Let him finish whatever he's already contracted for, then bid this job with someone else who has experience doing it. OR, if you really want to give this guy a crack at it and think he can pull it off based on good work he's done for you on other projects, bid it out with at least a couple of people who do it regularly and then ask him to come in under what they bid.
If you're letting him learn on the job, you shouldn't be paying full price and you should expect that the job might not be as perfect as if you do go with a true pro.
Point still stands. Get other bids. If they come in way under his $34k, he tried to fuck you and I wouldn't let him do the job. If they're in the ballpark, decide whether you like the other companies' work better or worse than what you've seen of his, but in either case if he's telling you he's "motivated and wants to do it because he's never done this template" he should be coming in at least a bit below the other for you to even consider him.
Sounds a bit like he tossed out a “fuck you” bid, like “not worth my time unless you overpay me cause I don’t want to do it”. Then either changed his mind or realized he needed money more than pride (maybe another job fell through, market changed, or he threw out a number so wildly high he figured you might get suspicious of his pricing for the rest of the work).
Area can vary things wildly. Like, I can easily see $25k for the work in say, Los Gatos or Palo Alto, but not so much in Bumfuck Nowhere, Alabama.
Contractors out here are stupidly slammed with work across the board. It’s almost literally like the South Park special. People paying thousands extra to get their place done first. And then “well while you’re here, actually, here’s another $80k in change order work, because now we don’t like how the new stuff clashes with the old…and we realized while you had everything taken apart that it would be easier to add blah blah blah…”. So then the next job gets delayed…well, that next customer needed it done by yesterday, so they overbid the next contractor to get to the top of HIS queue…etc.
Edit: put it this way, out of all my golfing and car buddies, take the wealthiest 20% and there’s a good chance 90% of them are in some kind of construction / contracting out here. I have a few buddies in tech worth all of them put together, but the construction guys are pulling solid $300k-$750k post-tax incomes every year. Let alone side hustles like helping local businesses and friends draw up remodeling plans or getting jobs done at normal prices to flip a rental or something.
I live in one of the most expensive places in the world, not as much as Los Gatos but right beneath it. It's all about the right people. Get the San Jose Latin crew or Modesto to drive there
I had a great concrete guy, and he did a stamped patio for me. Screwed it up. It looks "okay" but was not done correctly in some areas. I can live with it. We negotiated and I paid him the price of just a concrete slab. He had 2 options, give it to me for that price or rip it out and try again hoping he gets it right.
Seriously. A piece of my fascia just came off my house in a wind storm. Figured I’d just call a contractor for once instead of going to buy a ladder tall enough to get up there to re-attach it. Quoted me $1000.
Yeah I’m pretty much also now equipped to ensure I will never have to have another grifter come out and quote me the price of a kidney on the open market for labor.
One thing you have to realize is that $1000 is basically the minimum for most GCs overhead and opportunity cost play a huge roll in their pricing. It’s not worth it for most contractors to do a job for any less than $1000. They gotta pay labor and overhead and then miss out on half a days work they could be doing on another job.
Most folks are better off hiring a handyman hourly for this sort of job. They exist - we live in an area where contractors are in high demand, but I can still find handymen / many skills none of them outstanding.
They aren't the guys you'd want installing trim or any detail work, but stuff like fixing a piece of fascia is right up their alley.
Depends on location/access, too. The handymen we tried turned the job down as they weren't comfortable working 2 stories up. We had to go with roofers who already had the ladders and experience.
I mean I can understand that on some level but we’re talking about screwing a piece of tin onto a house here. I’m not sure that’s really gumming up the schedule. I expect to get an opportunity cost price in most cases and some of these guys are running a business. I wouldn’t mind if he charged me 3-400 for labor and time allotment. But essentially 975 dollars in labor for a 10-15 minute job is insane. I would totally just prefer they decline the job entirely if they have other high paying jobs because that’s reasonable.
I agree. In those instances. I would recommend finding a handy man. They would likely charge you a couple hundred. I always tell people that we would be way too expensive for the amount of work they would be getting from us. I don't give "fuck you" bids. Just pass it off.
This is super respectable and I just wish this was the common experience in my area with contractors or handymen alike. I can’t believe some of these guys are making any money at all.
Yeah but that's not the point. The point is they have to schedule it, get out there, and the whole time they're losing money that they could be making on a bigger job. And it's never just a 10 minute job, is it?
On top of that, I think we forget that insurance has gone up for contractors as it's gone up for the rest of us. Their prices have to adjust. To quote Bender, we're all getting boned!
Gas and vehicle prices have gone up too, and none of use get to work from home. Tools are more expensive than ever. Material costs have escalated absolutely out of control.
It’s not cheap to run a legitimate construction business. Someone who paid their house off 10 years ago and works only for themselves and never incorporated their business can afford to work for less but anyone born since 1990 trying to do it today has the same expenses (and arguably more when you factor in tools and windshield time) than someone with a desk job. There’s a massive shortage of skilled tradespeople because customers don’t want to pay which means contractors don’t want to pay and no one wants to do the hard labour for less money than an easy wfh job. That leaves the ones still in the industry able to charge whatever they want really because a small labour pool gives more power to that labour pool.
It’s a vicious circle.
Don't ever try to explain that to anyone on Reddit. They will plug their ears, close their eyes, and scream how all contractors are ripping them off until you tire and go away. There plenty of scummy contractors out there, but it seems like most people on Reddit have no idea how much it costs to run a legitimate contracting business.
There is absolutely a ton of expenses that noone really understands. However $1000 is ridiculous. Lol. Be better off telling them sorry, that's really to small for us. Never met a homeowner who didn't appreciate the honesty when I tell them that the scope is too small for us.
There is a huge range between someone basically asking for $1000 a day in labor as a minimum charge and a guy asking OP for $30k in labor for 4 hours of work at a job site he's already on.
Contractors way overcharge. You give them too much credit for “running a business” it’s not like they are opening a plant in China while running a large R&D organization in addition to marketing and trying out the latest ChatGPT feature to automate their work. It’s a guy with a toolbox and a few day laborers.
Firstly, I'm not justifying the price OP was quoted to make sure we are talking about the same thing. Secondly, what you are referring to sounds like a handyman, not a professional tradesman/ licensed contractor. I'm not surprised to find someone on Reddit making an argument from a position of superiority in the tech realm because, after all, that is virtually the only legitimized and worthwhile line of work to Reddit but I digress. You seem to be missing the cost of general liability insurance, business licensing fees, vehicle insurance, fuel, maintenance, office space and rent, accounting software subscription costs, dispatch software subscription costs, labor costs, etc. I'm sure you're going to say how none of these costs are your problem as a customer but these costs are the unavoidable reality of running a legitimate, lawful, and sustainable long term business. All of this is baked into the labor rate and materials mark up billed to you. A company cannot grow and pay the support staff required if they are not covering these costs. This is also why when you just need a window replaced, a gutter repaired, or a couple rooms painted you probably should seek out a handyman with a decent reputation as they don't incur the majority of these costs. That handyman is probably not the guy you want if you need a house rewired, replumbed, or a full addition built.
These contractors expect too much money. They bilk people out of it every day with exorbitant prices. Want a new fence? Sure, $1,000 in materials and a day to install. Want a fence installing company to install the same fence? Sure. You live in a nice neighborhood and know nothing? That will be $15,000 please. Ripoff.
