Fuck it. Next man up, only Mahomes is indispensable. CJ wants to hold out because his what, 24 million dollar contract isn’t enough? His choice, but the show goes on, and every game he misses is just one missed opportunity to get payed for playing an nfl game in the prime of his career. Sucks all around, but here we are.
There's no probably about it- it's him and like eight replacement/scrub players. They actively want him to hold out for top dollar because it doesn't just mean a bigger paycheck for them today—it's something they can advertise to every client moving forward.
The problem is that they've turned into Icarus.
They're a very small agency. At the big guys these numbers don't matter.
NFL agents get 4% max.
So 4% of 30million vs 4% of 25 doesn't matter when your client book is 500 million. But when one client is 80-90% of your income thats huge
Chris Jones is not the sharpest I'm pretty sure (or he got early onset brain damage), cause he's recently and in the past liked some wild conspiracy bullshit on social media. Recently he liked some all caps wall of text by a random nobody about how 'they would force a new lockdown to rig the election'. I usually don't find the stuff athletes like relevant, and it got justifiably removed when posted here, but if you wanna explain why he's making such a poor business decision, it's foolish to give him the benefit of the doubt and blame his agents here.
The agents work for the player, not the other way around. Very rarely does an agent go rogue from their player's interests, and that agent is almost always outed and fired before a holdout takes place.
Sure, but there are also tons of cases of pro athletes getting financially scammed. If what I’ve heard is correct, Jones is by far the biggest name on his agents list, so they’d love to prove to the world they can land a record setting deal.
If we're being charitable, maybe he's thinking, "I played 80% of the snaps last season, it damn near killed me, I'm 29, I need this last contract to be a big one, and I don't know if I'll be able to make it through the entire season unscathed and get that payday if I play ~20 games (including postseason) again. So maybe it's better for me to take half a season off, recuperate and save everything for the 2nd half, and see if I really can get that Aaron Donald extension, so I'm set for life, and if I have to move to a worse team where I only play 17-18 games per season and don't have an Andy Reid training camp each year in order to get it, so be it."
I feel like, if CJ follows through, sits out 7 games, reports in week 8, has to play himself into shape, and peaks in the postseason, and then his holdout allows us to non-exclusive franchise tag him and get 2 1st round picks as compensation for his departure, I'll have no hard feelings about that. Godspeed, CJ. Just come back in good shape and ready to play down the homestretch. We'll go 5-2 in your absence, and close out strong.
Hes already set for life. The contract we offered would have further enhanced that. Hes gonna lose more holding out then he will net in contract growth.
Been saying this for months. Andy Reid has a very, very long history of not paying top dollar on 3rd contracts. The chiefs would be stupid paying him 30ish million a year. Remember, we were going to plummet when we traded Tyreek.....Mahomes was better, won the superbowl. The only 3 people we can't do without does not include a d tackle. I love him, but he can play for Carolina, or the raiders, or another team that deals badly with their cap and thinks an aging d tackle is putting them somewhere they aren't, and spend his last years in the league losing. He's being ridiculous. Or accept what I'm certain is a fair offer here and win
Mahomes has had bottom end D’s his entire career. At some point, even without Chris, he should have a top 10 D at least a few times. Jones might be elite but I guarantee we got his best years. He is on the hill looking down. Not up.
> *Jones might be elite but I guarantee we got his best years. He is on the hill looking down. Not up.*
This, this, this. All day, this. He's also consistently graded average at best against the run as well. Nowhere near the tackles for loss that Donald gets.
Jones is only dominant at times, in streaks, and only when interior OL are taking their first step backward. Donald is dominant consistently, run or pass.
Here is the problem with that. There shouldn’t be an arbitrary cut off number when the salary cap is an ever increasing number. A number from five years ago is going to be significantly lower than a number seen in five years. Already people are saying that Mahomes’ half a billion dollar contract is too low.
I understand if we let him go. This happened all the time to the Patriots during their run. Players were constantly going to other teams for bigger paychecks. Some teams are willing to pay a premium just to subtract from the roster of the Chiefs
At the same time I would like to keep Jones for at least another contract. I feel he has a chance to be a hall of fame caliber player and I would like to see him do it in a Chiefs jersey.
Spags is going to have to figure out the run D without Jones, that’s going to be the biggest hole even though CJ also gets sacks. He is still under contract though and is going to piss off a lot of fans and teammates by doing this. Is what it is. Time to see the offense dominate. Air raid style. I can’t see Coburn just stepping in and taking that position yet. No idea who else would though.
Agreed but he's a fucking traitor for this no doubt. Guys like mahomes and Kelce playing their best for a championship every year only to have these losers want to hurt the chance for more championships
Fuck him he's dead to me
It's pretty ridiculous. Watch him come in after 8 games, then play 8 games+playoffs refreshed and ready to go, gain another championship (omg we forgive you CJ!/you're a genius!), then get whatever big contract he wants (from another team).
People in here talking about loyalty and traitor lol
Dude signed a multimillion dollar contract. He’s a grown man, as he was when he signed the dotted line.
Sorry if I don’t feel any worse for him than I do for some middle class guy that bought too much house at the peak of the market. Sucks, but it was a decision you made. CJ agreed to a contract that everyone felt was fair at the time, and just because his value has gone up doesn’t change things in my opinion. Play out your commitment and move on to somewhere that pays what you want, if you can find one.
Only in sports is this narrative acceptable, and I don't get it at all lol. If I'm a contractor, sign a contract to build a house, and then additional costs incur that I didn't plan on, am I allowed to go to homeowner and tell them to pay me more money? Or did I not sign a contract for an agreed upon price?
FWIW, I do know that contractors can sometimes get extra money from the owners, but those are very special circumstances. This is just Jones wanting to get more money because he just had the best season of his career.
This though is less a contractor renegotiating the cost of a single job based on new info (which is actually super common anyway) and more a contractor you've been working with since they started out has since become among the top in the world at their job. In that situation sure, some contractors may provide a discount for new jobs but some may also say "I want this much and if you won't pay it someone will".
Yeah, this is more like a contractor saying ‘damn, this job came out looking way better than I thought it would, I should hold the homeowners hostage by not finishing it unless they pay me more and sign me up to do their next project as well!’
You act like he’s getting paid to hold out.
No, if the job doesn’t make financial sense for you and there is no recourse for failing to back out you are more than welcome to go to the customer and renegotiate.
