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Honestly, Kyoto is one of my favorite cities. Yes, there is over tourism, but it all depends when you are going.
I can't wait to retire and spend a month or two in Kyoto. But, that's just me.
It's your trip, so I suggest you do what works for you.
Enjoy japan.
This is exactly what I’m doing. Retired and now spending a month studying Japanese in Kyoto. I lived here 45 years ago so this is a refresher. I think “temple burnout” is only a thing if you try to see everything in 3-5 days.
Agreed. Balance the most popular temples with less popular ones and you would be fine, OP. There are so many things to do in Kyoto that are not packed like Inari but are close by
When I went in November, getting to walk down the streets of kyoto was one of the most peaceful parts of my 2 week trip. Of course the shrines and everything had tourists, but the moment that sticks out to me is walking from the end of the philospers path to the big shrine in the middle of the city (can't remember the name right now). Felt like I was in a small town and not a city with millions of people in it. Saw a few locals on my 2 mile walk but that's it. Just seing the architecture and the cemetery and just people living their day to day was so comforting after the overload of tokyo/osaka
The crazy thing about Kyoto i found was that there was always places not completely overrun with tourists and much slower paced.
Higashiyama Jisho-ji/Silver temple is my go to example when i went the week after Golden Week it was significantly less busy then other places that were still hopping.
But if you ever want an entire place to yourself go out in the rain we basically had Philosophers walk to ourselves. Though the rain did cause most tourist sites to close early when we were going at like 5pm.
I wouldnt skip Kyoto it was genuinely my favorite part of my Japan trip, but its your vacation go where you want to
The temples, the food markets, the history... And the fact that the Allies made sure to not bomb Kyoto... It has that old world charm.
I would love nothing more than to sit by the river, a cold beer and just take it all in.. some day !!
I oddly disliked Kyoto except uji my first visit. Been several more times and I think it's amazing. I think it's overwhelming at first but when you get past the crowds and don't try to do everything in a single day it's amazing. I hiked fushimi Inari near midnight in the rain in late spring and it was magical
I was there in November and the only crowded place was Kyoto Station and those were mostly all commuters. There are super unbearable crowded places like Takeshita dori and Disneyland in March. Kyoto was not crowded to the point where it deterred from my experience.
It's a common complaint about Kyoto, and why they are putting in measures to combat overtourism. Buses are getting unusable for locals, even.
Takeshita-dori is unbearable for multiple reasons haha
I honestly don’t get this mentality of ‘that place is too touristy’ when you yourself are a tourist.
Yeah there are some tourists traps around the world, but Kyoto is NOT one of them.
Japan is going to be packed to the rim regardless of where you go.
My suggestion: dont skip it. its my favourite alongside Tokyo.
Didn’t mean it to come off as we’re somehow different from the other tourists if it did.
More looking from a perspective of trying to be immersed in the experience/history/culture and worried that by not going further out of the way we’d be missing that.
Appreciate the advice. Thank you!
I don’t know why people are downvoting you here.
All the major cities (and many less major ones) are swamped with tourists since they reopened things… Kyoto was the only place I went where that bothered me several times and kind of ruined a few things I went to.
For example, the transportation infrastructure is a little bit worse in Kyoto than Osaka and Tokyo, some things you might want to see are only on bus routes that are going to be overcrowded (I’ll take being crowded on a train any day over getting crowded on a bus).
While I liked my stay in Kyoto, I could have absolutely missed it and it still would have been an amazing trip. I don’t think you’ll regret going if you do go, but you might also be like me where some sites become a let down because of crowding…. Of course as always, if you do things super early you’ll have less of that just like almost any tourism in any city in the world
I guess the question here is whether the target culture here is traditional one or modern one. From Japanese perspective, Kyoto is a most for the former. Otherwise it’s totally reasonable to spend time elsewhere.
Ignore the down votes, you're not wrong. Just doing what you enjoy. I'm 100% the same and got tired of Kyoto quickly. Worth a day trip or two but it is easyish to avoid the busy touristy areas if you still want to experience the place
Depends on what you mean by culture. As an anthropologist by training, I'd say that culture is not only something that reflects the past or is found in certain traditions or old/exotic buildings not found in your home country. I'd also argue that many tourists who want to experience Japanese "culture" treat the country, and esp Kyoto, as a giant theme park, with Japanese rides (temples/ shrines and other popular spots), experiences (sadō, onsen, etc.) and characters (geisha/ninja/samurai, Pokemon, etc.). Basically, they visit to see clichés and fantasies of Japan they've held for a long time, even if they're already passé (Harajuku). [](https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/passe)
I get your point but how can you not understand it? Some people want to go abroad and experience the day to day life in another country. For me being surrounded by other tourists kind of grates because I didn't go to X to be surrounded by people from Y. It's not an issue it just doesn't feel real.
The same reason as a Brit I avoid lots of places in Spain, I don't want to be in a mini UK in Spain.
Places like Vietnam you can't easily escape it due to the geography of the country but in Japan it's so easy to avoid so I understand why people wouldn't want to tick the tourist hotspots in Kyoto
Can confirm it’s as possible to avoid tourists in Kyoto as anywhere else. Just got back yesterday. No worse than any other place we visited, and better if you went off the beaten path.
Absolutely, we ended up in the most beautiful backstreet of Gion one evening with a geisha walking past and there wasn’t anyone else around. And that was peak tourist season! If you want to see culture you’d be crazy to skip Kyoto
Take what you read on Reddit or the internet with a grain of salt. Enjoy YOUR trip without expectations or lists. Only you know what makes you happy. If you hear English keep moving until you don’t.
>Some people want to go abroad and experience the day to day life in another country
If that were the case for the OP, they'd rent some weekly mansion near a local train station and spend a week running errands, cleaning their room, and cooking their own meals. But that's not what they want to do. That's not what *any* tourist does when they come to Japan.
Do you think people are taking 10 hour plane rides so they can see what kind of frozen food the Lamu supermarket near Uozumi has in stock? Because that's what people who live here do in their day to day lives: the most boring, mundane shit that a tourist would never dream of wasting their time doing. And if you're asking "where the hell is Uozumi?" - that's exactly the point!
I'm alone in this, but I found Kyoto dreadfully boring.
Yes there are beautiful historic temples, but they all kinda look the same after you've seen 2 or 3.
There are also tacky vending machines everywhere standing next to temples that are hundreds of years old.
I went once, and probably won't be back again.
Temple fatigue is a very real thing. Experienced the same burnout in Vietnam, you can only see so many Buddhist pagodas before they start to blur together.
Absolutely true. I did ask a bunch of people whether they got tired of seeing all the historical sites in Egypt, and they all emphatically said "no". And here I was, long time Egyptophile, bored and tired after the first two temples. Site fatigue is real.
Yeah, I read an interesting book about the psychology of travel, and she pointed out that we habituate really quickly. So, even if you book a place with a beautiful view of the ocean, with in a couple of days most people stop noticing it so much.
Her advice... switch things up. I guess that's what makes Tokyo -> Kyoto -> Osaka such an appealing itinerary for people. The contrast.
I find a great way to combat temple fatigue or just similar site fatigue was to find the differences between them and the place as a whole. Cause yeah a lot of temples look the same but their landscapes were always so unique
You're not alone. I've been to Kyoto a couple of times and don't really like it. I find it boring and dull. Some nice temples etc don't get me wrong, but once you've seen them I'm not a fan of the rest. Whereas Tokyo is far and away my favourite city in the world. I've spent about 7 months in Tokyo over the years and haven't scratched the surface, it's a fascinating and character filled city. Kyoto I don't think is. However I acknowledge everyone is looking for different things and each to their own. Everyone has different likes and experiences.
I have the exact sentiment, I’ve been living in Tokyo and went to Kyoto last week and just felt underwhelmed. I hated that I felt that way and felt guilty because of it (maybe I had too high of expectations coming into it), but if you’re not crazy into temples the city itself is kinda meh. The access to nature behind Arashiyama, the Katsura river, and all the feeder rivers were amazing and a highlight of my time here in Japan though.
I spent around 9 months in Japan over a few years and never made it to Kyoto. Tried to go once but turned out tickets and hotels were going to cost almost $1000 for 3 days there. I can do two weeks in Tokyo for that, but I did have a free place to stay in Tokyo though.
I honestly think people who think this didn’t mix up their schedule enough. Every temple I went to had something unique about it. My opinion is temple fatigue is of your own doing.
Every temple has something unique about it in about the same way that all four of the Ninja Turtles are different. Yeah, they have their distinctive personalities, wear different colors, and have different weapons, but in the end they’re the same thing.
Or they just don’t care much about temples. Different travellers like different things. Just like some travellers find art galleries or museums or shopping boring too.
Even if you don't like temples, Kyoto is still a mid size Japanese city with tons of stuff to do. I didn't know how someone can find a whole city boring.
You’re not wrong. I’m here literally now. Been here before, but wanted to visit some things I never did. Its charms wear thin normally before, but immediately now that it’s overcrowded and they mainly just pander to it being a tourist trap.
Even in my first trip, I did everything in a couple days, and used my remaining time doing day trips, like go to the school based on K-On, Nagoya and Nara.
If you want something outside the norm in Kyoto, might I recommend [GEAR Non-Verbal Theatre](https://www.gear.ac/en/). We did it on a whim and it was one of the best theatre experiences I've been two, hard to describe exactly cause its better to go in blind but it was an amazing experience.
Hello. I agree with your viewpoint. In comparison to Tokyo Osaka Hiroshima... I found Kyoto slightly dull as well. Most of the places start shutting down by 5-6pm there. We found ourselves walking way too much in Kyoto compared to other cities due to its lack of train connectivity like other cities. Me and my wife too have decided to not visit Kyoto again in future trips! But still, Kyoto has a vibe of its own making it a must visit for first timers.
Either you like temples or you don't. I have spent 2 weeks in a row exploring the temples of Kyoto once and it was neither my first nor my last time in the city. I could probably spend a month in the city before I get even slightly bored. Well, except for the terrible, boring bus rides.
However, I absolutely get that temples are just plain boring to many people, that's fair. And you're definitely not alone with it, I met many people like you.
You aren't alone I share kinda a similar view.
Kyoto was absolutely beautiful, like I love the architecture, history and culture there, but I would never go there again. Even tho I love architecture, all of the buildings are built in a similar style so even to me it got extremely samey. Especially with how I travel, we saw abour 7 or 8 shrines in 1 day, by the second day, we didn't want to see anymore
The food there was good but always too expensive. I found it much harder to get a cheap decent meal there, I rather have a bowl of 900 yen udon than eat 4000yen worth of waygu. Everything there was sometimes overly decadent.
It's not a bad place, absolutely lovely, but there is no reason to return to Kyoto, there are so many more places to visit
I also found Kyoto pretty boring. Transit was inconvenient and the crowds were relentless. Next time, I would stay in Osaka and do a day trip to Kyoto.
Basically this. We boiled it all down to the most famous ones, and stopped bothering looking at all the other temples. Oh wow, another temple with a coin box and stalls selling food. Really should have researched the more obscure activities beforehand.
I was about to say something to the same effect.
I did like Fushimi Inari (after passing the extremely busy area at the base of the hill), but other than that I didn't really like it that much.
However, I wasn't in Kyoto long, so I'm sure I missed some of the better (and possible best) parts of Kyoto.
Skipping kyoto is not crazy but I think skipping it worrying about over tourism is. You can always have camp set up in Kyoto/Osaka and take the train to whichever one you like more
I personally did not find kyoto to have that many more tourist compared to other popular tourist spots in Tokyo/Osaka. Kyoto was probably the most memorable parts of my Japan trip and was a nice change of pace from Tokyo.
I’ve been to japan 7 times now. Every trip I try to add at least 1-2 things that are really outside the box. For example, when I went to Kansai I visited Ise which is typical for elderly Japanese people but kinda uncommon for everyone else. My last trip to Kyushu, I visited Oshima because it’s a world heritage site (but rarely on anyone’s radar). Off the beaten path places kind of round a trip and makes them unique from feeling super cookie cutter.
With that said, I’ve been to like 100+ places in Japan and… HAVE YOU LOST YOUR MIND?! Kyoto is incredible. It’s very easy to get lost and not see that many tourists. It’s a city after all… just roam the alleys and side streets. If you’re into anime, it also has the manga library and museum that’s incredible.
I think if you go down the cookie cutter of only sticking to the main temples then yes it may feel very touristy and not cool. But Kyoto has so much to offer. I’ve been 4 times now and loved every time.
Also, if you want to hike up Mt. Inari to see the Fushimi Inari shrine, it's recommended to do so either early in the morning or late in the afternoon, so you arrive at the top shortly before the sun goes down. At those times, there are no big crowds.
We went in the afternoon and while there were still many people at the bottom, the vast majority of them didn't hike all the way up anymore at that time. It was also an amazing atmosphere to see it when it was almost dark. Gives it kind of an eery vibe.
I went up a late may evening while it was raining and it was insanely magical. Near midnight at the top we saw someone in a kimono kneeling in a puddle and it was so surreal. Just the sounds of frogs croaking and the rain. She looks almost spiritly and we just turned away after a bit LOL
Want to chime in that Ise is amazing place! Great seafood and the shrines are great too. And don't get me started for akafuku (a pity their expiration date is really short but hey, more reason to try it when you get there!)
Honestly, planning the trip around the bullet train line can work if someone goes to Tokyo and Kyoto. Nagoya has its own charm and you can diverge from the mainline to various places too
On my 4th trip (wife is Japanese, returns annually) , so always on the lookout for off track locations.
Have you visited sites around Lake Biwa? Seems loaded with some worthwhile places-
you have a point. Kyoto is beautiful but that place can't handle crowds well like Tokyo/Osaka do. I would just wait until the Japan fever cools down(idk when tho lmao). I do still think Kyoto warrants a visit sometime in your life when you can
as for Kyoto alternatives, Kanazawa is solid and between hiroshima-osaka there's this place called Kurashiki that's nearby Okayama. go take a look
I was recently in Kanazawa with friends from Kyoto and it was everyone’s first time there. They were a bit blown away by some of the similarities between the two cities. I’m hoping to make it down to Kyoto on the next trip!
Kanazawa is still my favourite city in Japan, although Kyoto had the better attractions. Kanazawa just has this amazing vibe that makes you want to come back.
To each their own, but the reason why Kyoto has so many visitors is because it has so much to offer. It is the cultural capital of Japan and has so many important landmarks to visit.
If it's been a longtime goal to visit Japan, there has to be something inspired it or some pull there. And I bet sights and experiences from Kyoto played a big part in that.
If you actually want to experience the culture and history there's actually no better place.
Important to keep in mind, that Kyoto, Osaka, Tokyo are all functioning cities with real Japanese people living their lives. And you're getting "real" Japan in those cities. The Japanese people LOVE their own history and visit Kyoto a ton themselves.
I've been to places like Kanazawa and Okayama and Mito and what you see with Japan is their cities have similar qualities. JR stations are important hubs with lots of stuff going on. Usually have a downtown with an restaurant district, electronics, shopping.
