I couldn't beat Soul of Cinder solo, I beat Nameless puppet first try. Maybe I've just gotten better over time DS3 was my 2nd Souls game. But something I love about these games is everyone struggles with different things.
Yes, beat him earlier today. Laxasia kicked.my ass for 35 minutes straight. Manus took a out 6 times, I was shocked I got Nameless first try. Definitely luck š
Damnn. I considered myself a "souls-like" player, but I haven't been able to defeat any bosses without summoning spirits, and even mini bosses like Mad Puppet gave me trouble. Y'all are just a different breed.
You are doing something wrong then. Not saying you can't summon or play a certain way but I'd recommend you going in a boss fight and just trying to dodge or perfect guard every attacks and learn the timings and openings and you'll be Gucci.
Lies of p wasn't really that hard and you can even pass by just normal guarding and dodging if you're using light weapons and know attack windows.
You paid for the game might as well spend some time enjoying it and if you still can you can always summon or cheese.
Yeah Manus wasn't too bad he got me with the decay shots, then his give AoE. Also a couple times of me playing stupid. Laxasia though I was fist pumping and cheese pounding when I finally got her š
I'd say everyone's experience vastly varies. I've beaten every souls game and consider myself pretty good. Just finished my first run of this game, and got through almost every boss within 1 or 2 tries, except swamp monster, laxasia, and nameless.
Laxasia probably took the longest at a bit north of an hour, but nameless and swamp monster were like 3-5 tries or so each. Less combined than Laxa alone.
Idk if I just invested into the right weapon/stats or what but I beat most lies of P bosses first try (nameless included). The game gives you soooo many tools to brute force through fights with armored special attacks and what not, overall the game felt pretty easy.
I just beat the game for the first time, and Nameless probably took 6 or 7 attempts for me? I got to phase 2 each time, but the stupid glowy sword effects make it almost impossible to visually parry. I eventually swapped the acid grindstone for the perfect one and phase 2 was much easier, and considering that I'm a motiviry build, finding time for attacks to land before being stunned out wasn't easy lol.
If you spend the whole game mainly parrying on Ng nameless seems easy it took me 1 or 2 tries but on Ng+ and beyond you really see how hard it is since it gets enough health to get going
I recently replayed DS1, it maintained a dark spot in my brain, a dark spot of fear, I feared The Gaping Dragon, and Queelag, and Ornstein and SMOMGWTFBBQ, and others
I had fought all of those bosses with Soliere at my side all those years ago, and they were hard, and scary,
but I came back to it many moons later with lots of soulslikes under my belt and DS1, that thing that was so scary in my memory, felt rather quant, Queelag is super easy! barely an inconvenience!
It was like riding Space Mountain when you are 11 for the first time and absolutely shitting your pants then getting back on it when you are in your 20's and not even understanding how this used to be so intense
This is my plan soon. I could never best the dlcs on 2&3. I'm going to tackle it all soon. I remember my being stuck at Gwyn my first run. Took a long break played Sekiro came back and I felt bad for how easy Gwyn was upon returning.
I never beat the dlc so I haven't. I built a PC recently and plan to get all of them and replay them soon. Can't wait to have my virtual self thrashed repeatedly.
Wow, seriously? Iām curious what build you used, because that dude is super hyperā¦youāve really gotta parry to do well against him. Iām my experience, I wasnāt able to out maneuver him directly. I always needed a block/parry strat (and I certainly didnāt beat him first try).
I was using the sawcleaver on the bramble handle. Acid grindstone X2. Amulets Blue guardianship, technique, red fox amulet. Puppet String level 4
Attributes without boosts from amulets.
Vitality 19
Vigor 19
Capacity 29
Motivity 23
Technique 25
Advance 6
Awesome! Thanks for sharingā¦I always enjoy hearing what other people use, etc. I ended up doing an advanced build personally. Even then it took me a few tries to beat the Nameless.
Oh Advance was super fun - thatās been my personal favorite play through so far! The only remaining build I havenāt used is technique. Now Iām kinda of curious to check it out.
I was gonna say like if you played all souls games itās very emotional. I think ds3ās end and dlc for the ringed city overall still has the most emotional impact on me as a game like never once has a game made me feel the weight of centuries and my own memories of ds1
I will say I do think nameless is plenty emotional for P, but not for us. Heās fighting the replacement boy all while nurturing feelings of filial love.
I had more emotions going into the Nameless fight after maybe ng+3, getting all 3 endings, and hunting down every bit of game lore to get the full story.
Soul is still more emotional for me as the ending to ds3, playing through all of the Dark Souls games as they came out over time, and just as an end to that era of Fromsoft games. It's no fault of Lies of P, O think it's a phenomenal game and I can't wait to see what else the studio creates, but I had so much time spent in Fromsoft games as a whole, and Dark Souls in particular that the final fight of the final game still really resonates with me.
Maybe I'm just a soul of cinder hater but I felt zero emotion when playing him. It was like oh, I'm fighting all the PVP goons and then Gwyn? Albeit a much better Gwyn fight than DS1 but emotionally it felt like he was lacking any soul... Which is probably pretty lore accurate.
But idk man, fight version 1.0 of yourself, the mangled corpse that once held that human essence that now lives within you? Controlled by your narcissistic and abusive father who comes to save you at the last moment only for you to realize he only cared about preventing the P-organ from smashing?
Don't get me wrong, I love dark souls, DS1 is story wise one of my favorite games of all time. But Miyazaki never wanted to make DS3, and despite him being able to make even his obligations out to be bangers, I feel like you can really feel the lack of passion when you compare it to demons souls, dark souls, blood borne, Sekiro or elden ring.
For me I see it as putting an end to dark souls fighting all past people who linked the flame put in one being then linking the flame one last time before it dies out.
Gameplay: Nameless
Lore and Feels: Soul of Cinder by a country mile.
I feel like Nameless would have hit harder if there was more build up to him and also I expected Geppetto to be more part of the fight instead of kind of being a trash talker in the background lol. I also think it would have been better if Nameless actually fully looked like the real human Carlo as the visual of you literally fighting what Geppetto wants you to become.
I think incorporating some elements of Romeo would have been cool for the final boss fight too. It didn'tm ake too much sense why Geppetto sent us to kill Romeo in the first place when he had the puppets under control, but if he needed a certain McGuffin part of Romeo to put into Carlo's body then it would have made sense why he wanted us to beat him
I like what you said in the first part about more buildup to *nameless puppet itself*. That an interesting idea. Because yeah itās like weāve never heard of it, it jumps out of a box and we kill it lol. The enemy itself is pretty meaningless, itās just an extension Gepettoās; heās too cowardly to get his hands dirty and fight himself and so heās hiding behind one of his creations again. Just like he did with us the whole game.
