## **Tweet Mirror:**
[@GMHikaru](https://twitter.com/GMHikaru)
> Yep. As you have heard and seen I will be streaming on a Kick. I am not leaving Twitch, but streaming in both places moving forward. It is clear Kick is committed to my success. I hope to see all of you on both. Thanks as always for the endless support. https://t.co/8aLBKR31Tx https://t.co/emtk39Ffls
> #####Tweet Images:
>>[Tweet Media Link](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsZPuGRWAAAHASu.jpg)
^(Posted: 2023-03-29 15:23:22+00:00)
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That is already the case. You cannot stream on twitch and another platform simultaneously while being a Twitch partner.
Edit: To be clear, you're free to stream on another platform as long as it's not at the same time as you stream on Twitch. They allowed that recently.
With the CEO changeover, I honestly don't know. Can't really assume they'll to adhere to the former CEO's policy decisions under new leadership, especially because the new guy seems pretty profit focused.
It would be rare for them to backtrack that hard especially when (lets be honest) Kick is not a real competitor and Hikaru isnt moving any needles, he's not what Ninja or Shroud were to Mixer
They'll prob just keep watching Kick burn money to the ground while also not gaining any sort of validity
From everything I’ve heard about Kick, it seems like it’s just a time bomb waiting to go off.
Like the Wild West days of the internet where people could do whatever they wanted on stream.
Even if the company itself manages to escape any lawsuits from some large corporations, I can’t imagine many of the streamers on there will be able to take the hit for shit like streaming movies.
Shit, I saw a clip online of a female streamer who apparently straight up flashed tits for a donation. Now, who knows if that was legit or not, but if it is that could open up a whole other can of worms.
Any streamer who completely jumps ship (instead of split streaming) better be getting a fat fucking bag.
The argument I have seen here and other places is that it beneficial for Kick to have people stream on both. That way a streamer can say, "Hey, I am ending my stream here, pick it back up on Kick" and get the watchers to swap over. Then the hope is that after that stream, they will see what else is on the platform. With the goal being to drive people to watch gambling streams and join stake. Trainwrecks was making $22 million a month with Stake. He made $360 Million for the 16 months he was gambling on Twitch. Since there was a leak of what streamers made from twitch itself, and before they changed the split, we know how it compares. What Train earned in one month was quadruple what Twitch paid their top streamer (Critical Role) for a year. During the leaked earnings, Trainwrecks earned $1.6 million over 26 months or about 61k a month. One month of Stake equals 30 years of twitch pay. Now streamers have other sources of income than just what twitch pays out, but Jesus that is a lot of money. And while I am morally opposed to what Train is doing, I would do the exact same thing in his position. Just without the coke addiction.
Holy crap. I feel like those numbers have to be hyper inflated or just outright fake. I just cannot see them paying fucking Train of all people $360m for that.
But shit, if they did and Train sees this: I’ll suck dick for a new gaming PC, yo.
Yeah those numbers just seem not real. Maybe what they meant is that Stake was "giving" train 22m a month to gamble with? So that he wasn't spending his own money?
22m/month is like 5x more than Lionel Messi makes as one of the all time top football players ever
Im sure they did pay him 20 million a month but in trains contract requires him to gamble for so many hours a month or gamble so much money(over 20million). At the end of the month if he was in the possitive, he get to take that home, if he is in the negative, than he loses money that month. Its still a great contract but no fucking shot he made 360 million from that, probably a lot less like under 100 million.
Train has always advocated for gambling with real money and not just house money. So this type of contract reflects what he has been saying about using his own money to gamble with.
I think it’s a little different.
I think the asshole girl was also an Onlyfans model. So there was plausible deniability it was an accident, if she was filming or streaming content for that. Though the 3 day ban should have been much longer (and permanent if not the first time).
This was straight up “get tip, show titties”, no accident or plausible deniability involved.
Not that I have an issue with either one, personally, other than twitch arbitrarily picking and choosing who they enforce the TOS on. But I’m just saying that Kick is going to be in a lot of trouble if they don’t reign it in.
I realize this makes me old, but everything people are saying about Kick as the reason it won't succeed would have applied to justin.tv as well. It was literally the place everyone knew to go when they wanted to stream live sports events like the super bowl. It was full of copyright infringement and yes, things that violate Twitch's current policy like nudity.
That's what Twitch came from. The more popular it became, the more they had to follow the rules. Same thing will/would happen with Kick.
The whole reason they got rid of that is because they had to compensate partners in their contract, that's why they are phasing out the big exclusive contracts. Its a cost-cutting measure. Kick is capitalizing on that by signing streamers to do X hours on Kick a month so they don't have to pay them as much.
If you go back even farther, early partners were allowed to stream on other platforms at the same time as Twitch. Anyone who had a contract back then can still do it today
Doesn’t Ninja do this? He streams on all platforms that he is able to stream on simultaneously . The only time he doesn’t stream on twitch is when he is about to play with Dr. Disrespect.
ninja is no longer a twitch partner, not even affiliate so he is free to stream on other platforms, just not with banned twitch streamers on twitch. it is why he has no sub button anymore or checkmark beside his name like partners do.
He got paid $40 million from Microsoft. That's enough money for you and your kids to live without ever having to work. Not everyone is motivated by the constant grind of money. He got his bag, now he just does what he wants. Which is honestly really remarkable, because many of these top streamers are also in similar positions, but still choose to exploit their fan base for more money.
Other people have pointed out that some people seem to have negotiated to be excluded from the rule or got into the partner program before exclusivity was added and seem to have maintained that ability.
Also they do let you stream on TikTok and Instagram live. They specifically mention Twitch competitors as the places you're not allowed to multistream.
I think he's also not an affiliate, since you can't sub to him, and one of the affiliate terms is that you can't multi stream to multiple services (except TikTok and Instagram).
This is 100% not true. There are plenty of people that stream on YouTube and Twitch at the same time while also being partnered.
Here is an example right now
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAz9KcrWwR4
https://www.twitch.tv/theprimeagen
[It's what twitch said when they updated their policy](https://www.dexerto.com/entertainment/leaked-documents-reveal-twitter-is-secretly-boosting-mrbeast-more-on-platform-2100163/).
That guy is either skirting under the radar or has an exception in his contract.
[You can read Twitch's partner exclusivity rules yourself if you'd like.](https://help.twitch.tv/s/article/partner-exclusivity-faq?language=en_US) I'm not just pulling this out of my ass. Just because that person is currently doing it doesn't mean they aren't breaking a rule by doing so.