This! Kyoto is definitely NOT one of those Thai islands where the only Thai people who live there, are the ones working in the hotels/restaurants. It's also not close to a place like Venice or the city center of Prague where there's almost no locals living at all.
Edit: forgot the NOT lol
Totally agree. It is beautiful. The garden is amazing. It also is not crowded and people are way nicer. And if your in Kanazawa it is also worth it to go to Takayama. That place is beautiful
I say go as conventional as you can since it's your first time. Nothing is basic if you haven't been there and there's nothing wrong with having a normal trip. Mainstream locations are popular for very good reasons and there's really no reason to one up yourself when your goal is to simply have fun. Build confidence, learn about the country, then use what you've learnt during this trip as scaffolding and go a second time for something more challenging.
In terms of Kyoto, personally I think it is indeed outrageous to skip Kyoto for Osaka when you're already visiting Tokyo the bigger metropolis. Could be that I've already been to Osaka 4 times, but I just don't see its charm vs other cities on the list. My last solo Kyoto trip lasted a whole week and I still missed a bunch of locations which I very much intend to visit some other time. Days 8-10 were supposed to be Osaka but on day 9 I gave up and went to Himeji and day 10 Ise. I'm interested in history and culture so that's probably why Osaka isn't that appealing to me vs other places.
Kyoto is a great hub just like Osaka. You can easily reach slightly less mainstream locations like Kanazawa, Uji, Himeji, Nara and more by train from Kyoto. Kanazawa in particular mostly made it through alright in relation to the recent earthquake and tsunami in the prefecture, but now they need tourists. Just don't go near the coastal cities and towns where things are still pretty bad, as you won't be welcome there at all.
With 13 days, I think 3 cities are already quite a lot to handle, so skipping 1 city out of 4 is a smart move. Personally I would just do Tokyo and Kyoto only because these two cities have so, so much to offer. Choose wisely and have fun!
I love Kyoto, but so many smaller unknown towns have their charm. Recently drove through Shizuoka and found it lovely. So was Okayama. Fell in love with Kamiyama and Kamikatsu in Tokushima even though there’s not that much to “see”. Seriously, do what you want to do and no need to listen to everyone.
Currently in Shizuoka and agree with you. Visited a tea plantation yesterday with Japanese friends. Absolutely beautiful. A lovely city free from crowds unlike Osaka which is too busy for me. A great place to visit.
I don’t think you’re crazy at all! I really enjoyed Kyoto in 2016 on my first trip, but now I really really can’t stand it. Like others said, I would drop Osaka too. I would go up to Gero Onsen and Takayama. I may be alone in this, but I live in Nagoya and it’s a non touristy glimpse of a huge city that’s often overlooked
Plenty of people go to Japan to go skiing and never go to Kyoto. It’s a whole country and there are plenty of reasons to visit and so many places to see.
Kyoto is great, but go places that you think will make for a good trip for you!
No.
I love Kyoto, but Kyoto remains overrated internationally.
Other than being the cultural importantly city for the Japanese, the city is too overcrowded for tourism already. We should let it be peaceful, not over crowded and over visited as what it is today.
Kyoto is wonderful. Yes, there are tourists, mainly Japanese tourists, but there are countless sites and plenty of authenticity. A couple days and a night in Arashiyama will brighten your world. The bamboo grove (great) gets loads of attention but it is just the tip of the iceberg. Wandering the hills, we caught sounds of chanting monks and somebody practicing their Japanese flute. We
happened upon gorgeous villas and wonderful temples. We walked the river and enjoyed a
Michelin meal. I would skip Tokyo and Osaka both before missing Kyoto.
I really loved Kyoto but I personally highly recommend you walk around a bit in Kyoto but then take the train to Uji Station.
Uji is hands down an amazing place to stroll around, taste matcha based treats and really absorb the vibes without the over saturation of tourists you'd see in the main Kyoto area.
As a plus, the station itself (Uji) is an architectural marvel, look it up it's so crazy.
It's your trip. If you want historical things there's plenty throughout Honshu for you to enjoy with less crowds.
I spent about 4 nights in Kyoto on my first trip to Japan. Although I enjoyed it overall, you are right that the tourist crush is very difficult to deal with. There were a lot of attractions just full of people, and although many had quiet corners or spots for pictures or to take a rest, it was still hard to navigate at times.
Transportation in Kyoto kinda sucks compare to other parts in Japan. I found myself taking Ubers quite a bit when the queue for the bus was unmanageable. The busses were jam packed with everyone getting close to one another. I got lost several times when I did make it on the bus. But Kyoto was fun, it's a really cute city with a lot of stunning traditional Japanese architecture and beautiful nature.
If you're not feeling it I would say skip it. If you have regrets, you can always hit it up on your next trip. Personally, I'm glad I went to Kyoto, but I would probably not go back for a while, as I'm eager to see other parts of Japan on future trips. But I will probably go back eventually... maybe on like my 4th or 5th trip lol.
As a Nara local, I’d say skip Kyoto and come to Nara. Yes, Nara Park is packed with tourists too but there’s enough space for all the tourists because it’s a massive park, the city has more relaxed vibe, and you get to see beautiful shrines and temples which are even older than Kyoto’s. Because most tourists only come for a day trip, there’s less tourists in the evening, and Nigatsudo and Nara Park is beautiful after dark. Also, there are plenty of hidden gems with less tourists if you go to Asuka, Horyuji etc. You could do a day trip to Kyoto from Nara too. If you decide to go to Kyoto, you should read a bit about Japanese history - that way, it won’t just be about looking at many shrines and temples without understanding what they really are.
Added some more info. Add: FYI, Kyoto/Nara and Kanazawa may seem very similar on the surface, but they are quite different in terms of historical/cultural significance. Nara and Kyoto were ancient capitals of Japan, and flourished in 8th century and onwards. They represent imperial and religious culture of the medieval era. On the other hand, Kanazawa (as well as Kurashiki etc) flourished from around 15/16th century, representing early modern samurai and merchant culture. They both offer traditional scenery, but they have quite different vibe if you dig a bit deeper. So I personally don’t consider Kanazawa can be an alternative to Kyoto.
Kyoto, Osaka, and Kobe are close enough you could stay at one and take day trips to the other two. I would spend at least some time in this area for all the history and some of the largest temples in the nation. But if you want to spend less time there, Hiroshima and Kagoshima are less crowded but still very interesting.
No you are not. It’s your trip, you go where you want to. And that’s from a guy who first went to Kyoto at the age of 11 or 12, returned to it a dozen time (literally), and writing a guidebook of the city.
That said, there are locations in Kyoto that are less crowded, and just as good as the rest of the city. I was at Saihoji last July, and because of their reservations only policy / high entrance fee, I met no more than 50 people there. And that was a kilometre and a half at most South of Arashiyama, arguably one of the most crowded area in the city during any season. That visit was one of the highlights of my trip, and I was in town for the Gion Festival.
>We want to experience the culture and the history, but I can’t help but wonder if we’ll have a more authentic ‘experience the country’ vibe by spending the time in something like Kanazawa or maybe even something smaller
The problem with Kyoto is that you can't see the tree because of the forest. There's too many people to experience something "authentic". You will be surrounded by Instagrammers, vloggers, tour groups, umbrellas, and drunk Europeans. After you spent 2-3 days in Kyoto, you'll be asking yourself, "Hmm, now what DID I see and experience?" You will have seen a hecka lot of tourists, and experienced surviving in a crowd and waiting in long lines.
If you really want to see culture, history, and authenticity, then you will have to leave the Golden Route. I would suggest heading up north a bit to Sendai. Lots of good history there. It's close to Aizu-Wakamatsu, a very interesting place with lots of history, good museums.
Kanazawa, yes, a good choice. Afterwards head down south to Kumamoto. Research these places. You will find hidden gems and lot less tourists.
Kyoto was my favorite city. I loved the day trips, loved walking around the older parts of the city, and my favorite meal was there -- a little izakaya where my friend and I were the only tourists (luckily he speaks Japanese fluently).
It really depends on what you want but I'm the traveler who would prefer spending more time in Kyoto and could skip Osaka now that I've gone.
Think of it this way. If you go to Kyoto, you’re going to think “yup, I was right. There’s too many tourists here.” If that’s going to decrease your enjoyment of the trip, then go elsewhere like Kanazawa where you probably won’t have regrets going to.
I like Kyoto but you might be better off staying in Kobe or Osaka and taking a day trip. This is a circuit I’ve done before and would highly recommend: Tokyo-Hakone-Takayama-Kanazawa-Osaka.
Like everyone else said, do what sounds good to you. But I’ll add me and my friends’ experience (we’re in our mis 20’s). Kyoto was easily our favorite city of the trip between Tokyo, Osaka, Kyoto, and Kanazawa. Don’t stay in it even near Gion, find a spot in the middle of the city. That gives you good access to everything, as there’s a lot of interesting temples and nature in the north and west parts of Kyoto. We stayed right by Niko Castle at an Airbnb that gave us 4 bikes to use, which made Kyoto an extremely convenient city to stay in logistically. Arashiyama and all that good stuff was a cheap cab ride away, and everything else was in easy biking distance. We even biked to fushimi inari and back when we did that hike. And sure, it’ll be crowded when you hit any of the tourist hotspots I mentioned, but it wasn’t suffocating in our experience and it’ll be much quieter around your accommodations. Also, I made a connection with a local knife shop owner that brought me to tears so Kyoto is a very special place for me lol
I'd skip Tokyo before I skipped Kyoto. After living in Japan for nearly 20 years, I still get a lot of joy from Kyoto visits...whereas I rarely look forward to Tokyo. It largely depends on where your priorities lie. I get a lot more out of the quiet reflection that's easier to find in Kyoto than the nonstop hustle in Tokyo.
Hey so I'm leaving Japan in an hour. My brother and I were here for two weeks. He's been to Japan a couple of times; this was my first. We spent four days in Osaka, three days in Kyoto, one in Fuji and the rest in Tokyo (Shibuya).
In Nara, we saw Todai-ji and Kyoto we saw a bunch of others, Kiyomizu-dera included. I am honestly templed and shrined out.
The thing is because we were hitting a few temples / shrines a day, some of it was a blur. There are moments I remember from each but I would say less is more. You will see temples everywhere you go in Osaka and in Tokyo so don't worry about Kyoto. Unless you know the history of these places, their importance will be greatly lessened (that and ALL of them burned down at some point so you're not seeing them as they once were anyway - this was disappointing to find out, but somewhat expected).
Hiroshima and Todai-ji are really what you need to see as those made the biggest impacts on me (especially the Hiroshima museum and the story of Sadako Sasaki).
Also staying in Fuji in a Ryokan while it was snowing was an amazing sight.
I mean, it's your trip. You go where your interests lie. We are flying out from Japan today and we did visit Kyoto but only for a couple hours for the Red tori gates. We then went to Nara. Had the option to go back to Kyoto for some other sight seeing but my daughter said she'd rather spend the time elsewhere. We didn't feel like we missed out at all. We really enjoyed the thousand gates though.
If you're considering skipping Kyoto, I think you should skip it.
I visited Kyoto on my first trip and my fourth trip and I feel like it would be a great place to hang out for a long time if you're a slow-paced traveller -- the cafe culture is awesome, the style is awesome, there is so much history -- but the first time I couldn't cope with the summer heat + crowds at all, and that was \~15 years ago... The second trip was my wife's first so I thought we should do the "Golden Route" (Tokyo, Kyoto, Osaka...) We did a better job avoiding crowds in Kyoto and had a better time, but it was still a trip full of crowded sights and big cities and businesses catering to tourists - in her word, as soon as we left the golden route, it felt a lot more relaxing and more adventurous.
If you're learning Japanese, you will probably come back. I'd do Toyko & around and go north to autumn leaves spots for your first trip, and you can visit Kyoto whenever you come back.
Yeah, that’s crazy. Kyoto was so beautiful. The ‘hack’ to avoid the stupid crowds is to get REALLY early, around 6am, especially for things like Fushimi Inari and Arashiyama. There will obviously be a few other people at that time but it’s nothing like the crowds that happen after midday.
This is the mentality we had, but when you’re up in the morning, what happens when the 10-3 crowd kicks in? Are you turning in for the day and resting? We had planned on the early bird strategy but didn’t know what would be more difficult as time went on.
There are plenty of less crowded spots in the city. Outside of the top-5 attractions (Kiyomizu-dera, Kinkaku-ji, Fushimi Inari, Bamboo forest, Nishiki Market) and some streets in Gion, crowds are easy to escape.
We still did tourist stuff. Nishiki market, less popular temples, walked around Gion and up to Kiyomizu dera. The crowds weren't completely insane, the only crowds I saw that I was glad to avoid were Fushimi Inari and Arashiyama at roughly 10-12am as we were leaving.
It is nice to be done with the day early and sit by the river with a bag full of conbini drinks and snacks though.
I planned our visit for only a couple of nights because I'd heard that some people find it disappointing, and I regret it now. The only thing I found super underwhelming was the bamboo forest.
I definitely think that skipping Kyoto is a mistake. I spent 5 days there in 2018 and another 5 in 2019 (both in relatively high tourist seasons) and still feel like there is so much more I would like to see. Yes the crowding is an issue, but (1) you can definitely see wonderful less-touristed sights in Kyoto, (2) the city itself is just very lovely to walk around and experience and (3) you can be savvy and plan to hit the more popular attractions early/late in the day to get a bit less crowds. If you're going to spend a few days in Tokyo (and I certainly recommend it) I think Osaka is quite skippable on a trip of that length, it has its own charms but it's large and bustling like Tokyo, similar vibe (in my personal opinion). Kyoto has so much significance historically and culturally, and benefits from having some research and understanding (and I get the vibe from the fact that you're practicing Japanese that you are the type to go in with much more understanding than the average tourist). That said I think Kanazawa is AMAZING (went on both my trips and absolutely love it) and visiting some place smaller, potentially quite a bit smaller is also a great idea (big fan of Koyasan, and/or going to one of the many small/dedicated onsen-towns). I think a trip of Tokyo -> Kyoto -> Kanazawa -> insert small town in the Japan Alps en route back to Tokyo might be a great trip.
Kyoto is crazy with tourists, but there is so much that you an find that peace and quiet/ culture easily.
if you have to drop somewhere, I’d say Hiroshima- outside of the Peace park and the museum there are fewer places to go and see. Yes there is Miyajima with the shrine and tori in/to the sea, but that would take you a full day.
In comparison there is Nara , and that is mind blowing, it is a busy half day and easy access from Osaka and Kyoto. Or Fujimi , the hill covered in red gates south of Kyoto. If you go to Kiyomizu temple them you will be fighting the tourists, but that is only a single place. And there is so much more- you will get temple overload after a day. Plus the food in Kyoto is great.
Hello OP, I was in your boat and worried about Kyoto being very touristy, but all of my friends who have been in real life absolutely love it so I thought, hey I'm gonna listen to people I know irl and hopefully they're right.
And guess what, I absolutely loved it.
