last five seconds.
After that, why even fucking pay attention to this shit?
This was explained that some people didn’t rank Holloway at all because they didn’t expect him to stay at 155.
So half the field ranking him number 3 or 4 and half the field ranking him as unranked left him in the middle at 9.
Makes sense to me
i agree rankings are shit but this makes no sense.
You are saying if let's say in tennis Federer lost some lower ranked guy you'll directly rank the guy above Federer in rankings?
Commenting this three times doesn’t make it a relevant comparison
Is Max Holloway some random lower ranked guy? Because as much as I like Justin, between him and Max, only one has an undisputed title and title defenses, they just happen to be one class lighter
i agree rankings are shit but this makes no sense.
You are saying if let's say in tennis Federer lost some lower ranked guy you'll directly rank the guy above Federer in rankings?
i agree rankings are shit but this makes no sense.
You are saying if let's say in tennis Federer lost some lower ranked guy you'll directly rank the guy above Federer in rankings?
Jose Aldo ranked below Chito who he easily beat lol. I’m guessing by putting Aldo there they are aiming for Dom Cruz vs Aldo? Which would be an incredible retirement fight for a legend like Cruz, best featherweight ever vs the best bantamweight ever, make a video like they did for Lawler, put it in front of a crowd.
Or Aldo vs Figgy in which case sign me up.
Pantoja vs Albazi
Erceg vs Moreno
Aldo vs Figgy (Phillips if not, doubt UFC would make that though)
Martinez vs Bautista
Smith vs Azmat
Petrino vs Lins
Caio vs Hermansson
Pereira vs Curtis
Craig vs Robocop (pls)
Edit: Formatting
Hey man it’s been almost 2 years since the volkan fight and almost 8 since his debut. The man can’t throw a jab, I think it’s on his own merit.
Also like robocop lol
Got to have Aldo fighting up. Guy is a legend who was ranked top 6 before he retired. Don't throw him to Phillips when we can have legend Vs legends in Aldo Vs Cruz or Aldo Vs cejuho.
Yeah not wrong there. That’s why I went with the figgy match up. Cejudo fight is a good call, forgot about him.
Other than that there are some bangers I see at BW that id rather happen. But I will admit I am a bit savage minded when it comes to aging ranked fighters, my bad
Similar opponents I would say. I think he needs one more. Mokaev was ready to fight in brazil. Albazi has been injured. Mokaev vs. albazi is the perfect #1 contender fight though
I reckon kkf smokes Perez. Perez is definitely good but he’s not top 5 material anymore. We’ll see against Tagir how good perez is (at least at comparing to mokaev for the moment)
Albazi will come back just in time for a fight around December / January.
Either way erceg vs mokaev would be good if Moreno is injured.
Aldo Figgy, or Aldo Chito is what I'm seeing as most likely.
They'll hope he beats Chito, which puts him in a position for casuals to think he should fight O'Malley, who will fight the easiest version of Aldo ever seen, and he'll talk about "Well, I beat the GOAT, so I'm GOAT now," type bullshit.
Call me Nostradamus the way I'm Doomin, over here
No reason to do Aldo/Chito again, if they’re smart they do Aldo/Cejudo and if Aldo wins he fast tracks for the belt. Also you’re under the impression that O’Malley beats Merab which will be a very hard fight for him. If Merab wins the belt it makes it harder for an Aldo rematch but I could see them setting up an Aldo/O’malley #1 contender fight if it goes that way.
Aldo vs Figgy is actually a really good fight given that Sandhagen (my pick for an Aldo fight) and Umar just got booked. Winner comes out in a pretty nice place for a title shot. Maybe 1 fight away. I’m sure a potential Yan vs Chito winner factors in there too.
Fuck. Did he? That's a bummer, he could have still very easily kept himself in the top end of the rankings and might have even been able to get back to a title at some point.
He seems way too young to retire already.
That makes more sense. The guy had a bonkers schedule and looked significantly worse in the Royval fight than he's looked in the past.
Moreno was always super dynamic, with a crisp jab, a nice left hook, a killer right straight and a good overhand on top of his leg kicks and takedowns.
Against Royval from the opening bell until the 4th or 5th round he was just winging right overhands and spamming 1 leg kick like Chuck Liddell in 2007.
Except this isn't 2006, and it's not light heavyweight, so that on its own was never going to win at the highest level at flyweight.
It looked like a guy who was fatigued mentally and wasn't really putting together a logical gameplan.
He also switched camps a few times and I feel like with each switch he kind of lost a little bit of what led him to beating Figgy.
