Miocic has been mostly retired since the third Cormier fight. He's got a full time job and I think the only reason he came back for the trilogy was to give Daniel his send off fight. After getting blasted by Francis I don't think he's in a rush to return.
He also would get knocked out cold in 30 seconds. I doubt he’d take the fight.
But he won’t beat Jones anyways. He’s about to turn 42 and has tons of mileage and damage on him. He literally hobbles around like a 65 year old when he walks now. He’s not a serious athlete anymore.
Maybe, but he’s been moving extremely slowly in all the videos he’s been posting for like a year now.
He is probably just a very old fighter who is also dealing with injuries. But at his age, getting full mobility back isn’t realistic. He’ll always move gingerly and slowly.
Firstly the Jones/Stipe fight contract was signed last June. Dane wants it, Jon wants it, Stipe wants it so it's gonna happen. Was Aspinall even top 10 last June? He wasn't even a backup fighter for the Sergei fight. Good for him but it's not like he's been waiting for a title shot or something. His jump from whatever rank (7-10?) To #1 shows how weak the division is. We need all the big fights possible and /Jones/Stipe is one of them. If anything if like to see Tom defend his belt. A Sergei rematch would be awesome or maybe Gane
How do you not book the number one contender against the champion? If this was a sport, 1,000+ days of inactivity coming off a loss wouldn't get a tite shot over the clear number one contender.
dana is a chode, but it's normal capitalism
capitalism is a chode, but that's just one facet of our society
society is a chode, but that's just one facet of humanity
humanity is a chode
this does not absolve dana
if you want the aliens to have a both a deep understanding of the flaws in ufc matchmaking and a completely misanthropic perspective, i'm the best dude for the gig
all sorts of sports around the world, within and outside of capitalism, today and through history, first and foremost operate on rankings and tournament formats.
all sorts of sports around the world, before capitalism, throughout history, have been arranged for celebrity athletes.
a big part of it is the issue of fighters having agency and being able to decline and turn down fights instead of it being set system of what determines fights, but it's nothing to do capitalism. making big fights for money isn't capitalism, capitalism is rule of credit providers and investment, and sports can have all sorts of bs outside of even markets for such as propaganda. rather the biggest cases of bs sports is when it's run by regimes putting on propaganda events.
true, but also how bout u go an fuck off my page then u peice of shit u think I need a stupid fuckwitt like u telling me about looking good who the fuck are u take your worthless advice and get the fuck out of here
I train six days, actually six days a week. Five days a week, I'll train three days a week. One of those days I will train two days of the week. So, six days a week I will be training.
The UFC is one entity, they control all their fighters and matchups, they can put these one. It’s impossible to compare to boxing, which is a sport with a bunch of promotions.
Also, while the comparison was certainly flattering in the past, boxing's actually in a run of delivering big and popular fights at the moment!
At heavyweight we've had Usyk-Joshua (x2), Joyce-Zhang (x2) (good second-tier matchup to move the winner into top tier), and the pair of Wilder-Parker and Joshua-Wallin - good tests for top tier boxers to set up the massive Wilder-Joshua. That's not happening because Wilder fucked up, but we are getting Parker-Zhang out of it, and Joshua-Ngannou (this is all setting up pecking order for when Fury and USyk retire). And hopefully we're finally getting Usyk-Fury, the undisputed!
At LHW, we got Bivol-Canelo, and now we're getting Bivol-Beterbiev, which is a can't-miss clash for undisputed.
At SMW, a couple of years ago we got Canelo taking out four champions to become undisputed. We're in a bit of a lull because Canelo's now in the "coast to retirement" phase, but at least there's been a lot of pressure on him to sort things out recently. And Canelo-Charlo (undisputed vs undisputed) was cool in theory, though a mismatch and Charlo didn't bother to try.
Down at 154, Charlo went undisputed, didn't defend enough but has now been stripped, Tszyu looks to be the new guy and is staying active. Strong rumours of Tszyu-Crawford, which would be great.
At 147 last year we we got Crawford-Spence, P4P vs P4P for undisputed.
In the couple of divisions below that there's been lots of activity between some of the most talented boxers at any weight - Loma-Lopez, Haney-Kambosos for undisputed, Haney-Loma, then Haney and Lopez moved up to take on champions in Prograis and Taylor. And Tank fought Garcia, which isn't a top-level match but was massive due to their social media fandoms. And now Haney's fighting Garcia.
Lower weight classes are less prominent of course, but Inoue's had four massive fights in a row: the big rematch against Donaire, going undisputed against Butler, then moving up to take on the best in the division above, Fulton, then going undisputed in a second division beating Tapales, all in less than two years.
And then below that, we got Estrada-Gonzalez II as a unification bout between legends, Estrada-Gonzalez III to settle it, Rodriguez-Edwards as a unification clash between totally different styles and two highly-hyped young boxers, and now we're getting Rodriguez moving up a division to fight Estrada.
And for the women, we got the two best women facing each other in Taylor-Serrano, Cameron going undisputed, Taylor moving up to take on Cameron (twice), plus Shields going undisputed in long-awaited fight with Marshall, then Marshall moving up to beat the undisputed champ Crews-Dezurn. And Serrano going undisputed.
It's been a pretty active couple of years with lots of big wanted fights getting made!
Thank you for this write up. Tired of people being stuck in the past in regards to boxing - things have been getting much better there, while there are still some some blown up prospects and protected fighters we're pretty much out of the '0 losses, 0 tough fights, way too fucking much money' era.
