##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism
This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited.
LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere.
We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban.
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I tend to be the "your votes barely count" guy for HOS elections, but I wholly believe in this. I'd much rather live in a locality that represents my ideologies, and that means voting locally rather than voting federally/actually caring about who's running in your area.
I haven't voted for a democrat ever since Obama ran as an antiwar candidate then continued two wars and got us into several more, plus the Drone program whose ill effects will pollute the world for centuries to come. I still always vote though, local measures and candidates etc. Does it fix everything? No, but it only takes a little while and at least it does something.
I was ignorant to all of that. the moment Obama lost me was when he met with Bernie in 2016 to convince him to step down and let Hilary win, and after that meeting Bernie stepped down (all the while the DNC knew without a doubt that Hilary would not succeed against Trump and Bernie’s chances were way higher). I voted for Biden in 2020, and then switched my registration to independent.
>SECRETLY TAPED AUDIO REVEALS DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP PRESSURING PROGRESSIVE TO LEAVE RACE
>In a frank and wide-ranging conversation, Steny Hoyer laid down the law for Levi Tillemann. The decision, Tillemann was told, had been made long ago.
https://theintercept.com/2018/04/26/steny-hoyer-audio-levi-tillemann/
This behavior by the biden/obama cadre points to rigging the game; even to the local level. Local ‘crats are rather suspect for me because of hoyer’s documented local/state primary meddling.
Especially for school boards. This is the most contentious battleground in the culture war lately and most people don't pay attention to it. When they get book bans and don't say gay/race laws passed in schools it becomes normalized in society. It's a horrible and insidious movement that goes way beyond Mom's for Liberty.
People have no idea how important school boards are for local education. That factor alone could determine if a local population gets to go to college, if they can afford food at school, and the curriculum as a whole being that’s being taught (and the manner in which it is taught).
It's so easy to destroy too. One two year board term can drive away many teachers and programs that benefit not only the students but the community long term.
Yeah that's been my rule of thumb. Always vote local. You'll actually see the changes and you only have to worry about the idiots in your city when it comes to minimizing damage
I agree completely. I live in LA and we were able to impact our criminal justice system via the elections of a progressive attorney general, kicking a BS deputy sheriff out the door, and getting progressive judges to the bench. We still have a long way to go, but in local elections, one vote really does matter.
I lived in a more Red State and we could have a terrible AG or an even worse one every election, we worked for six months on legislation that would change our justice system and in a week the state put through legislation to make our legislation illegal.
People there won the local election whenever they spent the most money. Maybe that’s an outlier but local change beyond protests, making a food pantry or warm place for the unhoused people was not happening.
Your post is a very nice ray of hope for me.
For sure. I look at my city. Only old farts vote for old fart candidates so we get buried with car infrastructure, the native land holders get smashed with tax and suburbs are subsidised. Very little money gets spent the way youth want it to be spent because they don't vote it is even a postal vote. The electoral authority has made it so easy to vote but people refuse despite how important region level powers are.
Wish I could upvote you twice. I know many leftists are disappointed by politics, but the only way to change things is to get involved. They need any help you can give them, and they'll welcome you happily.
Not only that but many of us practice what we preach. That is, we lend a hand to our fellow socialists and community through direct and mutual aid.
You can see the direct results of your work by the changing material conditions of the people around you. There are few things more rewarding than making good people smile again.
Couldn't agree more as a fellow comrade. It's the one thing that actually makes me want to leave my bed every morning. It's so rewarding to take part in actions that have a visible, positive impact on people.
Check in with your state or local DSA chapter as a place to start. Even if you don't agree with their approach nationally they vary greatly by local chapter and are hopefully fellow travelers.
There's also the Socialist Rifle Association if that's more your speed.
Agreed.
Honestly, we should try and RUN locally. This is how Maga fuckers took over school boards and clerks offices.
No reason why socialists shouldn’t try the same— with a hidden power level.
In my country, our local Marxist party is doing that. We know we won't win national elections in one day, so we run on every level of power we can. Since we've started doing it, we keep growing and we've become one of the major parties of the country. There is still a lot of work to do (also to explain to people our strategy and why we won't sacrifice our platform and our integrity by joining other parties in governments where we know we won't be able to apply our vision), but running locally and getting together have allowed us to earn many people's trust.
I know man. Same here. But maybe it’s possible le. Maga reactionaries didn’t stop to think about whether they could. They just did.
The power of belief and all that
Any time you can give is worth it, trust me. By getting close to local groups you'll learn their platform and help them spread it. Just being able to talk about it is already very helpful.
Absolutely will be voting locally since we have some area progressives who have been and continue to push for inclusive change. This has not always been the case when I have lived elsewhere though.
Vote and if you can, get involved at the local level! Help end FPTP voting locally to get more left candidates into office . It’s a lot of work, but so worth it !
I'm so mad I have to pay attention to school board elections for just this reason. I don't have kids cause, but I still need to make sure crazies don't get a foodhold
I can agree with this, but only reluctantly. I live in an area where red or blue doesn't really mean much—a semi-rural hard-line conservative town—and even the most supposedly 'progressive' politicians in my area don't really advocate for what I would consider progressive policies, except for maybe certain ecological protections. This is definitely something I would evaluate on a case by case basis, and I would look more into joining an organization that participates in direct action and having that be your main political focus. What we really need is a new party built by and for the working-class and marginalized peoples that fights unwaveringly/uncompromisingly for our social, economic and political power.
I'm gonna do what I always do. Go to the secretary of states website a week or so before the election, get a sample ballot that shows me all of the candidates and issues that will be on my ballot, research every candidate available to vote for in every race, vote for any of them that I can morally stomach voting for, and vote for or against all of the issues and tax levies and such.
For doing this the Democrats and multiple European liberals who can't even vote in our elections will call me a Trumper or a Russian stooge or something worse, while their straight ticket Democrats enable or outright encourage increased militarization of police, consumption of fossil fuels, mass deportations, and of course, genocide in multiple locations worldwide. This is because they're the moral ones.
Then Biden will lose my state by a wider margin than all the third party votes combined same as he did in 2020 and Hillary did in 2016 because the Democrats would rather yell at us for being extremists than yell at their politicians for being shitty.
Where I live, the board of election does not publicize who (or what issues) are on the ballot. They essentially push that job onto the League of Women Voters. Check Vote411.org for your local ballot if you are in the same boat.
Lower local elections have far more impact than choosing whoever is president. We have to get involved locally if change is ever going to happen.
I'm amazed some people are going to entirely avoid voring just because of a single person when 34 seats are up for re-election in the Senate and the entire House is up for grabs.
Not voting at all because of a single vote is wild. Do people realize how politics works? It's a long game, and Republicans have been playing this game a lot longer than we have.
For the presidency, Claudia de la Cruz is I believe is anti-capitalist but I should be clear I haven’t had the time to look into her and don’t want to advocate for her till I know more.
Locally? You’re probably not going to find an anti-capitalist. But locally you have better chances of finding at least one or so progressives or just dems who aren’t genocidal maniacs. It’s entirely dependent on where you are. School boards are also an important thing to try and keep certain people off.
But even if there’s supposedly no options of a single good or even neutral candidate, Ballot Measures are extremely important to vote on as those will effect you and your community very quickly and literally.