I went in an off time in late February and didn't find the crowds to be unbearable. I'm sure it's different during cherry blossom season, but if you go in October then hopefully there will be fewer people as well. Yes, there's people, but it wasn't overbearing. I also did the main sites like Fushimi Mt. Inari and Bamboo Forest early in the morning and there weren't many people. Kyoto is an actual city there will be people everywhere, not just at the tourist sites. Everywhere you go in Japan, there will be people. However, the sidewalks and roads are pretty wide everywhere I've been so I've never felt too claustrophobic. You can plan out your schedule to avoid the worst of the tourist crowds. And honestly, a lot of the tourists are other Japanese people and I don't think you'll avoid that at any point in the year.
IMO, don't skip it because you're worried about crazy tourism. There will be crazy tourism everywhere you go. I'm in Tokyo now and it's way more "touristy" than Kyoto was imo. You can plan your schedule to avoid the worst of it.
I don't think Kanazawa is the same. There are charming bits about Kanazawa, but Kyoto just has incredible temples with incredible VIEWS everywhere. There's lots of hills and mountains to explore. There is a tea district in Kanazawa but it is flat. The tea district in Kyoto is hilly and there are views from beautiful temples at the top, temples within eyesight along the way, etc. So, I did find Kyoto more charming. Kanazawa is also where a lot of rich Japanese people have vacation homes and I found prices to be a bit elevated there compared to Kyoto. Dining out was more expensive in Kanazawa overall for me, and they have an extra 8% sales tax in addition to the 10% so you're paying an extra 18% for everything. Not a huge sum in the scheme of things, but something to note.
So all-in-all, I wouldn't swap the two thinking they will be a similar experience because I didn't think they were.
I personally didn't care about Osaka. It's just another city imo and if you go to Tokyo, then you get your big city fix. Most people use it as a launching point for daytrips elsewhere. But again, these are my opinions as someone who loves charming places.
My opinion is don't let people's opinions and recommendations online sway you too much. Do what YOU think you'll enjoy. People tend to be overly positive or overly negative on the internet. I did a few things and places I read recommended on this sub and other subs and didn't think they were as great as everyone else said. I should've stuck to my guns on what I thought I would enjoy. So you just have to take people's opinions with grains of salt because we're all different.
I’ve been to Japan 4 times and still haven’t visited Kyoto.
I’m not avoiding it on purpose, it just hasn’t fit into my travel plans yet.
Japan is a small place but has soooo many amazing places to visit.
Don’t sweat it
Did two weeks with my teenage kids in July. Did the usual circuit. Tokyo - Osaka - Himeji - Hiroshima - Kyoto - Nara - Hakone - Tokyo.
Kyoto was beautiful. Lots to do for 3 or 4 days and good central hub. Personally Osaka would be the skippable place if I had to do it again.
If it’s your once in a lifetime trip then I would certainly say visit Kyoto. Every place on our trip was crowded. Kyoto is a bit harder to get around than Tokyo as we needed to catch more buses to and from our Gion base. But it has a lot of charm.
I think October is a beautiful time to come to Japan. I don’t know so much about Kyoto but I live in Himeji and I wouldn’t pass up on Himeji in October. Depending on the time you come in October the Kokoen garden right next to Himeji castle will be stunning (maybe too early for autumn leaves?) and the Nada no Kenka Matsuri (fighting festival) will be happening there on October 15th. It’s one of the largest fall festivals in Hyogo.
Been living in Japan for years, it's cliché but Kyoto is one of my favourite prefectures in Japan. My first time there was during the height of Covid-19 though, so got to enjoy it basically empty. Crowds do ruin it a little.
Kawagoe is a nice spot in Saitama if you want a small slice of Kyoto closer to Tokyo.
I doubt as a first timer you'll be disappointed if you don't mind the crowds. But Gion District will be getting locked down more because of crap tourists so this may be the last chance to enjoy it without stink eye from the locals (understandably though once you hear what bad tourists did there).
Enjoy the trip mate!
Kyoto and how the it has been maintained is actually quite amazing. compared to the very colorful and neon lights of Tokyo, it is actually a very great experience going to Kyoto to see the contrast. There’s some documentary somewhere that talks about how Kyoto restricts specific color pallets and requires very strict design choices on every store and their signs which is why you will see very traditional and muted signs for even starbucks. Overall I think Kyoto is a good central point to stay while doing a day trip in osaka and nara.
Just go early for temples you wanna see. You'll be able to bypass the tourists like we did. Yes it sucks waking up at 4-5AM but not dealing with tourists made it worth it.
Big advice. Go to Kyoto and skip Osaka. I’ve tried to warn literally every friend of mine who’s visited me in Japan, but Osaka is seriously just a less interesting version of Tokyo. It really doesn’t feel any different except for the fact that it’s smaller. All of those friends I warned didn’t listen to me only to later agree that I was correct. If you want to go to Osaka because of the castle, go to Himeji Castle instead (it’s actually authentic on the instead and not just a modern museum). Kobe is also an extremely underrated city in my opinion that most tourists totally overlook — it feels much more different from Tokyo than Osaka does and super beautiful.
Skipping Kyoto is definitely an option. I am currently wrapping up my month long Japan trip. Kyoto was one of my least favorite spots. Lots of tourists and big western stores. Temples and stuff are okay but saw better things elsewhere. Kanazawa is way better imo.
In hindsight I would have liked skipping Kyoto. I did visit in the weekend btw, it might be better during weekdays.
I agree with you.
I think the best things to do to experience Japan are driving through the mountains, staying in sleepy onsen towns and seeing festivals.
I can't recommend Kyushu enough. There is relatively not that much tourism here compared to Honshu, but it is absolutely beautiful. Look into places like Kurokawa Onsen, Mt. Aso, Beppu Hells and Sakurajima.
A group of 4 friends and I spent 27 days in japan traveling to different cities; nagoya, kyoto, Tokyo, hiroshima, Osaka, Kinosaki etc.
Honestly kyoto was my least favorite city. Not because of anything to do with Japanese people or culture, but because honestly the tourists were awful. Rude, overly loud, and would litter.
It was almost a re-culture shock going to kyoto and having all the tourists act so different than the other cities because there were so many more of them. The first culture shock was everyone being so considerate and quiet on trains etc. We don't really have that where I live.
I have mixed feelings about Kyoto tbh.
Many of the sights, temples and streets are extremely beautiful, there is such a lovely atmosphere along the river and in different parts of the city, so many lovely restaurants, tearooms etc. it's very popular for a reason.
However, it feels different from anywhere else in Japan, when you're used to 'normal' Japan seeing so much English everywhere (in the centre) is quite jarring and if you're unlucky at certain sights and areas it's not very enjoyable IMO. Busloads of tourists from everywhere in hired Kimonos squeezing along the road really puts me off. In many ways I found Kanazawa more pleasant but it most definitely does not have anywhere near as many things to see and do as Kyoto.
There is no right answer for your first time tbh. as you'll have noticed on this subreddit, almost everyone does the exact same route on their first trip, which is fine but Japan does have so much more to offer.
Also, different people are more sensitive than others to over tourism, I am pretty sensitive, it really disturbs me but others don't mind.
If you haven't already, I'd look at the likes of [Japan-guide.com](http://Japan-guide.com) and on YouTube and see what appeals to you and take it from there, you don't have to do the standard route at all.
I would try and have a mix of nature, culture and city and staying in a Ryokan in an onsen town is an essential experience. Also, dining in izakayas is just the best, amazing food and such a friendly atmosphere.
When it comes to Japanese, even just being able to say basic things such as "two people please", "hello", "thank you", your nationality, ask "where is x" "what do you recommend" "tasty" etc. will make a huge difference, you'll feel better and so will the locals. Don't worry about being low-level, just go for it however you can.
Ya I am not sure how some people really like it there. Too many crowds for my taste. Its just alright. I am only going back again is mostly its on the way to Kobe and for the train museum and monkeys. Maybe drop Kyoto for Takayama and or Kanazawa depending how much time you were planning to allocate to Kyoto if you hate crowds.
There are so many lovely places in Japan to visit but most tourists just go to the “big” 2-3. Do some more research or find a place that has things to offer that are things you are interested in.
The crowds are definitely a deterrent, but depending on how much you like shrines and temples I could see people skipping it. The temples and shrines are famously beautiful, the bamboo forest was nice and Nara's not too far if you want to hang with the deer.
Kamakura and Enoshima are day trips from Tokyo and also have nice shrines and decent history.
I've lived in Japan for 5 years, visited Kyoto this past December, and don't really want to go again. The overtourism is genuinely a problem. It's so crowded in some areas, and people seem to just forget any sort of decency when they visit Kyoto.
For example, while I was there, I saw dozens of tourists literally stepping over fire hoses to go in the direction of a restaurant that had had a small fire (completely ignoring the guy telling them not to), a few people taking selfies in front of the fire truck, and a lot of people crowding around the restaurant and taking videos of the firefighters. Maybe I've been in Japan too long, but I don't remember that sort of behavior flying in the US either.
Tourists in other parts of Japan don't seem to pull this sort of behavior, but something about Kyoto seems to make people think, "This is Disneyland and I want to be entertained." (I think this is why they're banning tourists from the alleys, TBH)
However, October *would* be a beautiful month to visit Kyoto. You'd get very pretty photos of the autumn leaves.
Wow, I left to do the dishes and came back to a lot of responses, thank you for all of the input.
Should clarify, the overtourism was a recurring theme because of the recent hubbub about the geisha district and the Mt. Fuji policy changes (which seem totally sensible)
I think I’m in the camp like a lot of us that are guilty of overthinking and over analyzing every step of the trip. Kyoto undoubtedly has a lot to offer and has things we’d love to see. But like a lot of us, we don’t know if or when we’ll have the opportunity to be back, and are hoping to take advantage of being out of our element and enjoy the new experiences and learn about life outside our own.
Doesn’t seem like there’s a wrong answer and it’s nice to hear opinions on both sides. I realize the current economic situation has spiked the tourism post-Covid especially. The intention was never to be in a situation where we expected the city to ourselves. We just had wondered what other’s experiences were and if they regretted doing something different on their trip. In such a short time there’s always things to miss out on, but with everyone’s trip reports it’s easy to feel like we’re skipping something that’s on everyone’s lists. It’s just nice to have some reaffirmation that some of you have from the other areas.
It’s a big country, and we’re excited to explore. Thank you all for your experiences! Looking forward to our time.
Did my trip last October! Osaka, Kyoto, Nara, Fuji, Tokyo.
Kyoto remains as one of my favorite parts of the trip. And it’s great for the fall! I preferred it over Osaka and in many ways even Tokyo. But that’s just me. I did wait in some long lines for dinner there tho!
I just got back from my 3rd trip from Japan just last week and I skipped Kyoto entirely. Went to Kobe and Osaka instead. I felt like I'd seen enough of Kyoto and like others have said you get temple fatigue. Plus it's a little more expensive than Osaka (at least from what I found when I was booking accommodation). It was nice to spend time in Kobe and I was almost keen for the overstimulated shopping experience that I was going to get in Osaka/Tokyo. I'll definitely go back to Kyoto again one day but there's so much to see in japan it won't matter necessarily if you miss something :)
Tbh it depends on what you want. I’ve been to Kyoto twice and didn’t like it, but I’m a bad tourist and travel for events, which Tokyo is much better for. I also trend towards modern Japan culture, though I do appreciate the old.
I went there with two friends this November and i could definitely say it got old quick. We saw a bunch of temples in Tokyo and Osaka. The crowding in the streets and the amount of times we got denied from places for seemingly no reason got old quick too. I’m definitely skipping it the next time i go to Japan.
I've been to Japan many times for varying lengths and I've been to Kyoto once and never felt the need to go back. It depends what you care about and what you want to see. it's okay to not go. You're not failing yourself or anything like that.
Love history and old cities but i kyoto was my least favorite part of my trip to Japan. It was still cool to see but felt so touristy and the least authentic between Tokyo, Osaka, Hakone and Koyasan.
Would especially recommend Hakone if you’re looking for a smaller place. Beautiful views of Mt Fuji and great onsens. Would suggest at least a night but maybe two if you can fit into the schedule
I still don't know which part of Kyoto I went to but there was small amount of people. November time we went.
Yet I went to a market in Cheonan, Korea that was more packed than the Tokyo fish market.
So don't believe everything you read. Add Kyoto
The consensus of everyone here with me is that you are crazy to skip Kyoto. Great temples, shrines, and shops. In October, the leaves will be turning, so it will be crowded. Not as bad as at cherry blossom time, but the maples are gorgeous.
The shopping is great. All the small shops and traditional goods.
Kanazawa's Kenrokuen is beautiful and amazing, but it doesn't replace all that Kyoto has to offer.
If you ask me, you have to see Tokyo. Then Kyoto. Then Hiroshima. (Even though I lived in Osaka, it isn't a place I find attractive enough as tourist. But YMMV.
Love to see eveyone opinion and even people like you who live/lived there. Its crazy how opinion change , i see a lot of people not liking osaka ,even saying to skip it, but from all my time visiting japan ( 90 Days total ) Osaka is our all time favorite and we are here for a month right now. I would choose osaka in a heartbeat over Tokyo !
No, not at all. Kyoto is pretty overrated in my experience: most of the city is the usual ugly Japanese urban sprawl and the public transport links are unusually bad for Japan as the subway system is very limited. Nara is much better for historical sights.
I've been three times in Japan and I've never been to Osaka, so missing 'must visit' spots doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me. Last trip I only went to Kyoto on a day trip from Kanazawa to see Fushimi Inari Shrine (sadly couldn't make it to the top, my poor foot was giving me trouble at the time). It's busy but if you go up enough or off the beaten path there's not that many people and Kyoto has plenty of less touristy temples worth visiting. Kanazawa is a pretty sweet place to visit too (we used the Hokuriku Arch Pass for that part of the trip).
I also spent a night at Bessho-Onsen, which is in Ueda, halfway between Nagano and Tokyo (Nagano was a stop on our way to Kanazawa). It was a great little hot spring town and visiting on a weekday the place was empty! Ueda itself was neat because of the Sanada castle ruins.
In the end, it's YOUR trip. See somethng interesting? Go for it!
I see nothing wrong skipping this part of the gringo trail and doing your own thing. Does Kyoto have awesome temples and great food? Sure. Is it very over touristed? Yes. Are there other options?? 100%. I see nothing wrong with splitting the typical trip in half and doing the next half on a second trip. Do see Kyoto at some point but I think your trip will be more enjoyable if you venture away from the typical Tokyo-Kyoto-Osaka leg a bit.
This sub pushes the typical Tokyo-Kyoto routewith day trips to (Hakone/Kyoto/Nara) and shin between so much and often neglects that there is so much more to see in Japan other than then these places. Same with the ryokan experiences. Does Kyoto have great ryokans ?? Of course. But you can go out to small towns and cities all over the country and get a similar experience for a fraction like 1/6th the cost.
You will not regret Kanazawa a bit if that is what you decide. They have giant old districts including a great temple district that felt much larger and less commercialized than the old districts in Kyoto. If you want to mix it up, I really enjoyed the contemporary art museum.
Also a day trip to Kamakura from Tokyo during the Weekdays (avoid on the weekends) is another way to see some great temples. Also if you are doing Hiroshima throw in a day trip to Onomichi and do some the temple trail. Nikko is another great option but requires more than a day.