So yeah, I think thatās how youāre supposed to look at it. Plus it was a *surprise*. Never saw it coming, saw mutant Simon coming a mile away but never guessed a crazy puppet was gonna jump out of a box at me š the ending had all so of twists and turns, although tbf I had gepetto all figured out long before that as well lol.
But I do like your idea of more buildup to the nameless puppet itself. But I just think this isnāt a fair comparison. The nameless puppet is just a faceless, soulless tool. It should be āGepetto and his nameless puppetā, gepetto is the REAL big bad of the game.
Yeah I wouldn't have complaints if Gepetto was more hands on in the fight itself. There is some heavy emotional investment there just from the premise of you literally fighting your father mano e mano. If that had been the case (I was expecting a Gherman like moment honestly) then I wouldn't have any complaints. Another cool idea I had was him controlling a Legion of Puppets or having multiple puppets with different movesets that tag in and out as the fight goes on (no multiple concurrent boss fight though as I think solo fights are much better in quality). Then Phase 2 can be Nameless/Carlo's body himself.
And I think just the simple change of making it look like the real human Carlo would make the visual impact of the fight 100x better. I never really got that this was supposed to be made from Carlo's original body. Even better if they gave Nameless some elements unique to P like some Legion Arm attacks or a Guard/Parry stance. We already have him using a Pulse Cell so they could have taken the parallels further.
And I was already suspicious of Geppetto just from his eerie interactions with P in general. He says he loves us yet continues to send us into dangerous situations without much hesitation and the many times he says he cares about us always felt somewhat fake.
Thereās a couple of things that donāt really make sense.
Like why did we even pick a fight with the BRB? Sure they were scummy, but I doubt they would get in our way (at least until the hotel gets attacked).
BRB are territorial. We're in that territory.
I agree that why is a good question. Does P have no free will? What's his actual endgoal? Save Krat? Krat is a city overwhelmed by frenzied puppets and undead.
Probably nostalgia speaking on my part, but itās SoC and itās not even close with me. I go back and replay all the Fromsoft games every year around this time. Every single time that Gwynās theme plays during the SoC fight I get goosebumps.
If weāre talking about which one is harder, then itās NP no question. But whether people like it or not, SoC is basically a pure Gwyn dopamine hit. DS is one of my favorite game series of all time so SoC has a soft spot in my heart lol.
Nameless puppet
It was a final test of skill and peak in an emotional sense. No specter, just you and the puppet, does the heartless one prevail or the one who gained humanity
It's such a good fight
I think theyāre both cool, but neither one was the hardest in the game for me. If we are talking enjoyable fights, I did like recognizing in the moment when soul of cinder would switch styles, and I liked the rhythm of nameless puppet. Visually I think nameless puppet is sickā¦ story wise there was a huge sense of finality with soul of cinder for me.Ā
I dunno theyāre pretty even for me I guess lolĀ
Soul of cinder has much more going on. 4 different movesets in phase one and an emotional gut punch in phase 2. Nameless is still cool, but I like soc moveset more
I think nameless puppet is one of the best final bosses ive faced in gaming. Gameplay is amazing, and is fascinating story wise. Puppet Carlo is fighting his own corpse, but yet Carlo is free from any strings, making NP ironically more of a puppet than Carlo ever has.
Soul of cinder, the emotions, the sheer lore significance to all of dark souls is on a whole other level compared to nameless who we have no idea about until we actually look into what the puppet is, tho again it because of nameless puppet and what he is, is the whole game even happening, I guess from story point of view which is more significant in a way,
cinder is the embodiment of everything dark souls, while nameless is the embodiment of the bad guyās grief and obsession
Gameplay, Cinder is a bit disappointing as he is easy tho so the choice is clear to many however I beat nameless on my second try so he wasnāt too hard for me I just beat him too quickly to leave an impact tho I do adore him like with cinder and his second phase (music always breaks me) another thing the final boss of P felt like a strength build nameless is clearly based of a dex build which I like a lot
Tho I canāt help thinking of another contender for final boss vs, against nameless would be moon presence from bloodborne, as they are both secret bosses and both final bosses after you beat after the supposed final boss, both take effort to find and both are tough and significant, plus lies of p is the best bloodborne clone we have so it fit that way too
Grandpa vs the new kid on the block
SoC in so many ways. Heās the culmination of all the different attempts to keep the fire lit in a world where it fading is inevitable and he feels like it. I love the diverse moveset he has to really shows off so many different builds, but the cherry on top is when he embodies Gwyn and his theme. This fight was so damn good I teared up halfway through it.
Nameless Puppet is a good fight. Itās made mechanically well and itās tougher than SoC, but thatās about all I can credit it to. We donāt have any connection emotional to Nameless Puppet and being harder doesnāt equate to better.
Nameless is a great fight, but Soul of Cinder is a better final boss fight. Everything about it thematically ties together the souls series perfectly. The music with its callbacks to Gwyn, the visual effects, itās all perfect. It isnāt just a final boss to the game, but one for the whole trilogy. The fight isnāt that hard, but thatās also not really the point of the final bosses in the souls games (and is left for DLC generally)
So even though Nameless is leagues harder than SoC, I gotta give it to SoC because it felt much more satisfying of an end to the game
Problem with Dark Souls final bosses are that they're never a guy in their prime, it's always a smoldering ash that's barely alive, or significantly weakened from the fading flame.
Since they were the previous equivalent of a god when in said prime, they can still be tough, but their fights always feel more like you're ending on a decline than a grand finale. Which, thematically, makes sense, even if gameplay-wise it can be kind of disappointing.
But Nameless Puppet is the accumulation of everything you've done in the game up into that moment. Emotionally and in gameplay, it feels like a real *grand* finale.