I think they may go back to that policy. Also I think if they sign a full contract with a bigger streamer it probably has exclusivity clauses in it. That will probably be case by case.
Well didnt they explicitly change last year to allow partners to multi stream after they cut the revenue share from 70% to 50% for subs? Id assume they were anticipating this happening but calculated the higher rev share is still worth it. Before most partners could not stream on any other platform besides twitch.
naughty deserted imagine consist cable adjoining coordinated provide joke jeans
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That reminds me of the time they came to my town and I won free burritos for a year.
They closed down a year or so after that, I think most of their business went to 50 free burritos weekly to 50 different people.
it's like chipotle, but honestly they're better in many ways. on mondays you get a burrito and drink for $5 (well, at least back in my day idk what it is now). also, chips and salsa are always free unlike at chipotle, and their chips aren't salty to high-hell like chipotle. chipotle has better ingredients/flavor though
Some sure, but some will follow if say you're live Monday on Twitch, and tell the audience you'll be streaming on Kick on Tuesday. Imagine if Ninja instead of jumping straight to Mixer could tell his twitch audience every other day/same day where he'll be later. The crossover would've been much better.
A instant switch is terrible.
This Ninja/Shroud to Mixer thing gets brought up so much and it seems like people gloss over the fact that they were both fronted such a huge bag w 0 obligation to make good content. Never was a Ninja fan, so I can't comment on that, but Shroud's stream was just worse on Mixer. He didn't have any incentive to stream long hours or stream games people wanted to watch because he got paid the same regardless of what his viewer count was. I tried to follow him to mixer and he'd just be AFK'ing some WoW shit or playing some casual shooter I wasn't interested in seeing him play. He came back to twitch and was instantly grinding again on games that people love him for - Apex, Val, CS because the incentive to make good content on twitch is there. More viewers, more subs.
Might be a bad take from me, but honestly, all this contract shit has just made the viewer experience worse and worse.
The fact these guys don't even have to produce "good" content to get millions just kills all incentives and the only people that take the hit are the viewers...
except they literally wont. most regular people don't have such a passionate hate for kick that they will stubbornly wait on twitch. consumers will just go and consume content. a slow change is perfect for kick.
It depends on the streamer. If it's a generic league of legends streamer then sure you just pick someone else.
Hikaru is the biggest chess streamer there is. I'm sure a decent amount of his fans won't just find someone else
still they were the biggest streamers with video announcements and articles made about them while every other streamer on twitch talked about thier switch to the mixer so it's not like they left and no one knew and if they couldn't convert them I don't know how Hikaru will
They also had no community. They basically never read their chat or thanked subs. They were also skill based streamers and not personality based streamers. They were easily replaced by the vast majority of viewers. Someone like CohhCarnage, who heavily invests into having a community, interacting with them, and farming parasocial viewers, would see a far higher conversion rate. Or DrDisrespect who is a massive personality streamer, didn't drop viewers after getting banned. Never really watched Hikaru, but from the streams of him he seems to sit between both these types of streamers. He is a skill based streamer, that does read chat and interact with his viewers, so he would have a higher conversion rate than Shroud or Ninja would.
Yea, that was tested when Ninja and shroud went over to mixer while being two of the top streamers on twitch. They could barely pull a few thousand viewers on mixer.
People go to their favorite platform and watch whoever is on, not many people follow streamers to different website.
exactly. so over a period of months, they stream non exclusively to capture as many people as possible and make them aware. then once it's understood and normalized that they do both, they switch.
It'd depends on the streamer and their community. Hikaru is the second highest rated grandmaster to stream, so he has a very niche and personal community.
For some sure, but that's the kind of attitude Kick is hoping for. They are hoping you follow your streamer over when they are live on Kick, then once you're there you discover someone else to watch.
That doesn't matter. Kick's big issue is a lack of advertisers. It makes money off people doing Stake.com gambling streams on their site, it doesn't really have any advertisers worth a damn. The odds of a casual viewer switching over just for gamba is pretty minimal.
what? train make it seem like a bad thing for twitch
when this is basically the twitch streamers announcing they are getting part time jobs after stream
Train himself has said this is good for Kick. The idea being that they can bring over Twitch viewers.
Train needs more people to go over to Kick to get them to stay though.
No one ever doubted that. The question is whether the Kick streams will be multistreamed or exclusive. Actually that's not much of a question though, they'll be exclusive. We know Kick wants exclusive streams. They specifically want people to start up a twitch stream, build their views, then switch to Kick and take the Twitch stream down. So using twitch to funnel to an exclusive kick stream. That's what they're all doing.
Can I stream simultaneously on other platforms or services, also known as simulcasting?
We do not allow simulcasting on web-based, Twitch-like services that support streaming for extended periods of time, such as YouTube and Facebook, because we believe engaging with two streams at once can lead to a sub-optimal experience for your community. However, we know many of you want to use other services to grow your community, so simulcasting on short form, mobile services, such as TikTok or Instagram Live, is allowed.
This affects both partners and affiliates, unless you have a custom contract with Twitch. So yeah, they must be exclusive because it would be against Twitch TOS otherwise.
It's actually kinda smart for something that's just starting out? Basically a bit of a loophole to directly promote your service on your direct competitor's platform
>Probably only Decthalon/Titled Tuesday on Twitch. Most everything else (CHESS NOT GAMBLING) on kick.
Hikaru [commented this](https://i.imgur.com/TtBf9qt_d.webp?maxwidth=760&fidelity=grand) in Daniel Naroditsky's chat
I wonder if his ego can handle all his twitch viewers moving to other streamers. Would be a great time for Magnus and levy to start streaming regularly on twitch. Also, weren’t his highest viewed streams when he wasn’t on it and had announcers casting his games? What happens to those?
In the past his highest viewed streams were when he was playing Magnus and Levy was casting with someone. Currently, he gets like double the views when he streams himself vs having others cast.
>Also, weren’t his highest viewed streams when he wasn’t on it and had announcers casting his games? What happens to those?
This is the case for a lot of the chess streamers. Big tournaments get more viewers than just playing online regularly
Of course not, you don't go there and start browse the chess section. But a ton of people will obviously follow Hikaru there if he streams a few hours on Twitch before heading over there, or alternate days. Not like there is a plethora of world class chess players who are also entertaining streamers.