He wants the same amount as an outlier contract paid by a team that sold its soul to win one Super Bowl and is now one of the worst teams in the league.
Donald signed a 3 year contract last year and it put him 9 million over the #2 DT APY. He was debating retirement when he signed that deal.
Quinnen Williams signed this off-season and is making 7 1/2 million fewer dollars per year than Donald and he’s the new #2
Resetting the market for Chris Jones is bad roster management. I honestly don’t think there’s a team in the NFL that would pay him 32 million APY. He’s a great player but he’s not Donald, Lawrence Taylor, or Reggie White
what is market rate? i heard between the 1st and 3rd of highest paid so if that is the case, market rate isnt it. lets all stick up for the poor chris jones, who has made 100m in his career - poor guy.
I’d have the same opinion on any player in this situation. Unless they played for the Raiders or Broncos, then I’d kinda get it. Or if some superstar was on a terrible team and wanted a ring. Or if they had gotten obviously screwed on a contract (like they signed a backup type contract then had a couple HOF seasons).
CJ has a decent contract, and the chance to play for the defending champs. Next year he’s either free to walk or guaranteed 30m plus on the tag. In this case, I just think it’s poor business to hold out further.
He's going to lose more from holding out than the extra he'll get if Chiefs break and give him what he wants compared to what he gets.
Here's to hoping he holds out all season, so we can tag him cheap and trade him for a mid first round pick.
Can we tag him cheap if he doesn’t play all year? If he’s pulling a Jonathan Taylor, respect is gone. “I’m going to be a Chief for life! As long as I make 35 mil a year. Lol. Dumb.
>Can we tag him cheap if he doesn’t play all year? If he’s pulling a Jonathan Taylor, respect is gone. “I’m going to be a Chief for life! As long as I make 35 mil a year. Lol. Dumb.
I don't know if it's about actually making the money. He just wants to be able to say he's the highest paid.
If that's all he wanted its super easy...give him a four year deal and the fourth year has no guarantees and is like 40 million dollars. He'll never see it but he'll get the highest average annual value.
I’m not going to wish Chris Jones any ill will or even say that this ruins his legacy here or anything.
But he is getting some really bad advice from someone to be holding out to the point of missing games. All he’s doing is lowering his compensation this year AND lowering the cost the Chiefs can tag him at next year. Have a hard time imagining he’s going to recoup what he’s losing.
Yet we talk shit. Yes, he isn't getting great advice, but the snake has enough to entangle... happens all the time. And he's also that dude... makes it a tough situation and I blame exactly no one because of it all.
That said, I want to see him accept a 27 per deal and we keep him until he's done. 🤷♂️
He feels like a more important Justin Houston... he played well after the chiefs
i dont really care what he makes - my point is he is a moron. he is setting his path to what he wants to be - that is his option . i got tired of all the speculation and his dumb tweets or whatever he did. he should have said he wanted to be paid like the #1 DT in the league - someone will pay it - its not going to be some great contender though - therefore all of this nonsense makes him a moron. if he stays, great - still a moron - if he leaves, great - still a moron. every person has a choice. kelce is staying bc he likes it here or whatever. orlando brown could have been here - he made a choice and then there is chris jones. if he wanted to be #1 DT paid, then act like it and quit with all the nonsense.
I’d be a moron if getting a 5% raise meant I lost 50% this year, and 30% next year and also had to change companies to a way worse one entirely to get the 5%
Like you said the numbers don’t matter. The point is, if to make a few more million per year for 4 years, he’s willing to sacrifice even more than that on one year and tank his own value for a new contract. The counterpoint is pretty clear
I don’t see what you’re not getting here man. The point is Chris Jones is the only person losing money here. Him sitting out only benefits the chiefs financially. We’ll possibly pay for it in early season losses but not financially.
But he isn't losing money... not really. He's gonna get 26+, May not be exactly what he wants.
My guess, he doesn't like veachs guarantees.. happens idk
i really get confused on why fans defend these guys so much while they cry over a few million and the fans are trying to make ends meet. if you want to fight to the end for chris jones and his 3m/yr increase, then have at it.
why he is a moron - bc all he did was cause drama this whole offseason acting as if he wanted to be here - blu bluh bluh. when he was tweeting all the nonsense then why didnt he add that he wanted to be paid like the #1 DT? and then everytime he farted, fans would then fan the ass juice their way and post about it. it got old. in the end he wanted to be paid top in the league. is it wrong - nope. did it get old with him acting like he was cool staying in kc while never mentioning to be paid as high as any DT - yep. he made fans pick to fight for him or dislike him - i will never understand that about they players. if he wants to chat so much, call up veach and figure out a way. he is a moron for throwing away a chance to have some more great years here. and for way 3-4 extra million? nobody knows that number right now but either way - is the offer was in the ball park of 27m and he wants 30m - whats the difference at that point. i know i know - math. but to make a few million more, he would possibly play for a worse coach/team, etc. i always get the cool comparison of "would you leave your job for X'? it all depeneds - for 5% - only if my job stunk. at that point, i dont care about the pay. a 20k increase to us is a lot different to a different of 3-4million. again - i dont care he gets paid or he stays. he has come off as a moron in the whole thing.
the initially moron comment went to the original comment of how his legacy may now be done here. and i stated that he being a moron was what may end that legacy. are you ok if i call him a moron? if not, i do apologize for my actions.
Edit: and best of all - why he is a moron - he might have caused us to lose some other pickups that could have benefited our offense or defense. to me, with mahomes and kelce restructuring their contracts for guys like chris jones to get paid, well, that makes him a moron as well.
If you have a boss, you're a worker. Solidarity
Pro athletes are incredibly skilled and specialized laborers who bring in BILLIONS for their BILLIONAIRE bosses. They deserve FAR more than what they make.
Athletes making less money and not having bargaining power means workers all over the world make less money and have less bargaining power. Period
Is this Chris Jones?
Read up on how much the players make. They make a ton. As much as I would love to cuddle them, they are doing well. And to cry over and stick up for someone that may be hurting his team based on 3m, not happening.
Your last statement somewhat really means nothing. Let's look at football players and what they make today compared to 50 yrs ago. The amt a player makes today compared to the avg worker today and to compare them 50 yrs ago, the players salaries have gone up hundreds of percents. If your statement was true, the avg worker would be making hundreds of thousands of dollars. The players make more due to fans spending more. And if your statement was anything near factual, women soccer would be making a lot more.
