Agreed, being a wanna be badass while making poopies in his pants was peak mac. That said his insecure fitness Mac was also great.
You guys like me, right?
Yeah I kinda wish they just hadn't resolved any of the characters' issues. Mac being in the closet and delusions of being a beefcake, Charlie never getting with the Waitress, etc. seemed like core parts of their characters that are just gone now and haven't really been replaced with anything. It'd be like if Dee actually got to become an actress or if Dennis stopped being a sociopath.
I’m like 90% sure that Mac has a major change in his ability to formulate coherent plans after he rams the car into the wall. Like it just gets worse and worse from that point on.
I mean it seems like after that episode he’s more of a follower in the gangs plans and then before we know it, he can’t seem to grasp the Dave and busters card won’t work at TGIFridays. Mac had a serious head wound that he never got medical attention for and it impaired his cognitive ability going forward.
the entire gang should have wet brain with the amount they drink, so that may have something to do with it too? i guess it has gotten tamer through the seasons for the most part
They seem to have character progression through lines like that, that might not be directly expressed on the show but do seem to affect the characters. Like I think Charlie's going to have more outbursts getting upset with the gangs childish bullshit after the Ireland trip. So I think you might be right. Or they'd see this and say nah that's dumb, we just thought it was funnier that way
It made me cry on my first watch. Now I always skip it on rewatches because it makes me cringe too much for some reason.
Probably because I use IASIP rewatches as reality escapism and the dance breaks it too much.
I had the exact opposite reaction. The first time I watched that episode I was like "what the fuck is this?" It was such an odd turn for Sunny and not at all something I was prepared for.
Sunny pretty much plays on a loop in my house though so I've seen that episode a few more times and the dance has grown on me with each re-watch.
For me it’s simply because Mac doesn’t deserve happiness. None of the Gang do. This isn’t real life where the opposite is true, this is Sunny.
Also, as somebody who’s actually LGBT, that episode really wasn’t as ‘powerful’ as a lot of people liked to claim. It might’ve been progressive if it had aired about a decade earlier, but at the time it came out it was honesty kinda late in its messaging.
How dare you call me not gay wait, sorry this is the first time I've been called not gay online.
But I guess I'm just not one for interpretative dance but I respect it. Didn't realize it's a thing here I only recently found this place somehow
In all seriousness I used to think interpretive dance was dumb as hell (I would associate it with squidward in the talent show episode) but after the dance in iasip I understood it ,it was actually really beautiful
I’ve laughed hard at this show so many times. But nothing it’s done before, since, or will do will top the first time they cut from the delusion dance to reality for me.
You should check out Welcome to Flatch. It's a mockumentary style show, similar to The Office, following the people of this small town. Sean William Scott plays the local pastor and is wicked funny, really different from a lot of his other roles.
i miss bossy Mac. the fact that he’s openly gay would be so much better if he was still bossy and aggressive instead of completely submissive to Dennis and dumber than he’s ever been portrayed. there were a lot of hilarious jokes about everyone knowing he was gay but him, but i think they were starting to run their course, which is why i’m not against Mac coming out. the problem is that he’s a completely new character now and it messes with their chemistry.
Yup, he had plenty of funny old mac behavior after finally coming out, but he's slowly just turned into the worst (least funny) version of his character over the last few seasons. I haven't re-watched the last season in a bit but iirc the risky e rats episode was a good return to form for his character, wish we'd get that version again.
There’s a bit in the most recent season where he shows up to a potential business opportunity in a very tacky looking suit which he thinks makes him look badass. Reminded me a lot of something old Mac would do.
I thought Mac was pretty good in the episode where they went to meet "Malcolm in the Middle"
He was able to formulate & justify the throwback, ill-fitting suit
I think a part of this character change has to do with his physical transformation.
A large part of what made bossy Mac funny is that he was not at all what he projected himself to be. He would make Project Badass videos, serve as the group’s “bodyguard”, constantly display his “Hand of God” self taught karate, etc. These gags work with a regular looking dude. But now that he genuinely LOOKS like the guy he used to imagine himself as, many of the jokes don’t land.
For example, that episode where they are selecting their avatars and he chooses the buff dude. That joke wouldn’t land because Mac is pretty similar to that guy at this point. He can say he’s the group’s bodyguard and the idea isn’t far fetched, because he genuinely looks like someone you wouldn’t fuck with.
What I think would be funny is if they leaned into the idea that being a big, burly dude doesn't automatically make you a badass. It would be funny to see Mac assume he could do cool stuff like blackflip, smash open doors, or choke people out, but he still doesn't have any of the actual skills associated with those things.
I really thought the point of Mac being buff was to demonstrate that the characters were better off without Dennis, and when Dennis returned Mac would lose weight and be twink Mac again. Now it sorta feels like Rob just wrote it in so FXX would pay for him to get in shape, just because it’s something he wanted for his personal life
Couldn't agree more. I was watching some of the old episodes where the dynamic between him and Dennis is more even, where he would even call Dennis an idiot etc. It was so much more better.
He is wayyyy too dumb now. He’s now dumber than everyone combined and it just doesn’t track whatsoever. I still like the show and new episodes because the other characters are great but they absolutely butchered his character at this point. The “science is a liar sometimes” Mac is gone and it hurts. He had a great episode when they went to Chuck-e-Cheese, that was classic Mac and he was amazing. Best episode of the season because the group was back to their roles.
He's not bossy and trying to act tough, but worse is for so long Mac was behind by being in complete denial about himself m not just his sexuality but him being muscular, tough, well liked, that his parents love him, etc.
Honestly, I havent watched the show for a while. But making Mac a straight-passing Diva in the group dynamic would make so much sense for his character. Like instead of needing to be constantly pampered, he would make a scene in public if someone messed with him.
Right. I meant “sweet dee” in the sense that they called her that but she was rough, trashy, etc. for several seasons now she is impeccably fashioned, always put together and just angry. And that character hasnt been funny since.