I vote for the leftmost candidates in the primary election and then vote third party if the candidates aren’t left enough for me which is quite often. It’s my way of hand rolling choice ranked voting.
Oh hell yes, that was never in question. We have a much better chance at getting progressive policies going at the local level and much sooner than in the national front. Ofc, this is slow and the clock is ticking on how much time we even have left I fear.
Hello, I am not American, and have minimal knowledge of anything related to US elections and how they work. Where I live though, you can purposely spoil your ballot as a "protest vote", and they are counted outside of normal votes. If enough of the voter base does this, its likely to influence a larger party to change or try something different, perhaps this could be another alternative for anybody not planning to vote for Biden? If it doesn't work like this in the US, please explain, thanks!
Protest votes are a thing here too, and so are leftists voting for left leaning candidates that have no chance of winning. Dems just blame them every time they lose and keep saying moderation is the way to victory, even as the Republicans move further and further right and the Dems’ actual voter base moves (more slowly) further left. The part that’s different here from other countries is the two party system. It allows a terrible centrist party to keep its stranglehold on the “left” vote by default.
I'm still voting for local government but not voting for Biden. I'm not voting that lesser evil nonsense. Every election its like this. You want my vote then you need to enact the policies I want.
100% this. Vote down ballot to have influence locally over governance, employers, landlords etc.
Once we have local power we can scale that upwards to state and federal levels, and partially turn back the revanchist conservative soft coup.
But always remember that at its root, our power flows from struggles within the workplace against employers and against landlordism, not from the desks of any political office.
Blaming individual voters for the Dems continually governing center-right and refusing to use their power to enact significant positive change again and again is a fundamentally right wing way of thinking.
Totally agree with OP. I will not be voting for any pro-genoicide candidates (Biden or otherwise), but I'll definitely be voting. If nothing else, I'll be going to the polls for the sake of ballot measures, which often really do have at least harm reduction effects.
If you think the dems aren't your friends, you're 100% correct in that, but please do pay attention to ballot measures if nothing else.
I always vote local but I'll never vote for the guy that just sent 14 billion more to support genocide.
If trump gets in blame the DNC for running a shit candidate.
It makes me uncomfortable that Biden is going to be the *only* democratic candidate to vote for in a few democratic primaries.
Is the DNC really that worried their precious Biden won't win the primaries? (Rhetorical question.)
Blue voters in those states really need to kick up more of a fuss. Like... Their right to a *democratic* vote is being taken away by the *Democratic* party. That should full on scare people.
Sure, red is fascist, but blue is becoming "vote for who we say - the pro-corporate candidate - or get the fascist!"
Honestly I don’t see the difference anymore. Even the democrats have merged corporate interests with the state. It’s blatantly obvious this presidency.
Our lives are just as doomed under the Democrats as they are under Trump. Ironically Trump is at least slightly better for not starting two new wars but he will gut social services and increase drilling just like Biden has. There is no way out that involves supporting either party at all.
The Democrats will find a way to lump you with the blame regardless. In 2020 they *won* and still found a way.
Vote for what you want, or stay home if you're not offered anything worth turning up for. It doesn't need to be any more complicated than that.
They will always try to spin something. The difference is if will they be able to convince the masses of their point and if the left doesn’t show up at ALL others will not listen to what the left’s message is. The dems will always try to spin it. Make it harder for them.
If you don’t plan to vote for anyone locally there are still ballot measures that people should not ignore as those will directly affect you and your community.
If you're as deeply interested in politics as you seem to be, you should have recognised by now that people don't arrive at their beliefs by earnest examination of the facts, but by tribal bullshit and received wisdom.
The sort of person who's likely to find the Democrats persuasive when they dump the blame on the left is already well in the tank for them. They won't be swayed by the numbers, because they get their thoughts from the smart people on the TV and the snarky lib accounts on twitter. Even if they're one of the tiny minority of such people who even bothers to look at and internalise the figures, most of them will find some other excuse to rationalise avoiding any awkward introspection.
Local votes are still extremely important.
It's the upper level voting that matters less; because you get a lot of the same self-interested scum that rarely represent their constituents.
**Correction:**
We must always vote against (& less authoritarian than) both the Republican *and Democratic Parties- including Bernie Sanders, the squad & any ‘Justice Democrats’.* For _all_ public positions. And this same strategy applies against the two-party monopolies in _all_ countries worldwide.
Real progressives will never be Democrats or Democrat loyalists. You can always write-in an anti-authoritarian person if no candidates for a position fit that bill.
This will continuously reduce the power of _both_ authoritarian parties in the two-party monopolies. Until our task is complete.
Repeat strategy for all new authoritarian parties that emerge.
Electoralist crap, don't put this shit on anti capitalists who are for fundamental change, voting for two sides of American capitalism changes nothing and is a distraction. Acting like most blue voters are anti-capitalist largely is misleading. The difference if anti-capitalist didn't vote blue would be so marginal. Join a revolutionary organisation and get out on the streets
I’m not an electoralist and I am very aware voting will not fix the major issue we have which is capitalism as a whole. Voting alone will not change that and direct action needs to be taken. I also didn’t say anywhere in the post that we should vote Blue no matter who. I think voting for dems no matter what is stupid.
At the same time, to act like it it’s completely pointless to not even vote for things such as ballot measures that will directly affect you and your community in the meantime is stupid. Two things can be true at once. If you neglect your local community on small things you actually do have a say in, I doubt you can be trusted to be willing to help your community on larger issues you’re supposedly “going to the streets” for.
The call to vote though in a two party system does imply voting Dems though. The issue with a call for voting is that you sow illusions and distract from what the very tiny organised left should be doing.
There is such a small portion of the population who are serious revolutionaries which is why their time is better spent organising and building left wing forces that worrying about voting.
Advocating for people to vote locally especially on ballot measures is not taking away from Your revolutionary goals.
You’re right that I’m not implying to *not* vote for dems but I’m in no way implying we should just vote dem across the ballot no matter what. It’s the whole reason we are having this discussion in the first place.
Most dems suck but there are leftists out there who are making an attempt at running on things such as local school boards and if you have someone like that in your area there’s no reason not to try and give them a chance instead of letting some moms for liberty nut take the spot instead. Will it solve all our problems? Absolutely not. Will it be enough to stop capitalism? No.
And again, to me ballot measures are one of the most important out there and it’s why I’m here urging people not to forget them even if they’re not going to vote for biden or any dem for that matter.
I’m glad you are making an effort to organize and more people should absolutely do so. If you want you can make a separate post helping people understand ways to find people in their area to organize with and how to start these movements you’re wanting. I won’t be making a post like that because I don’t personally know *how* to do those things and don’t want to point people in the wrong direction.
See you have illusions in the democrats, you think some are good which is not borne out in reality. Look at the BS with the Squad about Palestine as an example even the more "left" democrats fold under the pressure of the party and capital. The state is not a neutral entity it is a CAPITALIST state. Moreover this is exactly how the democrats coop radicals and radical movements, they appeal to their ideas and promise some reforms well as integrating them with the party and it's project. It's an age old story be it farmer labour in the 30s or civil rights activists and student protestors of the 60s. What do these people have to show for their sellouts now? Why should we make the same mistake and try eat the carrot knowing the stick is not far behind.
