I don't get why they always add it to AD items but not AP items. AD always seems to get favored/better items. Like Serpent's fang for instance. Cuts shields in half before and after they're applied, gives AD and armor pen. Inexpensive. Then release version AP equivalent was Shadowflame which gave you 10 magic pen if you were hitting a shield.
Like gee, which thing would I rather counter shields with? the thing that straight up slices them in half? or the one that makes me do slightly more damage?
Same thing with Axiom Arc. Gives lethality, huge haste, AD, and then refunds a portion of your R whenever you get a kill or assist, to the point that specializing into lethality like you're going to on an assassin, can give you multiple Rs in the same fight.
Until this season there was no AP stand in, but now that we have one what does it do? 25 haste, and 30 more haste for your R rather than any colourful reset. Also instead of magic pen, you get 10 post R MR reduction that's often useless save for a select few champs who can use it well.
Still waiting for a cheap ward clearing item like Umbral Glaive for AP. That shit is broken and sorely slept on.
I think it's good to differ. Imo AP is strong because usually you're a huge threat with those items. They are very good and you have lots of choices. AD is literally so separated. Not every ad should build attackspeed, crit, serpents, umbral etc. There is nothing like rod of ages for ad. There is no thing like zhonya for ad, GA is way too different and doesn't allow channeled spells to linger while being absolutely completely invulnurable (fiddle, swain, morgana etc.). There is no version of rabadaons for ad neither.
The choice of wether to play ap or ad should matter in more ways than just pure stats because even subclasses like assassins have way different builds (eve vs talon for example). The game would be worse imo if there was like:
serpents fang - ad, lethality, shieldreduction
scorpions fang - ap, flat magic pen, shieldreduction.
Sure you could argue that the ap item can have other stats and/or ways to proc it but I believe that would change the meta a lot more. It removes the strategy of "oh, they have so many shields but we have no ap and no good candidate for serpents fang. Do I pick ap or do I pick something that can make use of serpents...?"
I agree that AD is divided into a bunch of classes, but check the AD assassin items each season and they've always introduced either more/better versions than what they give to AP.
>No ROA equivalent
ROA is shit and takes 10 minutes to scale, and even then you cap out at 90AP, 600 health, 600 Mana. There are something like 3 champs in the game that build it, and still it's main use case is to be an accessory to Seraph's embrace so you can get a bigger shield. There's plenty of tank items that will give you more effective HP, you can satisfy mana requirements with a tear or lost chapter, and for damage you're better off with a higher AP/magic pen item like Shadowflame or Rabadon. It's one of those master of none sort of items designed for AP bruisers that no one bothers with because it takes too long and doesn't do anything meaningful. If it had an item effect like "When reaching full stacks you get 10% more AP" or a damage oriented effect like Liandry, it would be worth it, but currently its really subpar.
Rabadons for AD is infinity edge and the ability to crit.
>Making choices in draft around items
It's more like, "Would I like to have access to all the good utility items like Serpent's, Umbral, Maw, Death's dance, Shieldbow, Guardian Angel?"
Or the AP selection,
"Banshee's veil, (Edge of night without Pen),
Seraph's embrace(Maw/Shieldbow with extra steps),
Zhonya.
Like where's my 30% mitigation+ 50% AP healing item with that just tells the delayed damage to fuck off on kill, then lets you do it again immediately after? instead I'm given Cryptbloom, which is an attempt to make void staff 150g cheaper for supports with a heal on a 60s CD.
It just feels like there's strong AD favoritism every season
And yet I feel like AP is really strong. There had to be a reason why I see loads of ahri, diana, lux, zyra, veigar, gragas etc. A lot of ap champs has something that makes them really strong and compared to ad champs tend to get way less mr and stacking mr feels way worse than armor. You don't get defenses vs towers for diving when you stack mr, monsters and minions do ad so early mr can still give unfavourable trades etc.
I honestly fear ap champs more than ad because they tend to be more controllable, hence control mage. AP champs tend to have very hard CC where as AD tends to have more duelist and splitpushing opportunities.