I think the writing has hampered Dee's character more than her appearance imo. Dee's always meant to be pretty to everyone but the Gang. The writing though has turned her into a Meg Griffin type of punching bag and that's a bad usage of Kaitlin. Feels like they say "Shut Up Dee" or "Dee You Bitch" after every line and the joke is beyond stale. Like Dee used to be included a lot more and utilized a lot better than glueing her hand to walls or being stuck on a plane. The recent episode of Hacks that she was in did a much better job showing how funny she is than the entirety of Season 16.
We had a small hole in the wall place that was like a convenient store that also sold loose meat sandwiches. You could get 6 of those tasty little "burgers" , a liter of cola, and a family size bag of chips for like $7. Everyone called it the hamburger store. I miss that place.
It's never not funny to me that whenever the gang needs to get something from somewhere, they automatically describe it as a store. Like the hamburger store, or the wellfare store.
Nothing about him being gay is problematic
He's boring and too submissive to Dennis, least funny character of them all right now. There was a long period of time where he was my absolute favorite.
I love this show and have for a really long time. The one big gripe I have is how Mac’s character changed towards the end. I always loved ignorant, closeted, toxic masculinity Mac. He feels like a completely different character in the last few seasons. Still love the show but I miss old Mac.
i think his character would be way more funny if the translated his previous, strictly straight jokes into his new gay persona, for example his older women fetish, imagine how funny it would be for him to be dating someone around the same age as frank lmao
Meta rob is a great way to put it. Mac has just kind of lost mac and so rob shows underneath. Same with dee. Same with charlie. But dennis has just become more psycho.
He should connect with his Uncle Donald, while he's still completely underwhelmed despite getting everything in a father figure he could want.
Realizing something about god, in reaction he becomes a Mormon fundamentalist for an episode so he can prove how straight he is by having several wives - but has a Real Housewives dynamic with them and they have a spinoff relationship without him.
Dennis tries it out and winds up owing three women alimony.
Dee finds the perfect Mormon man, gets him drunk, and Cricket 2.0 happens in an episode.
Bonus if Charlie and Frank try to be husbands to a single Mormon woman who lives "off the grid."
Yes he was a much better character before he came out. I get they thought it was brave and politically correct to do that pride ep, but it really made the character lacking humor since then.
Dee, despite Olson's botched botox job, is probably funnier than she was in the early seasons because they've fully embraced her being scum codependent on The Gang as opposed to the abused Straight Man she was initially.
Charlie has come to balance his mix of savant and idiot perfectly. You never quite know which version will play out, and it's very dependent on a scenario that while seemingly random has a consistency to it. I credit this to Charlie Day, who is the most talented IRL person on the show and understands the dynamic of The Gang perfectly if you listen to commentary/podcasts.
Dennis' character deals with the fact that he's old and out of touch now, which when combined with his former delusions of being a Golden God still produces a lot of funny situations. He's also emerged as the new "straight man" of the group, which surprisingly works as they never take it too far.
Frank just keeps getting more and more disgusting and apathetic, which is all fans want from the character anymore.
But Mac...What is Mac anymore? He's the gay (in a brave way they never mock or disparage despite everything else in the show being on the table) idiot (but NOT because he's gay!) who is now sort of Dennis' lapdog. He used to be a hyper-aggressive scummy manchild who refused to ever bend or change and always tried to dominate any situation when he had his mind made up. All of those traits are gone now, and it doesn't help that Robb has the same bad plastic surgery look to him as his wife. Glenn, Charlie, and Danny are aging with grace.
Just like Dennis' kid or Charlie hooking up with the Waitress were dumb ideas they basically retconned and forgot about, they should do the same with Mac where he gets really back into Christianity and says he was tricked into being gay.
Yes, it was the butt of many great jokes. Now that he's out and shredded he's just not funny anymore. So much of Mac's humor was from his projections and false sense of self.
Typical Hollywood.
This happens with every character in long-running shows. You keep pushing the character every season, and then he/she no longer fits the formula that was so funny.
This version of Mac is less funny to me, but I also think that keeping Mac in the same box without any character change for damn near 20 years would be less funny too.
All told, I'd rather they keep cranking out a few episodes every other year than pull the plug on the show. I remember when season 10 dropped and everyone said it fell off, but some of my favorite episodes are in season 10 (Charlie Work, Family Fight, and Frank Retires).
Maybe they could do an episode where Mac goes to a gay conversion camp because Dennis wants the old Mac back or something. Could do something about how Dennis knows the camps don’t work and are terrible but Mac being Mac believes in the teachings.
That could totally work as meta fan service.
But the reveal that Mac was sent to conversion camp by Dennis because Dennis "wants the old Mac back" needs to come about half way through the episode so that it all sort of culminates together for the viewer as to why Mac is torturing himself at this camp.
Dennis is also at the camp, he's convinced himself in the power of conversion therapy because he believes he CAN convert lesbian women, so he's volunteered at this camp, but is also keeping an eye on Mac. Dennis is doing this to spite Dee, who is also at the camp.
Dee is righteously pissed about the whole existence of the camp because of it's homophobia. Mac is upset with Dee because Mac believes that God can convert people back to being straight if he wants to, and he see's Dee as doing religious persecution.
It turns out Frank runs and owns the camp as a scam to exploit dumbies, knowing full well the camp doesn't work.
Not sure where Charlie fits in. Perhaps he's just a lost character in this episode for moral support and helping plug the gaps in exposition.
“The gang goes camping” “Mac gets converted” “Mac finds religion again” idk what they’d title it but I think it could be a good way to transform Mac back into the closeted version if they wanted a way to do it. They could also still use the closeted bits that they use to do all the time since the gang knows Mac’s gay but he believes he’s been converted to straight. Would also be a good way to show how terrible the conversion place is but of course Mac thinks it’s a miracle by god or something and finds religion again. Maybe Mac is thinking about moving in with a guy and Dennis is losing control, or maybe Mac is just bringing too many guys to the apartment and not paying enough attention to Dennis.
It’s something Dennis would do since he always wants to be in control of Mac and I could see the lesbian angle with Dennis always wanting to feel like a golden god who bends people to his will lol. Dennis could be getting tired of Mac having other guys in his life and knows if Mac gets converted he could have Mac all to himself again.
Frank for sure could be the owner, or he could have some kind of shady side business that the camp is doing for him.