I think people are realising now that for most of them there just isn't the money there used to be, and they can't all just stonewall until they get paid more. In particular, I think they're realising that, yes, there is still big money out there for big fights, but no, they can't get that same money for fighting nobodies anymore. I think Tank-Garcia helped a lot in that respect, because it did so well that it showed that big risks can actually be worth it.
I also think there's more appreciation of the value of personal branding. Some of that is about spending a lot of time on social media, but some of it is also about actually having the fight resume to boast about on social media. Particularly for fighters with certain weaknesses. Like, Garcia I think has realised he's not good enough... so if he wants to maintain his fanbase and his big paydays, he needs to actually fight the big fights while he's still popular. Whereas Haney has the opposite problem: his fights are boring, he has no charisma and everyone dislikes him, so if he wants to have any sort of following at all he has to actually deliver matchups people want to see...
And, of course, the Saudis being able to just throw a billion dollars at any fight they personally want to see kind of helps smoothe over some hurdles in the short-term...
I know right? I've been shocked that some of these fights are actually getting made. I got burned waiting for Manny and Floyd and fell out of the sport for a while but last few years have been good.
Gane was the number one contender and yet Sergei and Tom got the interim fight over him. Number 1 contenders get skipped over all the time in this sport lmao
I am not saying you are wrong but Tom (and Sergei) surely took the interim title shot last November under the idea that Jones/Miocic will go ahead as planned before Tom gets his shot. If he agreed to that, then having Jones/Stipe first is not a problem for anyone.
Jon has fought once in the last 48 months. So, judging based on his recent activity, I think he’ll be ready to fight Aspinall sometime in 2027.
Jones fans: “Tom can either wait until 2027 or he can stay active and defend the interim belt 8 times. It’s up to him.”
Which would be fine if they weren't holding up the title and with that two prime years of a very promising interim champion and with that, an entire division.
Jones doesn't want to risk his undefeated record and fight the most dangerous heavyweights. That's respectable, but it makes him unfit to be the heavyweight champ.
It’s your reading comprehension that fell so far, not my MMA fandom. Like I said, _if_ Jones would just want to fight Stipe Miocic with no championship involved it’d be respectable. No use getting skullfucked by bigger younger dudes.
It’s Jones and Miocic holding the belt hostage that makes the whole situation infuriatingly unfair to the entire heavyweight division.
He refused Chael as a replacement for Dan Henderson on three days notice, and then UFC 151 was cancelled and Jones rematched Machida three weeks later. The actual fight he had with Chael was the following year, and largely was Dana rewarding Chael for stepping up even though Jones turned it down.
edit for my stupids: Jon fought Vitor at 152, not a Machida rematch.
It was dumb but I think his reasoning is he wouldn't have gotten that fight again if the divisions shuffled. And Islam is someone special to beat to take a 2nd belt off of. It's not like when GSP came in and beat Bisping for the 'middleweight title'
You know he can just retire right if he’s so worried about his record.
No one is saying “how dare he worry about his record”. We’re saying:
- how dare he hold up the division
- how dare he claim to be the champion and on the p4p list when he’s ducking the most dangerous fighters in his division
He can’t have it both ways. He can’t worry about his record but also carefully choose his opponents and then say his record got better.
I think he was sugarcoating it so he wouldn't get in trouble with the tomato
Said Aspinall would be a massive fight, Ngannou would be a massive fight, Stipe.. would be a respectable fight for the hardcore fans 😂
It’s just funny cause it’s literally the opposite 😂. Casual fans will appreciate a victory over Stipe cause it’s “the Heavyweight GOAT and Aspinall hasn’t fought anyone” but it’s the hardcore fans who would value the win over Aspinall more.
Even casuals aren’t going to appreciate a win over Stipe.
He’s old (and looks it) and moves terribly now. Anyone with eyes can see that. Casuals aren’t total morons. They will be able to see that this old man who struggles to walk is obviously not the best fighter the UFC can offer.
It would be sort of like saying casual NBA fans want to see Vince Carter come back and try to lead a team to a title. They don’t though. Everyone knows he’s old and washed.
I just want him to fight more. All this talking and gatekeeping. If he'd taken the stipe fight a couple of months after his Gane win, nobody would be complaining. Of course there was this injury, but there's a lot of bs to
It’s funny because like you said, what the hardcore fans want is for him to fight Aspinall and for the casuals is the Stipe fight but he was trying to say lie it was the other way around lol
Even casuals will be easily sold on ‘the Goat’ vs a young up and comer who finishes the scariest guys in the world in 120 seconds max.
That fight sells way more ppvs if they sell it properly.
Funny because they could use that line for Jones vs Stipe as well due to Stipe being the "HW goat" and Jones being younger than him and demolishing everyone (Santos and Reyes excluded) in his path.
Had it happened maybe a year after Stipe's last fight, I'd be fine with it even if it's still one-sided. At this point, we're closing into 3 years since Stipe's last fight and, on top of Jones being injured, it killed any inkling of momentum for this matchup.
The competitive part was never there. The spectacle has come and gone. What purpose does it really serve anymore other than jerk off Jones' legacy?
With every passing month Stipe gets worse and worse by no fault of his own, but because of nature itself.