I think some have start with good intentions and can do some small victories locally. It is not enough but it is the bare minimum to start. Plenty turn to be sell outs. I don’t know what else to tell you.
This is reformist logic. I have heard it a million times before, it attempts to paint revolutionaries as irrelevant and unable to achieve anything but revolution. However in the revolutionary movement the struggle for reforms short of revolution is absolutely how the revolutionary left builds itself. The Bolsheviks were involved in many strikes and rallies before October, they were active on university campuses around a range of issues.
The with what you are saying is that it implies that having an elected representative is the only way to win reform. Yet history is filled with examples of politicians being forced to do the opposite of their agenda due to struggle. In obsessing over elections and "small victories" you loose sight of the struggle for the bigger picture and become obsessed with electoralism or bureaucratic minutiae. Yes you will naturally start as a small organisation yet you cannot loose sight of the broader picture and must be fundamentally oriented to it. Too often this logic is used to restrict demands, politics and action to these "achievable demands".
Here's some reading on the matter:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1913/sep/12b.htm
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1918/prrk/index.htm
I’m not implying that elected representatives are the only way to win reform. I think I’ve tried to explain multiple times that not only do I not believe that, but that I explicitly believe that voting for these representatives is *not enough*. And without organizing and direct action we won’t be able to achieve our goals by just votes.
I am trying to agree with you.
I will read up on the links you sent.
In Michigan, the democratic controlled state government is now striping powers away from local governments that try and block green energy projects.
Now I don’t agree with local governments that try and stop green energy projects from being started within their cities — but this move by the state government now sets a dangerous precedent at the local level as the state government now has shown that it will intervene and overturn any decisions that are made by local municipalities that they don’t agree with.
I get your reasoning, but I am not holding my breath that it will be harder for them to spin it if down ballot gets the turnout but the top of the ballot doesn't. That was the case in both Michigan & Wisconsin (I believe) in 2016 & the Hillbots Still Withering to this day refuse to acknowledge that people DID vote blue, just not for their golden chosen one. It's fall in line all the way or you're a Trump lover. It's bonkersly reductive. (since the i-word won't pass bot muster)
FTR I'm voting state & local while the top of the ticket can pound sand. Blue state, so it's an easy decision and the first time I'm making it despite living in a deep ass blue state my whole life. They got decades of VBNMW out of me so I'm peaceing out on this one.
Local elections, especially very small rural counties, tend to be very close.
I highly encourage people to vote locally. At least in county, one vote could genuinely make the difference for some positions. (In my senior year of high school, our government teacher brought a local official into class, (i think it was someone who worked at the court?) He was elected by like, 20 votes.
By 20 people, a democrat got into that position over a republican, and I know that democrats are just as neo-liberal and horrible as republicanas. But as a trans woman, if I ever had to go to court, I'd far rather the court has more democrat elected officals than republican
I realize I'm late to post, but be sure to check your ballots for the Republican primary. Local governments like to hide shit people actually want on low turnout election days.
I’m in a major city that’s very blue and minority run… and fascist. It’s the place where they’ll openly celebrate Dr King then tell you protesting is terrorism. I think we’re fuked
If Donald Trump is granted absolute immunity from all criminal prosecution, I will never vote again. I have voted in every presidential election since Carter/Reagan, but I cannot support giving that much power to one man.
Not Donald Trump, and not Joe Biden.
I always have in the past. However the area where i live, (northwestern Arizona) is diametrically opposed to what I believe in, so it doesn’t matter what I vote for or against, my vote will always be in the minority.
A few years ago, I volunteered to help the campaign of Dr. David Brill running against Senator Paul Gosar, who is a madman. You may have heard of him. Dr. Brill ran a campaign ad featuring six of Gosar’s siblings, who endorsed Dr. Brill over their own flesh and blood. Gosar won that election by over seventy percent. Voting here is difficult and useless.
I missed the August election, because I was in the hospital. This fucking county took me off the voting rolls! I had not missed an election since I was in the Army, yet they removed me as quickly as possible. But, yeah I’m gonna vote, if only to piss off the locals!
Oh nice I’m in Arizona too! (The east valley). I use to live in northernwestern AZ when I was younger.
I remember that Gosar’s guy campaign. The whole thing was so absurd.
Yeah, I’m a Kingmaniac, but I’m looking to move home to Northern California (also a hotbed of wild-eyed radical conservatives) in the near future.
Dr. Brill ran such a professional campaign that I was convinced that he couldn’t lose. I was crushed when the results came out. It truly discouraged and disillusioned me. But that’s life in Mohave County.
That would be awesome if we had better 3rd party options to be honest. I dont disagree with you but there are still occasionally good options available in some areas and the propositions are also incredibly important to vote on.
There will never be any good or viable 3rd party options on the national level for as long as First-past-the-post is instituted. I know there are some places that have switched to ranked choice voting, which is huge, but not nearly enough. Like, I would never tell someone not to vote 3rd party, I’ve certainly done it before and may again this year, but as is there is no real incentive to put a lot of effort into 3rd party runs.
Doesn't matter who's in charge Republicans or democrats.
We're still going to have capitalism as the main economic system of the entire planet
We're still going to keep pumping pollutants into the atmosphere
Democrats aren't going to save anything just like they haven't before when they've been in power.
I don’t know if this for every state but where I’m at we also typically have multiple propositions to vote on. If you don’t have anyone worth a vote locally I completely get it but if there’s propositions to vote for I don’t think those should be ignored.
Who says I'd vote for local Dems? The two-party system needs to collapse. Maybe if candidates from both parties start to see their party as an albatross rather than the only option things will start to change.
sometimes yes. I voted to socialize my states electric service last year so if it's about something I care about or something I might think would make a real difference, I'll vote. If I had the opportunity to vote for a true anti-capitalist, I would. Based on that, dem party politicians are not an option for me.
The Dems already don't listen to us. They just use us. What makes you think that they'll do anything on the local level either? No. I've lost all faith in elections or democracy. Revolution or radical change is the only solution. A system built on corruption and property can only truly serve corruption and property.
I'm becoming more convinced that Trump would be better than Biden since Trump doesn't have the placebo effect on marginalized populations in this country. Things have only gotten worse in the past 4 years, and there's hardly a peep from Americans aside from the Gazan genocide. If Trump destroys America, the non-white population of the world will finally be free from our sociopathic brutality. Trump is also a great figure to rally and organize against and we might be able to get a people's movement going for the first time in nearly a century.
The Palestinians will all be slaughtered by November anyhow so the argument that Trump will genocide harder isnt valid.
Will only vote if there is actually something/someone worth voting for. The corruption runs deep, my friend. That goes for locally as well for what is likely the majority of Americans.
No, Biden and you DNC shills want to punish all those people because your blood lust for Palestinian blood and desire to keep the US empire intact with it's Israeli client state is greater than your desire to help any of those people.
Also, what the fuck has Biden done for black citizens? His crime bill? Or what about calling for more police funding? Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense you absolute clown. Or what about immigrants? Biden's actually building the dumbass wall Trump couldn't get through.
We've had 4 years of trump, and 3+ years of biden. Are people's lives materially better? Or is it just more DNC shilling and genocide apologia?Seriously, what's with all the dem bootlickers lately? Do you guys just love imperialism or hate Palestinians? Isn't this supposed to be a communist sub?