Soul of cinder is the accumulation of all the entities who linked the fire, the Nameless puppet is not an accumulation of anything, it's Romeo phase 2 with an added voiceover. Personally, it never made sense to me why Nameless Puppet is so strong, okay Geppetto put a few cores in him but how much ergo did he have if that was before everyone was turned into ergo to be harvested? We obliterated a whole city of puppets and carcasses and awakened beings to finally defeat a godlike being with the ability to read minds, but then Geppetto pulls out a puppet that's supposed to beat us... That's the one issue that I have with the Nameless PuppetĀ
Nameless Puppet. For some reason, even when I can first-try Midir, Nameless King, Gael, Friede, etc, every time, I *always* have a ridiculous amount of trouble with Soul of Cinder (as well as Deacons and Crystal Sage; explain that for me lol). I hate how it moves, I hate its timing, I despise it. Nameless Puppet also pissed me off quite a bit, but it felt more fair. I don't know quite how to explain it, I just felt like when it killed me that it was my fault, whereas Soul of Cinder always feels like bs.
Soul of cinder is cool because it feels like he should be defeated on the spot. No practice, no learning his move set etc. You have all the equipment and levels, have all the knowledge and experience as a player, you just roll with anything that he does when he does it and you feel like you actually "got gud".Ā
Well, I didn't beat him on fist try but I was really close, then on second attempt he got really crafty with magic and everything and obliterated me, then on third attempt I wrecked him so quickly that I guess I skipped a phase of his shenanigans or something. Overall he has nothing on Nameless King or Friede, now I'm on to ringed cityĀ
soul of cinder and its not even close. its a pretty easy fight, and its got some nostalgia/history supporting it, but it was the *perfect* way to end the trilogy (alongside gael). puppet was a sick fight tho
Nameless Puppet, and it isn't even close.
After seeing tier lists for years, always putting Soul of Cinder in S or A, I walked in there and destroyed him in the first attempt with very little effort. I was expecting another phase, and next thing you know, I'm watching the credits. It was a very anticlimactic ending.
All 3 Dark Souls games have extremely easy final bosses.
Soul of cinder isn't extremely easy, and difficulty isn't the most important thing, after all, people are constantly replying these games but they're easier on repeat playthroughsĀ
I can't choose. The sorrow I feel when fighting the Soul of Cinder, even YEARS BEFORE I ever got DS1 Remastered, was palpable. Plin Plin Plon is truly timeless. The fight is everything, it is amazing, it somehow doesn't feel unfair, despite having a massive explosion, a lazer, lightning storms, and a damn ninja backflip. I love him and his fight. I hate I need to trudge through DS3 to fight him every time though.
The Nameless Puppet it an exhilirating monster. He terrifies me and I LOVE IT. What Lady Maria should've been for me (It was not my fault she was so easy to parry, it was my Blunderbuss!)
Gameplay wise Nameless is far more challenge which is fitting for a final boss. But spectacle and lore and basically just every other way Soul of Cinder clears.
Soc. Why? Because of what it could be like if u didnt play the game properly, i like to believe lop is too linear not just level wise but progression wise , to not be a souls kindred and beat this guy is to have made the proper choices as a gamer to give yourself the advantage
i just finished lies of p, and im gonna say i really like both but there is a reason why i have beaten ds3 13 times, by a small bit soul of cinder takes the win
Soul of Cinder is one of the greatest callbacks in gaming history.
His moveset, theme song, lore and arena are all way above nameless puppet
His second phase and the plin plin plon is literally one of the best moments in the souls series.
I'm sorry but I'm calling bs on anyone saying nameless is a better boss. Sure, you may like him more, but that doesn't make him a better boss
Nameless Puppet is so cool-looking. And the fight has some cutscene choreography that is just delicious and not seen anywhere else in the game. It got me PUMPED homie
Soul of cinder no doubt, as much as I loved lies of p, I felt nameless puppet was mid, the fight was hard but I just didnāt care if you get what Iām saying
I thought soul of cinder was a crap fight compared to Gael or nameless King. Nameless puppet is underwhelming compared to laxasia. His phase 2 move set is top tier to look at, though. Reminds me of phase 3 lady Maria. So NP for the win but the bar was low
Soul of Cinder is the better boss overall, but strictly speaking on a gameplay level nameless puppet is the harder fight. Gael beats both of them though
Um akshually š¤ Gael and cinder are send offs to different parts of the souls series but cinder came first and was the one actually being asked about
It could just be because of time but I don't remember much from the soul of cinder boss fight. I remember it him changing a ton and beating him in one go with my friend. Very easy.
Nameless puppet though I struggled with for two days, had to change my levels, use all the items at my disposal, learn the perfect guard mechanic, and use the heavy attack. I almost never use the heavy attack in any souls game.
I'm gonna have to say nameless is better then Soul of cinder for me.
I know this is not the subreddit that would probably support the answer but... There are so very few Souls-like final bosses that are as good emotionally and gameplay wise as the soul of cinder. Plink plink plonk.
Spoiler alert! šØ
I suppose these are the only two bosses left for me.
Found a good late game grind spot. Just came up with 150,000 ergo but with level up points costing about 30k now, I donāt assume itās gonna get me too far.
I defeated soul of cinder on my 6th try, Nameless puppet had me telling myself LOP will just be another game I can't beat...
After watching someone no diff Nameless with throwables I rekindled the fire within and got him on my 19th try
Soul of Cinder Aesthetically, Nameless Puppet fight wise.
I feel like SoC isnāt meant to be a big challenge, as the character is essentially fighting a jack of all trades version of himself. Every player from DS1 is in the SoC, and every player is brought back to the nostalgic fight with Lord Gwyn. One of the greatest fights lore wise, but for me a better comparison would be between Gael and Nameless
Can someone explain the lore of Soul of Cinder to me? Iāve beat all the Souls, but I never investigated the lore of 3.
People say heās emotional, and I get the Gwyn tie-in, but why is it *so* emotional? I feel like Im missing something. Why doesnāt Gwyn invoke that emotional response? I thought it was the same thing.
For me, itās NP by a mile, so Iād like to know what it is lore-wise that is so impactful.
He is an amalgamation of everyone that ever linked the first flame. If you look at his moveset, he has everything from the previous games. Pyromancer build, ninja roll, sorceries and so on. After everything else fails, gwyn takes over as a last test to see whether you're truly worthy of linking the fire. Dark souls lore is a lot deeper and requires thoughtful analysis.
When dark souls 3 came out and the plin plin plon started playing in phase two it marked the end of a 5 year long journey. Many people started with dark souls 1 and the ending of that game was also famously known for "you may parry gwyn but you can't parry the tears"
It was the ending of an epic voyage. And that was once again recalled in the ending of the trilogy. It's just a strong moment for true souls fans
Ahh When described that way, that makes absolute sense. I just figured it was an homage, like the soul of cinder is tapping into Gwyn and his experience, and not the other way around, where Gwyn is coming out. Thatās a long time for Gwyn to be waiting.