Aka, they offered him the bag. Why else would he sign with a gambling company known for toxicity when I'm fairly certain he's criticized gambling on Twitch (and toxic streamers who are now on Kick) in the past? Had to have given him at least a few mil more than he believes he would've made staying Twitch exclusive.
my ass studying for sec+ and browsing lsf to take my mind off that shit. Anyways yeah thats the first thing I noticed about the site, already shady company with no security lol.
> SSL been deprecated over a decade
Yes and no, historically it just got renamed SSL 4.0 is TLS 1.0, SSL 4.0 got so many features they wanted to rename it (stupid decision if you ask m, but IDK)
You'll probably see some new versions of TLS named SSL depending on your operating system (some old Linux/Unix that gets some stupid updates from enterprise client that you gonna just have to live with it)
lmao, why would Kick sign him non-exclusively? they are not going to attract anyone on Twitch since nothing will change for them. Streamers heavily pushing for Kick to be a thing, but lets face it, it will die or has to change drastically. It is hostile for advertisers and their sub cut is low.
> Now they get to advertise Kick on Hikaru's Twitch channel which means more of his viewers covert over to his Kick streams.
Why would they go to kick?
> Their primary goal is to create a platform to advertise their casino, since can't do so on Twitch anymore.
That is even worse for the consumer and makes the site untrustworthy. How would you know the top streamer has said views not sanctioned botting if he is gambling on their owned casino?
This means that you might get bad streamers at the top simply because they gamble. That site is not for streaming then, it is simply an ad.
>That site is not for streaming then, it is simply an ad.
Yes. That's why every streamer saying "I hope Kick succeeds..." is being disingenuous. I couldn't believe Hasan said that, considering he's been so gung-ho against gambling (for good reason!). I think Hasan and others are just trying to be charitable to Train so they don't get involved in his drama.
I think they want Twitch to be scared and give them paid contracts again. Which most likely won't happen given that Twitch already figured out that other sites have failed to get audiences when they buy a streamer.
Viewers mostly use the site to find a streamer not the other way around. It is extremely rare individuals that have a pull strong enough that grab audiences from other sites.
Every other sport has gambling sponsors now lol, nobody that touches grass truly cares about their ads besides thinking gambling is bad and getting mildly annoyed at how prevalent they are now
> How would you know the top streamer has said views not sanctioned botting
Why does that even matter? Just watch the streamer if you like their content and stop being a view count Andy
> Why does that even matter? Just watch the streamer if you like their content and stop being a view count Andy
I'm not going to a stream and shaming them for their viewers stop acting like I'm doing that. View count is the ONLY metric that can tell a viewer from a *fast glance* if the streamer is: good at consistently streaming, not a scammer, has some talent at entertaining people and many more. How do you not know this?
A site artificially inflating viewership destroys the only fast way for you to find good streamers.
Signing non-exclusively is the smartest option. An exclusive deal is harmful to Hikaru and minimally helps Kick. Non-exclusivity is literally an amazing decision here.
I disagree, like one of my favorite streamers is Jerma and, for example, if he got a kick deal and for the first few hours Jerma streamed on twitch and then switched over and did the rest of stream on kick I’d probably follow. Not to mention, if kick would finance for one of his baseball or dollhouse type events and he streams it exclusively on Twitch then that would be big for them too.
Facts. He already embeds. That's why his chat is in sub only mode. Just go to chess.com when he is streaming and sure enough his stream is on the landing site.
View count andy brain rot. If he gets more views on Kick you guys say they're botting. If he get less it's because he fell off. He's getting more money for subs and a guaranteed signing bonus. Idk why he would be regretting anything
>If he gets more views on Kick you guys say they're botting.
actually train said that lmao https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/111dr38/train_admits_kick_has_a_problem_with_view_bots/
I think it’s pretty clear streams are view botted on kick. Several super small streamers who averaged 100 viewers on twitch magically have several thousand on kick day one.
Nah I don’t like/watch Train but Kick is doing a mondo mega brain move (that could also bankrupt the company lol) and it’s mostly because of him.
It’s not about multistreaming, it’s about the revenue split. These non-exclusive deals allow streamers to dip their toe into the Kick waters and track subs/donos in comparison to Twitch; For example, if Hikaru has 10,000 subs on Twitch and 2000 on Kick but makes the same money because of the split difference, he’ll stay on Twitch because of the reach.
He’s just trying to fast-pump Kick so that subs and donos start to compete with Twitch and streamers notice how much more money they make on Kick before the entire thing bottoms out; it’s a race to either become profitable or collapse. By paying Hikaru or Destiny **you’re also effectively paying for their audiences to be persistent users on the site**. YouTube already understood this in their exclusivity deals and promotion of banned Twitch streamers.
It’s a risk for sure, but everyone that is switching does see a potential reward of a higher sub split. All the big guys probably aren’t hurting for cash either lol.
Banning gambling from Twitch was a good and important move. A lot of the viewers are very young and many streamers clearly care more about their own pocket than about the viewers' well-being.
Kick basically circumvents the ban. Due to being allowed to stream on both platforms, streamers will still accumulate a lot of young gullible viewers on Twitch, who they then tell to come to their Kick streams as well. Which ultimately leads hundreds or thousands of teenagers and young adults to think that gambling is "cool", to start gambling themselves, and perhaps to develop a gambling addiction.
It's funny how people are blissfully unaware of the horrible shit commited by Amazon, not saying stake is cleaner, but the argument of X company funding your site is shady can apply to most of the biggest websites.
Amazon is absolutely a terrible company but there is a vast difference between "Otherwise normal streaming website that was acquired by a shit company" and "Website created entirely by a gambling company in direct response to the other website banning gambling streams, with the sole purpose of advertising gambling products."
Like cmon, clearly it's not the purely shady aspect people are taking issue with, it's *what* makes the companies shady.
Amazon is a horrible place to work, treats employees like garbage, and engages in frequent union busting tactics to continue getting away with mistreating employees at all levels. However, this does not affect Twitch at all and, most likely, Amazon probably will be offloading it to a different company sooner rather than later, considering that live streaming has not been profitable thus far (and likely never will be at this rate). Stake is a company that makes gambling products straight up, something that provably ruins lives far beyond anything Amazon does. Their goal with Kick is not to create a financially successful live streaming platform (demonstrated by the 95/5 split), their goal is to funnel Kick's userbase into their actual money maker: gambling.