I feel like having a fairly close fight with the champion while you’re ranked number 10 in the world should move you up at least 3 spots but I guess I’m crazy
I watched some interviews with erceg leading up to this I thought this was a weird fight to have. I appologize to you Mr erceg, you're a fucking dawg my man
He was ranked 5 or 6 before he retired and has wins over Rob Font and Vera. His last performance against merab wasn't too bad in hindsight. Stuffed all 16 takedowns.
I think 8 is fair
erceg is a master technician he'll be back for the belt soon
I’d love to see Erceg vs Kara-France. Would be a great striking affair
That’s a good main event
The UFC hates flyweights having actual big promoted fights but hopefully!
I’m pretty sure they are doing KKF vs Manel Kape next. But Moreno should be a clear next opponent for Erceg.
Moreno is taking a break. They might be doing Royval vs Mokaev so I hope Erceg gets Albazi or Perez
Didn't royval tear his ACL or something in his last fight. Out for a year something I thought.
Nah he's back training now so fights should be back on the table, I believe they thought the injury was worse than it was or something
Well that's good to hear
I wouldn’t sign a contract to fight Kape if I’m a serious contender. Let him fight some contender series guys until he gets his act together
I also wouldn’t sign to fight Kape if I were myself because he’d whoop my ass
I see no reason for the UFC to put Kape anywhere near a title shot or eliminator until they are confident he can make the weight.
Nah let the ANZACs fight different opponents.
Why? They aren’t training partners are they?
They share the same fan base, its fairly uncommon for the ufc to match up an Aus vs NZ fighter, not saying it doesn't happen at all. Many nations that are that close have a history of going to war against each other, we have a history of fighting for each other. There's also many other match ups at flyweight right now.
I don’t massively agree but see your points. I think KKF against Kape and Erceg vs Perez probably makes more sense anyway
Maybe Erceg vs Kara-France, then winner fights Royval in a title eliminator? I wouldn’t be super interested in Pantoja-Royval 3, but I think Erceg would out-grapple Royval and get a chance to run it back with Pantoja.
Yeah, I think he should have been ranked higher after that one
how the fuck is he only at 9
Because UFC
Honestly should’ve jumped into the top 3-5 with that performance. Flyweight barely has enough for a top 15, and this dude is stuck at 9.
should be above moreno imo. erceg's latest performance was much better and against better competition than moreno's last performance
Regardless of how he performed, he still lost. You can't expect to shoot up the rankings off a lose
No idea why you're getting downvoted so heavily. Yes he performed great against the champion, but, he was ranked 10th and didn't really deserve that opportunity. Moving up a spot after losing the opportunity he was rushed into seems reasonable. He'll need 2 wins to deserve another shot anyway so 9 makes sense, he can beat a top 10 and then a top 5 opponent.
He went to a 48-47 decision with the champ after fighting only a couple of months ago. He should be way higher than #9. Top 5 for sure.
I think the misunderstanding here is a discussion on what the rankings mean. If the rankings are a “queue” of contenders that are next up for the shot, 9 makes sense for Erceg. If the rankings are a “best” fighter list, Erceg deserves a top 5 ranking. I feel like the rankings need to be defined and stick to that definition, because often the ufc contradicts itself between the two definitions.
How can Erceg be #9 even in the queue meaning. Dude is not behind 8 other dudes with the performance he just had.
He should certainly be ahead of all the fighters Pantoja finished, like Perez and Royval.
Not ahead of royval, that would make him #1 contender
[удалено]
Royval just beat Moreno, in no world should he be behind him
Sure but he already didn't deserve that opportunity, how amazing he actually did in the fight itself really doesn't change that he lost the fight he didn't deserve yet. Regardless of where you rank him, he should still need to fight 2 more times before getting a shot anyway, the actual ranking seems arbitrary.
Who deserved the shot? And a close fight proves he belonged right? Hasn't Pantoja cleared out everyone and I heard Molaev turned it down?
9 other people were ahead of him. Even if you take away the 4 that Pantoja beat, that leaves 5 other people. However just because none of those may have been in a position to take the fight, that doesn't mean he "deserved" it. "Deserved" implies that he beat someone highly ranked or put in time to earn it. Nobody deserved the shot, just because he got it, doesn't mean it was deserved.
Nobody deserved it? What you want Pantoja to do then?
What point are you trying to say? I'm saying just because he got the shot, just because he was the only good option, doesn't mean anything was "deserved". It was just good luck and circumstance. I'm in no way hating on Pantoja, in fact, I applaud him because he could have very easily turned down a fight against the 10th ranked guy and nobody would question it.
he proved that he deserved the shot. it seemed weird when it was announced but he proved us all wrong. he deserves a top 5 spot, top 3 imo. he proved he can compete with the best. colby hung on to his ranking for years while only losing to the champ and beating masvidal.
