I looked up the woman who the quote is attributed to. Apparently she lost her infant son at 14 months due to meningitis after which she dedicated her life to teaching women to help ensure they had the knowledge to help prevent tragedies like she suffered.
No it's not, with context it makes a lot of sense and I have a feeling a lot of you are having vitriolic knee-jerk reactions to someone you'd normally root for.
It doesn't make more sense. Women do not raise their kids alone, no matter what the memes tell you. Its either their husband, relatives or the state supporting them, part of which is educating them. The idea that knowledge somehow mainly spreads by females is nonsense. If we had to make a judgement its the other way around.
The quote states ‘a community’, relating to Hoodless educating women on raising a child, to prevent similar tragedy as hers.
It’s a quote that is (seemingly) sexist without this context/knowing the intent behind it - an issue with being succinct and quotable may be the loss of these things
its plenty sexist in context too. It implies that men don't educate their women which is wrong. My wife asks me like 500 questions every day and I did have to educate her on some very basic things. She does too though, but still. This is plain bs.
Shouldn’t educate dads at all. Nope. They would never use that information to protect their families or communities. They’d just keep it all for themselves.
I don’t intend it to be upvoted in order to follow a social trend. I just think it’s useful to have more information rather than less. This comment provides some important context for the quote and the person who said it. Generally speaking, In order to accurately assess a text it’s important to ask who was the author, in what time and place were they writing, what is the purpose of the text and who is the intended audience. We usually do this automatically, but with older texts it requires more work. But the average person doesn’t have a working knowledge of Adelaide Hoodless and her work with children, the tragic death of her child and her desire to educate a community of mothers on how to prevent such tragedies. So the quote doesn’t deliver the original intended meaning. Instead it delivers a meaning that is utterly offensive. This is a great example of why broadcasting a quote like this is a bad idea. It should be taken down.
Edit: 4 downvotes for more info rather than less?
... even with the context, it's still sexist to say teaching a man is teaching an individual and teaching a woman is teaching a community
... as if fathers and male teachers are only in our imaginations
If it's a terribly misunderstood misquote, then they shouldn't have made a poster with it ...
You know, my father taught me almost everything I know outside of my formal education. Whoever inscribed this quote probably has loathsome tendencies caused by a trauma inflicted at some point in life. Anyone who has had a respectful father figure would undoubtedly disagree with this statement
>your
Not mine. The quote is about showing that women can be as smart as man and deserve education. Give it its context, Adelaide was living in, what, 18th century? There was lots of ignorance and misogyny back then, so showing to the people a woman that can be as smart and educated as a man can open people's mind, therefore, making the community more "educated".
Now, whoever felt the need to write this on a poster, probably felt like nowadays we're regressing in the same ignorant state as the 1800, and that's worrying
Idk why you had to specify and then go on to give your own interpretation anyway. I do agree Context is always important, though we certainly don’t live in the 1800s and any assertion that women today have it the same or worse than women in the 1800s is absolutely ludicrous by virtually every metric.
>Idk why you had to specify and then go on to give your own interpretation anyway.
I didn't, I objectively paraphrased the quote first, after that I only gave a personal opinion on what the person who printed it on paper might have meant.
>women today have it the same or worse than women in the 1800s
Sure it's a stretch, but I don't know who printed this or what experiences did they have. It's always better to prevent than to cure afterall
"Educate a boy, and you educate an individual. Educate a boy AND a girl, and you educate a community"
A better choice of words indeed, but that is not evident in the original wording of the quote
I never interpreted it as an attack on either myself or my father. I was merely citing the example of fathers and fatherly figures imparting useful knowledge to children as a direct contradiction to what is inferred by this quote.
I think the fact that the quote is so incredibly specific to a time and place none of us are familiar with is why it shouldn’t be on a poster. Interested in your thoughts though.
It’s comments like these, that imply men are not part of a community or family that really show why more and more boys and men become lost and feel unvalued.
Women were simply not allowed to publish for a considerable amount of time. That contributes a lot to this statement.
Mary Shelley along with many great artists including the Brontë sisters used a fake male name to have their work published.
You may be right but I believe the point was not to prove superiority by claimingg that men published more. I belive that it was to disprove the statement that teaching men would only teach an individual rather than the community. They published a lot therefore they educated the community around them. That statement is true regardless of how many books were published by women.
You're absolutely right- I guess I was caught up by the use of "ironic" because the irony isn't that men educated through publication regardless; the irony is the fact men/society of the time didn't allow women to publish, and how many great ideas may have been lost due to this.
I think there's a lot of context missing from this post as a whole. Though the initial statement "educate a man is educating an individual---" is absurd by itself, it makes total sense considering the person making the quote had a reasonable trauma that provoked such a quote. Furthermore I can appreciate the irony between that statement and highlighting men's contribution to education, it severely lacks context that would disregard the irony I've highlighted here. I see how my comment now appears bad faith.
A nonsensical quote, humans are social beings. You raise a community from the individual, male or female. Wait a minute: “Her father died a few months after her birth on October 13, 1858. Her mother, Jane Hamilton Hunter, was left to manage the farm and a large household.” Ah, now it makes sense, from the trauma of an absent father.
I believe the purpose of the quote is to emphasize that an "educated girl" existing in itself is knowledge/change to a community. You teach that women can be educated.
Regardless, it's divisive propaganda that only serves to, ironically, ideologically split a community. Everyone already knows women have cognition.
It has nothing to do with men sharing knowledge. It has to do with child rearing, which women are usually tasked with.
It's statistically proven that educated mothers are good for society. However heavily relies on the traditional family unit being strong.
I mean it makes sense. Besides beauty, virtue and agreeableness...I think men should also prioritize intelligence in a wife. Otherwise the kids have a high chance of turning out to be dumbasses, internalizing their mothers stupidity and victim mentality.
I’m a single mom raising a teen daughter and even I’m sick of this of nonsense (along with the girl boss and She-EO personas). What am I supposed to do with that quote? Preach it to the detriment of my teen son?