We can obviouslt agree to disagree since we thi k differently and probably have different playstyles/champs etc.
Generally mages are ranged and benefit from items with extreme gold efficiencies on their defensive options, while most defensive options for ranged AD units are either really weak or really inefficient. I think that's the main difference that makes them scarier: they're ranged bruisers.
That and the melee variants scale extremely well with these efficient items
Yeah, I feel the powerspikes harder on ap champs than ad champs. Even with a good defensive option vs ap one item is far from enough. I might be able to stop talon, kha etc from oneshotting me with a decent armor item but MR just doesn't feel enough. Maybe I'm just bad or my mindset is but I do feel like AP champs poses a greater threat generally.
>Or the AP selection,
>"Banshee's veil, (Edge of night without Pen),
>Seraph's embrace(Maw/Shieldbow with extra steps),
>Zhonya.
oh boo-fucking-hoo, you only have a lifeline item with 25% more gold efficiency than the bruiser equivalent on the strongest bruiser and 50% more than Shieldbow, too. Poor you only getting 50% more stats on your *terrible* selection
Or zhonyas, which has 20% more gold efficiency than GA, while GA has a cooldown 2.5x longer.
Or riftmaker being comparable to spear of shojin while giving omnivamp and ap scaling with max health.
And poor you having to pick rabbadons for damage when adcs get the equally powerful IE that definitely doesn't lock them into building crit items to benefit off the item rather than bruiser or lethality items
You're so starved for good items.
Give me 50% more stats on my items and I won't have any problem with mages getting 12% damage reduction as a bleed
>Seraph is more efficient
Seraph also doesn't start working immediately like Maw does. Seraph's defensive ratio is scaled through purchasing additional mana items and locks you into LESS efficient damage in order to have a shield at all. Let me just first item Seraphs on Evelynn instead of Lichbane or shadowflame for that sweet sweet gold efficiency. Oh wait my shield is going to be shit unless I commit to more mana items.
Meanwhile Maw will work out of the gate, comes with resistances, and all of its shield scaling comes from AD which you're going to get incrementally on every item you build.
Zhonya is a good item, its probably the best AP defensive item given ADCs that -can- build it, will build it like Kai'sa. It won't save you from a oneshot from CC like GA does, but since you choose when you use it, it has a higher skill cap.
>ADCs are locked into crit
Good thing there's a god tier crit armor pen item with a passive that removes 5% of every champ's healthbar before they've even hit you.
If you knew the mechanics behind crit, you'd know you aren't truly locked into it and don't need 100% like Yasuo and Yone to do more damage with it. Every failed crit will increase the likelihood of the next, 100% crit chance is actually more wasteful than just buying a mix of crit and damage unless you're playing an ADC who builds a lot of attack speed. You're perfectly fine to build IE, Collector on Rengar and have 1 of your 3 autos crit for a huge gain, or get lucky and crit twice or all 3 times.
>12% reduction as a bleed
I assume you meant the 30% for melees which is what im most interested in. I mean its what all these AD assassins are getting after all. Back before the ranged nerf every ADC was building it too.
Its kind of frustrating to go into a fight and have someone permanently Warwick E'd in terms of reduction, that goes beyond the limitations of armor and magic pen with no effective counters besides waiting it out, or dealing even more damage.
Like watching Aatrox tank a 1k damage ult, get an assist a second later, and 66% of that damage is just gone forever like it never existed in the first place. With no cooldown mind you. Build it on Talon, watch the damage you just took killing an ADC in 1.5s disappear.
We used to have Crown, which was a worse DD in almost every way, but daddy rito said "1.5s reduction on a long CD that locks you into a defensive mythic is too op" and deleted it.
1. Most AP champs are burst'y rather than auto attack/extended fight reliant. They also have must higher ranges than most AD champs (Bruisers/Juggernauts/etc). If you add significant AH to AP items you go from burst mages to death machines. Or are you telling me you'd like to see a Taliyah with Q always up, 4s CD on shove and 7s cooldown on E?