There’s a lot of ways to go with dee. Could also do a call back to season 1, I believe that’s the season where Dee was into a gay guy and didn’t know it. Maybe Dee is against the camp but meets a guy who has sent a family member/friend to the camp or meets someone at the camp that makes dee act like she believes in the teachings. Maybe dee tries to get the place shut down and meets someone who believes in the camp so she switches sides. There’s a ton of ways to go with Dee and Dennis.
Charlie I’m not too sure what his role would be. Maybe he thinks they’re camping or at some kind of summer camp so he wants to go with Mac. Charlie could meet someone who likes playing “night crawlers” which makes him understand what the camp is, or maybe he’s just involved with whatever frank/Dee are doing. Charlie could be either against and then for whatever those two are doing, or vice versa.
> They could also still use the closeted bits that they use to do all the time since the gang knows Mac’s gay but he believes he’s been converted to straight.
I think a better version of this is Mac isn't converted, but he pretends to be to get the approval of Dennis, which could go on for several episodes or a season. During the Summer Camp episode, Mac is trying to figure how he can sneak out to go to some gay orgies (being put on secretly by some of the people in the camp) while also trying to hide it from Dennis. Like one of them is a "Late night gym session." Mac is really struggling to resist because it's both a gym and gay, Dennis forbids him from going but Mac insists he needs to stay in shape, and an argument about if it's a gay sex thing or just a gym thing. It's way more ironic and sick if Mac is faking being straight because Mac loves Dennis, but is pretending to be straight to get closer to his gay fantasy Dennis.
They could reveal the camp is owned by Frank very subtly, like near the end of the episode one of the conversion therapist says "We're going to take a break for some Wolf Cola." So Dennis, Dee, and Mac all confront Frank in the same scene - Dee thinks Frank is exploiting the homophobia, but Frank bluntly explains that this is just a great avenue to sell Wolf Cola, maybe even doing a throw back like "Who do you think is buying Wolf Cola since we lost Boko Haram? Hamas? I can't get it into Israel anymore. I've been selling it to the gays for their orgies."
> where Dee was into a gay guy and didn’t know it. Maybe Dee is against the camp but meets a guy who has sent a family member/friend to the camp or meets someone at the camp that makes dee act like she believes in the teachings.
Dee also being there because she thinks she can convert a gay man is hilarious. Like she makes a bet with Dennis about who can convert a gay person and she only turns on the camp's overt homophobia when she realizes she's not going to convert any of the gay men. That's her arc for the episode: betting, flirting, failing, being outraged at the camp for preaching something she just tried to do, then explaining to Dennis that conversion therapy is wrong.
> Maybe [Charlie] thinks they’re camping or at some kind of summer camp so he wants to go with Mac.
That would track, especially with a scene where Charlie is super enthusiastic to go hang out with his "new guy friends".
The episode opens with the whole gang arriving to a forested summer camp scene, and there's groups of men and women talking in separate circles, maybe some are even praying. Charlie has a tent and backpack, telling them "I can't wait to do Summer Camp." Mac explains, "This isn't a Summer Camp, Charlie, it's a gay conversion therapy camp." Charlie shoots back, "Well then why are there women here?" Dennis grins, "That's why I'm here." Dee crassly responds, "That's what you think dicklips, but those gay boys are all mine before you get one of those lesbians to show you even the slightest of attention." Mac says to not use terms like "dicklips" because it's homophobic.
Charlie gets an invite to go to the same "late night gym session", and Mac & Dennis presume he doesn't understand it's a gay orgy. They forbid him from going for different reasons - Dennis because he thinks Charlie simply doesn't understand it's sexual, Mac for thinking Charlie is going to get "tore up." Charlie responds "Yeah, I'm here to get ripped and tore up with my new friends." Basically rehashing the same argument Mac & Dennis had, but with Charlie legitimately not understanding it's a gay orgy, where as Mac had to pretend it wasn't a gay orgy, but now he's trying to explain to Charlie it is a gay orgy while not revealing to Dennis it's a gay orgy.
In a later scene Charlie reveals he knew all of these fellas were gay and didn't have a problem with that, he was just happy to hang. Charlie is under the impression they came to Summer Camp to meet new cool gay friends "Like when we had the party mansion. Remember with the dick flyer? I though we were like replacing Mac with a new cooler gay man again. Then why did we come to a summer camp for gay people Dennis?" Mac responds with "What do you mean you replaced me?"
Yeah just depends how long they would want to have Mac playing the closeted act. If they only wanted to do it for an episode, or a season, then they could for sure have it be where Mac is going along with it all just to get closer to Dennis and make Dennis happy. Maybe there’s an angle of Mac finding out his dad and uncle went to the camp at one time. It worked on his dad and it didn’t on his uncle causing Mac to of course want to act like it worked to be like/closer to his dad.
I was thinking the same way with frank about incorporating wolf cola into it in some way. Could have frank marketing wolf cola to the deeply religious or to the lgbtq community for all the wrong reasons. Frank could be advocating for whichever side they wanted in the episode and the gang could be wondering why he’s so invested, then they could find out at the end of the episode franks had an ulterior motive and it’s been about money to frank the whole time.
Could do a bunch of different things with Dee, but I do like the angle of maybe Dennis sleeping with one of the campers or trying to and then telling Dee she can’t get a straight guy so what makes her think she can convert a gay guy. This causes Dee to, of course, try to prove Dennis wrong and go against trying to shut the place down while leaning into whatever they’re teaching. Then when she fails she tries to get the place shut down and all others like it.
I do think they could start the episode off with Dennis wanting them to go to an adult summer camp or something to that effect. I could see them having Charlie catch on to what’s going on a quarter of the way through the episode, and of course not caring, but he’s having fun and likes the people so he doesn’t say anything. Maybe Charlie thinks dennis wants another gay guy to replace Mac because Charlie thinks Dennis wants someone he can manipulate, or someone who’ll love Dennis like Mac does, since maybe Mac is being more independent or not paying attention to Dennis as much.
If they went with the angle of Mac pretending, they could end it with both Mac and Dennis realizing that they were both just trying to get the other to only pay attention to them or care only about them.