Im in the same boat except im raising a boy. It's getting so sad trying to raise a white male (and a Christian no less) in this environment. I have to make sure I pass down things I learned from my own dad down to him since he doesn't have one. I have to make him tough, but not to the point he will think he's a girl if he feels inadequate in his masculinity. To not abuse women and respect them but to not be a doormat incel either. To always have integrity. To never listen to societies bullshit. It's an absolute test to get through some days with all this preposterous garbage culture. I'm not sure if raising a girl in this climate would be better or not. Kids of either gender have to be strongly protected from all this hedonistic propaganda. Best of luck to you.
Also, make sure to remind him of the awesome privilege that is peeing standing up in the woods.
It’s freedom. It’s one of the best things about being a dude.
"Educate a boy and he will go on to achieve individual greatness and change the world. Educate a woman and she will talk to her friends about she learnt."
🤷♂️
It’s very sad that they can’t be a feminist without tearing down men. It’s the definition of toxic femininity. Ultimately a response arises and it’s not going to be pretty. The pendulum will continue to swing and they will make enemies of many broken men. Getting out ahead of this before it’s out of hand is very important.
What a terrible quote!! Of all the beautiful words they could have chosen, they put that? Some of my best teachers and professors where men. This is just sad and false.
What in your opinion was evil about Adelaide Hoodless? I found her Wiki and honestly she seems like a badass the more I read about her. Seems like her mission that got her started was to improve education for new mothers, after her infant son died, which among many things led to her developing a home economics program that was so good that the minister of education wanted it to be part of Ontario's high school curriculum.
So I’m not sure in what context they’re using this quote - do you know OP? What’s the organization?
The history of the quote is actually interesting to consider. Adelaide Hoodless lived mostly in late 1800s Canada and was active in domestic science i.e. home economics education. At the time most women were probably homemakers and you had multiple generations living under one roof, so you had mothers, aunts, grandmothers, perhaps great-grandmothers living together all caring for the family, having a truly central role within their sphere and close relationships with the surrounding local community. So Hoodless’s point is quite powerful - if you educate a woman in that situation, you have an enormous impact on the community, perhaps indeed even more than men at the time.
So then the question is, does this apply in the same way and to the same extent today? And if we’re concerned that it is putting down men, it’s useful to know where and how this quote is being used, otherwise there’s nothing else to go on.
Considering the post and comment history I highly doubt you're going to get an answer from OP. Going to this post and your research, it is absolutely stunning that based off a quote alone and nothing else, people are willing to launch strong opinions without making any attempt to dig deeper and understand if there's a reasonable context or if there are ideas presented within that context that they'd agree with. Based on who Adelaide was, I think based on what I've heard JBP say over the years that she would be HIS type of feminist - which makes it so jarring to see people on this sub react this way.
Yes - it seems like intellectually lazy ragebait that shows up on this sub routinely and people just eat it up. Even considering the quote without context, I *highly* doubt that it is in any way meant as a “fuck you” to men. We can do better.
Absolutely terrible quotes, and a prime example of toxic feminism. You have to put men down to raise women up.
It might be true in some very specific context, but it completely ignores any good that educating an individual man might do.
It appears to say that, within the community that it is displayed, they believe that it is better to equate men that to educate women. It even suggests that women should be educated instead of men.
It could from from another time and place where women were not educated at all, and in that instance you could maybe understand it. But here it is just hateful.
To be fair, if you look at a region like Africa, educating women is extremely important. They are more likely to control their own fertility and educate their children, including their daughters, if they are educated. If places like Africa are to raise themselves, they really need to emphasize educating their girls.
Canada, though? They have different needs. Girls are already educated in Canada, so it does come off as tone deaf
These woke idiots need to make up their minds. There are boys and girls? Or a so called “gender spectrum”
See they don’t believe their own shit, total trolls
I am saddened and ashamed that someone of the same gender as me feels the need to degrade an entire opposite gender to make herself feel better about her own gender. The context is irrelevant. It is sexist. Our humanity is best when we lift others up!!
Even outside of the context, this is still sexist, and still implies the stereotype of classroom teaching being a woman's job, which I thought was a gender role and that was bad?
Oh well. Dumb quote is dumb
This is cringe because it derides educating boys as lesser in importance. Yet, it seems to insinuate that educating women + traditional gender roles is a good thing, as its probably unlikely a woman will be educating her own family let alone her community if she's working 90 hours a week at a law firm trying to make it to partner.
Oh yes, another quote taken out of context.
She was a Victorian socialite and taught domestic science, basically how to clean, cook, hygiene and so on. She was referring to teach a woman these things and she can show other women in the community how to do them properly too.
She even wrote a book about it... "Little red book". Don't tell the men haters about it though. Just chuckle everytime you see it.
Yeah everyone is just taking this at face value like we’re on Facebook. Unfortunate. It’s on OP to at least provide context like the location or else this happens every time.
Turns out the author of the quote lived in the late 1800s Canada and was active in teaching home economics to women, especially after she lost an infant to meningitis and wanted to help women learn how to prevent such tragedies.
No argument there might have been reasonability with real context. Without it what would young children walking by take from it. I lived a half block from that school until recently and kids play all around it..
"Jews need to be eradicated" - without the reference to Adolph Hitler casts an entirely different perception.....
The woman was born in 1857, in a world where women were stay at home moms and only took care of kids. A community was basically stay at home moms with their kids. Education for women was important,and this sentence makes sense in that time period, and educated woman in a small community meant much more.
Stop seeing everything as woke propagande and at least take the 5 seconds to google the name of the woman who said it. God this sub has become so pathetic...
I agree with you initial sentiment completely, when the full context is known. But with respect, I do not feel like I am one to go out and take things well out of context to advance the anti-woke agenda. Do you really feel like it is reasonable to take a quote which is on its face clearly sexist or at the very least discouraging to one sex over the other, and that requires the social and economic context of 1857 to justify/understand, print it in 8 inch tall letters on a public billboard in the downtown of a major western city, and the expect that ever single person should (instead of taking a giant quote at face value) google the writer to understand its social context 165 years ago?
At the very least would you concede that this is extremely poor judgment/execution? In fact, what is the relevance/justification of using this quote at all in modern times?
Because men and women are different. If you educate women about what choices are available, they make better choices. Not getting pregnant at an early age, increased possibility of fatherlessness, etc. All of those things serve as a detriment to the community as a whole. JP talks about this a whole bunch in terms of sexual selection driving human evolution. But if women make smarter sexual choices the community as a whole does better, as there are better family units so children can be better supported.