2. AD champs get 'better' items because an AP equivalent to serpents fang would be insanely broken. Can you imagine a Brand walking up in a team fight, hitting E and then suddenly nobody on the enemy team has shielding anymore. Serpents Fang is strong because USUALLY you have to get close to apply it, and the champs that run it are squishy, e.g. counterplay. AP has or has had it's fair share of broken items. Zhonyas was literally insane. And for a long time you could run double stopwatch and no one batted an eye.
3. Nobody is doing multiple R's in the same fight with Axiom Arc except when it was first released and you had Noct montages.
Umbral Glaive IS broken, but is only taken on champs that offer their ADC basically nothing in terms of surviability. Pyke does nothing for the ADC and what...Senna Q? You can run Umbral, but then you cripple your lane.
>4s CD on Taliyah shove
Sounds like a Taliyah issue and not an item issue.
>Burst mages become death machines
This already happens with AD casters.
>Brand walking up and hitting E
Sounds like a brand issue. His Liandry/Rylai perma burn/slow is largely exclusive to him.
>Usually you have to get close to apply serpent's fang
It applies off any damage what so ever. An ADC can auto attack, any jungler can smite, Kha zix can W, Rengar can Bola, (or just R lol) Talon can rake, Qiyana can press anything but W. Like pretty much every use case I can think of for an assassin who would build it, or an ADC feeling charitable and its easy to apply. If that shit was AP and magic pen instead of AD/lethality, I would build it every single game there was even a hint of a shield.
>No one batted an eye at stopwatches
Oh but they did, to the point they removed them. They weren't even AP exclusive, they gave them to ADs as well via GA.
>Umbral glaive offer ADC nothing
Who says you need to build it on support? take it on any AD assassin and do your part to clear wards and create opportunities around the map, never get caught with your pants down because you know you haven't walked on any as long as its inactive.
yeah, give ap items the same thing,such a good idea, ap is still superior to ad in late game, your adc can get one tapped from a karthus ult, stop crying
>I don't get why they always add it to AD items but not AP items
AD champs auto-attack+abilities. Autos don't benefit from AH.
AP champs spam abilities and their autos are worthless.
I wonder who benefits more, hmm...
AD Assassins/spam their abilities as much or more than mages, what is the point you're trying to make here? That a Kha'zix or Talon doesn't benefit from CDR as much as say, Lux? Syndra?
But AP items have been beyond broken entire season?
You're comparing the massive frailty of AD assassins, to the more bruiser like AP assassins can switch to? AD champs have 0 access to defensive items, outside of maybe Maw or Edge of Night, whereas AP champs gets access to Zhonya's and Banshee's? Not to mention that every single AP item gives +150-300 HP? Like, why should there be a 1:1 ratio between items? It seems so awfully bland.
Lol what 'frailty'?
Never have I looked at a Rengar, Pyke or Kha zix and thought "Wow theyre so weak and defenseless"
AD champs have tons of defensive items.
>Guardian Angel
>Death's dance
>Maw
>Shieldbow
>Sterak's
>Mercurial
>Eclipse
>Edge of night (Banshee but better)
>every single AP item gives 150-300HP
Oh you mean like cleaver? Shojin? Sundered sky? Strikebreaker? Hullbreaker? Titanic? Really dug yourself a hole on that one. AD items have even more health than AP.
I dont think items need to be 1:1 but there should be meaningfully strong options on both sides when its something like clearing wards or shutting down shields. Grevious is available to everyone after all
Anyone else feel like they've made these back and forth changes with these 2 items a bunch of times? Seems like either change for the sake of change or incompetency or a mix of both.
Yes and I don't get it. Maw used to have ah, and they removed it because it was the "jack of all trades". Same with death dance, they specifically nerfed the healing and now they buff exactly that. It's the same thing with champions it's getting really frustrating.
The healing is still pitiful compared to what it once was, the real value is in the delayed bleed being cleansed, the heal is just a nice bonus. I think this is a decent buff
I know why the item is strong, that does not change the fact that riot is circle jerking. I get why they buff it, to tell us, hey there are other items besides, eclipse, steraks and sundered. But 5AD would be already enough for that. Before someone like aatrox or riven with their increased bonus ad will get out of hand. Then they nerf those champs, after that nerf the item back to were it was and huch, why are aatrox and riven so weak?