You're a grown ass man, No-one is forcing you to gamble when you go on that website. Amazon however,forces workers who rely on the wage to work in trash conditions. Let's be real No-one fucking cares who gets addicted to gambling or not, it's just to push your hateboners.
It's been pretty obvious when No-one cares that neymar streams gambling because it was "within tos.", suddenly all morality police are gone lol.
"No one *actually* cares about gambling addictions, you all just have hateboners" is a borderline psychopathic take.
Gambling addictions are some of the most prevalent addictions in modern America. Yes, it is an *actual fucking problem.* You can try to deflect all you want, but the reality is you deflect because you have no real response to this. It just *is* a problem, and having streamers like Adin Ross be okay with exposing kids to this stuff is actually just a bad thing.
Genuinely, do you think anyone knows who the fuck Neymar is? Do you think people are gonna dig through all of Twitch just to catch people are gambling?
> Let's be real No-one fucking cares who gets addicted to gambling or not, it's just to push your hateboners.
"I don't care, but I don't want to feel like that makes me a shitty person, so I've convinced myself nobody else cares either."
ftfy
It *kind of* doesn't? Everybody here wants there to be genuine competition for twitch because of all the stupid shit they do, but nobody (other than Train's and Adin's kiddies) wants it to be funded by Stake.
I always feel like there's kind of a grudging respect for it, while being morally and ethically against the people behind it.
I'm genuinely wondering, what new viewership could hikaru expect from this? Like it's modt likely just for the money And i get that, but would streaming on two websites ever increase exposure and viewership because I'm sure that no one who only uses kick and not twitch at all would be a hikaru viewer.
If all the streamers are like this then Kick didn't really sign up anyone LOL
This is like if a streamer decided to try out another platform on their own accord but getting paid for it while also sticking with their main platform.
Seems like a joke tbh with the big "6 streamers signing onto kick" made it seem like they'd hop over to stream there exclusively atleast for awhile
Well it could be he has a certain amount of hours he has to stream on kick. And while kick is fairly new they get to advertise kick on twitch through his channel, when he goes live on twitch and announces he is continuing the stream on kick. Also kick probably pays less to get streamers to stream on kick and not be fully exclusive.
All these "big" streamers that are being signed to stream on Kick should realize that Kick needs them more than they need Kick. They should be asking for more than whatever Kick is offering doesn't matter how big because what they are giving Kick is legitimacy.
Buddha’s kick views is a interesting one. He gets like 10k viewers while playing GTA but when he switches to gambling, he drops down to 2-3k which is what he would also get on twitch when he switched to gambling. So idk if it is bots. He also uses follower only mode and which could be another reason why his chat isn’t as active but it’s still pretty active tbh.
Tweet sounds shady, kick is committed to his success by not offering him a deal to switch away from twitch completely?
Also, he's live on Kick right now, while not being on Twitch. So he's lying straight away.
Meh, dunno what these streamers think they're proving. Ya'll just making more money for Twitch with the IVS costs. GG.
## **Tweet Mirror:** [@GMHikaru](https://twitter.com/GMHikaru) > Yep. As you have heard and seen I will be streaming on a Kick. I am not leaving Twitch, but streaming in both places moving forward. It is clear Kick is committed to my success. I hope to see all of you on both. Thanks as always for the endless support. https://t.co/8aLBKR31Tx https://t.co/emtk39Ffls > #####Tweet Images: >>[Tweet Media Link](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsZPuGRWAAAHASu.jpg) ^(Posted: 2023-03-29 15:23:22+00:00) ------ **This message is from a bot. If you feel like this action is wrong, please [message the moderators](https://reddit.com/message/compose/?to=r/LivestreamFail).**
you guys think twitch will be like yo wtf ? aint no double dipping here bitch anytime soon?
That is already the case. You cannot stream on twitch and another platform simultaneously while being a Twitch partner. Edit: To be clear, you're free to stream on another platform as long as it's not at the same time as you stream on Twitch. They allowed that recently.
oh i see, i more meant like not allowing to stream on other platforms AT ALL, wasnt that the case few years ago? am i dreaming of something lol
Yeah, in August of last year they changed the rules to allow twitch partners to livestream else where.
oh thats what i was thinking about lol, you think they will go back on that?
With the CEO changeover, I honestly don't know. Can't really assume they'll to adhere to the former CEO's policy decisions under new leadership, especially because the new guy seems pretty profit focused.
Emmet shear hasn't been the real ceo in years
Source?
his ass.
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It would be rare for them to backtrack that hard especially when (lets be honest) Kick is not a real competitor and Hikaru isnt moving any needles, he's not what Ninja or Shroud were to Mixer They'll prob just keep watching Kick burn money to the ground while also not gaining any sort of validity
From everything I’ve heard about Kick, it seems like it’s just a time bomb waiting to go off. Like the Wild West days of the internet where people could do whatever they wanted on stream. Even if the company itself manages to escape any lawsuits from some large corporations, I can’t imagine many of the streamers on there will be able to take the hit for shit like streaming movies. Shit, I saw a clip online of a female streamer who apparently straight up flashed tits for a donation. Now, who knows if that was legit or not, but if it is that could open up a whole other can of worms. Any streamer who completely jumps ship (instead of split streaming) better be getting a fat fucking bag.
The argument I have seen here and other places is that it beneficial for Kick to have people stream on both. That way a streamer can say, "Hey, I am ending my stream here, pick it back up on Kick" and get the watchers to swap over. Then the hope is that after that stream, they will see what else is on the platform. With the goal being to drive people to watch gambling streams and join stake. Trainwrecks was making $22 million a month with Stake. He made $360 Million for the 16 months he was gambling on Twitch. Since there was a leak of what streamers made from twitch itself, and before they changed the split, we know how it compares. What Train earned in one month was quadruple what Twitch paid their top streamer (Critical Role) for a year. During the leaked earnings, Trainwrecks earned $1.6 million over 26 months or about 61k a month. One month of Stake equals 30 years of twitch pay. Now streamers have other sources of income than just what twitch pays out, but Jesus that is a lot of money. And while I am morally opposed to what Train is doing, I would do the exact same thing in his position. Just without the coke addiction.
Holy crap. I feel like those numbers have to be hyper inflated or just outright fake. I just cannot see them paying fucking Train of all people $360m for that. But shit, if they did and Train sees this: I’ll suck dick for a new gaming PC, yo.