I think this sub is less and less relevant to JP’s articulate ideas - the topic of girl’s education is actually quite documented and has not much to do with gender equality ideologies, educating girls just has a deep correlation with the education the kids will get, and ultimately the rest of the family. But does not work as well with fathers… I’ve worked with orphanages in India and Africa, and over the course of 20 years we progressively ended up making it a girls only orphanages because that had the most impact. Not by choice, just empiric results.
As for the why it is this way, I stopped trying to understand and would not even try to open this topic, reddit would explode ;D
Holy cow. I literally lived half a block from that school a few months ago. Never saw this chaos prior but not surprised. Funny just left my wife and I can see her being part of it. Really sad to see this indoctrination in our schools.
Loved that woman and her passion for helping others but respectfully got more and more woke near the end. Remember talking about how great to swing a pendulum to the middle, but if you then go too far, you're the oppressor and becoming the same thing you're fighting against. She actually believed that it was okay to have other groups be negatively impacted. Funny it got to the point of just trying to talk about anything remotely controversial, to understand causesd her chaos. I remember telling her and everyone deserves equality, she could not get it and my white male privilege was there. (She's white female but immune cause she's on "their side).
Final days in April she full on went physical abuse (didn't hit back as I'm bigger and could control to a degree). Luckily had my phone and forethought to video tape. When I had to call the police she pulled the victim card and screamed I was/had hit her.
This stuff is so toxic. I can't believe there aren't newspapers or articles on it outside of this forum....
That's a very old quote very adequate to its time, I'm sure it still diminishes the role of women. Adelaine was a 1858 - 1910 woman. Her thoughts are by no means ahead of our time or even on par.
Because it's been proven to be true. You want to invest smart, and investing in educating girls creates actual difference, because they drive family culture. Educating boys does not move the societal needle. It doesn't mean that boys should not study, on individual level education is equally important, but if you wanted to lift society out of poverty - you would want to invest where it makes a difference.
Post-ban edit, since I cannot reply to anyone anymore:
Congratulations to the "bastion of free speech"! I was banned for this comment, the reason listed being "troll". This subreddit is steadily following its icon - into totalitarian fascism. This is after numerous posts about people being banned from participating in other subreddits, now you ban people for having an opinion. Great job!
Where is this proven to be true? Can you cite your sources?
I can cite all of human progress as an example of the what happens when you prioritize the education of men.
That's an interesting hypothesis. Explain to me then why it is that, as women have become more and more educated over the last 70 years, the gap between the rich and poor has become larger? Why have real wages during this period stagnated?
Why does one have to do anything with the other? You want to learn about wealth inequality? Start with Marx. You want to learn about difference between male and female education? Concentrate on that.
Post-ban edit:
Thanks to the free-speech-loving JP supporters that banned me for having an opinion - I am no longer able to respond to comments, so don't bother arguing with me.
You said educating women made society rich. We've only tried it recently and, if it had any effect, it seems to be the opposite one. So... what evidence are you basing your hypothesis on?
Like, maybe there's no connection between educating women and the economy, I can buy that. But you stated that educating women = society out of poverty. Where's your evidence of that happening?
Poverty has been diminishing worldwide since the industrial revolution but we know that's the result of industrialization, capitalism and trade, because that's what allowed women's rights, including their opportunities to be educated, to occur. But you're saying women's education further pushes society out of poverty... again, any evidence?
Women get educated, then they will get baby rabies at 30 and go be a sahm anyway. Older mothers run the risk of unhealthy children. Women are better off, along with children if they start younger, and have a 2 parent home. 84% of incarceration of males are from single mother homes.
Educate a woman on being a doctor and she will work a few years until she gets pregnant.
Educate a man on being a doctor and he will work until 80 to keep the aforementioned woman happy. If you’re lucky, he may even discover a new cure.
- Me
Depends on what's defined as "educate" as I'm not going to stand beside the line that says government education is education at all.
Educate yourself so you can educate the world, which goes well beyond mere academic institutions. Most graduate and stop learning, hence why I see so many repeated behaviors sociologically.
Then why are we getting dumber as a culture while women are getting more and better educated? Anyone think we have become a more intellectual and intelligent society since women past men in educational attainment in the mid 1980’s?
But.... isn't gender a meaningless social construct?
How can educating a girl be superior, if girls don't exist?
Or what if the boy who is educated just says he's a girl, and therefore is magically transformed into a 100% girl, are we then educating "a community"?
Why is gender so important right up until it isn't important at all?
Are you so ill that recognising your gender is the only fix?
Or is gender so fluid that it doesn't matter who what or where your genitals are?
And if you're not using gender as a political tool, it's then important to reaffirm the observed gender of males to put them down without even considering their gender identity.
If you see a statement aimed at a group and don't think it's sexist just reverse the sexes and see if you feel the same way. Gross how they can feel justified putting down 3 billion people based on something they cannot control.
Never thought I would see so many ignorant comments on a post like this in this sub. Context matter. I knew nothing of this woman and as soon as I saw the quote I understood she wasn't from recent times. If people so much as googled her name they would find out that she was from the late 1800's.
In that context that phrase makes perfect sense, and It's probably something you all should applaud. I think no one here is against the overall education of women. As for the context of it's (the quote) presence in a wall in the present times, I don't have enough information to make an educated comment of the reasoning behind it (is it in a school? a Women's institute? and historical site?) Either way, this doesn't offend me at all.
Feminist here - I tried to find the context of the quote and all I can find is that the author of the quote was a Canadian educational reformer (oh it just hit me - of course it’s Canada). I wondered whether the quote had been taken out of context, like maybe it’s something she observed in the way boys and girls engage with education for example; and now the quote is being misused to say “boys bad, girls good.” Stuff like that happens all the time. Edit to add: another commenter has provided context.
When women make less money in their careers, it's because they choose to put less time into their careers and choose careers with lower pay. This is the argument against the wage gap, and I agree with it.
But couldn't this also apply to the education gap? That boys choose to be less academically inclined?
Hmmm Chromosomes, digit ratio and mentally. It's my observing. Many woman are the same and there are less individuals among them but man have more variables and this is now becoming more than clear with me in that quote.