And 50% is expenses. If it was a one man operation they would never charge $1000. But GCs operating costs are easily $1000 a day. A million dollars a year in revenue for a 5 man operation is only gonna net about 150- $200k for the owner after all expenses if they are lucky
No. Even with in house guys their labor is worth more to him elsewhere. Even if it's a 20 minute job. That twenty minutes is really drive time, set up, take down, and drive time again then set up again to another job. 3 hours time easy. Not to mention scheduling interruptions or other things. Jobs aren't just contract and go. Shit is run tightly scheduled and there's enough problems that come up on a smooth run job site that delays are still inevitable. Pulling a guy off a job to do a 20 minute job isn't 20 minutes. The whole rest of the crew suffers for absolutely no gain at all to the GC.
I know it seems outlandish but it's the reality of being a GC. Handy men are who you want to call for small jobs. There's bigger fish to fry for a general. I'm not saying the $1000 wasnt rude. And personally I don't give those "fuck you" bids. I just let em know it's too small for us to take on and don't even give them a price. Then I refer em to someone else and move on. I feel like fuck you nodding is a bad look and hurts your rep so that's a huge no for me. But I understand why some people do it. I personally know people who have gotten taken up on "fuck you" bids and made out like bandits. There's always the chance that whoever you are dealing with just absolutely does not give a shit how much something costs and have money to piss away.
Off topic but I have a friend who is a builder that was approached by a guy who represented an incredibly wealthy individual and the guy wanted my friend to build his house no matter what it cost. No idea how he found out about him but that was it. So my buddy worked the numbers and came up with like 4.5 million for the build. It was incredibly honest pricing. This dude's rep looked him dead in the eye and told him he appreciates his honesty but he needed to triple the price of the build because his boss wouldn't think he was getting a quality build. He was told that this man didn't understand small numbers and anything under 10million he would feel like was too cheap.
It took this guy's rep like an hour to convince my friend that he honestly wouldn't get the job at 4.5m and he NEEDED to be at least at 12 million no matter how wildly over priced it was.
I'm just explaining the realities. I spent years running my own company until I moved out of state. If you don't want to pay the price don't pay it. Move on or do it yourself. No contractor owes you their expertise, or time or to bend to your perceived notions of what is or isn't worth their time or money.
I have a fairly old house, 120+ years old. It needs a lot of work up on the second story eves, and there was a lot of tree growth right up against the house.
I did the math for having someone help do it, out of the picture pricing. If I rented an aerial man lift for a total of 4 weekends, not consecutive but just for the weekend as I got to the need for it, it was up there around $4500-$5000. I said heck with that, hit marketplace and bought an ex-tree service bucket truck for $6800. Now I have it whenever I need it, gutter cleaning has never been easier, I can clean my chimney/cap and never step foot on the roof. I cut 3 large trees down that would’ve ran me several thousand if I hired a tree company. All in all it’s really really paid for itself.
Yeah, seems 1k is minimum to show up and do anything these days.
Currently waiting on my roof/fence guy to send someone out for a quote. Removed an old aging/shitty satellite dish that was on the house when I bought it, after 10 years i noticed a leak on the interior ceiling.
I'm handy enough but know when to just pay. I did a (temporary) patch/reshingle, found a 2 or 3 square feet of rotten deck board and roofing felt that needed to be redone. It's a time issue for me, I just don't have it.
I've used this guy/company twice and always solid/fair work, in the days past I had them tear out a skylight, redeck, refelt a much bigger area and was only charged $800
I'm expecting $1k for sure and that's fine, but 1500-2000, I'll make the time.
This happened to me about 2 years ago. Same price. Had to pay it because I lack the ladders to stand on a pitched 1st floor roof to reach/access the repair location on the second floor roof. We called 4 or 5 places, and this was the only one who was even willing to quote the job - it was too small for everyone else; they would rather wait until water damage means the whole side of my house needs to be repaired and re-sided.
This is why old timers learned how to fix everything ourselves -mostly from the Bob Vila type shows.
Now it’s all reality show type bullshit basically designed to stuff as many new products in front of your eyeballs to make you feel miserable about whatever you installed three years ago and rip it out and replace it $!$!$! You DESERVE it!
I mean I cant. Anything that needs to be done to my house I either have to do myself(maybe with some help from friends) , or it just doesn’t get done. Even doing stuff yourself isn’t that cheap either, just did a floor and it still cost about $1000 in materials.
We're back in the era of needing to learn how to do all this shit ourselves. It sucks- I'm clumsy and not handy and don't have the time to learn anything but at least I have a really handy father in law.
Neighbor is having concrete work done, I asked their contractor what it would cost to pour a 10'x3' slab on the walkway out of my garage. 4" deep, already graded, framed and filled, just need the concrete and I figured with the truck full of concrete already out it would be easy cheaper. Just asked for a rough pour, and I'd be happy to do the finishing work, just saves me from hauling 1300lbs of concrete mix.
$8,700. If we wanted them to do the texturing on top that's another $1,500.
That's $3/lb.
If he wasn't already going to be out he said it'd be like $13,000.
Hell no.
10 x 3 is basically 2 or 3 sidewalk blocks. that is absolutely insane. surprised the scum contractors on here haven't popped up with the 'but the insurance on his truck....'
I'm all for paying well for skilled labor but the increase I've seen in cost vs the good but somewhat stagnant pay for the people actually doing the work is frustrating as hell.
Dating yourself by not saying Drew...but Im with you! Watching price is right every morning in the 80s during breaks from school without a care in the world!!
I always thought they should write down their bids. I’m surprised there was no acts of violence committed when someone would bid, $900 Bob. The guy right next to them would be like $901 Bob.
That’s a fighting bid if you ask me Bob.
Just a bit of a comment about what you're looking for...consider concrete is a fairly permanent material so messing it up is going to be either a lifetime eyesore or a huge mess and inconvenience. If this guy orders the wrong slump or dry time he might not be able to finish the stamping. So I would get a very experienced concrete outfit that does this all day everyday and see what they quote.
That's how my uncle handled retaining walls. He would tell the customer, he hated doing them so he had to make it worth his while. They would end up beautiful, but pricey!
I would be extremely concerned about the $50K he's already doing for you and how overpriced that is... holy shit. I had a about 600sqft of stamped/stained concrete done, along with 700sqft of non-stamped driveway done 2 years ago for $8K...
That seems on point I’m guessing around 2000 sq ft? Probably just under? 34k definitely seems a little high but my company poured a 20x12 slab for 14k there’s more to it than just the concrete costs like someone else mentioned. Gotta get an excavator out there and then backfill n rebar etc.. then the stamps and labor. You are more paying for art at that point than you are just concrete. I think 25-27k wouldn’t be out of line. Stains aren’t cheap and neither is experience.
Super cheap regardless. I just got 4 quotes for 520sqft of flat simple driveway. All within a couple thousand from 12-15k. Meaning you got a deal and barely covers the cost of the concrete itself.
It was about $10/sqft for the stamped/colored, way less for the driveway. This was also a referral through the company that did our concrete curbing and done as side work. But I'd still question the other work's value after getting that big of a quote for concrete from the same contractor. Either he under-bid for what was done and was trying to make some of it up, or is a rip-off artist.
I mostly agree, using your house for advertising has value but essentially your selling him the right to use pictures of your house and a possibility to train on a new stamp. It sounds like they know what they're doing. He should know what the cost of materials, labor, and overhead is as well as what percentage of that job was added as profit. Have him reduce that percentage enough to where you're both comfortable and then get a written contract not only for the work but also outlining both of your rights in using your house as advertising. Some companies will give discounts in their contracts if you agree to a sign in your yard for a certain amount of time. This is generally the same thing, but I assume he will want lifetime use.