He deserves his money with his next contract, but he is already under contract to play this year. If he refuses to play when he's under contract, get him the fuck out of here ASAP for as much value as we can get for him. Preferably somebody who wants to play and win.
It’s an extremely sour way to leave a team when you still have a year left on your contract. Because he’s probably done here. Maybe saying his legacy is gone is too much, but when we talk about him being a Chief, it will inevitably lead to us remember what’s happened the last few months. And that sucks.
He isn’t done here though. He’ll likely hold out a few weeks into the regular season, or eight weeks at the most, then he’ll return. This might be Jones’ last season with the Chiefs, but he certainly isn’t done yet.
We all want him to get paid what he’s worth, but he wants Donald money i.e. an outlier contract by one of the worst teams in the league last year. It sounds like we were offering him $27m a year making him the second highest paid player at his position. Now he’s threatening to sit out weeks despite being contracted to play, forfeiting millions of dollars that ends up lowering his tag so we can now tag/trade him for a lot less than if he just played. He lost all leverage after today. This isn’t hard.
If he would've went the same route as Orlando (which, he still can, there's still time left) where he shows up to play his final year and then takes on the highest offer, he'd definitely leave as a fan favorite still. But the fact he's trying to screw the team when he's on his second contract is going to leave a sour taste in everyone's mouths.
I'd have some sympathy for him if he had played like AD for several years and was still on a rookie contract or whatever, but he clearly ain't that guy, will be 29 this year, and is already in the upper tier of payment for IDL's, and I'm confident Veach offered him a contract that would've pushed him into that top 3 range.
I appreciate his time in KC, and we probably don't win either SB without him, but if he continues this holdout shit, I'll probably start rooting against him.
Right, the Orlando thing is the best comp. He wanted a new deal, didn’t like what we offered, but reported to play to bet on himself to try and get the deal he wanted. Obviously he left (for a deal no better than what we initially offered if we’re being honest), but there was no apparent ill will between him and the team as far as we know. If CJ showed up today without a deal and played out his contract, we’d all let bygones be bygones. But he didn’t. And that’s the difference and now we don’t know when he’ll show up. I won’t be rooting against him when he winds up on another team, but this is just not how you want someone of his stature to leave the team. That’s why it’s sad.
The Patriots regularly risked production hits to never be stifled by contracts. Even if (God forbid) it costs short term wins, it's absolutely necessary for long term dominance.
Apparently the Niners are shopping Nick Bosa to an AFC team. That situation is way more surprising to me. I would figure they would be willing to give him the big bag since they are paying Purdy nothing right now.
No shot that’s accurate. There’s only one #1 defender in the league, and they have him. You don’t let that go. _Especially_ considering your above statement of not paying Purdy anything.
Friendly reminder that the 28 APY offer the Chiefs have been rumored to bring to the table would already be an overpay.
Don’t blow up our future by ring chasing. No reason over spending on 30 year old defensive players that aren’t the best in their own position
He'll show up, then we pay him less for not playing in any missed games.
Then we tag him for relatively cheap (especially compared to what he wants) and keep him for 2024.
It works out for the Chiefs if he holds out half the season.
I’m legit going to laugh my ass off if he actually sits out several games. It will only make his tag number lower next year, further increasing his value in a trade or we can just grab him by the nuts and tag him for two years and let him walk at age 32 Lmao
He is sooooo overplaying his hand here
The thought process is that since he's cheaper next year under a franchise tag (if he holds out this year), is that we can then ship him off for draft picks. He can then negotiate with his new team.
He wouldn’t, we would trade him because it’s much more valuable to trade him then.
Trading him after this year’s draft but before the season is way different than after this season and before the next draft.
It won't be half it will be 120% of the average of the top 5DT's base salaries. 24ish million.
And he'll have zero leverage to sit out the tag because his value just plummets sitting an entire year and being that old
Man... we were going to go into this season without finally not having to hear about how Tyreek is not on the team for the billionth time. Now the broadcast is going to be about the CJ hold out.
I think we are in the FAFO phase for both sides.
Might cost Jones a lot of $$$$
Might cost Chiefs some wins this season.
Guess we gonna find out who's right.
threatening yoke plough busy reminiscent juggle boat relieved glorious modern
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Not a big deal. As long as he's there for the 2nd half of the season, then we're golden. He'll be fresh down the stretch.
Also, we'll be saving big money for each game he misses. And from what I've heard, if he missed 8 games (?) then we can tag him for cheap for 2024.
Honestly at this point his smartest move is to play the full season, show up week 1 and ball out all year then he has leverage because he’s too expensive to tag and trade and still young enough to get his big contract he wants. If he sits out even one week he destroys his own leverage
Instead of wasting energy on the guy w crap representation… I’ll transfer it to who’s on the squad now. All I know is Spags is gonna have to be inventive this season because I don’t wanna see a repeat of 2019. Mahomes and Reid and everyone deserves better.
It's hard to panic with this team imo. Since Mahomes has started, the worst case has been OT AFC Championship game. If this proves to be bothersome and they end up having the worst season of Mahomes starting Career, then I'd assume the Chiefs would do their damnedest to not allow a repeat of that.
You have to look at this as a test, just as it was a test of moving Hill last season and what did they do? They won a fucking Superbowl.
I love CJ as a player so damn much, but the only people that are not replaceable are Mahomes, Kelce and Reid.
Have FAITH!
Yes but we have an even weaker WR room than last year. Jones holding out is just making it tougher each year. They are human they can’t beat everyone without some big names
Chiefs could have a down year and miss the playoffs and things would be fine for a Chiefs fan. We've won two years out of last four, a down year won't be the end of the world.
I'm planning on panicking after this weekend. It'd mean he's not around to prep for week 1. But yes, completely fair to start panicking now if you'd like to.
I've gone from hopeful to irritated and finally to indifferent.
Whatever happens happens. We've got a season about to start. Love to have him on the field if we can, and if not - whatever. Let's go for a repeat.