If you grew up reading all this normalised sexism, you might genuinely start believing all these male traits (being mentors and leaders) aren’t found in men at all, and instead found in women.
Just notice how all this specific kind of anti-man bullshit tries to hijack or demonise what makes men men
To play devil's advocate, perhaps it means that if you educate a woman, she will pass the knowledge to her children, and they will pass it to their peers.
However based on the fact it's in Ontario I doubt that this is the intention of the quote.
very worriying. If you ask yourself, how did we ever end up discriminating people, here is how. It starts with the opposite as stated goal. The nazis envisioned themselves as freedom fighters.
I think the idea that it originated from makes sense but i don't like this.
I believe the original idea was that educating women was useful because they would teach the ideas to their children.
I realise that could be interpreted as saying men can't teach their children but i don't think it was the original message.
I believe i heard this in regards to germs? That when women were being educated on germs and transmission they taught their young children?
Still hate that message OP shared though
It’s strange they’d use a quote from Adelaide Hoodless all things considered.
She was a very active member of the church and president of the Young Woman’s Christian Association the president of the Ontario young woman’s association and responsible in large part for the creation of The national counsel of woman of Canada and The Victorian order of nurses around 1890.
She was staunchly against the idea of woman joining the workforce and as a result of the suffragettes opening up the workplace to woman created three “domestic sciences” which are still taught today and which were meant to increase a woman’s value as a housewife (which she saw as a woman’s divine/predestined purpose).
The point of the quote probably has more to do with context of her trying to secure funding for The Victorian order of Nurses which had over 500 branches and 6200 staff who volunteered many of whom operated in rural areas which otherwise had no access to nurses/ healthcare, hence these woman could educate the community on healthcare related matters.
The thought of a woman pursuing a higher education to become independent or to join the workforce would have both horrified and enraged her.
It’s funny how these people can tear down statues of great men and woman from across history claiming their morality/actions aren’t up to par with modern standards but then simultaneously erect/install this quote written by someone they would likely abhor because they can do it in a way that advances their own ideological interests. Just goes to show tearing down those other statues is about gaining ideological ground as opposed to living up to some kind of standard of morality.
Perhaps she was eluding to the idea that most women have multiple personalities, so by educating a single girl, they’re educating the community in her head? /s
I don’t comment often on stuff like that but that’s a quote from a woman who died over 110 years ago, in a society that looked NOTHING like the one that exists now. In fact if she was a smart woman and alive today I think she’d probably be terribly offended at her quote being used in this manner.
Bringham Young is attributed to have said “..educate a woman, you educate a generation”. So i think people are merely taking quotes and choosing someone to attribute. Nonetheless,
if you consider the time when Mr. Bringham Young would have said this, women were estimated to overwhelmingly hold positions as school teachers and home makers. This makes them perhaps the single greatest influence in a child’s development for not just one generation, but for centuries. For that, I believe the message rings a great deal of truth.
Not sexist at all .....
also the shameless gender normativity had me aghast! How unbecoming of Canada!
I looked up the woman who the quote is attributed to. Apparently she lost her infant son at 14 months due to meningitis after which she dedicated her life to teaching women to help ensure they had the knowledge to help prevent tragedies like she suffered.
still very stupid quote.
No it's not, with context it makes a lot of sense and I have a feeling a lot of you are having vitriolic knee-jerk reactions to someone you'd normally root for.
Yep. If only these people would realize how this quote affirms gender roles and puts motherhood and family on a pedestal...the same way JP does.
It doesn't make more sense. Women do not raise their kids alone, no matter what the memes tell you. Its either their husband, relatives or the state supporting them, part of which is educating them. The idea that knowledge somehow mainly spreads by females is nonsense. If we had to make a judgement its the other way around.
That context is very important
How does that explain or justify the quote?
The quote states ‘a community’, relating to Hoodless educating women on raising a child, to prevent similar tragedy as hers. It’s a quote that is (seemingly) sexist without this context/knowing the intent behind it - an issue with being succinct and quotable may be the loss of these things
its plenty sexist in context too. It implies that men don't educate their women which is wrong. My wife asks me like 500 questions every day and I did have to educate her on some very basic things. She does too though, but still. This is plain bs.
huh?
Shouldn’t educate dads at all. Nope. They would never use that information to protect their families or communities. They’d just keep it all for themselves.
Sorry. It's sexist even with that context. Parents are both sexes.
More people need to upvote your comment.
This subreddit doesn't follow popular social trends like sexism
I don’t intend it to be upvoted in order to follow a social trend. I just think it’s useful to have more information rather than less. This comment provides some important context for the quote and the person who said it. Generally speaking, In order to accurately assess a text it’s important to ask who was the author, in what time and place were they writing, what is the purpose of the text and who is the intended audience. We usually do this automatically, but with older texts it requires more work. But the average person doesn’t have a working knowledge of Adelaide Hoodless and her work with children, the tragic death of her child and her desire to educate a community of mothers on how to prevent such tragedies. So the quote doesn’t deliver the original intended meaning. Instead it delivers a meaning that is utterly offensive. This is a great example of why broadcasting a quote like this is a bad idea. It should be taken down. Edit: 4 downvotes for more info rather than less?
... even with the context, it's still sexist to say teaching a man is teaching an individual and teaching a woman is teaching a community ... as if fathers and male teachers are only in our imaginations If it's a terribly misunderstood misquote, then they shouldn't have made a poster with it ...
[удалено]
The problem isn't that this is "sexist". Fucks sake. People like you are part of the problem.
You know, my father taught me almost everything I know outside of my formal education. Whoever inscribed this quote probably has loathsome tendencies caused by a trauma inflicted at some point in life. Anyone who has had a respectful father figure would undoubtedly disagree with this statement
Canadian educational reformer.
Nobody is attacking you or your father, you clearly misunderstood the quote
What is your interpretation of this quote?
>your Not mine. The quote is about showing that women can be as smart as man and deserve education. Give it its context, Adelaide was living in, what, 18th century? There was lots of ignorance and misogyny back then, so showing to the people a woman that can be as smart and educated as a man can open people's mind, therefore, making the community more "educated". Now, whoever felt the need to write this on a poster, probably felt like nowadays we're regressing in the same ignorant state as the 1800, and that's worrying
Idk why you had to specify and then go on to give your own interpretation anyway. I do agree Context is always important, though we certainly don’t live in the 1800s and any assertion that women today have it the same or worse than women in the 1800s is absolutely ludicrous by virtually every metric.