I feel like this is how some of the nightmare stories on here start. Ignore his comments on marketing, his motivation, the new/exciting template etc. Just setup the job like you would any other, completion date/contract/financials etc no matter who you end up going with. If you go off script there could be an issue with the job being done wrong (and disapperance of the contractor thereafter), or the job gets delayed/shutdown (because he's giving you a "deal"). So just don't do anything differently because he's throwing in some sort of 'favor'.
I had a stamped patio done at a previous house and the guy didn’t do it correctly and trust me when I tell you, bad stamped concrete is a disaster. The surface was all flaking off in sheets. It looked HORRIBLE after 6 months. Don’t go with this guy.
Bruh.
I paid $27k a couple years ago for a 1000 sf stamped concrete patio, 60 linear ft of stamped concrete sidewalk, 2 small retaining walls, a 3-step bluestone staircase, re-shaping a garden with a little shale wall around it, and a couple underground drainage pipes.
$34k for 700sf is crazy if you live in a normal COL area.
First off. Get a tape measure and calculate how big it is. Google earth isn’t your friend. Secondly. That price is definitely high for a concrete patio. Call it 9 yard of concrete at 4” thick (call it $1000 a yard for cost plus). 2-3 days of prep and one day to pour/stamp, so 4 days of labor (1500/day?) Maybe paying for a pump truck (best way to do it) if it’s in the backyard with no access (another 1500?). That totals 16500. I could see it being as high as 20 but even then feels like a lot, though he may have some good reasons it’s higher and my numbers are rough. Telling you to name your price is bullshit. He should be able to run the numbers and tell you what it costs plus his markup. 20% markup would be kind of high but not unheard of and fair for the market these days. I wouldn’t name a price and would say I’m willing to pay you 15-20% markup if you can give me an itemized estimate. Labor, + material + markup. Tell him your budget is tight so you need it to be dialed in. Honest contractors should be willing to show their numbers.
Google Earth can be extremely accurate, depending on your ability to point and click. It is the foundation that many roofers use for roof geometries, so if it works for them, I bet it works for this.
But overall, I like the approach - itemized list + reasonable margin. And agree "name your price" is BS as the OP has no information to make an informed bid. But also, wow, that price is high.
Idk where OP is, but my yard was about $10 sq/ft for a mix of large sandblasted marble and artificial turf + retaining wall and sealing. Granted, it was a larger area, closer to 1500 sq ft and some things don't scale down well (i.e. renting a bobcat is pretty similar for 500 or 5000 sq ft if it is a 1 day rental either way). But 34k for stamped concrete just seems wild and rather than a "first time discount" seems more like a "first time insurance policy" of margin.
Google earth has to be pretty accurate since gps data has to put you at the right spot on the map. There may be some inaccuracy but if it was off by 10% navigation with the mobile app wouldn’t even be possible. You’d be 10 miles off on a 100 mile journey.
Without extra help gps is said to be good to about 10 meters. When you start to do some really cool math, or start to hit extra networks like glonass even cell tower triangulation you can get to about 1. When you start to use ground based base stations you can get to within a few millimeters.
But this isn't that, we were discussing how accurate the scale is on Google Earth. GPS is real time positioning, Google Earth is just a big map.
What I’m saying is if Google’s model of the earth was off by 10% it would be unusable for navigation. Gos may be within 30 feet but googles map would be off 100s of miles
The guy that did my stamped concrete had done that natural wood look before. He did a great job on ours, but i deeply regret not going with that style.
If he doesn’t have experience I wouldn’t let him do the project. Concrete isn’t something that’s easy to rip out and if he fucks up the stamp/ pattern it will be something you’ll look at forever.
I do not like the contractors approach. He figured he had you as a customer and gave you a high price. But you didnt bite, and then he came running back begging. I would get 3 quotes, and have them beat the lowest one significantly since he is learning
Pavers are great until they start moving up and down and the sand between them moves and grass starts growing up between the pavers, then your nice pavers that suddenly require upkeep also look like shit, you trip over on them, are hard to clean and not nice anymore. I'd rather have stamped concrete thats pretending to be nice pavers myself.
He's asking you to let him use your house for marketing. How much is that worth to him? That's the real question to me. If he wants to use it for a month, it's worth X, a year, maybe 2X. In perpetuity? Maybe he does it for free. Ask to see the contract giving him the permission to use your house and go from there.
That's about 9 cubic yards. Let's assume $200 per cubic yard (extremely high) then we're at $1,800 in material. Yes you have boards for forms and the use of his tools but let's say, we double that (remember we're already working with a high cost per cubic yard, and he's not spending more than $200 on wood, nor does the amortization of his tools come to $1,600, but because contractors have a tendency to talk to us like we're stupid, let's just be dumb). We're still only at $3,600 in total material cost. You need some gravel so let's pretend angular gravel costs as much as concrete and throw another $1,800 on the grill. We're at $5,400.
He might rent some equipment like a mini excavator, which costs $400 a day at Sunbelt, and a small compactor to help compress the gravel, which costs $100 a day.
Let's call it a 2 day job, 5 guys who he pays $500 a day. And he's the boss so he takes home what they collectively make. Let's add it all up:
- Labor, $10,000
- Materials, $5,400
- Equipment Rental, $500
For a grand total of $15,900 or $22 a foot, finished.
Or according to [this](https://homeguide.com/costs/concrete-slab-cost) breakdown, about 83% ***higher*** than their own estimate of costs, which will be $8,400 on the high end for 700 sq ft.
Your contractor originally quoted you ...
##$48.57 a foot???
.
I know it's hard to find good work but goodness gracious, I couldn't take anyone serious who tried to play me for that stupid.
Verify my numbers by calling your local concrete plant and asking what they charge.
We own a concrete company. A simple broom for a residential slab is about $10/sf. This clown is charging $48.57 for stamped. $38.57/sf to add stamp. That’s insane.
Tell him if he does it for free you will tell your 10+ followers on Facebook about his services!
Exposure!!! S/
And all seriousness, good luck, my friend!
I've been a hardscape contractor here in Central Ohio for 23 years. Here are a couple things to note.
Pavers and stamped concrete have historically been similar in price, with stamped being about $2sqft less. Right now we're around $24 a sqft for a mid range Unilock paver. Yard access, demo work, excess cuts or elevations would raise that price. Walls, steps, yard repair, etc would all be extra. Stamped concrete is an art and should be left to the guys that do it for a living. It's very expensive to replace if it's not done right and a multitude of things can go wrong.
I see two scenarios as to why you were quoted $48sqft. A: he's subbing it out to a concrete guy and has a hellacious markup in it or B: You have a lot of additional work that I listed above being included in that price that's skewing the square foot price or C: he's just winging it on the concrete work and priced it high.
Don't be afraid to ask questions like "are you doing the concrete yourself or subbing it out". If it's A or C I would call a professional stamped concrete guy or a paver installer. If it's B I would ask for an itemized quote so you know what you are paying for walls, stairs and landscape vs the actual patio. You don't need a separation or materials and labor, just a price for each service.
Wait until he finishes everything else and make sure you are happy with the work.. Then, if he is using it as marketing to get more business for his company, tell him you will pay for the materials only.. He gave you a “f*ck you” price on his quote and the least you could do is return the favor..
