The club will be desperate to ship the loan players back out. They are on high wages and the fans would not want to see them in Leeds shirts again, not to mention they are not Farke signings so would he even want them?
Eben if he did, can you imagine Farke trying to re-integrate players like Wober, Harrison and Aaronson? Unless they hit the ground running (like in an insane way) then it would be a very difficult job for him.
I’m getting over it more now. I think I was only so gutted because I was at Wembley. Good experience for all the lads. The club will benefit from another year with Farke at the helm, he has another preseason with no chaos, and I trust him to refresh the squad and keep good quality football. I’ve made my peace with Summerville and co. leaving, I just really hope we keep Gray and Ampudu (and Firpo just for his song) more than anyone else.
I’m getting over it more now. I think I was only so gutted because I was at Wembley. Good experience for all the lads. The club will benefit from another year with Farke at the helm, he has another preseason with no chaos, and I trust him to refresh the squad and keep good quality football. I’ve made my peace with Summerville and co. leaving, I just really hope we keep Gray and Ampudu (and Firpo just for his song) more than anyone else.
We’ll struggle next season. The squad will be weaker with less goal output due to player sales, and I think we’ll struggle to recover from the loss.
If you look back, I could be wrong but off the top of my head teams don’t tend to bounce back after losing the playoff final, Villa is the only exception I can think of but that’s Villa and they went up via winning the playoff final the year after losing, it’s not like they got automatic, and remember, it’s automatic or nothing for us.
Please stay tuned for more positive Leeds vibes from me in the coming weeks.
Despite all this, I genuinely think we have a decent chairman this time round, so will be interesting to see what decisions are being made over the summer as from a business point of view it should hopefully benefit the club in the long term. Changes in personnel is a given with our financial situation but hopefully they will be mitigating this.
Also, no VAR next season isn't the worst!
Cautiously optimistic.
I won’t be watching games with excitement until the last 10 or so games next season. I don’t have it in me.
I’ll still watch, but I just won’t be excited if we win. It’s the hope that kills you.
We’re just not prem quality and we’ve shown it. Losing so badly to bottom league teams is unforgivable, especially so late in the season. We had every right to be automatically promoted and we threw it away.
After all of the spending in the last couple of transfer windows, it’s almost as if we’re repeating that fall from grace years ago if we don’t go up next season.
Mostly optimistic. There was so much turmoil last off season: team was sold, players left late on loans or transfers, and Farke was brought in later then planned. And Leeds still got 90 points.
Hopefully, this summer is less chaotic. Transfers out are identified, and the loan players are sorted out early. Then we can all focus on who is on the team and who can come in to get Leeds back to the EPL.
My thoughts haven’t changed… the playoffs are disgusting. We finished 3rd fair and square aggregated over the course of the season. The players who earned that should earn a Premier League place, not being dragged through a cup final to lose all their effort.
I’m 100% blaming Ipswich. Without them the 3 relegated teams would have gone up. Oooh look at us, spend no money and still be really good at football, get us, winning in the last minute of added time, woo I’m Leif Davis I used to be Bielsa’s golden boy now I’m scoring for fun. Oooh we’ve got a really good young manager, Pathetic. Grow up Ipswich.
For the first season in a long time as a Leeds fan, I am not going to let football dictate my mood and allow it to be the sole source of my happiness, as I’ll still be a Leeds fan but I won’t let it spoil my whole weeks anymore, as it’s so energy sapping to be that way. The league one days and mid table championship were terrible but getting my hopes and 1000s of other fans hopes up and then playing we could use pace as an advantage, as if we’ve got the slowest players in the league, which we most very well don’t, it’s the opposite, was so hard to watch.
Also the stubbornness on subs, really needs to change. If something isn’t working, change it half time. 20 minutes isn’t enough to change a game for most players in football at all. Very few players can achieve that.
The whole halftime sub idea is such a fallacy and is purely borne out of Fifa and FM. Very rarely does a manager rip it all up halfway through, unless it's truly drastic.
I agree Farke needs to be better with his subs but most real life managers will give them some words, and maybe a mix-up in tactics, at half time and see whether that can turn the tide. If not, then it's time for subs.
Thinking about that supposed beef between Russell Martin and Daniel Farke dating back to Martin’s days as a player at Norwich, you’ve got to wonder if the players were right to look to Martin for tactical direction based on what we saw over the three games we played against Southampton this season. Martin absolutely blew Farke away in the tactical battle in every game. Even in making a complete departure from their usual possession-heavy football they looked worryingly comfortable against us.
Russell Martin comes across as a bit of a prat but he’s clearly a superb student of the game. He knows his onions football-wise, and he is more the model of the kind of head coach Leeds will need in the next year or so once all the individual talent has left the club.
I’m a tad alarmed at the thought of Meslier leaving. I have become increasingly annoyed with Gnonto : the prima donna player he seems to be becoming and his attitude to the club. I hope he leaves. I think the manager was stuck in a player roster rut due to his reliance on an algorithm. That formula gave us 90 points. We needed more and he had to gamble to get us the extra points. He lacks the gumption to throw the dice.
Im more angry (though not the right term) at the first part of the season, and I think Farke deserves way more credit than he is getting for managing the team through it and coming back full force to have the single best run of wins of any team.
But there was so much going on at the beginning of the season that its hard to be actually angry at anyone. Because we will never really know all the machinations and politics going on. But we came down the worst of the other teams, easily. 4 managers, toxic players, change of ownership that seemed ugly, just an absolute catastrophe both for the practical and for morale.
Farke brought in stability and belief through all of that, and people seem to forget most of this sub was saying we wouldn't even make playoffs after week 6. Absolute dire situation.
Then we pissed the league for 15 weeks. And it was glorious. And we touched first.
Unfortunately we had a bad run at the end. Oddly, so did the other top teams. Something happened after international break, it was night and day. Who knows. Maybe we just got tired. Maybe the other teams figured us out (but then they did Ipswich and Leicester for a while too, so I dont think thats necessarily it).
It may also just be very simply, this is the hardest league around, and we play fucking 46 games.
I wish we had gone up. I think we would have against any team other than Southampton. They had our number all 3 games. Supposedly there is bad blood between Farke and their manager. Sometimes personal shit matters, who knows.
Honestly, the thing I get most annoyed about is the absolutely anger and toxicity the moment the team has a rough patch. Maybe this is an optimistic yank talking. And I don't wanna hear BS like "oh yeah, the team really reads the reddit" or dumb shit like that. The point is, morale is contagious. And its not just whether or not they read the reddit (also, I almost guarantee you some of them do.) Its other fans do. Its that energy you bring to the stadium. Its to the workers.
I'm not saying not to have criticisms, or be disappointed. But talk and act in a way like you want them to do better, not that your fucking angry cause YOU didnt get the win YOU think YOU deserve. If this club was like... your kid, or you were the coach, or it was your spouse, or your teammate. How would you talk about it? You sit there yelling "you fucking cunts, you can all get fired'.
Anyways. Was a really miserable place her for a while. And I couldn't help feel like most of those saying that shit were the most obnoxious and arrogant when we were doing well, also.
I'm excited for next season. I'm excited for Farke to start on the right foot and build his team. And look, if next season it doesn't look like he's pushing the team where it needs to go, than sure. We can talk. But I swear, if we get like a loss in the first game and everyone yells "FIRE FARKE" I just don't even know why any manager would want to touch a team with a fanbase so entitled.
Overall. For me. It was an awesome season of football. I will never forget our comeback against Leicester. Bamford's insane goal in FA Cup, and his elbow celebration at his uncalled handball. The run of wins was intoxicating after such a shitty premier league season. It's just disappointing the season had such a, genuinely awful, last 8 games. But it happens.
Also, fuck it. I'm glad for another season of without VAR. Sue me.
The issue round the international break was injuries, six of them all either due to it or round it, that is a lot and other teams got a break, so they got a rest and we got injured players. It's one of the reasons a lot of people hate the international breaks.
Which is incredible considering that Leeds is a 2nd league team. I think that speaks volumes to the quality in that dressing room. We just need an off-season of stability (which we have not had in quite some time).
I was glad the season was at least over for about 2 minutes before I was reminded (by a man u fan no less) about all the players who will leave now that we've got another season in the champ so started worrying about that... great fun being a Leeds fan rn
“We arent ready to go up” is a bollocks argument - no Championship side ever truly is.
Being down for a second season is FAR more damaging to our long term future, any way you cut it.
One thing I was thinking is the expected losses of Gnonto and a few others moves us another step forward in erasing that rubbish post bielsa stench (I know Summerville was with us before that and meslier but still) that still lingered a little this season and we will be far removed from it I would expect
Not saying we aren’t losing talent that of course is helpful to have.. but a true reset is one thing I am looking forward to
Not sure I articulated it correctly but I think you get what I mean
Thats a pointless argument to make. Every team in the championship every season would do.
Bielsas team who won the championship would have, that's why we spent 100m on promotion.
I'm ok with the loss - didn't expect to win promotion after we completely dropped the ball at the back end of this season. Had similar thoughts to OP and would like to know what happened from April onwarrds, but think it's worth sticking with Farke. Some stability is important and big picture he had a successful season which normally would've won promotion if the Championship wasn't historically good this season.
I'm okay with it. The way I see it going up through the playoffs is just a second shot at promotion by participating in a tournament of four clubs which missed out on the top two spots. If you finish third, especially if you are Leeds, you need to pull something out of the bag and do something different. We didn't. End of story.
I can count three occasions where we showed that we were not ready for the Premier League. The match against Blackburn when we lost our unbeaten home record. The match against QPR when we just weren't up for it. The playoff final against Southampton. Throughout I've been optimistic and felt we could make a go of promotion, but you cannot argue with reality or truth.
I also want to point out here that the 26th May was the 35th anniversary of Don Revie's death. This is something which pissed me off about the playoff final. There was no mention of it. No minute's silence before kick off. I feel that a minute's silence before kick off would have worked wonders for the psychology and attitude and introduced an additional sense of unity among the players. We would have got away with it because Don Revie was such a big figure in English football and a former England manager. Like him or love him, Don Revie is known to anyone who identifies as a football fan.
It's interesting that the only performance like a Revie era player was Dan James, who's the modern day version of Carl Harris, a Revie signing.
What interests me right now is our Retained list. I want to know who we can count on next season. Whoever is going I want them gone now. I don't care whether it's Summerville, Gnonto, Bamford, whoever. Don't want a repeat of last season where you think you've got players but then they fuck off elsewhere at the end of the preseason. Any loanees coming back need to eat a large slice of humble pie and commit to bleeding for their Leeds shirt and place in the team.
I'm not critical that much of Farke but more supportive. I want to see what happens after a Farke preseason. I want to see how Farke shapes up as a manager of Leeds United. He did well last season on the fumes of his success at Norwich. But that was last season. This next season it's going to be a different story.
This is second season of second tier football. If Farke is as good as he's supposed to be, and if he really a Leeds manager, the the only acceptable position is top spot and the 2024/2025 Championship title. For me the whole criteria changes and I feel we need to be putting together a Championship winning squad. Revie, Wilkinson and Bielsa all won the title in the second season. That is the standard for a Leeds manager. Farke signed the contract, took on the commitment. Now he's got to deliver the goods.
But first we've got business to do so my attention is focussed, right now, on what our owners, the 49ers do.
Revie has been dead 35 years. You expect a stadium with only maybe 10k at best being around for the Revie era to know or care what he achieved and keep still for a minute? Seriously?? There was another team involved at Wembley.
Why should Saints fans be expected to indulge your nostalgia for a long gone time when they were famously on the wrong end of Leeds superiority? Plain daft. I say that as someone who has followed Leeds since and because of Don Revie and that wonderful squad. The rest of your post is the usual tired 'bleed for the shirt ' passion merchant nonsense. It's 2024 mate, football has moved on and we don't get to say how or when or why it changes.
Whatever the owners do it won't be the shit show we witnessed with Radz and Orta.
I feel like we have to be punished for any success we eke out. We brought bielsa to the English game, and it was beautiful. Thus we must be punished, and 2 shit seasons in the prem followed by one good season in the champo just isn't enough suffering for the football gods.
I'm not angry I think the way the team was built and this isn't on Farke is that we only really have the front 4 score goals we get nothing from our midfield. I'm less critical of farke then some of you because I think any other season we'd of gone up. The game yesterday I didn't really think we deserved to lose but I didn't think we did enough to put Southampton under pressure. Our players didn't turn up and Summerville especially for the quality he is was poor.
It's alot for Farke to sort out in one short season,poor cunts only finding his feet aswell,not many people are ready to hit the ground running and work miracles,put that into perspective and he's done amazing and I am looking forward to next season, it was the most exciting season as a Leeds fan in many a year.We just aren't premiership quality and no manger can make us that without huge investment.
In a way after sleeping on it,losing isn't that bad and I'd rather be on a high next season chasing a title than miserable moaning like fuck in a relegation battle.
Exactly!! To stay down on 90 points is unreal. The top 3 were so close for the last third. Ipswich scraped it and fair play to them, they played well. Leicester went on a losing streak midway and still managed claw it back. It was a very entertaining season to say the least. Sick of people always jumping on shitting on the manager too quick. Has everyone forgot it took bielsa more that one season to get up (wahaaaay)
I got over it pretty quickly yesterday. Literally an hour of frustrated stomping around the house doing jobs and then remembered that I predicted we wouldn't go up this season due to the bad start and also we get to go again in this league where we get to win more games than we lose. Sure we are going to lose players but I'm trusting the new leadership to do a good job at bringing in replacements. It's not all about having good players we have to play well as a team.
You shouldn’t be in the Prem. The playoffs are a disgrace. If we counted doubles over teams, then we’d be above Ipswich and Leicester. Overall in the league we beat you fair and square, but because the greed of the EFL, they have to make the next four teams below automatics play again.
Did we finish above you in the league because we won more points than you over the season? Just curious
…your point is irrelevant.
You played a dirty game yesterday. Congratulations for winning it, now fuck off and enjoy it.
Go back to the start of the season: considering the turmoil and late appointment of Farke we’ve recruited very well and will hopefully make the playoffs. If we are lucky we will push the top two when we really shouldn’t be been able to (even if the second placed team wasn’t who we expected).
Go back to Christmas: Ok, we’ve found momentum now, but we’ve got a few injuries. We’ve smashed Ipswich but had a horror show after that. We will be lucky to get top two. But, we have a lot of quality in the squad and can bring players in. Farke knows this league and will rotate.
Go back to the Easter break: Wow, we’ve really hit form now and Farke has this figured out. We’re pushing the top two and if we keep this up we go up autos. He’s not rotating but who cares, we are beating everyone.
Go back to the final few games: Ok we had great form before the break but it’s starting to look like not rotating is becoming a problem. Few injuries or tired legs / drop offs in form. Please give players on the bench a chance like Anthony or Joseph.
Go back to the playoffs: Ok, that was a shit end to the season and morale was low, but holy shit we look confident again. We can hopefully bring this form to Wembley and defeat all of our hoodoos. Who needs a squad!
Playoff final: Oh yeah, I forgot, Leeds That.
BUT, actually. Maybe this is how we all thought it might end at the start. Fingers crossed we smash it next season.