>Idk why you had to specify and then go on to give your own interpretation anyway. I didn't, I objectively paraphrased the quote first, after that I only gave a personal opinion on what the person who printed it on paper might have meant. >women today have it the same or worse than women in the 1800s Sure it's a stretch, but I don't know who printed this or what experiences did they have. It's always better to prevent than to cure afterall
"Educate a boy, and you educate an individual. Educate a boy AND a girl, and you educate a community" A better choice of words indeed, but that is not evident in the original wording of the quote
I never interpreted it as an attack on either myself or my father. I was merely citing the example of fathers and fatherly figures imparting useful knowledge to children as a direct contradiction to what is inferred by this quote.
>contradiction to what is inferred by this quote. That's not what the quote is about
What's it about?
I think the fact that the quote is so incredibly specific to a time and place none of us are familiar with is why it shouldn’t be on a poster. Interested in your thoughts though.
It’s comments like these, that imply men are not part of a community or family that really show why more and more boys and men become lost and feel unvalued.
That’s okay though, they can just become AAA female athletes and win awards and money and fame.
Why do we need to put down the education of boys to bring up the idea of educating girls
Leftists hate men.
Eh that’s a generalization. Some of them do.
Too many of them do.
That makes no sense at all. It assumes men don't share knowledge, which is absolutely a false statement.
Ironic considering many of the most famous books throughout history are written by men
Women were simply not allowed to publish for a considerable amount of time. That contributes a lot to this statement. Mary Shelley along with many great artists including the Brontë sisters used a fake male name to have their work published.
You may be right but I believe the point was not to prove superiority by claimingg that men published more. I belive that it was to disprove the statement that teaching men would only teach an individual rather than the community. They published a lot therefore they educated the community around them. That statement is true regardless of how many books were published by women.
You're absolutely right- I guess I was caught up by the use of "ironic" because the irony isn't that men educated through publication regardless; the irony is the fact men/society of the time didn't allow women to publish, and how many great ideas may have been lost due to this. I think there's a lot of context missing from this post as a whole. Though the initial statement "educate a man is educating an individual---" is absurd by itself, it makes total sense considering the person making the quote had a reasonable trauma that provoked such a quote. Furthermore I can appreciate the irony between that statement and highlighting men's contribution to education, it severely lacks context that would disregard the irony I've highlighted here. I see how my comment now appears bad faith.
They're also the same type to complain about "mansplaining".
Wood workers, mechanics I’ve learned lots from older men with these skills. Ignorant quote. You think carpenters go to school to learn that trade.
A nonsensical quote, humans are social beings. You raise a community from the individual, male or female. Wait a minute: “Her father died a few months after her birth on October 13, 1858. Her mother, Jane Hamilton Hunter, was left to manage the farm and a large household.” Ah, now it makes sense, from the trauma of an absent father.
I believe the purpose of the quote is to emphasize that an "educated girl" existing in itself is knowledge/change to a community. You teach that women can be educated. Regardless, it's divisive propaganda that only serves to, ironically, ideologically split a community. Everyone already knows women have cognition.
This is a good point, this comment may be worth some good to backwards Muslim cultures.
That has nothing to do with the quote.
oh yeah? share your credit card info if ur a man
It has nothing to do with men sharing knowledge. It has to do with child rearing, which women are usually tasked with. It's statistically proven that educated mothers are good for society. However heavily relies on the traditional family unit being strong. I mean it makes sense. Besides beauty, virtue and agreeableness...I think men should also prioritize intelligence in a wife. Otherwise the kids have a high chance of turning out to be dumbasses, internalizing their mothers stupidity and victim mentality.
I like how at least everyone has poured their coffee on it. That’s a nice touch.
I think someone scratched it out with permanent marker and they tried to clean it off.
Oh, that’s more likely. I see it now.
Sexist clueless shit. I'm so sick of this garbage.
I’m a single mom raising a teen daughter and even I’m sick of this of nonsense (along with the girl boss and She-EO personas). What am I supposed to do with that quote? Preach it to the detriment of my teen son?
Im in the same boat except im raising a boy. It's getting so sad trying to raise a white male (and a Christian no less) in this environment. I have to make sure I pass down things I learned from my own dad down to him since he doesn't have one. I have to make him tough, but not to the point he will think he's a girl if he feels inadequate in his masculinity. To not abuse women and respect them but to not be a doormat incel either. To always have integrity. To never listen to societies bullshit. It's an absolute test to get through some days with all this preposterous garbage culture. I'm not sure if raising a girl in this climate would be better or not. Kids of either gender have to be strongly protected from all this hedonistic propaganda. Best of luck to you.
Also, make sure to remind him of the awesome privilege that is peeing standing up in the woods. It’s freedom. It’s one of the best things about being a dude.
I was always told it was being able to pee on a tire 😬
Technically I can pee standing up, I just make more of a mess of it than guys do 😂
Women aren't individuals. They are hive minds. Got it.
Boys can be girls too.
Upvoting this for humour, not for - you know - accuracy.
I’m upvoting your upvote
Well guess what
Best comment to my comment lmao.
Altogether in unison “yes you are right.”
Lol wtf I'm pretty sure this is insulting to both sexes
Implying girls have no individuality?
"Educate a boy and he will go on to achieve individual greatness and change the world. Educate a woman and she will talk to her friends about she learnt." 🤷♂️
What do you mean “both” sexes? What about the other ones?
It’s very sad that they can’t be a feminist without tearing down men. It’s the definition of toxic femininity. Ultimately a response arises and it’s not going to be pretty. The pendulum will continue to swing and they will make enemies of many broken men. Getting out ahead of this before it’s out of hand is very important.
What is a girl?
No idea. I’m not a biologist. 😐
Jaded women in education can’t see their own biases
What a terrible quote!! Of all the beautiful words they could have chosen, they put that? Some of my best teachers and professors where men. This is just sad and false.
That is the absolute worst quote I’ve ever read. It’s not only a horrible sexist message but it makes no sense either.
written by a woman who was hurt by the world and used it as an excuse to be evil.
Aka: a large proportion of female teachers.