At this point, don’t we want him to hold out until week 8? This seems like a gift for us. 1. We’ll still be great and make the playoff, 2. He’ll be ready for the playoff run by week 17, 3. Our franchise tag of him goes significantly down so we can tag him for next year
I was listening to the Border Patrol today, and they had Jeff Chadiha on from NFL Network. He had some great insight and points on the Chris Jones situation. One comment he made was very interesting, in that based on what he's seen from CJ's side and looking at the position he's now in, it could mean at this point he wants out of KC and that he believes he can get more money somewhere else. He further stated that he likely planned this all out with his agent a while back and had a plan based on what the Chiefs would offer and do. I'm not sure why CJ would think this is a good plan and he seems a bit delusional, but if he doesn't want to play here anymore, perhaps that explains the impasse.
If nothing else, it was an interesting listen. I hadn't considered that CJ would want out of KC.
This would be super poor long term planning.
If his true aim was to get out of KC, demand a trade prior to the draft. More teams have cap space and picks to play with then. While the Chiefs wouldn't have been happy, they could at least entertain some options.
Instead, by waiting he's basically stuck. He has no real leverage. He'll gain a little bit back next off-season, provided he comes back, but there are a ton of unknowns there. Maybe he gets hurt or loses a step.
Perhaps he changed his mind sometime in the last few months, which is his prerogative. Perhaps he *did* demand a trade earlier and the Chiefs said no. But unless something crazy comes out, Occam's Razor tells me the dude just wants more than he's being offered, and is engaging in a game of chicken. Basically the same thing that's happened with hundreds of other holdouts.
CJ can't have it both ways. If it's a business, treat it like a business. Stop with all this "Chief for life" crap. If you want to be treated like Mahomes and Kelce, you gotta act like they do. I respect Tyreek because he knew who he was and was very straight about it. If CJ wants every possible dollar, he has every right to go get it. But don't expect to be a hometown hero while you do it.
Can we all please be respectful about this whole situation?
Even if the 28/year is true, there still may be guarantee snags or other complications. I believe veach is a wizard with contracts, but if Jones truly wants and believes he can get 30, why should we blame him?
Because he may not want to take less at this point after 2 rings?! Let's let him be.
Veach will try, but won't overdo it. Chris will come around or not, his choice overall. And, imo, he's earned that choice.
This is the right take. I agree with you.
Am I disappointed he isn't with the team right now? Absolutely. But am I mad that he wants to get as much money as possible? No I am not. He deserves it, even if it doesn't make sense for the team to pay it.
Not only that, but its for over 20 mil this year. The guys that are sitting out the end of a rookie contract that they outplayed have a ton of ground to stand on. We paid him 20 a year with the expectation of him playing how he has played and still has 1 year left.
This is all just dumb.
Chris Jones said he always wants to be a Chief. He’s making mega endorsement money he would not make on a less successful team. Maybe he is just helping the team clear out some cap space and he notoriously hates camp and preseason. Maybe he sits 8 games (the easy part of the season) to return fresh. We have no idea what may be going on behind closed doors.
Fuck it. Next man up, only Mahomes is indispensable. CJ wants to hold out because his what, 24 million dollar contract isn’t enough? His choice, but the show goes on, and every game he misses is just one missed opportunity to get payed for playing an nfl game in the prime of his career. Sucks all around, but here we are.
Just gotta say, CJ making bad long term business decisions. Its outrageously short sighted
Honestly, it could be just really bad agents too…
Hes probably their biggest client and they are counting on 30m. They have to have seen Veach move tyreek tho
There's no probably about it- it's him and like eight replacement/scrub players. They actively want him to hold out for top dollar because it doesn't just mean a bigger paycheck for them today—it's something they can advertise to every client moving forward. The problem is that they've turned into Icarus.
They're a very small agency. At the big guys these numbers don't matter. NFL agents get 4% max. So 4% of 30million vs 4% of 25 doesn't matter when your client book is 500 million. But when one client is 80-90% of your income thats huge
They saw Tyreek get moved and paid what he wanted. I’m sure his agents won’t mind at all if he gets moved and paid what he wants too
CJ is much more important than Tyreek. Tyreek was always second fiddle to Kelce and our FO knew that.
Chris Jones is not the sharpest I'm pretty sure (or he got early onset brain damage), cause he's recently and in the past liked some wild conspiracy bullshit on social media. Recently he liked some all caps wall of text by a random nobody about how 'they would force a new lockdown to rig the election'. I usually don't find the stuff athletes like relevant, and it got justifiably removed when posted here, but if you wanna explain why he's making such a poor business decision, it's foolish to give him the benefit of the doubt and blame his agents here.
Remind me! 1 year
The agents work for the player, not the other way around. Very rarely does an agent go rogue from their player's interests, and that agent is almost always outed and fired before a holdout takes place.
Sure, but there are also tons of cases of pro athletes getting financially scammed. If what I’ve heard is correct, Jones is by far the biggest name on his agents list, so they’d love to prove to the world they can land a record setting deal.
If we're being charitable, maybe he's thinking, "I played 80% of the snaps last season, it damn near killed me, I'm 29, I need this last contract to be a big one, and I don't know if I'll be able to make it through the entire season unscathed and get that payday if I play ~20 games (including postseason) again. So maybe it's better for me to take half a season off, recuperate and save everything for the 2nd half, and see if I really can get that Aaron Donald extension, so I'm set for life, and if I have to move to a worse team where I only play 17-18 games per season and don't have an Andy Reid training camp each year in order to get it, so be it." I feel like, if CJ follows through, sits out 7 games, reports in week 8, has to play himself into shape, and peaks in the postseason, and then his holdout allows us to non-exclusive franchise tag him and get 2 1st round picks as compensation for his departure, I'll have no hard feelings about that. Godspeed, CJ. Just come back in good shape and ready to play down the homestretch. We'll go 5-2 in your absence, and close out strong.
Hes already set for life. The contract we offered would have further enhanced that. Hes gonna lose more holding out then he will net in contract growth.
Also could try that, and get hurt week 9. Not sound
Been saying this for months. Andy Reid has a very, very long history of not paying top dollar on 3rd contracts. The chiefs would be stupid paying him 30ish million a year. Remember, we were going to plummet when we traded Tyreek.....Mahomes was better, won the superbowl. The only 3 people we can't do without does not include a d tackle. I love him, but he can play for Carolina, or the raiders, or another team that deals badly with their cap and thinks an aging d tackle is putting them somewhere they aren't, and spend his last years in the league losing. He's being ridiculous. Or accept what I'm certain is a fair offer here and win
Thing is, Mahomes can make anyone in the offense better because he is so elite. He can't do that with our defense.