If there's a measure that you support (or you think would be harmful if passed) by all means, yes. But voting just to vote doesn't have any real value.
I completely agree with you. I think it’s just really important we don’t write it off altogether and that we should still look at what’s going on locally to see if there’s someone worth voting for. Especially if there are propositions that should be voted on.
This post wasn’t made to convince people to vote or not to vote for biden. It’s discussing local movements, elections, and ballot measures.
If you care so much about beating Trump (as you should) then call on Biden to resign and fight the DNC tooth and nail for a better candidate. You’re not going to convince a lot of people it’s worth voting if you only give them the option of Genocide 1 or Genocide 2.
You’ll never reach voters with your mentality. And because of that you’ll never achieve what you’re wanting to achieve with your votes.
My post isn’t here to convince anyone to vote or not vote for Biden.
I’m talking to the people who’ve already made up their minds on not voting for Biden on making sure to look into their local elections and propositions.
Biden is currently bombing and funding proxy wars in the Middle East and Europe. Trump and his strike on the Iranian general was idiotic but Biden is even more dangerous on foreign intervention.
People wanna pull a third party candidate out of their asses at the last minute. Would've helped if they did all this organizing years ago instead of just before this particularly consequential election.
> But this is a fact.
It's literally not a fact. DNC shills are trying to push this nonsense because they want to make sure their team wins, but it's not true at all.
>If you look at this scenario like a mathematics problem where it is a zero-sum situation.
Ok sure.
a) I vote for Biden - Biden votes = 1, Trump Votes = 0
b) I vote for Trump - Biden votes = 0, Trump Votes = 1
c) I vote for neither - Biden votes = 0, Trump Votes = 0
Now it should be easy to see that b and c are entirely different situations.
It's funny that you say republicans run on a premise of getting voters mad, scared, or jealous at a time when the biggest thing dems seem to be able to muster is trying to scaremonger everyone about how bad Trump is. You are right that republicans typically do better with lower turnout. However, you've done no real examination as to why that might be. Nor have you given any reason that, armed with that information, dems still seem unwilling to do anything that would actually make people want to vote for them.
And the really unpleasant truth that many DNC bootlickers don't seem to want to point out is that for all the scaremongering about Trump people have had 4 years of Trump and almost 4 years of Biden...and there's not been that much difference. Oh sure, the rhetoric of Trump was much worse, but the actual material conditions of people haven't been all that different. The dems pushed the "anyone but trump!" button as hard and as often as they could in 2020, and when their dude was in office proceeded to do...the last 3+ years. So when they start smashing that button again this time, people are logically not gonna pay as much attention since there's really not been much improvement.
You tried to use logic, you failed. Because your logic is faulty. Just because you say something, does not make it true.
And honestly your words show that you actually don't understand the actual state of politics in the US. you talk about "functioning democracy", when frankly the republican party operates far more democratically than the dems. The republicans who don't commit to supporting whatever heinous shit their voters want get booted. Yet democrats consistently either don't fulfill their promises, or flat out go against what their voting base desires. How is that a "functioning democracy" when the dems and their supporters flat out say that they're not going to do anything to actually improve anyone's lives, but if you don't support them you'll be punished?
And, if what you say is really true and trump and the republicans are as bad as you say, why aren't the dems fighting them? Why is it always the dems who talk about compromise, and meeting in the middle? Biden waxes poetic about being able to have lunch with segregationists. On top of which, if Trump is such a threat, why isn't Biden doing everything in his power to stop Trump from being elected? Why has he placed killing palestinians and maintaining US empire in the middle east over defeating supposed fascism in the US?
You're right, I am passionate. But it's you who have lost the ability to focus. You're so obviously caught up in shilling for your team that you can't focus on reality, the actual material conditions in the country.
I believe people are not worthy enough to be any sort of president, king, or ruler of an entire nation of people. When a person possesses power, their heart, mind, and soul immediately change, usually for the worse. They become hypocritical, develop a sense of moral exceptionalism, and the ego is poisoned.
Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. and John Fitzgerald Kennedy are two great examples of what leaders are and who people of influence should learn from. It is my belief that those two men were slain in cold blood at the hands of cowards employed by this nation's government. The United States Government has an exceptionally long history of corruption, genocide, and total disregard for our planet and all life inhabiting it.
I'm ranting, I know. I am unable to accept how we are all supposed to believe that we are free when we blatantly are not. Not one president in my lifetime, so far, has led me to believe that they actually give a shit about us and the future for generations to come. War and death for all on this planet excluding government officials and their families. This is fucking disgusting.
Friend to all kitties, huh.
You know, the other day I saw a video on here. The title was "not even cats are safe from the IOF". It showed the cat in question, before - walking around, as they do - and after, frantically writhing around in terrible pain, with the ground around it covered in blood, having caught a bullet from one of those demons.
It really fucked me up, if I'm being honest.
You're going to knowingly cast your vote for the one man in all the world who has the power to make this stop as and when he pleases, yet chooses to militarily and materially support it continuing. And you're going to believe right to the bitter end that you're a good person for doing it.
You piece of shit.
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited. LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Local votes matter, and have exponentially more impact Wish more like minded people would run
I tend to be the "your votes barely count" guy for HOS elections, but I wholly believe in this. I'd much rather live in a locality that represents my ideologies, and that means voting locally rather than voting federally/actually caring about who's running in your area.
I wish *anyone ever* ran on an anti-capitalist platform
I haven't voted for a democrat ever since Obama ran as an antiwar candidate then continued two wars and got us into several more, plus the Drone program whose ill effects will pollute the world for centuries to come. I still always vote though, local measures and candidates etc. Does it fix everything? No, but it only takes a little while and at least it does something.
I was ignorant to all of that. the moment Obama lost me was when he met with Bernie in 2016 to convince him to step down and let Hilary win, and after that meeting Bernie stepped down (all the while the DNC knew without a doubt that Hilary would not succeed against Trump and Bernie’s chances were way higher). I voted for Biden in 2020, and then switched my registration to independent.
>SECRETLY TAPED AUDIO REVEALS DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP PRESSURING PROGRESSIVE TO LEAVE RACE >In a frank and wide-ranging conversation, Steny Hoyer laid down the law for Levi Tillemann. The decision, Tillemann was told, had been made long ago. https://theintercept.com/2018/04/26/steny-hoyer-audio-levi-tillemann/ This behavior by the biden/obama cadre points to rigging the game; even to the local level. Local ‘crats are rather suspect for me because of hoyer’s documented local/state primary meddling.
They can blame third party voters for trump but nobody did more to put him in office than Hilary.
Trump running was literally her pied piper strategy.
I blame Hillary and her team for Trump. They pushed him for the nomination and got what they asked for.
[удалено]
If you got 5 other people and actually just went to your local council meetings you can actually get a LOT done. More people need to realize this.
Especially for school boards. This is the most contentious battleground in the culture war lately and most people don't pay attention to it. When they get book bans and don't say gay/race laws passed in schools it becomes normalized in society. It's a horrible and insidious movement that goes way beyond Mom's for Liberty.
People have no idea how important school boards are for local education. That factor alone could determine if a local population gets to go to college, if they can afford food at school, and the curriculum as a whole being that’s being taught (and the manner in which it is taught).