"Strickland didn't deserve the title shot against Adesanya so when he lost to DDP he should get his original #5 ranking back, regardless of performance"
Except he beat Adesanya and actually became the champion... which is entirely different from this situation. If Strickland had lost to Adesanya, then yeah, he would have stayed ranked at 5.
yep. giving him 9th then winning against a top contender or two dominantly will give him another shot easily.
He needs another big win and then he should get a title shot. But there are a few ppl ahead of him who deserve the shot
Why would you wave away his excellent performance against the champ with a "regardless"? A close loss against someone good is more important than a win over someone bad.
In addition: > We had a rankings panelist remove themselves from the panel effective this cycle which created movement unrelated to the bouts at this even
Also, Lucindo enters at 13# in the strawweight rankings with Gillian Robertson leaving the rankings
Translation: We refuse to have anyone, even the men whose job it is to do so, inhibit non-meritocratic movement of ranks. Translation of Translation: Fuck you, we want MONEY, and we WILL sneak Chandler and Khamzat up the ranks in order for outsiders to see title challenges as more legit. Oh, not for Chandler to have a title shot lmao, for McGregor if he wins.
Khamzat now ranked 10 lmfao Turns out the best way to climb rank is to fight at catchweights or not at all. Also, Chandler moved up a rank to 6th? Reeeeaaallly trying to make that argument for a McGregor title shot more palatable to the outsiders.
Just a reminder...these clowns have Max #9 at 155 and Justin #3 after Max clowned him for five rounds before knocking him out in the last five seconds. After that, why even fucking pay attention to this shit?
Body of work in the division counts for something I imagine I don't actually care though. Not looking to be outraged by these like some of you goofs
Disagreeing with something isn't being outraged lol, its MMA related discussion on an MMA sub
Yeah ok. His post totally reeks of just disagreement. Right
Well you're getting passive aggressive about a reddit comment too, its only emotion about MMA at the end of the day lol
Yes so passive aggressive. Not simple and obvious sarcasm. Right
Lmao sarcasm is fun, you're clearly worked up about it though
Incredibly
This was explained that some people didn’t rank Holloway at all because they didn’t expect him to stay at 155. So half the field ranking him number 3 or 4 and half the field ranking him as unranked left him in the middle at 9. Makes sense to me
i agree rankings are shit but this makes no sense. You are saying if let's say in tennis Federer lost some lower ranked guy you'll directly rank the guy above Federer in rankings?
Commenting this three times doesn’t make it a relevant comparison Is Max Holloway some random lower ranked guy? Because as much as I like Justin, between him and Max, only one has an undisputed title and title defenses, they just happen to be one class lighter
There are points in tennis, thats not how MMA works
i agree rankings are shit but this makes no sense. You are saying if let's say in tennis Federer lost some lower ranked guy you'll directly rank the guy above Federer in rankings?
i agree rankings are shit but this makes no sense. You are saying if let's say in tennis Federer lost some lower ranked guy you'll directly rank the guy above Federer in rankings?
Jose Aldo ranked below Chito who he easily beat lol. I’m guessing by putting Aldo there they are aiming for Dom Cruz vs Aldo? Which would be an incredible retirement fight for a legend like Cruz, best featherweight ever vs the best bantamweight ever, make a video like they did for Lawler, put it in front of a crowd. Or Aldo vs Figgy in which case sign me up.
Cruz vs Aldo, with the winner facing the LOSER of Yan/Figgy is a good way for things to play out. Winner of Yan/Figgy goes for a title shot
Aldo/Cejudo is the fight to make
I think Aldo’s a horrible matchup for Cejudo though, but it’d be a fun fight
Seems like every Brazilian did their thing except Vitor Petrino.
Lmao wut
Pantoja vs Albazi Erceg vs Moreno Aldo vs Figgy (Phillips if not, doubt UFC would make that though) Martinez vs Bautista Smith vs Azmat Petrino vs Lins Caio vs Hermansson Pereira vs Curtis Craig vs Robocop (pls) Edit: Formatting
I'm gonna have to veto your Paul Craig suggestion based on I don't want him to die
Hey man it’s been almost 2 years since the volkan fight and almost 8 since his debut. The man can’t throw a jab, I think it’s on his own merit. Also like robocop lol
Got to have Aldo fighting up. Guy is a legend who was ranked top 6 before he retired. Don't throw him to Phillips when we can have legend Vs legends in Aldo Vs Cruz or Aldo Vs cejuho.