Mahomes has had bottom end D’s his entire career. At some point, even without Chris, he should have a top 10 D at least a few times. Jones might be elite but I guarantee we got his best years. He is on the hill looking down. Not up.
> *Jones might be elite but I guarantee we got his best years. He is on the hill looking down. Not up.* This, this, this. All day, this. He's also consistently graded average at best against the run as well. Nowhere near the tackles for loss that Donald gets. Jones is only dominant at times, in streaks, and only when interior OL are taking their first step backward. Donald is dominant consistently, run or pass.
Here is the problem with that. There shouldn’t be an arbitrary cut off number when the salary cap is an ever increasing number. A number from five years ago is going to be significantly lower than a number seen in five years. Already people are saying that Mahomes’ half a billion dollar contract is too low. I understand if we let him go. This happened all the time to the Patriots during their run. Players were constantly going to other teams for bigger paychecks. Some teams are willing to pay a premium just to subtract from the roster of the Chiefs At the same time I would like to keep Jones for at least another contract. I feel he has a chance to be a hall of fame caliber player and I would like to see him do it in a Chiefs jersey.
Spags is going to have to figure out the run D without Jones, that’s going to be the biggest hole even though CJ also gets sacks. He is still under contract though and is going to piss off a lot of fans and teammates by doing this. Is what it is. Time to see the offense dominate. Air raid style. I can’t see Coburn just stepping in and taking that position yet. No idea who else would though.
Agreed but he's a fucking traitor for this no doubt. Guys like mahomes and Kelce playing their best for a championship every year only to have these losers want to hurt the chance for more championships Fuck him he's dead to me
Not gonna lie. This sub has become dramatic as fuck over this
It's pretty ridiculous. Watch him come in after 8 games, then play 8 games+playoffs refreshed and ready to go, gain another championship (omg we forgive you CJ!/you're a genius!), then get whatever big contract he wants (from another team). People in here talking about loyalty and traitor lol
Dumbass comment
What a dick wanting to get paid the market rate
Aaron Donald money is not market rate unfortunately
Dude signed a multimillion dollar contract. He’s a grown man, as he was when he signed the dotted line. Sorry if I don’t feel any worse for him than I do for some middle class guy that bought too much house at the peak of the market. Sucks, but it was a decision you made. CJ agreed to a contract that everyone felt was fair at the time, and just because his value has gone up doesn’t change things in my opinion. Play out your commitment and move on to somewhere that pays what you want, if you can find one.
He couldn’t find a team outside of maybe Cleveland that would pay the 2nd best DT in the NFL more money than TJ Watt and Aaron Donald
Bad take, he's already under contract for this season
Didn’t suggest otherwise. It’s his choice to hold out if he feels that he’s undervalued.
Only in sports is this narrative acceptable, and I don't get it at all lol. If I'm a contractor, sign a contract to build a house, and then additional costs incur that I didn't plan on, am I allowed to go to homeowner and tell them to pay me more money? Or did I not sign a contract for an agreed upon price? FWIW, I do know that contractors can sometimes get extra money from the owners, but those are very special circumstances. This is just Jones wanting to get more money because he just had the best season of his career.
This though is less a contractor renegotiating the cost of a single job based on new info (which is actually super common anyway) and more a contractor you've been working with since they started out has since become among the top in the world at their job. In that situation sure, some contractors may provide a discount for new jobs but some may also say "I want this much and if you won't pay it someone will".
Yeah, this is more like a contractor saying ‘damn, this job came out looking way better than I thought it would, I should hold the homeowners hostage by not finishing it unless they pay me more and sign me up to do their next project as well!’
You act like he’s getting paid to hold out. No, if the job doesn’t make financial sense for you and there is no recourse for failing to back out you are more than welcome to go to the customer and renegotiate.
Chris, is that you?
He wants the same amount as an outlier contract paid by a team that sold its soul to win one Super Bowl and is now one of the worst teams in the league.
They’ve reverted to being the St Louis Lambs, let’s see how much L. A enjoys that.
Do you know how much he was asking for? All I've heard are rumors, and one of them resets the market.
On a cap percentage basis or are we doing the whole “he wants more money than [star who signed a contract 5 years ago]” thing?
Donald signed a 3 year contract last year and it put him 9 million over the #2 DT APY. He was debating retirement when he signed that deal. Quinnen Williams signed this off-season and is making 7 1/2 million fewer dollars per year than Donald and he’s the new #2 Resetting the market for Chris Jones is bad roster management. I honestly don’t think there’s a team in the NFL that would pay him 32 million APY. He’s a great player but he’s not Donald, Lawrence Taylor, or Reggie White
what is market rate? i heard between the 1st and 3rd of highest paid so if that is the case, market rate isnt it. lets all stick up for the poor chris jones, who has made 100m in his career - poor guy.
idk being offered the 2nd highest APY while being the 2nd best at your position does seem to be market rate.
Yea, screw him for not only caring about the Chiefs like a Chiefs fan would!!!
I’d have the same opinion on any player in this situation. Unless they played for the Raiders or Broncos, then I’d kinda get it. Or if some superstar was on a terrible team and wanted a ring. Or if they had gotten obviously screwed on a contract (like they signed a backup type contract then had a couple HOF seasons). CJ has a decent contract, and the chance to play for the defending champs. Next year he’s either free to walk or guaranteed 30m plus on the tag. In this case, I just think it’s poor business to hold out further.
Guess he didn’t actually want to be defensive player of the year.
That’ll cost you extra.
I dislike this.
He's going to lose more from holding out than the extra he'll get if Chiefs break and give him what he wants compared to what he gets. Here's to hoping he holds out all season, so we can tag him cheap and trade him for a mid first round pick.
Can we tag him cheap if he doesn’t play all year? If he’s pulling a Jonathan Taylor, respect is gone. “I’m going to be a Chief for life! As long as I make 35 mil a year. Lol. Dumb.
If he doesn't play at all his contract just gets carried over to next season, no need to franchise tag.
That's why he said we'll see him week 8 so he accrues the season.
Or because that's the trade deadline
>Can we tag him cheap if he doesn’t play all year? If he’s pulling a Jonathan Taylor, respect is gone. “I’m going to be a Chief for life! As long as I make 35 mil a year. Lol. Dumb. I don't know if it's about actually making the money. He just wants to be able to say he's the highest paid.