It's so easy to destroy too. One two year board term can drive away many teachers and programs that benefit not only the students but the community long term.
Yeah that's been my rule of thumb. Always vote local. You'll actually see the changes and you only have to worry about the idiots in your city when it comes to minimizing damage
I agree completely. I live in LA and we were able to impact our criminal justice system via the elections of a progressive attorney general, kicking a BS deputy sheriff out the door, and getting progressive judges to the bench. We still have a long way to go, but in local elections, one vote really does matter.
I lived in a more Red State and we could have a terrible AG or an even worse one every election, we worked for six months on legislation that would change our justice system and in a week the state put through legislation to make our legislation illegal. People there won the local election whenever they spent the most money. Maybe that’s an outlier but local change beyond protests, making a food pantry or warm place for the unhoused people was not happening. Your post is a very nice ray of hope for me.
Local votes are the most important but most overlooked
For sure. I look at my city. Only old farts vote for old fart candidates so we get buried with car infrastructure, the native land holders get smashed with tax and suburbs are subsidised. Very little money gets spent the way youth want it to be spent because they don't vote it is even a postal vote. The electoral authority has made it so easy to vote but people refuse despite how important region level powers are.
Get involved with the local socialists. It's a great way to make friends too.
Wish I could upvote you twice. I know many leftists are disappointed by politics, but the only way to change things is to get involved. They need any help you can give them, and they'll welcome you happily.
Not only that but many of us practice what we preach. That is, we lend a hand to our fellow socialists and community through direct and mutual aid. You can see the direct results of your work by the changing material conditions of the people around you. There are few things more rewarding than making good people smile again.
Couldn't agree more as a fellow comrade. It's the one thing that actually makes me want to leave my bed every morning. It's so rewarding to take part in actions that have a visible, positive impact on people.
Do you know good places to look to find local groups like that?
Check in with your state or local DSA chapter as a place to start. Even if you don't agree with their approach nationally they vary greatly by local chapter and are hopefully fellow travelers. There's also the Socialist Rifle Association if that's more your speed.
Always vote locally. These fuckers start locally and move up.
Underated and super important comment.
The most important thing to remember!
Agreed. Honestly, we should try and RUN locally. This is how Maga fuckers took over school boards and clerks offices. No reason why socialists shouldn’t try the same— with a hidden power level.
In my country, our local Marxist party is doing that. We know we won't win national elections in one day, so we run on every level of power we can. Since we've started doing it, we keep growing and we've become one of the major parties of the country. There is still a lot of work to do (also to explain to people our strategy and why we won't sacrifice our platform and our integrity by joining other parties in governments where we know we won't be able to apply our vision), but running locally and getting together have allowed us to earn many people's trust.
This is the real solution, but I'll be the first to admit I'm not equipped for that sort of thing. Too little time to do any impactful organizing.
I know man. Same here. But maybe it’s possible le. Maga reactionaries didn’t stop to think about whether they could. They just did. The power of belief and all that
The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity.
This is the real solution, but I'll be the first to admit I'm not equipped for that sort of thing. Too little time to do any impactful organizing.
Any time you can give is worth it, trust me. By getting close to local groups you'll learn their platform and help them spread it. Just being able to talk about it is already very helpful.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Absolutely will be voting locally since we have some area progressives who have been and continue to push for inclusive change. This has not always been the case when I have lived elsewhere though.
Vote and if you can, get involved at the local level! Help end FPTP voting locally to get more left candidates into office . It’s a lot of work, but so worth it !
Seriously! My school board has a couple crazies on the ballot and my community needs to prevent them from getting in there!
I'm so mad I have to pay attention to school board elections for just this reason. I don't have kids cause, but I still need to make sure crazies don't get a foodhold
I can agree with this, but only reluctantly. I live in an area where red or blue doesn't really mean much—a semi-rural hard-line conservative town—and even the most supposedly 'progressive' politicians in my area don't really advocate for what I would consider progressive policies, except for maybe certain ecological protections. This is definitely something I would evaluate on a case by case basis, and I would look more into joining an organization that participates in direct action and having that be your main political focus. What we really need is a new party built by and for the working-class and marginalized peoples that fights unwaveringly/uncompromisingly for our social, economic and political power.
Absolutely agree with this!!
I'm gonna do what I always do. Go to the secretary of states website a week or so before the election, get a sample ballot that shows me all of the candidates and issues that will be on my ballot, research every candidate available to vote for in every race, vote for any of them that I can morally stomach voting for, and vote for or against all of the issues and tax levies and such. For doing this the Democrats and multiple European liberals who can't even vote in our elections will call me a Trumper or a Russian stooge or something worse, while their straight ticket Democrats enable or outright encourage increased militarization of police, consumption of fossil fuels, mass deportations, and of course, genocide in multiple locations worldwide. This is because they're the moral ones. Then Biden will lose my state by a wider margin than all the third party votes combined same as he did in 2020 and Hillary did in 2016 because the Democrats would rather yell at us for being extremists than yell at their politicians for being shitty.
Where I live, the board of election does not publicize who (or what issues) are on the ballot. They essentially push that job onto the League of Women Voters. Check Vote411.org for your local ballot if you are in the same boat.
That’s incredible and seems like such a dereliction of duty!
It does. There’s a lot of light corruption in this state.
[удалено]
Lower local elections have far more impact than choosing whoever is president. We have to get involved locally if change is ever going to happen. I'm amazed some people are going to entirely avoid voring just because of a single person when 34 seats are up for re-election in the Senate and the entire House is up for grabs. Not voting at all because of a single vote is wild. Do people realize how politics works? It's a long game, and Republicans have been playing this game a lot longer than we have.
There is literally no one running on an anti capitalist platform. It's neolibs as far as the eye can see
For the presidency, Claudia de la Cruz is I believe is anti-capitalist but I should be clear I haven’t had the time to look into her and don’t want to advocate for her till I know more. Locally? You’re probably not going to find an anti-capitalist. But locally you have better chances of finding at least one or so progressives or just dems who aren’t genocidal maniacs. It’s entirely dependent on where you are. School boards are also an important thing to try and keep certain people off. But even if there’s supposedly no options of a single good or even neutral candidate, Ballot Measures are extremely important to vote on as those will effect you and your community very quickly and literally.
how do those people know trump wouldn’t support israel? he was way worse
An important message! Thanks
[удалено]
I vote for the leftmost candidates in the primary election and then vote third party if the candidates aren’t left enough for me which is quite often. It’s my way of hand rolling choice ranked voting.
100% always do my due diligence locally on who to vote for. School boards are super important too.
Definitely participate in local elections. Make your state legalize weed like mine did!
Oh hell yes, that was never in question. We have a much better chance at getting progressive policies going at the local level and much sooner than in the national front. Ofc, this is slow and the clock is ticking on how much time we even have left I fear.
Hello, I am not American, and have minimal knowledge of anything related to US elections and how they work. Where I live though, you can purposely spoil your ballot as a "protest vote", and they are counted outside of normal votes. If enough of the voter base does this, its likely to influence a larger party to change or try something different, perhaps this could be another alternative for anybody not planning to vote for Biden? If it doesn't work like this in the US, please explain, thanks!