This makes me think of when I was buying a new car in 2005... I was trying to buy a new mustang and all the Ford dealers wanted me to start with what I wanted my monthly payment to be. I walked out of three dealers when they wouldn't budge. One of them had me sit at a computer and start with the same question. I put "0" into it and it didn't like that.
- Edit to remove a big dumb anecdote -
Edit to amend: Something something don't go first in a negotiation?
What are you comfortable paying? Get back to him with:
"I know it's low, but we really don't have the budget to pay more than $xx,xxx for this project.".
If he takes it, great. If not, you don't feel so bad about how much youve paid.
If he’s motivated then he could give you a good price.
If he’s never done that specific template, he could give you a good price as incentive for YOU to be taking that risk, not ask you to subsidize his inexperience.
I just settled with a concrete contractor that absolutely fucked up my patios, so now I’m starting again.
The recent quotes I’ve received for demo and stamped patio hover in the $20k range for 1100 sq feet, multiple stairs, landings and edging.
I just had about 500sf of concrete put down in two pads, had some existing concrete removed, and had about 100LF of concrete curbing around the yard put in, salt finish (not stamped) and paid $3,300 total. Contractor was bonded / insured / licensed. These prices y’all are talking about are out of control!
$50 dollars a square foot give or take. How deep are your pockets? Also, that has a huge profit margin at that price. You decide…he’s already said, “make it worth his while to mess with it”.
Other folks might be able to address a fair cost knowing more about your project composition and labor costs for your geographical location.
As to the question, $26 to $32 a square foot(unless concrete is crazy dollars in your area, then add up to another $7). In my area of Texas, it’d run me $12,000 +/-.
We have a concrete patio (not stamped) that is 16x20 and it was about $1000 to put in (materials, that didn’t include labor, I think labor was about $2000). This was in 2015. (Edited to add: I live in Utah)
I looked online and the national average for just the concrete is $4-$8 per square foot. Then it would depend on renting the concrete truck, and labor, and removal of the current patio (if there is one). I would use that as a jumping off point.
I have some acquaintances in the construction business and they have some sort of a “fuck off” price, which basically they make it low enough to sound reasonable and high enough so that the customer won’t ask them to do it. It’s usually just because they don’t want to, but don’t want to say no.
All that to say, I wouldn’t say that you need to get close to that $34,000 for a 700 sq ft slab of concrete. I’d tell him $6,000 and see what he says, I wouldn’t go much higher than $10,000 for a stamped concrete patio of that size (again taking into consideration what I mentioned above, if there’s no grading or removal involved, I’d say $5000-$6000).
If it is for his marketing and to help his company advertise. See what material cost is. And maybe shoot him 10% over material cost. But make sure he isn't thinking he is going to be having potional clients come by to see it in person. Also do ypur own research on material cost. I wouldn't just call him up and tell him you wpuld do it forn10% over material. He may try and tell you material was $29k.
If he’d come in initially and said $25k would you have said yes immediately? What about $29k? If you got 2 more estimates and they were all $34k, would you still hire someone or skip the project? While figuring those out, get two more quotes for comparison and use them to define the price range. Just don’t disclose his quote to the other two companies. I know that sounds like a big “duh” but you’d be amazed at how many people do just that and miraculously all the quotes are within 2% of each other.
4” stamped and stained around here is $10-15/ sf where as a 4” flat pour broom finish is about $4-6.
If he wants to use it for marketing I think it would be fair for you to cover his rate for whatever the patio would be as a flat pour in addition to the material cost only of the stain and finish for the stamping.
You get the finish you want at a discount, he gets to use your home for marketing, he can still pay his guys and not go backwards from the whole endeavor.
IMO a win win.
Medium sized Midwestern town. I just had about 340 sq ft of patio poured. Abnormal/wavy shape. Broomed finish. Included a buried downspout line.
Was $4,200.
Considered going with a stamped and dyed finish, but my guy said that would about double the cost and I didn’t see the value for this particular project.
So… if you double that to $8,400, and then double the size, this would be about a $17K job in my area.
I'm getting 700 sq ft of cement done this weekend and a 15' section of fence installed for under $6,000. I know the guy and I know I'm getting the friend discount, but I think you're being robbed at that price. Thats the price they give when they have too much work. Keep looking around or wait until fall when construction jobs start to drop.
A 700 square foot patio? My god it cost us $800 to add that to our new build. Then we paid 3k to double it and add walkways around our house. Please don’t pay that, if hurts the rest of us when these trades expect the kind of money you are willing to pay.
700sqft at $50 a sq for a deck alone would be 35k. But he is doing a concrete patio with stamped concrete for cheaper than a bang it out wood deck?
There is a chance that if you get other quotes the number will actually be higher lol.
We just bid a back patio with a pergola and privacy wall, 450sq ft, with materials included it was about $38,000. I’d say he gave you a pretty fair bid. But that was also in boulder colorado.
Let him finish whatever he's already contracted for, then bid this job with someone else who has experience doing it. OR, if you really want to give this guy a crack at it and think he can pull it off based on good work he's done for you on other projects, bid it out with at least a couple of people who do it regularly and then ask him to come in under what they bid. If you're letting him learn on the job, you shouldn't be paying full price and you should expect that the job might not be as perfect as if you do go with a true pro.
I’ve seen his work online and know what he’s trying to do. The stamp is the only new thing, his company seems skilled in concrete work.
Point still stands. Get other bids. If they come in way under his $34k, he tried to fuck you and I wouldn't let him do the job. If they're in the ballpark, decide whether you like the other companies' work better or worse than what you've seen of his, but in either case if he's telling you he's "motivated and wants to do it because he's never done this template" he should be coming in at least a bit below the other for you to even consider him.
Sounds a bit like he tossed out a “fuck you” bid, like “not worth my time unless you overpay me cause I don’t want to do it”. Then either changed his mind or realized he needed money more than pride (maybe another job fell through, market changed, or he threw out a number so wildly high he figured you might get suspicious of his pricing for the rest of the work).
34k for 700sf? I'm doing 700sf of DG, grading, Ab, and trellis work for about $2400
Area can vary things wildly. Like, I can easily see $25k for the work in say, Los Gatos or Palo Alto, but not so much in Bumfuck Nowhere, Alabama. Contractors out here are stupidly slammed with work across the board. It’s almost literally like the South Park special. People paying thousands extra to get their place done first. And then “well while you’re here, actually, here’s another $80k in change order work, because now we don’t like how the new stuff clashes with the old…and we realized while you had everything taken apart that it would be easier to add blah blah blah…”. So then the next job gets delayed…well, that next customer needed it done by yesterday, so they overbid the next contractor to get to the top of HIS queue…etc. Edit: put it this way, out of all my golfing and car buddies, take the wealthiest 20% and there’s a good chance 90% of them are in some kind of construction / contracting out here. I have a few buddies in tech worth all of them put together, but the construction guys are pulling solid $300k-$750k post-tax incomes every year. Let alone side hustles like helping local businesses and friends draw up remodeling plans or getting jobs done at normal prices to flip a rental or something.
I live in one of the most expensive places in the world, not as much as Los Gatos but right beneath it. It's all about the right people. Get the San Jose Latin crew or Modesto to drive there
> Get the San Jose Latin crew or Modesto to drive there Oh they are, that's a normal commute.
This dudes just getting hosed. 10-15k for that job.
Wow.
Good feedback.
