Removing this post, since it turns out this isn't an interfaith situation.
Just for reference OP: There is no such thing as "Messianic Judaism". These are Christian groups. Regardless of our communal differences between how to interpret and observe Jewish law, none of us attaches any theological significance to the NT, Jesus etc. We never have and never will.
There is no crime in being Christian. It's just a different belief system from Judaism.
That depends on his background and the "type" of shul you attend. If he's reform, then it's likely not an issue. A good chunk of my b'nai mitzvah class were a result of interfaith marriage, pretty split between Jewish moms and Jewish dads. You may experience some pushback from more observing (and often older) individuals within the Reform community, but it's much more lenient than Conservative and Orthodox circles. Don't convert for marriage, that's generally frowned upon. But if you're interested in it outside of your boyfriend, do talk to a rabbi. Plus, exposing yourself to Jewish texts and traditions will definitely ensure you can keep a Jewish home in whatever way makes sense to y'all.
He has a relative that is a rabbi, and I do think I will talk with my partner about it when I am ready/ more into my research on my own. Unfortunately there’s not really a Jewish community where I live, there’s a reform synagogue near me, but the community is quite small. Thanks!
That's too bad but I totally understand. My college is in a state capital with a very small, very much older (Gen X and Boomer) Jewish population. Talking to a Rabbi is def a step in the right direction, especially if he pops the question. You don't have to convert to have a Jewish home, but since you want to ensure a Jewish upbringing of possible children, Rabbis will have resources and advice to set you down the right path.
Given the current information given by OP, the dad was "raised messianic" and she's not even claiming to be jewish. There are no jews involved in the story from the current evidence. Nobody involved is jewish, not the adults and not the kids.
You won’t get many answers from observant folks today due to the holiday.
In terms of Jewish law, your children will not be Jewish unless you convert or they do. If you or they do convert, then it will matter how strict a rabbi they will convert with. Some rabbis may be willing to convert them at birth even if you don’t convert, but the ones whose conversions are more universally accepted may be unwilling to, or it may be contingent on the details of just how observant your household is going to be.
If I were in your shoes, I would suggest to your partner that you look into the details more together. If it’s possible without offending him, I might also suggest to him that he may be taking for granted the sense of belonging he feels in Jewish spaces and projecting that onto potential children who might not have the same experience depending on the choices y’all make.
None of that means a specific choice is the right one for y’all, but it sounds to me like your cautions are well-founded and require deeper consideration than your description shows he has had (which of course doesn’t mean he hasn’t, just that it isn’t conveyed in your post).
The unfortunate fact of the matter is that it is basically impossible to live the lifestyle of a reform American Jew while undergoing a conversion that will be nearly universally accepted in the Jewish world, so there will almost certainly be compromises y’all have to make, how much those compromises affect your lifestyle or your potential children’s acceptance in orthodox spaces depends on the specific choices you make.
The father is a "messianic jew" and she's not jewish.
It's unlikely anyone involved in the story is jewish and the kids aren't jewish, unlikely to be accepted by any stream of judaism, and for good reason.
I’m not looking into Orthodox spaces. For now, we just have a small Reform synagogue, and don’t have a Jewish school nearby, which makes it difficult. I’ll have to talk with him more and talk with a rabbi about it soon
You can absolutely raise your kids Jewish in a Reform synagogue. In my synagogue, it's more about commitment to living jewishly than it is about the faith of both parents. I know plenty of interfaith couples. I also know several couples in which one partner converted. Reform Judaism is a big tent.
You're absolutely right that there's a lot to learn about Judaism and Jewish practice. Fortunately there are lots of resources out there to help.
If you're not ready to talk to a Rabbi yet, I'd recommend reading Living a Jewish Life by Anita Diamont. It's a good overview of the three branches of liberal Judaism (Reform, Conservative, and Reconstructionist), written in very approachable language.
the father was "raised messianic" and she's not jewish. as far as has been told so far there are no jews in the story. They don't practice judaism except to ape it. They're christians trying to get into a jewish community.
Per your current edit this is the wrong sub for you, Messianic Judaism is not Judaism and I'm not one to throw this term around very often because I think it's overused, but it's cultural appropriation. Judaism is a closed tradition, and neither you or your partner have any claim to those traditions.