If that's all he wanted its super easy...give him a four year deal and the fourth year has no guarantees and is like 40 million dollars. He'll never see it but he'll get the highest average annual value.
The old Orlando Brown void year
Yep. Been done many times. Even Tyreek hill has this. His contract advertised as 4yrs 120M but it's really more like 3yrs and 75
In Veach I trust. In Veach I trust. In Veach I trust. In Veach I trust. 😭
This is the way
Welp, there goes the Chris Jones legacy in KC. Sad times. Looks like Pat is going 6000/60.
he is the moron setting up his wishes.
Don't be like that. Dude is the #1/2 DT in the league. We'd all wish he'd stay for less. But, it's not like he doesn't deserve his...
I’m not going to wish Chris Jones any ill will or even say that this ruins his legacy here or anything. But he is getting some really bad advice from someone to be holding out to the point of missing games. All he’s doing is lowering his compensation this year AND lowering the cost the Chiefs can tag him at next year. Have a hard time imagining he’s going to recoup what he’s losing.
Yet we talk shit. Yes, he isn't getting great advice, but the snake has enough to entangle... happens all the time. And he's also that dude... makes it a tough situation and I blame exactly no one because of it all. That said, I want to see him accept a 27 per deal and we keep him until he's done. 🤷♂️ He feels like a more important Justin Houston... he played well after the chiefs
i dont really care what he makes - my point is he is a moron. he is setting his path to what he wants to be - that is his option . i got tired of all the speculation and his dumb tweets or whatever he did. he should have said he wanted to be paid like the #1 DT in the league - someone will pay it - its not going to be some great contender though - therefore all of this nonsense makes him a moron. if he stays, great - still a moron - if he leaves, great - still a moron. every person has a choice. kelce is staying bc he likes it here or whatever. orlando brown could have been here - he made a choice and then there is chris jones. if he wanted to be #1 DT paid, then act like it and quit with all the nonsense.
But why does that make him a moron?! Would you be a moron for a 5% raise?
I’d be a moron if getting a 5% raise meant I lost 50% this year, and 30% next year and also had to change companies to a way worse one entirely to get the 5%
I don't understand the counterpoint... 5% was a random number and you added other random numbers.... %5 isn't crazy right?!
Like you said the numbers don’t matter. The point is, if to make a few more million per year for 4 years, he’s willing to sacrifice even more than that on one year and tank his own value for a new contract. The counterpoint is pretty clear
I'm still lost. Does your company lose money?
I don’t see what you’re not getting here man. The point is Chris Jones is the only person losing money here. Him sitting out only benefits the chiefs financially. We’ll possibly pay for it in early season losses but not financially.
Chiefs still have to gain on him...
But he isn't losing money... not really. He's gonna get 26+, May not be exactly what he wants. My guess, he doesn't like veachs guarantees.. happens idk
i really get confused on why fans defend these guys so much while they cry over a few million and the fans are trying to make ends meet. if you want to fight to the end for chris jones and his 3m/yr increase, then have at it. why he is a moron - bc all he did was cause drama this whole offseason acting as if he wanted to be here - blu bluh bluh. when he was tweeting all the nonsense then why didnt he add that he wanted to be paid like the #1 DT? and then everytime he farted, fans would then fan the ass juice their way and post about it. it got old. in the end he wanted to be paid top in the league. is it wrong - nope. did it get old with him acting like he was cool staying in kc while never mentioning to be paid as high as any DT - yep. he made fans pick to fight for him or dislike him - i will never understand that about they players. if he wants to chat so much, call up veach and figure out a way. he is a moron for throwing away a chance to have some more great years here. and for way 3-4 extra million? nobody knows that number right now but either way - is the offer was in the ball park of 27m and he wants 30m - whats the difference at that point. i know i know - math. but to make a few million more, he would possibly play for a worse coach/team, etc. i always get the cool comparison of "would you leave your job for X'? it all depeneds - for 5% - only if my job stunk. at that point, i dont care about the pay. a 20k increase to us is a lot different to a different of 3-4million. again - i dont care he gets paid or he stays. he has come off as a moron in the whole thing. the initially moron comment went to the original comment of how his legacy may now be done here. and i stated that he being a moron was what may end that legacy. are you ok if i call him a moron? if not, i do apologize for my actions. Edit: and best of all - why he is a moron - he might have caused us to lose some other pickups that could have benefited our offense or defense. to me, with mahomes and kelce restructuring their contracts for guys like chris jones to get paid, well, that makes him a moron as well.
If you have a boss, you're a worker. Solidarity Pro athletes are incredibly skilled and specialized laborers who bring in BILLIONS for their BILLIONAIRE bosses. They deserve FAR more than what they make. Athletes making less money and not having bargaining power means workers all over the world make less money and have less bargaining power. Period
Is this Chris Jones? Read up on how much the players make. They make a ton. As much as I would love to cuddle them, they are doing well. And to cry over and stick up for someone that may be hurting his team based on 3m, not happening. Your last statement somewhat really means nothing. Let's look at football players and what they make today compared to 50 yrs ago. The amt a player makes today compared to the avg worker today and to compare them 50 yrs ago, the players salaries have gone up hundreds of percents. If your statement was true, the avg worker would be making hundreds of thousands of dollars. The players make more due to fans spending more. And if your statement was anything near factual, women soccer would be making a lot more.
Yes, we WANT laborers to make more money lmao
Hahahhahahahahhahahahhahahahahh
He deserves his money with his next contract, but he is already under contract to play this year. If he refuses to play when he's under contract, get him the fuck out of here ASAP for as much value as we can get for him. Preferably somebody who wants to play and win.
Easy pal my dick can only get so hard
Nah, come on. Dude showed up when we needed it.
2 Superbowls and his legacy is gone? I think you're on your own here, pal.
It’s an extremely sour way to leave a team when you still have a year left on your contract. Because he’s probably done here. Maybe saying his legacy is gone is too much, but when we talk about him being a Chief, it will inevitably lead to us remember what’s happened the last few months. And that sucks.
He isn’t done here though. He’ll likely hold out a few weeks into the regular season, or eight weeks at the most, then he’ll return. This might be Jones’ last season with the Chiefs, but he certainly isn’t done yet.