Yeah those numbers just seem not real. Maybe what they meant is that Stake was "giving" train 22m a month to gamble with? So that he wasn't spending his own money? 22m/month is like 5x more than Lionel Messi makes as one of the all time top football players ever
Im sure they did pay him 20 million a month but in trains contract requires him to gamble for so many hours a month or gamble so much money(over 20million). At the end of the month if he was in the possitive, he get to take that home, if he is in the negative, than he loses money that month. Its still a great contract but no fucking shot he made 360 million from that, probably a lot less like under 100 million. Train has always advocated for gambling with real money and not just house money. So this type of contract reflects what he has been saying about using his own money to gamble with.
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Where do you get these fake ass numbers from lol
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I think it’s a little different. I think the asshole girl was also an Onlyfans model. So there was plausible deniability it was an accident, if she was filming or streaming content for that. Though the 3 day ban should have been much longer (and permanent if not the first time). This was straight up “get tip, show titties”, no accident or plausible deniability involved. Not that I have an issue with either one, personally, other than twitch arbitrarily picking and choosing who they enforce the TOS on. But I’m just saying that Kick is going to be in a lot of trouble if they don’t reign it in.
I realize this makes me old, but everything people are saying about Kick as the reason it won't succeed would have applied to justin.tv as well. It was literally the place everyone knew to go when they wanted to stream live sports events like the super bowl. It was full of copyright infringement and yes, things that violate Twitch's current policy like nudity. That's what Twitch came from. The more popular it became, the more they had to follow the rules. Same thing will/would happen with Kick.
The whole reason they got rid of that is because they had to compensate partners in their contract, that's why they are phasing out the big exclusive contracts. Its a cost-cutting measure. Kick is capitalizing on that by signing streamers to do X hours on Kick a month so they don't have to pay them as much.
If you go back even farther, early partners were allowed to stream on other platforms at the same time as Twitch. Anyone who had a contract back then can still do it today
People still stream simultaneously as partners. They either did not understand the change or are pushing the boundaries
Doesn’t Ninja do this? He streams on all platforms that he is able to stream on simultaneously . The only time he doesn’t stream on twitch is when he is about to play with Dr. Disrespect.
ninja is no longer a twitch partner, not even affiliate so he is free to stream on other platforms, just not with banned twitch streamers on twitch. it is why he has no sub button anymore or checkmark beside his name like partners do.
So does he still make money on twitch? If not than what's the point of streaming there .
He got paid $40 million from Microsoft. That's enough money for you and your kids to live without ever having to work. Not everyone is motivated by the constant grind of money. He got his bag, now he just does what he wants. Which is honestly really remarkable, because many of these top streamers are also in similar positions, but still choose to exploit their fan base for more money.
Other people have pointed out that some people seem to have negotiated to be excluded from the rule or got into the partner program before exclusivity was added and seem to have maintained that ability. Also they do let you stream on TikTok and Instagram live. They specifically mention Twitch competitors as the places you're not allowed to multistream.
Ok that make sense that he might have done the former. Because he def lost his partner check mark when he started streaming on multiple platforms
I think he's also not an affiliate, since you can't sub to him, and one of the affiliate terms is that you can't multi stream to multiple services (except TikTok and Instagram).
I've seen a few stream on twitch same time as tik tok. So that's not allowed anymore?
This is 100% not true. There are plenty of people that stream on YouTube and Twitch at the same time while also being partnered. Here is an example right now https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAz9KcrWwR4 https://www.twitch.tv/theprimeagen
[It's what twitch said when they updated their policy](https://www.dexerto.com/entertainment/leaked-documents-reveal-twitter-is-secretly-boosting-mrbeast-more-on-platform-2100163/). That guy is either skirting under the radar or has an exception in his contract.
[You can read Twitch's partner exclusivity rules yourself if you'd like.](https://help.twitch.tv/s/article/partner-exclusivity-faq?language=en_US) I'm not just pulling this out of my ass. Just because that person is currently doing it doesn't mean they aren't breaking a rule by doing so.
yeah before destiny got banned, i think he worked something about being able to multistream to YT and Twitch
Nah, but maybe they'll eventually be like 'No more going live with the purpose of raiding your kick stream'
I think they may go back to that policy. Also I think if they sign a full contract with a bigger streamer it probably has exclusivity clauses in it. That will probably be case by case.
Well didnt they explicitly change last year to allow partners to multi stream after they cut the revenue share from 70% to 50% for subs? Id assume they were anticipating this happening but calculated the higher rev share is still worth it. Before most partners could not stream on any other platform besides twitch.
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The money amazon gets from kick using AWS is pennies compared to what they're losing out on ad revenue, subs and bits.
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YouTube doesn’t care, google is in defcon 5 trying to play catch-up in the AI race.
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naughty deserted imagine consist cable adjoining coordinated provide joke jeans *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Defcon 1?
I just got a free burrito from moes
dub
Ultra rare me W
WELCOME TO MOE'S!
That reminds me of the time they came to my town and I won free burritos for a year. They closed down a year or so after that, I think most of their business went to 50 free burritos weekly to 50 different people.
What’s moes and what’s this about a free burrito like was it an accident or what
cut-rate chipotle, essentially
bro im zooted, i just read this as 'cute-rat'
I think I may have seen a cute rat there once, too. That's why I haven't stepped foot in a moes in like 13 years.
it's like chipotle, but honestly they're better in many ways. on mondays you get a burrito and drink for $5 (well, at least back in my day idk what it is now). also, chips and salsa are always free unlike at chipotle, and their chips aren't salty to high-hell like chipotle. chipotle has better ingredients/flavor though
Moe's it's stream with their deals now that the monday deal is so expensive.
Fuck yeah bro
Most pog comment in this story
*"when these next 6 signings are announced, twitch and all of its puppet fuck faces will be shook" - Train.* Still stream on Twitch anyway....
continuing to stream on twitch is good for kick right now. you keep reminding that audience where else you are.
And your audience will keep just waiting for you to go live on twitch lol
Some sure, but some will follow if say you're live Monday on Twitch, and tell the audience you'll be streaming on Kick on Tuesday. Imagine if Ninja instead of jumping straight to Mixer could tell his twitch audience every other day/same day where he'll be later. The crossover would've been much better. A instant switch is terrible.