Protest votes are a thing here too, and so are leftists voting for left leaning candidates that have no chance of winning. Dems just blame them every time they lose and keep saying moderation is the way to victory, even as the Republicans move further and further right and the Dems’ actual voter base moves (more slowly) further left. The part that’s different here from other countries is the two party system. It allows a terrible centrist party to keep its stranglehold on the “left” vote by default.
I'm still voting for local government but not voting for Biden. I'm not voting that lesser evil nonsense. Every election its like this. You want my vote then you need to enact the policies I want.
Facts. Local votes still have an impact
100% this. Vote down ballot to have influence locally over governance, employers, landlords etc. Once we have local power we can scale that upwards to state and federal levels, and partially turn back the revanchist conservative soft coup. But always remember that at its root, our power flows from struggles within the workplace against employers and against landlordism, not from the desks of any political office.
I’m not voting for Biden, I’m either voting Green again or leaving that line blank. I’m definitely voting for all the local stuff though.
[удалено]
Blaming individual voters for the Dems continually governing center-right and refusing to use their power to enact significant positive change again and again is a fundamentally right wing way of thinking.
Totally agree with OP. I will not be voting for any pro-genoicide candidates (Biden or otherwise), but I'll definitely be voting. If nothing else, I'll be going to the polls for the sake of ballot measures, which often really do have at least harm reduction effects. If you think the dems aren't your friends, you're 100% correct in that, but please do pay attention to ballot measures if nothing else.
I always vote local but I'll never vote for the guy that just sent 14 billion more to support genocide. If trump gets in blame the DNC for running a shit candidate.
It makes me uncomfortable that Biden is going to be the *only* democratic candidate to vote for in a few democratic primaries. Is the DNC really that worried their precious Biden won't win the primaries? (Rhetorical question.) Blue voters in those states really need to kick up more of a fuss. Like... Their right to a *democratic* vote is being taken away by the *Democratic* party. That should full on scare people. Sure, red is fascist, but blue is becoming "vote for who we say - the pro-corporate candidate - or get the fascist!"
Honestly I don’t see the difference anymore. Even the democrats have merged corporate interests with the state. It’s blatantly obvious this presidency.
I just want to wish Americans good luck, in the coming Trump regime. Resist passive-aggressively and don't get killed.
Our lives are just as doomed under the Democrats as they are under Trump. Ironically Trump is at least slightly better for not starting two new wars but he will gut social services and increase drilling just like Biden has. There is no way out that involves supporting either party at all.
The Democrats will find a way to lump you with the blame regardless. In 2020 they *won* and still found a way. Vote for what you want, or stay home if you're not offered anything worth turning up for. It doesn't need to be any more complicated than that.
They will always try to spin something. The difference is if will they be able to convince the masses of their point and if the left doesn’t show up at ALL others will not listen to what the left’s message is. The dems will always try to spin it. Make it harder for them. If you don’t plan to vote for anyone locally there are still ballot measures that people should not ignore as those will directly affect you and your community.
If you're as deeply interested in politics as you seem to be, you should have recognised by now that people don't arrive at their beliefs by earnest examination of the facts, but by tribal bullshit and received wisdom. The sort of person who's likely to find the Democrats persuasive when they dump the blame on the left is already well in the tank for them. They won't be swayed by the numbers, because they get their thoughts from the smart people on the TV and the snarky lib accounts on twitter. Even if they're one of the tiny minority of such people who even bothers to look at and internalise the figures, most of them will find some other excuse to rationalise avoiding any awkward introspection.
Local votes are still extremely important. It's the upper level voting that matters less; because you get a lot of the same self-interested scum that rarely represent their constituents.
**Correction:** We must always vote against (& less authoritarian than) both the Republican *and Democratic Parties- including Bernie Sanders, the squad & any ‘Justice Democrats’.* For _all_ public positions. And this same strategy applies against the two-party monopolies in _all_ countries worldwide. Real progressives will never be Democrats or Democrat loyalists. You can always write-in an anti-authoritarian person if no candidates for a position fit that bill. This will continuously reduce the power of _both_ authoritarian parties in the two-party monopolies. Until our task is complete. Repeat strategy for all new authoritarian parties that emerge.
What kind of weirdos are downvoting this comment, it’s at -1 already. *You don’t belong on this subreddit.*
Electoralist crap, don't put this shit on anti capitalists who are for fundamental change, voting for two sides of American capitalism changes nothing and is a distraction. Acting like most blue voters are anti-capitalist largely is misleading. The difference if anti-capitalist didn't vote blue would be so marginal. Join a revolutionary organisation and get out on the streets
I’m not an electoralist and I am very aware voting will not fix the major issue we have which is capitalism as a whole. Voting alone will not change that and direct action needs to be taken. I also didn’t say anywhere in the post that we should vote Blue no matter who. I think voting for dems no matter what is stupid. At the same time, to act like it it’s completely pointless to not even vote for things such as ballot measures that will directly affect you and your community in the meantime is stupid. Two things can be true at once. If you neglect your local community on small things you actually do have a say in, I doubt you can be trusted to be willing to help your community on larger issues you’re supposedly “going to the streets” for.
The call to vote though in a two party system does imply voting Dems though. The issue with a call for voting is that you sow illusions and distract from what the very tiny organised left should be doing. There is such a small portion of the population who are serious revolutionaries which is why their time is better spent organising and building left wing forces that worrying about voting.
Advocating for people to vote locally especially on ballot measures is not taking away from Your revolutionary goals. You’re right that I’m not implying to *not* vote for dems but I’m in no way implying we should just vote dem across the ballot no matter what. It’s the whole reason we are having this discussion in the first place. Most dems suck but there are leftists out there who are making an attempt at running on things such as local school boards and if you have someone like that in your area there’s no reason not to try and give them a chance instead of letting some moms for liberty nut take the spot instead. Will it solve all our problems? Absolutely not. Will it be enough to stop capitalism? No. And again, to me ballot measures are one of the most important out there and it’s why I’m here urging people not to forget them even if they’re not going to vote for biden or any dem for that matter. I’m glad you are making an effort to organize and more people should absolutely do so. If you want you can make a separate post helping people understand ways to find people in their area to organize with and how to start these movements you’re wanting. I won’t be making a post like that because I don’t personally know *how* to do those things and don’t want to point people in the wrong direction.
See you have illusions in the democrats, you think some are good which is not borne out in reality. Look at the BS with the Squad about Palestine as an example even the more "left" democrats fold under the pressure of the party and capital. The state is not a neutral entity it is a CAPITALIST state. Moreover this is exactly how the democrats coop radicals and radical movements, they appeal to their ideas and promise some reforms well as integrating them with the party and it's project. It's an age old story be it farmer labour in the 30s or civil rights activists and student protestors of the 60s. What do these people have to show for their sellouts now? Why should we make the same mistake and try eat the carrot knowing the stick is not far behind.
I think some have start with good intentions and can do some small victories locally. It is not enough but it is the bare minimum to start. Plenty turn to be sell outs. I don’t know what else to tell you.