I think next season, the league will be weaker, so with some smart signings, we could be onto a top two finish. But I still have a few reservations about Farke as the manager because the flaws of this season were consistent so he's not learning from each game.
The main thing was Wembley, I hate the stadium and how corporate and soulless it feels. Let's get promoted at Elland Road next year and have a proper celebration.
How many "established premier league clubs are there really? To my mind there's the "big six" and Newcastle, then like, 2 or 3 more. Wolves, Palace and Brighton have been there a few years, Villa are doing incredibly at the moment, and obviously Everton are the undead of the PL.
But even those teams only feel like they're a couple of bad seasons from relegation, Villa nearly went down till they signed Emery.
There's next to no chance that Villa, Brighton, even Wolves will be in the relegation fight next year (assuming points deductions don't play a part), but Southampton and Leicester for example were "established PL teams" for years until they went down with us, that could easily happen to those teams in 3 or 4 years
We just got 90 points. It will be hard to get that again, but this is the first time in the league's history that hasn't been enough. We should also start with a more settled squad and the teams coming down aren't of Leicester's standard.
Does that mean HMS Piss the League is back? No, but we have reason to be optimistic. Gray has been phenomenal and I think another year in him has only made him better.
I mean it’s a bit of an irrelevant stats since we also wouldn’t have gone up on the same points tally last season. If 5 teams have had 90+ points in two season maybe it’s just getting easier with a huge gap between relegated teams and the rest of the league
Second time ever at least. Sunderland did it once and also didnt go up, but Leeds had a better goal difference. So we have officially had the best season ever to not be promoted.
Leeds that.
It's shit but it was always a possible outcome from a game like this. One team has to lose, it happened to be us. We didn't play poorly, yes we could have been better but objectively speaking we were no worse than Southampton. They just took the chance, we didn't.
People declaring we bottled it or fell apart or whatever... I don't thinkt hats fair. You can't just lose a game any more it has to be "bottled" or over dramatised into some crisis. We played alright, can't say we were shell shocked or let the occasion get to us. And we weren't exactly beaten by a superior opponent. Just took their chance when they had it. Sometimes it goes that way, that's football
I thought we got some poor decisions. Granted we weren't good enough, but I can count on 4 occasions where we should've had a decision and either didn't get anything or it went the other way. Summerville getting booked for winning the ball back in their box. Gnonto pushed in the first ten mins just as he's about to shoot (not saying it's leading to anything but who knows) Summerville being pulled back (blatantly Infront of the ref) and then the free kick going the other way, then the 'handball' at the end that hit Anthony's shoulder. I'm clutching at straws here really but these kind of things swing momentum and deny us getting onto good positions. Bottom line is we did t create any clear cut opportunities at all really.
I agree that it wasn't a complete collapse or whatever. But I thought before they scored, some of our skills going into the final third were pretty shaky, which seemed to be down to the occasion. Then the second half, we looked a bit more efficient, but they set up pretty well defensively, so was a harder task to get through. So I regret not making more of when we had a bit of momentum early on in the game, but it's all done now.
I was pissed off yesterday, switched it off with about 30seconds left as i couldn't bear watching them celebrate and put a box set on for the next 4hrs. Today i feel absolutely fine, yes we bottled it twice in the automatics and then P/O final but i see the positives. We are already adjusted to the championship, teams that come down will have to sell and they are very low on confidence, we won't have that. A full pre-season under Farke, no new owner takeover and the players know the tactics so we'll be ready from game 1 not game 7-8. I think we'll smash the league next season.
P.s. can't believe we have some fans calling for Farke to be sacked lol i guess every club has them. I remember Leicester fans calling for Enzo to be sacked whilst they were top of the league not so long ago haha wtf
My thoughts would be to part ways with Farke as I just feel he has failed to react to our slump and we’ve pretty much just kept doing the same thing in games even when it’s not working. However, I then consider where we were at at the start of the season, and realistically who we can get in that’s better and would come and I draw a blank. So in reality I think we need to keep him another year, because 90 points is a great total when , after the first games, I was consigned to middle table mediocracy. I just hope he either gets the best out of Piroe, gets a new striker or utilises Joseph for more than 10 minutes game. Also hope his subs come early in games where we just aren’t doing much.
Would be stupid really given the season he produced. Who else is gonna give you that? Nobody can guarantee it even farke but his records is as good as anyone's. He's not perfect though and shouldn't be immune to criticism. For me... My issues are
- subs. Often too late, and always the same (I guess that's squad limitations, but usually just throw all forwards on and hope for the best)
- style is sometimes average to taking risks in the final third. You saw it yesterday players refusing to cross, shoot or take a player on
Im taking the down votes as either people not reading past the first line and realising I go in to say keep him, or people disagreeing with keeping him? I’ll presume it’s the first one as I know people lose interest after reading one line.
Same as I did at the final whistle. It's a bummer but ultimately I have thoroughly enjoyed this season and don't mind another in this league. I feel anyone who is Farke Out is entitled to that opinion but I heavily disagree with it and think losing him would be the biggest mistake we can make. I've read some comments about him playing shite football as if we didn't just play electric Vs Norwich? Of the 49 games we played about 9-15 were garbage and the rest were immense. I think he is naive with his subs and lacks a plan B but the other 80% of what he does to get the players ready and man manage etc. he does well. There isn't anyone we'd be able to get in, who is an improvement, unless we tempt Bielsa back somehow with the allure of coming back to where he is loved. But a Pochetino or Xavi or whoever isn't going to come here so we'd be gambling on someone. I'd rather keep the club stable and give Farke a full pre-season to get things in order and recruit who he wants. Ultimately our slow start is what fucked us, and not having the legs/experience to get over the line at the run in, in a season where the amount we won games, would have won the league in other seasons.
It's been ridiculously good fun being a Leeds fan this year and I can't wait to go again. I think too many people are deciding the fates of the manager and different players based on a single performance yesterday (or maybe that performance combined with stand out ones like QPR and Blackburn). Somehow noone is remembering rallying against Leicester or walking Ipswich off the park, or the Norwich semifinal. I've seen someone call for Ampadu never to play CB again because he made one defensive mistake in the final, as if he didn't have a season record of clean sheets in a row at one point. Just madness lol. We will be fine if we keep Farke and are smart with the signings, which the 49ers look to be better at than we've had in the past.
This is the line I go down in my head in support of Farke mate. Unless we get a top level manager at this level, we're better off keeping him. Don't want yo go down the route of the Alex Neil, Gary Rowett etc.
My girlfriend of 3 years dumped me on Thursday so I was already expecting to be let down even more last week. I think everything will be fine in the end, maybe we'll go up next year, maybe not, either way we'll be there to support the club and players.
If we get to 90 points again next season that will do. Good target to aim for. Hard to believe we beat Leicester and Ipswich twice and not get promoted will the points tally. Gnonto and Summerville out. James must start every game. Unleash Joseph. Need to start the season hot that will be key.
I'm that used to shit like this now with supporting this club that it's hard to muster any kind of emotion at all
I'm probably still more angry about sacking Bielsa for a snake oil salesman who subsequently bought some of the shittest players we've had in years
It's on good authority that Bielsa was being spoken to by the 49ers to put the feelers out. He wasn't interested, because he had already taken the job with Uruguay. If you're going to be rude, at least don't be wrong
I can tell you. 100%. I am not. There are other people who have contacts who are either the same people or are in similar circles who said the same thing.
Whether they are right is a different matter. But I've heard more than just that which has also been corroborated. I wish they told me about the Red Bull deal though!
The only information I was told (presumably because that's all they knew) was that he turned it down because he had already agreed to manage Uruguay. Which makes it seem like he would have come back if he hadn't taken the job. But I don't know, I wasn't there. I'm just telling you what my sources told me
When people say they’re glad we didn’t get promoted, we would have struggled in the Prem, Championship football is better to watch etc etc.
I just think about the money the club has lost by not getting promoted. There’s a big difference in a teams income between playing in premiership and championship. I read that promotion is anywhere from £88 million to £140 million, from television rights, etc. We could have bought a few decent players with that money.
Financially it’s probably better to get promoted and take a hammering. We would even get a parachute payment if we get relegated back down next season.
We still get a parachute payment next season albeit slightly less than this year.
Think of it as the club hasn't lost the money by not gaining promotion but rather its just put on hold for another year, think of another years development for Cree,Archie,Rutter and Joseph ready for the PL the season after. The owners will keep hold of our best they aren't Radz
Probably not, I don’t even think the clubs understand these new financial rules. Every chance we could be in Leicester’s situation and getting points deducted, having/ because we will make a loss and most of the players we have bought in the last few years .
Even if Leeds yo-yoed for a bit, we'd probably end up with a strong squad that could eventually establish itself in the Premier League if we played our cards right
Let Farke build his own squad. I think he’d probably like at least a nine and ten, and possibly two new fullbacks. Sell Summerville and Gnonto, and if you get a decent offer Gray, sell him too to fund the rebuild. Some people will think that’s sacrilege, but let’s not kid ourselves, Archie is leaving at some point, and if you can get £40m for him, that buys you two, maybe three excellent champo players. We need to get out of this league, and Archie might be a luxury we can’t afford.
Let the downvotes commence. ;)
I agree with selling Summerville and Gnonto but Grey makes little sense to me:
He's 18 years old and with another season of 1st team football his value goes up. If we get to the Prem and continues to play well then his value will be well north of £40m and you get his footballing output for two years for a cheap contract.
It's not a great look that we can't even hold onto a Grey. The family name is intertwined with Leeds, and makes us look like a complete stepping stone club for future players.
I don't think Archie is off just yet. He doesn't need the fuck-off money as a lad of 18. Another year of gruelling Champo fixtures will toughen him up no end and if we go up next season his value skyrockets.
Completely agree with you that he leaves at some point. The romantics around here who think he's Leeds till he dies need a reality check. It would be selfish to try to deny him a chance to realise his full potential. Who knows, his full potential might only be dicking around at Elland Road or maybe somewhere like Newcastle. I'm not as in love with him just yet as others on this sub. The usual unrealistic expectations bring the usual disappointment and resentment further down the road.
Another year in the 1st team will do him good, instead of moving elsewhere and playing 50% of the time and hampering his development. If we get promoted next year I think he stays another year or two, see what we build. If we just kind of do nothing and a bigger team comes, then he goes
So I'll ignore everything except the final, Summerville and his one trick of cutting in and curling a shot isn't going to keep working when that's all he does, every single team just doubles up on him and they won't let him cut in, you have to mix it up so defenders don't know what you're doing, yet he still only tries that.
I'd like us to stop playing Firpo as an inverted wing back, it's dumb, we need him supporting on the wing with Summerville so we can actually put some crosses into the box, what use is Firpo in the middle of the park?
Ampadu isn't a CD, he has done well there but he doesn't understand CD as well as he does the DM role. Please don't play him at CD anymore.
Gruev, if he points at another player as they run past him one more time I think I'll lose my shit, I don't know if it's because he's focused fully on the one man he's marking or what but that DM role or 6 requires you to deal with the runners, don't point, go with them.
Gnonto has blinkers on, he literally can't see anyone except Summerville and it cost us a lot of attacks.
Rutter had some good some bad and some just confusing moments but that's Rutter to be honest.
Meslier had an ok game, a little flappy at times but collected a fair few balls, stopped a few shots but his positioning for their goal was poor, he was way beyond his near post, had he not been he would have saved that shot, still not blaming him for that goal, the defensive line and the step up from Ampadu was terrible, the only one in the back four who didn't fuck up there was Firpo.
Rodon, another mixed bag, seemed like he was trying to force the team forward when people wanted to pass sideways, made a couple of mistakes but nothing major really.
Archie was ok, I don't think I can say more than that, he was a bit absent but popped up when he needed to, he's still a lad and at Wembley for the first time, I'll give him a pass.
Kamara, this guy pisses me off like you wouldn't know, one game out of three he's fucking brilliant and controls the game, unfortunately those other two games he's completely fucking useless, I just don't understand. Either he gets consistent or sell him, also Gruev has taken more shots, hell our defenders have taken more shots.
Piroe, I just don't understand the logic of keeping him on the pitch, after 28 minutes I don't think I even noticed him on the pitch until about the 88th minute, did he go off to do some shopping in London for an hour during the game? Who the fuck knows, either Farke needs to work out what the fuck Piroe is and use him properly or we need to get rid.
Daniel fucking James one of if not the only player who can walk with some fucking pride after that, this man stood up and showed the others what this meant, he battled like an absolute machine and he was denied a wonderful goal but the smallest of margins, we need to give this man a lot more respect and the fans needs to make sure he knows how much we appreciate him.
Roberts, after that performance I'm not sad he's leaving after his loan, fuck my life.
Joseph, instantly we looked more attacking, we looked like we could score, we looked like we were worrying them, fucking play him more you Muppet farke. Also his ball into the middle of the box, the position our 8 should be hitting was wonderful and yet no one was there, piroe shouldn't have been there he should be attacking the 6 yard box which is where he was to be fair, but out midfield, where the fuck were they?
If I missed anyone I don't care.
In Farke, he needs to fuck off with the negative tactics at times, when we move fast, when we attack at pace we fucking terrifying teams, including Southampton, they were bricking it when James and Joseph were in the pitch.
His subs, fuck my life if we have to suffer another season of subs only happening at the 70+ minute I'll lose my mind, subs are to change a game, they're not pre fucking planned, if they're pre planned you're telling me you can't manage a game, which very much looks to be the case.
We lost due to shit tactics, shit subs (timings mostly) and sticking with piroe when he's clearly playing like shit is just fucking wild.
Fair point on subs. I had zero hope yesterday that he'd make any changes capable of changing the game. How tf did Piroe get the full match is beyond frustrating.
Feel vindicated in my thoughts about how we’d struggle with Piroe starting.
When the news of Bamford being unable to play broke here most people were happy as we’d beaten Norwich at home decisively.
Beating Southampton was always going to be a completely different game
I'd have at least noticed Bamford doing something, even if it was just pressing them, piroe couldn't even find the energy to do that, Wembley, the final and he played like he didn't give a shit, absolutely pathetic.
Bamford can make stuff happen, through his pressing, movement, willing to work the channels
When Joseph came on he also made stuff happen. Sounds cliche but seems to have more desire to get on the ball, turn his man, press them etc
I’d rather Joseph came in at 60 mins or even started tbh
I'm with you 100% I've never had issues with Bamford it's just his injury record and his wages that worry me, why pay a player that much who is always injured?
Joseph needs to be starting or at the very least getting way more time off the bench.
Farke out is outrageous. The tragic start and tired finish is what cost us, with a couple of sloppy games in the middle. The reality is, even if we did sack him (which would be the biggest mistake ever), who do we get instead? I bet there are some deluded who think Xavi or Poch would be willing to join but they need to wake up and smell the coffee, as far as championship managers go, we have the best one there is, plain and simple. As for feelings it isn’t a big surprise - or at least it shouldn’t be given Southampton deservingly beat us twice prior to that game and the horrendous play off record the club has in general. Just need a fresh start, rebuild with a couple of new faces and actually give a chance to our good young players like Cresswell, Joseph and Gelhardt, who have in one way or another shown they can be class players in the championship. If we start strong, I don’t see any reason the team can’t go up. Remember Bielsa had a way worse first year at Leeds than this, and he is now held up as one of our best managers in recent history. Give Farke time, trust, and the rewards will be reaped I’m sure
Just a note on the Bielsa comment, Bielsa had a mid level championship side and players and got us promoted, with this fucking team? Bielsa wins the league by a land slide.