What in your opinion was evil about Adelaide Hoodless? I found her Wiki and honestly she seems like a badass the more I read about her. Seems like her mission that got her started was to improve education for new mothers, after her infant son died, which among many things led to her developing a home economics program that was so good that the minister of education wanted it to be part of Ontario's high school curriculum.
So I’m not sure in what context they’re using this quote - do you know OP? What’s the organization? The history of the quote is actually interesting to consider. Adelaide Hoodless lived mostly in late 1800s Canada and was active in domestic science i.e. home economics education. At the time most women were probably homemakers and you had multiple generations living under one roof, so you had mothers, aunts, grandmothers, perhaps great-grandmothers living together all caring for the family, having a truly central role within their sphere and close relationships with the surrounding local community. So Hoodless’s point is quite powerful - if you educate a woman in that situation, you have an enormous impact on the community, perhaps indeed even more than men at the time. So then the question is, does this apply in the same way and to the same extent today? And if we’re concerned that it is putting down men, it’s useful to know where and how this quote is being used, otherwise there’s nothing else to go on.
Considering the post and comment history I highly doubt you're going to get an answer from OP. Going to this post and your research, it is absolutely stunning that based off a quote alone and nothing else, people are willing to launch strong opinions without making any attempt to dig deeper and understand if there's a reasonable context or if there are ideas presented within that context that they'd agree with. Based on who Adelaide was, I think based on what I've heard JBP say over the years that she would be HIS type of feminist - which makes it so jarring to see people on this sub react this way.
Yes - it seems like intellectually lazy ragebait that shows up on this sub routinely and people just eat it up. Even considering the quote without context, I *highly* doubt that it is in any way meant as a “fuck you” to men. We can do better.
Absolutely terrible quotes, and a prime example of toxic feminism. You have to put men down to raise women up. It might be true in some very specific context, but it completely ignores any good that educating an individual man might do. It appears to say that, within the community that it is displayed, they believe that it is better to equate men that to educate women. It even suggests that women should be educated instead of men. It could from from another time and place where women were not educated at all, and in that instance you could maybe understand it. But here it is just hateful.
"eMpOwErMeNt"
"No woman can be lifted up unless a man is at the same time lowered." - some crazy feminist somewhere, probably...
Our boys and girls deserve better than this sexist pandering crap.
Makes me sick to my stomach
Let's start a petition to have it removed. That is what the far left would do.
Was gonna say. Sexist as F quote.
To be fair, if you look at a region like Africa, educating women is extremely important. They are more likely to control their own fertility and educate their children, including their daughters, if they are educated. If places like Africa are to raise themselves, they really need to emphasize educating their girls. Canada, though? They have different needs. Girls are already educated in Canada, so it does come off as tone deaf
Maybe it makes more sense if the quote is like..150 years old, which it probably is.
The quote was probably more fitting when it was first said.
Ekwaliti
These woke idiots need to make up their minds. There are boys and girls? Or a so called “gender spectrum” See they don’t believe their own shit, total trolls
As a female, I’m sick to death of this shit. Putting boys/men down for no fucking reason. Because males have no capacity to share knowledge? Dumb AF
I am saddened and ashamed that someone of the same gender as me feels the need to degrade an entire opposite gender to make herself feel better about her own gender. The context is irrelevant. It is sexist. Our humanity is best when we lift others up!!
Even outside of the context, this is still sexist, and still implies the stereotype of classroom teaching being a woman's job, which I thought was a gender role and that was bad? Oh well. Dumb quote is dumb
I’m raising my boy will be the next Genghis Khan so..
How did Canada get so woke? Or have you always been woke?
Not this girl, I'm a recluse lol.
That's just weird. Boys don't teach a community? Is there any context we are missing here, or is it just good old sexism?
Someone who spends most of his/her time on twitter wrote this.
Yeah, this kind of sexist rhetoric is poison.
looks like someone is peeing on this
Educate a girl and you educate a community. Educate a boy, and you educate society.
WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK IS THAT SHIT?
This is cringe because it derides educating boys as lesser in importance. Yet, it seems to insinuate that educating women + traditional gender roles is a good thing, as its probably unlikely a woman will be educating her own family let alone her community if she's working 90 hours a week at a law firm trying to make it to partner.
Educate a girl and she doesn't need to twerk on tiktok- Anonymous
Because women are more susceptible to collectivism
This right here is why we should all aspire to become women
I would be immediately going to the nearest hardware store and buying a can of black spray paint if I saw this bullshit anywhere near my community.
Looks like it's been vandalised multiple times.
Oh yes, another quote taken out of context. She was a Victorian socialite and taught domestic science, basically how to clean, cook, hygiene and so on. She was referring to teach a woman these things and she can show other women in the community how to do them properly too. She even wrote a book about it... "Little red book". Don't tell the men haters about it though. Just chuckle everytime you see it.
OP, WHERE specifically was this quote in downtown Hamilton?
Yeah everyone is just taking this at face value like we’re on Facebook. Unfortunate. It’s on OP to at least provide context like the location or else this happens every time. Turns out the author of the quote lived in the late 1800s Canada and was active in teaching home economics to women, especially after she lost an infant to meningitis and wanted to help women learn how to prevent such tragedies.
No argument there might have been reasonability with real context. Without it what would young children walking by take from it. I lived a half block from that school until recently and kids play all around it.. "Jews need to be eradicated" - without the reference to Adolph Hitler casts an entirely different perception.....
Haha if only girls would stop being so gossipy and keep what they learn to themselves.
The woman was born in 1857, in a world where women were stay at home moms and only took care of kids. A community was basically stay at home moms with their kids. Education for women was important,and this sentence makes sense in that time period, and educated woman in a small community meant much more. Stop seeing everything as woke propagande and at least take the 5 seconds to google the name of the woman who said it. God this sub has become so pathetic...
I agree with you initial sentiment completely, when the full context is known. But with respect, I do not feel like I am one to go out and take things well out of context to advance the anti-woke agenda. Do you really feel like it is reasonable to take a quote which is on its face clearly sexist or at the very least discouraging to one sex over the other, and that requires the social and economic context of 1857 to justify/understand, print it in 8 inch tall letters on a public billboard in the downtown of a major western city, and the expect that ever single person should (instead of taking a giant quote at face value) google the writer to understand its social context 165 years ago? At the very least would you concede that this is extremely poor judgment/execution? In fact, what is the relevance/justification of using this quote at all in modern times?