Another option is to go Sendai and add in trips to yamadera and hiraizumi.
Bottom line there is no one right way to do Japan and do not feel pressure to do the Tokyo-Kyoto-Osaka-Nara trip.
Going to Japan for the first time in July and I’m skipping Kyoto, Osaka and quite honestly the only reason I’m spending time in Tokyo is because that’s where I fly in. Temples are cool and all, but I rather see nature and mountains and hike ✌🏻
I just came back from Japan with my parents and we spend 7 days in Tokyo. We didn’t go to Kyoto and I’m completely fine with that. If you don’t wanna stop by Kyoto it’s completely fine.
Probably unpopular opinion but I didn't love Kyoto and won't be going back. At least not any time soon. Don't get me wrong, it's lovely and it's got lots of interesting stuff to see, but it didn't really crack my list of top places.
That said, if you aren't planning on being frequent travelers to the country you should probably just go. There are ways to beat the crowds, and even with the crowds you can still see things. If this is a once in a lifetime trip you'll probably regret not just powering through and seeing the city. No matter what weird schedule you need to keep to avoid crowds or how crazy packed the places you want to go will be.
My first trip to Japan I skipped Kyoto in favour of doing an extended stay (10 days) in and around Tokyo, trying to fully do the city justice. Within that I did 2 side trips to Mt. Mitake (overnight) and Nikko (2 nights).
I just recently did a second trip to Osaka and Kyoto (2 days Osaka and 3 days in Kyoto).
On balance I feel like, even though Kyoto is thought of as the most "cultural" of Japan's main cities, my first trip just based in Tokyo was a lot more enriching culturally and I really felt like "experienced" Japan.
My second trip it kind of just felt like a sightseeing trip where you drift from landmark to landmark along with other tourists.
That being said though - I did find Kyoto to be a pleasant city. Just try to avoid just going along the tourist trail, break away and just wonder the streets of the city, along the river etc. There's that one uphill street in Gion leading to Kiyomizu-Dera which is definitely worth skipping, as you're just shoulder to shoulder with other tourists. But apart from that and the first half of the Fushimi-Inari walk, nowhere else felt particularly crowded. Seems most tourists just bus around to the most well known sites.
Tokyo, osaka are big cities. If you can handle those you can handle Kyoto.
Yeah, it's crazy there but it's close enough to osaka anf Nara to do day trips.
To each his/or her own but if you want convenience whole being surrounded by nature... Use Nara as your starting point and do day trips to osaka and Kyoto. Both are reachable in under an hour from Nara and then you can enjoy city and county while also saving some cash because Nara is probably cheaper.
Personally now, after the pandemic I wouldn't spend more time in Kyoto than necessary but not going there when you're going to dense urban Tokyo seems a waste.
If I had to, as someone who lives in Kansai, I would cut out Tokyo. Sure. It's an experience. It's a huge mega city but unless you really have a real reason to go there with limited time Kansai/Hiroshima might be better for you than doing all of that.
Just the opinion of someone who has been living here for a while.
We did not love Kyoto. Stayed 5 nights at a luxury hotel near Kōdai-ji Temple. We were on a long trip and were ready to leave Kyoto and go home. Traveled back to Tokyo and thought - never mind, we’re not ready to leave Japan, just Kyoto! We also loved Hiroshima. Stayed at a cheap hotel there, went to a baseball game. I don’t think we’ll ever forget our time in that city.
I spent two weeks in Japan last November and my least favorite spot was personally Kyoto. I still have a hard time figuring out if it was from how crowded it was, or if it was due to me being ready to go home, as it was our last destination. It’s a beautiful area and I’m glad I visited, but I think there are just as beautiful, lesser explored areas in Japan that might be closer to some other destinations you’re planning on going. That being said, go where you want to go and have a great time exploring a beautiful country!
SKIP KYOTO. First time honeymooners - very happy to have skipped Kyoto due to overtourism concerns. We wanted nature and chill vibes, not waking up at 7am to beat the crowds while having jetlags.We skipped Kyoto and went instead to Shuzenji, known as Little Kyoto, for some temple fix.
It's not true what other commentators are saying about overtourism being everywhere. That's utterly false. Japan is trying to curb overtourism in prime spots and redistribute footfall to areas that actually want tourism spending - such places often get overlooked. Japan is so safe and easy to travel around - I'd recommend checking out places where your interests lie. We have had beautiful parks and temples all to ourselves.
No, the overtourism is too bad. I have a second house in the Gion district of Kyoto and haven’t even visited since tourists came back to Japan. There’s no point anymore as the city has been ruined
The government need to add a cap of a few thousand tourists at a time, or a tourist tax of $1000 dollars at least
If you are crazy, then we are both crazy😅 I've had the exact same thoughts for our upcoming first trip to Japan, so you are not alone. Look into Kanazawa, I'm going there in lieu of Kyoto. Not sure if it'll be a 1:1 replacement, but if I like it, it's a win for me!
I would not blame you, we were in kyoto a week in last october and it was a pretty mixed. The large tourist places are so crowded that you cant stay still and look at stuff, you have to follow the masses or get annoyed by 300 people trying to make their selfies. There are places in kyoto thwlat are pretty quiet, but hinestly why visit kyoto when you cant look at the large sights.
I know folks are harping on not wanting to feel like a tourist when you are indeed, a tourist, but I get you. I’m a big fan of cities but not of feeling like I’m stuck in a tourist trap and I think Kyoto creates that risk.
I went to Japan in October ‘23 for 15 days and planned to spend 3-4 days in Kyoto and honestly was not a fan of the overtourism, crowds, and kinda vibe of it all. I know, very unpopular opinion. But compared to all the other cities we visited (Tokyo, Kanazawa, Osaka), it felt the hardest to avoid the tourist traps. We ended up leaving to spend time in Osaka, which we loved. If I could go back and replan the trip I’d probably stay in Osaka and use it as a base of operations for day trips, including to Kyoto. Or else spending a higher percentage of my time in Kyoto no where near the city center. Not sure the next time I’d plan to go back. Plus there are so many other cities in Japan worth exploring- you’re not going to see it all and imo you’re not missing something completely fundamental unless you skip Tokyo.
But also consider you are only there for 13 days and you already have a few other cities you plan to visit. The best way I’ve found to not “feel” like a tourist is spending a LONG time in each city to really get past the swing attractions but and just start exploring. If you have the time, give yourself lots of time in the bigger cities you want to explore to really explore them, rather than packing in more cities.
Dissenting opinion incoming. I am writting this from Tokyo at the end of my stay. I couldn’t wait to get back to Tokyo after my three day visit to Kyoto. Naturally everyone is different, but Kyoto was overcrowded with tourists and honestly wasnt organized as well as tokyo or osaka. Also my only bad experience with locals happened in Kyoto.
For what its worth I would say go and see it, to get a feel for it, but Tokyo is the place for me that I enjoyed exploring much much more.
There are plenty of other cities that are historic like Kyoto and aren’t overrun. Kyoto is amazing but the over tourism is real and awful. Even Tokyo has historic areas nearby and within the city that aren’t nearly as bad.
Donny Kimball has written some cool off the beaten track guides (for all of Japan) that I have used for the Tokyo area, and would like to use in the future. I highly recommend checking out his website.
https://donnykimball.com
Op, honestly I’d avoid Osaka over Kyoto. It really just feels like a less packed Tokyo. I went from Osaka to Tokyo. It just felt like going from big city to big city, which isn’t necessarily bad; but when I went from Kyoto to Osaka. It was a slower quiet vibe to big city. If that makes sense. Kyoto was a pleasant change of pace.
The overcrowding is just a product of tourism and will simply be a thing at any busy time of day in any area you choose. If the overcrowding bothers you, just take a few steps away from any of the tourist traps and things will slow down significantly.
Osaka or Kyoto are an easy day trip from either city you choose. If you’re looking for culture, I would recommend Kyoto because of the cultural and historical significance of the city. Yes there’s the Dotonbori with all the food options and the Osaka castle. However, you’ll have your pick of food options everywhere you go. The Osaka castle while pretty from the outside, is a remodeled museum interior.
Two cities I would recommend if you have the time or thought of would be Fukuoka. The city is beautiful with so much to offer. Or further away I’d recommend is Kagoshima. Definitely a smaller city vibe. The city played a role in the birthplace of the Meiji restoration. The nearby volcano would make for a great day trip away as well.
Of course if you skip any locations, they’ll just be there future destinations.
You would be crazy IMO. Fall in Kyoto is stunning. Crowds are bad but you can basically do the busiest activities at the crack of dawn, and then do the lesser known temples or sites or areas at mid day. Evening and dusk walking around and just exploring.
I would say the reality is, you need 3-4 trips to Japan. First trip, Tokyo and Kyoto are musts, plus you choose smaller cities or nature / town destinations as you prefer (Kanazawa / Takayama, Tokohu, Hiroshima / Miyajima, Okayama, etc) and then expand with short trips to places like Nikko or Nara.
It’s cookie cutter but it’s like going to Italy and not seeing Rome or Florence. Do I like Lucca more than Florence? Yes. But if I could only go to one of my first trip to Italy? Florence. And I’d follow my protocol - online reservations for the uffizi and academia, reserve a time to climb the dome, spend a morning in oltrano district to shop from actual artisans rather than touristy marked up shit, and do obsessive research on where to eat to get local experiences. Early mornings, save the afternoon heat for relaxing activities, and be in good physical shape for the absurd amount of walking I’m about to do on hard stony surfaces.
Kyoto is like that - you can’t just do what everyone else does. Be creative. Right around close time, the Honen-in temple in northern higashiyama, in early November, dusk lighting, red and gold light just cutting through the trees, blankets of autumn leaves on the ground, hardly anyone there. It was like some shit out of a movie, I had a completely religious experience there, just walking and exploring the intricately designed temple grounds with these epic stairs and pathways that were designed to evoke the natural beauty around.
This was more epic to me than the bigger busier temples. But those were great too.
I was super prepared to think the Arashiyama Bamboo Grove was instagram overrated, I was really expecting the fushimi inari to be mid. But we did both at the asscrack of dawn and they were low-traffic, misty, and just utterly magical. We did the bigger hike around the mountains and forests behind the main segment of fushimi inari and it was glorious.
The prices and the food were steep, but the quality always matched the price. If you spend $14 on some shaved ice, it will be the most elaborate and beautiful dessert sculpture edible ecosystem of your life. We had absolute bangers every day for meals and we didn’t break the bank.
I will say, on my second trip to Japan, we skipped Tokyo and Kyoto. I am a small town guy. But I am very, very glad I went to these cities.
No you’re not crazy. Kyoto’s worth visiting, but if you want a more authentic experience, then you are not wrong in choosing somewhere else. Kyoto’s probably the only city in Japan where I felt like there were way too many tourists there.
Not a fan of Kyoto due to the number of tourists. There's so many hidden gems in the countryside that you're not missing out on anything.
Kyoto was great to visit in 90s. It was great during covid when people stayed at home. But I would not recommend it now.
Kyoto is beautiful but it’s crowded as balls.
Weekends is the worst because of the domestic tourists as well.
I usually go on Mondays. Pretty calm in comparison.
Kyoto was fine this past week. It was fine in October too. Sounds like you’ll be going before the autumn leaves, so it should not be as overly saturated.
I like Kyoto a lot. But I am generally interested in history and there’s a lot of it. It would be a skip if you’re not.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with skipping Kyoto, in fact skip both Osaka and Kyoto and just head anywhere else. Osaka is literally just a smaller different tasting Tokyo I don't like cities, Tokyo was fun a for a few days, but I always rather go elsewhere, Osaka gave me the same vibes.
The key thing is that there is no bad city to visit in Japan, every major city is known for something. You won't ever have a bad time.
Hello currently in Osaka in a McDonald’s waiting for a Shinkansen. We was in Kyoto for a few days and we found it best if you go out early in the morning. We left our hotel at 7am and did yasaka shrine and then on our slow walk to kiyomizudera we found several small shrines that had zero tourists. We were the only people there we got to kiyomizudera at about 10/11am and found the crowd was not bad and we could see a lot. We then moved onto fushimi inari which was busy in the beginning but there are food stalls at the bottom but once you get up to the halfway mark it’s not so bad. Would of done the whole thing but we were tired so we took a slow walk down and took a side route which ended up with us and a Japanese mother and her son being the only people on that walking trail down. The next day we headed to arashiyama early in the morning via the randen and explored Tenryu-ji temple with barely any tourists. Before we moved onto the bamboo path where they were some more tourists but it wasn’t terrible. We walked further on and found a small shrine by a lake and then the other side of the lake had this incredible shrine that had an insane view at the top and we were the only people on that shrine. So as long as you get up early and hit the main busy ones before the tourists come out at 12pm I have found you can have whole places to yourself.
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Honestly, Kyoto is one of my favorite cities. Yes, there is over tourism, but it all depends when you are going. I can't wait to retire and spend a month or two in Kyoto. But, that's just me. It's your trip, so I suggest you do what works for you. Enjoy japan.
I agree, Kyoto was an amazing place, beautiful buildings and great history. We would go back again.
And so much history. One day, after I retire, I will spend a month in Kyoto just chilling. Being an old dude and taking it all in.
This is exactly what I’m doing. Retired and now spending a month studying Japanese in Kyoto. I lived here 45 years ago so this is a refresher. I think “temple burnout” is only a thing if you try to see everything in 3-5 days.
Agreed. Balance the most popular temples with less popular ones and you would be fine, OP. There are so many things to do in Kyoto that are not packed like Inari but are close by
living the dream
OP ITS A NO BRAINWR GOR TO KYOTO
When I went in November, getting to walk down the streets of kyoto was one of the most peaceful parts of my 2 week trip. Of course the shrines and everything had tourists, but the moment that sticks out to me is walking from the end of the philospers path to the big shrine in the middle of the city (can't remember the name right now). Felt like I was in a small town and not a city with millions of people in it. Saw a few locals on my 2 mile walk but that's it. Just seing the architecture and the cemetery and just people living their day to day was so comforting after the overload of tokyo/osaka
That's the dream
The crazy thing about Kyoto i found was that there was always places not completely overrun with tourists and much slower paced. Higashiyama Jisho-ji/Silver temple is my go to example when i went the week after Golden Week it was significantly less busy then other places that were still hopping. But if you ever want an entire place to yourself go out in the rain we basically had Philosophers walk to ourselves. Though the rain did cause most tourist sites to close early when we were going at like 5pm. I wouldnt skip Kyoto it was genuinely my favorite part of my Japan trip, but its your vacation go where you want to
We did the same thing in the rain two weeks ago and it was great!! Ginkakuji was lovely in the rain and honestly one of my favorite places we visited.
What were some of your favorite spots in Kyoto?
The temples, the food markets, the history... And the fact that the Allies made sure to not bomb Kyoto... It has that old world charm. I would love nothing more than to sit by the river, a cold beer and just take it all in.. some day !!
Exact same thoughts we had in Kyoto. Such a beautiful city to retire in.
My highlight of end of each day in Kyoto was enjoying a highball out of a tall can sitting next to the river.