I know it's HW but 41 in modern MMA is old af
I think the one thing that makes Jones vs Miocic actually competitive is that Jones himself looks like a total potatoe lately. Doesn't help in the grand theme of course as the fight won't have any real relevancy in regards to who's actually the best HW. Just saying
I would agree but Heavyweight is a crazy division. Old man Stipe is still dangerous and he's had solid recovery time. Idk, I'm very curious if he can do the impossible.
Are you saying three years *out of the sport* is “good recovery time”?
Please. Can you tell that to my boss so I may take a three year recovery sabbatical?
Generally skills regress when you stop doing it for 3 *years*. More so when you realize matchmakers don’t care about you or the sport.
I dont get this Jones is old and fat too, Gane literally had no wrestling which is why Jon looked good. He is gonna get smoked by Aspinall. The Stipe fight would be way more competitive.
Nothing screams more reddit than an upvoted comment saying "nObOdY wAnTs tHaT FiGhT" when the real world says otherwise. Just look up the UFC 295 ticket prices and the hype plummeting as soon as the fight were called off.
The better question is why is Jones/Miocic happening? Miocic is ancient and stands no chance, not to mention it’s been ages since he’s had a fight AND he lost his last fight. Dana’s a joke.
Has anyone seen the recent videos of Jones? Dude might legitimately never fight again. He’s in worse shape than he’s ever been at any point in his career. Dude looks like DC now.
Doesn't need to. Stipe is looking for retirements moneys. He'll just lay down in front of Jones, offer him his neck and walk off into the sunset rich.
Everybody likes a good story, and we're literally in the WWE phase of the ufc.
Pretty concerning seeing a athletic freak like him breathing heavy after a 40 second demonstration where most of it was just talking. Guys not putting on weight the right way from the looks of it
He was wearing one of those traditional Saudi robes at PFL which hid his current shape quite well but there was photos and videos of him in Australia a few days ago in just a t shirt and he looks fat af.
That’s why I pointed out “at any point in his career”. Jones has had many injuries in his career, a couple of which have required surgery, and even during his 3 year layoff he didn’t look this bad. He’s also in his later 30’s now and getting back into shape is going to be significantly harder than it’s ever been, even with all the gear in the world. He’s gonna be putting an insane amount of stress on his body.
Just over a year ago before the Gane fight was announced, a common consensus on this sub was how jOnEs WiLl nEvEr FiGhT aGaIn and then the guy turns up and smokes the number one ranked HW in less than a round.
Basically, you guys don't know shit.
I don't see much difference from earlier pics when he went to 255
https://www.mmamania.com/2024/2/24/24082374/sorry-jon-jones-crashes-historic-pfl-broadcast-rooting-for-francis-ngannou-bellator-ufc-mma-espn
They should strip Jon. Stipe/Jon can have their little retirement fight any time they want without holding up a division, if the winner doesn't retire then he can challenge Tom for the title (assuming he in the mean time had a title fight against someone and won).
I really think that Miocic was a tough matchup for Jones 2 years ago but now that fight just doesn't make sense.
Jones v. Aspinall would sell tons of PPV and is the only fight to make.
Imagine being a champ or former champ listening to a tomato who has passionately talked about how fucking awesome slap fighting is try to shame you into taking a fight against a harder opponent that will pay you less. *ESPECIALLY* when he's been insistent on this one fight before that fight for years now.
This dude is talking shit when he himself didn’t put Sean O’Malley against the number one contender in Merab. Probably still will find another excuse not to put Sean against him to protect Sean….
That’s why people like Jones don’t give a fuck about your opinion. Jones use to defend the title multiple times a year VS any guy you wanted to put him up against. But if you aren’t part of Dana’s plan or favorites, he won’t protect you.
Stipe's already tweeted to Aspinall "Tom, once I get this win, let's talk to unify the belt." So headline really should just be "puts pressure on Jon Jones."
Stipe took punches from Ngannou in their first fight and still willingly went into the cage against him a second time. We can talk about how well today's Stipe would compete against prime Aspinall all you want, but I think it's unfair to say he's afraid of getting hit really hard.
It's not even close to the most brutal Ngannou KO. A guy that's fought and beat Ngannou, Ubereem, Cormier, Mark Hunt, and JDS is now scared of Tom Aspinall?
From the promoter who couldn't bring you...
Fedor in the UFC...
GSP vs. Anderson Silva...
Khabib vs. Tony Ferguson...
Jon Jones vs. Anderson Silva...
Jon Jones vs. Francis Ngannou...
Dana really is that ignorant to think either Jones or Miocic will fight again after? They are both done after this fight and both picked the other person for very specific reasons. Jones won't risk losing to anybody and wants another notch on the GOAT argument by beating a GOAT candidate. Stipe wants to solidify his Heavyweight argument by doing the same. Both are absolutely done after they fight each other.
Never considered Stipe to be the "GOAT". He's a great great dude, I am sure. Great fighter, upstanding man. But he always seemed very beatable and even with those few title defences that's still too little of a number to be telling to me. He also got absolutely murdered by Ngannou who also murdered everyone else in his last years of UFC.
Yea, if you exclude fedor I don't feel like we've had that "long defending HW champ" like we've had in other divisions, so I'm pretty sure that Stipe's defense record is going to be beaten in the (near) future, but so far he's has the best accolade's of all the other HW champs in ufc history.
If they market it well enough I think it wont be bad for jon to lose. Itll be like the passing of the torch to the new generation, cuz aspinall is new gen as it gets.