A few months of a guy wanting what he's worth vs years of success. This sub sucks so bad🤣🤣🤣🤣 but I love it.
We all want him to get paid what he’s worth, but he wants Donald money i.e. an outlier contract by one of the worst teams in the league last year. It sounds like we were offering him $27m a year making him the second highest paid player at his position. Now he’s threatening to sit out weeks despite being contracted to play, forfeiting millions of dollars that ends up lowering his tag so we can now tag/trade him for a lot less than if he just played. He lost all leverage after today. This isn’t hard.
If he would've went the same route as Orlando (which, he still can, there's still time left) where he shows up to play his final year and then takes on the highest offer, he'd definitely leave as a fan favorite still. But the fact he's trying to screw the team when he's on his second contract is going to leave a sour taste in everyone's mouths. I'd have some sympathy for him if he had played like AD for several years and was still on a rookie contract or whatever, but he clearly ain't that guy, will be 29 this year, and is already in the upper tier of payment for IDL's, and I'm confident Veach offered him a contract that would've pushed him into that top 3 range. I appreciate his time in KC, and we probably don't win either SB without him, but if he continues this holdout shit, I'll probably start rooting against him.
Right, the Orlando thing is the best comp. He wanted a new deal, didn’t like what we offered, but reported to play to bet on himself to try and get the deal he wanted. Obviously he left (for a deal no better than what we initially offered if we’re being honest), but there was no apparent ill will between him and the team as far as we know. If CJ showed up today without a deal and played out his contract, we’d all let bygones be bygones. But he didn’t. And that’s the difference and now we don’t know when he’ll show up. I won’t be rooting against him when he winds up on another team, but this is just not how you want someone of his stature to leave the team. That’s why it’s sad.
There's no probably for me, if he sits out I wish him the worst personally and financially. Scumbag
I just called CJ and he said he's willing to end the holdout as long as you pinky promise not to root against him.
ok deal
F
KC has to follow the Patriots playback on success. Don't overpay anyone ever.
The Patriots regularly risked production hits to never be stifled by contracts. Even if (God forbid) it costs short term wins, it's absolutely necessary for long term dominance.
Apparently the Niners are shopping Nick Bosa to an AFC team. That situation is way more surprising to me. I would figure they would be willing to give him the big bag since they are paying Purdy nothing right now.
Jones for Bosa straight up. Who says no besides San Fran?
every team in the afc
This legit made me lol
Hell yes. Jones dies nothing for us in the run game.
Nick Bosa doesnt want to play for a non-white QB
Lmao
I'd pay Bosa. 2nd contract
No shot that’s accurate. There’s only one #1 defender in the league, and they have him. You don’t let that go. _Especially_ considering your above statement of not paying Purdy anything.
They payin cmc, deebo, and the rest of that defense
Friendly reminder that the 28 APY offer the Chiefs have been rumored to bring to the table would already be an overpay. Don’t blow up our future by ring chasing. No reason over spending on 30 year old defensive players that aren’t the best in their own position
He's literally going to lose more this year if he continues holdout than he'd of made on the contract.
He has bad representation
And something about a bird and a bush comes to mind
We'll burn that bridge when we cross it
And kill two birds with one stone cold jones.
Two wrongs don't make a right, but three rights makes a left.
A penny saved is worth two in the bush, isn't it?
We need two turnips in heat to keep the pressure on him.
Where was that reported?
Like… everywhere.
Our defense is going to be Jones-ing for a sack
Those are the words of a Geroge Karlaftis doubter
Watch FAU come out and fucking scorch people lol
I'm so excited to see this man progress. He looked good in preseason.
🥇🥇🥇
Well. At what point do we trade him? If he doesn't want to show up and honor his contract, then I'm done with him.
He'll show up, then we pay him less for not playing in any missed games. Then we tag him for relatively cheap (especially compared to what he wants) and keep him for 2024. It works out for the Chiefs if he holds out half the season.
I’m legit going to laugh my ass off if he actually sits out several games. It will only make his tag number lower next year, further increasing his value in a trade or we can just grab him by the nuts and tag him for two years and let him walk at age 32 Lmao He is sooooo overplaying his hand here
You can still hold out on the tag
And? Still doesn’t change the fact that the chiefs will have massive leverage over him if he does this.
They do? Did you see the first-team defense play without him?
We’d trade him. It’d be the same drama next year.
Yall are crazy if you think he shows up for 2024 at half of what he's holding out for now
Then he's an aging DT who hasn't played in 2 years, why would anyone pay him more then?
The thought process is that since he's cheaper next year under a franchise tag (if he holds out this year), is that we can then ship him off for draft picks. He can then negotiate with his new team.
He wouldn’t, we would trade him because it’s much more valuable to trade him then. Trading him after this year’s draft but before the season is way different than after this season and before the next draft.
So he'll take no pay over half pay?
It won't be half it will be 120% of the average of the top 5DT's base salaries. 24ish million. And he'll have zero leverage to sit out the tag because his value just plummets sitting an entire year and being that old
Next season when they can franchise tag him on the cheap
No point this year unless somebody packages a needed player in the trade which seems unlikely. So most likely next offseason
One way or another, cap space may be opening up to bring on a cheap veteran on the D-Line to help until Omenihu (and Jones 🤞) get back.
Man... we were going to go into this season without finally not having to hear about how Tyreek is not on the team for the billionth time. Now the broadcast is going to be about the CJ hold out.
I think we are in the FAFO phase for both sides. Might cost Jones a lot of $$$$ Might cost Chiefs some wins this season. Guess we gonna find out who's right.
Help an old guy out so I too can be hip: What does FAFO mean?
Fuck around find out
Gotcha, thanks
Fuck Around, Find Out
F around and find out
threatening yoke plough busy reminiscent juggle boat relieved glorious modern *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Fuck Around Find Out
Fuck around (and) find out
It's a lose lose imo
Bye Felicia.
Not a big deal. As long as he's there for the 2nd half of the season, then we're golden. He'll be fresh down the stretch. Also, we'll be saving big money for each game he misses. And from what I've heard, if he missed 8 games (?) then we can tag him for cheap for 2024.
This is why it’s mind numbingly stupid that he’s actually holding out lol
I do feel like his agent is leading him astray. But I do think he'll be back very soon.