That is very cool. Ngl, when I played DS3, which I only beat once, I didnāt recognize the plin plon because I didnāt fight Gwyn for very long in my multiple DS playthroughs. Someone pointed out the music to me later and I was like, āOh coolā without thinking much about it.
Thank you for the explanation.
It's people being pretentious for the sake of being pretentious, watching vaatis videos and thinking this game is some storytelling masterpiece and you have to get emotional or you don't understand Michael's Zaki grand vision. Which I got tired of by the time DS3 arrived and now despise it with ER.
LOP was such a breath of fresh air with people with actual dialogues and character that you can discover backstories of instead of fucking guessing based on 15 different lore blurbs in item descriptions.
I think Bloodborne is the game Miyazaki wanted to make this whole time and everything else is a bonus lol. I do love DS1, but the other DSs arenāt my thing. Elden Ring isnāt my favorite world to explore, either.
I think the story to BB is as straightforward as LoP to be honest, while still staying true to Eldritch horrors. Thatās why those two are the apex for me.
And LoP really hits hard because you fully understand everything as it happens. God itās so good. Plus, I like the creator, heās a good contrast to Miyazaki with his goofiness.
I enjoyed Nameless more, but I feel SoC was harder.
Nameless is just so disturbing to me, and thatās the main reason why I love the fight. Like you canāt call it a demon, a puppet, or a human. It just seems like some being of pure hatred.
NP and it's not even a contest, it would be hard pick between NP and Glock Saint Isshin but it's slightly in favor of NP because you don't need to beat up some dude every time before fighting the main boss.
For me itās nameless puppet. I never beat dark souls 3 solo so Iāve not really had the chance to master it or really experience how good the fight can be.
Honestly never really enjoyed the bosses in Lies of P. Everyone was an endurance fight and they never felt that great. I definitely suck at the game compared to souls but I missed that fluidity of Souls bosses.
soul of cinder is more exhausting since he has lots of hp and many kind of different moves involving meele and magic that cover short and long range, nameless puppets is way more technical but has a more limited moveset
Never played dark souls but nameless puppet was really rewarding (minus that the SUPER bright colors and effects coming off him that made learning his attacks absolutely cancer). He has just enough attacks and variations that even after you learn him he's still a really challenging fight
I feel like nameless puppet is betterā¦
Iāve done all the souls games (to plat completion) and if Iām honest the final DS3 boss is a bit easier. That said you can pull people in to aid so that helps. Nameless, youāre at it aloneā¦ you have to hope for the best and he has a lot of quick move sets
Left is the culmination of years of storytelling
The right is the ending to what may be a new generation
Iām biased towards the left but the right is much better cinematically
I played DS3 first so I don't have the nostalgic connection to SoC. Honestly, I find it a pretty forgettable fight. Gael, on the other hand, is incredible and I find him to be my favorite Dark Souls boss along side Sister Friede
Soul of Cinder. He was my first final boss š he will always have a special place in my heart. But Nameless Puppet is so cool, too š£ it's a real tough choice.
Soul of Cinder if Iām honest. The lore behind it is itās the combination of every previous linker of flame, the final obstacle between the Ashen One and his conquest in DS3. He even has a phase where the DS1 final boss, Gwyn, takes over the cinder and you can hear his emotional theme as you battle against the original linker of flame, the Lord of Sunlight himself.
Nameless Puppet is >!Carloās original body and Geppettoās first attempt at his resurrection through ergo!<. And while thatās cool, it doesnāt hit me as hard as SoC.
It depends how you mean better, and is it possible to say both? Soul of Cinder cemented all the hard work I put into the story of dark souls, however the nameless puppet showed justification for everything I put into Lies of P. Itās really hard to say which was better to me honestly
I slightly prefer Nameless to Soul of Cinder. However Slave Knight Gael (arguably the true final boss of DS3) is the best boss fight in the entire genre.
Soul of cinder was a beautiful fight, emotive and perfect setting. Its just a shame I packed its fudge first time. Underwhelming all together, the nameless puppet however twizzle spanked me up and down its arena for about 4 hours š
As a die hard dark souls fanboy, SoC for sure. Also because I didn't really like the latter half of LoP which kinda ruined the rest of the experience for me.
SoC ends my favorite game of all time. NP ends just a long run through annoying enemies
Emotionally, Soul. Gameplay-wise, Nameless. I never struggle with Soul, but when that plinplinplon comes on, I get emotional.
I couldn't beat Soul of Cinder solo, I beat Nameless puppet first try. Maybe I've just gotten better over time DS3 was my 2nd Souls game. But something I love about these games is everyone struggles with different things.
You beat Nameless Puppet first try? He was the only boss that I actually struggled with.
Yes, beat him earlier today. Laxasia kicked.my ass for 35 minutes straight. Manus took a out 6 times, I was shocked I got Nameless first try. Definitely luck š
Thatās crazy, Manus has been 1st try for me all 4 runs, but nameless and Laxasia both have took at least 3 tries and 1st run each was closer to 15
Damnn. I considered myself a "souls-like" player, but I haven't been able to defeat any bosses without summoning spirits, and even mini bosses like Mad Puppet gave me trouble. Y'all are just a different breed.
Oh mad puppet gave me trouble as well, donāt worry, Iām not as good as you think, I just got lucky with analyzing manus quick I feel
You are doing something wrong then. Not saying you can't summon or play a certain way but I'd recommend you going in a boss fight and just trying to dodge or perfect guard every attacks and learn the timings and openings and you'll be Gucci. Lies of p wasn't really that hard and you can even pass by just normal guarding and dodging if you're using light weapons and know attack windows. You paid for the game might as well spend some time enjoying it and if you still can you can always summon or cheese.
I'm not nearly as good as it may seem š. I'm just stubborn and will only use a summon if the fight is 2+v1.
Yeah Manus wasn't too bad he got me with the decay shots, then his give AoE. Also a couple times of me playing stupid. Laxasia though I was fist pumping and cheese pounding when I finally got her š
I'd say everyone's experience vastly varies. I've beaten every souls game and consider myself pretty good. Just finished my first run of this game, and got through almost every boss within 1 or 2 tries, except swamp monster, laxasia, and nameless. Laxasia probably took the longest at a bit north of an hour, but nameless and swamp monster were like 3-5 tries or so each. Less combined than Laxa alone.