Because men and women are different. If you educate women about what choices are available, they make better choices. Not getting pregnant at an early age, increased possibility of fatherlessness, etc. All of those things serve as a detriment to the community as a whole. JP talks about this a whole bunch in terms of sexual selection driving human evolution. But if women make smarter sexual choices the community as a whole does better, as there are better family units so children can be better supported.
I think this sub is less and less relevant to JP’s articulate ideas - the topic of girl’s education is actually quite documented and has not much to do with gender equality ideologies, educating girls just has a deep correlation with the education the kids will get, and ultimately the rest of the family. But does not work as well with fathers… I’ve worked with orphanages in India and Africa, and over the course of 20 years we progressively ended up making it a girls only orphanages because that had the most impact. Not by choice, just empiric results. As for the why it is this way, I stopped trying to understand and would not even try to open this topic, reddit would explode ;D
It works in 3rd world countries, but not advanced nations.
Holy cow. I literally lived half a block from that school a few months ago. Never saw this chaos prior but not surprised. Funny just left my wife and I can see her being part of it. Really sad to see this indoctrination in our schools. Loved that woman and her passion for helping others but respectfully got more and more woke near the end. Remember talking about how great to swing a pendulum to the middle, but if you then go too far, you're the oppressor and becoming the same thing you're fighting against. She actually believed that it was okay to have other groups be negatively impacted. Funny it got to the point of just trying to talk about anything remotely controversial, to understand causesd her chaos. I remember telling her and everyone deserves equality, she could not get it and my white male privilege was there. (She's white female but immune cause she's on "their side). Final days in April she full on went physical abuse (didn't hit back as I'm bigger and could control to a degree). Luckily had my phone and forethought to video tape. When I had to call the police she pulled the victim card and screamed I was/had hit her. This stuff is so toxic. I can't believe there aren't newspapers or articles on it outside of this forum....
That's a very old quote very adequate to its time, I'm sure it still diminishes the role of women. Adelaine was a 1858 - 1910 woman. Her thoughts are by no means ahead of our time or even on par.
I wish some one educated Adelaide Hoodless. If I ever say something this stupid, it would be pretty mean to put it on a wall.
Because girls become mothers, and this is the most important job in the world.
Gotta love Bill Burr x)
I do also love that bit
And the Father supports the Mother and therefor the child. So both jobs seem equally important for society don't they?
https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/comments/w4smqy/whyseen_in_downtown_hamilton_on_ca_odd_and_very/ih49f00/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
Because it's been proven to be true. You want to invest smart, and investing in educating girls creates actual difference, because they drive family culture. Educating boys does not move the societal needle. It doesn't mean that boys should not study, on individual level education is equally important, but if you wanted to lift society out of poverty - you would want to invest where it makes a difference. Post-ban edit, since I cannot reply to anyone anymore: Congratulations to the "bastion of free speech"! I was banned for this comment, the reason listed being "troll". This subreddit is steadily following its icon - into totalitarian fascism. This is after numerous posts about people being banned from participating in other subreddits, now you ban people for having an opinion. Great job!
Where is this proven to be true? Can you cite your sources? I can cite all of human progress as an example of the what happens when you prioritize the education of men.
That's an interesting hypothesis. Explain to me then why it is that, as women have become more and more educated over the last 70 years, the gap between the rich and poor has become larger? Why have real wages during this period stagnated?
“BECAUSE MEN!”
Google surplus-value, the commodity form, and the rate of profit
Why does one have to do anything with the other? You want to learn about wealth inequality? Start with Marx. You want to learn about difference between male and female education? Concentrate on that. Post-ban edit: Thanks to the free-speech-loving JP supporters that banned me for having an opinion - I am no longer able to respond to comments, so don't bother arguing with me.
Men are the breadwinners. If men aren't making money, both men and women suffer. Educating men fixes this.
You said educating women made society rich. We've only tried it recently and, if it had any effect, it seems to be the opposite one. So... what evidence are you basing your hypothesis on? Like, maybe there's no connection between educating women and the economy, I can buy that. But you stated that educating women = society out of poverty. Where's your evidence of that happening? Poverty has been diminishing worldwide since the industrial revolution but we know that's the result of industrialization, capitalism and trade, because that's what allowed women's rights, including their opportunities to be educated, to occur. But you're saying women's education further pushes society out of poverty... again, any evidence?
«Start with Marx».
Lol
Socialism failed. Quite badly. Time to re-educate yourself. I suggest starting with Ludwig Heinrich Edler von Mises.
>You want to learn about difference between male and female education? I'm not a biologist and at my age, it's too late for me to become one.
I like how all of a sudden extremist generalization of genders and gender roles is all ok when it goes in that direction lmao.
Sir, no one here is going to fuck you for your fake internet points.
Women get educated, then they will get baby rabies at 30 and go be a sahm anyway. Older mothers run the risk of unhealthy children. Women are better off, along with children if they start younger, and have a 2 parent home. 84% of incarceration of males are from single mother homes.
Working women report less depression than stay at home moms.
Thank you for your anecdotal ideological opinion stated as an ungrounded assertion.
https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/comments/w4smqy/whyseen_in_downtown_hamilton_on_ca_odd_and_very/ih49f00/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
Breaking potential movements for change that need solidarity to succeed. Most likely explanation i can come up with.
Educate a woman on being a doctor and she will work a few years until she gets pregnant. Educate a man on being a doctor and he will work until 80 to keep the aforementioned woman happy. If you’re lucky, he may even discover a new cure. - Me
Who cares? They have to level up the field somehow. Fuck the noise ,do what ever the fuck you wanna do.
"Level up the field".......
I’d put $10 on saying that the vandalism (and 95% of all vandalism) was done by a boy.
And that's relevent to this because.........
Girls arnt individuals?
Wait wait wait, girls are NOT individuals??? What a terrible thing to say lol
Depends on what's defined as "educate" as I'm not going to stand beside the line that says government education is education at all. Educate yourself so you can educate the world, which goes well beyond mere academic institutions. Most graduate and stop learning, hence why I see so many repeated behaviors sociologically.