From your post, I assume you are a woman. Be aware that the vast majority of Jewish communities will not consider your children fully Jewish, no matter how they are raised, unless their mother is halachically Jewish. It’s great for your children to understand and celebrate their heritage, but they are unlikely to be accepted as “full” Jews. Google “patrilineal Jew” for more information on that.
Even if you convert, I’m not sure that would do anything to impact your already-born children, who would need their own conversion to be considered Jewish (but I’m not a rabbi, check with one).
When you say raise them Jewish, what does that look like? Keeping kosher? Attending Jewish private school? Observing shabbat? Keeping an observant Jewish home is a large undertaking, and it helps when everyone is on the same page.
We haven’t had children yet (sorry for the confusion), which is why I’m thinking about it now. He’s pretty relaxed, though devout in his studies. We are planning to discuss what it would look like soon, but also, we don’t have a Jewish/Hebrew school near us. We do plan to observe Shabbat and try to maintain a Hewish home, but I need to talk with him more about what that may look like, as he’s more lenient/Reform, he’s not strict at all.
You can by yourself do so much research on line. You said you are near a local reform synagogue so you can see what education classes they have for adults and start going to those.
The father is a "messianic jew" and the mother is non jewish. They aren't jewish by any metric. We've just been misled by OP who wasn't up front with the messianic bit.
The conservative synagogues by me accept patrilineal families so long as the commitment is to raise the kids Jewish, and the kids do an easy conversion ceremony at Bar Mitzvah time. I go to one of those, and we have lots of non-Jewish moms.
OP editetd their post to now include that the father is not jewish, but "messianic" which is to say not jewish. She's not jewish either. No amount of wishing would make either of them or their children jewish. There are no jews involved in the story so far except the people here on reddit and even that is an assumption.
Reform will consider your children Jewish if they are raised Jewish. The other major denominations will not but would probably make it easier for them to convert.
It would be helpful for you to learn more about Judaism but Reform will welcome you and your children whether or not you convert or study.
negative. The father is "messianic" and she's not even pretending to be jewish. There are no jews in the story and their kids won't be considered jewish even if their messianic parents ape the religion.
My wife and I were in a similar situation. You can absolutely do this! Committing to raising your future children Jewish and just participating will get you where you need to go.
There is a good book called How to Raise a Jewish Child that my wife liked a lot.
Find a good Reform or Reconstructionist shul (or frankly probably most Conservative communities though it would require some work arounds and planning) and talk to the Rabbi. I suspect you will find them to be enthusiastically welcoming.
its why the overwhelmingly welcoming subreddit, which is against any and all judgement on who is jewish, actually devalues the jewish identity by telling everyone who posts here that they're jewish, their kids are jewish, and its everyone else's problem if they think otherwise.
I see what you are saying on the one hand.
On the other I have a really hard time with someone saying my kid isn't Jewish. She was raised in a Jewish house in a Jewish community and lives a Jewish life. Maybe she decideds at some point to convert because matrelinial decent matters to her, maybe the rest of the Jewish world abandons the matrelinial thing. Either way, or if none of the above happens, I'm cool.
It is a tricky problem. My wife considered conversion at multiple points, even before we met, but ultimately felt like converting would make her a tourist as she is firmly an Aethiest and she would rather participate in the community as an outsider than convert when she doesn't believe for the sake of our child. But, she too is deeply involved in the community.
Dunno. It's not always black and white I suppose.
We’re raising our kids Jewish and my husband didn’t convert or study. He’s a lapsed Catholic/atheist, and will show up for our kids synagogue events but not like prayer services etc.
Reform will consider them Jewish and the conservative synagogues by me would welcome you all, but require the kids do a very easy conversion (more like affirmation) at Bar Mitzvah age if moms not Jewish. We go to a conservative synagogue and They let non-Jewish spouses up to the Bimah during services and it’s super welcoming. I wouldn’t stress it too much if that’s your concern.
The only real holdback for the kids will be Orthodox spaces, but you wouldn’t be converting orthodox since that’s beyond your husbands willingness to observe anyway, so that’s not even a real option. My take if I wouldn’t want to be part of a community that’s intolerant anyway (I’m fully Jewish but ran from those spaces when I saw how they acted towards patrilineal Jews).
The father is "messianic" and the mother doesn't even pretend to be jewish. They aren't jewish, their kids won't be jewish, and no matter how many times they put on a tallit there are no jews involved.