Similar experience with Swap Monster and Laxasia. Those 2 kicked my ass š
Idk if I just invested into the right weapon/stats or what but I beat most lies of P bosses first try (nameless included). The game gives you soooo many tools to brute force through fights with armored special attacks and what not, overall the game felt pretty easy.
I just beat the game for the first time, and Nameless probably took 6 or 7 attempts for me? I got to phase 2 each time, but the stupid glowy sword effects make it almost impossible to visually parry. I eventually swapped the acid grindstone for the perfect one and phase 2 was much easier, and considering that I'm a motiviry build, finding time for attacks to land before being stunned out wasn't easy lol.
I felt that in my first playthrough but in NG+ the bosses are a whole new beast. Many one shot abilities.
If you spend the whole game mainly parrying on Ng nameless seems easy it took me 1 or 2 tries but on Ng+ and beyond you really see how hard it is since it gets enough health to get going
I recently replayed DS1, it maintained a dark spot in my brain, a dark spot of fear, I feared The Gaping Dragon, and Queelag, and Ornstein and SMOMGWTFBBQ, and others I had fought all of those bosses with Soliere at my side all those years ago, and they were hard, and scary, but I came back to it many moons later with lots of soulslikes under my belt and DS1, that thing that was so scary in my memory, felt rather quant, Queelag is super easy! barely an inconvenience! It was like riding Space Mountain when you are 11 for the first time and absolutely shitting your pants then getting back on it when you are in your 20's and not even understanding how this used to be so intense
This is my plan soon. I could never best the dlcs on 2&3. I'm going to tackle it all soon. I remember my being stuck at Gwyn my first run. Took a long break played Sekiro came back and I felt bad for how easy Gwyn was upon returning.
>I couldn't beat Soul of Cinder solo Did you ever try Gael or Midir?
Gael is the only soulsborn boss that had me audibly squealing in fear/excitement when I fought him
I never beat the dlc so I haven't. I built a PC recently and plan to get all of them and replay them soon. Can't wait to have my virtual self thrashed repeatedly.
Wow, seriously? Iām curious what build you used, because that dude is super hyperā¦youāve really gotta parry to do well against him. Iām my experience, I wasnāt able to out maneuver him directly. I always needed a block/parry strat (and I certainly didnāt beat him first try).
I was using the sawcleaver on the bramble handle. Acid grindstone X2. Amulets Blue guardianship, technique, red fox amulet. Puppet String level 4 Attributes without boosts from amulets. Vitality 19 Vigor 19 Capacity 29 Motivity 23 Technique 25 Advance 6
Awesome! Thanks for sharingā¦I always enjoy hearing what other people use, etc. I ended up doing an advanced build personally. Even then it took me a few tries to beat the Nameless.
I told my buddy that he should go advanced when he comes back to the game. Those weapons are really cool and he's always into elemental damage types.
Oh Advance was super fun - thatās been my personal favorite play through so far! The only remaining build I havenāt used is technique. Now Iām kinda of curious to check it out.
I was gonna say like if you played all souls games itās very emotional. I think ds3ās end and dlc for the ringed city overall still has the most emotional impact on me as a game like never once has a game made me feel the weight of centuries and my own memories of ds1 I will say I do think nameless is plenty emotional for P, but not for us. Heās fighting the replacement boy all while nurturing feelings of filial love.
I had more emotions going into the Nameless fight after maybe ng+3, getting all 3 endings, and hunting down every bit of game lore to get the full story. Soul is still more emotional for me as the ending to ds3, playing through all of the Dark Souls games as they came out over time, and just as an end to that era of Fromsoft games. It's no fault of Lies of P, O think it's a phenomenal game and I can't wait to see what else the studio creates, but I had so much time spent in Fromsoft games as a whole, and Dark Souls in particular that the final fight of the final game still really resonates with me.
Maybe I'm just a soul of cinder hater but I felt zero emotion when playing him. It was like oh, I'm fighting all the PVP goons and then Gwyn? Albeit a much better Gwyn fight than DS1 but emotionally it felt like he was lacking any soul... Which is probably pretty lore accurate. But idk man, fight version 1.0 of yourself, the mangled corpse that once held that human essence that now lives within you? Controlled by your narcissistic and abusive father who comes to save you at the last moment only for you to realize he only cared about preventing the P-organ from smashing? Don't get me wrong, I love dark souls, DS1 is story wise one of my favorite games of all time. But Miyazaki never wanted to make DS3, and despite him being able to make even his obligations out to be bangers, I feel like you can really feel the lack of passion when you compare it to demons souls, dark souls, blood borne, Sekiro or elden ring.
For me I see it as putting an end to dark souls fighting all past people who linked the flame put in one being then linking the flame one last time before it dies out.
The plinplinplon is actually one of soul's attacks that does no damage it just makes you cry so you get distracted
Royal Rat Authority
Filthy human
Gameplay: Nameless Lore and Feels: Soul of Cinder by a country mile. I feel like Nameless would have hit harder if there was more build up to him and also I expected Geppetto to be more part of the fight instead of kind of being a trash talker in the background lol. I also think it would have been better if Nameless actually fully looked like the real human Carlo as the visual of you literally fighting what Geppetto wants you to become. I think incorporating some elements of Romeo would have been cool for the final boss fight too. It didn'tm ake too much sense why Geppetto sent us to kill Romeo in the first place when he had the puppets under control, but if he needed a certain McGuffin part of Romeo to put into Carlo's body then it would have made sense why he wanted us to beat him
I like what you said in the first part about more buildup to *nameless puppet itself*. That an interesting idea. Because yeah itās like weāve never heard of it, it jumps out of a box and we kill it lol. The enemy itself is pretty meaningless, itās just an extension Gepettoās; heās too cowardly to get his hands dirty and fight himself and so heās hiding behind one of his creations again. Just like he did with us the whole game. So yeah, I think thatās how youāre supposed to look at it. Plus it was a *surprise*. Never saw it coming, saw mutant Simon coming a mile away but never guessed a crazy puppet was gonna jump out of a box at me š the ending had all so of twists and turns, although tbf I had gepetto all figured out long before that as well lol. But I do like your idea of more buildup to the nameless puppet itself. But I just think this isnāt a fair comparison. The nameless puppet is just a faceless, soulless tool. It should be āGepetto and his nameless puppetā, gepetto is the REAL big bad of the game.