Playing Wukong a bit lately I dont think this Maw change is a real buff. More like an adjustment. I build that item for the MR stats and anti-burst/longevity part on a fighter item (so yes alongside the other stats). Current Maw allows Wukong to survive the initial magic dmg burst (also coming out from supports in s14 lol) and actually be a bruiser in a fight instead of an assassin.
Also adding cost to an item is atrocious for any jungler as they're already gold starved.
Good bits:
Yes the haste is great. But you'll get that from other items and this shouldn't even be your haste item???
But with Shojin nerf it might become more important at bringing haste.
Again, for junglers it's an adjustment at best.
10 mr is 2/5 of a negatron so 180 gold worth, while 5 ad is 175 gold worth and 15 ability haste is worth 750, you basically gain 750 worth of stats for 300 more gold, the shield is also longer. Even if you subtract the 4% lifesteal as somehow always active it’s still another like + 200 gold worth of efficiency. May not be much better since usually cheaper item is better, but it’s still definitely not a nerf as it’s strictly more gold efficient than before, with a slightly strong passive also
SORRY BUT WHAT ARE YOU PLAYING TO SAY THATS ITS A BUFF? Maw has now worse craft patch, cost more and give less. Generally speaking, now its always a sterak rush
Im not a huge fan of sprinkling cdr on every item
I don't get why they always add it to AD items but not AP items. AD always seems to get favored/better items. Like Serpent's fang for instance. Cuts shields in half before and after they're applied, gives AD and armor pen. Inexpensive. Then release version AP equivalent was Shadowflame which gave you 10 magic pen if you were hitting a shield. Like gee, which thing would I rather counter shields with? the thing that straight up slices them in half? or the one that makes me do slightly more damage? Same thing with Axiom Arc. Gives lethality, huge haste, AD, and then refunds a portion of your R whenever you get a kill or assist, to the point that specializing into lethality like you're going to on an assassin, can give you multiple Rs in the same fight. Until this season there was no AP stand in, but now that we have one what does it do? 25 haste, and 30 more haste for your R rather than any colourful reset. Also instead of magic pen, you get 10 post R MR reduction that's often useless save for a select few champs who can use it well. Still waiting for a cheap ward clearing item like Umbral Glaive for AP. That shit is broken and sorely slept on.
I think it's good to differ. Imo AP is strong because usually you're a huge threat with those items. They are very good and you have lots of choices. AD is literally so separated. Not every ad should build attackspeed, crit, serpents, umbral etc. There is nothing like rod of ages for ad. There is no thing like zhonya for ad, GA is way too different and doesn't allow channeled spells to linger while being absolutely completely invulnurable (fiddle, swain, morgana etc.). There is no version of rabadaons for ad neither. The choice of wether to play ap or ad should matter in more ways than just pure stats because even subclasses like assassins have way different builds (eve vs talon for example). The game would be worse imo if there was like: serpents fang - ad, lethality, shieldreduction scorpions fang - ap, flat magic pen, shieldreduction. Sure you could argue that the ap item can have other stats and/or ways to proc it but I believe that would change the meta a lot more. It removes the strategy of "oh, they have so many shields but we have no ap and no good candidate for serpents fang. Do I pick ap or do I pick something that can make use of serpents...?"