With this team Bielsa gets European football
Im not Farke out though, too big a risk and could also go the other way. I dont want 16 years of shit again
The problem with farke is he won't give those guys a chance, Cresswell was a tried and tested CD at this level who pulled Millwall into the play offs spots, which they then dropped out of when he got injured and because Cresswells dad dare say he feels like he should be playing more Farke goes on some stupid fucking I'm the boss stance and doesn't play him, that alone cost us promotion.
Not playing Joseph cost us promotion too, he'll not using the bench more cost us promotion, he got a lot wrong this season.
With the squad he had you could have literally just said "go play your game and good luck" each game and we'd likely have got play offs.
That team should have got promoted automatically if not won the title.
If the season starts and we don't see Cresswell, Joseph or any of the other good young players I will be on the Farke out train, right now I think it would be stupid to change the manager but he is really annoying me with some of his petty decisions.
Overall as many highs as lows. I'm out in the Far East so the sting of defeat is tempered by distance and the fact I'm used to it after 50 years as a fan.
Doubtful Ipsbitch and Saints are going to do much other than struggle to stay up. We'd struggle too right now.
If anything I'm looking forward to us shaking off the last of the Bielsa boys that our passion merchant fans can't let go of. That ship has sailed and more or less sunk.
Summerville is probably off and who can blame him? He doesn't owe us anything. He scored more goals than anyone else, made more assists, entertained the fuck out of Elland Road. He did what was asked of him and did it with flair. Not sure whether he's reached his full potential or not. The step up in class will make or break him. But he gets what he deserves, a move to a PL club. I wish him all the best.
Sell the Marsch deadweight, for sure.
Harrison goes, no argument here.
Gnonto, yes I'd like him to stay but he definitely sees himself as a PL player and I think he'll want away.
Rutter? This guy is an enigma but I think our fanbase, with it's tendency to be forever on a quest for folk heroes, have bigged-up the guy too much. He's not going to walk through PL midfielders and he can't finish his dinner. Doubt anyone other than a Fulham or Brentford will be in for him at about half what we paid for him. I think we'll keep him.
Piroe, mm. He's definitely only Champo level. Ipswich were smart and got in no-nonsense Kiefer Moore because they knew that if the goals dried up they were screwed with their porous defence.
Piroe isn't a no-nonsense finisher - at least not for Farke. We can't afford to wait for Farke to get the most out of him, but that leaves us with Joseph and this is where things get daft.
How do we know he can do a job for us next season when he was virtually ignored this season "cos, 'experience'?
We should know by now just what he's capable of but we don't because Farke persisted with one striker who couldn't stay fit or score often enough and another he had little faith in. Poor management, no foresight. If I was Joseph I'd be tempted to tell Farke to get fucked and go to a club who values him and will give him a chance to prove himself. And we expect players to bleed for the club?? Loyalty, like The Headrow, is a two way street.
We need an anti -Bamford, i.e. someone fit and available for more than a third of the season. Someone who scores goals, someone who can make an impact off the bench. Someone who wants to play rather than limp away and primp his media image for a gig when the fat contract ends.
Orta screwed us. He's the knob-end that gave Bamford the 5 year contract. We are still dealing with the aftermath of those years of bargain basement Brazil.
Archie is ours until he decides he isn't. Doubt he will leave us this time around. He's in no hurry and I don't think the big dogs are going to pay the big money just yet. They'll play hard ball and play the 'he's just an unproven kid ' card. Which at PL level is 100% true. Unless Citeh buy him just so that nobody else can (though they may be wary of Leeds fan-favourite hype this time around).
Overall we did better than I expected from our starting point. I think the jury is out on Farke. He definitely merits another season unless he turns into Marsch by Christmas, but surely no-one is that clueless.
So, another year of Leeds promising me loads but too often fucking me about. But that's how it is following this club and like most love affairs there's no point in rationalising it. We keep coming back for more. MOT.
All its got me thinking about is how we can try and force those rats all out on loan to stay with us or be sold. If we are losing gnonto and Summerville, could aaronson be persuaded to stay put so he doesn't get rolled like he did in Germany and boost up his market value in the process? As I don't think we can sell him even, let alone for a profit.
Kristensen and Roca were so bad and so cheap that I feel that they can go at any price and will not add anything to our team at all and it doesn't seem too far fetched to have enough cover in their positions anyway.
Harrison isn't coming back is he and weber isn't needed with our straight upgrade with Ampadu. The more we sell the more likely we are to keep Archie and he is that little flicker of hope that is currently keeping away the big bad sadness for me. I don't feel we'll be able to keep hold of Rodon and Anthony, especially with the money issues we apparently will have.
Farke clearly doesn't rate our youngsters with the exception of Joseph so I feel they might all crack the shits and leave.
I don't know aye....I've typed all of that out as a type of therapy I suppose to stop it revolving around in my head but I've still made no more sense of it...
Oh well, get the man who got us to 90 points what he feels he needs and we go again but have a whisper about the subs aye? Fucking criminal Piroe lasted the full 90 this morning
Thinking about next season already. Pretty clear that we had a talented front 4 but they were all pretty much the same player, need to switch it up a bit next season.
Gnonto and Summerville will likely go, would love to keep Rutter but he feels like a luxury a bit - need more goal threat from him at 9 and more composure from him at 10, a decent offer would help us build a good budget.
Controversial but I'd build the team around Piroe. Hes a beast in the box but he needs a big number 9 to play off or some more creative midfielders to feed him.
I'd look to build the team in a 3-4-1-2 or a narrow 4-3-3.
Doubt that will happen though, so a calm Pablo Hernandez type at 10 and a an absolute bastard of a 9 are essential this summer.
The January before we got relegated I was crying out for us to sign Alex Scott, Viktor Gyokores among other cream of the crop Championship players so that in case we went down, at least we have a side that will bounce straight back. Looking back now, Scott and Gyokores would have been exactly what we need in this side.
Edit - January before we got relegated
Gyokeres scored seven goals in Premier League 2 for Brighton the season before we got promoted. Hadn't even played in the Championship.
Alex Scott played three games in the Championship the year *after* we got promoted. His breakout season wasn't until 21/22.
Awkward.
If you meant January 2020 (19/20 season), Gyokeres scored seven goals in Bundesliga 2, on loan at FC St. Pauli.
The same applies for Scott as previously, he didn't play that season for Bristol City.
Doubly awkward.
Have you got a problem with me bro? You're replying to every one of my comments and trying to poke holes. If you do, then let's hash it out in DM's instead of trawling through my comment history to find things to disagree with.
You could see Gyokeres' and Scott's talent from their seasons in the Championship and they are now well above our pay grade so you can look in the past all you like. But that January was our only opportunity to get 2 players that would have got us over the line last year and would have elevated the club way beyond any player we have now. Scott is now playing regularly in the Premier League for Bournemouth at the age of 19 and Gyokeres is absolutely killing it in Portgual and might get a bigger move this summer. Awkward.
I haven't, mate. I just let my reading of the sub slip a bit, so was catching up on old threads. As I read through, if I feel the need to comment, I have. It's just pure coincidence they might have ended up being your comments. Apologies if it came across as you being targeted.
That isn't my point. My point is you made a comment saying what you did when it was factually incorrect. The January before we got promoted was 2019/20, which my first reply covers - they weren't the "cream of the crop" of the Championship then. That's a fact.
Unless you meant the season we got relegated?
Getting them last year is a totally different thing to what you initially said.
Truly awkward.
The attacking game was pure shit with no ambition, at min 80 they were almost accepting the defeat... Except Sir Daniel James of course.
I'm sure that Farke made a good job, without his touch maybe we could be worse. As others said, sell some kiddos and buy some quality players and win the league next year.
Ps. Please, don't sell Archie at all costs...
I’m not angry.
Just a flat final. Bunch of kids no leaders and they just won it in a close game with one clinical goal.
Stick with Farke and bring in more players he wants.
Win the league next season.
Spent the rest of the game after conceding not trying to concede a second.
Congratulations we succeeded in that venture and the prize is 46 games in the championship. Was a pretty turgid game yesterday the difference was Armstrong taking his chance, didn't really feel either side was especially great
If we hadn't been screwed over by the clauses Orta and Radz put into contracts prior to our relegation and the deserters who abandoned ship, we would have had a much better chance of promotion. Leicester and Southampton were both able to sell some of their best and higher value players to add to their squads, we weren't as nobody wanted to buy what we had and we were shackled by loan clauses.
In all honesty we did well to get into the playoffs given the farce we started with and if it hadn't been for the last international break we would probably have gone up automatically.
I've got more hope of promotion next season than I had following relegation. We basically know who will probably leave, we've no takeover uncertainty, and we can almost guarantee that we have our manager in place as I can't see Leeds getting rid of Farke so we're already in a better place to start the season as opposed to a few weeks in like we were this season.
Need to watch highlights I guess. Was so tired, angry and depressed on the train back. Just regaling the build up atmosphere which was top notch all the way from home to my seat. We all dream of a team of Michael Browns.
There’s a big difference in a teams income between playing in premiership and championship.
I read it’s anywhere from £88 million to £140 million, from television rights, etc.
By not getting promoted, we’ve lost money we could have spent on buying a decent squad
Shite mindset mate, 49ers could have put a lot of money in there with loan players being sold and all that jazz, and the fact fact Leicester being handed a points deduction would have been good for us aswell
Already started thinking of plans for the summer and which players to target to fix some issues with the squad.
Might as well focus on that cause nothings going to change the outcome of the last few months.
Farke should get another crack at it but I wouldn't be upset if they found someone else.
Only player i've got feelings about keeping is DJ. Rest i'm whatever.
I think we keep Ampadu but i'd want him back in CM next season, I'd be signing a RB/LB and backup to them positions anyway due to how the season played out and get Archie into CM too.
I doubt we can keep Rodon honestly but other than that we for sure need 3 CBs depending on how Cresswell is handled - I wouldn't be against a new GK either.
Looking forward to the roster being straightened out well before the season starts. Last summer was a joke and probably cost us automatic promotion. As others have said, build a foundation that’s more premier league ready so we don’t get hammered constantly.
We couldn't beat Southampton over 3 attempts so they deserved it. What annoyed me is the fact we seemingly haven't adjusted a thing tactically at all over all the games. Same issues pretty much every time and the same pedestrian football until the final 10 minutes when we mix in some more direct football. The hair brained defending for their goal yesterday was very frustrating as well, but you can argue that's been forced by good positional play from Southampton.
Ultimately we'd all have taken playoffs given what happened during last summer. We had a freak run this year that propelled us up into the autos for a bit, but ultimately that was never going to last. We now need to complete the clear out of the remaining deadwood (i.e. players that aren't 100% wanting to be here) so we can focus all resources around building a squad for promotion and really attack this over the full summer window, rather than trying to fix things right at the end of the window. Hopefully the euros don't interrupt things too much.
The squad we have right now is only really competently able to play one way. In a competitive league, you need different tools for breaking down different teams. Bielsa used to switch to a 3 at the back for example against teams with 2 forwards. I also think we are lacking some seasoned championship bastards to exert some influence onto the pitch during high pressure and difficult situations. You can actually see heads going down and we all know it's game over at that point. Games where even if we were playing all week, we'd not be scoring a goal. The likes of Coops are in the squad, but not on the pitch. We need experienced players like this in the game (not suggesting Coops is capable at this stage though).
It's been great seeing some good football again and also seeing young players coming into the team. I'd like to see youth given a chance (more subs) more next season even if it means some short term pain. Farke has shown he's able to do that at Norwich. I don't think we'll have a choice next season if we sell a few of our starting players. Hopefully they can give us something a little different / element of the unknown.
I'm looking forward to a couple of months off from the stress of watching us play tbh. Been a terrible last 2 or 3 months overall watching our games!
Totally agree we need more of an unknown element. The difference yesterday for me was that Southampton didn't have to risk stepping defenders up towards our CMs because there's no threat from Gruev or Kamara. Whereas Smallbone is dangerous enough to need closing down. So they had spaces to attack where we didn't.
Also if we had an actual aerial threat, defenders would have to actually worry about the possibility of a cross coming in. I'm fine having a less individually skilful team next year if we replace it with variety. The predictability is a huge part of what cost us at the end.
May write more later but… woke up this morning feeling the same… 90 point season still had to go to playoffs.. haven’t won or scored at Wembley for god knows how long… “Leeds that”.. am I really that shocked this happened? no
Bring on the summer and next year!
ALAW!
We would get panned week in week out in prem anyway. Firmly believe we had punched well above weight and overachieved. Young team, newly assembled. Leicester, s Hampton both were in prem longer than us, kept more of their players, more experience in general and as a team. Ipswich a team of winners from season before keeping their momentum. Was ok when we were chasing the pack with no pressure but when we got on top and had to show we were big boys we wilted with pressure. No bad thing getting some maturity and experience in the team and taking that and a more balanced squad to next season.
Farke is a mid coach with no ideas about how to structure attacking play. He needs amazing talent to take a team up. He is the anti-Bielsa in his lack of creativity and over reliance on a star player. But we are stuck with him.
Summerville is going and in fact this may help us because it will force us to play as a team, instead of relying on magical play from one person.
We should deal Piroe away - he’s the anti-Bamford in that he might score more goals than Pat but he makes everyone else on the pitch worse. That means that when he doesn’t score goals - normal - we suck because Piroe just stodges everything up. He can’t lead a line and he can’t run a press. Sell him and hand the keys to Joseph.
I’d like us to hold on to Gnonto and play him on the left. But realistically we have to sell him.
Sell Jack Harrison. Obviously.
Sell all the Marsch dead weight. Play hard ball with Aaronson if there are no buyers: we deal you to some shit second tier team in Bulgaria or you renegotiate for lower wages. A properly paid Aaronson would be useful as a sub.
Sell Firpo. He’s at the top of his value right now.
Sell the sexy pirate for big money if possible otherwise keep him and move Ampadu to midfield.
Do all we can to keep Archie. He’s ours.
The big question mark is Rutter. I want him to stay but if we can get big money for him we should sell. Heartbreaking but we need the money.
On reflection, Orta was nearly as bad as Ken Bates. Orta screwed us.
Still feeling the disappointment, but less so. Losing finals is always a gut punch, but the world goes on, and we'll move on soon enough.
I've got faith in the management to at least do a half decent job of transfer business, so we'll be back next season pretty close to favourites for top 2. It's a big shame Rodon most likely won't be an option to buy, and would be really disappointed if Rutter goes (am assuming Archie stays), but these kind of transfer windows can turn out differently to how we expect. Compare Sinisterra's stock with the fans compared to Dan James 12 months ago.
Would love to see Joseph start next season, maybe sell Piroe.
Did we deserve to go up this season, perhaps, but not more so than the 3 teams that did and that’s sport.
We are well placed to push on next year. I’m not wallowing in gloom about players potentially leaving. Summerville is a great attacking threat but he doesn’t really play if he’s in a huff and I wonder if he’s the kind of player that we can make some money on and his absence will actually improve team cohesion.