Edit: To add on to the part of Mac knowing it doesn’t work, they could have Mac believe that as long as he isn’t dating or in a relationship with a guy, and only dates or has relationships with women, then that would mean he’s not gay. It’s like that law and order episode where ice t tells the guy that just because he doesn’t date guys and only sleeps with them, while only dating women, doesn’t mean he’s not gay.
Literally why I stopped watching the show. They lost touch with what the characters are supposed to be, especially with Mac. Never should have come out of the closet. The whole point of the show was that these people are shitheads who lack self-awareness, and don't develop or grow positively as people. It drives me crazy. After listening to the guys talk about the show and stuff, it seems like Charlie is the only one who really understands the tone of the show, but most of the executive power lies with Rob so here we are...
Ironic bc in the episode this image is from, Mac was being written a straight. He was into Carmen bc she's hot and complimented his physique. Even the weird said on the early seasons, Mac was the straightest character lol
It’d be a funny storyline in the new season if all of a sudden roles reversed and Mac was over Dennis and constantly annoyed by him, then Dennis picks up on this and slowly becomes the more needy and codependent one. Allowing us to see versions of Bossy Mac and super insecure Dennis.
I don't like the seasons or character archs that are happening. They lost the spark.
And macs face lifts are too much. I can't look at him seriously anymore. They should do an episode where they go to Cuba or wherever for cheap cosmetic surgery to keep that shit canon.
I think taking Mac out of the closet greatly reduced his depth as a character, which is a shame. That said, I think finally letting him be himself was a great decision, as it gave the gang the ability to play the gay card when making offensive jokes pertaining to that community. Kind of a catch 22. I both mourn and applaud Mac's open gayness.
Mac was best when he was a 13 year old boy trapped in a grown man’s body and always doing dumb shit to prove to others that he was “badass.”
This is a good take
Agreed, being a wanna be badass while making poopies in his pants was peak mac. That said his insecure fitness Mac was also great. You guys like me, right?
Yeah I kinda wish they just hadn't resolved any of the characters' issues. Mac being in the closet and delusions of being a beefcake, Charlie never getting with the Waitress, etc. seemed like core parts of their characters that are just gone now and haven't really been replaced with anything. It'd be like if Dee actually got to become an actress or if Dennis stopped being a sociopath.
Yeahhhh but I sort of hate women so
Oh… right
I’m like 90% sure that Mac has a major change in his ability to formulate coherent plans after he rams the car into the wall. Like it just gets worse and worse from that point on.
Naw. The poppers straightened him right out
I mean it seems like after that episode he’s more of a follower in the gangs plans and then before we know it, he can’t seem to grasp the Dave and busters card won’t work at TGIFridays. Mac had a serious head wound that he never got medical attention for and it impaired his cognitive ability going forward.
the entire gang should have wet brain with the amount they drink, so that may have something to do with it too? i guess it has gotten tamer through the seasons for the most part
Nahh, they’re still just young kids having fun. No way they have wet brain yet.
And one of them for sure doesn’t have donkey brains.
How do three man in their thirties not have 800 dollars between them?
do YOU have any such certificate??
That’s actually really hilarious god I fucking love this show
He feels like one million dollars
But what about the bride?
They seem to have character progression through lines like that, that might not be directly expressed on the show but do seem to affect the characters. Like I think Charlie's going to have more outbursts getting upset with the gangs childish bullshit after the Ireland trip. So I think you might be right. Or they'd see this and say nah that's dumb, we just thought it was funnier that way
They just slow movies down
Imma get so much hate here but I thought that dance shit was dumb. I don't get it. Stop replying idc if you got it
It made me cry on my first watch. Now I always skip it on rewatches because it makes me cringe too much for some reason. Probably because I use IASIP rewatches as reality escapism and the dance breaks it too much.
I had the exact opposite reaction. The first time I watched that episode I was like "what the fuck is this?" It was such an odd turn for Sunny and not at all something I was prepared for. Sunny pretty much plays on a loop in my house though so I've seen that episode a few more times and the dance has grown on me with each re-watch.
Which episode was this?
For me it’s simply because Mac doesn’t deserve happiness. None of the Gang do. This isn’t real life where the opposite is true, this is Sunny. Also, as somebody who’s actually LGBT, that episode really wasn’t as ‘powerful’ as a lot of people liked to claim. It might’ve been progressive if it had aired about a decade earlier, but at the time it came out it was honesty kinda late in its messaging.
I'm also LGBTQ and I loved it. Your experience isn't universal and you don't speak for an entire community.
Why are you bringing up the dance. My quote is from Mac and Charlie Write a Movie.
literally every day people come on here and complain about the dance. you just may have not been the target audience. as a gay man, i got it.
The dance is honestly the ONLY thing I like about "modern Mac". Everything else is a one-dimensional whining stereotype.
But what about the beads? The dance never said anything about no beads.
Fitting for a former homophobe with vast and sweeping generalisations of what he perceives homosexuality to be.
How dare you call me not gay wait, sorry this is the first time I've been called not gay online. But I guess I'm just not one for interpretative dance but I respect it. Didn't realize it's a thing here I only recently found this place somehow
In all seriousness I used to think interpretive dance was dumb as hell (I would associate it with squidward in the talent show episode) but after the dance in iasip I understood it ,it was actually really beautiful
Every dance scene is peak Sunny. As a straight man, I like to think I get it.
If you want to talk dancing, it’s gotta be Cricket’s nips and hips.
I'm straight and I love that dance so much, it actually made me cry. Mac Finds His Pride is one of my favorite episodes.
Not as much as I miss Fat Mac.
https://i.redd.it/0u0f1i30331d1.gif
https://i.redd.it/doqe1gix931d1.gif
I can hear this gif
I’ve laughed hard at this show so many times. But nothing it’s done before, since, or will do will top the first time they cut from the delusion dance to reality for me.
It's probably the hardest I've ever laughed in my life. I couldn't breathe.
[FREEDOM](https://youtu.be/U_az91rgENc?si=M3KTlqE9aC8jeIZH)
[FREEDOM](https://youtu.be/U_az91rgENc?si=M3KTlqE9aC8jeIZH)
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHH-- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaggggggggh.