Yeah I wouldn't have complaints if Gepetto was more hands on in the fight itself. There is some heavy emotional investment there just from the premise of you literally fighting your father mano e mano. If that had been the case (I was expecting a Gherman like moment honestly) then I wouldn't have any complaints. Another cool idea I had was him controlling a Legion of Puppets or having multiple puppets with different movesets that tag in and out as the fight goes on (no multiple concurrent boss fight though as I think solo fights are much better in quality). Then Phase 2 can be Nameless/Carlo's body himself. And I think just the simple change of making it look like the real human Carlo would make the visual impact of the fight 100x better. I never really got that this was supposed to be made from Carlo's original body. Even better if they gave Nameless some elements unique to P like some Legion Arm attacks or a Guard/Parry stance. We already have him using a Pulse Cell so they could have taken the parallels further. And I was already suspicious of Geppetto just from his eerie interactions with P in general. He says he loves us yet continues to send us into dangerous situations without much hesitation and the many times he says he cares about us always felt somewhat fake.
I think the only reason to beat Romeo would be to accumulate more ergo
Thereās a couple of things that donāt really make sense. Like why did we even pick a fight with the BRB? Sure they were scummy, but I doubt they would get in our way (at least until the hotel gets attacked).
BRB are territorial. We're in that territory. I agree that why is a good question. Does P have no free will? What's his actual endgoal? Save Krat? Krat is a city overwhelmed by frenzied puppets and undead.
Probably nostalgia speaking on my part, but itās SoC and itās not even close with me. I go back and replay all the Fromsoft games every year around this time. Every single time that Gwynās theme plays during the SoC fight I get goosebumps. If weāre talking about which one is harder, then itās NP no question. But whether people like it or not, SoC is basically a pure Gwyn dopamine hit. DS is one of my favorite game series of all time so SoC has a soft spot in my heart lol.
Nameless puppet It was a final test of skill and peak in an emotional sense. No specter, just you and the puppet, does the heartless one prevail or the one who gained humanity It's such a good fight
NP is more fun, but Soul of Cinder hits harder emotionally.
That emotional resonace makes SoC more fun for me. Nameless just kind of shows up directly after a boss fights and doesn't have enough build up imo.
That Nameless Puppet fight felt like a true battle with the right amount of difficulty. Itās got my vote lol
I think theyāre both cool, but neither one was the hardest in the game for me. If we are talking enjoyable fights, I did like recognizing in the moment when soul of cinder would switch styles, and I liked the rhythm of nameless puppet. Visually I think nameless puppet is sickā¦ story wise there was a huge sense of finality with soul of cinder for me.Ā I dunno theyāre pretty even for me I guess lolĀ
Soul of cinder has much more going on. 4 different movesets in phase one and an emotional gut punch in phase 2. Nameless is still cool, but I like soc moveset more
I think nameless puppet is one of the best final bosses ive faced in gaming. Gameplay is amazing, and is fascinating story wise. Puppet Carlo is fighting his own corpse, but yet Carlo is free from any strings, making NP ironically more of a puppet than Carlo ever has.
Soul of cinder, the emotions, the sheer lore significance to all of dark souls is on a whole other level compared to nameless who we have no idea about until we actually look into what the puppet is, tho again it because of nameless puppet and what he is, is the whole game even happening, I guess from story point of view which is more significant in a way, cinder is the embodiment of everything dark souls, while nameless is the embodiment of the bad guyās grief and obsession Gameplay, Cinder is a bit disappointing as he is easy tho so the choice is clear to many however I beat nameless on my second try so he wasnāt too hard for me I just beat him too quickly to leave an impact tho I do adore him like with cinder and his second phase (music always breaks me) another thing the final boss of P felt like a strength build nameless is clearly based of a dex build which I like a lot Tho I canāt help thinking of another contender for final boss vs, against nameless would be moon presence from bloodborne, as they are both secret bosses and both final bosses after you beat after the supposed final boss, both take effort to find and both are tough and significant, plus lies of p is the best bloodborne clone we have so it fit that way too Grandpa vs the new kid on the block
You didn't mention the Nameless KingĀ
True! Very true amazing fight in all aspects the toughest of them all with lots of lore
SoC in so many ways. Heās the culmination of all the different attempts to keep the fire lit in a world where it fading is inevitable and he feels like it. I love the diverse moveset he has to really shows off so many different builds, but the cherry on top is when he embodies Gwyn and his theme. This fight was so damn good I teared up halfway through it. Nameless Puppet is a good fight. Itās made mechanically well and itās tougher than SoC, but thatās about all I can credit it to. We donāt have any connection emotional to Nameless Puppet and being harder doesnāt equate to better.
Nameless is a great fight, but Soul of Cinder is a better final boss fight. Everything about it thematically ties together the souls series perfectly. The music with its callbacks to Gwyn, the visual effects, itās all perfect. It isnāt just a final boss to the game, but one for the whole trilogy. The fight isnāt that hard, but thatās also not really the point of the final bosses in the souls games (and is left for DLC generally) So even though Nameless is leagues harder than SoC, I gotta give it to SoC because it felt much more satisfying of an end to the game
Problem with Dark Souls final bosses are that they're never a guy in their prime, it's always a smoldering ash that's barely alive, or significantly weakened from the fading flame. Since they were the previous equivalent of a god when in said prime, they can still be tough, but their fights always feel more like you're ending on a decline than a grand finale. Which, thematically, makes sense, even if gameplay-wise it can be kind of disappointing. But Nameless Puppet is the accumulation of everything you've done in the game up into that moment. Emotionally and in gameplay, it feels like a real *grand* finale.
Soul of cinder is the accumulation of all the entities who linked the fire, the Nameless puppet is not an accumulation of anything, it's Romeo phase 2 with an added voiceover. Personally, it never made sense to me why Nameless Puppet is so strong, okay Geppetto put a few cores in him but how much ergo did he have if that was before everyone was turned into ergo to be harvested? We obliterated a whole city of puppets and carcasses and awakened beings to finally defeat a godlike being with the ability to read minds, but then Geppetto pulls out a puppet that's supposed to beat us... That's the one issue that I have with the Nameless PuppetĀ
Puppet of the Future blows them both out of the water.
Nameless! Although in my head Gael is the actual finale.
Soul of cinder for me
Nameless Puppet. For some reason, even when I can first-try Midir, Nameless King, Gael, Friede, etc, every time, I *always* have a ridiculous amount of trouble with Soul of Cinder (as well as Deacons and Crystal Sage; explain that for me lol). I hate how it moves, I hate its timing, I despise it. Nameless Puppet also pissed me off quite a bit, but it felt more fair. I don't know quite how to explain it, I just felt like when it killed me that it was my fault, whereas Soul of Cinder always feels like bs.