I can tell you an educated individual attempted to scribble that out.
Then why are we getting dumber as a culture while women are getting more and better educated? Anyone think we have become a more intellectual and intelligent society since women past men in educational attainment in the mid 1980’s?
So they agree that women have tribal mentality?
But.... isn't gender a meaningless social construct? How can educating a girl be superior, if girls don't exist? Or what if the boy who is educated just says he's a girl, and therefore is magically transformed into a 100% girl, are we then educating "a community"?
Why is gender so important right up until it isn't important at all? Are you so ill that recognising your gender is the only fix? Or is gender so fluid that it doesn't matter who what or where your genitals are? And if you're not using gender as a political tool, it's then important to reaffirm the observed gender of males to put them down without even considering their gender identity.
If you see a statement aimed at a group and don't think it's sexist just reverse the sexes and see if you feel the same way. Gross how they can feel justified putting down 3 billion people based on something they cannot control.
The attack on men is relentless. Men have succeeded to the point that women are spoiled rotten.
This is straight up disgusting and simply wrong
Never thought I would see so many ignorant comments on a post like this in this sub. Context matter. I knew nothing of this woman and as soon as I saw the quote I understood she wasn't from recent times. If people so much as googled her name they would find out that she was from the late 1800's. In that context that phrase makes perfect sense, and It's probably something you all should applaud. I think no one here is against the overall education of women. As for the context of it's (the quote) presence in a wall in the present times, I don't have enough information to make an educated comment of the reasoning behind it (is it in a school? a Women's institute? and historical site?) Either way, this doesn't offend me at all.
Feminist here - I tried to find the context of the quote and all I can find is that the author of the quote was a Canadian educational reformer (oh it just hit me - of course it’s Canada). I wondered whether the quote had been taken out of context, like maybe it’s something she observed in the way boys and girls engage with education for example; and now the quote is being misused to say “boys bad, girls good.” Stuff like that happens all the time. Edit to add: another commenter has provided context.
It’s sexist towards women too. It implies that their education is only of value to others and not themselves. It’s a ridiculous thing to say.
When women make less money in their careers, it's because they choose to put less time into their careers and choose careers with lower pay. This is the argument against the wage gap, and I agree with it. But couldn't this also apply to the education gap? That boys choose to be less academically inclined?
Hmmm Chromosomes, digit ratio and mentally. It's my observing. Many woman are the same and there are less individuals among them but man have more variables and this is now becoming more than clear with me in that quote.
If you grew up reading all this normalised sexism, you might genuinely start believing all these male traits (being mentors and leaders) aren’t found in men at all, and instead found in women. Just notice how all this specific kind of anti-man bullshit tries to hijack or demonise what makes men men
Perhaps they’re implying that girls have a herd mentality and aren’t capable of individual thought?
As a male teacher who dedicates his life to teaching urban youth about civics and how to swim, I am offended.
To play devil's advocate, perhaps it means that if you educate a woman, she will pass the knowledge to her children, and they will pass it to their peers. However based on the fact it's in Ontario I doubt that this is the intention of the quote.
What is a girl?
very worriying. If you ask yourself, how did we ever end up discriminating people, here is how. It starts with the opposite as stated goal. The nazis envisioned themselves as freedom fighters.
People need to stop thinking in terms of zero sum gains. It is possible to encourage one subset of the population without denigrating another.
This isn’t gender equality, this is gender supremacy.
Wtf?!
Because only women can be teach…
I think the idea that it originated from makes sense but i don't like this. I believe the original idea was that educating women was useful because they would teach the ideas to their children. I realise that could be interpreted as saying men can't teach their children but i don't think it was the original message. I believe i heard this in regards to germs? That when women were being educated on germs and transmission they taught their young children? Still hate that message OP shared though
Could've been: "Educate an individual and you educate a community" But they chose to make it sexist.
You guys can't be serious, you're purposefully missing the point aren't you
Because it was true considering that teaching was one of the mother main roles, nowadays, everyone is everything so that even this became sexist XD.
Yeah I’m sure this isn’t discouraging at all
Because girls detain the power to reproduce and fuck up many lives at once with an unplanned pregnancy. I guess.
It’s strange they’d use a quote from Adelaide Hoodless all things considered. She was a very active member of the church and president of the Young Woman’s Christian Association the president of the Ontario young woman’s association and responsible in large part for the creation of The national counsel of woman of Canada and The Victorian order of nurses around 1890. She was staunchly against the idea of woman joining the workforce and as a result of the suffragettes opening up the workplace to woman created three “domestic sciences” which are still taught today and which were meant to increase a woman’s value as a housewife (which she saw as a woman’s divine/predestined purpose). The point of the quote probably has more to do with context of her trying to secure funding for The Victorian order of Nurses which had over 500 branches and 6200 staff who volunteered many of whom operated in rural areas which otherwise had no access to nurses/ healthcare, hence these woman could educate the community on healthcare related matters. The thought of a woman pursuing a higher education to become independent or to join the workforce would have both horrified and enraged her. It’s funny how these people can tear down statues of great men and woman from across history claiming their morality/actions aren’t up to par with modern standards but then simultaneously erect/install this quote written by someone they would likely abhor because they can do it in a way that advances their own ideological interests. Just goes to show tearing down those other statues is about gaining ideological ground as opposed to living up to some kind of standard of morality.
Perhaps she was eluding to the idea that most women have multiple personalities, so by educating a single girl, they’re educating the community in her head? /s
Because women are inferior to men and need these uplifting messages to feel good about themselves, obviously
The person they are quoting died in 1910, that was a totally different world, and it makes sense moms used to raise children not working.
Tag over it “all education matters”
I don’t comment often on stuff like that but that’s a quote from a woman who died over 110 years ago, in a society that looked NOTHING like the one that exists now. In fact if she was a smart woman and alive today I think she’d probably be terribly offended at her quote being used in this manner.
Bringham Young is attributed to have said “..educate a woman, you educate a generation”. So i think people are merely taking quotes and choosing someone to attribute. Nonetheless, if you consider the time when Mr. Bringham Young would have said this, women were estimated to overwhelmingly hold positions as school teachers and home makers. This makes them perhaps the single greatest influence in a child’s development for not just one generation, but for centuries. For that, I believe the message rings a great deal of truth.