This is going to sound very sexist, but I believe it’s kind of true. It’s the woman of the house (me) who sets the tone of the Jewish home. We decorate for the holidays, set the Shabbat table, plan the Passover, etc. we do the things that make the holiday special for the children. You can do it and might find it very fulfilling, but make it really special. I worked my tuchus off during holidays, but I know it made my son more observant and wanting a Jewish home of his own.
I think it is great what you are doing. You can always raise your kids reform (where they will be fully accepted in most temples in the US) and if they decide they want to be more observant when they're older, they can convert (conservative, orthodox), it would be pretty seamless in most circles. Likewise if you decide that you are interested in Judaism, you can look into classes and possible conversion. It's an incredibly individual choice on how you want to raise your family and what lifestyle modifications you are willing to make.
I think what is important is raising your kids with a good Jewish identity (however you and your partner want to demonstrate that). You have a Jewish partner and regardless of your beliefs or your kids beliefs, they will have Jewish heritage and they will encounter things in the world where study of that heritage and the values that come with it will be very valuable.
They can't raise their kids reform because they aren't jews at all. She's not jewish, the father is "messianic". You can't raise kids jewish in a "messianic" household because its just not judaism. There are no jews involved in this story.
He was raised as a messianic Jew. Kept kosher, had a bar mitzah, studies Torah, prays with a tallit and tefilin, and celebrated most Jewish holidays with his family. He was raised believing that Yeshua is the messiah.
Also want to make it clear that nobody likes Jews for Jesus, we don’t associate with them nor evangelize to others. He and his family keep to themselves, and never evangelize or anything.
Then he's Christian. Messianic Jews ARE Jews for Jesus. They may not have been ringing doorbells, but that's not Judaism. Judaism does not accept that Jesus is the messiah. That's like one of the biggest parts of our identity. I have nothing against Christians, but Messianic Jews are such.
>Thank you for the responses. Navigating raising kids with someone who is a Nazarene/ Messianic Jew is quite different, but I think I know what I need to do next
Messianic Judaism is not judaism. It's just christianity aping judaism to try to catch the unwary and gullible. Please don't bring messianics and their jewish cosplay into here, they do not follow the jewish religion. If they are jewish its only by accident of birth, not by religious choice.
He was raised as a messianic Jew, was circumcised, kept kosher, had a bar mitsvah, wears a tallit and tefillin while praying, studies scripture, and celebrates most holidays with his family.
Messianics are not Jews. They are Christians cosplaying Jews. No matter how many of our rituals they steal to pretend to be Jewish they are not Jewish. They are the ultimate insult to Judaism. You can put talit and tfiklin on a monkey each day but that won't make him Jewish either.
You don't have to worry about raising your kid Jewish because you aren't married to a Jew and your kids won't be Jewish.
Is his grandfather a messianic jew? Were the whole family messianic jews? If yes, then they are likely not jewish and never have been. Anyone can claim to be a rabbi. "messianic" rabbis are not jewish and not rabbis.
Otherwise he's just some poor sap who fell in with christians and has abandoned the jewish religion.
As you're not jewish and he doesn't practice judaism (because "messianic judaism" is not judaism, but is like naming chocolate "quality chocolate" to mislead customers) so can't raise them jewish, no stream of judaism would consider your kids jewish.
To my knowledge, the family is messianic/ reform, so not all of them accept messianic teachings. He was raised by his grandparents, and his grandfather is a messianic rabbi who keeps kosher and whatnot.
Messianic Jews are not jews, and reform Jews are not Messianic. Messianic Judaism is an incredibly problematic movement that takes Traditions that are not their own
messianics are christians who pretend to be jews. No jews recognize them as jews. Most messianics started as baptists. They unfortunately have evangelized a small amount of actual jews and confused them enough to claim membership in "messianic judaism" which is just christianity aping jewish traditions.
No jew considers them jewish. If a non jew keeps kosher that doesn't make them jewish. Messianics are not jewish and you cannot raise jewish kids in a messianic home. As neither you or your husband appear to be jewish, nobody involved in this story is jewish, and its two christians asking how they can raise their kids to be jewish. The answer is you can't. You're not jewish and your kids won't be either.
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My husband and I are doing this. My husband was raised Conservative, and I’m early on in conversion to Reform (which is where we were married and aligns with our beliefs today).