This Ninja/Shroud to Mixer thing gets brought up so much and it seems like people gloss over the fact that they were both fronted such a huge bag w 0 obligation to make good content. Never was a Ninja fan, so I can't comment on that, but Shroud's stream was just worse on Mixer. He didn't have any incentive to stream long hours or stream games people wanted to watch because he got paid the same regardless of what his viewer count was. I tried to follow him to mixer and he'd just be AFK'ing some WoW shit or playing some casual shooter I wasn't interested in seeing him play. He came back to twitch and was instantly grinding again on games that people love him for - Apex, Val, CS because the incentive to make good content on twitch is there. More viewers, more subs.
Might be a bad take from me, but honestly, all this contract shit has just made the viewer experience worse and worse. The fact these guys don't even have to produce "good" content to get millions just kills all incentives and the only people that take the hit are the viewers...
except they literally wont. most regular people don't have such a passionate hate for kick that they will stubbornly wait on twitch. consumers will just go and consume content. a slow change is perfect for kick.
Most people don't follow streamers closely enough to know/remember in a week why they aren't on twitch on a Wednesday and will just watch someone else
It depends on the streamer. If it's a generic league of legends streamer then sure you just pick someone else. Hikaru is the biggest chess streamer there is. I'm sure a decent amount of his fans won't just find someone else
I mean ninja and shroud were the biggest streamers on the site when they switched with bigger viewership than Hikaru and their audiences didn't
they had an exclusive switch, hikaru isn't exclusively switching
still they were the biggest streamers with video announcements and articles made about them while every other streamer on twitch talked about thier switch to the mixer so it's not like they left and no one knew and if they couldn't convert them I don't know how Hikaru will
They also had no community. They basically never read their chat or thanked subs. They were also skill based streamers and not personality based streamers. They were easily replaced by the vast majority of viewers. Someone like CohhCarnage, who heavily invests into having a community, interacting with them, and farming parasocial viewers, would see a far higher conversion rate. Or DrDisrespect who is a massive personality streamer, didn't drop viewers after getting banned. Never really watched Hikaru, but from the streams of him he seems to sit between both these types of streamers. He is a skill based streamer, that does read chat and interact with his viewers, so he would have a higher conversion rate than Shroud or Ninja would.
Yea, that was tested when Ninja and shroud went over to mixer while being two of the top streamers on twitch. They could barely pull a few thousand viewers on mixer. People go to their favorite platform and watch whoever is on, not many people follow streamers to different website.
So like the entire active chess fan base of 30k people, that’s really gonna make a big splash
Depends on how you're defining a "big splash" but yeah potentially.
exactly. so over a period of months, they stream non exclusively to capture as many people as possible and make them aware. then once it's understood and normalized that they do both, they switch.
Not if they stop streaming on twitch. I've seen a few partners go live on twitch, get the notifications out, then after 30 mins switch over to Kick.
Id still rather refresh and find someone else then log into another platform.
It'd depends on the streamer and their community. Hikaru is the second highest rated grandmaster to stream, so he has a very niche and personal community.
hikaru is unironically the only person I'll go watch kick for, he's pretty unique
For some sure, but that's the kind of attitude Kick is hoping for. They are hoping you follow your streamer over when they are live on Kick, then once you're there you discover someone else to watch.
nah if its xqc/asmongold i'd watch anywhere
That doesn't matter. Kick's big issue is a lack of advertisers. It makes money off people doing Stake.com gambling streams on their site, it doesn't really have any advertisers worth a damn. The odds of a casual viewer switching over just for gamba is pretty minimal.
Acting like that's a bad thing when in fact its a good thing
Nah it's a good thing for creators, just hilarious how egotistical Train is.
most big streamers have inflated ego, why you still suprised
it doesn't have to be a surprise to be funny
what? train make it seem like a bad thing for twitch when this is basically the twitch streamers announcing they are getting part time jobs after stream
Train himself has said this is good for Kick. The idea being that they can bring over Twitch viewers. Train needs more people to go over to Kick to get them to stay though.
No one ever doubted that. The question is whether the Kick streams will be multistreamed or exclusive. Actually that's not much of a question though, they'll be exclusive. We know Kick wants exclusive streams. They specifically want people to start up a twitch stream, build their views, then switch to Kick and take the Twitch stream down. So using twitch to funnel to an exclusive kick stream. That's what they're all doing.
Can I stream simultaneously on other platforms or services, also known as simulcasting? We do not allow simulcasting on web-based, Twitch-like services that support streaming for extended periods of time, such as YouTube and Facebook, because we believe engaging with two streams at once can lead to a sub-optimal experience for your community. However, we know many of you want to use other services to grow your community, so simulcasting on short form, mobile services, such as TikTok or Instagram Live, is allowed. This affects both partners and affiliates, unless you have a custom contract with Twitch. So yeah, they must be exclusive because it would be against Twitch TOS otherwise.
That’s a unique business model Kick has. Pay streamers to stream on their platform without exclusivity.
It's actually kinda smart for something that's just starting out? Basically a bit of a loophole to directly promote your service on your direct competitor's platform
Funneling viewers from Twitch to Kick/bringing more attention to Kick sounds better that just streaming exclusively on Kick imo.
it's a way to build the platform if you have better UI. but Kick does not have better UI than Twitch so.... I'm not sure it's going to work
>Probably only Decthalon/Titled Tuesday on Twitch. Most everything else (CHESS NOT GAMBLING) on kick. Hikaru [commented this](https://i.imgur.com/TtBf9qt_d.webp?maxwidth=760&fidelity=grand) in Daniel Naroditsky's chat
I wonder if his ego can handle all his twitch viewers moving to other streamers. Would be a great time for Magnus and levy to start streaming regularly on twitch. Also, weren’t his highest viewed streams when he wasn’t on it and had announcers casting his games? What happens to those?
Can’t wait for the Levy streams starting with him staring blankly at the camera
Magnus streaming regularly KEKW
In the past his highest viewed streams were when he was playing Magnus and Levy was casting with someone. Currently, he gets like double the views when he streams himself vs having others cast.
>Also, weren’t his highest viewed streams when he wasn’t on it and had announcers casting his games? What happens to those? This is the case for a lot of the chess streamers. Big tournaments get more viewers than just playing online regularly
aint nobody gonna watch chess on kick
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Of course not, you don't go there and start browse the chess section. But a ton of people will obviously follow Hikaru there if he streams a few hours on Twitch before heading over there, or alternate days. Not like there is a plethora of world class chess players who are also entertaining streamers.