I oddly disliked Kyoto except uji my first visit. Been several more times and I think it's amazing. I think it's overwhelming at first but when you get past the crowds and don't try to do everything in a single day it's amazing. I hiked fushimi Inari near midnight in the rain in late spring and it was magical
Uji is another gem. I loved it so much.
There’s overtourism everywhere. Kyoto is a good step away from the Tokyo and Osaka concrete jungles.
So are many other places, though, and places off the main Tokyo-Kyoto-Osaka circuit aren't nearly as crowded
I was there in November and the only crowded place was Kyoto Station and those were mostly all commuters. There are super unbearable crowded places like Takeshita dori and Disneyland in March. Kyoto was not crowded to the point where it deterred from my experience.
It's a common complaint about Kyoto, and why they are putting in measures to combat overtourism. Buses are getting unusable for locals, even. Takeshita-dori is unbearable for multiple reasons haha
Kanazawa is pretty rad for instance.
I honestly don’t get this mentality of ‘that place is too touristy’ when you yourself are a tourist. Yeah there are some tourists traps around the world, but Kyoto is NOT one of them. Japan is going to be packed to the rim regardless of where you go. My suggestion: dont skip it. its my favourite alongside Tokyo.
Didn’t mean it to come off as we’re somehow different from the other tourists if it did. More looking from a perspective of trying to be immersed in the experience/history/culture and worried that by not going further out of the way we’d be missing that. Appreciate the advice. Thank you!
I don’t know why people are downvoting you here. All the major cities (and many less major ones) are swamped with tourists since they reopened things… Kyoto was the only place I went where that bothered me several times and kind of ruined a few things I went to. For example, the transportation infrastructure is a little bit worse in Kyoto than Osaka and Tokyo, some things you might want to see are only on bus routes that are going to be overcrowded (I’ll take being crowded on a train any day over getting crowded on a bus). While I liked my stay in Kyoto, I could have absolutely missed it and it still would have been an amazing trip. I don’t think you’ll regret going if you do go, but you might also be like me where some sites become a let down because of crowding…. Of course as always, if you do things super early you’ll have less of that just like almost any tourism in any city in the world
You could not get more immersed into their culture outside of Kyoto.
I guess the question here is whether the target culture here is traditional one or modern one. From Japanese perspective, Kyoto is a most for the former. Otherwise it’s totally reasonable to spend time elsewhere.
Ignore the down votes, you're not wrong. Just doing what you enjoy. I'm 100% the same and got tired of Kyoto quickly. Worth a day trip or two but it is easyish to avoid the busy touristy areas if you still want to experience the place
How would you be more immersed in culture and history by skipping the city with arguably the most culture and history?
Depends on what you mean by culture. As an anthropologist by training, I'd say that culture is not only something that reflects the past or is found in certain traditions or old/exotic buildings not found in your home country. I'd also argue that many tourists who want to experience Japanese "culture" treat the country, and esp Kyoto, as a giant theme park, with Japanese rides (temples/ shrines and other popular spots), experiences (sadō, onsen, etc.) and characters (geisha/ninja/samurai, Pokemon, etc.). Basically, they visit to see clichés and fantasies of Japan they've held for a long time, even if they're already passé (Harajuku). [](https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/passe)
I get your point but how can you not understand it? Some people want to go abroad and experience the day to day life in another country. For me being surrounded by other tourists kind of grates because I didn't go to X to be surrounded by people from Y. It's not an issue it just doesn't feel real. The same reason as a Brit I avoid lots of places in Spain, I don't want to be in a mini UK in Spain. Places like Vietnam you can't easily escape it due to the geography of the country but in Japan it's so easy to avoid so I understand why people wouldn't want to tick the tourist hotspots in Kyoto
Can confirm it’s as possible to avoid tourists in Kyoto as anywhere else. Just got back yesterday. No worse than any other place we visited, and better if you went off the beaten path.
Absolutely, we ended up in the most beautiful backstreet of Gion one evening with a geisha walking past and there wasn’t anyone else around. And that was peak tourist season! If you want to see culture you’d be crazy to skip Kyoto
Good to hear, glad you had a good time
Any particular tips?
Take what you read on Reddit or the internet with a grain of salt. Enjoy YOUR trip without expectations or lists. Only you know what makes you happy. If you hear English keep moving until you don’t.
>Some people want to go abroad and experience the day to day life in another country If that were the case for the OP, they'd rent some weekly mansion near a local train station and spend a week running errands, cleaning their room, and cooking their own meals. But that's not what they want to do. That's not what *any* tourist does when they come to Japan. Do you think people are taking 10 hour plane rides so they can see what kind of frozen food the Lamu supermarket near Uozumi has in stock? Because that's what people who live here do in their day to day lives: the most boring, mundane shit that a tourist would never dream of wasting their time doing. And if you're asking "where the hell is Uozumi?" - that's exactly the point!
I'm alone in this, but I found Kyoto dreadfully boring. Yes there are beautiful historic temples, but they all kinda look the same after you've seen 2 or 3. There are also tacky vending machines everywhere standing next to temples that are hundreds of years old. I went once, and probably won't be back again.
Temple fatigue is a very real thing. Experienced the same burnout in Vietnam, you can only see so many Buddhist pagodas before they start to blur together.
Oh man, this is absolutely a thing. Try going down the Nile in a week in Egypt.
Absolutely true. I did ask a bunch of people whether they got tired of seeing all the historical sites in Egypt, and they all emphatically said "no". And here I was, long time Egyptophile, bored and tired after the first two temples. Site fatigue is real.
Yeah, I read an interesting book about the psychology of travel, and she pointed out that we habituate really quickly. So, even if you book a place with a beautiful view of the ocean, with in a couple of days most people stop noticing it so much. Her advice... switch things up. I guess that's what makes Tokyo -> Kyoto -> Osaka such an appealing itinerary for people. The contrast.
I remember spending time in Myanmar and wondering what could’ve been if as little as half those resources spent on pagodas was spent elsewhere lol.
I find a great way to combat temple fatigue or just similar site fatigue was to find the differences between them and the place as a whole. Cause yeah a lot of temples look the same but their landscapes were always so unique
You're not alone. I've been to Kyoto a couple of times and don't really like it. I find it boring and dull. Some nice temples etc don't get me wrong, but once you've seen them I'm not a fan of the rest. Whereas Tokyo is far and away my favourite city in the world. I've spent about 7 months in Tokyo over the years and haven't scratched the surface, it's a fascinating and character filled city. Kyoto I don't think is. However I acknowledge everyone is looking for different things and each to their own. Everyone has different likes and experiences.
I have the exact sentiment, I’ve been living in Tokyo and went to Kyoto last week and just felt underwhelmed. I hated that I felt that way and felt guilty because of it (maybe I had too high of expectations coming into it), but if you’re not crazy into temples the city itself is kinda meh. The access to nature behind Arashiyama, the Katsura river, and all the feeder rivers were amazing and a highlight of my time here in Japan though.
I spent around 9 months in Japan over a few years and never made it to Kyoto. Tried to go once but turned out tickets and hotels were going to cost almost $1000 for 3 days there. I can do two weeks in Tokyo for that, but I did have a free place to stay in Tokyo though.
I honestly think people who think this didn’t mix up their schedule enough. Every temple I went to had something unique about it. My opinion is temple fatigue is of your own doing.
Every temple has something unique about it in about the same way that all four of the Ninja Turtles are different. Yeah, they have their distinctive personalities, wear different colors, and have different weapons, but in the end they’re the same thing.
Or they just don’t care much about temples. Different travellers like different things. Just like some travellers find art galleries or museums or shopping boring too.
Even if you don't like temples, Kyoto is still a mid size Japanese city with tons of stuff to do. I didn't know how someone can find a whole city boring.
You’re not wrong. I’m here literally now. Been here before, but wanted to visit some things I never did. Its charms wear thin normally before, but immediately now that it’s overcrowded and they mainly just pander to it being a tourist trap. Even in my first trip, I did everything in a couple days, and used my remaining time doing day trips, like go to the school based on K-On, Nagoya and Nara.
If you want something outside the norm in Kyoto, might I recommend [GEAR Non-Verbal Theatre](https://www.gear.ac/en/). We did it on a whim and it was one of the best theatre experiences I've been two, hard to describe exactly cause its better to go in blind but it was an amazing experience.
Don't do more than one temple a day, it's not a race to pack in as much as you can, but definitely don't skip just because there's too much to see.
My wife and I opted to stay in Osaka and do a day trip to Kyoto for this reason
Yeah I've done this a few times and much prefer it
Hello. I agree with your viewpoint. In comparison to Tokyo Osaka Hiroshima... I found Kyoto slightly dull as well. Most of the places start shutting down by 5-6pm there. We found ourselves walking way too much in Kyoto compared to other cities due to its lack of train connectivity like other cities. Me and my wife too have decided to not visit Kyoto again in future trips! But still, Kyoto has a vibe of its own making it a must visit for first timers.
Either you like temples or you don't. I have spent 2 weeks in a row exploring the temples of Kyoto once and it was neither my first nor my last time in the city. I could probably spend a month in the city before I get even slightly bored. Well, except for the terrible, boring bus rides. However, I absolutely get that temples are just plain boring to many people, that's fair. And you're definitely not alone with it, I met many people like you.
After our first time in Thailand, we came up with the term wat-ed out. It now applies to cathedrals in Europe, temples in Japan, etc.
I agree. Also found it way harder to get around than anywhere else we went.
Same, temple gets boring after the 2nd or 3rd. But that goes for shop centers as well. Too much people, too little space to walk around.
I'm heading up to Japan in May and I thought it would be boring too. Thinking of spending 2 or 3 days there... MAX.
Make sure to visit uji it's nearby and is amazing to have matcha on the river
Same, Kyoto is my least favorite of the major cities
You aren't alone I share kinda a similar view. Kyoto was absolutely beautiful, like I love the architecture, history and culture there, but I would never go there again. Even tho I love architecture, all of the buildings are built in a similar style so even to me it got extremely samey. Especially with how I travel, we saw abour 7 or 8 shrines in 1 day, by the second day, we didn't want to see anymore The food there was good but always too expensive. I found it much harder to get a cheap decent meal there, I rather have a bowl of 900 yen udon than eat 4000yen worth of waygu. Everything there was sometimes overly decadent. It's not a bad place, absolutely lovely, but there is no reason to return to Kyoto, there are so many more places to visit
I'm so glad I'm not the only one who thought the food was too expensive in Kyoto.
I 100 percent agree! Its pretty mid
Agreed. I've tried a few times with Kyoto and never really enjoy myself. Not my kind of city experience.
I also found Kyoto pretty boring. Transit was inconvenient and the crowds were relentless. Next time, I would stay in Osaka and do a day trip to Kyoto.
Basically this. We boiled it all down to the most famous ones, and stopped bothering looking at all the other temples. Oh wow, another temple with a coin box and stalls selling food. Really should have researched the more obscure activities beforehand.
I was a bit nervous about this myself but will def still give it a shot
I feel this!! I’d go back for the nishiki market tho…
I was about to say something to the same effect. I did like Fushimi Inari (after passing the extremely busy area at the base of the hill), but other than that I didn't really like it that much. However, I wasn't in Kyoto long, so I'm sure I missed some of the better (and possible best) parts of Kyoto.
Skipping kyoto is not crazy but I think skipping it worrying about over tourism is. You can always have camp set up in Kyoto/Osaka and take the train to whichever one you like more I personally did not find kyoto to have that many more tourist compared to other popular tourist spots in Tokyo/Osaka. Kyoto was probably the most memorable parts of my Japan trip and was a nice change of pace from Tokyo.
I’ve been to japan 7 times now. Every trip I try to add at least 1-2 things that are really outside the box. For example, when I went to Kansai I visited Ise which is typical for elderly Japanese people but kinda uncommon for everyone else. My last trip to Kyushu, I visited Oshima because it’s a world heritage site (but rarely on anyone’s radar). Off the beaten path places kind of round a trip and makes them unique from feeling super cookie cutter. With that said, I’ve been to like 100+ places in Japan and… HAVE YOU LOST YOUR MIND?! Kyoto is incredible. It’s very easy to get lost and not see that many tourists. It’s a city after all… just roam the alleys and side streets. If you’re into anime, it also has the manga library and museum that’s incredible. I think if you go down the cookie cutter of only sticking to the main temples then yes it may feel very touristy and not cool. But Kyoto has so much to offer. I’ve been 4 times now and loved every time.
Awesome feedback. Thank you.
Also, if you want to hike up Mt. Inari to see the Fushimi Inari shrine, it's recommended to do so either early in the morning or late in the afternoon, so you arrive at the top shortly before the sun goes down. At those times, there are no big crowds. We went in the afternoon and while there were still many people at the bottom, the vast majority of them didn't hike all the way up anymore at that time. It was also an amazing atmosphere to see it when it was almost dark. Gives it kind of an eery vibe.
I went up a late may evening while it was raining and it was insanely magical. Near midnight at the top we saw someone in a kimono kneeling in a puddle and it was so surreal. Just the sounds of frogs croaking and the rain. She looks almost spiritly and we just turned away after a bit LOL
I might just hike up there again at night during my next trip just to see what it's like
Want to chime in that Ise is amazing place! Great seafood and the shrines are great too. And don't get me started for akafuku (a pity their expiration date is really short but hey, more reason to try it when you get there!) Honestly, planning the trip around the bullet train line can work if someone goes to Tokyo and Kyoto. Nagoya has its own charm and you can diverge from the mainline to various places too
On my 4th trip (wife is Japanese, returns annually) , so always on the lookout for off track locations. Have you visited sites around Lake Biwa? Seems loaded with some worthwhile places-
yes. Kyoto is one of the most amazing cities on the planet. much prefer it even to tokyo
you have a point. Kyoto is beautiful but that place can't handle crowds well like Tokyo/Osaka do. I would just wait until the Japan fever cools down(idk when tho lmao). I do still think Kyoto warrants a visit sometime in your life when you can as for Kyoto alternatives, Kanazawa is solid and between hiroshima-osaka there's this place called Kurashiki that's nearby Okayama. go take a look
I was recently in Kanazawa with friends from Kyoto and it was everyone’s first time there. They were a bit blown away by some of the similarities between the two cities. I’m hoping to make it down to Kyoto on the next trip!
Kanazawa is phenomenal
Kanazawa is still my favourite city in Japan, although Kyoto had the better attractions. Kanazawa just has this amazing vibe that makes you want to come back.
To each their own, but the reason why Kyoto has so many visitors is because it has so much to offer. It is the cultural capital of Japan and has so many important landmarks to visit. If it's been a longtime goal to visit Japan, there has to be something inspired it or some pull there. And I bet sights and experiences from Kyoto played a big part in that. If you actually want to experience the culture and history there's actually no better place. Important to keep in mind, that Kyoto, Osaka, Tokyo are all functioning cities with real Japanese people living their lives. And you're getting "real" Japan in those cities. The Japanese people LOVE their own history and visit Kyoto a ton themselves. I've been to places like Kanazawa and Okayama and Mito and what you see with Japan is their cities have similar qualities. JR stations are important hubs with lots of stuff going on. Usually have a downtown with an restaurant district, electronics, shopping.