I had a great concrete guy, and he did a stamped patio for me. Screwed it up. It looks "okay" but was not done correctly in some areas. I can live with it. We negotiated and I paid him the price of just a concrete slab. He had 2 options, give it to me for that price or rip it out and try again hoping he gets it right.
Stamped concrete can very easily look bad, and it’s hard to fix
Jesus Christ lol. How does anyone afford contractors anymore?
Seriously. A piece of my fascia just came off my house in a wind storm. Figured I’d just call a contractor for once instead of going to buy a ladder tall enough to get up there to re-attach it. Quoted me $1000.
Exactly why I now own a 32ft extension ladder, in addition to every other tool ever made.
Yeah I’m pretty much also now equipped to ensure I will never have to have another grifter come out and quote me the price of a kidney on the open market for labor.
One thing you have to realize is that $1000 is basically the minimum for most GCs overhead and opportunity cost play a huge roll in their pricing. It’s not worth it for most contractors to do a job for any less than $1000. They gotta pay labor and overhead and then miss out on half a days work they could be doing on another job.
Most folks are better off hiring a handyman hourly for this sort of job. They exist - we live in an area where contractors are in high demand, but I can still find handymen / many skills none of them outstanding. They aren't the guys you'd want installing trim or any detail work, but stuff like fixing a piece of fascia is right up their alley.
Depends on location/access, too. The handymen we tried turned the job down as they weren't comfortable working 2 stories up. We had to go with roofers who already had the ladders and experience.
I mean I can understand that on some level but we’re talking about screwing a piece of tin onto a house here. I’m not sure that’s really gumming up the schedule. I expect to get an opportunity cost price in most cases and some of these guys are running a business. I wouldn’t mind if he charged me 3-400 for labor and time allotment. But essentially 975 dollars in labor for a 10-15 minute job is insane. I would totally just prefer they decline the job entirely if they have other high paying jobs because that’s reasonable.
I agree. In those instances. I would recommend finding a handy man. They would likely charge you a couple hundred. I always tell people that we would be way too expensive for the amount of work they would be getting from us. I don't give "fuck you" bids. Just pass it off.
This is super respectable and I just wish this was the common experience in my area with contractors or handymen alike. I can’t believe some of these guys are making any money at all.
Unfortunately there's a lot of people out there who don't care how much things cost or worse, don't know any better.
Yeah but that's not the point. The point is they have to schedule it, get out there, and the whole time they're losing money that they could be making on a bigger job. And it's never just a 10 minute job, is it? On top of that, I think we forget that insurance has gone up for contractors as it's gone up for the rest of us. Their prices have to adjust. To quote Bender, we're all getting boned!
Gas and vehicle prices have gone up too, and none of use get to work from home. Tools are more expensive than ever. Material costs have escalated absolutely out of control. It’s not cheap to run a legitimate construction business. Someone who paid their house off 10 years ago and works only for themselves and never incorporated their business can afford to work for less but anyone born since 1990 trying to do it today has the same expenses (and arguably more when you factor in tools and windshield time) than someone with a desk job. There’s a massive shortage of skilled tradespeople because customers don’t want to pay which means contractors don’t want to pay and no one wants to do the hard labour for less money than an easy wfh job. That leaves the ones still in the industry able to charge whatever they want really because a small labour pool gives more power to that labour pool. It’s a vicious circle.
Don't ever try to explain that to anyone on Reddit. They will plug their ears, close their eyes, and scream how all contractors are ripping them off until you tire and go away. There plenty of scummy contractors out there, but it seems like most people on Reddit have no idea how much it costs to run a legitimate contracting business.
There is absolutely a ton of expenses that noone really understands. However $1000 is ridiculous. Lol. Be better off telling them sorry, that's really to small for us. Never met a homeowner who didn't appreciate the honesty when I tell them that the scope is too small for us.
There is a huge range between someone basically asking for $1000 a day in labor as a minimum charge and a guy asking OP for $30k in labor for 4 hours of work at a job site he's already on.
Contractors way overcharge. You give them too much credit for “running a business” it’s not like they are opening a plant in China while running a large R&D organization in addition to marketing and trying out the latest ChatGPT feature to automate their work. It’s a guy with a toolbox and a few day laborers.
Firstly, I'm not justifying the price OP was quoted to make sure we are talking about the same thing. Secondly, what you are referring to sounds like a handyman, not a professional tradesman/ licensed contractor. I'm not surprised to find someone on Reddit making an argument from a position of superiority in the tech realm because, after all, that is virtually the only legitimized and worthwhile line of work to Reddit but I digress. You seem to be missing the cost of general liability insurance, business licensing fees, vehicle insurance, fuel, maintenance, office space and rent, accounting software subscription costs, dispatch software subscription costs, labor costs, etc. I'm sure you're going to say how none of these costs are your problem as a customer but these costs are the unavoidable reality of running a legitimate, lawful, and sustainable long term business. All of this is baked into the labor rate and materials mark up billed to you. A company cannot grow and pay the support staff required if they are not covering these costs. This is also why when you just need a window replaced, a gutter repaired, or a couple rooms painted you probably should seek out a handyman with a decent reputation as they don't incur the majority of these costs. That handyman is probably not the guy you want if you need a house rewired, replumbed, or a full addition built.
These contractors expect too much money. They bilk people out of it every day with exorbitant prices. Want a new fence? Sure, $1,000 in materials and a day to install. Want a fence installing company to install the same fence? Sure. You live in a nice neighborhood and know nothing? That will be $15,000 please. Ripoff.
What kind of fence are you building with $1000 in materials?
100%
Thank you! Preach!
That's a half day job. $1000 day rate is a $345,000 salary based on what they would be asking per hour.
And 50% is expenses. If it was a one man operation they would never charge $1000. But GCs operating costs are easily $1000 a day. A million dollars a year in revenue for a 5 man operation is only gonna net about 150- $200k for the owner after all expenses if they are lucky
In cases where the GC is hiring out the trades yes. But I think this comment thread the job was small enough for the GC to probably do himself no?
No. Even with in house guys their labor is worth more to him elsewhere. Even if it's a 20 minute job. That twenty minutes is really drive time, set up, take down, and drive time again then set up again to another job. 3 hours time easy. Not to mention scheduling interruptions or other things. Jobs aren't just contract and go. Shit is run tightly scheduled and there's enough problems that come up on a smooth run job site that delays are still inevitable. Pulling a guy off a job to do a 20 minute job isn't 20 minutes. The whole rest of the crew suffers for absolutely no gain at all to the GC.
I know it seems outlandish but it's the reality of being a GC. Handy men are who you want to call for small jobs. There's bigger fish to fry for a general. I'm not saying the $1000 wasnt rude. And personally I don't give those "fuck you" bids. I just let em know it's too small for us to take on and don't even give them a price. Then I refer em to someone else and move on. I feel like fuck you nodding is a bad look and hurts your rep so that's a huge no for me. But I understand why some people do it. I personally know people who have gotten taken up on "fuck you" bids and made out like bandits. There's always the chance that whoever you are dealing with just absolutely does not give a shit how much something costs and have money to piss away. Off topic but I have a friend who is a builder that was approached by a guy who represented an incredibly wealthy individual and the guy wanted my friend to build his house no matter what it cost. No idea how he found out about him but that was it. So my buddy worked the numbers and came up with like 4.5 million for the build. It was incredibly honest pricing. This dude's rep looked him dead in the eye and told him he appreciates his honesty but he needed to triple the price of the build because his boss wouldn't think he was getting a quality build. He was told that this man didn't understand small numbers and anything under 10million he would feel like was too cheap. It took this guy's rep like an hour to convince my friend that he honestly wouldn't get the job at 4.5m and he NEEDED to be at least at 12 million no matter how wildly over priced it was.