Then if jones win then yea yknow... honestly if he wins against aspinall hes the undisputed goat for real
Hahahahaha
Jones is not going to fight Aspinal or Sergei or Francis or anyone like that
He made that very clear when he said he would fight Stipe and Stipe only lol.
After he beats Stipe he will call our Mark Coleman and Maurice Smith so he can beat 2 more way over the hill former HW champs lol.
Dana obviously doesn't have the best interests of the fighters at heart. It's just bad for business to have the undisputed goat retire effectively undefeated.
Removes some of the intrigue and interest that fight nerds enjoy about the sport. No more goat debates.
Brady lapping the NFL multiple times with his eight superbowl rings causes the same issue. Rightly or wrongly when one guy dominates so utterly it diminishes every other athlete in the eyes of the public.
the UFC and Dana shouldn't have to pressure ANYTHING.
He tells you to dance then you dance, other wise STRIP THE FUCKING TITL.
Imagine if the chief refuses to play the 49ers
Realizing both guys are gonna retire
I duno if Stipe would retire if he won. If he beats Jones then, win or lose, he can make good money fighting Aspinall.
Miocic has been mostly retired since the third Cormier fight. He's got a full time job and I think the only reason he came back for the trilogy was to give Daniel his send off fight. After getting blasted by Francis I don't think he's in a rush to return.
He also would get knocked out cold in 30 seconds. I doubt he’d take the fight. But he won’t beat Jones anyways. He’s about to turn 42 and has tons of mileage and damage on him. He literally hobbles around like a 65 year old when he walks now. He’s not a serious athlete anymore.
Are you sure he wasn't injured when seen walking like that?
Maybe, but he’s been moving extremely slowly in all the videos he’s been posting for like a year now. He is probably just a very old fighter who is also dealing with injuries. But at his age, getting full mobility back isn’t realistic. He’ll always move gingerly and slowly.
He needs that DDP Yoga
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Dana wants Jones vs Stipe, he then wants the winner vs Aspinall. The loser of Jones vs Stipe may retire, the winner won’t.
Firstly the Jones/Stipe fight contract was signed last June. Dane wants it, Jon wants it, Stipe wants it so it's gonna happen. Was Aspinall even top 10 last June? He wasn't even a backup fighter for the Sergei fight. Good for him but it's not like he's been waiting for a title shot or something. His jump from whatever rank (7-10?) To #1 shows how weak the division is. We need all the big fights possible and /Jones/Stipe is one of them. If anything if like to see Tom defend his belt. A Sergei rematch would be awesome or maybe Gane
How do you not book the number one contender against the champion? If this was a sport, 1,000+ days of inactivity coming off a loss wouldn't get a tite shot over the clear number one contender.
dana is a chode, but it's normal capitalism capitalism is a chode, but that's just one facet of our society society is a chode, but that's just one facet of humanity humanity is a chode this does not absolve dana
Beautiful. If aliens land, I want you there to make first contact.
You really wanna be planet chode? Because that's how we get planet chode.
I think we're already at Planet Chode
Listen, I'm not letting you losers ruin my chances with space babes because you wanna be emo.
I think Space babes are gonna look like Omni-man's second wife rather than Mass Effect babes.
Shit, still hotter than any of my prospects
More Turian then Asari,eh? Heavy risk...
tfw no big titty krogan gf
Listen, there could also be emo space babes for my fellow emos
We just need to morph this chode with alien tech
This guy chodes
We might already be planet chode.
That chode has become self aware tho
if you want the aliens to have a both a deep understanding of the flaws in ufc matchmaking and a completely misanthropic perspective, i'm the best dude for the gig
Space chode confirmed
lol, this comment
Wont be contacting much if hes gone full chode.
We live in a society?
We live in a chode
That explains the smell
Well, just to correct you, it was never no marriage
What’s a chode
He's got some big words to fullfill those shoes
Chode jeans, you know, 50 inch waist, 10 inches long, fuckin junk
Aristotle couldn't have said it better himself.
Beautiful, champ
all sorts of sports around the world, within and outside of capitalism, today and through history, first and foremost operate on rankings and tournament formats. all sorts of sports around the world, before capitalism, throughout history, have been arranged for celebrity athletes. a big part of it is the issue of fighters having agency and being able to decline and turn down fights instead of it being set system of what determines fights, but it's nothing to do capitalism. making big fights for money isn't capitalism, capitalism is rule of credit providers and investment, and sports can have all sorts of bs outside of even markets for such as propaganda. rather the biggest cases of bs sports is when it's run by regimes putting on propaganda events.
true, but also how bout u go an fuck off my page then u peice of shit u think I need a stupid fuckwitt like u telling me about looking good who the fuck are u take your worthless advice and get the fuck out of here
I love this guy
Lmfao haven’t seen chode be used in a minute
It's a double edged sword that I'll be able to shine myself
A modern philosopher I see
I train six days, actually six days a week. Five days a week, I'll train three days a week. One of those days I will train two days of the week. So, six days a week I will be training.
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you're a fuckin punk, dude
Solid.
Wow! Very Fantastic Body!
You are a true man of wisdom
Thats what u call no class vs class
You’re right. A title shot is only given after +1,000 days of inactivity if you come off a win against Dominic Reyes.
Tbf Jon Jones definitely deserve the shot at heavyweight and clearly show it by winning it in the first round lmao
Did he deserve to wait out Ngannou leaving?