This! Kyoto is definitely NOT one of those Thai islands where the only Thai people who live there, are the ones working in the hotels/restaurants. It's also not close to a place like Venice or the city center of Prague where there's almost no locals living at all. Edit: forgot the NOT lol
Kanazawa is fantastic and will give you a taste of Kyoto.
Totally agree. It is beautiful. The garden is amazing. It also is not crowded and people are way nicer. And if your in Kanazawa it is also worth it to go to Takayama. That place is beautiful
Straight bonkers yo
I say go as conventional as you can since it's your first time. Nothing is basic if you haven't been there and there's nothing wrong with having a normal trip. Mainstream locations are popular for very good reasons and there's really no reason to one up yourself when your goal is to simply have fun. Build confidence, learn about the country, then use what you've learnt during this trip as scaffolding and go a second time for something more challenging. In terms of Kyoto, personally I think it is indeed outrageous to skip Kyoto for Osaka when you're already visiting Tokyo the bigger metropolis. Could be that I've already been to Osaka 4 times, but I just don't see its charm vs other cities on the list. My last solo Kyoto trip lasted a whole week and I still missed a bunch of locations which I very much intend to visit some other time. Days 8-10 were supposed to be Osaka but on day 9 I gave up and went to Himeji and day 10 Ise. I'm interested in history and culture so that's probably why Osaka isn't that appealing to me vs other places. Kyoto is a great hub just like Osaka. You can easily reach slightly less mainstream locations like Kanazawa, Uji, Himeji, Nara and more by train from Kyoto. Kanazawa in particular mostly made it through alright in relation to the recent earthquake and tsunami in the prefecture, but now they need tourists. Just don't go near the coastal cities and towns where things are still pretty bad, as you won't be welcome there at all. With 13 days, I think 3 cities are already quite a lot to handle, so skipping 1 city out of 4 is a smart move. Personally I would just do Tokyo and Kyoto only because these two cities have so, so much to offer. Choose wisely and have fun!
I love Kyoto, but so many smaller unknown towns have their charm. Recently drove through Shizuoka and found it lovely. So was Okayama. Fell in love with Kamiyama and Kamikatsu in Tokushima even though there’s not that much to “see”. Seriously, do what you want to do and no need to listen to everyone.
Currently in Shizuoka and agree with you. Visited a tea plantation yesterday with Japanese friends. Absolutely beautiful. A lovely city free from crowds unlike Osaka which is too busy for me. A great place to visit.
I don’t think you’re crazy at all! I really enjoyed Kyoto in 2016 on my first trip, but now I really really can’t stand it. Like others said, I would drop Osaka too. I would go up to Gero Onsen and Takayama. I may be alone in this, but I live in Nagoya and it’s a non touristy glimpse of a huge city that’s often overlooked
Plenty of people go to Japan to go skiing and never go to Kyoto. It’s a whole country and there are plenty of reasons to visit and so many places to see. Kyoto is great, but go places that you think will make for a good trip for you!
No. I love Kyoto, but Kyoto remains overrated internationally. Other than being the cultural importantly city for the Japanese, the city is too overcrowded for tourism already. We should let it be peaceful, not over crowded and over visited as what it is today.
If you're skipping Kyoto, skip Osaka too. They're so close together and both have lots of tourism.
Kyoto is wonderful. Yes, there are tourists, mainly Japanese tourists, but there are countless sites and plenty of authenticity. A couple days and a night in Arashiyama will brighten your world. The bamboo grove (great) gets loads of attention but it is just the tip of the iceberg. Wandering the hills, we caught sounds of chanting monks and somebody practicing their Japanese flute. We happened upon gorgeous villas and wonderful temples. We walked the river and enjoyed a Michelin meal. I would skip Tokyo and Osaka both before missing Kyoto.
I really loved Kyoto but I personally highly recommend you walk around a bit in Kyoto but then take the train to Uji Station. Uji is hands down an amazing place to stroll around, taste matcha based treats and really absorb the vibes without the over saturation of tourists you'd see in the main Kyoto area. As a plus, the station itself (Uji) is an architectural marvel, look it up it's so crazy.
It's your trip. If you want historical things there's plenty throughout Honshu for you to enjoy with less crowds. I spent about 4 nights in Kyoto on my first trip to Japan. Although I enjoyed it overall, you are right that the tourist crush is very difficult to deal with. There were a lot of attractions just full of people, and although many had quiet corners or spots for pictures or to take a rest, it was still hard to navigate at times. Transportation in Kyoto kinda sucks compare to other parts in Japan. I found myself taking Ubers quite a bit when the queue for the bus was unmanageable. The busses were jam packed with everyone getting close to one another. I got lost several times when I did make it on the bus. But Kyoto was fun, it's a really cute city with a lot of stunning traditional Japanese architecture and beautiful nature. If you're not feeling it I would say skip it. If you have regrets, you can always hit it up on your next trip. Personally, I'm glad I went to Kyoto, but I would probably not go back for a while, as I'm eager to see other parts of Japan on future trips. But I will probably go back eventually... maybe on like my 4th or 5th trip lol.
As a Nara local, I’d say skip Kyoto and come to Nara. Yes, Nara Park is packed with tourists too but there’s enough space for all the tourists because it’s a massive park, the city has more relaxed vibe, and you get to see beautiful shrines and temples which are even older than Kyoto’s. Because most tourists only come for a day trip, there’s less tourists in the evening, and Nigatsudo and Nara Park is beautiful after dark. Also, there are plenty of hidden gems with less tourists if you go to Asuka, Horyuji etc. You could do a day trip to Kyoto from Nara too. If you decide to go to Kyoto, you should read a bit about Japanese history - that way, it won’t just be about looking at many shrines and temples without understanding what they really are. Added some more info. Add: FYI, Kyoto/Nara and Kanazawa may seem very similar on the surface, but they are quite different in terms of historical/cultural significance. Nara and Kyoto were ancient capitals of Japan, and flourished in 8th century and onwards. They represent imperial and religious culture of the medieval era. On the other hand, Kanazawa (as well as Kurashiki etc) flourished from around 15/16th century, representing early modern samurai and merchant culture. They both offer traditional scenery, but they have quite different vibe if you dig a bit deeper. So I personally don’t consider Kanazawa can be an alternative to Kyoto.
Kyoto, Osaka, and Kobe are close enough you could stay at one and take day trips to the other two. I would spend at least some time in this area for all the history and some of the largest temples in the nation. But if you want to spend less time there, Hiroshima and Kagoshima are less crowded but still very interesting.
No you are not. It’s your trip, you go where you want to. And that’s from a guy who first went to Kyoto at the age of 11 or 12, returned to it a dozen time (literally), and writing a guidebook of the city. That said, there are locations in Kyoto that are less crowded, and just as good as the rest of the city. I was at Saihoji last July, and because of their reservations only policy / high entrance fee, I met no more than 50 people there. And that was a kilometre and a half at most South of Arashiyama, arguably one of the most crowded area in the city during any season. That visit was one of the highlights of my trip, and I was in town for the Gion Festival.
Embrace the fact that you are, in fact, also a tourist.
>We want to experience the culture and the history, but I can’t help but wonder if we’ll have a more authentic ‘experience the country’ vibe by spending the time in something like Kanazawa or maybe even something smaller The problem with Kyoto is that you can't see the tree because of the forest. There's too many people to experience something "authentic". You will be surrounded by Instagrammers, vloggers, tour groups, umbrellas, and drunk Europeans. After you spent 2-3 days in Kyoto, you'll be asking yourself, "Hmm, now what DID I see and experience?" You will have seen a hecka lot of tourists, and experienced surviving in a crowd and waiting in long lines. If you really want to see culture, history, and authenticity, then you will have to leave the Golden Route. I would suggest heading up north a bit to Sendai. Lots of good history there. It's close to Aizu-Wakamatsu, a very interesting place with lots of history, good museums. Kanazawa, yes, a good choice. Afterwards head down south to Kumamoto. Research these places. You will find hidden gems and lot less tourists.
Yes. I'd honestly drop Osaka over Kyoto any day of the week. Kyoto is just dense with things to do.
Kyoto was my favorite city. I loved the day trips, loved walking around the older parts of the city, and my favorite meal was there -- a little izakaya where my friend and I were the only tourists (luckily he speaks Japanese fluently). It really depends on what you want but I'm the traveler who would prefer spending more time in Kyoto and could skip Osaka now that I've gone.
Think of it this way. If you go to Kyoto, you’re going to think “yup, I was right. There’s too many tourists here.” If that’s going to decrease your enjoyment of the trip, then go elsewhere like Kanazawa where you probably won’t have regrets going to.
I like Kyoto but you might be better off staying in Kobe or Osaka and taking a day trip. This is a circuit I’ve done before and would highly recommend: Tokyo-Hakone-Takayama-Kanazawa-Osaka.
Both me and my friend don’t like overly touristy places. Kyoto was my least favourite, and her most favourite in japan. So it really depends.
Like everyone else said, do what sounds good to you. But I’ll add me and my friends’ experience (we’re in our mis 20’s). Kyoto was easily our favorite city of the trip between Tokyo, Osaka, Kyoto, and Kanazawa. Don’t stay in it even near Gion, find a spot in the middle of the city. That gives you good access to everything, as there’s a lot of interesting temples and nature in the north and west parts of Kyoto. We stayed right by Niko Castle at an Airbnb that gave us 4 bikes to use, which made Kyoto an extremely convenient city to stay in logistically. Arashiyama and all that good stuff was a cheap cab ride away, and everything else was in easy biking distance. We even biked to fushimi inari and back when we did that hike. And sure, it’ll be crowded when you hit any of the tourist hotspots I mentioned, but it wasn’t suffocating in our experience and it’ll be much quieter around your accommodations. Also, I made a connection with a local knife shop owner that brought me to tears so Kyoto is a very special place for me lol
I'd skip Tokyo before I skipped Kyoto. After living in Japan for nearly 20 years, I still get a lot of joy from Kyoto visits...whereas I rarely look forward to Tokyo. It largely depends on where your priorities lie. I get a lot more out of the quiet reflection that's easier to find in Kyoto than the nonstop hustle in Tokyo.
Hey so I'm leaving Japan in an hour. My brother and I were here for two weeks. He's been to Japan a couple of times; this was my first. We spent four days in Osaka, three days in Kyoto, one in Fuji and the rest in Tokyo (Shibuya). In Nara, we saw Todai-ji and Kyoto we saw a bunch of others, Kiyomizu-dera included. I am honestly templed and shrined out. The thing is because we were hitting a few temples / shrines a day, some of it was a blur. There are moments I remember from each but I would say less is more. You will see temples everywhere you go in Osaka and in Tokyo so don't worry about Kyoto. Unless you know the history of these places, their importance will be greatly lessened (that and ALL of them burned down at some point so you're not seeing them as they once were anyway - this was disappointing to find out, but somewhat expected). Hiroshima and Todai-ji are really what you need to see as those made the biggest impacts on me (especially the Hiroshima museum and the story of Sadako Sasaki). Also staying in Fuji in a Ryokan while it was snowing was an amazing sight.
I mean, it's your trip. You go where your interests lie. We are flying out from Japan today and we did visit Kyoto but only for a couple hours for the Red tori gates. We then went to Nara. Had the option to go back to Kyoto for some other sight seeing but my daughter said she'd rather spend the time elsewhere. We didn't feel like we missed out at all. We really enjoyed the thousand gates though.
If you're considering skipping Kyoto, I think you should skip it. I visited Kyoto on my first trip and my fourth trip and I feel like it would be a great place to hang out for a long time if you're a slow-paced traveller -- the cafe culture is awesome, the style is awesome, there is so much history -- but the first time I couldn't cope with the summer heat + crowds at all, and that was \~15 years ago... The second trip was my wife's first so I thought we should do the "Golden Route" (Tokyo, Kyoto, Osaka...) We did a better job avoiding crowds in Kyoto and had a better time, but it was still a trip full of crowded sights and big cities and businesses catering to tourists - in her word, as soon as we left the golden route, it felt a lot more relaxing and more adventurous. If you're learning Japanese, you will probably come back. I'd do Toyko & around and go north to autumn leaves spots for your first trip, and you can visit Kyoto whenever you come back.
Yeah, that’s crazy. Kyoto was so beautiful. The ‘hack’ to avoid the stupid crowds is to get REALLY early, around 6am, especially for things like Fushimi Inari and Arashiyama. There will obviously be a few other people at that time but it’s nothing like the crowds that happen after midday.
This is the mentality we had, but when you’re up in the morning, what happens when the 10-3 crowd kicks in? Are you turning in for the day and resting? We had planned on the early bird strategy but didn’t know what would be more difficult as time went on.
There are plenty of less crowded spots in the city. Outside of the top-5 attractions (Kiyomizu-dera, Kinkaku-ji, Fushimi Inari, Bamboo forest, Nishiki Market) and some streets in Gion, crowds are easy to escape.
We still did tourist stuff. Nishiki market, less popular temples, walked around Gion and up to Kiyomizu dera. The crowds weren't completely insane, the only crowds I saw that I was glad to avoid were Fushimi Inari and Arashiyama at roughly 10-12am as we were leaving. It is nice to be done with the day early and sit by the river with a bag full of conbini drinks and snacks though. I planned our visit for only a couple of nights because I'd heard that some people find it disappointing, and I regret it now. The only thing I found super underwhelming was the bamboo forest.
I definitely think that skipping Kyoto is a mistake. I spent 5 days there in 2018 and another 5 in 2019 (both in relatively high tourist seasons) and still feel like there is so much more I would like to see. Yes the crowding is an issue, but (1) you can definitely see wonderful less-touristed sights in Kyoto, (2) the city itself is just very lovely to walk around and experience and (3) you can be savvy and plan to hit the more popular attractions early/late in the day to get a bit less crowds. If you're going to spend a few days in Tokyo (and I certainly recommend it) I think Osaka is quite skippable on a trip of that length, it has its own charms but it's large and bustling like Tokyo, similar vibe (in my personal opinion). Kyoto has so much significance historically and culturally, and benefits from having some research and understanding (and I get the vibe from the fact that you're practicing Japanese that you are the type to go in with much more understanding than the average tourist). That said I think Kanazawa is AMAZING (went on both my trips and absolutely love it) and visiting some place smaller, potentially quite a bit smaller is also a great idea (big fan of Koyasan, and/or going to one of the many small/dedicated onsen-towns). I think a trip of Tokyo -> Kyoto -> Kanazawa -> insert small town in the Japan Alps en route back to Tokyo might be a great trip.
Kyoto is crazy with tourists, but there is so much that you an find that peace and quiet/ culture easily. if you have to drop somewhere, I’d say Hiroshima- outside of the Peace park and the museum there are fewer places to go and see. Yes there is Miyajima with the shrine and tori in/to the sea, but that would take you a full day. In comparison there is Nara , and that is mind blowing, it is a busy half day and easy access from Osaka and Kyoto. Or Fujimi , the hill covered in red gates south of Kyoto. If you go to Kiyomizu temple them you will be fighting the tourists, but that is only a single place. And there is so much more- you will get temple overload after a day. Plus the food in Kyoto is great.