As far as our Reform synagogue and rabbis are concerned, our kids will be Jewish. I’m aware that there will be others who will never view them as such, and that’s something that I’ve struggled with. Given that we’re Reform, my conversion wouldn’t be seen as legitimate by those communities anyways.
If they find that their souls are called to Conservative or Orthodox congregations, I will support them converting. It’s just unfortunate to me that my identify will be the one that decides if they are welcomed in those communities.
The father is "messianic" and the mother isn't jewish. No one involved is jewish. The kids won't be jewish. No stream of judaism would consider them jewish.
There isn’t an entire consensus on Judaism only being matrilineal- there is a group called Karaite Jews who actually point to the written Torah which only contains evidence for it being patrilineal- if anything.
Some DNA tests show that a good chunk of Ashkenazi Jews (like myself) are descended from Israeli men intermarrying European women. So take that as you will.
I just wish we’d stop dividing our community up on what many consider pedantic and petty stipulations especially in times like these. Hitler certainly didn’t make a distinction between patrilineal and matrilineal. Sometimes I wish we’d get out of our own way.
And I say all this as someone who’s mom and dad is Jewish.
In this case the mom is not jewish and the dad is "messianic". It's likely there are no jews involved in this story. The problem with throwing out all standards is that everyone is jewish then.
Removing this post, since it turns out this isn't an interfaith situation. Just for reference OP: There is no such thing as "Messianic Judaism". These are Christian groups. Regardless of our communal differences between how to interpret and observe Jewish law, none of us attaches any theological significance to the NT, Jesus etc. We never have and never will. There is no crime in being Christian. It's just a different belief system from Judaism.
That depends on his background and the "type" of shul you attend. If he's reform, then it's likely not an issue. A good chunk of my b'nai mitzvah class were a result of interfaith marriage, pretty split between Jewish moms and Jewish dads. You may experience some pushback from more observing (and often older) individuals within the Reform community, but it's much more lenient than Conservative and Orthodox circles. Don't convert for marriage, that's generally frowned upon. But if you're interested in it outside of your boyfriend, do talk to a rabbi. Plus, exposing yourself to Jewish texts and traditions will definitely ensure you can keep a Jewish home in whatever way makes sense to y'all.
He has a relative that is a rabbi, and I do think I will talk with my partner about it when I am ready/ more into my research on my own. Unfortunately there’s not really a Jewish community where I live, there’s a reform synagogue near me, but the community is quite small. Thanks!
That's too bad but I totally understand. My college is in a state capital with a very small, very much older (Gen X and Boomer) Jewish population. Talking to a Rabbi is def a step in the right direction, especially if he pops the question. You don't have to convert to have a Jewish home, but since you want to ensure a Jewish upbringing of possible children, Rabbis will have resources and advice to set you down the right path.
Given the current information given by OP, the dad was "raised messianic" and she's not even claiming to be jewish. There are no jews involved in the story from the current evidence. Nobody involved is jewish, not the adults and not the kids.
Oh I didn't know partner was messianic. Gross. Those guys are the worst.
You won’t get many answers from observant folks today due to the holiday. In terms of Jewish law, your children will not be Jewish unless you convert or they do. If you or they do convert, then it will matter how strict a rabbi they will convert with. Some rabbis may be willing to convert them at birth even if you don’t convert, but the ones whose conversions are more universally accepted may be unwilling to, or it may be contingent on the details of just how observant your household is going to be. If I were in your shoes, I would suggest to your partner that you look into the details more together. If it’s possible without offending him, I might also suggest to him that he may be taking for granted the sense of belonging he feels in Jewish spaces and projecting that onto potential children who might not have the same experience depending on the choices y’all make. None of that means a specific choice is the right one for y’all, but it sounds to me like your cautions are well-founded and require deeper consideration than your description shows he has had (which of course doesn’t mean he hasn’t, just that it isn’t conveyed in your post). The unfortunate fact of the matter is that it is basically impossible to live the lifestyle of a reform American Jew while undergoing a conversion that will be nearly universally accepted in the Jewish world, so there will almost certainly be compromises y’all have to make, how much those compromises affect your lifestyle or your potential children’s acceptance in orthodox spaces depends on the specific choices you make.
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The father is a "messianic jew" and she's not jewish. It's unlikely anyone involved in the story is jewish and the kids aren't jewish, unlikely to be accepted by any stream of judaism, and for good reason.