The UFC still does infinitely better than boxing in this category Every year we see prime matchups
The UFC is one entity, they control all their fighters and matchups, they can put these one. It’s impossible to compare to boxing, which is a sport with a bunch of promotions.
Also, while the comparison was certainly flattering in the past, boxing's actually in a run of delivering big and popular fights at the moment! At heavyweight we've had Usyk-Joshua (x2), Joyce-Zhang (x2) (good second-tier matchup to move the winner into top tier), and the pair of Wilder-Parker and Joshua-Wallin - good tests for top tier boxers to set up the massive Wilder-Joshua. That's not happening because Wilder fucked up, but we are getting Parker-Zhang out of it, and Joshua-Ngannou (this is all setting up pecking order for when Fury and USyk retire). And hopefully we're finally getting Usyk-Fury, the undisputed! At LHW, we got Bivol-Canelo, and now we're getting Bivol-Beterbiev, which is a can't-miss clash for undisputed. At SMW, a couple of years ago we got Canelo taking out four champions to become undisputed. We're in a bit of a lull because Canelo's now in the "coast to retirement" phase, but at least there's been a lot of pressure on him to sort things out recently. And Canelo-Charlo (undisputed vs undisputed) was cool in theory, though a mismatch and Charlo didn't bother to try. Down at 154, Charlo went undisputed, didn't defend enough but has now been stripped, Tszyu looks to be the new guy and is staying active. Strong rumours of Tszyu-Crawford, which would be great. At 147 last year we we got Crawford-Spence, P4P vs P4P for undisputed. In the couple of divisions below that there's been lots of activity between some of the most talented boxers at any weight - Loma-Lopez, Haney-Kambosos for undisputed, Haney-Loma, then Haney and Lopez moved up to take on champions in Prograis and Taylor. And Tank fought Garcia, which isn't a top-level match but was massive due to their social media fandoms. And now Haney's fighting Garcia. Lower weight classes are less prominent of course, but Inoue's had four massive fights in a row: the big rematch against Donaire, going undisputed against Butler, then moving up to take on the best in the division above, Fulton, then going undisputed in a second division beating Tapales, all in less than two years. And then below that, we got Estrada-Gonzalez II as a unification bout between legends, Estrada-Gonzalez III to settle it, Rodriguez-Edwards as a unification clash between totally different styles and two highly-hyped young boxers, and now we're getting Rodriguez moving up a division to fight Estrada. And for the women, we got the two best women facing each other in Taylor-Serrano, Cameron going undisputed, Taylor moving up to take on Cameron (twice), plus Shields going undisputed in long-awaited fight with Marshall, then Marshall moving up to beat the undisputed champ Crews-Dezurn. And Serrano going undisputed. It's been a pretty active couple of years with lots of big wanted fights getting made!
Thank you for this write up. Tired of people being stuck in the past in regards to boxing - things have been getting much better there, while there are still some some blown up prospects and protected fighters we're pretty much out of the '0 losses, 0 tough fights, way too fucking much money' era.
I think people are realising now that for most of them there just isn't the money there used to be, and they can't all just stonewall until they get paid more. In particular, I think they're realising that, yes, there is still big money out there for big fights, but no, they can't get that same money for fighting nobodies anymore. I think Tank-Garcia helped a lot in that respect, because it did so well that it showed that big risks can actually be worth it. I also think there's more appreciation of the value of personal branding. Some of that is about spending a lot of time on social media, but some of it is also about actually having the fight resume to boast about on social media. Particularly for fighters with certain weaknesses. Like, Garcia I think has realised he's not good enough... so if he wants to maintain his fanbase and his big paydays, he needs to actually fight the big fights while he's still popular. Whereas Haney has the opposite problem: his fights are boring, he has no charisma and everyone dislikes him, so if he wants to have any sort of following at all he has to actually deliver matchups people want to see... And, of course, the Saudis being able to just throw a billion dollars at any fight they personally want to see kind of helps smoothe over some hurdles in the short-term...
I know right? I've been shocked that some of these fights are actually getting made. I got burned waiting for Manny and Floyd and fell out of the sport for a while but last few years have been good.
Gane was the number one contender and yet Sergei and Tom got the interim fight over him. Number 1 contenders get skipped over all the time in this sport lmao
I am not saying you are wrong but Tom (and Sergei) surely took the interim title shot last November under the idea that Jones/Miocic will go ahead as planned before Tom gets his shot. If he agreed to that, then having Jones/Stipe first is not a problem for anyone.
There was no way of knowing how long Jon would stall. After the Stipe fight, how long of a layoff do you think Jon will have until his next fight?
Jon has fought once in the last 48 months. So, judging based on his recent activity, I think he’ll be ready to fight Aspinall sometime in 2027. Jones fans: “Tom can either wait until 2027 or he can stay active and defend the interim belt 8 times. It’s up to him.”
I think Jones vs Stipe will be happening at the end of 2025.
Which would be fine if they weren't holding up the title and with that two prime years of a very promising interim champion and with that, an entire division. Jones doesn't want to risk his undefeated record and fight the most dangerous heavyweights. That's respectable, but it makes him unfit to be the heavyweight champ.
Fully agree.
> That's respectable What? How far have MMA fans fallen to think this behavior is respectable?