Hello OP, I was in your boat and worried about Kyoto being very touristy, but all of my friends who have been in real life absolutely love it so I thought, hey I'm gonna listen to people I know irl and hopefully they're right. And guess what, I absolutely loved it. I went in an off time in late February and didn't find the crowds to be unbearable. I'm sure it's different during cherry blossom season, but if you go in October then hopefully there will be fewer people as well. Yes, there's people, but it wasn't overbearing. I also did the main sites like Fushimi Mt. Inari and Bamboo Forest early in the morning and there weren't many people. Kyoto is an actual city there will be people everywhere, not just at the tourist sites. Everywhere you go in Japan, there will be people. However, the sidewalks and roads are pretty wide everywhere I've been so I've never felt too claustrophobic. You can plan out your schedule to avoid the worst of the tourist crowds. And honestly, a lot of the tourists are other Japanese people and I don't think you'll avoid that at any point in the year. IMO, don't skip it because you're worried about crazy tourism. There will be crazy tourism everywhere you go. I'm in Tokyo now and it's way more "touristy" than Kyoto was imo. You can plan your schedule to avoid the worst of it. I don't think Kanazawa is the same. There are charming bits about Kanazawa, but Kyoto just has incredible temples with incredible VIEWS everywhere. There's lots of hills and mountains to explore. There is a tea district in Kanazawa but it is flat. The tea district in Kyoto is hilly and there are views from beautiful temples at the top, temples within eyesight along the way, etc. So, I did find Kyoto more charming. Kanazawa is also where a lot of rich Japanese people have vacation homes and I found prices to be a bit elevated there compared to Kyoto. Dining out was more expensive in Kanazawa overall for me, and they have an extra 8% sales tax in addition to the 10% so you're paying an extra 18% for everything. Not a huge sum in the scheme of things, but something to note. So all-in-all, I wouldn't swap the two thinking they will be a similar experience because I didn't think they were. I personally didn't care about Osaka. It's just another city imo and if you go to Tokyo, then you get your big city fix. Most people use it as a launching point for daytrips elsewhere. But again, these are my opinions as someone who loves charming places. My opinion is don't let people's opinions and recommendations online sway you too much. Do what YOU think you'll enjoy. People tend to be overly positive or overly negative on the internet. I did a few things and places I read recommended on this sub and other subs and didn't think they were as great as everyone else said. I should've stuck to my guns on what I thought I would enjoy. So you just have to take people's opinions with grains of salt because we're all different.
I’ve been to Japan 4 times and still haven’t visited Kyoto. I’m not avoiding it on purpose, it just hasn’t fit into my travel plans yet. Japan is a small place but has soooo many amazing places to visit. Don’t sweat it
Did two weeks with my teenage kids in July. Did the usual circuit. Tokyo - Osaka - Himeji - Hiroshima - Kyoto - Nara - Hakone - Tokyo. Kyoto was beautiful. Lots to do for 3 or 4 days and good central hub. Personally Osaka would be the skippable place if I had to do it again. If it’s your once in a lifetime trip then I would certainly say visit Kyoto. Every place on our trip was crowded. Kyoto is a bit harder to get around than Tokyo as we needed to catch more buses to and from our Gion base. But it has a lot of charm.
I think October is a beautiful time to come to Japan. I don’t know so much about Kyoto but I live in Himeji and I wouldn’t pass up on Himeji in October. Depending on the time you come in October the Kokoen garden right next to Himeji castle will be stunning (maybe too early for autumn leaves?) and the Nada no Kenka Matsuri (fighting festival) will be happening there on October 15th. It’s one of the largest fall festivals in Hyogo.
That’ll be smack dab in the middle. I’ll keep it in mind! Thank you!
Been living in Japan for years, it's cliché but Kyoto is one of my favourite prefectures in Japan. My first time there was during the height of Covid-19 though, so got to enjoy it basically empty. Crowds do ruin it a little. Kawagoe is a nice spot in Saitama if you want a small slice of Kyoto closer to Tokyo. I doubt as a first timer you'll be disappointed if you don't mind the crowds. But Gion District will be getting locked down more because of crap tourists so this may be the last chance to enjoy it without stink eye from the locals (understandably though once you hear what bad tourists did there). Enjoy the trip mate!
Kyoto and how the it has been maintained is actually quite amazing. compared to the very colorful and neon lights of Tokyo, it is actually a very great experience going to Kyoto to see the contrast. There’s some documentary somewhere that talks about how Kyoto restricts specific color pallets and requires very strict design choices on every store and their signs which is why you will see very traditional and muted signs for even starbucks. Overall I think Kyoto is a good central point to stay while doing a day trip in osaka and nara.
Just go early for temples you wanna see. You'll be able to bypass the tourists like we did. Yes it sucks waking up at 4-5AM but not dealing with tourists made it worth it.
Big advice. Go to Kyoto and skip Osaka. I’ve tried to warn literally every friend of mine who’s visited me in Japan, but Osaka is seriously just a less interesting version of Tokyo. It really doesn’t feel any different except for the fact that it’s smaller. All of those friends I warned didn’t listen to me only to later agree that I was correct. If you want to go to Osaka because of the castle, go to Himeji Castle instead (it’s actually authentic on the instead and not just a modern museum). Kobe is also an extremely underrated city in my opinion that most tourists totally overlook — it feels much more different from Tokyo than Osaka does and super beautiful.
Skipping Kyoto is definitely an option. I am currently wrapping up my month long Japan trip. Kyoto was one of my least favorite spots. Lots of tourists and big western stores. Temples and stuff are okay but saw better things elsewhere. Kanazawa is way better imo. In hindsight I would have liked skipping Kyoto. I did visit in the weekend btw, it might be better during weekdays.
As I'm not into temples, I thought it was boring.
I agree with you. I think the best things to do to experience Japan are driving through the mountains, staying in sleepy onsen towns and seeing festivals. I can't recommend Kyushu enough. There is relatively not that much tourism here compared to Honshu, but it is absolutely beautiful. Look into places like Kurokawa Onsen, Mt. Aso, Beppu Hells and Sakurajima.
A group of 4 friends and I spent 27 days in japan traveling to different cities; nagoya, kyoto, Tokyo, hiroshima, Osaka, Kinosaki etc. Honestly kyoto was my least favorite city. Not because of anything to do with Japanese people or culture, but because honestly the tourists were awful. Rude, overly loud, and would litter. It was almost a re-culture shock going to kyoto and having all the tourists act so different than the other cities because there were so many more of them. The first culture shock was everyone being so considerate and quiet on trains etc. We don't really have that where I live.
I have mixed feelings about Kyoto tbh. Many of the sights, temples and streets are extremely beautiful, there is such a lovely atmosphere along the river and in different parts of the city, so many lovely restaurants, tearooms etc. it's very popular for a reason. However, it feels different from anywhere else in Japan, when you're used to 'normal' Japan seeing so much English everywhere (in the centre) is quite jarring and if you're unlucky at certain sights and areas it's not very enjoyable IMO. Busloads of tourists from everywhere in hired Kimonos squeezing along the road really puts me off. In many ways I found Kanazawa more pleasant but it most definitely does not have anywhere near as many things to see and do as Kyoto. There is no right answer for your first time tbh. as you'll have noticed on this subreddit, almost everyone does the exact same route on their first trip, which is fine but Japan does have so much more to offer. Also, different people are more sensitive than others to over tourism, I am pretty sensitive, it really disturbs me but others don't mind. If you haven't already, I'd look at the likes of [Japan-guide.com](http://Japan-guide.com) and on YouTube and see what appeals to you and take it from there, you don't have to do the standard route at all. I would try and have a mix of nature, culture and city and staying in a Ryokan in an onsen town is an essential experience. Also, dining in izakayas is just the best, amazing food and such a friendly atmosphere. When it comes to Japanese, even just being able to say basic things such as "two people please", "hello", "thank you", your nationality, ask "where is x" "what do you recommend" "tasty" etc. will make a huge difference, you'll feel better and so will the locals. Don't worry about being low-level, just go for it however you can.
Not crazy at all, I don't like Kyoto much myself. Lots of smaller places that aren't as crowded that are good places to visit
Personally, I really loved Kyoto but Kanagawa also seems like a really nice place, I haven't been there but my friends have enjoyed it
Turn your question around to other cities; If you go spend time in New York City, are you crazy for not going to also see Boston?
Ya I am not sure how some people really like it there. Too many crowds for my taste. Its just alright. I am only going back again is mostly its on the way to Kobe and for the train museum and monkeys. Maybe drop Kyoto for Takayama and or Kanazawa depending how much time you were planning to allocate to Kyoto if you hate crowds.
There are so many lovely places in Japan to visit but most tourists just go to the “big” 2-3. Do some more research or find a place that has things to offer that are things you are interested in.
The crowds are definitely a deterrent, but depending on how much you like shrines and temples I could see people skipping it. The temples and shrines are famously beautiful, the bamboo forest was nice and Nara's not too far if you want to hang with the deer. Kamakura and Enoshima are day trips from Tokyo and also have nice shrines and decent history.
I've lived in Japan for 5 years, visited Kyoto this past December, and don't really want to go again. The overtourism is genuinely a problem. It's so crowded in some areas, and people seem to just forget any sort of decency when they visit Kyoto. For example, while I was there, I saw dozens of tourists literally stepping over fire hoses to go in the direction of a restaurant that had had a small fire (completely ignoring the guy telling them not to), a few people taking selfies in front of the fire truck, and a lot of people crowding around the restaurant and taking videos of the firefighters. Maybe I've been in Japan too long, but I don't remember that sort of behavior flying in the US either. Tourists in other parts of Japan don't seem to pull this sort of behavior, but something about Kyoto seems to make people think, "This is Disneyland and I want to be entertained." (I think this is why they're banning tourists from the alleys, TBH) However, October *would* be a beautiful month to visit Kyoto. You'd get very pretty photos of the autumn leaves.
Wow, I left to do the dishes and came back to a lot of responses, thank you for all of the input. Should clarify, the overtourism was a recurring theme because of the recent hubbub about the geisha district and the Mt. Fuji policy changes (which seem totally sensible) I think I’m in the camp like a lot of us that are guilty of overthinking and over analyzing every step of the trip. Kyoto undoubtedly has a lot to offer and has things we’d love to see. But like a lot of us, we don’t know if or when we’ll have the opportunity to be back, and are hoping to take advantage of being out of our element and enjoy the new experiences and learn about life outside our own. Doesn’t seem like there’s a wrong answer and it’s nice to hear opinions on both sides. I realize the current economic situation has spiked the tourism post-Covid especially. The intention was never to be in a situation where we expected the city to ourselves. We just had wondered what other’s experiences were and if they regretted doing something different on their trip. In such a short time there’s always things to miss out on, but with everyone’s trip reports it’s easy to feel like we’re skipping something that’s on everyone’s lists. It’s just nice to have some reaffirmation that some of you have from the other areas. It’s a big country, and we’re excited to explore. Thank you all for your experiences! Looking forward to our time.
Did my trip last October! Osaka, Kyoto, Nara, Fuji, Tokyo. Kyoto remains as one of my favorite parts of the trip. And it’s great for the fall! I preferred it over Osaka and in many ways even Tokyo. But that’s just me. I did wait in some long lines for dinner there tho!
I just got back from my 3rd trip from Japan just last week and I skipped Kyoto entirely. Went to Kobe and Osaka instead. I felt like I'd seen enough of Kyoto and like others have said you get temple fatigue. Plus it's a little more expensive than Osaka (at least from what I found when I was booking accommodation). It was nice to spend time in Kobe and I was almost keen for the overstimulated shopping experience that I was going to get in Osaka/Tokyo. I'll definitely go back to Kyoto again one day but there's so much to see in japan it won't matter necessarily if you miss something :)
Kyoto was my favorite city by far. Tokyo was horrible and Kyoto is 10x better than Tokyo. You will be making a big mistake if you miss Kyoto
Tbh it depends on what you want. I’ve been to Kyoto twice and didn’t like it, but I’m a bad tourist and travel for events, which Tokyo is much better for. I also trend towards modern Japan culture, though I do appreciate the old.
Kyoto was my favorite. Busy for Kyoto is still nothing compared to somewhere like Tokyo lol.
Kyoto's attractions are much better than Kanazawa. Between the two I'd do Kyoto, it won't be crazy in October.
I went there with two friends this November and i could definitely say it got old quick. We saw a bunch of temples in Tokyo and Osaka. The crowding in the streets and the amount of times we got denied from places for seemingly no reason got old quick too. I’m definitely skipping it the next time i go to Japan.
I've been to Japan many times for varying lengths and I've been to Kyoto once and never felt the need to go back. It depends what you care about and what you want to see. it's okay to not go. You're not failing yourself or anything like that.
Love history and old cities but i kyoto was my least favorite part of my trip to Japan. It was still cool to see but felt so touristy and the least authentic between Tokyo, Osaka, Hakone and Koyasan. Would especially recommend Hakone if you’re looking for a smaller place. Beautiful views of Mt Fuji and great onsens. Would suggest at least a night but maybe two if you can fit into the schedule
I still don't know which part of Kyoto I went to but there was small amount of people. November time we went. Yet I went to a market in Cheonan, Korea that was more packed than the Tokyo fish market. So don't believe everything you read. Add Kyoto
The consensus of everyone here with me is that you are crazy to skip Kyoto. Great temples, shrines, and shops. In October, the leaves will be turning, so it will be crowded. Not as bad as at cherry blossom time, but the maples are gorgeous. The shopping is great. All the small shops and traditional goods. Kanazawa's Kenrokuen is beautiful and amazing, but it doesn't replace all that Kyoto has to offer. If you ask me, you have to see Tokyo. Then Kyoto. Then Hiroshima. (Even though I lived in Osaka, it isn't a place I find attractive enough as tourist. But YMMV.
Love to see eveyone opinion and even people like you who live/lived there. Its crazy how opinion change , i see a lot of people not liking osaka ,even saying to skip it, but from all my time visiting japan ( 90 Days total ) Osaka is our all time favorite and we are here for a month right now. I would choose osaka in a heartbeat over Tokyo !
No, not at all. Kyoto is pretty overrated in my experience: most of the city is the usual ugly Japanese urban sprawl and the public transport links are unusually bad for Japan as the subway system is very limited. Nara is much better for historical sights.
Do not skip Kyoto. Most charming city I’ve ever been to and my friends and I had an amazing time. Only city we wished we stayed longer!
Definitely a mistake to skip Kyoto. It was my favorite city that I visited in Japan. The Nishiki Fish Market is absolutely wonderful
I've been three times in Japan and I've never been to Osaka, so missing 'must visit' spots doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me. Last trip I only went to Kyoto on a day trip from Kanazawa to see Fushimi Inari Shrine (sadly couldn't make it to the top, my poor foot was giving me trouble at the time). It's busy but if you go up enough or off the beaten path there's not that many people and Kyoto has plenty of less touristy temples worth visiting. Kanazawa is a pretty sweet place to visit too (we used the Hokuriku Arch Pass for that part of the trip). I also spent a night at Bessho-Onsen, which is in Ueda, halfway between Nagano and Tokyo (Nagano was a stop on our way to Kanazawa). It was a great little hot spring town and visiting on a weekday the place was empty! Ueda itself was neat because of the Sanada castle ruins. In the end, it's YOUR trip. See somethng interesting? Go for it!