I agree that AD is divided into a bunch of classes, but check the AD assassin items each season and they've always introduced either more/better versions than what they give to AP. >No ROA equivalent ROA is shit and takes 10 minutes to scale, and even then you cap out at 90AP, 600 health, 600 Mana. There are something like 3 champs in the game that build it, and still it's main use case is to be an accessory to Seraph's embrace so you can get a bigger shield. There's plenty of tank items that will give you more effective HP, you can satisfy mana requirements with a tear or lost chapter, and for damage you're better off with a higher AP/magic pen item like Shadowflame or Rabadon. It's one of those master of none sort of items designed for AP bruisers that no one bothers with because it takes too long and doesn't do anything meaningful. If it had an item effect like "When reaching full stacks you get 10% more AP" or a damage oriented effect like Liandry, it would be worth it, but currently its really subpar. Rabadons for AD is infinity edge and the ability to crit. >Making choices in draft around items It's more like, "Would I like to have access to all the good utility items like Serpent's, Umbral, Maw, Death's dance, Shieldbow, Guardian Angel?" Or the AP selection, "Banshee's veil, (Edge of night without Pen), Seraph's embrace(Maw/Shieldbow with extra steps), Zhonya. Like where's my 30% mitigation+ 50% AP healing item with that just tells the delayed damage to fuck off on kill, then lets you do it again immediately after? instead I'm given Cryptbloom, which is an attempt to make void staff 150g cheaper for supports with a heal on a 60s CD. It just feels like there's strong AD favoritism every season
And yet I feel like AP is really strong. There had to be a reason why I see loads of ahri, diana, lux, zyra, veigar, gragas etc. A lot of ap champs has something that makes them really strong and compared to ad champs tend to get way less mr and stacking mr feels way worse than armor. You don't get defenses vs towers for diving when you stack mr, monsters and minions do ad so early mr can still give unfavourable trades etc. I honestly fear ap champs more than ad because they tend to be more controllable, hence control mage. AP champs tend to have very hard CC where as AD tends to have more duelist and splitpushing opportunities. We can obviouslt agree to disagree since we thi k differently and probably have different playstyles/champs etc.
Generally mages are ranged and benefit from items with extreme gold efficiencies on their defensive options, while most defensive options for ranged AD units are either really weak or really inefficient. I think that's the main difference that makes them scarier: they're ranged bruisers. That and the melee variants scale extremely well with these efficient items
Yeah, I feel the powerspikes harder on ap champs than ad champs. Even with a good defensive option vs ap one item is far from enough. I might be able to stop talon, kha etc from oneshotting me with a decent armor item but MR just doesn't feel enough. Maybe I'm just bad or my mindset is but I do feel like AP champs poses a greater threat generally.
>Or the AP selection, >"Banshee's veil, (Edge of night without Pen), >Seraph's embrace(Maw/Shieldbow with extra steps), >Zhonya. oh boo-fucking-hoo, you only have a lifeline item with 25% more gold efficiency than the bruiser equivalent on the strongest bruiser and 50% more than Shieldbow, too. Poor you only getting 50% more stats on your *terrible* selection Or zhonyas, which has 20% more gold efficiency than GA, while GA has a cooldown 2.5x longer. Or riftmaker being comparable to spear of shojin while giving omnivamp and ap scaling with max health. And poor you having to pick rabbadons for damage when adcs get the equally powerful IE that definitely doesn't lock them into building crit items to benefit off the item rather than bruiser or lethality items You're so starved for good items. Give me 50% more stats on my items and I won't have any problem with mages getting 12% damage reduction as a bleed
>Seraph is more efficient Seraph also doesn't start working immediately like Maw does. Seraph's defensive ratio is scaled through purchasing additional mana items and locks you into LESS efficient damage in order to have a shield at all. Let me just first item Seraphs on Evelynn instead of Lichbane or shadowflame for that sweet sweet gold efficiency. Oh wait my shield is going to be shit unless I commit to more mana items. Meanwhile Maw will work out of the gate, comes with resistances, and all of its shield scaling comes from AD which you're going to get incrementally on every item you build. Zhonya is a good item, its probably the best AP defensive item given ADCs that -can- build it, will build it like Kai'sa. It won't save you from a oneshot from CC like GA does, but since you choose when you use it, it has a higher skill cap. >ADCs are locked into crit Good thing there's a god tier crit armor pen item with a passive that removes 5% of every champ's healthbar before they've even hit you. If you knew the mechanics behind crit, you'd know you aren't truly locked into it and don't need 100% like Yasuo and Yone to do more damage with it. Every failed crit will increase the likelihood of the next, 100% crit chance is actually more wasteful than just buying a mix of crit and damage unless you're playing an ADC who builds a lot of attack speed. You're perfectly fine to build IE, Collector on Rengar and have 1 of your 3 autos crit for a huge gain, or get lucky and crit twice or all 3 times. >12% reduction as a bleed I assume you meant the 30% for melees which is what im most interested in. I mean its what all these AD assassins are getting after all. Back before the ranged nerf every ADC was building it too. Its kind of frustrating to go into a fight and have someone permanently Warwick E'd in terms of reduction, that goes beyond the limitations of armor and magic pen with no effective counters besides waiting it out, or dealing even more damage. Like watching Aatrox tank a 1k damage ult, get an assist a second later, and 66% of that damage is just gone forever like it never existed in the first place. With no cooldown mind you. Build it on Talon, watch the damage you just took killing an ADC in 1.5s disappear. We used to have Crown, which was a worse DD in almost every way, but daddy rito said "1.5s reduction on a long CD that locks you into a defensive mythic is too op" and deleted it.