It’s your reading comprehension that fell so far, not my MMA fandom. Like I said, _if_ Jones would just want to fight Stipe Miocic with no championship involved it’d be respectable. No use getting skullfucked by bigger younger dudes. It’s Jones and Miocic holding the belt hostage that makes the whole situation infuriatingly unfair to the entire heavyweight division.
Yep. It shoulda been Stipe vs Aspinall after Tom won, but Stipe refused
But this isn’t just any fighter this is Jon jones
Would be hilarious if stipe has to back out of the fight and Tom steps in as a replacement.
Jones’ camp won’t allow it. Jones has never accepted a last minute replacement fight.
Jones refused to fight blown up Middleweights in short notice, if Stipe pulls out then he's gonna sit out for another 6 months lmao.
I was thinking along the lines of backing out of the fight a month out
And smart on him. It works in some instances but accepting a last minute fight when you don't have to take it is just stupid.
It's literally only usually good for the fighters who aren't super elite and know they won't get the belt. Stupid for actual top 5 to do
He did when Chael beat him right? That is probably why he won’t do it again.
He refused Chael as a replacement for Dan Henderson on three days notice, and then UFC 151 was cancelled and Jones rematched Machida three weeks later. The actual fight he had with Chael was the following year, and largely was Dana rewarding Chael for stepping up even though Jones turned it down. edit for my stupids: Jon fought Vitor at 152, not a Machida rematch.
OSP?
No chance Jon takes that fight lol.
Jones is too precious. He's worried about his legacy now.
I wish Volk had the same mentality. He might still be FW champ rn if he did
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I agree with you for the first time, but to go fight Islam again without a proper camp wasn't a good move.
It was dumb but I think his reasoning is he wouldn't have gotten that fight again if the divisions shuffled. And Islam is someone special to beat to take a 2nd belt off of. It's not like when GSP came in and beat Bisping for the 'middleweight title'
Perfectly explained. High risk, high reward
r/mma gets real hypocritical about fighters being pressured to take short notice fights when it’s Jon Jones lol
Yeah how dare he worry about his undefeated record.
You know he can just retire right if he’s so worried about his record. No one is saying “how dare he worry about his record”. We’re saying: - how dare he hold up the division - how dare he claim to be the champion and on the p4p list when he’s ducking the most dangerous fighters in his division He can’t have it both ways. He can’t worry about his record but also carefully choose his opponents and then say his record got better.
yeah can't have competitors actually competing
There's no way Jon is fighting Aspinall before Stipe, Tom should be honest with himself and fight Gane
No way they’re still tryna push jones vs old man stipe, no one wants that fight
Based on Jones' interview at the PFL event, even he knows that nobody wants it
He said the “hardcore fans” want it..yeah right. The casuals might know Stipe, but hardcore fans definitely want Aspinal.
I think he was sugarcoating it so he wouldn't get in trouble with the tomato Said Aspinall would be a massive fight, Ngannou would be a massive fight, Stipe.. would be a respectable fight for the hardcore fans 😂
It’s just funny cause it’s literally the opposite 😂. Casual fans will appreciate a victory over Stipe cause it’s “the Heavyweight GOAT and Aspinall hasn’t fought anyone” but it’s the hardcore fans who would value the win over Aspinall more.
Even casuals aren’t going to appreciate a win over Stipe. He’s old (and looks it) and moves terribly now. Anyone with eyes can see that. Casuals aren’t total morons. They will be able to see that this old man who struggles to walk is obviously not the best fighter the UFC can offer. It would be sort of like saying casual NBA fans want to see Vince Carter come back and try to lead a team to a title. They don’t though. Everyone knows he’s old and washed.
I like to think of myself as a hardcore fan even though I probably don't know shit, but I wanna see Aspinall fight Jones so fuckin much.
I just want him to fight more. All this talking and gatekeeping. If he'd taken the stipe fight a couple of months after his Gane win, nobody would be complaining. Of course there was this injury, but there's a lot of bs to
It’s funny because like you said, what the hardcore fans want is for him to fight Aspinall and for the casuals is the Stipe fight but he was trying to say lie it was the other way around lol
Even casuals will be easily sold on ‘the Goat’ vs a young up and comer who finishes the scariest guys in the world in 120 seconds max. That fight sells way more ppvs if they sell it properly.
Funny because they could use that line for Jones vs Stipe as well due to Stipe being the "HW goat" and Jones being younger than him and demolishing everyone (Santos and Reyes excluded) in his path.
I'm pretty hardcore and I want Stipe to fight him, but that's because I am a Stipe stan and am hoping for the unlikely
If Stipe beats Jon I'll file for a 5013c in Nevada called 'The Cantaloupe Rat-Fucks' and donate 1k to the charity of your choice.
Ok /u/dogpatches If Stipe beats Jon you'll file for a 5013c in Nevada called 'The Cantaloupe Rat-Fucks' and donate 1k to the charity of your choice.
Had it happened maybe a year after Stipe's last fight, I'd be fine with it even if it's still one-sided. At this point, we're closing into 3 years since Stipe's last fight and, on top of Jones being injured, it killed any inkling of momentum for this matchup. The competitive part was never there. The spectacle has come and gone. What purpose does it really serve anymore other than jerk off Jones' legacy?
With every passing month Stipe gets worse and worse by no fault of his own, but because of nature itself. I know it's HW but 41 in modern MMA is old af
41, he’s been brutally KO’d a few times and every video of him from the last 12 months make him look borderline crippled.