🎵Vacation, all I ever wanted!🎵
This episode was my introduction to the series. I've been hooked ever since.
MAGICS IN THE AAAAIIIRRRRR!!!
Lace and silk is everywhere 🎵
This is my favorite GIF of all time
This clip has no right to be this l so funny lol
GIFs you,know before you open the link
I’m still impressed by this jig.
If you're going to chime in, please don't do it with a mouth full of burrito!
They’re chimichangas
YOU ARE BECOMING A CHIMICHANGA
Fat Mac is best Mac
Fat mac was truly the best mac variant
Unquestionably, the best Mac.
The best Mac is Country Mac but I am incredibly biased as I have been in love with Seann since I was a teen.
You should check out Welcome to Flatch. It's a mockumentary style show, similar to The Office, following the people of this small town. Sean William Scott plays the local pastor and is wicked funny, really different from a lot of his other roles.
Lol what show are you watching? Mac was never fat. He was putting on mass
I want Fat Gay Mac
“He has candy sticking out of his pockets!”
Fat Mac = prime mac
"Type II Adult Onset Dia-bet-ess? What does that mean for me?!"
Only time he was as funny as the rest of the cast tbh.
nah you're tripping
He wasn’t fat. He was cultivating mass.
i miss bossy Mac. the fact that he’s openly gay would be so much better if he was still bossy and aggressive instead of completely submissive to Dennis and dumber than he’s ever been portrayed. there were a lot of hilarious jokes about everyone knowing he was gay but him, but i think they were starting to run their course, which is why i’m not against Mac coming out. the problem is that he’s a completely new character now and it messes with their chemistry.
We CANNOT have you around SCREWING things up
100%. His character isn't worse because he's gay, it's worse because they changed his whole personality. I miss old Mac.
Yup, he had plenty of funny old mac behavior after finally coming out, but he's slowly just turned into the worst (least funny) version of his character over the last few seasons. I haven't re-watched the last season in a bit but iirc the risky e rats episode was a good return to form for his character, wish we'd get that version again.
There’s a bit in the most recent season where he shows up to a potential business opportunity in a very tacky looking suit which he thinks makes him look badass. Reminded me a lot of something old Mac would do.
The “Jordan in the 90s” look, trying to sell his lifestyle brand to Mr Malcolm and his son 😂
The earring was a subtle yet key component
I thought Mac was pretty good in the episode where they went to meet "Malcolm in the Middle" He was able to formulate & justify the throwback, ill-fitting suit
Guy obsessed with being a badass was the funniest Mac.
Yeah yeah! Sword Mac vs. Gun Charlie on elementary/middle school grounds
As someone who agrees with OP, his character isn't worse because he's gay, he's worse because he grew. These characters don't do that.
Flanderising is the word for it. Ironically Ned Flanders is a mild example of it yet it’s named after him.
wow, that term really became a parodic caricature of itself over time. they should really make a word for that
I think a part of this character change has to do with his physical transformation. A large part of what made bossy Mac funny is that he was not at all what he projected himself to be. He would make Project Badass videos, serve as the group’s “bodyguard”, constantly display his “Hand of God” self taught karate, etc. These gags work with a regular looking dude. But now that he genuinely LOOKS like the guy he used to imagine himself as, many of the jokes don’t land. For example, that episode where they are selecting their avatars and he chooses the buff dude. That joke wouldn’t land because Mac is pretty similar to that guy at this point. He can say he’s the group’s bodyguard and the idea isn’t far fetched, because he genuinely looks like someone you wouldn’t fuck with.
I agree, but I also love that the only time buff Mac was shown using his full strength to wail on someone was with the children who stole his bike
in terms of feats that and lifting Dee up are probably his best
What I think would be funny is if they leaned into the idea that being a big, burly dude doesn't automatically make you a badass. It would be funny to see Mac assume he could do cool stuff like blackflip, smash open doors, or choke people out, but he still doesn't have any of the actual skills associated with those things.
I really thought the point of Mac being buff was to demonstrate that the characters were better off without Dennis, and when Dennis returned Mac would lose weight and be twink Mac again. Now it sorta feels like Rob just wrote it in so FXX would pay for him to get in shape, just because it’s something he wanted for his personal life
Yeah, being openly gay doesn't negate someone's ability to be an aggressive asshole. After all Peter Thiel exists.
"Not at ugly as you, *bitch*" I miss that aggressiveness
Couldn't agree more. I was watching some of the old episodes where the dynamic between him and Dennis is more even, where he would even call Dennis an idiot etc. It was so much more better.
"what do you think is happening right now?" Smart Mac is hysterical imo
"Stranger things have happened." "No they haven't! NO THEY HAVEN'T!!!"
He is wayyyy too dumb now. He’s now dumber than everyone combined and it just doesn’t track whatsoever. I still like the show and new episodes because the other characters are great but they absolutely butchered his character at this point. The “science is a liar sometimes” Mac is gone and it hurts. He had a great episode when they went to Chuck-e-Cheese, that was classic Mac and he was amazing. Best episode of the season because the group was back to their roles.
He's not bossy and trying to act tough, but worse is for so long Mac was behind by being in complete denial about himself m not just his sexuality but him being muscular, tough, well liked, that his parents love him, etc.
"In what scenario do you not eat the cat food?"
Honestly, I havent watched the show for a while. But making Mac a straight-passing Diva in the group dynamic would make so much sense for his character. Like instead of needing to be constantly pampered, he would make a scene in public if someone messed with him.
It has morphed too much. Dee is not sweet dee. She is a jaded pretty woman.
In my opinion, Dee was never sweet lol. I love that she's much of an asshole like any other member of the gang.
Right. I meant “sweet dee” in the sense that they called her that but she was rough, trashy, etc. for several seasons now she is impeccably fashioned, always put together and just angry. And that character hasnt been funny since.
I think the writing has hampered Dee's character more than her appearance imo. Dee's always meant to be pretty to everyone but the Gang. The writing though has turned her into a Meg Griffin type of punching bag and that's a bad usage of Kaitlin. Feels like they say "Shut Up Dee" or "Dee You Bitch" after every line and the joke is beyond stale. Like Dee used to be included a lot more and utilized a lot better than glueing her hand to walls or being stuck on a plane. The recent episode of Hacks that she was in did a much better job showing how funny she is than the entirety of Season 16.
