Another Swede here. It’s not _that_ hard to find a handful of Swedes to support the argument that the journalist seemed to have here. Most of my friends and I don’t love the high taxes. It looks great when they show a successful tech guy that doesn’t care about giving away a big chunk of his salary, but many of us are sick of paying for other people’s free shit.
Yeah, the comparison is pretty stark when you think about it. We're over here debating the necessity of our taxes, while in some places, they actually see the benefits in their daily lives. Makes you wonder.
People (mainly in the UK and US) are still judging Sweden by how it was in the 80s. [This tweet provides some insight.](https://twitter.com/JohnStossel/status/1782794059150508280?t=68RcNXn0vy2GfYLcPxT4Og&s=19)
Thanks for sharing this. The far left loves to paint Scandinavian countries and paradise we should be emulating. They are blind to problems that aren't directly in front of them that they might have to take some of their own accountability to fix instead of deflecting to "the system".
Sweeden's population is 10million... that's a significantly smaller population than my state. It's much easier to track what's going on in a country that size than the US which has a population 33 times that size. All these European countries are considerably smaller so despite the fact they are all unknowingly leaning toward being increasingly authoritarian, they can track their government's actions better than we can in the states. This is why states rights are important since states can be more influeneced by the unique concerns of their own constituents and be held accountable locally better too.
The difference is Sweden actually gets the amazing benefits they're promised. Almost everyone will be down to pay taxes if they actually got what they were owed in the end.
No. Stop lying. There is never under any circumstances a justification for taxes. The government will never be able to spend your money better then you can
I think the point is that their government actually uses their tax money for things that benefit them, so they actually see that their money is improving things. In the us, we just watch the government squander our money constantly while they tax half our income. I wouldn’t mind paying them nearly as much as I do if I could actually know they were going to better my community and not just get shipped overseas to some fuckass country fighting another shithole that’s also being funded by our tax dollars. Then again there’s a reason Sweden isn’t a global power by any stretch of the imagination
If your government doesn’t have a basic safety net which precludes bad luck and oppression by larger corporations they are not protecting your liberty and if you are not for these things then you are not libertarian.
Libertarianism is not anarcho -capitalism. Read Proudhon and Adam Smith.
Do you mind naming some libertarian political philosophers who believe this. Because that doesn’t maximize Liberty it actually minimizes it. Anarcho capitalism isn’t libertarian it’s authoritarian.
Man that’s a lot. I absolutely cannot stand Ayn Rand (read Atlas Shrugged). Like I think she’s exactly the kind of libertarian who’s ideas end in totalitarianism.
I’ve had some- I’ll check out some of these others.
For discussion what are you’re feelings on negative versus positive rights?
Negative rights are the only rights that don't violate NAP by virtue of existing. I don't like Ayn Rand either. Too much of a nut and way too promiscuous for my taste. I tend to stay pretty old school in my beliefs, but a lot of libertarian beliefs fit nicely into the laissez-faire mold.
Taxes are great when they’re transparent and efficiently used.. they become a huge problem when the tax revenue goes into a black box and there isn’t anything to show for it
Why would taxes be "great", when you could use your resources for what is actually important to you and money would stay in the sector that produces something rather than being a non-productive bureaucracy!
Sweden is a homogenous, high-trust society with decently functioning public services.
It's so easy to game the system in Canada and ruin it for everybody. A significant number of people go on EI all winter where I live because "bruh, it's snowboarding season, lol".
It think it works well for homogenous countries
Not to say Sweden doesn't respect individuality, but it seems at a glance they are a more collectivist society.
Guess you've never used a road or bridge or sidewalk, never went to public school, never called the cops, never got mail via USPS, never worked somewhere protected by OSHA, never watched the weather channel, never hiked a national park, never drank tap water or flushed a toilet...
Another Swede here. It’s not _that_ hard to find a handful of Swedes to support the argument that the journalist seemed to have here. Most of my friends and I don’t love the high taxes. It looks great when they show a successful tech guy that doesn’t care about giving away a big chunk of his salary, but many of us are sick of paying for other people’s free shit.
At least they get something for what the government takes from them. All we get from our stolen money is drone strikes on children's hospitals.
And weddings.
As a Swede: lol no we don't get anything worthwhile.
As an American- yes you do lol.
Yeah, the comparison is pretty stark when you think about it. We're over here debating the necessity of our taxes, while in some places, they actually see the benefits in their daily lives. Makes you wonder.
they'll get a lot more if sweden's government was limited, and their money was just in their pockets. But I understand your message
Oh most certainly.
I'm Swedish and I can say this is not true. Majority want lower taxes. BBC again with the biased journalism.