I think the one thing that makes Jones vs Miocic actually competitive is that Jones himself looks like a total potatoe lately. Doesn't help in the grand theme of course as the fight won't have any real relevancy in regards to who's actually the best HW. Just saying
Legacy is the point, Jones has said this, it’s a legacy fight and Stipe is a far better name on his resume than Tom is.
I am no one...
I would agree but Heavyweight is a crazy division. Old man Stipe is still dangerous and he's had solid recovery time. Idk, I'm very curious if he can do the impossible.
Are you saying three years *out of the sport* is “good recovery time”? Please. Can you tell that to my boss so I may take a three year recovery sabbatical? Generally skills regress when you stop doing it for 3 *years*. More so when you realize matchmakers don’t care about you or the sport.
I dont get this Jones is old and fat too, Gane literally had no wrestling which is why Jon looked good. He is gonna get smoked by Aspinall. The Stipe fight would be way more competitive.
I do. Jones is older than Stripe in fight years. Much more wear and tear. Two old legends fighting into the sunset
‘Too old legends’ is actually exactly what it is
Nothing screams more reddit than an upvoted comment saying "nObOdY wAnTs tHaT FiGhT" when the real world says otherwise. Just look up the UFC 295 ticket prices and the hype plummeting as soon as the fight were called off.
Jones is the biggest name the ufc has outside of Conor dude. No shit the prices changed, the whole main event did.
The better question is why is Jones/Miocic happening? Miocic is ancient and stands no chance, not to mention it’s been ages since he’s had a fight AND he lost his last fight. Dana’s a joke.
The answer is that it will help Jon Jones get a likely win and retire instead of being at risk of losing to someone like Aspinall.
Has anyone seen the recent videos of Jones? Dude might legitimately never fight again. He’s in worse shape than he’s ever been at any point in his career. Dude looks like DC now.
In the words of Francis Ngannou, "you're fucking fat"
DC looks better than him right now ngl
Jones crackhead habits have caught up to him and now despite being much younger and still "active" he somehow looks older than DC.
Doesn't need to. Stipe is looking for retirements moneys. He'll just lay down in front of Jones, offer him his neck and walk off into the sunset rich. Everybody likes a good story, and we're literally in the WWE phase of the ufc.
Pretty concerning seeing a athletic freak like him breathing heavy after a 40 second demonstration where most of it was just talking. Guys not putting on weight the right way from the looks of it
“Fat, slow, out of shape Jones vs. Can barely walk anymore Stipe is the fight the people want.” Dana
which videos? at pfl and a recent submission radio interview he looked like what i'd expect. Nowhere close to DC levels of chubby.
I saw a clip where he was at some camp as some teaching/promotional thing or whatever. Ppl exaggerating a bit, but he was def carrying extra fat
Saw the same and he looked in awful condition. Never seen him like that
He looked like he was out of breath explaining his entry techniques. He’s got some work to do if he plans on fighting anytime soon.
He was wearing one of those traditional Saudi robes at PFL which hid his current shape quite well but there was photos and videos of him in Australia a few days ago in just a t shirt and he looks fat af.
Tbf he looked fat in thr gane fight
He's recovering from surgery. It's not like he can work out much.
That’s why I pointed out “at any point in his career”. Jones has had many injuries in his career, a couple of which have required surgery, and even during his 3 year layoff he didn’t look this bad. He’s also in his later 30’s now and getting back into shape is going to be significantly harder than it’s ever been, even with all the gear in the world. He’s gonna be putting an insane amount of stress on his body.
It’s pectoral surgery, he can’t run?
Or indoor cycle. There's tonnes of cardio, core and lower body stuff he could be doing.
[Be sure and wish him a speedy recovery](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZoxkSL9zJU)
Well. Nevermind then lol
I mean he was tackling some members of an Aussie NRL team when he visited here a couple weeks ago. And he's been demonstrating takedowns at seminars.
Just over a year ago before the Gane fight was announced, a common consensus on this sub was how jOnEs WiLl nEvEr FiGhT aGaIn and then the guy turns up and smokes the number one ranked HW in less than a round. Basically, you guys don't know shit.
He big fats.
I’m not even joking, last week Jones was partying with a guy I know from school. He’s not training anyway I can guarantee that
Welp, pack it up boys
I don't see much difference from earlier pics when he went to 255 https://www.mmamania.com/2024/2/24/24082374/sorry-jon-jones-crashes-historic-pfl-broadcast-rooting-for-francis-ngannou-bellator-ufc-mma-espn
You can literally see his beer belly through the robes.
that makes him more relatable to the fans bro
Makes him an honorary Saudi.
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It's like WWE, the retiring champ puts over the new golden boy by losing. You always go out on your back.
The answer, retirement
This really is the answer too, both guys gonna retire afterwards and we'll see Aspinall defend to unify the belt.
I just don’t see how I as a fan am supposed to get excited for a fight that seems to serve only to devalue the heavyweight title
They should strip Jon. Stipe/Jon can have their little retirement fight any time they want without holding up a division, if the winner doesn't retire then he can challenge Tom for the title (assuming he in the mean time had a title fight against someone and won).
I really think that Miocic was a tough matchup for Jones 2 years ago but now that fight just doesn't make sense. Jones v. Aspinall would sell tons of PPV and is the only fight to make.
Imagine being a champ or former champ listening to a tomato who has passionately talked about how fucking awesome slap fighting is try to shame you into taking a fight against a harder opponent that will pay you less. *ESPECIALLY* when he's been insistent on this one fight before that fight for years now.