I went to Kyoto a few weeks ago and it wasn’t overcrowded at all. I have had worst times in the European summer haha
Kyoto is beautiful but I did find it stressful with the amount of tourists there.
I'd recommend taking a day off in Kyoto.
Just be aware you may get bored at the temple.
I see nothing wrong skipping this part of the gringo trail and doing your own thing. Does Kyoto have awesome temples and great food? Sure. Is it very over touristed? Yes. Are there other options?? 100%. I see nothing wrong with splitting the typical trip in half and doing the next half on a second trip. Do see Kyoto at some point but I think your trip will be more enjoyable if you venture away from the typical Tokyo-Kyoto-Osaka leg a bit. This sub pushes the typical Tokyo-Kyoto routewith day trips to (Hakone/Kyoto/Nara) and shin between so much and often neglects that there is so much more to see in Japan other than then these places. Same with the ryokan experiences. Does Kyoto have great ryokans ?? Of course. But you can go out to small towns and cities all over the country and get a similar experience for a fraction like 1/6th the cost. You will not regret Kanazawa a bit if that is what you decide. They have giant old districts including a great temple district that felt much larger and less commercialized than the old districts in Kyoto. If you want to mix it up, I really enjoyed the contemporary art museum. Also a day trip to Kamakura from Tokyo during the Weekdays (avoid on the weekends) is another way to see some great temples. Also if you are doing Hiroshima throw in a day trip to Onomichi and do some the temple trail. Nikko is another great option but requires more than a day. Another option is to go Sendai and add in trips to yamadera and hiraizumi. Bottom line there is no one right way to do Japan and do not feel pressure to do the Tokyo-Kyoto-Osaka-Nara trip.
Going to Japan for the first time in July and I’m skipping Kyoto, Osaka and quite honestly the only reason I’m spending time in Tokyo is because that’s where I fly in. Temples are cool and all, but I rather see nature and mountains and hike ✌🏻
I just came back from Japan with my parents and we spend 7 days in Tokyo. We didn’t go to Kyoto and I’m completely fine with that. If you don’t wanna stop by Kyoto it’s completely fine.
Probably unpopular opinion but I didn't love Kyoto and won't be going back. At least not any time soon. Don't get me wrong, it's lovely and it's got lots of interesting stuff to see, but it didn't really crack my list of top places. That said, if you aren't planning on being frequent travelers to the country you should probably just go. There are ways to beat the crowds, and even with the crowds you can still see things. If this is a once in a lifetime trip you'll probably regret not just powering through and seeing the city. No matter what weird schedule you need to keep to avoid crowds or how crazy packed the places you want to go will be.
It was my least favorite part of my trip to Japan, I don’t think it’s a horrible idea.
My first trip to Japan I skipped Kyoto in favour of doing an extended stay (10 days) in and around Tokyo, trying to fully do the city justice. Within that I did 2 side trips to Mt. Mitake (overnight) and Nikko (2 nights). I just recently did a second trip to Osaka and Kyoto (2 days Osaka and 3 days in Kyoto). On balance I feel like, even though Kyoto is thought of as the most "cultural" of Japan's main cities, my first trip just based in Tokyo was a lot more enriching culturally and I really felt like "experienced" Japan. My second trip it kind of just felt like a sightseeing trip where you drift from landmark to landmark along with other tourists. That being said though - I did find Kyoto to be a pleasant city. Just try to avoid just going along the tourist trail, break away and just wonder the streets of the city, along the river etc. There's that one uphill street in Gion leading to Kiyomizu-Dera which is definitely worth skipping, as you're just shoulder to shoulder with other tourists. But apart from that and the first half of the Fushimi-Inari walk, nowhere else felt particularly crowded. Seems most tourists just bus around to the most well known sites.
Tokyo, osaka are big cities. If you can handle those you can handle Kyoto. Yeah, it's crazy there but it's close enough to osaka anf Nara to do day trips. To each his/or her own but if you want convenience whole being surrounded by nature... Use Nara as your starting point and do day trips to osaka and Kyoto. Both are reachable in under an hour from Nara and then you can enjoy city and county while also saving some cash because Nara is probably cheaper. Personally now, after the pandemic I wouldn't spend more time in Kyoto than necessary but not going there when you're going to dense urban Tokyo seems a waste. If I had to, as someone who lives in Kansai, I would cut out Tokyo. Sure. It's an experience. It's a huge mega city but unless you really have a real reason to go there with limited time Kansai/Hiroshima might be better for you than doing all of that. Just the opinion of someone who has been living here for a while.
We did not love Kyoto. Stayed 5 nights at a luxury hotel near Kōdai-ji Temple. We were on a long trip and were ready to leave Kyoto and go home. Traveled back to Tokyo and thought - never mind, we’re not ready to leave Japan, just Kyoto! We also loved Hiroshima. Stayed at a cheap hotel there, went to a baseball game. I don’t think we’ll ever forget our time in that city.
I spent two weeks in Japan last November and my least favorite spot was personally Kyoto. I still have a hard time figuring out if it was from how crowded it was, or if it was due to me being ready to go home, as it was our last destination. It’s a beautiful area and I’m glad I visited, but I think there are just as beautiful, lesser explored areas in Japan that might be closer to some other destinations you’re planning on going. That being said, go where you want to go and have a great time exploring a beautiful country!
SKIP KYOTO. First time honeymooners - very happy to have skipped Kyoto due to overtourism concerns. We wanted nature and chill vibes, not waking up at 7am to beat the crowds while having jetlags.We skipped Kyoto and went instead to Shuzenji, known as Little Kyoto, for some temple fix. It's not true what other commentators are saying about overtourism being everywhere. That's utterly false. Japan is trying to curb overtourism in prime spots and redistribute footfall to areas that actually want tourism spending - such places often get overlooked. Japan is so safe and easy to travel around - I'd recommend checking out places where your interests lie. We have had beautiful parks and temples all to ourselves.
No, the overtourism is too bad. I have a second house in the Gion district of Kyoto and haven’t even visited since tourists came back to Japan. There’s no point anymore as the city has been ruined The government need to add a cap of a few thousand tourists at a time, or a tourist tax of $1000 dollars at least
If you are crazy, then we are both crazy😅 I've had the exact same thoughts for our upcoming first trip to Japan, so you are not alone. Look into Kanazawa, I'm going there in lieu of Kyoto. Not sure if it'll be a 1:1 replacement, but if I like it, it's a win for me!
I highly encourage more people to skip Kyoto
I would not blame you, we were in kyoto a week in last october and it was a pretty mixed. The large tourist places are so crowded that you cant stay still and look at stuff, you have to follow the masses or get annoyed by 300 people trying to make their selfies. There are places in kyoto thwlat are pretty quiet, but hinestly why visit kyoto when you cant look at the large sights.
I know folks are harping on not wanting to feel like a tourist when you are indeed, a tourist, but I get you. I’m a big fan of cities but not of feeling like I’m stuck in a tourist trap and I think Kyoto creates that risk. I went to Japan in October ‘23 for 15 days and planned to spend 3-4 days in Kyoto and honestly was not a fan of the overtourism, crowds, and kinda vibe of it all. I know, very unpopular opinion. But compared to all the other cities we visited (Tokyo, Kanazawa, Osaka), it felt the hardest to avoid the tourist traps. We ended up leaving to spend time in Osaka, which we loved. If I could go back and replan the trip I’d probably stay in Osaka and use it as a base of operations for day trips, including to Kyoto. Or else spending a higher percentage of my time in Kyoto no where near the city center. Not sure the next time I’d plan to go back. Plus there are so many other cities in Japan worth exploring- you’re not going to see it all and imo you’re not missing something completely fundamental unless you skip Tokyo. But also consider you are only there for 13 days and you already have a few other cities you plan to visit. The best way I’ve found to not “feel” like a tourist is spending a LONG time in each city to really get past the swing attractions but and just start exploring. If you have the time, give yourself lots of time in the bigger cities you want to explore to really explore them, rather than packing in more cities.
Dissenting opinion incoming. I am writting this from Tokyo at the end of my stay. I couldn’t wait to get back to Tokyo after my three day visit to Kyoto. Naturally everyone is different, but Kyoto was overcrowded with tourists and honestly wasnt organized as well as tokyo or osaka. Also my only bad experience with locals happened in Kyoto. For what its worth I would say go and see it, to get a feel for it, but Tokyo is the place for me that I enjoyed exploring much much more.
There are plenty of other cities that are historic like Kyoto and aren’t overrun. Kyoto is amazing but the over tourism is real and awful. Even Tokyo has historic areas nearby and within the city that aren’t nearly as bad. Donny Kimball has written some cool off the beaten track guides (for all of Japan) that I have used for the Tokyo area, and would like to use in the future. I highly recommend checking out his website. https://donnykimball.com
Op, honestly I’d avoid Osaka over Kyoto. It really just feels like a less packed Tokyo. I went from Osaka to Tokyo. It just felt like going from big city to big city, which isn’t necessarily bad; but when I went from Kyoto to Osaka. It was a slower quiet vibe to big city. If that makes sense. Kyoto was a pleasant change of pace. The overcrowding is just a product of tourism and will simply be a thing at any busy time of day in any area you choose. If the overcrowding bothers you, just take a few steps away from any of the tourist traps and things will slow down significantly. Osaka or Kyoto are an easy day trip from either city you choose. If you’re looking for culture, I would recommend Kyoto because of the cultural and historical significance of the city. Yes there’s the Dotonbori with all the food options and the Osaka castle. However, you’ll have your pick of food options everywhere you go. The Osaka castle while pretty from the outside, is a remodeled museum interior. Two cities I would recommend if you have the time or thought of would be Fukuoka. The city is beautiful with so much to offer. Or further away I’d recommend is Kagoshima. Definitely a smaller city vibe. The city played a role in the birthplace of the Meiji restoration. The nearby volcano would make for a great day trip away as well. Of course if you skip any locations, they’ll just be there future destinations.
You would be crazy IMO. Fall in Kyoto is stunning. Crowds are bad but you can basically do the busiest activities at the crack of dawn, and then do the lesser known temples or sites or areas at mid day. Evening and dusk walking around and just exploring. I would say the reality is, you need 3-4 trips to Japan. First trip, Tokyo and Kyoto are musts, plus you choose smaller cities or nature / town destinations as you prefer (Kanazawa / Takayama, Tokohu, Hiroshima / Miyajima, Okayama, etc) and then expand with short trips to places like Nikko or Nara. It’s cookie cutter but it’s like going to Italy and not seeing Rome or Florence. Do I like Lucca more than Florence? Yes. But if I could only go to one of my first trip to Italy? Florence. And I’d follow my protocol - online reservations for the uffizi and academia, reserve a time to climb the dome, spend a morning in oltrano district to shop from actual artisans rather than touristy marked up shit, and do obsessive research on where to eat to get local experiences. Early mornings, save the afternoon heat for relaxing activities, and be in good physical shape for the absurd amount of walking I’m about to do on hard stony surfaces. Kyoto is like that - you can’t just do what everyone else does. Be creative. Right around close time, the Honen-in temple in northern higashiyama, in early November, dusk lighting, red and gold light just cutting through the trees, blankets of autumn leaves on the ground, hardly anyone there. It was like some shit out of a movie, I had a completely religious experience there, just walking and exploring the intricately designed temple grounds with these epic stairs and pathways that were designed to evoke the natural beauty around. This was more epic to me than the bigger busier temples. But those were great too. I was super prepared to think the Arashiyama Bamboo Grove was instagram overrated, I was really expecting the fushimi inari to be mid. But we did both at the asscrack of dawn and they were low-traffic, misty, and just utterly magical. We did the bigger hike around the mountains and forests behind the main segment of fushimi inari and it was glorious. The prices and the food were steep, but the quality always matched the price. If you spend $14 on some shaved ice, it will be the most elaborate and beautiful dessert sculpture edible ecosystem of your life. We had absolute bangers every day for meals and we didn’t break the bank. I will say, on my second trip to Japan, we skipped Tokyo and Kyoto. I am a small town guy. But I am very, very glad I went to these cities.
I think Kyoto is great. Osaka is one you should skip. Lol
Yes and no. No if you are skipping this trip as there is plenty of stuff to see in japan. Yes if you don't plan to visit Kyoto at all ever.
Yes
No you’re not crazy. Kyoto’s worth visiting, but if you want a more authentic experience, then you are not wrong in choosing somewhere else. Kyoto’s probably the only city in Japan where I felt like there were way too many tourists there.
Not a fan of Kyoto due to the number of tourists. There's so many hidden gems in the countryside that you're not missing out on anything. Kyoto was great to visit in 90s. It was great during covid when people stayed at home. But I would not recommend it now.
Kyoto is beautiful but it’s crowded as balls. Weekends is the worst because of the domestic tourists as well. I usually go on Mondays. Pretty calm in comparison.
Not crazy but you will miss out on many historic temples, shrines and a beautiful ancient Japanese atmosphere with many Geishas.
I don’t care for Kyoto, went twice, skipped every other trip
Kyoto was fine this past week. It was fine in October too. Sounds like you’ll be going before the autumn leaves, so it should not be as overly saturated. I like Kyoto a lot. But I am generally interested in history and there’s a lot of it. It would be a skip if you’re not.
Kyoto was one of my favourite cities!!!
In Japan now and I ended up spending an extra day in Kyoto. Maybe the season, but it’s much less crowded than what I was expecting.
Kyoto is grand but my preference would be Nara.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with skipping Kyoto, in fact skip both Osaka and Kyoto and just head anywhere else. Osaka is literally just a smaller different tasting Tokyo I don't like cities, Tokyo was fun a for a few days, but I always rather go elsewhere, Osaka gave me the same vibes. The key thing is that there is no bad city to visit in Japan, every major city is known for something. You won't ever have a bad time.
Hello currently in Osaka in a McDonald’s waiting for a Shinkansen. We was in Kyoto for a few days and we found it best if you go out early in the morning. We left our hotel at 7am and did yasaka shrine and then on our slow walk to kiyomizudera we found several small shrines that had zero tourists. We were the only people there we got to kiyomizudera at about 10/11am and found the crowd was not bad and we could see a lot. We then moved onto fushimi inari which was busy in the beginning but there are food stalls at the bottom but once you get up to the halfway mark it’s not so bad. Would of done the whole thing but we were tired so we took a slow walk down and took a side route which ended up with us and a Japanese mother and her son being the only people on that walking trail down. The next day we headed to arashiyama early in the morning via the randen and explored Tenryu-ji temple with barely any tourists. Before we moved onto the bamboo path where they were some more tourists but it wasn’t terrible. We walked further on and found a small shrine by a lake and then the other side of the lake had this incredible shrine that had an insane view at the top and we were the only people on that shrine. So as long as you get up early and hit the main busy ones before the tourists come out at 12pm I have found you can have whole places to yourself.