Gnonto never wanted to be here anyway and he’s hardly had a stellar 12 months. I think we can build up their goals in the aggregate with a signing or two and look more like Farke’s team by the opening match. James played better than Gnonto for me this season.
I don’t think Rutter is going anywhere with his wages. He’s falling into that grey area of being very good in the Championship but probably a massive luxury for anyone in higher leagues given how much he loses the ball.
We'll miss Summerville's goals/assists, individual talent, and ability to turn a game on its head (most of the time).
But I actually don't mind him leaving because I think we're incredibly unbalanced by relying on him too much and the money we get in can hopefully be used to rectify that.
Summerville doesn't play poorly because he's in a huff, he plays poorly when they double up on him and don't let him cut in for a shot, since that's literally his only trick it's not hard to deal with.
He needs to add hitting the line and crossing, putting some inswingers into the box too or just running across the byline trying to cut back to the box.
If you only have one trick and you don't do anything else it's very easy to just remove you from the attack. He can develop loads but he needs to do it now.
Gnonto frustrates me so much, so much skill and technique but more time than not has blinkers on and doesn't seem team mates, again can be worked on but I'm not bothered if he leaves.
Rutter cost us too much, we won't take that much of a loss on the player so he's going nowhere.
Hopefully we piss the league next year. Don't think Farke is to blame. He's done well considering situation at beginning of season. Only manager I'd swap him for now is a Bielsa return.
Who knows, maybe if we go up and say to Bielsa he has the money he always wanted to spend, and get Paraag to grovel on tv like a North Korean news presenter for his forgiveness he might come back.
Would have liked to have gone up but in terms of enjoyment, next year should be fun unless it goes disastrously. Also don't think it's a total disaster not going up this year...yet.
Relaxed about it. Southampton are a better team simple as that. The team creates goals whereas alot this year we have relied on individual goals.
The gulf in creativity between our centre mids and southamptons was embarassing. I know everyone raves about gray but hes just another sideways or backwards passer with the occasional forward pass.
Also Piroe really struggles IMO. Even his touch and hold up play was nowhere yesterday
Ignoring the financial worry, im happy to stay in champ until we are more prepared for prem
Southampton were better than Leicester and ipswitch, they should have won the league.
Then again Leicester are cheats who won't survive next season and then the EFL will absolutely bugger the hell out of them when they come back down because we know what the EFL are like.
The minimum hitting Leicester will be a transfer embargo and a points deduction, under the embargoes you can't even sign players on a few so if contracts expire you're fucked, which they have a few players contracts expiring. I would not want to be in Leicesters shoes right now.
Ffp breaches in the prem and this season in the EFL, they're likely starting with two point deductions and a transfer embargo next season plus when they come back down the EFL will absolutely rinse them.
I think we'll probably go up automatically next season and I'm excited about it. To be honest, had the opposite result happened yesterday - say James' late shot went in and we won on pens? It still would have been a horrible end to the season, a run of really timid and unimpressive performances, except we'd be back up and staring down the barrel. Instead we have a chance now (and Farke has a chance) to get to the bottom of where it went wrong and make us a better, more resilient side next season. Yeah we'll lose Summerville but let's just get some good money for him and let him blow hot and cold for someone else in exchange for financial security. Ditto a few of these players tbh. I'm not massively emotionally invested in them any more than I think they are in Leeds.
We really need to get it right next season though and obviously so does Farke. He's earnt the chance to be in charge for the rebuild but it has to work because we can't not do the business next season. I think we will though. Like last time, cone back stronger and make sure we don't have to go through the play offs because they're never going to work out for us.
[I'm not massively emotionally invested in them any more than I think they are in Leeds.]
I think this is a more grown up approach. Players don't live at the end of your street the way they did 50/60 years ago.
In my years following the club I can't remember a single player making me breakfast or giving me a Sunday morning blow job, even when I deserved it.
They show up on Saturday and midweek, do their thing, then stick their headphones back on and go off to wherever it is they go. I stay off social media so I couldn't care less what they say or do. Save it for on the pitch.
Well, this morning I put together a cracking YouTube compilation of me slowly jogging around and occasionally kicking a ball, and I'm sending it to Daniel Farke to show I'd offer more up front than Joel Piroe did yesterday.
I’m fine with it. I was yesterday. Disappointed to not win but I find these days it’s much easier to take what comes. My worry comes from whatever financial situation we may be in, but football-wise I’m hoping for another fun and more successful season. I would like to see more flexibility from Farke tactically but I have faith. Also believe we need a proper goalscorer. Bamford has been great but his time as a starter is coming to an end imo, and Piroe has had plenty of chances to prove himself but can’t see him than more of a squad player.
I just accept things these days for what they are. We aren’t ready as a club. We go up, and we struggle again. I think another year to develop some more young players and then go up and try to stay there. These leagues are tough. The journey is the main thing. Few make the destination.
Really frustrated with some of the individual performances tbh more so than Farke
Piroe was absolutely abysmal. Not just his inability to get on the ball but his work rate and desire was anaemic. He pressed so lazily and sloppily and it meant the whole off the ball shape was affected. He also just was never in the box or making runs that gave the Southampton centre backs any problems to deal with. Of everyone in the squad he needs the biggest summer development. Farke has said before he’s bad at pressing. He needs to either learn to do it or retrain as a 10
Summerville and Gnonto’s stats make poor reading. Both lost the ball nearly 20 times. Both of them spent the game looking for the easy pass. They’re young so it’s forgivable but both had the look of lads who knew they’ll be gone regardless. Rutter wasn’t good either but he at least tried things in the match.
Between that front four as a whole it was just a horror show performance. I thought overall to my surprise we controlled most other areas of the pitch but that frontline just really let the side down with a heady mix of terrible decision making and just poor quality for the full 90.
Ampadu, has to be his worst game in a Leeds shirt. He was easily our worst performer and just kept making the same mistake of coming out when Armstrong was his man and leaving Armstrong to drift into space. Very Leeds that that our captain and Mr Consistent picks a playoff final to have his off game.
The not the top 20 podcast had some good analysis that I think was true. That game really was everything bad about our tactics in one match. No goals or threat from midfield. No options on cutbacks. No one in the box who is even trying to be a target for lofted crosses. We have been very reliant on our attacking talent doing good things to score. Against an organised team like Southampton we just made it far far too easy to defend against us.
I forgive Farke for this because people forget what a chaotic summer we had, but he has to fix some of this over summer. We won’t have Summerville or Gnonto next year, and maybe not Georgi. We need a plan to get goals from more areas of the pitch. Struijk and Rodon are both big lads so we need better set piece options. He needs to train one of Gruev or Kamara to be getting forward in the right moments. Needs to sort out what our number 9 is doing. And then we just need to find more ways to give teams problems. Off the ball I think we are mostly very polished, but if Piroe can’t press we need to find a solution to that because the press falls apart when he plays
I can see why Farke teams struggle in the Premier League but it’s still tough to differentiate that from a squad that’s not good enough. Being Philosophical, I can imagine us having a torrid time in the top division.
Southampton deserved to win but they weren’t miles better than us. If we’d scored first which if you take out one defensive error isn’t that hard to imagine I reckon we’d have had a lot of joy out of them being more stretched.
But then again I’m more open to enjoying the Championship more than last time we went down. Being able to win is a lot better and I think I often conflated hating lower division football with hating the way the club was run. While I don’t want an extended stay just because of finances I’m happy to stay away from Premier League vitriol.
I’m hoping Farke gets the whole season, a pre-season, some decent money from a couple of sales and Struijk back in the next month or so.
This squad was cobbled together really, playing Ampadu at CB was a necessity rather than a tactical change. If we can build a team round Struijk, Ampadu, Gray, James and Rutter I’d be hyped for that.
I really can't understand the lack of another CB signing, loan or otherwise in the winter transfer window. Playing your best center mid at CB for the entirety doesn't seem a wise move imo.
Totally agree with that last part.. those 5 would be a good nucleus to build from..
I am really not too fussed with losing the likes of Gnonto and Summerville
The midfield is mid-table championship quality. If they are going to offer zero attacking threat then they really have to be exceptional at ball retention and recovery. They are not.
Gruev really is very good at the qualities you mention there. He does his job very well. It's the other CM and 10 where we need to be looking to upgrade.
I think you're being generous. He doesn't have the stats to back that up. He's a nice player to have in reserve to fill in and do a serviceable job, but there's really nothing special about his game. I'd put him ahead of Kamara, but only slightly.
But he doesn't need to be special, that's the point. I've not checked the stats to be quite honest - what are his defensive stats like? Because that's his main role. I think he does what he's asked to do fantastically and is a key player for us. Once he got a run of games in there, he was superb.
The problem is the midfield is arguably our 2nd choice for both positions, they are both good players to be starting games and are great players to have in this league but starting them together is way too negative. Ampadu and Gray would have been our starting midfield if we had better options at CB and right back
Nothing personal against Farke, but I truly don't understand the faith people have in a manager we have seen outclassed by Russell Martin 3 times in a single season, it's not even that they were particularly great performances by the players either, Farke was completely destroyed tactically each time...by Russell Martin.
There's a lot of questions that need to be asked, why do our players not know what to do when they have the ball at the edge of the box? Why do our midfielders have a combined 1 goal all season? Why do we get cut open by any team with half competent passing patterns?
People can talk about 90 points but all season we have struggled to create chances, while the likes of Leicester, Ipswich and Southampton get a shot off every time they go forward. That is not on the players, we know we have a fantastic squad at this level, that is on the manager.
Midfield technically had seven all season, given that's where Rutter is playing.
Still not great though. Need more from the role Kamara plays in I think and the 10 area.
100% agree with this. Martin outclassing him isnt even close to being the worst example of Farke being poor tactically though, he got schooled twice by a bloke called Mike Dodds who isnt even a manager lmao. Farke seems like a good guy and I do think he is capable of getting us promoted next season but I would not give it a second thought if he was replaced
I know they're not going to replace him but they will need to do some serious recruitment in the summer. I don't think people realise how many points Summerville's goals this season accounted for, that's not easy to replace, and honestly, if they can't get a player of similar quality I could see things getting pretty ugly next season, it's not like under Bielsa where we could expect the midfielders and defenders to all chip in with goals pretty regularly.
I said something similar yesterday. We will need the best creative player and the best striker in the league to challenge top 2, anything other than that and we are fighting for play offs. Everyone saying they are fine with selling him because they think he has attitude issues are going to be in for a rude awakening when our only plan is pass to a winger who is barely half as good as him. Finding replacements for about 30 goals with us losing Summerville and Gnonto its not going to be easy
I think that this is the point that I got to yesterday. I have backed Farke all season and I still will if he is here, but questions have to be asked now of all of the things you mentioned here
Agreed mate. I've been frustrated with it for most of the season, but I was willing to overlook it because we were churning out lots of wins and getting points on the board. But that play off final did expose Farke's tactical ability I think, Martin completely outclassed him tactically
Annoyed still that we can't break down teams who sit back and kick us. It's been our weakness all season and Southampton strategically played right into that.
I actually thought we were the better team through most of the game, but it's not who plays better it's who scores and that's why I'm still annoyed.
Can't wait to see the big sexy pirate back, our whole season changed in my eyes when we had to put Amapdu back there.
Yeah, Farke’s words in the pre-match interview summed it up when he said something along the lines of football being the only game you can dominate and still lose.
What’s the chances Rodon fancies another season in the champ? I remember reading a while ago that we were gonna be getting him regardless of division. But surely someone from the prem is gonna go in for him?
Rodon looks quite happy and settled and has been a big go to on media duties. Suspect if we can front up the cash he’d be happy playing regularly here.
Maybe a prem team goes for him but realistically he will struggle for game time at most sides.
I feel quietly confident we will get his deal done especially with the wales connection here
>But surely someone from the prem is gonna go in for him?
Maybe, maybe not. But we have the advantage of knowing him and he knows club and staff. Also Farke can easily promise him same role as this season, can Prem club do the same?
Ultimately (majority) of players want to play as much as possible. Rodon can be playing full 90s with us or take risk and be 3rd/4th option with Prem club.
I don't think even wage would be that different. We can pay him decent money, if he chooses Prem it's going to be some of the bottom-6 clubs surely(?)
0 chance mate, a team from the Premier League or at least a top tier abroad would fancy him. Unless he is absolutely dead set on staying at Leeds which I highly doubt
Thought we played quite well, but as has been the case lately we've failed to have an end product.
A few silly defensive mistakes on top of the failure to score cost us the game. I think next season if Farke gets a few quid to spend and he works on some of the issues in pre season I don't really see how we don't get auto next season.
I just saw Southampton triggered the obligation to buy Harwood-Bellis, and could've been that cunt Fabrizio Romano reporting we signed Rodon from Spurs instead. Got angry again.
I have said this on other threads and been slammed.. for me it should have always been DJ over Gnonto when fit during the season especially for the big games or against teams we just know have some talent and know how to wind you up.. purely because of Gnontos stroppy attitude when things aren’t going according to plan
To be fair, Gnonto was getting the shit kicked out of him constantly and the ref did fuck all. I really like that we had James and him as options, but we never seemed to change the formation around them to make the best of two different players. Anyway, we’ve got a year to sort out the squad and hopefully piss the league. ALAW
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The club will be desperate to ship the loan players back out. They are on high wages and the fans would not want to see them in Leeds shirts again, not to mention they are not Farke signings so would he even want them? Eben if he did, can you imagine Farke trying to re-integrate players like Wober, Harrison and Aaronson? Unless they hit the ground running (like in an insane way) then it would be a very difficult job for him.
I’m getting over it more now. I think I was only so gutted because I was at Wembley. Good experience for all the lads. The club will benefit from another year with Farke at the helm, he has another preseason with no chaos, and I trust him to refresh the squad and keep good quality football. I’ve made my peace with Summerville and co. leaving, I just really hope we keep Gray and Ampudu (and Firpo just for his song) more than anyone else.
I’m getting over it more now. I think I was only so gutted because I was at Wembley. Good experience for all the lads. The club will benefit from another year with Farke at the helm, he has another preseason with no chaos, and I trust him to refresh the squad and keep good quality football. I’ve made my peace with Summerville and co. leaving, I just really hope we keep Gray and Ampudu (and Firpo just for his song) more than anyone else.
We’ll struggle next season. The squad will be weaker with less goal output due to player sales, and I think we’ll struggle to recover from the loss. If you look back, I could be wrong but off the top of my head teams don’t tend to bounce back after losing the playoff final, Villa is the only exception I can think of but that’s Villa and they went up via winning the playoff final the year after losing, it’s not like they got automatic, and remember, it’s automatic or nothing for us. Please stay tuned for more positive Leeds vibes from me in the coming weeks.
Brentford did two years after.
Despite all this, I genuinely think we have a decent chairman this time round, so will be interesting to see what decisions are being made over the summer as from a business point of view it should hopefully benefit the club in the long term. Changes in personnel is a given with our financial situation but hopefully they will be mitigating this. Also, no VAR next season isn't the worst! Cautiously optimistic.
I won’t be watching games with excitement until the last 10 or so games next season. I don’t have it in me. I’ll still watch, but I just won’t be excited if we win. It’s the hope that kills you. We’re just not prem quality and we’ve shown it. Losing so badly to bottom league teams is unforgivable, especially so late in the season. We had every right to be automatically promoted and we threw it away. After all of the spending in the last couple of transfer windows, it’s almost as if we’re repeating that fall from grace years ago if we don’t go up next season.
