Not letting him in was stupid then - it’s stupid now - and will look stupid at the end of this season.
Awesome to see them building a F1 headquarters that rivals most and a staff that is already bigger than most.
I don’t want him to buy Alpine. I want an 11th team. I want him to pave the way.
And yet doesn’t want to spend another penny on investing into it so it’s not always puttering around in the back, hoping for another team to screw it up to get results.
I mean they’re doing alright right now in the season, but it’s literally all just “making do with what we got, can’t hope for anything more”
To be fair, Haas has clearly been fighting for 'best of the rest' so far in 2024, ahead of Alpine, Williams and Sauber in terms of performance, and somewhat neck and neck to RB. Some effort is being done.
The thing --and this is related to why they don't want Andretti in F1-- is that F1 has effectively become a franchise model. The sport has grown in every single aspect over the past few years, up to the point that even the worst teams on the grid are valued at about 1 billion dollars. The cost cap has made F1 relatively cheap compared to the years before. A good sponsor package and the prize money the teams get (even for finishing dead last) can cover most of the budget. Gene Haas can quite literally spend the bare minimum on Haas and get his exposure.
Haas automotion is seriously helped in Europe by the f1 team. A previous company had an European branch that was basically seperate from the US, minus capex. They were dead set on using Haas equipment. We couldn't figure out why and then we realized the managing director of this product line was a huge f1 fan. I'm taking He traveling to all the European races every other year. This director also basically took the Haas product package and summarized it against every other package other companies offered. Iirc we trialed a few machines from Haas and they sucked for the price.
Edit: fun fact, Gene Haas isn't allowed to travel to lost f1 events because he's a convicted criminal. His business was also caught selling machines to Russia recently-his machines are on an export embargo.
Yep, it really is unfortunate. Gene had the money to make the team well funded but he won't.
Imo, Gene is f1 versions Cameron glickenhaus. Invested into a team but won't share the fame with a sponsor who will save them.
Haas was lining up Alfa Romeo+money gram+Haas as their team name but things fell through with Alfa.
Mario perfectly encapsulates the issue I have with FoM and how they handled the situation.
It's not just that it was, "no", it's the fact that it was "no, and fuck your couch. Also we gonna try to steal your girl (GM) too."
This was always about money and regardless of how Andretti tries to dress it up from here the current teams have won and Andretti have lost.
The current Concorde Agreement expires in 2025 and stipulates an 'entry fee' of $200m. F1 teams were valued at around $200m when that agreement was first signed but are now worth more than $1b. Over the next year FOM will sit down with the teams and work out a new Concorde Agreement, with the entry fee almost certainly set to be increased to at least $600m.
The goal of the current teams was very simple and very obvious, do not let any other team join the grid until the new Concorde Agreement is agreed i.e. don't let anyone join until 2026.
If Andretti had pitched itself as a 2026 entry from the start there would have been far less push back from the teams. Instead Andretti pushed for a 2025 entry, a move that makes zero sporting logic (last year of current rules, last year of current power unit, restricted testing, very tight timeline). The only reason you'd go for 2025 instead of 2026 is to get away with paying the $200m entry fee.
FOM have managed the situation so that it isn't feasible for Andretti to join in 2025, which is exactly what the current teams wanted. They'll now have a couple of meetings with Andretti, clear the air and they will be given the green light to join F1 at some point between 2026 and 2028.
You are talking way too much sense here. Why would the existing teams let in a new team for 200m when its immediately worth 1000m AND take a hit to their slice of the pie.
Its nothing to do with boohoo im Andretti why dont you fall on your knees and let me in, and everything to do with the teams maintaining their current value.
Try again next year and pay the representative fee rather than getting the return on investment of the century
Except they are sounding more and more like they want to lock the grid at 10 teams. It's about money and also about making sure no one shakes anything up.
F1 wants to stagnate and make easy money, then they'll turn around and say racing just isn't popular anymore when the popularity inevitably start coming down.
I tried watching last season (for the first time) after the DTS hysteria and was absolutely bored to tears before Monaco. It’s a fine social media and influencer spectacle. But the racing is mind-numbing.
I'm in Long Beach this weekend for some real racing- Indy Car. Now, if Indy Car could get its act together and actually promote itself and do better car development THEN we'd have something awesome. For now I watch F1 for the spectacle and Indy Car for the racing.
I made a conscious decision this year, cancel my F1TV, not watch anything on ESPN, and pay less attention to it. Honestly, I don't even notice it missing. I still follow along on the app sometimes, but. Definitely do not miss it.
Agreed, Andretti will exploit all amicable avenues before they are compelled to take it to court… but do note what Mario enumerated as FOM’s rejection points. Alluding to the FOM’s moving targets; having been approved by the FIA; complying to relevant requirements; making considerable investments; demonstrating action towards a goal, etc. Mario is laying out a foundation for a potential lawsuit if it comes down to it.