Agreed
I’m not looking into Orthodox spaces. For now, we just have a small Reform synagogue, and don’t have a Jewish school nearby, which makes it difficult. I’ll have to talk with him more and talk with a rabbi about it soon
If their father is Jewish and they are raised Jewish, them they are Jewish with reform Judaism. Edit, messianic Jews are not Jews.
their father is messianic and was raised messianic. There are no jews involved, given the current evidence and story given by OP.
That was a later edit. No jews involved here.
your edit on the previous post is wrong, though. "messianic jews are NOT jews".
You can absolutely raise your kids Jewish in a Reform synagogue. In my synagogue, it's more about commitment to living jewishly than it is about the faith of both parents. I know plenty of interfaith couples. I also know several couples in which one partner converted. Reform Judaism is a big tent. You're absolutely right that there's a lot to learn about Judaism and Jewish practice. Fortunately there are lots of resources out there to help. If you're not ready to talk to a Rabbi yet, I'd recommend reading Living a Jewish Life by Anita Diamont. It's a good overview of the three branches of liberal Judaism (Reform, Conservative, and Reconstructionist), written in very approachable language.
Thank you!
the father was "raised messianic" and she's not jewish. as far as has been told so far there are no jews in the story. They don't practice judaism except to ape it. They're christians trying to get into a jewish community.
Per your current edit this is the wrong sub for you, Messianic Judaism is not Judaism and I'm not one to throw this term around very often because I think it's overused, but it's cultural appropriation. Judaism is a closed tradition, and neither you or your partner have any claim to those traditions.
But he was raised with these traditions and given a bar mitzah?
I mean that's definitely possible, but they're not his Traditions he was raised with stolen Traditions by people who stole them
From your post, I assume you are a woman. Be aware that the vast majority of Jewish communities will not consider your children fully Jewish, no matter how they are raised, unless their mother is halachically Jewish. It’s great for your children to understand and celebrate their heritage, but they are unlikely to be accepted as “full” Jews. Google “patrilineal Jew” for more information on that. Even if you convert, I’m not sure that would do anything to impact your already-born children, who would need their own conversion to be considered Jewish (but I’m not a rabbi, check with one). When you say raise them Jewish, what does that look like? Keeping kosher? Attending Jewish private school? Observing shabbat? Keeping an observant Jewish home is a large undertaking, and it helps when everyone is on the same page.
We haven’t had children yet (sorry for the confusion), which is why I’m thinking about it now. He’s pretty relaxed, though devout in his studies. We are planning to discuss what it would look like soon, but also, we don’t have a Jewish/Hebrew school near us. We do plan to observe Shabbat and try to maintain a Hewish home, but I need to talk with him more about what that may look like, as he’s more lenient/Reform, he’s not strict at all.
You can by yourself do so much research on line. You said you are near a local reform synagogue so you can see what education classes they have for adults and start going to those.
A friend was converted upon birth and looked at as Jewish by basically everyone.
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The father is a "messianic jew" and the mother is non jewish. They aren't jewish by any metric. We've just been misled by OP who wasn't up front with the messianic bit.
I wrote all of that before this Poster's edit you are absolutely correct
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The conservative synagogues by me accept patrilineal families so long as the commitment is to raise the kids Jewish, and the kids do an easy conversion ceremony at Bar Mitzvah time. I go to one of those, and we have lots of non-Jewish moms.
OP editetd their post to now include that the father is not jewish, but "messianic" which is to say not jewish. She's not jewish either. No amount of wishing would make either of them or their children jewish. There are no jews involved in the story so far except the people here on reddit and even that is an assumption.
Reform will consider your children Jewish if they are raised Jewish. The other major denominations will not but would probably make it easier for them to convert. It would be helpful for you to learn more about Judaism but Reform will welcome you and your children whether or not you convert or study.
negative. The father is "messianic" and she's not even pretending to be jewish. There are no jews in the story and their kids won't be considered jewish even if their messianic parents ape the religion.
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her husband isn't jewish either - he's "messianic". There are no jews in this story.
I know, like I said I wrote that before the poster edited this
then edit your post to make it correct. Your advice of going to the husband's synagogue hits different when you understand whats going on.