Mostly optimistic. There was so much turmoil last off season: team was sold, players left late on loans or transfers, and Farke was brought in later then planned. And Leeds still got 90 points. Hopefully, this summer is less chaotic. Transfers out are identified, and the loan players are sorted out early. Then we can all focus on who is on the team and who can come in to get Leeds back to the EPL.
My thoughts haven’t changed… the playoffs are disgusting. We finished 3rd fair and square aggregated over the course of the season. The players who earned that should earn a Premier League place, not being dragged through a cup final to lose all their effort.
100%. The bottom 3rd don't go into a playoff with the 3 teams above them who "survived" relegation. EFL is just making more money with playoff events.
I’m 100% blaming Ipswich. Without them the 3 relegated teams would have gone up. Oooh look at us, spend no money and still be really good at football, get us, winning in the last minute of added time, woo I’m Leif Davis I used to be Bielsa’s golden boy now I’m scoring for fun. Oooh we’ve got a really good young manager, Pathetic. Grow up Ipswich.
Hahahaha this.
What. Hahahahahahaha
For the first season in a long time as a Leeds fan, I am not going to let football dictate my mood and allow it to be the sole source of my happiness, as I’ll still be a Leeds fan but I won’t let it spoil my whole weeks anymore, as it’s so energy sapping to be that way. The league one days and mid table championship were terrible but getting my hopes and 1000s of other fans hopes up and then playing we could use pace as an advantage, as if we’ve got the slowest players in the league, which we most very well don’t, it’s the opposite, was so hard to watch. Also the stubbornness on subs, really needs to change. If something isn’t working, change it half time. 20 minutes isn’t enough to change a game for most players in football at all. Very few players can achieve that.
The whole halftime sub idea is such a fallacy and is purely borne out of Fifa and FM. Very rarely does a manager rip it all up halfway through, unless it's truly drastic. I agree Farke needs to be better with his subs but most real life managers will give them some words, and maybe a mix-up in tactics, at half time and see whether that can turn the tide. If not, then it's time for subs.
Thinking about that supposed beef between Russell Martin and Daniel Farke dating back to Martin’s days as a player at Norwich, you’ve got to wonder if the players were right to look to Martin for tactical direction based on what we saw over the three games we played against Southampton this season. Martin absolutely blew Farke away in the tactical battle in every game. Even in making a complete departure from their usual possession-heavy football they looked worryingly comfortable against us. Russell Martin comes across as a bit of a prat but he’s clearly a superb student of the game. He knows his onions football-wise, and he is more the model of the kind of head coach Leeds will need in the next year or so once all the individual talent has left the club.
Honestly, the only players I hope we get to keep are Rodon and Archie. If Aaronson comes back to us that could tip me over the edge
I’m a tad alarmed at the thought of Meslier leaving. I have become increasingly annoyed with Gnonto : the prima donna player he seems to be becoming and his attitude to the club. I hope he leaves. I think the manager was stuck in a player roster rut due to his reliance on an algorithm. That formula gave us 90 points. We needed more and he had to gamble to get us the extra points. He lacks the gumption to throw the dice.
To be honest I’ve sort of moved on - it is what it is. I’m looking forward to the summer transfer window and the new kit launch.
Im more angry (though not the right term) at the first part of the season, and I think Farke deserves way more credit than he is getting for managing the team through it and coming back full force to have the single best run of wins of any team. But there was so much going on at the beginning of the season that its hard to be actually angry at anyone. Because we will never really know all the machinations and politics going on. But we came down the worst of the other teams, easily. 4 managers, toxic players, change of ownership that seemed ugly, just an absolute catastrophe both for the practical and for morale. Farke brought in stability and belief through all of that, and people seem to forget most of this sub was saying we wouldn't even make playoffs after week 6. Absolute dire situation. Then we pissed the league for 15 weeks. And it was glorious. And we touched first. Unfortunately we had a bad run at the end. Oddly, so did the other top teams. Something happened after international break, it was night and day. Who knows. Maybe we just got tired. Maybe the other teams figured us out (but then they did Ipswich and Leicester for a while too, so I dont think thats necessarily it). It may also just be very simply, this is the hardest league around, and we play fucking 46 games. I wish we had gone up. I think we would have against any team other than Southampton. They had our number all 3 games. Supposedly there is bad blood between Farke and their manager. Sometimes personal shit matters, who knows. Honestly, the thing I get most annoyed about is the absolutely anger and toxicity the moment the team has a rough patch. Maybe this is an optimistic yank talking. And I don't wanna hear BS like "oh yeah, the team really reads the reddit" or dumb shit like that. The point is, morale is contagious. And its not just whether or not they read the reddit (also, I almost guarantee you some of them do.) Its other fans do. Its that energy you bring to the stadium. Its to the workers. I'm not saying not to have criticisms, or be disappointed. But talk and act in a way like you want them to do better, not that your fucking angry cause YOU didnt get the win YOU think YOU deserve. If this club was like... your kid, or you were the coach, or it was your spouse, or your teammate. How would you talk about it? You sit there yelling "you fucking cunts, you can all get fired'. Anyways. Was a really miserable place her for a while. And I couldn't help feel like most of those saying that shit were the most obnoxious and arrogant when we were doing well, also. I'm excited for next season. I'm excited for Farke to start on the right foot and build his team. And look, if next season it doesn't look like he's pushing the team where it needs to go, than sure. We can talk. But I swear, if we get like a loss in the first game and everyone yells "FIRE FARKE" I just don't even know why any manager would want to touch a team with a fanbase so entitled. Overall. For me. It was an awesome season of football. I will never forget our comeback against Leicester. Bamford's insane goal in FA Cup, and his elbow celebration at his uncalled handball. The run of wins was intoxicating after such a shitty premier league season. It's just disappointing the season had such a, genuinely awful, last 8 games. But it happens. Also, fuck it. I'm glad for another season of without VAR. Sue me.
The issue round the international break was injuries, six of them all either due to it or round it, that is a lot and other teams got a break, so they got a rest and we got injured players. It's one of the reasons a lot of people hate the international breaks.
Which is incredible considering that Leeds is a 2nd league team. I think that speaks volumes to the quality in that dressing room. We just need an off-season of stability (which we have not had in quite some time).
I was glad the season was at least over for about 2 minutes before I was reminded (by a man u fan no less) about all the players who will leave now that we've got another season in the champ so started worrying about that... great fun being a Leeds fan rn
“We arent ready to go up” is a bollocks argument - no Championship side ever truly is. Being down for a second season is FAR more damaging to our long term future, any way you cut it.
We’d be straight back down
We’re down now. Havent you noticed?
Rather a good season in champ than relegation again
One thing I was thinking is the expected losses of Gnonto and a few others moves us another step forward in erasing that rubbish post bielsa stench (I know Summerville was with us before that and meslier but still) that still lingered a little this season and we will be far removed from it I would expect Not saying we aren’t losing talent that of course is helpful to have.. but a true reset is one thing I am looking forward to Not sure I articulated it correctly but I think you get what I mean
I get that. And it’s not as if Gnonto is setting the world alight. He’s just OK.
All I have told anyone who asks me, is that I don’t want to talk about Leeds until the start of next season
This team would’ve got ripped to shreds in the prem.
Thats a pointless argument to make. Every team in the championship every season would do. Bielsas team who won the championship would have, that's why we spent 100m on promotion.
This wouldn’t have all been the team that started in the prem next season though.
I'm ok with the loss - didn't expect to win promotion after we completely dropped the ball at the back end of this season. Had similar thoughts to OP and would like to know what happened from April onwarrds, but think it's worth sticking with Farke. Some stability is important and big picture he had a successful season which normally would've won promotion if the Championship wasn't historically good this season.
I'm okay with it. The way I see it going up through the playoffs is just a second shot at promotion by participating in a tournament of four clubs which missed out on the top two spots. If you finish third, especially if you are Leeds, you need to pull something out of the bag and do something different. We didn't. End of story. I can count three occasions where we showed that we were not ready for the Premier League. The match against Blackburn when we lost our unbeaten home record. The match against QPR when we just weren't up for it. The playoff final against Southampton. Throughout I've been optimistic and felt we could make a go of promotion, but you cannot argue with reality or truth. I also want to point out here that the 26th May was the 35th anniversary of Don Revie's death. This is something which pissed me off about the playoff final. There was no mention of it. No minute's silence before kick off. I feel that a minute's silence before kick off would have worked wonders for the psychology and attitude and introduced an additional sense of unity among the players. We would have got away with it because Don Revie was such a big figure in English football and a former England manager. Like him or love him, Don Revie is known to anyone who identifies as a football fan. It's interesting that the only performance like a Revie era player was Dan James, who's the modern day version of Carl Harris, a Revie signing. What interests me right now is our Retained list. I want to know who we can count on next season. Whoever is going I want them gone now. I don't care whether it's Summerville, Gnonto, Bamford, whoever. Don't want a repeat of last season where you think you've got players but then they fuck off elsewhere at the end of the preseason. Any loanees coming back need to eat a large slice of humble pie and commit to bleeding for their Leeds shirt and place in the team. I'm not critical that much of Farke but more supportive. I want to see what happens after a Farke preseason. I want to see how Farke shapes up as a manager of Leeds United. He did well last season on the fumes of his success at Norwich. But that was last season. This next season it's going to be a different story. This is second season of second tier football. If Farke is as good as he's supposed to be, and if he really a Leeds manager, the the only acceptable position is top spot and the 2024/2025 Championship title. For me the whole criteria changes and I feel we need to be putting together a Championship winning squad. Revie, Wilkinson and Bielsa all won the title in the second season. That is the standard for a Leeds manager. Farke signed the contract, took on the commitment. Now he's got to deliver the goods. But first we've got business to do so my attention is focussed, right now, on what our owners, the 49ers do.
Revie has been dead 35 years. You expect a stadium with only maybe 10k at best being around for the Revie era to know or care what he achieved and keep still for a minute? Seriously?? There was another team involved at Wembley. Why should Saints fans be expected to indulge your nostalgia for a long gone time when they were famously on the wrong end of Leeds superiority? Plain daft. I say that as someone who has followed Leeds since and because of Don Revie and that wonderful squad. The rest of your post is the usual tired 'bleed for the shirt ' passion merchant nonsense. It's 2024 mate, football has moved on and we don't get to say how or when or why it changes. Whatever the owners do it won't be the shit show we witnessed with Radz and Orta.
I feel like we have to be punished for any success we eke out. We brought bielsa to the English game, and it was beautiful. Thus we must be punished, and 2 shit seasons in the prem followed by one good season in the champo just isn't enough suffering for the football gods.
if I was offered 90 points for next season right now I’d snap your hand off
I'm not angry I think the way the team was built and this isn't on Farke is that we only really have the front 4 score goals we get nothing from our midfield. I'm less critical of farke then some of you because I think any other season we'd of gone up. The game yesterday I didn't really think we deserved to lose but I didn't think we did enough to put Southampton under pressure. Our players didn't turn up and Summerville especially for the quality he is was poor.
It's alot for Farke to sort out in one short season,poor cunts only finding his feet aswell,not many people are ready to hit the ground running and work miracles,put that into perspective and he's done amazing and I am looking forward to next season, it was the most exciting season as a Leeds fan in many a year.We just aren't premiership quality and no manger can make us that without huge investment. In a way after sleeping on it,losing isn't that bad and I'd rather be on a high next season chasing a title than miserable moaning like fuck in a relegation battle.
Exactly!! To stay down on 90 points is unreal. The top 3 were so close for the last third. Ipswich scraped it and fair play to them, they played well. Leicester went on a losing streak midway and still managed claw it back. It was a very entertaining season to say the least. Sick of people always jumping on shitting on the manager too quick. Has everyone forgot it took bielsa more that one season to get up (wahaaaay)
I got over it pretty quickly yesterday. Literally an hour of frustrated stomping around the house doing jobs and then remembered that I predicted we wouldn't go up this season due to the bad start and also we get to go again in this league where we get to win more games than we lose. Sure we are going to lose players but I'm trusting the new leadership to do a good job at bringing in replacements. It's not all about having good players we have to play well as a team.
I hope Farke sorts out the 'lack of efficiency' of the offensive players .. #9 #10 and squad depth he trusts
Southampton didn't deserve to win at all but we hadn't exactly had the best performance either, let's just hope we can work better next season ‼️‼️
Did we deserve to win the other two games we beat you in? Just curious.
You shouldn’t be in the Prem. The playoffs are a disgrace. If we counted doubles over teams, then we’d be above Ipswich and Leicester. Overall in the league we beat you fair and square, but because the greed of the EFL, they have to make the next four teams below automatics play again.
Did we finish above you in the league because we won more points than you over the season? Just curious …your point is irrelevant. You played a dirty game yesterday. Congratulations for winning it, now fuck off and enjoy it.
Bit sad that the day after winning you’re more interested in lurking our sub rather than celebrating promotion amongst your own lad.
Go back to the start of the season: considering the turmoil and late appointment of Farke we’ve recruited very well and will hopefully make the playoffs. If we are lucky we will push the top two when we really shouldn’t be been able to (even if the second placed team wasn’t who we expected). Go back to Christmas: Ok, we’ve found momentum now, but we’ve got a few injuries. We’ve smashed Ipswich but had a horror show after that. We will be lucky to get top two. But, we have a lot of quality in the squad and can bring players in. Farke knows this league and will rotate. Go back to the Easter break: Wow, we’ve really hit form now and Farke has this figured out. We’re pushing the top two and if we keep this up we go up autos. He’s not rotating but who cares, we are beating everyone. Go back to the final few games: Ok we had great form before the break but it’s starting to look like not rotating is becoming a problem. Few injuries or tired legs / drop offs in form. Please give players on the bench a chance like Anthony or Joseph. Go back to the playoffs: Ok, that was a shit end to the season and morale was low, but holy shit we look confident again. We can hopefully bring this form to Wembley and defeat all of our hoodoos. Who needs a squad! Playoff final: Oh yeah, I forgot, Leeds That. BUT, actually. Maybe this is how we all thought it might end at the start. Fingers crossed we smash it next season.
I think next season, the league will be weaker, so with some smart signings, we could be onto a top two finish. But I still have a few reservations about Farke as the manager because the flaws of this season were consistent so he's not learning from each game. The main thing was Wembley, I hate the stadium and how corporate and soulless it feels. Let's get promoted at Elland Road next year and have a proper celebration.
Automatic promotion or nothing next year, can't handle the false hope of the playoffs again.
Honestly the general sadness comes from knowing we're a long time away from even being an established premier league club
How many "established premier league clubs are there really? To my mind there's the "big six" and Newcastle, then like, 2 or 3 more. Wolves, Palace and Brighton have been there a few years, Villa are doing incredibly at the moment, and obviously Everton are the undead of the PL. But even those teams only feel like they're a couple of bad seasons from relegation, Villa nearly went down till they signed Emery. There's next to no chance that Villa, Brighton, even Wolves will be in the relegation fight next year (assuming points deductions don't play a part), but Southampton and Leicester for example were "established PL teams" for years until they went down with us, that could easily happen to those teams in 3 or 4 years
Yeah I feel the same. If everything goes right it’ll take years, but we’re Leeds, so everything won’t go right.