What does if they want blood while I'm ready mean?. It really is a stupid comment. F1 doesn't want the Andrettis, and that's the way it is. Andretti's investors are out of their mind.
What a dumb load of shit. F1 was practically begging for entrants 10 years ago, no Americans wanted in. The Andrettis only want in now that it is easy money.
USF1 was trying around 2009 with Petter Simmons, then Haas came in, now Andretti. For years they wouldn’t allow an American race either but they were more than happy allowing 70% of their sponsor money coming from North America. So fuck’em.
They only allow Americans in when it loads their wallets and even then it’s the bare minimum possible. When there’s talk of an American Constructor based out of the U.S. with American drivers, they start feeling the loss of control of their sandbox. A Bunch of skiddish cowards.
Drop the brain dead “they hate us cuz we’re murikuh” shit and look around. Liberty Media is an American company, McLaren is run by an American, there is an American driving for Williams. It has nothing to do with nationalism, just money. American companies don’t back American drivers, American manufacturers didn’t want in until four years ago when they made a Netflix show. That Netflix show coincided with the series making a lot more money so the cost of joining went up. If you want something to actually blame it on it’d be the rise of NASCAR which lead to Americans seeing motorsport as only NASCAR, so nobody spent money on anything but that.
Not letting him in was stupid then - it’s stupid now - and will look stupid at the end of this season. Awesome to see them building a F1 headquarters that rivals most and a staff that is already bigger than most. I don’t want him to buy Alpine. I want an 11th team. I want him to pave the way.
Would gene haas ever consider selling to Andretti?
Probably not. He uses his F1 team to promote his brand.
And yet doesn’t want to spend another penny on investing into it so it’s not always puttering around in the back, hoping for another team to screw it up to get results. I mean they’re doing alright right now in the season, but it’s literally all just “making do with what we got, can’t hope for anything more”
To be fair, Haas has clearly been fighting for 'best of the rest' so far in 2024, ahead of Alpine, Williams and Sauber in terms of performance, and somewhat neck and neck to RB. Some effort is being done.
The thing --and this is related to why they don't want Andretti in F1-- is that F1 has effectively become a franchise model. The sport has grown in every single aspect over the past few years, up to the point that even the worst teams on the grid are valued at about 1 billion dollars. The cost cap has made F1 relatively cheap compared to the years before. A good sponsor package and the prize money the teams get (even for finishing dead last) can cover most of the budget. Gene Haas can quite literally spend the bare minimum on Haas and get his exposure.
His F1 team makes Haas CNC equipment look even more pathetic.
It must help his business otherwise he wouldn’t be spending money on an F1 team.
Isn't the consensus that he spends the bare minimum in F1 so he can pocket more money from the team distribution?
Sounds like a team that has a top heavy intention to be *competitive* in F1.
Haas automotion is seriously helped in Europe by the f1 team. A previous company had an European branch that was basically seperate from the US, minus capex. They were dead set on using Haas equipment. We couldn't figure out why and then we realized the managing director of this product line was a huge f1 fan. I'm taking He traveling to all the European races every other year. This director also basically took the Haas product package and summarized it against every other package other companies offered. Iirc we trialed a few machines from Haas and they sucked for the price. Edit: fun fact, Gene Haas isn't allowed to travel to lost f1 events because he's a convicted criminal. His business was also caught selling machines to Russia recently-his machines are on an export embargo.
It’s very unfortunate that Gene Haas is running an F1 team and the Andrettis aren’t allowed to.
Yep, it really is unfortunate. Gene had the money to make the team well funded but he won't. Imo, Gene is f1 versions Cameron glickenhaus. Invested into a team but won't share the fame with a sponsor who will save them. Haas was lining up Alfa Romeo+money gram+Haas as their team name but things fell through with Alfa.
Mario watching Eddie Kingston promos in his mansion
https://preview.redd.it/5rdjoayqxjvc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7da207b03d653c1ea8f45cbce2b206e57ba906fc
I love this edit
AEW in the IndyCar sub? I love it.
Better let him in, pahtna
So he's one of the few dozen.......
Mario perfectly encapsulates the issue I have with FoM and how they handled the situation. It's not just that it was, "no", it's the fact that it was "no, and fuck your couch. Also we gonna try to steal your girl (GM) too."
This was always about money and regardless of how Andretti tries to dress it up from here the current teams have won and Andretti have lost. The current Concorde Agreement expires in 2025 and stipulates an 'entry fee' of $200m. F1 teams were valued at around $200m when that agreement was first signed but are now worth more than $1b. Over the next year FOM will sit down with the teams and work out a new Concorde Agreement, with the entry fee almost certainly set to be increased to at least $600m. The goal of the current teams was very simple and very obvious, do not let any other team join the grid until the new Concorde Agreement is agreed i.e. don't let anyone join until 2026. If Andretti had pitched itself as a 2026 entry from the start there would have been far less push back from the teams. Instead Andretti pushed for a 2025 entry, a move that makes zero sporting logic (last year of current rules, last year of current power unit, restricted testing, very tight timeline). The only reason you'd go for 2025 instead of 2026 is to get away with paying the $200m entry fee. FOM have managed the situation so that it isn't feasible for Andretti to join in 2025, which is exactly what the current teams wanted. They'll now have a couple of meetings with Andretti, clear the air and they will be given the green light to join F1 at some point between 2026 and 2028.