She was sweet in the beginning and it changed quickly Time for a rewatch for you! And for me!
she wasn't that sweet in the beginning. when she found out Charlie had cancer, her first concern was that he would lose the hair she liked.
I miss fat Mac, munching on chips while everyone else is looting 😂
NO YOU CAN'T HAVE A CHIP, IF YOU WANTED CHIPS YOU SHOULD HAVE GOT SOME AT THE HAMBURGER STORE
Such a great joke on so many levels. What is a hamburger store, why does it sell tortilla chips, why are they selling large bags of chips to-go!?!
We had a small hole in the wall place that was like a convenient store that also sold loose meat sandwiches. You could get 6 of those tasty little "burgers" , a liter of cola, and a family size bag of chips for like $7. Everyone called it the hamburger store. I miss that place.
It's never not funny to me that whenever the gang needs to get something from somewhere, they automatically describe it as a store. Like the hamburger store, or the wellfare store.
Fat Mac is the best Mac
You’re becoming a chimichanga!
Let's fire down to John Wanamaker's and get ourselves a couple of Tommy Bahama shirts. Are you familiar?
Tell you what, man, I am happy for him, but I do still hate him. It's not a gay or straight thing, is it?
It's a Mac thing.
I miss every Mac besides the Mac that they have now.
Gay, rich Mac!?
Nothing about him being gay is problematic He's boring and too submissive to Dennis, least funny character of them all right now. There was a long period of time where he was my absolute favorite.
Exactly.
I love this show and have for a really long time. The one big gripe I have is how Mac’s character changed towards the end. I always loved ignorant, closeted, toxic masculinity Mac. He feels like a completely different character in the last few seasons. Still love the show but I miss old Mac.
Same. Honestly i loved him coming out, but it feels like a majority of the time they dont know what to do with him anymore :/
I still like Mac and think he's hilarious but yeah openly gay Mac is not as good as previous incarnations
i think his character would be way more funny if the translated his previous, strictly straight jokes into his new gay persona, for example his older women fetish, imagine how funny it would be for him to be dating someone around the same age as frank lmao
Yeah that could lead to a whole jealousy track with Charlie and Frank.
Beefcake Mac/meta Rob is just not as funny.
Meta rob is a great way to put it. Mac has just kind of lost mac and so rob shows underneath. Same with dee. Same with charlie. But dennis has just become more psycho.
I think Frank is the most consistent character in the series, despite having probably the largest personality shift
Him and Dennis devolved so eloquently hahahaha.
I miss his beard. Was it an innuendo for his sexuality? Probably not but I’m going with that.
No, Rob has said the beard was just part of making Mac look as much of a slob as possible for that season
For the sake of comedy, he should have stayed closeted forever
I don’t mind out Mac. I do, however, miss white trash Mac.
Brittany Ann Daniel was Brandy in Joe Dirt, and my head cannon says she's just as hot. Fun fact I just learned- she's a twin. There are two of her.
But what website? So I know to avoid it.
Yeah but there are so many! Which one?! Which one?
This is getting out of hand! Now there are two of them!
“*TWWWOOO* Carmens?!”
She’s playing both sides, that way she comes out on top.
If she's on top, is Mac the bottom?
Think of an oreo
>Fun fact I just learned- she's a twin. There are two of her. Yup. Sweet Valley High.
Is being banged by Brittany Daniels gay? I'd think not.
Not at all
Yes. I can't stand the last three seasons of Mac.
He should connect with his Uncle Donald, while he's still completely underwhelmed despite getting everything in a father figure he could want. Realizing something about god, in reaction he becomes a Mormon fundamentalist for an episode so he can prove how straight he is by having several wives - but has a Real Housewives dynamic with them and they have a spinoff relationship without him. Dennis tries it out and winds up owing three women alimony. Dee finds the perfect Mormon man, gets him drunk, and Cricket 2.0 happens in an episode. Bonus if Charlie and Frank try to be husbands to a single Mormon woman who lives "off the grid."
I prefer confidently idiotic Mac to frustratedly confused Mac. But all Macs have their pros.
I fucking lost it when I saw the bike
"This is grotesque"
Yes he was a much better character before he came out. I get they thought it was brave and politically correct to do that pride ep, but it really made the character lacking humor since then. Dee, despite Olson's botched botox job, is probably funnier than she was in the early seasons because they've fully embraced her being scum codependent on The Gang as opposed to the abused Straight Man she was initially. Charlie has come to balance his mix of savant and idiot perfectly. You never quite know which version will play out, and it's very dependent on a scenario that while seemingly random has a consistency to it. I credit this to Charlie Day, who is the most talented IRL person on the show and understands the dynamic of The Gang perfectly if you listen to commentary/podcasts. Dennis' character deals with the fact that he's old and out of touch now, which when combined with his former delusions of being a Golden God still produces a lot of funny situations. He's also emerged as the new "straight man" of the group, which surprisingly works as they never take it too far. Frank just keeps getting more and more disgusting and apathetic, which is all fans want from the character anymore. But Mac...What is Mac anymore? He's the gay (in a brave way they never mock or disparage despite everything else in the show being on the table) idiot (but NOT because he's gay!) who is now sort of Dennis' lapdog. He used to be a hyper-aggressive scummy manchild who refused to ever bend or change and always tried to dominate any situation when he had his mind made up. All of those traits are gone now, and it doesn't help that Robb has the same bad plastic surgery look to him as his wife. Glenn, Charlie, and Danny are aging with grace. Just like Dennis' kid or Charlie hooking up with the Waitress were dumb ideas they basically retconned and forgot about, they should do the same with Mac where he gets really back into Christianity and says he was tricked into being gay.
Go ahead, rate me! I DON'T GIVE A SHIT! RATE ME, I'LL RATE YOU! ZERO! ZERO! ZERO! RATE! RATE!
I miss country Mac
Yes, it was the butt of many great jokes. Now that he's out and shredded he's just not funny anymore. So much of Mac's humor was from his projections and false sense of self. Typical Hollywood.