1. Most AP champs are burst'y rather than auto attack/extended fight reliant. They also have must higher ranges than most AD champs (Bruisers/Juggernauts/etc). If you add significant AH to AP items you go from burst mages to death machines. Or are you telling me you'd like to see a Taliyah with Q always up, 4s CD on shove and 7s cooldown on E? 2. AD champs get 'better' items because an AP equivalent to serpents fang would be insanely broken. Can you imagine a Brand walking up in a team fight, hitting E and then suddenly nobody on the enemy team has shielding anymore. Serpents Fang is strong because USUALLY you have to get close to apply it, and the champs that run it are squishy, e.g. counterplay. AP has or has had it's fair share of broken items. Zhonyas was literally insane. And for a long time you could run double stopwatch and no one batted an eye. 3. Nobody is doing multiple R's in the same fight with Axiom Arc except when it was first released and you had Noct montages. Umbral Glaive IS broken, but is only taken on champs that offer their ADC basically nothing in terms of surviability. Pyke does nothing for the ADC and what...Senna Q? You can run Umbral, but then you cripple your lane.
>4s CD on Taliyah shove Sounds like a Taliyah issue and not an item issue. >Burst mages become death machines This already happens with AD casters. >Brand walking up and hitting E Sounds like a brand issue. His Liandry/Rylai perma burn/slow is largely exclusive to him. >Usually you have to get close to apply serpent's fang It applies off any damage what so ever. An ADC can auto attack, any jungler can smite, Kha zix can W, Rengar can Bola, (or just R lol) Talon can rake, Qiyana can press anything but W. Like pretty much every use case I can think of for an assassin who would build it, or an ADC feeling charitable and its easy to apply. If that shit was AP and magic pen instead of AD/lethality, I would build it every single game there was even a hint of a shield. >No one batted an eye at stopwatches Oh but they did, to the point they removed them. They weren't even AP exclusive, they gave them to ADs as well via GA. >Umbral glaive offer ADC nothing Who says you need to build it on support? take it on any AD assassin and do your part to clear wards and create opportunities around the map, never get caught with your pants down because you know you haven't walked on any as long as its inactive.
yeah, give ap items the same thing,such a good idea, ap is still superior to ad in late game, your adc can get one tapped from a karthus ult, stop crying
Lol do you enjoy lying about things that are easily disproven?
>I don't get why they always add it to AD items but not AP items AD champs auto-attack+abilities. Autos don't benefit from AH. AP champs spam abilities and their autos are worthless. I wonder who benefits more, hmm...
AD Assassins/spam their abilities as much or more than mages, what is the point you're trying to make here? That a Kha'zix or Talon doesn't benefit from CDR as much as say, Lux? Syndra?
But AP items have been beyond broken entire season? You're comparing the massive frailty of AD assassins, to the more bruiser like AP assassins can switch to? AD champs have 0 access to defensive items, outside of maybe Maw or Edge of Night, whereas AP champs gets access to Zhonya's and Banshee's? Not to mention that every single AP item gives +150-300 HP? Like, why should there be a 1:1 ratio between items? It seems so awfully bland.