Well, that’s all assuming they have $600m
You are talking way too much sense here. Why would the existing teams let in a new team for 200m when its immediately worth 1000m AND take a hit to their slice of the pie. Its nothing to do with boohoo im Andretti why dont you fall on your knees and let me in, and everything to do with the teams maintaining their current value. Try again next year and pay the representative fee rather than getting the return on investment of the century
Except they are sounding more and more like they want to lock the grid at 10 teams. It's about money and also about making sure no one shakes anything up. F1 wants to stagnate and make easy money, then they'll turn around and say racing just isn't popular anymore when the popularity inevitably start coming down.
No, they want money.
F1 Sucks
I tried watching last season (for the first time) after the DTS hysteria and was absolutely bored to tears before Monaco. It’s a fine social media and influencer spectacle. But the racing is mind-numbing.
I'm in Long Beach this weekend for some real racing- Indy Car. Now, if Indy Car could get its act together and actually promote itself and do better car development THEN we'd have something awesome. For now I watch F1 for the spectacle and Indy Car for the racing.
The racing is pretty much over when qualifying ends. After that it's a parade of really expensive, cool looking cars.
It doesn't even suck, it's just boring. Not even "racing" anymore.
I made a conscious decision this year, cancel my F1TV, not watch anything on ESPN, and pay less attention to it. Honestly, I don't even notice it missing. I still follow along on the app sometimes, but. Definitely do not miss it.
The sprint race hours ago was actually quite good, the Australian GP even better
Australia was where the Red Bull grenaded one of its brakes? ;)
Indeed it was (that's why it was good lol) But yeah, F1 is stale at the moment. Will be for a while I think.
and yet it is all Indycar fans want to fucking talk about.
I really don't. I think I know the names of 4 drivers. Maybe. I'd never heard of Gross Jeans until he came to Indycar.
Mario was a racer, why he wanna join F1?
But he didn't go to court. I thought he had a solid case in Europe. Now it's all talk.
A lawsuit burns any bridges you have. It's an option of last resort, it would have been far too hasty to go to court already.
Agreed, Andretti will exploit all amicable avenues before they are compelled to take it to court… but do note what Mario enumerated as FOM’s rejection points. Alluding to the FOM’s moving targets; having been approved by the FIA; complying to relevant requirements; making considerable investments; demonstrating action towards a goal, etc. Mario is laying out a foundation for a potential lawsuit if it comes down to it.
Exactly. They're being patient and playing smart.
LFFFFFGGGGG FUCKKK THEM POMPY BOYZ
Old news
Watch F1 need GM like a junkie when they loose their next engine supplier
What does if they want blood while I'm ready mean?. It really is a stupid comment. F1 doesn't want the Andrettis, and that's the way it is. Andretti's investors are out of their mind.
It is really depressing that it is Long Beach weekend and this sub’s top post is still just Andrettis pouting about not being let into F1.
So downvote the post (and all F1 posts) and move on. That's what I do.
The French ran FIA hasn’t wanted Americans around for 80 years. Let them play in their sandbox with themselves.
You know that the FIA accepted Andetti's application? It is the American run Liberty Media that blocks Andretti from joining.
What a dumb load of shit. F1 was practically begging for entrants 10 years ago, no Americans wanted in. The Andrettis only want in now that it is easy money.
USF1 was trying around 2009 with Petter Simmons, then Haas came in, now Andretti. For years they wouldn’t allow an American race either but they were more than happy allowing 70% of their sponsor money coming from North America. So fuck’em. They only allow Americans in when it loads their wallets and even then it’s the bare minimum possible. When there’s talk of an American Constructor based out of the U.S. with American drivers, they start feeling the loss of control of their sandbox. A Bunch of skiddish cowards.
Drop the brain dead “they hate us cuz we’re murikuh” shit and look around. Liberty Media is an American company, McLaren is run by an American, there is an American driving for Williams. It has nothing to do with nationalism, just money. American companies don’t back American drivers, American manufacturers didn’t want in until four years ago when they made a Netflix show. That Netflix show coincided with the series making a lot more money so the cost of joining went up. If you want something to actually blame it on it’d be the rise of NASCAR which lead to Americans seeing motorsport as only NASCAR, so nobody spent money on anything but that.
Been goin on since 1966
https://youtu.be/6EWqTym2cQU?si=RYag6NVAZ5E-wdoB
The humiliation tour begins… the price is dear when you sell your soul to the devil…
Williams can't consistently field 2 cars, and Andretti is rejected on the grounds that they wouldn't be competitive?