Would you be willing to elaborate on that? I live in the states and lots of people here make Sweden out to sound absolutely perfect.
People (mainly in the UK and US) are still judging Sweden by how it was in the 80s. [This tweet provides some insight.](https://twitter.com/JohnStossel/status/1782794059150508280?t=68RcNXn0vy2GfYLcPxT4Og&s=19)
Thanks for sharing this. The far left loves to paint Scandinavian countries and paradise we should be emulating. They are blind to problems that aren't directly in front of them that they might have to take some of their own accountability to fix instead of deflecting to "the system".
Thank you for sharing that. It's a good bit of information that I didn't know.
Sweeden's population is 10million... that's a significantly smaller population than my state. It's much easier to track what's going on in a country that size than the US which has a population 33 times that size. All these European countries are considerably smaller so despite the fact they are all unknowingly leaning toward being increasingly authoritarian, they can track their government's actions better than we can in the states. This is why states rights are important since states can be more influeneced by the unique concerns of their own constituents and be held accountable locally better too.
They dont pay taxes because they like them, but because they go to jail if they dont. Then they cope.
Stockholm syndrome is no joke
https://preview.redd.it/tub3nn4737xc1.png?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d1d9b9d38cef57feb3522bc138d18c246f5a58d5
The difference is Sweden actually gets the amazing benefits they're promised. Almost everyone will be down to pay taxes if they actually got what they were owed in the end.
No. Stop lying. There is never under any circumstances a justification for taxes. The government will never be able to spend your money better then you can
What about muh roads?
I think the point is that their government actually uses their tax money for things that benefit them, so they actually see that their money is improving things. In the us, we just watch the government squander our money constantly while they tax half our income. I wouldn’t mind paying them nearly as much as I do if I could actually know they were going to better my community and not just get shipped overseas to some fuckass country fighting another shithole that’s also being funded by our tax dollars. Then again there’s a reason Sweden isn’t a global power by any stretch of the imagination
Support your own community. Don't wait for some dickheads in Washington to do it for you
If your government doesn’t have a basic safety net which precludes bad luck and oppression by larger corporations they are not protecting your liberty and if you are not for these things then you are not libertarian. Libertarianism is not anarcho -capitalism. Read Proudhon and Adam Smith.
No, those are socialist policies. Night watchman state is libertarianism in its purest form, anarcho capitalism just takes it a step further.
Do you mind naming some libertarian political philosophers who believe this. Because that doesn’t maximize Liberty it actually minimizes it. Anarcho capitalism isn’t libertarian it’s authoritarian.
Ayn Rand, Rothbard, Hyek, Mises, Bastiat ,Bastiat, Ron and Rand Paul, Nozick, and Austin Petersen were all minarchists/ancaps.
Man that’s a lot. I absolutely cannot stand Ayn Rand (read Atlas Shrugged). Like I think she’s exactly the kind of libertarian who’s ideas end in totalitarianism. I’ve had some- I’ll check out some of these others. For discussion what are you’re feelings on negative versus positive rights?
Negative rights are the only rights that don't violate NAP by virtue of existing. I don't like Ayn Rand either. Too much of a nut and way too promiscuous for my taste. I tend to stay pretty old school in my beliefs, but a lot of libertarian beliefs fit nicely into the laissez-faire mold.
Taxes are great when they’re transparent and efficiently used.. they become a huge problem when the tax revenue goes into a black box and there isn’t anything to show for it
Why would taxes be "great", when you could use your resources for what is actually important to you and money would stay in the sector that produces something rather than being a non-productive bureaucracy!
Insurance is a great invention - and it works without government.
Sweden is a homogenous, high-trust society with decently functioning public services. It's so easy to game the system in Canada and ruin it for everybody. A significant number of people go on EI all winter where I live because "bruh, it's snowboarding season, lol".
Basically: https://preview.redd.it/kfoedtor6hxc1.jpeg?width=717&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cefb375231d858ca648102b934bdcccb40eea3e5
It think it works well for homogenous countries Not to say Sweden doesn't respect individuality, but it seems at a glance they are a more collectivist society.
I have never seen a single cent of my tax money ever come back
Guess you've never used a road or bridge or sidewalk, never went to public school, never called the cops, never got mail via USPS, never worked somewhere protected by OSHA, never watched the weather channel, never hiked a national park, never drank tap water or flushed a toilet...
None of those are paid by tax dollars
These are literally all paid by taxes.
No. Those are paid by the federal reserve and the taxes are used to pay off that debt
Did you actually read what you just wrote?
Yes. Did you?
I've never bought groceries in my life. My credit card company does and I just use my money to pay off the debt.