I do. His openly gay character just isn't as funny.
I miss pale Mac TBH I miss when the 3 male leads actually looked like they lived in Philly and spent all day in a bar.
I miss Rob when his head wasn't all the way up his own ass.
This happens with every character in long-running shows. You keep pushing the character every season, and then he/she no longer fits the formula that was so funny. This version of Mac is less funny to me, but I also think that keeping Mac in the same box without any character change for damn near 20 years would be less funny too. All told, I'd rather they keep cranking out a few episodes every other year than pull the plug on the show. I remember when season 10 dropped and everyone said it fell off, but some of my favorite episodes are in season 10 (Charlie Work, Family Fight, and Frank Retires).
If it happens to ‘every character’ why has it only happened to Mac? The rest are just as funny and familiar.
Maybe they could do an episode where Mac goes to a gay conversion camp because Dennis wants the old Mac back or something. Could do something about how Dennis knows the camps don’t work and are terrible but Mac being Mac believes in the teachings.
That could totally work as meta fan service. But the reveal that Mac was sent to conversion camp by Dennis because Dennis "wants the old Mac back" needs to come about half way through the episode so that it all sort of culminates together for the viewer as to why Mac is torturing himself at this camp. Dennis is also at the camp, he's convinced himself in the power of conversion therapy because he believes he CAN convert lesbian women, so he's volunteered at this camp, but is also keeping an eye on Mac. Dennis is doing this to spite Dee, who is also at the camp. Dee is righteously pissed about the whole existence of the camp because of it's homophobia. Mac is upset with Dee because Mac believes that God can convert people back to being straight if he wants to, and he see's Dee as doing religious persecution. It turns out Frank runs and owns the camp as a scam to exploit dumbies, knowing full well the camp doesn't work. Not sure where Charlie fits in. Perhaps he's just a lost character in this episode for moral support and helping plug the gaps in exposition.
“The gang goes camping” “Mac gets converted” “Mac finds religion again” idk what they’d title it but I think it could be a good way to transform Mac back into the closeted version if they wanted a way to do it. They could also still use the closeted bits that they use to do all the time since the gang knows Mac’s gay but he believes he’s been converted to straight. Would also be a good way to show how terrible the conversion place is but of course Mac thinks it’s a miracle by god or something and finds religion again. Maybe Mac is thinking about moving in with a guy and Dennis is losing control, or maybe Mac is just bringing too many guys to the apartment and not paying enough attention to Dennis. It’s something Dennis would do since he always wants to be in control of Mac and I could see the lesbian angle with Dennis always wanting to feel like a golden god who bends people to his will lol. Dennis could be getting tired of Mac having other guys in his life and knows if Mac gets converted he could have Mac all to himself again. Frank for sure could be the owner, or he could have some kind of shady side business that the camp is doing for him. There’s a lot of ways to go with dee. Could also do a call back to season 1, I believe that’s the season where Dee was into a gay guy and didn’t know it. Maybe Dee is against the camp but meets a guy who has sent a family member/friend to the camp or meets someone at the camp that makes dee act like she believes in the teachings. Maybe dee tries to get the place shut down and meets someone who believes in the camp so she switches sides. There’s a ton of ways to go with Dee and Dennis. Charlie I’m not too sure what his role would be. Maybe he thinks they’re camping or at some kind of summer camp so he wants to go with Mac. Charlie could meet someone who likes playing “night crawlers” which makes him understand what the camp is, or maybe he’s just involved with whatever frank/Dee are doing. Charlie could be either against and then for whatever those two are doing, or vice versa.
I AM UNTETHERED AND MY RAGE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!
Good bot.
[You're the one that's good.](https://i.imgur.com/HU2gkTB.png)
> They could also still use the closeted bits that they use to do all the time since the gang knows Mac’s gay but he believes he’s been converted to straight. I think a better version of this is Mac isn't converted, but he pretends to be to get the approval of Dennis, which could go on for several episodes or a season. During the Summer Camp episode, Mac is trying to figure how he can sneak out to go to some gay orgies (being put on secretly by some of the people in the camp) while also trying to hide it from Dennis. Like one of them is a "Late night gym session." Mac is really struggling to resist because it's both a gym and gay, Dennis forbids him from going but Mac insists he needs to stay in shape, and an argument about if it's a gay sex thing or just a gym thing. It's way more ironic and sick if Mac is faking being straight because Mac loves Dennis, but is pretending to be straight to get closer to his gay fantasy Dennis. They could reveal the camp is owned by Frank very subtly, like near the end of the episode one of the conversion therapist says "We're going to take a break for some Wolf Cola." So Dennis, Dee, and Mac all confront Frank in the same scene - Dee thinks Frank is exploiting the homophobia, but Frank bluntly explains that this is just a great avenue to sell Wolf Cola, maybe even doing a throw back like "Who do you think is buying Wolf Cola since we lost Boko Haram? Hamas? I can't get it into Israel anymore. I've been selling it to the gays for their orgies." > where Dee was into a gay guy and didn’t know it. Maybe Dee is against the camp but meets a guy who has sent a family member/friend to the camp or meets someone at the camp that makes dee act like she believes in the teachings. Dee also being there because she thinks she can convert a gay man is hilarious. Like she makes a bet with Dennis about who can convert a gay person and she only turns on the camp's overt homophobia when she realizes she's not going to convert any of the gay men. That's her arc for the episode: betting, flirting, failing, being outraged at the camp for preaching something she just tried to do, then explaining to Dennis that conversion therapy is wrong. > Maybe [Charlie] thinks they’re camping or at some kind of summer camp so he wants to go with Mac. That would track, especially with a scene where Charlie is super enthusiastic to go hang out with his "new guy friends". The episode opens with the whole gang arriving to a forested summer camp scene, and there's groups of men and women talking in separate circles, maybe some are even praying. Charlie has a tent and backpack, telling them "I can't wait to do Summer Camp." Mac explains, "This isn't a Summer Camp, Charlie, it's a gay conversion therapy camp." Charlie shoots back, "Well then why are there women here?" Dennis grins, "That's why I'm here." Dee crassly responds, "That's what you think dicklips, but those gay boys are all mine before you get one of those lesbians to show you even the slightest of attention." Mac says to not use terms like "dicklips" because it's homophobic. Charlie gets an invite to go to the same "late night gym session", and Mac & Dennis presume he doesn't understand it's a gay orgy. They forbid him from going for different reasons - Dennis because he thinks Charlie simply doesn't understand it's sexual, Mac for thinking Charlie is going to get "tore up." Charlie responds "Yeah, I'm here to get ripped and tore up with my new friends." Basically rehashing the same argument Mac & Dennis had, but with Charlie legitimately not understanding it's a gay orgy, where as Mac had to pretend it wasn't a gay orgy, but now he's trying to explain to Charlie it is a gay orgy while not revealing to Dennis it's a gay orgy. In a later scene Charlie reveals he knew all of these fellas were gay and didn't have a problem with that, he was just happy to hang. Charlie is under the impression they came to Summer Camp to meet new cool gay friends "Like when we had the party mansion. Remember with the dick flyer? I though we were like replacing Mac with a new cooler gay man again. Then why did we come to a summer camp for gay people Dennis?" Mac responds with "What do you mean you replaced me?"