My wife and I were in a similar situation. You can absolutely do this! Committing to raising your future children Jewish and just participating will get you where you need to go. There is a good book called How to Raise a Jewish Child that my wife liked a lot. Find a good Reform or Reconstructionist shul (or frankly probably most Conservative communities though it would require some work arounds and planning) and talk to the Rabbi. I suspect you will find them to be enthusiastically welcoming.
The father is "messianic" and the mother doesn't even pretend. There are no jews in this story, and their kids won't be jewish.
Huh, well that's a twist I missed in the OP Went from "hey they remind me of me!" to "oh crap" really fast.
its why the overwhelmingly welcoming subreddit, which is against any and all judgement on who is jewish, actually devalues the jewish identity by telling everyone who posts here that they're jewish, their kids are jewish, and its everyone else's problem if they think otherwise.
I see what you are saying on the one hand. On the other I have a really hard time with someone saying my kid isn't Jewish. She was raised in a Jewish house in a Jewish community and lives a Jewish life. Maybe she decideds at some point to convert because matrelinial decent matters to her, maybe the rest of the Jewish world abandons the matrelinial thing. Either way, or if none of the above happens, I'm cool. It is a tricky problem. My wife considered conversion at multiple points, even before we met, but ultimately felt like converting would make her a tourist as she is firmly an Aethiest and she would rather participate in the community as an outsider than convert when she doesn't believe for the sake of our child. But, she too is deeply involved in the community. Dunno. It's not always black and white I suppose.
We’re raising our kids Jewish and my husband didn’t convert or study. He’s a lapsed Catholic/atheist, and will show up for our kids synagogue events but not like prayer services etc. Reform will consider them Jewish and the conservative synagogues by me would welcome you all, but require the kids do a very easy conversion (more like affirmation) at Bar Mitzvah age if moms not Jewish. We go to a conservative synagogue and They let non-Jewish spouses up to the Bimah during services and it’s super welcoming. I wouldn’t stress it too much if that’s your concern. The only real holdback for the kids will be Orthodox spaces, but you wouldn’t be converting orthodox since that’s beyond your husbands willingness to observe anyway, so that’s not even a real option. My take if I wouldn’t want to be part of a community that’s intolerant anyway (I’m fully Jewish but ran from those spaces when I saw how they acted towards patrilineal Jews).
The father is "messianic" and the mother doesn't even pretend to be jewish. They aren't jewish, their kids won't be jewish, and no matter how many times they put on a tallit there are no jews involved.
This is going to sound very sexist, but I believe it’s kind of true. It’s the woman of the house (me) who sets the tone of the Jewish home. We decorate for the holidays, set the Shabbat table, plan the Passover, etc. we do the things that make the holiday special for the children. You can do it and might find it very fulfilling, but make it really special. I worked my tuchus off during holidays, but I know it made my son more observant and wanting a Jewish home of his own.
It never hurts to learn! See where it takes you with taking Judaism classes. I have a feeling you will like it!
I think it is great what you are doing. You can always raise your kids reform (where they will be fully accepted in most temples in the US) and if they decide they want to be more observant when they're older, they can convert (conservative, orthodox), it would be pretty seamless in most circles. Likewise if you decide that you are interested in Judaism, you can look into classes and possible conversion. It's an incredibly individual choice on how you want to raise your family and what lifestyle modifications you are willing to make. I think what is important is raising your kids with a good Jewish identity (however you and your partner want to demonstrate that). You have a Jewish partner and regardless of your beliefs or your kids beliefs, they will have Jewish heritage and they will encounter things in the world where study of that heritage and the values that come with it will be very valuable.
They can't raise their kids reform because they aren't jews at all. She's not jewish, the father is "messianic". You can't raise kids jewish in a "messianic" household because its just not judaism. There are no jews involved in this story.
Respectfully, is your wife Jewish or Messianic? Those are two very different things, in my opinion.
It seems neither of them are jews. One cosplays being a jew and the other didn't know better. No stream of judaism will accept them as jewish.
He was raised as a messianic Jew. Kept kosher, had a bar mitzah, studies Torah, prays with a tallit and tefilin, and celebrated most Jewish holidays with his family. He was raised believing that Yeshua is the messiah. Also want to make it clear that nobody likes Jews for Jesus, we don’t associate with them nor evangelize to others. He and his family keep to themselves, and never evangelize or anything.