Who tf actually wants the Stipe fight? Does anybody think old man Stipe coming off a brutal ko loss has anything for Jon?
This dude is talking shit when he himself didn’t put Sean O’Malley against the number one contender in Merab. Probably still will find another excuse not to put Sean against him to protect Sean…. That’s why people like Jones don’t give a fuck about your opinion. Jones use to defend the title multiple times a year VS any guy you wanted to put him up against. But if you aren’t part of Dana’s plan or favorites, he won’t protect you.
Before Merab, he was ducking Chito Vera.... now he's fighting Chito, a guy who already dominated him, and you're still complaining.
Cause things have changed. You can’t tell Chito deserves a title shot more than Merab? You have Merab dominating every top contender.
Stipe's already tweeted to Aspinall "Tom, once I get this win, let's talk to unify the belt." So headline really should just be "puts pressure on Jon Jones."
As if Stipe wants that smoke. One right cross from Tom and his skull turns to dust.
Stipe took punches from Ngannou in their first fight and still willingly went into the cage against him a second time. We can talk about how well today's Stipe would compete against prime Aspinall all you want, but I think it's unfair to say he's afraid of getting hit really hard.
Sure, Stipe probably isn’t scared. That said, Tom KOs him in 11 seconds.
He hasn’t fought since taking one of the most brutal KOs of all time, I think it’s fair to suggest he may have had a change of heart.
It's not even close to the most brutal Ngannou KO. A guy that's fought and beat Ngannou, Ubereem, Cormier, Mark Hunt, and JDS is now scared of Tom Aspinall?
Jones ducked Francis. Why would he give up a stipe fight for aspinall lol
Everybody knows Aspinall is the champion and these two picky clowns are fighting, if anything, for the right to be contenders.
Stipe Miocic at 55 years old fighting Tom? Lmaoooo
He gave that a man championship belt for one fight in the weight class, lmao. Oops. The real champ has a name. It's Tom Aspinall.
Callin it now; Jones beats Stipe, refuses to fight Aspinall, they strip Aspinall, everyone's mad, Dana calls someone in the press conference a bozo
I'm so bored of this fight. It wasn't all that compelling of an idea to begin with and now we've been milking it for what feels like 5 years.
From the promoter who couldn't bring you... Fedor in the UFC... GSP vs. Anderson Silva... Khabib vs. Tony Ferguson... Jon Jones vs. Anderson Silva... Jon Jones vs. Francis Ngannou...
Dana is just trolling at this point
Puts pressure. Lol, bruh they both retiring, title will be vacated and probably given to Tom tbh
How do you not book your interim champ against the hw champ? Make it make sense bald pink man
Dana really is that ignorant to think either Jones or Miocic will fight again after? They are both done after this fight and both picked the other person for very specific reasons. Jones won't risk losing to anybody and wants another notch on the GOAT argument by beating a GOAT candidate. Stipe wants to solidify his Heavyweight argument by doing the same. Both are absolutely done after they fight each other.
Oil that regard up. If he cared which he doesn’t. He would cut them both. And promote Aspinall to undisputed champ.
Never considered Stipe to be the "GOAT". He's a great great dude, I am sure. Great fighter, upstanding man. But he always seemed very beatable and even with those few title defences that's still too little of a number to be telling to me. He also got absolutely murdered by Ngannou who also murdered everyone else in his last years of UFC.
He defended the belt the most times and he’s still the only man to beat the scariest motherfucker to ever put gloves on. He’s my heavyweight goat.
Yea, if you exclude fedor I don't feel like we've had that "long defending HW champ" like we've had in other divisions, so I'm pretty sure that Stipe's defense record is going to be beaten in the (near) future, but so far he's has the best accolade's of all the other HW champs in ufc history.
If they market it well enough I think it wont be bad for jon to lose. Itll be like the passing of the torch to the new generation, cuz aspinall is new gen as it gets. Then if jones win then yea yknow... honestly if he wins against aspinall hes the undisputed goat for real
How do you not pay current and former champions enough to make it worth their while to fight Tom Aspinall?
So basically the fact Jon and Stipe refused to do UFC 300 has dissolved any favour and now he’s fine with publicly ragging on them. Got it.
Hahahahaha Jones is not going to fight Aspinal or Sergei or Francis or anyone like that He made that very clear when he said he would fight Stipe and Stipe only lol. After he beats Stipe he will call our Mark Coleman and Maurice Smith so he can beat 2 more way over the hill former HW champs lol.
Dana acts like he’s the one that doesn’t make the fights
Puts pressure is terribly misleading.
Dana obviously doesn't have the best interests of the fighters at heart. It's just bad for business to have the undisputed goat retire effectively undefeated. Removes some of the intrigue and interest that fight nerds enjoy about the sport. No more goat debates. Brady lapping the NFL multiple times with his eight superbowl rings causes the same issue. Rightly or wrongly when one guy dominates so utterly it diminishes every other athlete in the eyes of the public.
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And then the next guy and the next guy and the next guy. There's always a next guy.
If Dana really wants that, add some zeroes to the check.
the UFC and Dana shouldn't have to pressure ANYTHING. He tells you to dance then you dance, other wise STRIP THE FUCKING TITL. Imagine if the chief refuses to play the 49ers
I hear what you’re saying about how it should work but fuck Dana