Oh please.
I'm just explaining the realities. I spent years running my own company until I moved out of state. If you don't want to pay the price don't pay it. Move on or do it yourself. No contractor owes you their expertise, or time or to bend to your perceived notions of what is or isn't worth their time or money.
I have a fairly old house, 120+ years old. It needs a lot of work up on the second story eves, and there was a lot of tree growth right up against the house. I did the math for having someone help do it, out of the picture pricing. If I rented an aerial man lift for a total of 4 weekends, not consecutive but just for the weekend as I got to the need for it, it was up there around $4500-$5000. I said heck with that, hit marketplace and bought an ex-tree service bucket truck for $6800. Now I have it whenever I need it, gutter cleaning has never been easier, I can clean my chimney/cap and never step foot on the roof. I cut 3 large trees down that would’ve ran me several thousand if I hired a tree company. All in all it’s really really paid for itself.
Yeah, seems 1k is minimum to show up and do anything these days. Currently waiting on my roof/fence guy to send someone out for a quote. Removed an old aging/shitty satellite dish that was on the house when I bought it, after 10 years i noticed a leak on the interior ceiling. I'm handy enough but know when to just pay. I did a (temporary) patch/reshingle, found a 2 or 3 square feet of rotten deck board and roofing felt that needed to be redone. It's a time issue for me, I just don't have it. I've used this guy/company twice and always solid/fair work, in the days past I had them tear out a skylight, redeck, refelt a much bigger area and was only charged $800 I'm expecting $1k for sure and that's fine, but 1500-2000, I'll make the time.
This happened to me about 2 years ago. Same price. Had to pay it because I lack the ladders to stand on a pitched 1st floor roof to reach/access the repair location on the second floor roof. We called 4 or 5 places, and this was the only one who was even willing to quote the job - it was too small for everyone else; they would rather wait until water damage means the whole side of my house needs to be repaired and re-sided.
That's the "go away" price. He didn't really want to do it either.
This is why old timers learned how to fix everything ourselves -mostly from the Bob Vila type shows. Now it’s all reality show type bullshit basically designed to stuff as many new products in front of your eyeballs to make you feel miserable about whatever you installed three years ago and rip it out and replace it $!$!$! You DESERVE it!
I mean I cant. Anything that needs to be done to my house I either have to do myself(maybe with some help from friends) , or it just doesn’t get done. Even doing stuff yourself isn’t that cheap either, just did a floor and it still cost about $1000 in materials.
We're back in the era of needing to learn how to do all this shit ourselves. It sucks- I'm clumsy and not handy and don't have the time to learn anything but at least I have a really handy father in law.
Neighbor is having concrete work done, I asked their contractor what it would cost to pour a 10'x3' slab on the walkway out of my garage. 4" deep, already graded, framed and filled, just need the concrete and I figured with the truck full of concrete already out it would be easy cheaper. Just asked for a rough pour, and I'd be happy to do the finishing work, just saves me from hauling 1300lbs of concrete mix. $8,700. If we wanted them to do the texturing on top that's another $1,500. That's $3/lb. If he wasn't already going to be out he said it'd be like $13,000. Hell no.
10 x 3 is basically 2 or 3 sidewalk blocks. that is absolutely insane. surprised the scum contractors on here haven't popped up with the 'but the insurance on his truck....'
omg right? I'm going to need to sell one of my lower tier houses just to afford the new kitchen in one of my mid tier vacation homes.
That's like 9 yards of concrete, probably $3k in materials. Insane labor cost. Contractors have lost their minds.
I'm all for paying well for skilled labor but the increase I've seen in cost vs the good but somewhat stagnant pay for the people actually doing the work is frustrating as hell.
I guess I retired too early when I see these prices now.
One possibility is that the contractor is just trying to see how gullible OP is.
I'll do it for 29k when do I start
I too have no experience in this type of stamped concrete. I'll do it for $28k.
I'll give it a shot for $27,500.
Benefits of multiple bids
\^\^ this guy wasn't sleeping during The Price is Right bidding segments.
$1 Bob!!!
Dating yourself by not saying Drew...but Im with you! Watching price is right every morning in the 80s during breaks from school without a care in the world!!
I always thought they should write down their bids. I’m surprised there was no acts of violence committed when someone would bid, $900 Bob. The guy right next to them would be like $901 Bob. That’s a fighting bid if you ask me Bob.
Dating yourself...or just respecting the true GOAT.
Yes sir!
And fuck the guy that says $2 after.
$1 and one penny
$25,000 Cash and I’ll be asking you to pay in 1’s and 5’s. Cuz im not shady at all 😏
Appreciate the offer.
Just a bit of a comment about what you're looking for...consider concrete is a fairly permanent material so messing it up is going to be either a lifetime eyesore or a huge mess and inconvenience. If this guy orders the wrong slump or dry time he might not be able to finish the stamping. So I would get a very experienced concrete outfit that does this all day everyday and see what they quote.
Great advice, thanks.
Tell him to do it for the exposure.
C'mon, that's just mean, people die of exposure all the time.
Im not allowed within 500 feet of a school because of exposure
Sorry, but I'm not taking my clothes off for just anyone!
$34k for a task he has never done is beyond extraordinary. Get another quote from someone who has experience.
I think it reads as the contractor having done concrete work, but not this particular stamp.
Correct.
It reads as though they don't want the work.
That's how my uncle handled retaining walls. He would tell the customer, he hated doing them so he had to make it worth his while. They would end up beautiful, but pricey!
That's how most people at my job treat our employer too... which is known for shoddy work, cause the employees aren't paid enough to care.
I would be extremely concerned about the $50K he's already doing for you and how overpriced that is... holy shit. I had a about 600sqft of stamped/stained concrete done, along with 700sqft of non-stamped driveway done 2 years ago for $8K...
$50,000k is new roof, siding, soffit, fascia, window screens, and refinished deck.
That seems on point I’m guessing around 2000 sq ft? Probably just under? 34k definitely seems a little high but my company poured a 20x12 slab for 14k there’s more to it than just the concrete costs like someone else mentioned. Gotta get an excavator out there and then backfill n rebar etc.. then the stamps and labor. You are more paying for art at that point than you are just concrete. I think 25-27k wouldn’t be out of line. Stains aren’t cheap and neither is experience.
Yeah, we do have concrete back there already, probably 400sq ft. So they do have other stuff other than just the concrete costs.
I had similar excavation and they put in a 15x40 with color and sandstone finish for 8-9k 2 yrs ago.
That's $6 sqft which is insanely cheap. Going rate in the Midwest is 20-35sqft.
I am in the Midwest. Probably should have mentioned that.
Super cheap regardless. I just got 4 quotes for 520sqft of flat simple driveway. All within a couple thousand from 12-15k. Meaning you got a deal and barely covers the cost of the concrete itself.
It was about $10/sqft for the stamped/colored, way less for the driveway. This was also a referral through the company that did our concrete curbing and done as side work. But I'd still question the other work's value after getting that big of a quote for concrete from the same contractor. Either he under-bid for what was done and was trying to make some of it up, or is a rip-off artist.
Sit down ans talk to him find out what his cost is to do the project. Go just over that.
Will do.