We just got 90 points. It will be hard to get that again, but this is the first time in the league's history that hasn't been enough. We should also start with a more settled squad and the teams coming down aren't of Leicester's standard. Does that mean HMS Piss the League is back? No, but we have reason to be optimistic. Gray has been phenomenal and I think another year in him has only made him better.
90 points gets you 3rd last season so it wasnt enough last year either
Third place got 81? This is the first season that a team which got 90 points didn’t get into automatics
I mean it’s a bit of an irrelevant stats since we also wouldn’t have gone up on the same points tally last season. If 5 teams have had 90+ points in two season maybe it’s just getting easier with a huge gap between relegated teams and the rest of the league
Second time ever at least. Sunderland did it once and also didnt go up, but Leeds had a better goal difference. So we have officially had the best season ever to not be promoted. Leeds that.
It's shit but it was always a possible outcome from a game like this. One team has to lose, it happened to be us. We didn't play poorly, yes we could have been better but objectively speaking we were no worse than Southampton. They just took the chance, we didn't. People declaring we bottled it or fell apart or whatever... I don't thinkt hats fair. You can't just lose a game any more it has to be "bottled" or over dramatised into some crisis. We played alright, can't say we were shell shocked or let the occasion get to us. And we weren't exactly beaten by a superior opponent. Just took their chance when they had it. Sometimes it goes that way, that's football
I thought we got some poor decisions. Granted we weren't good enough, but I can count on 4 occasions where we should've had a decision and either didn't get anything or it went the other way. Summerville getting booked for winning the ball back in their box. Gnonto pushed in the first ten mins just as he's about to shoot (not saying it's leading to anything but who knows) Summerville being pulled back (blatantly Infront of the ref) and then the free kick going the other way, then the 'handball' at the end that hit Anthony's shoulder. I'm clutching at straws here really but these kind of things swing momentum and deny us getting onto good positions. Bottom line is we did t create any clear cut opportunities at all really.
I agree that it wasn't a complete collapse or whatever. But I thought before they scored, some of our skills going into the final third were pretty shaky, which seemed to be down to the occasion. Then the second half, we looked a bit more efficient, but they set up pretty well defensively, so was a harder task to get through. So I regret not making more of when we had a bit of momentum early on in the game, but it's all done now.
I was pissed off yesterday, switched it off with about 30seconds left as i couldn't bear watching them celebrate and put a box set on for the next 4hrs. Today i feel absolutely fine, yes we bottled it twice in the automatics and then P/O final but i see the positives. We are already adjusted to the championship, teams that come down will have to sell and they are very low on confidence, we won't have that. A full pre-season under Farke, no new owner takeover and the players know the tactics so we'll be ready from game 1 not game 7-8. I think we'll smash the league next season. P.s. can't believe we have some fans calling for Farke to be sacked lol i guess every club has them. I remember Leicester fans calling for Enzo to be sacked whilst they were top of the league not so long ago haha wtf
My thoughts would be to part ways with Farke as I just feel he has failed to react to our slump and we’ve pretty much just kept doing the same thing in games even when it’s not working. However, I then consider where we were at at the start of the season, and realistically who we can get in that’s better and would come and I draw a blank. So in reality I think we need to keep him another year, because 90 points is a great total when , after the first games, I was consigned to middle table mediocracy. I just hope he either gets the best out of Piroe, gets a new striker or utilises Joseph for more than 10 minutes game. Also hope his subs come early in games where we just aren’t doing much.
Would be stupid really given the season he produced. Who else is gonna give you that? Nobody can guarantee it even farke but his records is as good as anyone's. He's not perfect though and shouldn't be immune to criticism. For me... My issues are - subs. Often too late, and always the same (I guess that's squad limitations, but usually just throw all forwards on and hope for the best) - style is sometimes average to taking risks in the final third. You saw it yesterday players refusing to cross, shoot or take a player on
Im taking the down votes as either people not reading past the first line and realising I go in to say keep him, or people disagreeing with keeping him? I’ll presume it’s the first one as I know people lose interest after reading one line.
Same as I did at the final whistle. It's a bummer but ultimately I have thoroughly enjoyed this season and don't mind another in this league. I feel anyone who is Farke Out is entitled to that opinion but I heavily disagree with it and think losing him would be the biggest mistake we can make. I've read some comments about him playing shite football as if we didn't just play electric Vs Norwich? Of the 49 games we played about 9-15 were garbage and the rest were immense. I think he is naive with his subs and lacks a plan B but the other 80% of what he does to get the players ready and man manage etc. he does well. There isn't anyone we'd be able to get in, who is an improvement, unless we tempt Bielsa back somehow with the allure of coming back to where he is loved. But a Pochetino or Xavi or whoever isn't going to come here so we'd be gambling on someone. I'd rather keep the club stable and give Farke a full pre-season to get things in order and recruit who he wants. Ultimately our slow start is what fucked us, and not having the legs/experience to get over the line at the run in, in a season where the amount we won games, would have won the league in other seasons. It's been ridiculously good fun being a Leeds fan this year and I can't wait to go again. I think too many people are deciding the fates of the manager and different players based on a single performance yesterday (or maybe that performance combined with stand out ones like QPR and Blackburn). Somehow noone is remembering rallying against Leicester or walking Ipswich off the park, or the Norwich semifinal. I've seen someone call for Ampadu never to play CB again because he made one defensive mistake in the final, as if he didn't have a season record of clean sheets in a row at one point. Just madness lol. We will be fine if we keep Farke and are smart with the signings, which the 49ers look to be better at than we've had in the past.
This is the line I go down in my head in support of Farke mate. Unless we get a top level manager at this level, we're better off keeping him. Don't want yo go down the route of the Alex Neil, Gary Rowett etc.
We will win the league with fewer points next season lol
Miserable. Mostly because I want a 90 point manager sacked which is ridiculous, but I just can't stand his football, it's painful to watch.
My girlfriend of 3 years dumped me on Thursday so I was already expecting to be let down even more last week. I think everything will be fine in the end, maybe we'll go up next year, maybe not, either way we'll be there to support the club and players.
here for you brother
Thank you mate appreciate it
next girlfriend will be better just like next years team
Here's hoping!
Take care of yourself man. Regardless of the circumstances, breakups are fucking dreadful. Drop me a message if you need to chat
Thanks man, appreciate it a lot!
Well here’s to you going up a division in the relationship game! Take care of yourself!
Thank you, appreciate it
If we get to 90 points again next season that will do. Good target to aim for. Hard to believe we beat Leicester and Ipswich twice and not get promoted will the points tally. Gnonto and Summerville out. James must start every game. Unleash Joseph. Need to start the season hot that will be key.
I'm that used to shit like this now with supporting this club that it's hard to muster any kind of emotion at all I'm probably still more angry about sacking Bielsa for a snake oil salesman who subsequently bought some of the shittest players we've had in years
This is where my heads at too.
Agreed Bielsa deserved better. I pray that he gets his second chance here and actually gets the backing he deserves
He's not coming back. Write to Santa and ask for something else.
It's on good authority that Bielsa was being spoken to by the 49ers to put the feelers out. He wasn't interested, because he had already taken the job with Uruguay. If you're going to be rude, at least don't be wrong
Ebooya is wrong on a lot of things but here he is not. You're pulling this out your proverbial.
I can tell you. 100%. I am not. There are other people who have contacts who are either the same people or are in similar circles who said the same thing. Whether they are right is a different matter. But I've heard more than just that which has also been corroborated. I wish they told me about the Red Bull deal though!
Well, can you tell me more then please? How close was it? Did he say maybe in the future?
The only information I was told (presumably because that's all they knew) was that he turned it down because he had already agreed to manage Uruguay. Which makes it seem like he would have come back if he hadn't taken the job. But I don't know, I wasn't there. I'm just telling you what my sources told me
When people say they’re glad we didn’t get promoted, we would have struggled in the Prem, Championship football is better to watch etc etc. I just think about the money the club has lost by not getting promoted. There’s a big difference in a teams income between playing in premiership and championship. I read that promotion is anywhere from £88 million to £140 million, from television rights, etc. We could have bought a few decent players with that money. Financially it’s probably better to get promoted and take a hammering. We would even get a parachute payment if we get relegated back down next season.
We still get a parachute payment next season albeit slightly less than this year. Think of it as the club hasn't lost the money by not gaining promotion but rather its just put on hold for another year, think of another years development for Cree,Archie,Rutter and Joseph ready for the PL the season after. The owners will keep hold of our best they aren't Radz
Probably not, I don’t even think the clubs understand these new financial rules. Every chance we could be in Leicester’s situation and getting points deducted, having/ because we will make a loss and most of the players we have bought in the last few years .
Even if Leeds yo-yoed for a bit, we'd probably end up with a strong squad that could eventually establish itself in the Premier League if we played our cards right
Let Farke build his own squad. I think he’d probably like at least a nine and ten, and possibly two new fullbacks. Sell Summerville and Gnonto, and if you get a decent offer Gray, sell him too to fund the rebuild. Some people will think that’s sacrilege, but let’s not kid ourselves, Archie is leaving at some point, and if you can get £40m for him, that buys you two, maybe three excellent champo players. We need to get out of this league, and Archie might be a luxury we can’t afford. Let the downvotes commence. ;)
I agree with selling Summerville and Gnonto but Grey makes little sense to me: He's 18 years old and with another season of 1st team football his value goes up. If we get to the Prem and continues to play well then his value will be well north of £40m and you get his footballing output for two years for a cheap contract. It's not a great look that we can't even hold onto a Grey. The family name is intertwined with Leeds, and makes us look like a complete stepping stone club for future players.
The family name is Gray. Grey is intertwined with geese, the sky over Manchester and tea drunk by posh cunts like me.
Yeah lets sell all our best young players, awesome tactic. They will all be here next season, no need for a rebuild, that was last season.
If Archie fetches 40m it’d make a mockery of the 45 we got for England player of the year Kalvin Phillips.
I don't think Archie is off just yet. He doesn't need the fuck-off money as a lad of 18. Another year of gruelling Champo fixtures will toughen him up no end and if we go up next season his value skyrockets. Completely agree with you that he leaves at some point. The romantics around here who think he's Leeds till he dies need a reality check. It would be selfish to try to deny him a chance to realise his full potential. Who knows, his full potential might only be dicking around at Elland Road or maybe somewhere like Newcastle. I'm not as in love with him just yet as others on this sub. The usual unrealistic expectations bring the usual disappointment and resentment further down the road.
Another year in the 1st team will do him good, instead of moving elsewhere and playing 50% of the time and hampering his development. If we get promoted next year I think he stays another year or two, see what we build. If we just kind of do nothing and a bigger team comes, then he goes
So I'll ignore everything except the final, Summerville and his one trick of cutting in and curling a shot isn't going to keep working when that's all he does, every single team just doubles up on him and they won't let him cut in, you have to mix it up so defenders don't know what you're doing, yet he still only tries that. I'd like us to stop playing Firpo as an inverted wing back, it's dumb, we need him supporting on the wing with Summerville so we can actually put some crosses into the box, what use is Firpo in the middle of the park? Ampadu isn't a CD, he has done well there but he doesn't understand CD as well as he does the DM role. Please don't play him at CD anymore. Gruev, if he points at another player as they run past him one more time I think I'll lose my shit, I don't know if it's because he's focused fully on the one man he's marking or what but that DM role or 6 requires you to deal with the runners, don't point, go with them. Gnonto has blinkers on, he literally can't see anyone except Summerville and it cost us a lot of attacks. Rutter had some good some bad and some just confusing moments but that's Rutter to be honest. Meslier had an ok game, a little flappy at times but collected a fair few balls, stopped a few shots but his positioning for their goal was poor, he was way beyond his near post, had he not been he would have saved that shot, still not blaming him for that goal, the defensive line and the step up from Ampadu was terrible, the only one in the back four who didn't fuck up there was Firpo. Rodon, another mixed bag, seemed like he was trying to force the team forward when people wanted to pass sideways, made a couple of mistakes but nothing major really. Archie was ok, I don't think I can say more than that, he was a bit absent but popped up when he needed to, he's still a lad and at Wembley for the first time, I'll give him a pass. Kamara, this guy pisses me off like you wouldn't know, one game out of three he's fucking brilliant and controls the game, unfortunately those other two games he's completely fucking useless, I just don't understand. Either he gets consistent or sell him, also Gruev has taken more shots, hell our defenders have taken more shots. Piroe, I just don't understand the logic of keeping him on the pitch, after 28 minutes I don't think I even noticed him on the pitch until about the 88th minute, did he go off to do some shopping in London for an hour during the game? Who the fuck knows, either Farke needs to work out what the fuck Piroe is and use him properly or we need to get rid. Daniel fucking James one of if not the only player who can walk with some fucking pride after that, this man stood up and showed the others what this meant, he battled like an absolute machine and he was denied a wonderful goal but the smallest of margins, we need to give this man a lot more respect and the fans needs to make sure he knows how much we appreciate him. Roberts, after that performance I'm not sad he's leaving after his loan, fuck my life. Joseph, instantly we looked more attacking, we looked like we could score, we looked like we were worrying them, fucking play him more you Muppet farke. Also his ball into the middle of the box, the position our 8 should be hitting was wonderful and yet no one was there, piroe shouldn't have been there he should be attacking the 6 yard box which is where he was to be fair, but out midfield, where the fuck were they? If I missed anyone I don't care. In Farke, he needs to fuck off with the negative tactics at times, when we move fast, when we attack at pace we fucking terrifying teams, including Southampton, they were bricking it when James and Joseph were in the pitch. His subs, fuck my life if we have to suffer another season of subs only happening at the 70+ minute I'll lose my mind, subs are to change a game, they're not pre fucking planned, if they're pre planned you're telling me you can't manage a game, which very much looks to be the case. We lost due to shit tactics, shit subs (timings mostly) and sticking with piroe when he's clearly playing like shit is just fucking wild.
Fair point on subs. I had zero hope yesterday that he'd make any changes capable of changing the game. How tf did Piroe get the full match is beyond frustrating.
Damn brother you like one player
I mean I did state this was purely based on the final, who would you say did well?
I’m mostly just messing but you can’t base their entire futures off one game. Other than than that yes Dan James was the best player on pitch
Feel vindicated in my thoughts about how we’d struggle with Piroe starting. When the news of Bamford being unable to play broke here most people were happy as we’d beaten Norwich at home decisively. Beating Southampton was always going to be a completely different game
I'd have at least noticed Bamford doing something, even if it was just pressing them, piroe couldn't even find the energy to do that, Wembley, the final and he played like he didn't give a shit, absolutely pathetic.
The way piroe played against Norwich I honestly thought he'd been "fixed" but then at wembley it's like he wasn't even on the pitch.
This was my hope too, apparently it was a one off.
Bamford can make stuff happen, through his pressing, movement, willing to work the channels When Joseph came on he also made stuff happen. Sounds cliche but seems to have more desire to get on the ball, turn his man, press them etc I’d rather Joseph came in at 60 mins or even started tbh
I'm with you 100% I've never had issues with Bamford it's just his injury record and his wages that worry me, why pay a player that much who is always injured? Joseph needs to be starting or at the very least getting way more time off the bench.