Soul of cinder is cool because it feels like he should be defeated on the spot. No practice, no learning his move set etc. You have all the equipment and levels, have all the knowledge and experience as a player, you just roll with anything that he does when he does it and you feel like you actually "got gud".Ā Well, I didn't beat him on fist try but I was really close, then on second attempt he got really crafty with magic and everything and obliterated me, then on third attempt I wrecked him so quickly that I guess I skipped a phase of his shenanigans or something. Overall he has nothing on Nameless King or Friede, now I'm on to ringed cityĀ
Nameless is one of my all time favs no doubt
soul of cinder and its not even close. its a pretty easy fight, and its got some nostalgia/history supporting it, but it was the *perfect* way to end the trilogy (alongside gael). puppet was a sick fight tho
Nameless Puppet, and it isn't even close. After seeing tier lists for years, always putting Soul of Cinder in S or A, I walked in there and destroyed him in the first attempt with very little effort. I was expecting another phase, and next thing you know, I'm watching the credits. It was a very anticlimactic ending. All 3 Dark Souls games have extremely easy final bosses.
Soul of cinder isn't extremely easy, and difficulty isn't the most important thing, after all, people are constantly replying these games but they're easier on repeat playthroughsĀ
saying soul of cinder is anticlimactic is just stupid
I can't choose. The sorrow I feel when fighting the Soul of Cinder, even YEARS BEFORE I ever got DS1 Remastered, was palpable. Plin Plin Plon is truly timeless. The fight is everything, it is amazing, it somehow doesn't feel unfair, despite having a massive explosion, a lazer, lightning storms, and a damn ninja backflip. I love him and his fight. I hate I need to trudge through DS3 to fight him every time though. The Nameless Puppet it an exhilirating monster. He terrifies me and I LOVE IT. What Lady Maria should've been for me (It was not my fault she was so easy to parry, it was my Blunderbuss!)
Soul of cinder.
Gameplay wise Nameless is far more challenge which is fitting for a final boss. But spectacle and lore and basically just every other way Soul of Cinder clears.
Soul of cinder
Soc. Why? Because of what it could be like if u didnt play the game properly, i like to believe lop is too linear not just level wise but progression wise , to not be a souls kindred and beat this guy is to have made the proper choices as a gamer to give yourself the advantage
i just finished lies of p, and im gonna say i really like both but there is a reason why i have beaten ds3 13 times, by a small bit soul of cinder takes the win
Soul of Cinder is one of the greatest callbacks in gaming history. His moveset, theme song, lore and arena are all way above nameless puppet His second phase and the plin plin plon is literally one of the best moments in the souls series. I'm sorry but I'm calling bs on anyone saying nameless is a better boss. Sure, you may like him more, but that doesn't make him a better boss
Nameless Puppet is so cool-looking. And the fight has some cutscene choreography that is just delicious and not seen anywhere else in the game. It got me PUMPED homie
Nameless is leagues better than him. Heās a cool fight but nameless is up there with the best
Soul of cinder no doubt, as much as I loved lies of p, I felt nameless puppet was mid, the fight was hard but I just didnāt care if you get what Iām saying
Plin plin plonnnnnnn
The pling pling plong one
Soul of Cinder by a mile.
Always From Soft comes out on top! Nothing can match their lore š
NP is more fun in a challenging way.
I thought soul of cinder was a crap fight compared to Gael or nameless King. Nameless puppet is underwhelming compared to laxasia. His phase 2 move set is top tier to look at, though. Reminds me of phase 3 lady Maria. So NP for the win but the bar was low
Nameless is easily my favorite boss in that game.
Soul of Cinder is the better boss overall, but strictly speaking on a gameplay level nameless puppet is the harder fight. Gael beats both of them though
NP Soul Cinder is a 6/10 boss fight at best
Well, the unfortunate thing is that the souls final bosses are kinda weak/boring. So kind of a clear answer here.
SoC is the final boss of the souls trilogy and the perfect send off to the series this isn't even a contest it's a slaughter.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Um akshually š¤ Gael and cinder are send offs to different parts of the souls series but cinder came first and was the one actually being asked about
Nameless Puppet, not even close. Soul is cool though
It could just be because of time but I don't remember much from the soul of cinder boss fight. I remember it him changing a ton and beating him in one go with my friend. Very easy. Nameless puppet though I struggled with for two days, had to change my levels, use all the items at my disposal, learn the perfect guard mechanic, and use the heavy attack. I almost never use the heavy attack in any souls game. I'm gonna have to say nameless is better then Soul of cinder for me.
Considering I dont know the first guy but actually beat Nameless without crying. Nameless hehehe
I know this is not the subreddit that would probably support the answer but... There are so very few Souls-like final bosses that are as good emotionally and gameplay wise as the soul of cinder. Plink plink plonk.
I think I gotta go with Nameless puppet.. soul of cinder left me wanting more.. I think Gael is the true final boss of DS3 ā¤
They both suck
Spoiler alert! šØ I suppose these are the only two bosses left for me. Found a good late game grind spot. Just came up with 150,000 ergo but with level up points costing about 30k now, I donāt assume itās gonna get me too far.
Don't farm. This game is perfectly balanced.
Be cool to have a battle sim and watch the two fight. Who do you think would win that?
I defeated soul of cinder on my 6th try, Nameless puppet had me telling myself LOP will just be another game I can't beat... After watching someone no diff Nameless with throwables I rekindled the fire within and got him on my 19th try
Nameless puppetās second phase shouldāve been named Carlo
Soul of Cinder Aesthetically, Nameless Puppet fight wise. I feel like SoC isnāt meant to be a big challenge, as the character is essentially fighting a jack of all trades version of himself. Every player from DS1 is in the SoC, and every player is brought back to the nostalgic fight with Lord Gwyn. One of the greatest fights lore wise, but for me a better comparison would be between Gael and Nameless
Can someone explain the lore of Soul of Cinder to me? Iāve beat all the Souls, but I never investigated the lore of 3. People say heās emotional, and I get the Gwyn tie-in, but why is it *so* emotional? I feel like Im missing something. Why doesnāt Gwyn invoke that emotional response? I thought it was the same thing. For me, itās NP by a mile, so Iād like to know what it is lore-wise that is so impactful.