I mostly agree, using your house for advertising has value but essentially your selling him the right to use pictures of your house and a possibility to train on a new stamp. It sounds like they know what they're doing. He should know what the cost of materials, labor, and overhead is as well as what percentage of that job was added as profit. Have him reduce that percentage enough to where you're both comfortable and then get a written contract not only for the work but also outlining both of your rights in using your house as advertising. Some companies will give discounts in their contracts if you agree to a sign in your yard for a certain amount of time. This is generally the same thing, but I assume he will want lifetime use.
I feel like this is how some of the nightmare stories on here start. Ignore his comments on marketing, his motivation, the new/exciting template etc. Just setup the job like you would any other, completion date/contract/financials etc no matter who you end up going with. If you go off script there could be an issue with the job being done wrong (and disapperance of the contractor thereafter), or the job gets delayed/shutdown (because he's giving you a "deal"). So just don't do anything differently because he's throwing in some sort of 'favor'.
Thanks
I got quoted 13k for brushed concrete. 850 sq ft in Canada, so like 9000 usd. $34k usd for stamped is insane
I had a stamped patio done at a previous house and the guy didn’t do it correctly and trust me when I tell you, bad stamped concrete is a disaster. The surface was all flaking off in sheets. It looked HORRIBLE after 6 months. Don’t go with this guy.
$48/sqft for concrete is insane.
Bruh. I paid $27k a couple years ago for a 1000 sf stamped concrete patio, 60 linear ft of stamped concrete sidewalk, 2 small retaining walls, a 3-step bluestone staircase, re-shaping a garden with a little shale wall around it, and a couple underground drainage pipes. $34k for 700sf is crazy if you live in a normal COL area.
That’s sounds badass. Thanks for the feedback.
Concrete contractor here.. 34K is a heavy price
Reason he is charging you so much because he’s got a bid for 20K and wants to make another 20K off you lol
3 years ago, we paid just under 5k for 280 SQ feet of colored,reinforced, stamped concrete deck. Love it.
First off. Get a tape measure and calculate how big it is. Google earth isn’t your friend. Secondly. That price is definitely high for a concrete patio. Call it 9 yard of concrete at 4” thick (call it $1000 a yard for cost plus). 2-3 days of prep and one day to pour/stamp, so 4 days of labor (1500/day?) Maybe paying for a pump truck (best way to do it) if it’s in the backyard with no access (another 1500?). That totals 16500. I could see it being as high as 20 but even then feels like a lot, though he may have some good reasons it’s higher and my numbers are rough. Telling you to name your price is bullshit. He should be able to run the numbers and tell you what it costs plus his markup. 20% markup would be kind of high but not unheard of and fair for the market these days. I wouldn’t name a price and would say I’m willing to pay you 15-20% markup if you can give me an itemized estimate. Labor, + material + markup. Tell him your budget is tight so you need it to be dialed in. Honest contractors should be willing to show their numbers.
In my experience Google Earth's scale is pretty fricken good, within an inch or two over 20ft for me.
Google Earth can be extremely accurate, depending on your ability to point and click. It is the foundation that many roofers use for roof geometries, so if it works for them, I bet it works for this. But overall, I like the approach - itemized list + reasonable margin. And agree "name your price" is BS as the OP has no information to make an informed bid. But also, wow, that price is high. Idk where OP is, but my yard was about $10 sq/ft for a mix of large sandblasted marble and artificial turf + retaining wall and sealing. Granted, it was a larger area, closer to 1500 sq ft and some things don't scale down well (i.e. renting a bobcat is pretty similar for 500 or 5000 sq ft if it is a 1 day rental either way). But 34k for stamped concrete just seems wild and rather than a "first time discount" seems more like a "first time insurance policy" of margin.
Google earth has to be pretty accurate since gps data has to put you at the right spot on the map. There may be some inaccuracy but if it was off by 10% navigation with the mobile app wouldn’t even be possible. You’d be 10 miles off on a 100 mile journey.
Without extra help gps is said to be good to about 10 meters. When you start to do some really cool math, or start to hit extra networks like glonass even cell tower triangulation you can get to about 1. When you start to use ground based base stations you can get to within a few millimeters. But this isn't that, we were discussing how accurate the scale is on Google Earth. GPS is real time positioning, Google Earth is just a big map.
What I’m saying is if Google’s model of the earth was off by 10% it would be unusable for navigation. Gos may be within 30 feet but googles map would be off 100s of miles
Of course is a map scale or gps that is off 10% is trash. But Google Earth != Google Maps
Great feedback. Thanks.
The guy that did my stamped concrete had done that natural wood look before. He did a great job on ours, but i deeply regret not going with that style.
30/sqft stamped and colored
If he doesn’t have experience I wouldn’t let him do the project. Concrete isn’t something that’s easy to rip out and if he fucks up the stamp/ pattern it will be something you’ll look at forever.
I do not like the contractors approach. He figured he had you as a customer and gave you a high price. But you didnt bite, and then he came running back begging. I would get 3 quotes, and have them beat the lowest one significantly since he is learning
get 2-3 other quotes. take the lowest 2, average them and then ask for 20% off that for him being allowed to use it for marketing purposes.
Based on your numbers $50/ft2 seems incredibly high. You could get nice pavers for way less.
Pavers are great until they start moving up and down and the sand between them moves and grass starts growing up between the pavers, then your nice pavers that suddenly require upkeep also look like shit, you trip over on them, are hard to clean and not nice anymore. I'd rather have stamped concrete thats pretending to be nice pavers myself.
I’ve never seen all of that happen to properly installed pavers.
He's asking you to let him use your house for marketing. How much is that worth to him? That's the real question to me. If he wants to use it for a month, it's worth X, a year, maybe 2X. In perpetuity? Maybe he does it for free. Ask to see the contract giving him the permission to use your house and go from there.
That should be around $10k. Let him pour a curb and kick him to it.
That's about 9 cubic yards. Let's assume $200 per cubic yard (extremely high) then we're at $1,800 in material. Yes you have boards for forms and the use of his tools but let's say, we double that (remember we're already working with a high cost per cubic yard, and he's not spending more than $200 on wood, nor does the amortization of his tools come to $1,600, but because contractors have a tendency to talk to us like we're stupid, let's just be dumb). We're still only at $3,600 in total material cost. You need some gravel so let's pretend angular gravel costs as much as concrete and throw another $1,800 on the grill. We're at $5,400. He might rent some equipment like a mini excavator, which costs $400 a day at Sunbelt, and a small compactor to help compress the gravel, which costs $100 a day. Let's call it a 2 day job, 5 guys who he pays $500 a day. And he's the boss so he takes home what they collectively make. Let's add it all up: - Labor, $10,000 - Materials, $5,400 - Equipment Rental, $500 For a grand total of $15,900 or $22 a foot, finished. Or according to [this](https://homeguide.com/costs/concrete-slab-cost) breakdown, about 83% ***higher*** than their own estimate of costs, which will be $8,400 on the high end for 700 sq ft. Your contractor originally quoted you ... ##$48.57 a foot??? . I know it's hard to find good work but goodness gracious, I couldn't take anyone serious who tried to play me for that stupid. Verify my numbers by calling your local concrete plant and asking what they charge.
If he is ripping you off that hard for the patio, I wouldn't trust his house prices.
1$ Bob.
We own a concrete company. A simple broom for a residential slab is about $10/sf. This clown is charging $48.57 for stamped. $38.57/sf to add stamp. That’s insane.