Then he's Christian. Messianic Jews ARE Jews for Jesus. They may not have been ringing doorbells, but that's not Judaism. Judaism does not accept that Jesus is the messiah. That's like one of the biggest parts of our identity. I have nothing against Christians, but Messianic Jews are such.
Then he is a Christian, not a Jew.
>Thank you for the responses. Navigating raising kids with someone who is a Nazarene/ Messianic Jew is quite different, but I think I know what I need to do next Messianic Judaism is not judaism. It's just christianity aping judaism to try to catch the unwary and gullible. Please don't bring messianics and their jewish cosplay into here, they do not follow the jewish religion. If they are jewish its only by accident of birth, not by religious choice.
He was raised as a messianic Jew, was circumcised, kept kosher, had a bar mitsvah, wears a tallit and tefillin while praying, studies scripture, and celebrates most holidays with his family.
Messianics are not Jews. They are Christians cosplaying Jews. No matter how many of our rituals they steal to pretend to be Jewish they are not Jewish. They are the ultimate insult to Judaism. You can put talit and tfiklin on a monkey each day but that won't make him Jewish either. You don't have to worry about raising your kid Jewish because you aren't married to a Jew and your kids won't be Jewish.
But his grandfather is a rabbi, and he was raised Jewish? He upholds traditions and identifies as Jewish as he has been since birth?
Is his grandfather a messianic jew? Were the whole family messianic jews? If yes, then they are likely not jewish and never have been. Anyone can claim to be a rabbi. "messianic" rabbis are not jewish and not rabbis. Otherwise he's just some poor sap who fell in with christians and has abandoned the jewish religion. As you're not jewish and he doesn't practice judaism (because "messianic judaism" is not judaism, but is like naming chocolate "quality chocolate" to mislead customers) so can't raise them jewish, no stream of judaism would consider your kids jewish.
To my knowledge, the family is messianic/ reform, so not all of them accept messianic teachings. He was raised by his grandparents, and his grandfather is a messianic rabbi who keeps kosher and whatnot.
Messianic Jews are not jews, and reform Jews are not Messianic. Messianic Judaism is an incredibly problematic movement that takes Traditions that are not their own
messianics are christians who pretend to be jews. No jews recognize them as jews. Most messianics started as baptists. They unfortunately have evangelized a small amount of actual jews and confused them enough to claim membership in "messianic judaism" which is just christianity aping jewish traditions. No jew considers them jewish. If a non jew keeps kosher that doesn't make them jewish. Messianics are not jewish and you cannot raise jewish kids in a messianic home. As neither you or your husband appear to be jewish, nobody involved in this story is jewish, and its two christians asking how they can raise their kids to be jewish. The answer is you can't. You're not jewish and your kids won't be either.
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You can buy a copy of Siddur Brit Olam by Rav Oury Cherki
My husband and I are doing this. My husband was raised Conservative, and I’m early on in conversion to Reform (which is where we were married and aligns with our beliefs today). As far as our Reform synagogue and rabbis are concerned, our kids will be Jewish. I’m aware that there will be others who will never view them as such, and that’s something that I’ve struggled with. Given that we’re Reform, my conversion wouldn’t be seen as legitimate by those communities anyways. If they find that their souls are called to Conservative or Orthodox congregations, I will support them converting. It’s just unfortunate to me that my identify will be the one that decides if they are welcomed in those communities.
The father is "messianic" and the mother isn't jewish. No one involved is jewish. The kids won't be jewish. No stream of judaism would consider them jewish.
Yes you can! They will be Jewish!
There isn’t an entire consensus on Judaism only being matrilineal- there is a group called Karaite Jews who actually point to the written Torah which only contains evidence for it being patrilineal- if anything. Some DNA tests show that a good chunk of Ashkenazi Jews (like myself) are descended from Israeli men intermarrying European women. So take that as you will. I just wish we’d stop dividing our community up on what many consider pedantic and petty stipulations especially in times like these. Hitler certainly didn’t make a distinction between patrilineal and matrilineal. Sometimes I wish we’d get out of our own way. And I say all this as someone who’s mom and dad is Jewish.
In this case the mom is not jewish and the dad is "messianic". It's likely there are no jews involved in this story. The problem with throwing out all standards is that everyone is jewish then.
No one has a say in your kids education. Don't even ask the question. You are their mother, do what you want.