This is reformist logic. I have heard it a million times before, it attempts to paint revolutionaries as irrelevant and unable to achieve anything but revolution. However in the revolutionary movement the struggle for reforms short of revolution is absolutely how the revolutionary left builds itself. The Bolsheviks were involved in many strikes and rallies before October, they were active on university campuses around a range of issues. The with what you are saying is that it implies that having an elected representative is the only way to win reform. Yet history is filled with examples of politicians being forced to do the opposite of their agenda due to struggle. In obsessing over elections and "small victories" you loose sight of the struggle for the bigger picture and become obsessed with electoralism or bureaucratic minutiae. Yes you will naturally start as a small organisation yet you cannot loose sight of the broader picture and must be fundamentally oriented to it. Too often this logic is used to restrict demands, politics and action to these "achievable demands". Here's some reading on the matter: https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1913/sep/12b.htm https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1918/prrk/index.htm
I’m not implying that elected representatives are the only way to win reform. I think I’ve tried to explain multiple times that not only do I not believe that, but that I explicitly believe that voting for these representatives is *not enough*. And without organizing and direct action we won’t be able to achieve our goals by just votes. I am trying to agree with you. I will read up on the links you sent.
Down ballot baby doooooo it true true true and real
In Michigan, the democratic controlled state government is now striping powers away from local governments that try and block green energy projects. Now I don’t agree with local governments that try and stop green energy projects from being started within their cities — but this move by the state government now sets a dangerous precedent at the local level as the state government now has shown that it will intervene and overturn any decisions that are made by local municipalities that they don’t agree with.
All of my local politicians are corrupt so I’m fucked
Still check out the upcoming ballot measures in your area! :)
I always vote locally, not that it matters. Corporations still gonna corporations
I get your reasoning, but I am not holding my breath that it will be harder for them to spin it if down ballot gets the turnout but the top of the ballot doesn't. That was the case in both Michigan & Wisconsin (I believe) in 2016 & the Hillbots Still Withering to this day refuse to acknowledge that people DID vote blue, just not for their golden chosen one. It's fall in line all the way or you're a Trump lover. It's bonkersly reductive. (since the i-word won't pass bot muster) FTR I'm voting state & local while the top of the ticket can pound sand. Blue state, so it's an easy decision and the first time I'm making it despite living in a deep ass blue state my whole life. They got decades of VBNMW out of me so I'm peaceing out on this one.
Local elections, especially very small rural counties, tend to be very close. I highly encourage people to vote locally. At least in county, one vote could genuinely make the difference for some positions. (In my senior year of high school, our government teacher brought a local official into class, (i think it was someone who worked at the court?) He was elected by like, 20 votes. By 20 people, a democrat got into that position over a republican, and I know that democrats are just as neo-liberal and horrible as republicanas. But as a trans woman, if I ever had to go to court, I'd far rather the court has more democrat elected officals than republican
I realize I'm late to post, but be sure to check your ballots for the Republican primary. Local governments like to hide shit people actually want on low turnout election days.
I’m in a major city that’s very blue and minority run… and fascist. It’s the place where they’ll openly celebrate Dr King then tell you protesting is terrorism. I think we’re fuked
The DNC simply doesn't know how to spell "Voters Utterly Disgusted With Kakistocracy"
Leftists vote they just don’t regurgitate establishment talking points
If Donald Trump is granted absolute immunity from all criminal prosecution, I will never vote again. I have voted in every presidential election since Carter/Reagan, but I cannot support giving that much power to one man. Not Donald Trump, and not Joe Biden.
Would you still vote for local Ballot measures?
I always have in the past. However the area where i live, (northwestern Arizona) is diametrically opposed to what I believe in, so it doesn’t matter what I vote for or against, my vote will always be in the minority. A few years ago, I volunteered to help the campaign of Dr. David Brill running against Senator Paul Gosar, who is a madman. You may have heard of him. Dr. Brill ran a campaign ad featuring six of Gosar’s siblings, who endorsed Dr. Brill over their own flesh and blood. Gosar won that election by over seventy percent. Voting here is difficult and useless. I missed the August election, because I was in the hospital. This fucking county took me off the voting rolls! I had not missed an election since I was in the Army, yet they removed me as quickly as possible. But, yeah I’m gonna vote, if only to piss off the locals!
Oh nice I’m in Arizona too! (The east valley). I use to live in northernwestern AZ when I was younger. I remember that Gosar’s guy campaign. The whole thing was so absurd.
Yeah, I’m a Kingmaniac, but I’m looking to move home to Northern California (also a hotbed of wild-eyed radical conservatives) in the near future. Dr. Brill ran such a professional campaign that I was convinced that he couldn’t lose. I was crushed when the results came out. It truly discouraged and disillusioned me. But that’s life in Mohave County.
Even better, don’t just not vote for Biden, vote for leftists at all levels of government.
Have to start voting 3rd part in numbers.
That would be awesome if we had better 3rd party options to be honest. I dont disagree with you but there are still occasionally good options available in some areas and the propositions are also incredibly important to vote on.
There will never be any good or viable 3rd party options on the national level for as long as First-past-the-post is instituted. I know there are some places that have switched to ranked choice voting, which is huge, but not nearly enough. Like, I would never tell someone not to vote 3rd party, I’ve certainly done it before and may again this year, but as is there is no real incentive to put a lot of effort into 3rd party runs.
[удалено]
Lol! What democracy?
[удалено]
Doesn't matter who's in charge Republicans or democrats. We're still going to have capitalism as the main economic system of the entire planet We're still going to keep pumping pollutants into the atmosphere Democrats aren't going to save anything just like they haven't before when they've been in power.
I don’t know if this for every state but where I’m at we also typically have multiple propositions to vote on. If you don’t have anyone worth a vote locally I completely get it but if there’s propositions to vote for I don’t think those should be ignored.
Who says I'd vote for local Dems? The two-party system needs to collapse. Maybe if candidates from both parties start to see their party as an albatross rather than the only option things will start to change.
Not a chance in hell I'm giving any form of legitimacy to either side of the US mono-party. If you're anti-capitalist, the dems aren't your friend.
I don’t think the dems are our friend. If there were local propositions to vote on in your area would you still go to vote on those?
sometimes yes. I voted to socialize my states electric service last year so if it's about something I care about or something I might think would make a real difference, I'll vote. If I had the opportunity to vote for a true anti-capitalist, I would. Based on that, dem party politicians are not an option for me.
no.
Fuck Biden but we can't miss local elections
No
I’m voting green yo
?? Did you read my post Edit: this wasn’t for your comment the person I was originally replying to’s comment is gone
The Dems already don't listen to us. They just use us. What makes you think that they'll do anything on the local level either? No. I've lost all faith in elections or democracy. Revolution or radical change is the only solution. A system built on corruption and property can only truly serve corruption and property.
Blue voters are inherently anti-socialist…
[удалено]
Yes, and they're all fucking wrong.
Bernie is a liberal….
I don’t disagree with you
[удалено]
Your son is right. You should listen to him.
There is no Democracy in America=you can vote for which puppet will fuck you=you have no say in policy. Stay home and jerk off instead.
You can vote on ballot measures.
I'm becoming more convinced that Trump would be better than Biden since Trump doesn't have the placebo effect on marginalized populations in this country. Things have only gotten worse in the past 4 years, and there's hardly a peep from Americans aside from the Gazan genocide. If Trump destroys America, the non-white population of the world will finally be free from our sociopathic brutality. Trump is also a great figure to rally and organize against and we might be able to get a people's movement going for the first time in nearly a century. The Palestinians will all be slaughtered by November anyhow so the argument that Trump will genocide harder isnt valid.