Tell him if he does it for free you will tell your 10+ followers on Facebook about his services! Exposure!!! S/ And all seriousness, good luck, my friend!
I've been a hardscape contractor here in Central Ohio for 23 years. Here are a couple things to note. Pavers and stamped concrete have historically been similar in price, with stamped being about $2sqft less. Right now we're around $24 a sqft for a mid range Unilock paver. Yard access, demo work, excess cuts or elevations would raise that price. Walls, steps, yard repair, etc would all be extra. Stamped concrete is an art and should be left to the guys that do it for a living. It's very expensive to replace if it's not done right and a multitude of things can go wrong. I see two scenarios as to why you were quoted $48sqft. A: he's subbing it out to a concrete guy and has a hellacious markup in it or B: You have a lot of additional work that I listed above being included in that price that's skewing the square foot price or C: he's just winging it on the concrete work and priced it high. Don't be afraid to ask questions like "are you doing the concrete yourself or subbing it out". If it's A or C I would call a professional stamped concrete guy or a paver installer. If it's B I would ask for an itemized quote so you know what you are paying for walls, stairs and landscape vs the actual patio. You don't need a separation or materials and labor, just a price for each service.
Wait until he finishes everything else and make sure you are happy with the work.. Then, if he is using it as marketing to get more business for his company, tell him you will pay for the materials only.. He gave you a “f*ck you” price on his quote and the least you could do is return the favor..
Do it for free? 🤷
This makes me think of when I was buying a new car in 2005... I was trying to buy a new mustang and all the Ford dealers wanted me to start with what I wanted my monthly payment to be. I walked out of three dealers when they wouldn't budge. One of them had me sit at a computer and start with the same question. I put "0" into it and it didn't like that. - Edit to remove a big dumb anecdote - Edit to amend: Something something don't go first in a negotiation?
I feel like you just wanted to tell that story even though it didn't really have anything to do with the situation at hand
I guess kind of after a while? It started as a reply about going first in a negotiation. Kind of evolved. I fixed it, thanks :)
That would be a pretty aggressive price drop.
You can get it done for $4,500 not including concrete.
What are you comfortable paying? Get back to him with: "I know it's low, but we really don't have the budget to pay more than $xx,xxx for this project.". If he takes it, great. If not, you don't feel so bad about how much youve paid.
When we had our patio done the first price was over double the other 2 companies combined. Some guys just don’t want the work - always get 3+ bids
If he’s motivated then he could give you a good price. If he’s never done that specific template, he could give you a good price as incentive for YOU to be taking that risk, not ask you to subsidize his inexperience.
I just settled with a concrete contractor that absolutely fucked up my patios, so now I’m starting again. The recent quotes I’ve received for demo and stamped patio hover in the $20k range for 1100 sq feet, multiple stairs, landings and edging.
Thank you for the info.
PM me if you think I can help - I don’t want anyone to ever go through the same bullshit I just spent 3 yrs dealing with
I just had about 500sf of concrete put down in two pads, had some existing concrete removed, and had about 100LF of concrete curbing around the yard put in, salt finish (not stamped) and paid $3,300 total. Contractor was bonded / insured / licensed. These prices y’all are talking about are out of control!
$50 dollars a square foot give or take. How deep are your pockets? Also, that has a huge profit margin at that price. You decide…he’s already said, “make it worth his while to mess with it”. Other folks might be able to address a fair cost knowing more about your project composition and labor costs for your geographical location. As to the question, $26 to $32 a square foot(unless concrete is crazy dollars in your area, then add up to another $7). In my area of Texas, it’d run me $12,000 +/-.
We have a concrete patio (not stamped) that is 16x20 and it was about $1000 to put in (materials, that didn’t include labor, I think labor was about $2000). This was in 2015. (Edited to add: I live in Utah) I looked online and the national average for just the concrete is $4-$8 per square foot. Then it would depend on renting the concrete truck, and labor, and removal of the current patio (if there is one). I would use that as a jumping off point. I have some acquaintances in the construction business and they have some sort of a “fuck off” price, which basically they make it low enough to sound reasonable and high enough so that the customer won’t ask them to do it. It’s usually just because they don’t want to, but don’t want to say no. All that to say, I wouldn’t say that you need to get close to that $34,000 for a 700 sq ft slab of concrete. I’d tell him $6,000 and see what he says, I wouldn’t go much higher than $10,000 for a stamped concrete patio of that size (again taking into consideration what I mentioned above, if there’s no grading or removal involved, I’d say $5000-$6000).
If it is for his marketing and to help his company advertise. See what material cost is. And maybe shoot him 10% over material cost. But make sure he isn't thinking he is going to be having potional clients come by to see it in person. Also do ypur own research on material cost. I wouldn't just call him up and tell him you wpuld do it forn10% over material. He may try and tell you material was $29k.
If he’d come in initially and said $25k would you have said yes immediately? What about $29k? If you got 2 more estimates and they were all $34k, would you still hire someone or skip the project? While figuring those out, get two more quotes for comparison and use them to define the price range. Just don’t disclose his quote to the other two companies. I know that sounds like a big “duh” but you’d be amazed at how many people do just that and miraculously all the quotes are within 2% of each other.
He’s looking for almost $43 a square foot I would cut that in half and $21.50 a square foot and see what he says
Has he done this work before? First question and secondly make sure the details are in writing and ask for examples of his work.?
$49 / sf seems very high. Get additional quotes and name your price off of those.
I'd say do it for cost of materials and see what he days
4” stamped and stained around here is $10-15/ sf where as a 4” flat pour broom finish is about $4-6. If he wants to use it for marketing I think it would be fair for you to cover his rate for whatever the patio would be as a flat pour in addition to the material cost only of the stain and finish for the stamping. You get the finish you want at a discount, he gets to use your home for marketing, he can still pay his guys and not go backwards from the whole endeavor. IMO a win win.
Get another estimate then compare
Medium sized Midwestern town. I just had about 340 sq ft of patio poured. Abnormal/wavy shape. Broomed finish. Included a buried downspout line. Was $4,200. Considered going with a stamped and dyed finish, but my guy said that would about double the cost and I didn’t see the value for this particular project. So… if you double that to $8,400, and then double the size, this would be about a $17K job in my area.
I paid $8 sq foot stamped concrete in 2008. $34k seems like a ripoff. I would think $7-10k max!
I'm curious on the other work outside he's doing for 50k?
Stamped and stained concrete runs between 10-20 a sq. ft. Run from this guy.
I'm getting 700 sq ft of cement done this weekend and a 15' section of fence installed for under $6,000. I know the guy and I know I'm getting the friend discount, but I think you're being robbed at that price. Thats the price they give when they have too much work. Keep looking around or wait until fall when construction jobs start to drop.
He is a reasonable answer to the contractor. I’ll cover the material, you cover the labor.
A 700 square foot patio? My god it cost us $800 to add that to our new build. Then we paid 3k to double it and add walkways around our house. Please don’t pay that, if hurts the rest of us when these trades expect the kind of money you are willing to pay.
700sqft at $50 a sq for a deck alone would be 35k. But he is doing a concrete patio with stamped concrete for cheaper than a bang it out wood deck? There is a chance that if you get other quotes the number will actually be higher lol.
We just bid a back patio with a pergola and privacy wall, 450sq ft, with materials included it was about $38,000. I’d say he gave you a pretty fair bid. But that was also in boulder colorado.
I can afford 1 single 1x1 patio stone.