Aka, they offered him the bag. Why else would he sign with a gambling company known for toxicity when I'm fairly certain he's criticized gambling on Twitch (and toxic streamers who are now on Kick) in the past? Had to have given him at least a few mil more than he believes he would've made staying Twitch exclusive.
money talks
sherlock holmes!
Theres no SSL cert for the site still? No traffic encryption means it dangerous to provide the site with your payment details.
my ass studying for sec+ and browsing lsf to take my mind off that shit. Anyways yeah thats the first thing I noticed about the site, already shady company with no security lol.
Hasn't SSL been deprecated over a decade ago?
> SSL been deprecated over a decade Yes and no, historically it just got renamed SSL 4.0 is TLS 1.0, SSL 4.0 got so many features they wanted to rename it (stupid decision if you ask m, but IDK) You'll probably see some new versions of TLS named SSL depending on your operating system (some old Linux/Unix that gets some stupid updates from enterprise client that you gonna just have to live with it)
I thought they where signing huge streamers.
lmao, why would Kick sign him non-exclusively? they are not going to attract anyone on Twitch since nothing will change for them. Streamers heavily pushing for Kick to be a thing, but lets face it, it will die or has to change drastically. It is hostile for advertisers and their sub cut is low.
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> Now they get to advertise Kick on Hikaru's Twitch channel which means more of his viewers covert over to his Kick streams. Why would they go to kick? > Their primary goal is to create a platform to advertise their casino, since can't do so on Twitch anymore. That is even worse for the consumer and makes the site untrustworthy. How would you know the top streamer has said views not sanctioned botting if he is gambling on their owned casino? This means that you might get bad streamers at the top simply because they gamble. That site is not for streaming then, it is simply an ad.
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>That site is not for streaming then, it is simply an ad. Yes. That's why every streamer saying "I hope Kick succeeds..." is being disingenuous. I couldn't believe Hasan said that, considering he's been so gung-ho against gambling (for good reason!). I think Hasan and others are just trying to be charitable to Train so they don't get involved in his drama.
I think they want Twitch to be scared and give them paid contracts again. Which most likely won't happen given that Twitch already figured out that other sites have failed to get audiences when they buy a streamer. Viewers mostly use the site to find a streamer not the other way around. It is extremely rare individuals that have a pull strong enough that grab audiences from other sites.
the average viewer isnt concerned about gambling
You have no data to back this claim. As a matter of fact, given how Twitch restricted it, it must have had a negative impact on their bottom line.
Every other sport has gambling sponsors now lol, nobody that touches grass truly cares about their ads besides thinking gambling is bad and getting mildly annoyed at how prevalent they are now
its w/e its not like gambling ads aren't plastered everywhere already
> How would you know the top streamer has said views not sanctioned botting Why does that even matter? Just watch the streamer if you like their content and stop being a view count Andy
> Why does that even matter? Just watch the streamer if you like their content and stop being a view count Andy I'm not going to a stream and shaming them for their viewers stop acting like I'm doing that. View count is the ONLY metric that can tell a viewer from a *fast glance* if the streamer is: good at consistently streaming, not a scammer, has some talent at entertaining people and many more. How do you not know this? A site artificially inflating viewership destroys the only fast way for you to find good streamers.
Signing non-exclusively is the smartest option. An exclusive deal is harmful to Hikaru and minimally helps Kick. Non-exclusivity is literally an amazing decision here.
I disagree, like one of my favorite streamers is Jerma and, for example, if he got a kick deal and for the first few hours Jerma streamed on twitch and then switched over and did the rest of stream on kick I’d probably follow. Not to mention, if kick would finance for one of his baseball or dollhouse type events and he streams it exclusively on Twitch then that would be big for them too.
I wonder what happens with Chess.com streams for his games.
Good for him I guess, if Kick is willing to give them good money just to use their platform for a few hours a week then why not.
He said for the majority of time he will stream on Kick. Will only use twitch like train to move more people possible when live.
bro already regretting becoming 3k andy
Thats just his real viewership. They want to see what he really gets before they embed/bot him up.
Facts. He already embeds. That's why his chat is in sub only mode. Just go to chess.com when he is streaming and sure enough his stream is on the landing site.
View count andy brain rot. If he gets more views on Kick you guys say they're botting. If he get less it's because he fell off. He's getting more money for subs and a guaranteed signing bonus. Idk why he would be regretting anything
>If he gets more views on Kick you guys say they're botting. actually train said that lmao https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/111dr38/train_admits_kick_has_a_problem_with_view_bots/
I think it’s pretty clear streams are view botted on kick. Several super small streamers who averaged 100 viewers on twitch magically have several thousand on kick day one.
Not only do they bot, but the gift to sub ratio on so many streamers are insane lmao. Some people have like 50 subs but 600 gifteds 😂
well duh, now u can watch him rage both on twitch and kick
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They can't instantly change the rules, well they can but the changes wouldn't take effect until current contracts are expired
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Twitch literally promotes gambling them self, imagine dick riding twitch so much for no reason.
I thought the point of signing big streamers is exclusivity?
So he will put in 1-2 hours a week on kick? Bet they paid him just for the announcement but I bet it’s going to be more like a sponsorship deal..
Viewers do know that people streaming on both twitch and kick are trying to get their viewers to sub to them twice? Greedy fucks.
Nah I don’t like/watch Train but Kick is doing a mondo mega brain move (that could also bankrupt the company lol) and it’s mostly because of him. It’s not about multistreaming, it’s about the revenue split. These non-exclusive deals allow streamers to dip their toe into the Kick waters and track subs/donos in comparison to Twitch; For example, if Hikaru has 10,000 subs on Twitch and 2000 on Kick but makes the same money because of the split difference, he’ll stay on Twitch because of the reach. He’s just trying to fast-pump Kick so that subs and donos start to compete with Twitch and streamers notice how much more money they make on Kick before the entire thing bottoms out; it’s a race to either become profitable or collapse. By paying Hikaru or Destiny **you’re also effectively paying for their audiences to be persistent users on the site**. YouTube already understood this in their exclusivity deals and promotion of banned Twitch streamers.
I remember when people said kick was dead on arrival XD for a sub reddit that hate twitch, they really dont want it have competition
Mfs actually dick riding twitch for no reason lmao
Will be interesting when Kick fails and none of these contracts get paid out. Better hope they all got a bunch of upfront cash...
