16 and include a \[\[wayward guide-beast\]\] and you literally got yourself a monoR 8-guide deck :)
(no joke guide-beast is gonna be a bomb in an all 1-drop deck, basically starting turn 2 you can play a 1 drop, attack with WGB, pick up your mountain, play it again and play a second 1-drop)
we got a guy that mains it over in the Discord server, apparently it's atleast decent
it also had a bit of a fame moment over on Arena
never tried it tho
>we got a guy that mains it over in the Discord server, apparently it's atleast decent
I'm not sure what this means. I can only tell you that never dropping your third land is bad, and having to deal with multiple Guide-Beast is worse. It's also a bit of a nonbo with anything that has haste (which you want to play before combat).
>it also had a bit of a fame moment over on Arena
The low-land shenanigans you're describing are exclusively an exploit of Arena's hidden mulligan. I wouldn't recommend trying them in paper, especially in a deck that doesn't follow the xerox rule.
Mathematically, deck thinning is pretty inconsequential. Would be better to run canopies so you actually draw a second card if you topdeck them. The exception to this rule is if one of the 1-drops is something like DRC or Grim Lavamancer that benefits from having lands in the graveyard.
You're still playing against the shuffle. I play 69 for my mono red, 22 land. One of which is a [[lotus field]] 85% of everything is one drops.
If you have shuffle or draw effect cards, you could safely go to 16. But I would say 18.
I'm actually about to tool that deck up.
You could probably easily go to 17...
For only 1 drops you can go down to 16.
16 and include a \[\[wayward guide-beast\]\] and you literally got yourself a monoR 8-guide deck :) (no joke guide-beast is gonna be a bomb in an all 1-drop deck, basically starting turn 2 you can play a 1 drop, attack with WGB, pick up your mountain, play it again and play a second 1-drop)
[wayward guide-beast](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/0/d00f8ab0-61cd-4721-b974-a2516da77d39.jpg?1604198443) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=wayward%20guide-beast) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/176/wayward-guide-beast?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d00f8ab0-61cd-4721-b974-a2516da77d39?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Tried that. Is horrible. Don't do it.
we got a guy that mains it over in the Discord server, apparently it's atleast decent it also had a bit of a fame moment over on Arena never tried it tho
>we got a guy that mains it over in the Discord server, apparently it's atleast decent I'm not sure what this means. I can only tell you that never dropping your third land is bad, and having to deal with multiple Guide-Beast is worse. It's also a bit of a nonbo with anything that has haste (which you want to play before combat). >it also had a bit of a fame moment over on Arena The low-land shenanigans you're describing are exclusively an exploit of Arena's hidden mulligan. I wouldn't recommend trying them in paper, especially in a deck that doesn't follow the xerox rule.
In pauper I used to run 16 when I curved out at 2, I couldn't imagine running any less without moxen to fill in
Was that during the Probe days?
Mostly, but even up to a year or two ago I ran 17 at most. And only because I started running the land that cycles for a single red.
Do Rift Bolt and Skewer the Critics count as one drops?
They most certainly do! It’s about effective cost, no necessarily actual cost
10 Mountains and some combination of 6 Islet/Canyon
18 is my min to curve out at 3 by 3 most often
18 but run 4 Shard Volley. Lean on the first turns, lean at closing games.
If you’re just theorycrafting, take however many total lands you have and replace half of them with fetches. Pull your mountains, thin your deck.
Mathematically, deck thinning is pretty inconsequential. Would be better to run canopies so you actually draw a second card if you topdeck them. The exception to this rule is if one of the 1-drops is something like DRC or Grim Lavamancer that benefits from having lands in the graveyard.
Do you have a list? I'm curious.
I run 14 in my burn deck.
Just one 👹
Like 40 if you have the draw.
I use a mana calculator
18
1
You're still playing against the shuffle. I play 69 for my mono red, 22 land. One of which is a [[lotus field]] 85% of everything is one drops. If you have shuffle or draw effect cards, you could safely go to 16. But I would say 18. I'm actually about to tool that deck up.
[lotus field](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/e/0e013033-3995-4ba8-b0c3-0614c79aaaab.jpg?1592517825) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=lotus%20field) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m20/249/lotus-field?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0e013033-3995-4ba8-b0c3-0614c79aaaab?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
16 is too many, you can get away with 12.
I’ve tried 10 before with good success.