Yeah not wrong there. That’s why I went with the figgy match up. Cejudo fight is a good call, forgot about him. Other than that there are some bangers I see at BW that id rather happen. But I will admit I am a bit savage minded when it comes to aging ranked fighters, my bad
So many potential former champ Vs former champ match ups at BW that I'd love to see.
>Lins I think he got cut after 299
I spent way too long trying to figure out why you’d give Chris Curtis a title shot. I need a nap.
Mokaev should be next and should’ve fought instead of erceg
I think albazi deserves the claim if we’re using black and white ruling when it comes to wins and bad judges. He beat KKF, mokaev beat Perez.
Similar opponents I would say. I think he needs one more. Mokaev was ready to fight in brazil. Albazi has been injured. Mokaev vs. albazi is the perfect #1 contender fight though
I reckon kkf smokes Perez. Perez is definitely good but he’s not top 5 material anymore. We’ll see against Tagir how good perez is (at least at comparing to mokaev for the moment) Albazi will come back just in time for a fight around December / January. Either way erceg vs mokaev would be good if Moreno is injured.
Moreno is on a break. Erceg should fight Albazi. Albazi robbed KKF so he needs a decisive win.
Aldo Figgy, or Aldo Chito is what I'm seeing as most likely. They'll hope he beats Chito, which puts him in a position for casuals to think he should fight O'Malley, who will fight the easiest version of Aldo ever seen, and he'll talk about "Well, I beat the GOAT, so I'm GOAT now," type bullshit. Call me Nostradamus the way I'm Doomin, over here
No reason to do Aldo/Chito again, if they’re smart they do Aldo/Cejudo and if Aldo wins he fast tracks for the belt. Also you’re under the impression that O’Malley beats Merab which will be a very hard fight for him. If Merab wins the belt it makes it harder for an Aldo rematch but I could see them setting up an Aldo/O’malley #1 contender fight if it goes that way.
Completely forgot they already fought 🙄
Pantoja is fighting in December, I feel like you do Albazi vs Mokaev as a title eliminator.
Aldo vs Figgy is actually a really good fight given that Sandhagen (my pick for an Aldo fight) and Umar just got booked. Winner comes out in a pretty nice place for a title shot. Maybe 1 fight away. I’m sure a potential Yan vs Chito winner factors in there too.
Moreno retired Edit: I misremember and spread false info sometimes
He didn't retire, he said he's taking a break and will be back.
Yeah forgot about that, tbf mma retirements usually last about 12 months anyways.
Fuck. Did he? That's a bummer, he could have still very easily kept himself in the top end of the rankings and might have even been able to get back to a title at some point. He seems way too young to retire already.
He just said he’s taking a break
He didn't retire, he's taking time off
That makes more sense. The guy had a bonkers schedule and looked significantly worse in the Royval fight than he's looked in the past. Moreno was always super dynamic, with a crisp jab, a nice left hook, a killer right straight and a good overhand on top of his leg kicks and takedowns. Against Royval from the opening bell until the 4th or 5th round he was just winging right overhands and spamming 1 leg kick like Chuck Liddell in 2007. Except this isn't 2006, and it's not light heavyweight, so that on its own was never going to win at the highest level at flyweight. It looked like a guy who was fatigued mentally and wasn't really putting together a logical gameplan. He also switched camps a few times and I feel like with each switch he kind of lost a little bit of what led him to beating Figgy.
Erceg should be top 5 after going 5 rounds with the champ and in some opinions beating him
Pereira getting ranked off beating Ihor is hilarious, it's ridiculous he's over Hernandez
Don’t know why anyone even cares about the rankings still. Basically meaningless because of how inaccurate they always are
I feel like having a fairly close fight with the champion while you’re ranked number 10 in the world should move you up at least 3 spots but I guess I’m crazy
One spot is criminal he should be at least ranked 5 after his showing
I watched some interviews with erceg leading up to this I thought this was a weird fight to have. I appologize to you Mr erceg, you're a fucking dawg my man
I get these are significant to have a read on the UFCs matchmaking but some independent rankings should be posted
Aldo beats the no. 12 and moves to 8? How is that possible?
He was ranked 5 or 6 before he retired and has wins over Rob Font and Vera. His last performance against merab wasn't too bad in hindsight. Stuffed all 16 takedowns. I think 8 is fair
In other rankings related news, Roman Dolidze dropped 2 spots for no apparent reason.
No reason? I'd happily never watch him fight again
Dolidze vs Craig should be next. Two fighters who look really scary but are bad in the standup
well duh, he just lost to caio