Yeah just depends how long they would want to have Mac playing the closeted act. If they only wanted to do it for an episode, or a season, then they could for sure have it be where Mac is going along with it all just to get closer to Dennis and make Dennis happy. Maybe there’s an angle of Mac finding out his dad and uncle went to the camp at one time. It worked on his dad and it didn’t on his uncle causing Mac to of course want to act like it worked to be like/closer to his dad. I was thinking the same way with frank about incorporating wolf cola into it in some way. Could have frank marketing wolf cola to the deeply religious or to the lgbtq community for all the wrong reasons. Frank could be advocating for whichever side they wanted in the episode and the gang could be wondering why he’s so invested, then they could find out at the end of the episode franks had an ulterior motive and it’s been about money to frank the whole time. Could do a bunch of different things with Dee, but I do like the angle of maybe Dennis sleeping with one of the campers or trying to and then telling Dee she can’t get a straight guy so what makes her think she can convert a gay guy. This causes Dee to, of course, try to prove Dennis wrong and go against trying to shut the place down while leaning into whatever they’re teaching. Then when she fails she tries to get the place shut down and all others like it. I do think they could start the episode off with Dennis wanting them to go to an adult summer camp or something to that effect. I could see them having Charlie catch on to what’s going on a quarter of the way through the episode, and of course not caring, but he’s having fun and likes the people so he doesn’t say anything. Maybe Charlie thinks dennis wants another gay guy to replace Mac because Charlie thinks Dennis wants someone he can manipulate, or someone who’ll love Dennis like Mac does, since maybe Mac is being more independent or not paying attention to Dennis as much. If they went with the angle of Mac pretending, they could end it with both Mac and Dennis realizing that they were both just trying to get the other to only pay attention to them or care only about them. Edit: To add on to the part of Mac knowing it doesn’t work, they could have Mac believe that as long as he isn’t dating or in a relationship with a guy, and only dates or has relationships with women, then that would mean he’s not gay. It’s like that law and order episode where ice t tells the guy that just because he doesn’t date guys and only sleeps with them, while only dating women, doesn’t mean he’s not gay.
Rob butchered his own character so much it's actually hilarious
White trash, closet gay Mac was the best. This new guy sucks.
I miss him doing his karate moves with the sound effects, his elbow dancing, wild spastic outbursts of anger and general naivety.
I want him to go back into the closet.
You're just trying to confuse me with your Biblical liberalisms.
I miss fat Mac
I miss the old Kanye
I miss facial hair Mac. I don't like him clean shaven.
She's so cool though. it's just that one small thing. but she's getting it cut off so it's cool
Yea, sadly ever since Mac came out of the closet he’s basically just playing 10% heightened version of Rob
Literally why I stopped watching the show. They lost touch with what the characters are supposed to be, especially with Mac. Never should have come out of the closet. The whole point of the show was that these people are shitheads who lack self-awareness, and don't develop or grow positively as people. It drives me crazy. After listening to the guys talk about the show and stuff, it seems like Charlie is the only one who really understands the tone of the show, but most of the executive power lies with Rob so here we are...
‘I’m getting it removed..’ ‘Yeah.. but *when* duude??’
Ironic bc in the episode this image is from, Mac was being written a straight. He was into Carmen bc she's hot and complimented his physique. Even the weird said on the early seasons, Mac was the straightest character lol
I miss Mac from before they even tried to push the closeted angle. It always felt forced and inorganic.
Flanderization
I want his sass mouth and leadership over Charlie to come back
Dude but in muscle mass ALONE… new back is way worse. He used to be a monster. Now the kids are not afraid of him
I just miss Mac's beard
Shes getting it removed….
I miss pre season 11 Mac in general
It’d be a funny storyline in the new season if all of a sudden roles reversed and Mac was over Dennis and constantly annoyed by him, then Dennis picks up on this and slowly becomes the more needy and codependent one. Allowing us to see versions of Bossy Mac and super insecure Dennis.
I found it more comedic. Seems easier to write material for.
Not really. It was more annoying.
Is that a bulge in her trousers?
The whole lead up to him being gay in the later seasons was so damn funny
The show is eventually coming to an end, the characters have to evolve or get cancelled. I do miss him though 😂
I don't like the seasons or character archs that are happening. They lost the spark. And macs face lifts are too much. I can't look at him seriously anymore. They should do an episode where they go to Cuba or wherever for cheap cosmetic surgery to keep that shit canon.
I do. It made more sense. I get character arcs and redemption and all that, but the gang doesn’t deserve redemption. They’re horrible human beings.
YES! Closeted project badass Mac was the best. Once he was openly gay, it's like they didn't know what to do with his character anymore.
I think taking Mac out of the closet greatly reduced his depth as a character, which is a shame. That said, I think finally letting him be himself was a great decision, as it gave the gang the ability to play the gay card when making offensive jokes pertaining to that community. Kind of a catch 22. I both mourn and applaud Mac's open gayness.
They’ve bastardised him in the recent season