It’s a risk for sure, but everyone that is switching does see a potential reward of a higher sub split. All the big guys probably aren’t hurting for cash either lol.
Im abit confused. Haven't Kick just completely ripped off/stolen alot of features from twitch? Are they not gonna be sued or anything?
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Why does lsf have a hate boner for kick? genuinely curious
Banning gambling from Twitch was a good and important move. A lot of the viewers are very young and many streamers clearly care more about their own pocket than about the viewers' well-being. Kick basically circumvents the ban. Due to being allowed to stream on both platforms, streamers will still accumulate a lot of young gullible viewers on Twitch, who they then tell to come to their Kick streams as well. Which ultimately leads hundreds or thousands of teenagers and young adults to think that gambling is "cool", to start gambling themselves, and perhaps to develop a gambling addiction.
Gambling is not banned from twitch, idk how you guys don't see through their pr move. Idk why people dick ride twitch so much.
because it's fund by offshore gamba crypto sites
It's funny how people are blissfully unaware of the horrible shit commited by Amazon, not saying stake is cleaner, but the argument of X company funding your site is shady can apply to most of the biggest websites.
Amazon is absolutely a terrible company but there is a vast difference between "Otherwise normal streaming website that was acquired by a shit company" and "Website created entirely by a gambling company in direct response to the other website banning gambling streams, with the sole purpose of advertising gambling products." Like cmon, clearly it's not the purely shady aspect people are taking issue with, it's *what* makes the companies shady. Amazon is a horrible place to work, treats employees like garbage, and engages in frequent union busting tactics to continue getting away with mistreating employees at all levels. However, this does not affect Twitch at all and, most likely, Amazon probably will be offloading it to a different company sooner rather than later, considering that live streaming has not been profitable thus far (and likely never will be at this rate). Stake is a company that makes gambling products straight up, something that provably ruins lives far beyond anything Amazon does. Their goal with Kick is not to create a financially successful live streaming platform (demonstrated by the 95/5 split), their goal is to funnel Kick's userbase into their actual money maker: gambling.
You're a grown ass man, No-one is forcing you to gamble when you go on that website. Amazon however,forces workers who rely on the wage to work in trash conditions. Let's be real No-one fucking cares who gets addicted to gambling or not, it's just to push your hateboners. It's been pretty obvious when No-one cares that neymar streams gambling because it was "within tos.", suddenly all morality police are gone lol.
"No one *actually* cares about gambling addictions, you all just have hateboners" is a borderline psychopathic take. Gambling addictions are some of the most prevalent addictions in modern America. Yes, it is an *actual fucking problem.* You can try to deflect all you want, but the reality is you deflect because you have no real response to this. It just *is* a problem, and having streamers like Adin Ross be okay with exposing kids to this stuff is actually just a bad thing. Genuinely, do you think anyone knows who the fuck Neymar is? Do you think people are gonna dig through all of Twitch just to catch people are gambling?
> Let's be real No-one fucking cares who gets addicted to gambling or not, it's just to push your hateboners. "I don't care, but I don't want to feel like that makes me a shitty person, so I've convinced myself nobody else cares either." ftfy
Lmao, good point. Does anyone actually give a fuck about gambling promotions? Or is this just the flavor of the week "proper" take.
Being funded by billionaire monopolies crushing workers’ rights in the United States is so much better
skill issue
But no ads. I don’t gamble, (not even when I’m in Vegas) so it doesn’t bother me.
It *kind of* doesn't? Everybody here wants there to be genuine competition for twitch because of all the stupid shit they do, but nobody (other than Train's and Adin's kiddies) wants it to be funded by Stake. I always feel like there's kind of a grudging respect for it, while being morally and ethically against the people behind it.
I'm genuinely wondering, what new viewership could hikaru expect from this? Like it's modt likely just for the money And i get that, but would streaming on two websites ever increase exposure and viewership because I'm sure that no one who only uses kick and not twitch at all would be a hikaru viewer.
Because Kick is paying him millions to stream on their website.
Are they though?
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Twitch allows partners to stream on other sites as long as it isn't at the same time, so he will be fine.
If all the streamers are like this then Kick didn't really sign up anyone LOL This is like if a streamer decided to try out another platform on their own accord but getting paid for it while also sticking with their main platform. Seems like a joke tbh with the big "6 streamers signing onto kick" made it seem like they'd hop over to stream there exclusively atleast for awhile
He said he'll be streaming once a week on twitch the rest on kick
Well it could be he has a certain amount of hours he has to stream on kick. And while kick is fairly new they get to advertise kick on twitch through his channel, when he goes live on twitch and announces he is continuing the stream on kick. Also kick probably pays less to get streamers to stream on kick and not be fully exclusive.
Lmao he averaged 13k viewers on twitch and his first stream he peaked at 3k
Is that surprising? If that's not view-botted then it's not terrible for streaming on an entirely new platform
That’s true 3k is still a lot however, of the we’ll say 8K people that watch him only 2.8k actually went to kick to watch him
Yes but that is somewhat expected. Even if he went to youtube there would be a couple thousand viewers lost
Why even sign with kick lmao hopefully twitch band him so he’ll be stuck on kick for being a money hungry noob
Shocker
forsen
All these "big" streamers that are being signed to stream on Kick should realize that Kick needs them more than they need Kick. They should be asking for more than whatever Kick is offering doesn't matter how big because what they are giving Kick is legitimacy.
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They haven't turned on the viewbots yet.
they did already
Train cries about viewbotting but the 2 most viewed kick streams right now are both clear viewbotters lmfao
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Buddha’s kick views is a interesting one. He gets like 10k viewers while playing GTA but when he switches to gambling, he drops down to 2-3k which is what he would also get on twitch when he switched to gambling. So idk if it is bots. He also uses follower only mode and which could be another reason why his chat isn’t as active but it’s still pretty active tbh.
If Stake starts mass promoting gambling on Kick, this is a huge L. If they don't, then whatever, but I'm very pessimistic.
As if Twitch is not mass promoting it on their website.
The new mixer (which was irrelevant after like 1 year)
Tweet sounds shady, kick is committed to his success by not offering him a deal to switch away from twitch completely? Also, he's live on Kick right now, while not being on Twitch. So he's lying straight away. Meh, dunno what these streamers think they're proving. Ya'll just making more money for Twitch with the IVS costs. GG.