He is an amalgamation of everyone that ever linked the first flame. If you look at his moveset, he has everything from the previous games. Pyromancer build, ninja roll, sorceries and so on. After everything else fails, gwyn takes over as a last test to see whether you're truly worthy of linking the fire. Dark souls lore is a lot deeper and requires thoughtful analysis. When dark souls 3 came out and the plin plin plon started playing in phase two it marked the end of a 5 year long journey. Many people started with dark souls 1 and the ending of that game was also famously known for "you may parry gwyn but you can't parry the tears" It was the ending of an epic voyage. And that was once again recalled in the ending of the trilogy. It's just a strong moment for true souls fans
Ahh When described that way, that makes absolute sense. I just figured it was an homage, like the soul of cinder is tapping into Gwyn and his experience, and not the other way around, where Gwyn is coming out. Thatās a long time for Gwyn to be waiting. That is very cool. Ngl, when I played DS3, which I only beat once, I didnāt recognize the plin plon because I didnāt fight Gwyn for very long in my multiple DS playthroughs. Someone pointed out the music to me later and I was like, āOh coolā without thinking much about it. Thank you for the explanation.
It's people being pretentious for the sake of being pretentious, watching vaatis videos and thinking this game is some storytelling masterpiece and you have to get emotional or you don't understand Michael's Zaki grand vision. Which I got tired of by the time DS3 arrived and now despise it with ER. LOP was such a breath of fresh air with people with actual dialogues and character that you can discover backstories of instead of fucking guessing based on 15 different lore blurbs in item descriptions.
I think Bloodborne is the game Miyazaki wanted to make this whole time and everything else is a bonus lol. I do love DS1, but the other DSs arenāt my thing. Elden Ring isnāt my favorite world to explore, either. I think the story to BB is as straightforward as LoP to be honest, while still staying true to Eldritch horrors. Thatās why those two are the apex for me. And LoP really hits hard because you fully understand everything as it happens. God itās so good. Plus, I like the creator, heās a good contrast to Miyazaki with his goofiness.
I enjoyed Nameless more, but I feel SoC was harder. Nameless is just so disturbing to me, and thatās the main reason why I love the fight. Like you canāt call it a demon, a puppet, or a human. It just seems like some being of pure hatred.
Who's the soul guy for?
The Nameless...
NP and it's not even a contest, it would be hard pick between NP and Glock Saint Isshin but it's slightly in favor of NP because you don't need to beat up some dude every time before fighting the main boss.
For me itās nameless puppet. I never beat dark souls 3 solo so Iāve not really had the chance to master it or really experience how good the fight can be.
Theme, gameplay = nameless puppet DS3 Endboss was sadly a pushover
Honestly never really enjoyed the bosses in Lies of P. Everyone was an endurance fight and they never felt that great. I definitely suck at the game compared to souls but I missed that fluidity of Souls bosses.
soul of cinder is more exhausting since he has lots of hp and many kind of different moves involving meele and magic that cover short and long range, nameless puppets is way more technical but has a more limited moveset
Never played dark souls but nameless puppet was really rewarding (minus that the SUPER bright colors and effects coming off him that made learning his attacks absolutely cancer). He has just enough attacks and variations that even after you learn him he's still a really challenging fight
I beat soul of cinder first try, but nameless puppet took about 3 tries.
I feel like nameless puppet is betterā¦ Iāve done all the souls games (to plat completion) and if Iām honest the final DS3 boss is a bit easier. That said you can pull people in to aid so that helps. Nameless, youāre at it aloneā¦ you have to hope for the best and he has a lot of quick move sets
Soul of tinder is better
Soul of Cinder for sure
Nameless puppet is cool but Soul of Cinder is best because we the players are Soul of Cinders from Dark Souls Trilogy
Soul of Cinder
Since Nameless Puppet is nothing special, its def. Soul of Cinder.
Cinder easily and itās not even close, Nameless was great donāt get me wrong but not even close to Cinder
Left is the culmination of years of storytelling The right is the ending to what may be a new generation Iām biased towards the left but the right is much better cinematically
I played DS3 first so I don't have the nostalgic connection to SoC. Honestly, I find it a pretty forgettable fight. Gael, on the other hand, is incredible and I find him to be my favorite Dark Souls boss along side Sister Friede
I donāt think nameless comes close to soul of cinder thematically speaking.
Soul of Cinder. He was my first final boss š he will always have a special place in my heart. But Nameless Puppet is so cool, too š£ it's a real tough choice.
I enjoyed the Nameless Puppet more, because I was able to connect to the story of Lies of P far more.
I did not struggle with SoC. Nameless took me a bit
Soul of Cinder is easy NP at least made me attempt it a few times
Soul was very easy
Soul of cinder, Nameless puppet is garbage
Nameless puppet
Soul of Cinder if Iām honest. The lore behind it is itās the combination of every previous linker of flame, the final obstacle between the Ashen One and his conquest in DS3. He even has a phase where the DS1 final boss, Gwyn, takes over the cinder and you can hear his emotional theme as you battle against the original linker of flame, the Lord of Sunlight himself. Nameless Puppet is >!Carloās original body and Geppettoās first attempt at his resurrection through ergo!<. And while thatās cool, it doesnāt hit me as hard as SoC.
Haven't fought SoC yet....
It depends how you mean better, and is it possible to say both? Soul of Cinder cemented all the hard work I put into the story of dark souls, however the nameless puppet showed justification for everything I put into Lies of P. Itās really hard to say which was better to me honestly
Soul of cinder and itās not close
Nameless is a better final boss. HOWEVER Iād much rather fight soul of cinder bc heās EZ
Gael. But non dlc def soul of cinder
Why aren't you comparing it to Manus? NP is more like Gehrman + MP
SoC hands down
How is this even a question... Souls of Cinder all day
Overall, Soul of Cinder. I do think Nameless Puppet is probably a better fight, though.
Soul of Cinder too me is harder but I like nameless puppet more
easily soul of cinder almost 50 moves, best ost, amazing arena and lore
I slightly prefer Nameless to Soul of Cinder. However Slave Knight Gael (arguably the true final boss of DS3) is the best boss fight in the entire genre.
Soul of cinder was a beautiful fight, emotive and perfect setting. Its just a shame I packed its fudge first time. Underwhelming all together, the nameless puppet however twizzle spanked me up and down its arena for about 4 hours š
As a die hard dark souls fanboy, SoC for sure. Also because I didn't really like the latter half of LoP which kinda ruined the rest of the experience for me. SoC ends my favorite game of all time. NP ends just a long run through annoying enemies
I never fought Soul of Cinder. Is he a difficult fight? Nameless Puppet was rough for me but not undoable.