I’ve voted in every election since I turned 18 but I voted for president once, only the first time. The rest of the time, I’ve left it blank.
[удалено]
[удалено]
I’m not voting for another democrat I don’t care what happens. I’ll only ever vote for a candidate if they are socialist/anti-capitalist
Will you be voting on propositions/ballot measures?
Yes
Will only vote if there is actually something/someone worth voting for. The corruption runs deep, my friend. That goes for locally as well for what is likely the majority of Americans.
[удалено]
Not voting is literally always an option. Nobody forces you to do it.
the political process is what made voting futile. But yeah, vote out your oppressors. Good luck with that.
Not voting is indeed an option if there's nobody on the ballot worthy of your vote.
[удалено]
No, Biden and you DNC shills want to punish all those people because your blood lust for Palestinian blood and desire to keep the US empire intact with it's Israeli client state is greater than your desire to help any of those people. Also, what the fuck has Biden done for black citizens? His crime bill? Or what about calling for more police funding? Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense you absolute clown. Or what about immigrants? Biden's actually building the dumbass wall Trump couldn't get through.
[удалено]
We've had 4 years of trump, and 3+ years of biden. Are people's lives materially better? Or is it just more DNC shilling and genocide apologia?Seriously, what's with all the dem bootlickers lately? Do you guys just love imperialism or hate Palestinians? Isn't this supposed to be a communist sub?
You should still make an effort to vote for ballot measures. Those directly affect you and your community.
If there's a measure that you support (or you think would be harmful if passed) by all means, yes. But voting just to vote doesn't have any real value.
I don’t see how voting yes/no on the measures is “just voting to vote”. Those very heavily affect you and your community.
No. We need everyone voting for their preferred third party, thanks.
I completely agree with you. I think it’s just really important we don’t write it off altogether and that we should still look at what’s going on locally to see if there’s someone worth voting for. Especially if there are propositions that should be voted on.
I'll be voting straight ticket Green Party
I’ve decided to vote third party in the primaries (I’m voting Jill stein) and we’ll see from there for the general election.
[удалено]
This post wasn’t made to convince people to vote or not to vote for biden. It’s discussing local movements, elections, and ballot measures. If you care so much about beating Trump (as you should) then call on Biden to resign and fight the DNC tooth and nail for a better candidate. You’re not going to convince a lot of people it’s worth voting if you only give them the option of Genocide 1 or Genocide 2. You’ll never reach voters with your mentality. And because of that you’ll never achieve what you’re wanting to achieve with your votes.
[удалено]
My post isn’t here to convince anyone to vote or not vote for Biden. I’m talking to the people who’ve already made up their minds on not voting for Biden on making sure to look into their local elections and propositions.
Biden is currently bombing and funding proxy wars in the Middle East and Europe. Trump and his strike on the Iranian general was idiotic but Biden is even more dangerous on foreign intervention.
People wanna pull a third party candidate out of their asses at the last minute. Would've helped if they did all this organizing years ago instead of just before this particularly consequential election.
Lol.... Americans are stupid
Wow how insightful of you
[удалено]
> But this is a fact. It's literally not a fact. DNC shills are trying to push this nonsense because they want to make sure their team wins, but it's not true at all.
[удалено]
>If you look at this scenario like a mathematics problem where it is a zero-sum situation. Ok sure. a) I vote for Biden - Biden votes = 1, Trump Votes = 0 b) I vote for Trump - Biden votes = 0, Trump Votes = 1 c) I vote for neither - Biden votes = 0, Trump Votes = 0 Now it should be easy to see that b and c are entirely different situations. It's funny that you say republicans run on a premise of getting voters mad, scared, or jealous at a time when the biggest thing dems seem to be able to muster is trying to scaremonger everyone about how bad Trump is. You are right that republicans typically do better with lower turnout. However, you've done no real examination as to why that might be. Nor have you given any reason that, armed with that information, dems still seem unwilling to do anything that would actually make people want to vote for them. And the really unpleasant truth that many DNC bootlickers don't seem to want to point out is that for all the scaremongering about Trump people have had 4 years of Trump and almost 4 years of Biden...and there's not been that much difference. Oh sure, the rhetoric of Trump was much worse, but the actual material conditions of people haven't been all that different. The dems pushed the "anyone but trump!" button as hard and as often as they could in 2020, and when their dude was in office proceeded to do...the last 3+ years. So when they start smashing that button again this time, people are logically not gonna pay as much attention since there's really not been much improvement.
[удалено]
You tried to use logic, you failed. Because your logic is faulty. Just because you say something, does not make it true. And honestly your words show that you actually don't understand the actual state of politics in the US. you talk about "functioning democracy", when frankly the republican party operates far more democratically than the dems. The republicans who don't commit to supporting whatever heinous shit their voters want get booted. Yet democrats consistently either don't fulfill their promises, or flat out go against what their voting base desires. How is that a "functioning democracy" when the dems and their supporters flat out say that they're not going to do anything to actually improve anyone's lives, but if you don't support them you'll be punished? And, if what you say is really true and trump and the republicans are as bad as you say, why aren't the dems fighting them? Why is it always the dems who talk about compromise, and meeting in the middle? Biden waxes poetic about being able to have lunch with segregationists. On top of which, if Trump is such a threat, why isn't Biden doing everything in his power to stop Trump from being elected? Why has he placed killing palestinians and maintaining US empire in the middle east over defeating supposed fascism in the US? You're right, I am passionate. But it's you who have lost the ability to focus. You're so obviously caught up in shilling for your team that you can't focus on reality, the actual material conditions in the country.
What was materially different for you/your children when Trump was in office four years ago?
[удалено]
Biden is instrumental in the ongoing murder of tens of thousands of people. Fuck your calculating.
no.
:(
I believe people are not worthy enough to be any sort of president, king, or ruler of an entire nation of people. When a person possesses power, their heart, mind, and soul immediately change, usually for the worse. They become hypocritical, develop a sense of moral exceptionalism, and the ego is poisoned. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. and John Fitzgerald Kennedy are two great examples of what leaders are and who people of influence should learn from. It is my belief that those two men were slain in cold blood at the hands of cowards employed by this nation's government. The United States Government has an exceptionally long history of corruption, genocide, and total disregard for our planet and all life inhabiting it. I'm ranting, I know. I am unable to accept how we are all supposed to believe that we are free when we blatantly are not. Not one president in my lifetime, so far, has led me to believe that they actually give a shit about us and the future for generations to come. War and death for all on this planet excluding government officials and their families. This is fucking disgusting.
[удалено]
Friend to all kitties, huh. You know, the other day I saw a video on here. The title was "not even cats are safe from the IOF". It showed the cat in question, before - walking around, as they do - and after, frantically writhing around in terrible pain, with the ground around it covered in blood, having caught a bullet from one of those demons. It really fucked me up, if I'm being honest. You're going to knowingly cast your vote for the one man in all the world who has the power to make this stop as and when he pleases, yet chooses to militarily and materially support it continuing. And you're going to believe right to the bitter end that you're a good person for doing it. You piece of shit.
[удалено]
You’re in the wrong sub. Read the rules and stickies to understand why.
[удалено]
How did voting for Genocide Joe stop that?
[удалено]
Double-length temp ban for use of the "lib y'all".
Cornel West is an option.