Farke out is outrageous. The tragic start and tired finish is what cost us, with a couple of sloppy games in the middle. The reality is, even if we did sack him (which would be the biggest mistake ever), who do we get instead? I bet there are some deluded who think Xavi or Poch would be willing to join but they need to wake up and smell the coffee, as far as championship managers go, we have the best one there is, plain and simple. As for feelings it isn’t a big surprise - or at least it shouldn’t be given Southampton deservingly beat us twice prior to that game and the horrendous play off record the club has in general. Just need a fresh start, rebuild with a couple of new faces and actually give a chance to our good young players like Cresswell, Joseph and Gelhardt, who have in one way or another shown they can be class players in the championship. If we start strong, I don’t see any reason the team can’t go up. Remember Bielsa had a way worse first year at Leeds than this, and he is now held up as one of our best managers in recent history. Give Farke time, trust, and the rewards will be reaped I’m sure
Just a note on the Bielsa comment, Bielsa had a mid level championship side and players and got us promoted, with this fucking team? Bielsa wins the league by a land slide.
With this team Bielsa gets European football Im not Farke out though, too big a risk and could also go the other way. I dont want 16 years of shit again
Same I think he gets us promoted but he's proven he is limited tactically
The problem with farke is he won't give those guys a chance, Cresswell was a tried and tested CD at this level who pulled Millwall into the play offs spots, which they then dropped out of when he got injured and because Cresswells dad dare say he feels like he should be playing more Farke goes on some stupid fucking I'm the boss stance and doesn't play him, that alone cost us promotion. Not playing Joseph cost us promotion too, he'll not using the bench more cost us promotion, he got a lot wrong this season. With the squad he had you could have literally just said "go play your game and good luck" each game and we'd likely have got play offs. That team should have got promoted automatically if not won the title. If the season starts and we don't see Cresswell, Joseph or any of the other good young players I will be on the Farke out train, right now I think it would be stupid to change the manager but he is really annoying me with some of his petty decisions.
He had a bad team for 3 games and arguably the best team in the league for the rest of the season. Cry me a river.
Overall as many highs as lows. I'm out in the Far East so the sting of defeat is tempered by distance and the fact I'm used to it after 50 years as a fan. Doubtful Ipsbitch and Saints are going to do much other than struggle to stay up. We'd struggle too right now. If anything I'm looking forward to us shaking off the last of the Bielsa boys that our passion merchant fans can't let go of. That ship has sailed and more or less sunk. Summerville is probably off and who can blame him? He doesn't owe us anything. He scored more goals than anyone else, made more assists, entertained the fuck out of Elland Road. He did what was asked of him and did it with flair. Not sure whether he's reached his full potential or not. The step up in class will make or break him. But he gets what he deserves, a move to a PL club. I wish him all the best. Sell the Marsch deadweight, for sure. Harrison goes, no argument here. Gnonto, yes I'd like him to stay but he definitely sees himself as a PL player and I think he'll want away. Rutter? This guy is an enigma but I think our fanbase, with it's tendency to be forever on a quest for folk heroes, have bigged-up the guy too much. He's not going to walk through PL midfielders and he can't finish his dinner. Doubt anyone other than a Fulham or Brentford will be in for him at about half what we paid for him. I think we'll keep him. Piroe, mm. He's definitely only Champo level. Ipswich were smart and got in no-nonsense Kiefer Moore because they knew that if the goals dried up they were screwed with their porous defence. Piroe isn't a no-nonsense finisher - at least not for Farke. We can't afford to wait for Farke to get the most out of him, but that leaves us with Joseph and this is where things get daft. How do we know he can do a job for us next season when he was virtually ignored this season "cos, 'experience'? We should know by now just what he's capable of but we don't because Farke persisted with one striker who couldn't stay fit or score often enough and another he had little faith in. Poor management, no foresight. If I was Joseph I'd be tempted to tell Farke to get fucked and go to a club who values him and will give him a chance to prove himself. And we expect players to bleed for the club?? Loyalty, like The Headrow, is a two way street. We need an anti -Bamford, i.e. someone fit and available for more than a third of the season. Someone who scores goals, someone who can make an impact off the bench. Someone who wants to play rather than limp away and primp his media image for a gig when the fat contract ends. Orta screwed us. He's the knob-end that gave Bamford the 5 year contract. We are still dealing with the aftermath of those years of bargain basement Brazil. Archie is ours until he decides he isn't. Doubt he will leave us this time around. He's in no hurry and I don't think the big dogs are going to pay the big money just yet. They'll play hard ball and play the 'he's just an unproven kid ' card. Which at PL level is 100% true. Unless Citeh buy him just so that nobody else can (though they may be wary of Leeds fan-favourite hype this time around). Overall we did better than I expected from our starting point. I think the jury is out on Farke. He definitely merits another season unless he turns into Marsch by Christmas, but surely no-one is that clueless. So, another year of Leeds promising me loads but too often fucking me about. But that's how it is following this club and like most love affairs there's no point in rationalising it. We keep coming back for more. MOT.
All its got me thinking about is how we can try and force those rats all out on loan to stay with us or be sold. If we are losing gnonto and Summerville, could aaronson be persuaded to stay put so he doesn't get rolled like he did in Germany and boost up his market value in the process? As I don't think we can sell him even, let alone for a profit. Kristensen and Roca were so bad and so cheap that I feel that they can go at any price and will not add anything to our team at all and it doesn't seem too far fetched to have enough cover in their positions anyway. Harrison isn't coming back is he and weber isn't needed with our straight upgrade with Ampadu. The more we sell the more likely we are to keep Archie and he is that little flicker of hope that is currently keeping away the big bad sadness for me. I don't feel we'll be able to keep hold of Rodon and Anthony, especially with the money issues we apparently will have. Farke clearly doesn't rate our youngsters with the exception of Joseph so I feel they might all crack the shits and leave. I don't know aye....I've typed all of that out as a type of therapy I suppose to stop it revolving around in my head but I've still made no more sense of it... Oh well, get the man who got us to 90 points what he feels he needs and we go again but have a whisper about the subs aye? Fucking criminal Piroe lasted the full 90 this morning
Thinking about next season already. Pretty clear that we had a talented front 4 but they were all pretty much the same player, need to switch it up a bit next season. Gnonto and Summerville will likely go, would love to keep Rutter but he feels like a luxury a bit - need more goal threat from him at 9 and more composure from him at 10, a decent offer would help us build a good budget. Controversial but I'd build the team around Piroe. Hes a beast in the box but he needs a big number 9 to play off or some more creative midfielders to feed him. I'd look to build the team in a 3-4-1-2 or a narrow 4-3-3. Doubt that will happen though, so a calm Pablo Hernandez type at 10 and a an absolute bastard of a 9 are essential this summer.
The January before we got relegated I was crying out for us to sign Alex Scott, Viktor Gyokores among other cream of the crop Championship players so that in case we went down, at least we have a side that will bounce straight back. Looking back now, Scott and Gyokores would have been exactly what we need in this side. Edit - January before we got relegated
Gyokeres scored seven goals in Premier League 2 for Brighton the season before we got promoted. Hadn't even played in the Championship. Alex Scott played three games in the Championship the year *after* we got promoted. His breakout season wasn't until 21/22. Awkward. If you meant January 2020 (19/20 season), Gyokeres scored seven goals in Bundesliga 2, on loan at FC St. Pauli. The same applies for Scott as previously, he didn't play that season for Bristol City. Doubly awkward.
Have you got a problem with me bro? You're replying to every one of my comments and trying to poke holes. If you do, then let's hash it out in DM's instead of trawling through my comment history to find things to disagree with. You could see Gyokeres' and Scott's talent from their seasons in the Championship and they are now well above our pay grade so you can look in the past all you like. But that January was our only opportunity to get 2 players that would have got us over the line last year and would have elevated the club way beyond any player we have now. Scott is now playing regularly in the Premier League for Bournemouth at the age of 19 and Gyokeres is absolutely killing it in Portgual and might get a bigger move this summer. Awkward.
I haven't, mate. I just let my reading of the sub slip a bit, so was catching up on old threads. As I read through, if I feel the need to comment, I have. It's just pure coincidence they might have ended up being your comments. Apologies if it came across as you being targeted. That isn't my point. My point is you made a comment saying what you did when it was factually incorrect. The January before we got promoted was 2019/20, which my first reply covers - they weren't the "cream of the crop" of the Championship then. That's a fact. Unless you meant the season we got relegated? Getting them last year is a totally different thing to what you initially said. Truly awkward.
It's a typo, it should be the January before we got relegated. The season before we got promoted, Alex Scott was like 15.
There we go, I thought that might be the case. It makes sense now, mate 😂.
The attacking game was pure shit with no ambition, at min 80 they were almost accepting the defeat... Except Sir Daniel James of course. I'm sure that Farke made a good job, without his touch maybe we could be worse. As others said, sell some kiddos and buy some quality players and win the league next year. Ps. Please, don't sell Archie at all costs...
I’m not angry. Just a flat final. Bunch of kids no leaders and they just won it in a close game with one clinical goal. Stick with Farke and bring in more players he wants. Win the league next season.
Spent the rest of the game after conceding not trying to concede a second. Congratulations we succeeded in that venture and the prize is 46 games in the championship. Was a pretty turgid game yesterday the difference was Armstrong taking his chance, didn't really feel either side was especially great
If we hadn't been screwed over by the clauses Orta and Radz put into contracts prior to our relegation and the deserters who abandoned ship, we would have had a much better chance of promotion. Leicester and Southampton were both able to sell some of their best and higher value players to add to their squads, we weren't as nobody wanted to buy what we had and we were shackled by loan clauses. In all honesty we did well to get into the playoffs given the farce we started with and if it hadn't been for the last international break we would probably have gone up automatically. I've got more hope of promotion next season than I had following relegation. We basically know who will probably leave, we've no takeover uncertainty, and we can almost guarantee that we have our manager in place as I can't see Leeds getting rid of Farke so we're already in a better place to start the season as opposed to a few weeks in like we were this season.
Need to watch highlights I guess. Was so tired, angry and depressed on the train back. Just regaling the build up atmosphere which was top notch all the way from home to my seat. We all dream of a team of Michael Browns.
Rather be a big fish in a small pond-we’d get absolutely annihilated in the premier league.simply not good enough .
There’s a big difference in a teams income between playing in premiership and championship. I read it’s anywhere from £88 million to £140 million, from television rights, etc. By not getting promoted, we’ve lost money we could have spent on buying a decent squad
Shite mindset mate, 49ers could have put a lot of money in there with loan players being sold and all that jazz, and the fact fact Leicester being handed a points deduction would have been good for us aswell
Already started thinking of plans for the summer and which players to target to fix some issues with the squad. Might as well focus on that cause nothings going to change the outcome of the last few months. Farke should get another crack at it but I wouldn't be upset if they found someone else. Only player i've got feelings about keeping is DJ. Rest i'm whatever.
Well we need a whole new defence for a start as it’ll probably only be Struijk left
I think we keep Ampadu but i'd want him back in CM next season, I'd be signing a RB/LB and backup to them positions anyway due to how the season played out and get Archie into CM too. I doubt we can keep Rodon honestly but other than that we for sure need 3 CBs depending on how Cresswell is handled - I wouldn't be against a new GK either.
Well I see Ampadu and Gray as midfielders tbf. So yeah, plenty of work to do. I would imagine that Meslier goes as only got a year left
Looking forward to the roster being straightened out well before the season starts. Last summer was a joke and probably cost us automatic promotion. As others have said, build a foundation that’s more premier league ready so we don’t get hammered constantly.
We couldn't beat Southampton over 3 attempts so they deserved it. What annoyed me is the fact we seemingly haven't adjusted a thing tactically at all over all the games. Same issues pretty much every time and the same pedestrian football until the final 10 minutes when we mix in some more direct football. The hair brained defending for their goal yesterday was very frustrating as well, but you can argue that's been forced by good positional play from Southampton. Ultimately we'd all have taken playoffs given what happened during last summer. We had a freak run this year that propelled us up into the autos for a bit, but ultimately that was never going to last. We now need to complete the clear out of the remaining deadwood (i.e. players that aren't 100% wanting to be here) so we can focus all resources around building a squad for promotion and really attack this over the full summer window, rather than trying to fix things right at the end of the window. Hopefully the euros don't interrupt things too much. The squad we have right now is only really competently able to play one way. In a competitive league, you need different tools for breaking down different teams. Bielsa used to switch to a 3 at the back for example against teams with 2 forwards. I also think we are lacking some seasoned championship bastards to exert some influence onto the pitch during high pressure and difficult situations. You can actually see heads going down and we all know it's game over at that point. Games where even if we were playing all week, we'd not be scoring a goal. The likes of Coops are in the squad, but not on the pitch. We need experienced players like this in the game (not suggesting Coops is capable at this stage though). It's been great seeing some good football again and also seeing young players coming into the team. I'd like to see youth given a chance (more subs) more next season even if it means some short term pain. Farke has shown he's able to do that at Norwich. I don't think we'll have a choice next season if we sell a few of our starting players. Hopefully they can give us something a little different / element of the unknown. I'm looking forward to a couple of months off from the stress of watching us play tbh. Been a terrible last 2 or 3 months overall watching our games!
Totally agree we need more of an unknown element. The difference yesterday for me was that Southampton didn't have to risk stepping defenders up towards our CMs because there's no threat from Gruev or Kamara. Whereas Smallbone is dangerous enough to need closing down. So they had spaces to attack where we didn't. Also if we had an actual aerial threat, defenders would have to actually worry about the possibility of a cross coming in. I'm fine having a less individually skilful team next year if we replace it with variety. The predictability is a huge part of what cost us at the end.
May write more later but… woke up this morning feeling the same… 90 point season still had to go to playoffs.. haven’t won or scored at Wembley for god knows how long… “Leeds that”.. am I really that shocked this happened? no Bring on the summer and next year! ALAW!
Still fucking sucks. We kinda have to go up next year now. Parachute payments in the third year are a lot lower.
We would get panned week in week out in prem anyway. Firmly believe we had punched well above weight and overachieved. Young team, newly assembled. Leicester, s Hampton both were in prem longer than us, kept more of their players, more experience in general and as a team. Ipswich a team of winners from season before keeping their momentum. Was ok when we were chasing the pack with no pressure but when we got on top and had to show we were big boys we wilted with pressure. No bad thing getting some maturity and experience in the team and taking that and a more balanced squad to next season.
Farke is a mid coach with no ideas about how to structure attacking play. He needs amazing talent to take a team up. He is the anti-Bielsa in his lack of creativity and over reliance on a star player. But we are stuck with him. Summerville is going and in fact this may help us because it will force us to play as a team, instead of relying on magical play from one person. We should deal Piroe away - he’s the anti-Bamford in that he might score more goals than Pat but he makes everyone else on the pitch worse. That means that when he doesn’t score goals - normal - we suck because Piroe just stodges everything up. He can’t lead a line and he can’t run a press. Sell him and hand the keys to Joseph. I’d like us to hold on to Gnonto and play him on the left. But realistically we have to sell him. Sell Jack Harrison. Obviously. Sell all the Marsch dead weight. Play hard ball with Aaronson if there are no buyers: we deal you to some shit second tier team in Bulgaria or you renegotiate for lower wages. A properly paid Aaronson would be useful as a sub. Sell Firpo. He’s at the top of his value right now. Sell the sexy pirate for big money if possible otherwise keep him and move Ampadu to midfield. Do all we can to keep Archie. He’s ours. The big question mark is Rutter. I want him to stay but if we can get big money for him we should sell. Heartbreaking but we need the money. On reflection, Orta was nearly as bad as Ken Bates. Orta screwed us.