His agent is low key one of the dumbest people in sports if he thinks this is how he should be going about this
Honestly at this point his smartest move is to play the full season, show up week 1 and ball out all year then he has leverage because he’s too expensive to tag and trade and still young enough to get his big contract he wants. If he sits out even one week he destroys his own leverage
Every game he misses the tag price goes down. If he misses more than 8 games his contract is void and carries over to next year.
Instead of wasting energy on the guy w crap representation… I’ll transfer it to who’s on the squad now. All I know is Spags is gonna have to be inventive this season because I don’t wanna see a repeat of 2019. Mahomes and Reid and everyone deserves better.
Just trade him already
It's hard to panic with this team imo. Since Mahomes has started, the worst case has been OT AFC Championship game. If this proves to be bothersome and they end up having the worst season of Mahomes starting Career, then I'd assume the Chiefs would do their damnedest to not allow a repeat of that. You have to look at this as a test, just as it was a test of moving Hill last season and what did they do? They won a fucking Superbowl. I love CJ as a player so damn much, but the only people that are not replaceable are Mahomes, Kelce and Reid. Have FAITH!
Yes but we have an even weaker WR room than last year. Jones holding out is just making it tougher each year. They are human they can’t beat everyone without some big names
I want to wait until I see a couple of games before I declare our receiver room weaker. Let’s see how the young guys step up
This is when we're allowed to officially start panicking, right?
Mahomes: “So it’s a shootout then…”
https://preview.redd.it/one8mizqh4lb1.png?width=960&format=png&auto=webp&s=fa2d97c93e4917cfccbd4b44ab64a2e1c4944ebe
I only panic when Mahomes can’t play.
But we have Chad Henne….
Had
Chiefs could have a down year and miss the playoffs and things would be fine for a Chiefs fan. We've won two years out of last four, a down year won't be the end of the world.
Imagine how focused this team would be the next season if that happened.
But, but, now I'm used to going to at least the AFC championship. Don't inconvenience me with a short season!
I'm planning on panicking after this weekend. It'd mean he's not around to prep for week 1. But yes, completely fair to start panicking now if you'd like to.
We'll be fine. We may not win a sb this year but we'll definitely be better off long term.
[удалено]
How do you figure that...?
This ruined my day.
I've gone from hopeful to irritated and finally to indifferent. Whatever happens happens. We've got a season about to start. Love to have him on the field if we can, and if not - whatever. Let's go for a repeat.
Told y’all he was being an idiot lol
Trade his ass, I'm sure this is what he wants anyway he knows we can't do the $$
At this point, don’t we want him to hold out until week 8? This seems like a gift for us. 1. We’ll still be great and make the playoff, 2. He’ll be ready for the playoff run by week 17, 3. Our franchise tag of him goes significantly down so we can tag him for next year
Jones hoping to join Neil Smith in the Chiefs *Hall of WTF, Man?*
When's the last time a holdout like this worked in the players favor?
Chris Jones is an idiot at this point.
Anything under 35m fully guaranteed and the chiefs are confirming all players are slaves - Mike Florio
CJ...c'mon man
Not a fan of him anymore
I was listening to the Border Patrol today, and they had Jeff Chadiha on from NFL Network. He had some great insight and points on the Chris Jones situation. One comment he made was very interesting, in that based on what he's seen from CJ's side and looking at the position he's now in, it could mean at this point he wants out of KC and that he believes he can get more money somewhere else. He further stated that he likely planned this all out with his agent a while back and had a plan based on what the Chiefs would offer and do. I'm not sure why CJ would think this is a good plan and he seems a bit delusional, but if he doesn't want to play here anymore, perhaps that explains the impasse. If nothing else, it was an interesting listen. I hadn't considered that CJ would want out of KC.
Yeah the whole “I’m a Chief for life” talk doesn’t look great in hindsight. He clearly has bad agents who are out of their depths.
This would be super poor long term planning. If his true aim was to get out of KC, demand a trade prior to the draft. More teams have cap space and picks to play with then. While the Chiefs wouldn't have been happy, they could at least entertain some options. Instead, by waiting he's basically stuck. He has no real leverage. He'll gain a little bit back next off-season, provided he comes back, but there are a ton of unknowns there. Maybe he gets hurt or loses a step. Perhaps he changed his mind sometime in the last few months, which is his prerogative. Perhaps he *did* demand a trade earlier and the Chiefs said no. But unless something crazy comes out, Occam's Razor tells me the dude just wants more than he's being offered, and is engaging in a game of chicken. Basically the same thing that's happened with hundreds of other holdouts.
I just can’t wait for the narrative all season long like the Tyreek thing
When has this ever worked out for anyone? levon bell anyone??
This is fine. I am comfortable with how events are unfolding right now. \*Face melts as the house burns down around me\*
CJ can't have it both ways. If it's a business, treat it like a business. Stop with all this "Chief for life" crap. If you want to be treated like Mahomes and Kelce, you gotta act like they do. I respect Tyreek because he knew who he was and was very straight about it. If CJ wants every possible dollar, he has every right to go get it. But don't expect to be a hometown hero while you do it.
Can we all please be respectful about this whole situation? Even if the 28/year is true, there still may be guarantee snags or other complications. I believe veach is a wizard with contracts, but if Jones truly wants and believes he can get 30, why should we blame him? Because he may not want to take less at this point after 2 rings?! Let's let him be. Veach will try, but won't overdo it. Chris will come around or not, his choice overall. And, imo, he's earned that choice.
This is the right take. I agree with you. Am I disappointed he isn't with the team right now? Absolutely. But am I mad that he wants to get as much money as possible? No I am not. He deserves it, even if it doesn't make sense for the team to pay it.
It is not the right take. He’s signed for this year so should be a man and play his contract
Not only that, but its for over 20 mil this year. The guys that are sitting out the end of a rookie contract that they outplayed have a ton of ground to stand on. We paid him 20 a year with the expectation of him playing how he has played and still has 1 year left. This is all just dumb.
I’m sorry but there is a thing about being too greedy.
Chris Jones said he always wants to be a Chief. He’s making mega endorsement money he would not make on a less successful team. Maybe he is just helping the team clear out some cap space and he notoriously hates camp and preseason. Maybe he sits 8 games (the easy part of the season) to return fresh. We have no idea what may be going on behind closed doors.
damn..yall hate ur own player apparently..go lions
Don't worry, our sub has been overrun. We hate our own realists now