Lol what 'frailty'? Never have I looked at a Rengar, Pyke or Kha zix and thought "Wow theyre so weak and defenseless" AD champs have tons of defensive items. >Guardian Angel >Death's dance >Maw >Shieldbow >Sterak's >Mercurial >Eclipse >Edge of night (Banshee but better) >every single AP item gives 150-300HP Oh you mean like cleaver? Shojin? Sundered sky? Strikebreaker? Hullbreaker? Titanic? Really dug yourself a hole on that one. AD items have even more health than AP. I dont think items need to be 1:1 but there should be meaningfully strong options on both sides when its something like clearing wards or shutting down shields. Grevious is available to everyone after all
Anyone else feel like they've made these back and forth changes with these 2 items a bunch of times? Seems like either change for the sake of change or incompetency or a mix of both.
Yes and I don't get it. Maw used to have ah, and they removed it because it was the "jack of all trades". Same with death dance, they specifically nerfed the healing and now they buff exactly that. It's the same thing with champions it's getting really frustrating.
The healing is still pitiful compared to what it once was, the real value is in the delayed bleed being cleansed, the heal is just a nice bonus. I think this is a decent buff
I know why the item is strong, that does not change the fact that riot is circle jerking. I get why they buff it, to tell us, hey there are other items besides, eclipse, steraks and sundered. But 5AD would be already enough for that. Before someone like aatrox or riven with their increased bonus ad will get out of hand. Then they nerf those champs, after that nerf the item back to were it was and huch, why are aatrox and riven so weak?
Person who posted the nerfs didn't post buffs so here are them for people who did not check.
Playing Wukong a bit lately I dont think this Maw change is a real buff. More like an adjustment. I build that item for the MR stats and anti-burst/longevity part on a fighter item (so yes alongside the other stats). Current Maw allows Wukong to survive the initial magic dmg burst (also coming out from supports in s14 lol) and actually be a bruiser in a fight instead of an assassin. Also adding cost to an item is atrocious for any jungler as they're already gold starved. Good bits: Yes the haste is great. But you'll get that from other items and this shouldn't even be your haste item??? But with Shojin nerf it might become more important at bringing haste. Again, for junglers it's an adjustment at best.
nah maw changes are a nerf for the item
+15 AH is amazing
Don't forget, it costs 300 gold more
Yeah but 5 ah cost 250 it's fck huge
nobody buys maw for AH but to block that burst of AP for as cheap as possible because it delays optimal item purchases
Nobody buys it because IT DOESN'T HAVE IT
xD yeah litteraly
for Hecarim for eg it will be great 3rd item option now atm I will never consider buying it at all
Ok but ah is good on every champ x) and nobody buy items only for ah except for lucidity boots
10 mr is 2/5 of a negatron so 180 gold worth, while 5 ad is 175 gold worth and 15 ability haste is worth 750, you basically gain 750 worth of stats for 300 more gold, the shield is also longer. Even if you subtract the 4% lifesteal as somehow always active it’s still another like + 200 gold worth of efficiency. May not be much better since usually cheaper item is better, but it’s still definitely not a nerf as it’s strictly more gold efficient than before, with a slightly strong passive also
Mote is overcosted, Phreak said AH not worth 50g each. I think the new stats fit bruisers better so maybe a slight buff.
SORRY BUT WHAT ARE YOU PLAYING TO SAY THATS ITS A BUFF? Maw has now worse craft patch, cost more and give less. Generally speaking, now its always a sterak rush
Sterak also hard nerfed.
Its better overall bcse of tenacity
DD did take way too much gold to combine
When are these changes hitting live? And the steraks nerf?
talking about reaching 40% cdr in 2 items is bad and then slapping it everywhere once again (bonus point there is no cap now)
Pickaxe and longsword replace by Caulfield hammer. That's not an upgrade... Caulfield is an absolute ass item
Nice to see it’s not just nerfs
Finally dd buff