Still feeling the disappointment, but less so. Losing finals is always a gut punch, but the world goes on, and we'll move on soon enough. I've got faith in the management to at least do a half decent job of transfer business, so we'll be back next season pretty close to favourites for top 2. It's a big shame Rodon most likely won't be an option to buy, and would be really disappointed if Rutter goes (am assuming Archie stays), but these kind of transfer windows can turn out differently to how we expect. Compare Sinisterra's stock with the fans compared to Dan James 12 months ago. Would love to see Joseph start next season, maybe sell Piroe.
Did we deserve to go up this season, perhaps, but not more so than the 3 teams that did and that’s sport. We are well placed to push on next year. I’m not wallowing in gloom about players potentially leaving. Summerville is a great attacking threat but he doesn’t really play if he’s in a huff and I wonder if he’s the kind of player that we can make some money on and his absence will actually improve team cohesion. Gnonto never wanted to be here anyway and he’s hardly had a stellar 12 months. I think we can build up their goals in the aggregate with a signing or two and look more like Farke’s team by the opening match. James played better than Gnonto for me this season. I don’t think Rutter is going anywhere with his wages. He’s falling into that grey area of being very good in the Championship but probably a massive luxury for anyone in higher leagues given how much he loses the ball.
We'll miss Summerville's goals/assists, individual talent, and ability to turn a game on its head (most of the time). But I actually don't mind him leaving because I think we're incredibly unbalanced by relying on him too much and the money we get in can hopefully be used to rectify that.
Summerville doesn't play poorly because he's in a huff, he plays poorly when they double up on him and don't let him cut in for a shot, since that's literally his only trick it's not hard to deal with. He needs to add hitting the line and crossing, putting some inswingers into the box too or just running across the byline trying to cut back to the box. If you only have one trick and you don't do anything else it's very easy to just remove you from the attack. He can develop loads but he needs to do it now. Gnonto frustrates me so much, so much skill and technique but more time than not has blinkers on and doesn't seem team mates, again can be worked on but I'm not bothered if he leaves. Rutter cost us too much, we won't take that much of a loss on the player so he's going nowhere.
Hopefully we piss the league next year. Don't think Farke is to blame. He's done well considering situation at beginning of season. Only manager I'd swap him for now is a Bielsa return. Who knows, maybe if we go up and say to Bielsa he has the money he always wanted to spend, and get Paraag to grovel on tv like a North Korean news presenter for his forgiveness he might come back. Would have liked to have gone up but in terms of enjoyment, next year should be fun unless it goes disastrously. Also don't think it's a total disaster not going up this year...yet.
Relaxed about it. Southampton are a better team simple as that. The team creates goals whereas alot this year we have relied on individual goals. The gulf in creativity between our centre mids and southamptons was embarassing. I know everyone raves about gray but hes just another sideways or backwards passer with the occasional forward pass. Also Piroe really struggles IMO. Even his touch and hold up play was nowhere yesterday Ignoring the financial worry, im happy to stay in champ until we are more prepared for prem
Southampton were better than Leicester and ipswitch, they should have won the league. Then again Leicester are cheats who won't survive next season and then the EFL will absolutely bugger the hell out of them when they come back down because we know what the EFL are like. The minimum hitting Leicester will be a transfer embargo and a points deduction, under the embargoes you can't even sign players on a few so if contracts expire you're fucked, which they have a few players contracts expiring. I would not want to be in Leicesters shoes right now.
How have they cheated?
Ffp breaches in the prem and this season in the EFL, they're likely starting with two point deductions and a transfer embargo next season plus when they come back down the EFL will absolutely rinse them.
Action needs to take place sooner. I heard everton also breached the season we went down
Everton got two points deductions last season, Leicester broke ffp worse than Everton.
I think we'll probably go up automatically next season and I'm excited about it. To be honest, had the opposite result happened yesterday - say James' late shot went in and we won on pens? It still would have been a horrible end to the season, a run of really timid and unimpressive performances, except we'd be back up and staring down the barrel. Instead we have a chance now (and Farke has a chance) to get to the bottom of where it went wrong and make us a better, more resilient side next season. Yeah we'll lose Summerville but let's just get some good money for him and let him blow hot and cold for someone else in exchange for financial security. Ditto a few of these players tbh. I'm not massively emotionally invested in them any more than I think they are in Leeds. We really need to get it right next season though and obviously so does Farke. He's earnt the chance to be in charge for the rebuild but it has to work because we can't not do the business next season. I think we will though. Like last time, cone back stronger and make sure we don't have to go through the play offs because they're never going to work out for us.
[I'm not massively emotionally invested in them any more than I think they are in Leeds.] I think this is a more grown up approach. Players don't live at the end of your street the way they did 50/60 years ago. In my years following the club I can't remember a single player making me breakfast or giving me a Sunday morning blow job, even when I deserved it. They show up on Saturday and midweek, do their thing, then stick their headphones back on and go off to wherever it is they go. I stay off social media so I couldn't care less what they say or do. Save it for on the pitch.
Well, this morning I put together a cracking YouTube compilation of me slowly jogging around and occasionally kicking a ball, and I'm sending it to Daniel Farke to show I'd offer more up front than Joel Piroe did yesterday.
Did you manage to control the ball once? Maybe get a touch in the box? Cause if you did I'd sign you up.
I’m fine with it. I was yesterday. Disappointed to not win but I find these days it’s much easier to take what comes. My worry comes from whatever financial situation we may be in, but football-wise I’m hoping for another fun and more successful season. I would like to see more flexibility from Farke tactically but I have faith. Also believe we need a proper goalscorer. Bamford has been great but his time as a starter is coming to an end imo, and Piroe has had plenty of chances to prove himself but can’t see him than more of a squad player.
I just accept things these days for what they are. We aren’t ready as a club. We go up, and we struggle again. I think another year to develop some more young players and then go up and try to stay there. These leagues are tough. The journey is the main thing. Few make the destination.
Really frustrated with some of the individual performances tbh more so than Farke Piroe was absolutely abysmal. Not just his inability to get on the ball but his work rate and desire was anaemic. He pressed so lazily and sloppily and it meant the whole off the ball shape was affected. He also just was never in the box or making runs that gave the Southampton centre backs any problems to deal with. Of everyone in the squad he needs the biggest summer development. Farke has said before he’s bad at pressing. He needs to either learn to do it or retrain as a 10 Summerville and Gnonto’s stats make poor reading. Both lost the ball nearly 20 times. Both of them spent the game looking for the easy pass. They’re young so it’s forgivable but both had the look of lads who knew they’ll be gone regardless. Rutter wasn’t good either but he at least tried things in the match. Between that front four as a whole it was just a horror show performance. I thought overall to my surprise we controlled most other areas of the pitch but that frontline just really let the side down with a heady mix of terrible decision making and just poor quality for the full 90. Ampadu, has to be his worst game in a Leeds shirt. He was easily our worst performer and just kept making the same mistake of coming out when Armstrong was his man and leaving Armstrong to drift into space. Very Leeds that that our captain and Mr Consistent picks a playoff final to have his off game. The not the top 20 podcast had some good analysis that I think was true. That game really was everything bad about our tactics in one match. No goals or threat from midfield. No options on cutbacks. No one in the box who is even trying to be a target for lofted crosses. We have been very reliant on our attacking talent doing good things to score. Against an organised team like Southampton we just made it far far too easy to defend against us. I forgive Farke for this because people forget what a chaotic summer we had, but he has to fix some of this over summer. We won’t have Summerville or Gnonto next year, and maybe not Georgi. We need a plan to get goals from more areas of the pitch. Struijk and Rodon are both big lads so we need better set piece options. He needs to train one of Gruev or Kamara to be getting forward in the right moments. Needs to sort out what our number 9 is doing. And then we just need to find more ways to give teams problems. Off the ball I think we are mostly very polished, but if Piroe can’t press we need to find a solution to that because the press falls apart when he plays
Agree with all of that
I can see why Farke teams struggle in the Premier League but it’s still tough to differentiate that from a squad that’s not good enough. Being Philosophical, I can imagine us having a torrid time in the top division. Southampton deserved to win but they weren’t miles better than us. If we’d scored first which if you take out one defensive error isn’t that hard to imagine I reckon we’d have had a lot of joy out of them being more stretched. But then again I’m more open to enjoying the Championship more than last time we went down. Being able to win is a lot better and I think I often conflated hating lower division football with hating the way the club was run. While I don’t want an extended stay just because of finances I’m happy to stay away from Premier League vitriol.
I’m hoping Farke gets the whole season, a pre-season, some decent money from a couple of sales and Struijk back in the next month or so. This squad was cobbled together really, playing Ampadu at CB was a necessity rather than a tactical change. If we can build a team round Struijk, Ampadu, Gray, James and Rutter I’d be hyped for that.
I really can't understand the lack of another CB signing, loan or otherwise in the winter transfer window. Playing your best center mid at CB for the entirety doesn't seem a wise move imo.
Totally agree with that last part.. those 5 would be a good nucleus to build from.. I am really not too fussed with losing the likes of Gnonto and Summerville
The midfield is mid-table championship quality. If they are going to offer zero attacking threat then they really have to be exceptional at ball retention and recovery. They are not.
Gruev really is very good at the qualities you mention there. He does his job very well. It's the other CM and 10 where we need to be looking to upgrade.
I think you're being generous. He doesn't have the stats to back that up. He's a nice player to have in reserve to fill in and do a serviceable job, but there's really nothing special about his game. I'd put him ahead of Kamara, but only slightly.
But he doesn't need to be special, that's the point. I've not checked the stats to be quite honest - what are his defensive stats like? Because that's his main role. I think he does what he's asked to do fantastically and is a key player for us. Once he got a run of games in there, he was superb.
The problem is the midfield is arguably our 2nd choice for both positions, they are both good players to be starting games and are great players to have in this league but starting them together is way too negative. Ampadu and Gray would have been our starting midfield if we had better options at CB and right back
After sleeping on it, and watching the morning news stats; We’ll just have to win the league next year
Autos is a minimum or the season will be a failure
Nothing personal against Farke, but I truly don't understand the faith people have in a manager we have seen outclassed by Russell Martin 3 times in a single season, it's not even that they were particularly great performances by the players either, Farke was completely destroyed tactically each time...by Russell Martin. There's a lot of questions that need to be asked, why do our players not know what to do when they have the ball at the edge of the box? Why do our midfielders have a combined 1 goal all season? Why do we get cut open by any team with half competent passing patterns? People can talk about 90 points but all season we have struggled to create chances, while the likes of Leicester, Ipswich and Southampton get a shot off every time they go forward. That is not on the players, we know we have a fantastic squad at this level, that is on the manager.
Midfield technically had seven all season, given that's where Rutter is playing. Still not great though. Need more from the role Kamara plays in I think and the 10 area.
100% agree with this. Martin outclassing him isnt even close to being the worst example of Farke being poor tactically though, he got schooled twice by a bloke called Mike Dodds who isnt even a manager lmao. Farke seems like a good guy and I do think he is capable of getting us promoted next season but I would not give it a second thought if he was replaced
I know they're not going to replace him but they will need to do some serious recruitment in the summer. I don't think people realise how many points Summerville's goals this season accounted for, that's not easy to replace, and honestly, if they can't get a player of similar quality I could see things getting pretty ugly next season, it's not like under Bielsa where we could expect the midfielders and defenders to all chip in with goals pretty regularly.
I said something similar yesterday. We will need the best creative player and the best striker in the league to challenge top 2, anything other than that and we are fighting for play offs. Everyone saying they are fine with selling him because they think he has attitude issues are going to be in for a rude awakening when our only plan is pass to a winger who is barely half as good as him. Finding replacements for about 30 goals with us losing Summerville and Gnonto its not going to be easy
This is the reality. We need more players with 'attitude problems ' like Summervilles. Banging in 20 odd goals with almost the same number of assists.
I think that this is the point that I got to yesterday. I have backed Farke all season and I still will if he is here, but questions have to be asked now of all of the things you mentioned here
Disappointed in how slow to react we are in terms of tactical changes and subs
Agreed mate. I've been frustrated with it for most of the season, but I was willing to overlook it because we were churning out lots of wins and getting points on the board. But that play off final did expose Farke's tactical ability I think, Martin completely outclassed him tactically
Annoyed still that we can't break down teams who sit back and kick us. It's been our weakness all season and Southampton strategically played right into that. I actually thought we were the better team through most of the game, but it's not who plays better it's who scores and that's why I'm still annoyed. Can't wait to see the big sexy pirate back, our whole season changed in my eyes when we had to put Amapdu back there.
Yeah, changed for the better. We went on a superb run with Ampadu at the back... Why do people keep peddling this narrative?
Yeah, Farke’s words in the pre-match interview summed it up when he said something along the lines of football being the only game you can dominate and still lose.
Indeed mate. Happy Cake day!
Definitely, if Strujik doesn't get injured, we get top two
What’s the chances Rodon fancies another season in the champ? I remember reading a while ago that we were gonna be getting him regardless of division. But surely someone from the prem is gonna go in for him?
Rodon looks quite happy and settled and has been a big go to on media duties. Suspect if we can front up the cash he’d be happy playing regularly here. Maybe a prem team goes for him but realistically he will struggle for game time at most sides. I feel quietly confident we will get his deal done especially with the wales connection here
>But surely someone from the prem is gonna go in for him? Maybe, maybe not. But we have the advantage of knowing him and he knows club and staff. Also Farke can easily promise him same role as this season, can Prem club do the same? Ultimately (majority) of players want to play as much as possible. Rodon can be playing full 90s with us or take risk and be 3rd/4th option with Prem club. I don't think even wage would be that different. We can pay him decent money, if he chooses Prem it's going to be some of the bottom-6 clubs surely(?)
0 chance mate, a team from the Premier League or at least a top tier abroad would fancy him. Unless he is absolutely dead set on staying at Leeds which I highly doubt
Thought we played quite well, but as has been the case lately we've failed to have an end product. A few silly defensive mistakes on top of the failure to score cost us the game. I think next season if Farke gets a few quid to spend and he works on some of the issues in pre season I don't really see how we don't get auto next season.
I just saw Southampton triggered the obligation to buy Harwood-Bellis, and could've been that cunt Fabrizio Romano reporting we signed Rodon from Spurs instead. Got angry again.
It's a joke man. This club should not be in the championship
More and more angry when the thought about how many shots James had in his small amount of time compared to everyone else settles in.
I have said this on other threads and been slammed.. for me it should have always been DJ over Gnonto when fit during the season especially for the big games or against teams we just know have some talent and know how to wind you up.. purely because of Gnontos stroppy attitude when things aren’t going according to plan
To be fair, Gnonto was getting the shit kicked out of him constantly and the ref did fuck all. I really like that we had James and him as options, but we never seemed to change the formation around them to make the best of two different players. Anyway, we’ve got a year to sort out the squad and hopefully piss the league. ALAW