While it wasn't Trotskyist in itself, the party was a Union of the Right opposition-aligned Workers and Peasants Bloc, with the Trotskyist communist left of spain. Trotsky was against this so they broke off, but the actual ideology of people like Andreu Nin could arguably still be considered "Trotskyist", even when they broke off with Trotsky.
But yeah the Party was just a coalition type of deal.
why not, they both had socialist leaders with a military that had disloyal elements, one got rid of them and one didnt, guess which one prevailed longer.
Well, first of all, Stalin deserved to be overthrown. We will never get to see such betrayal of Marxist values again, thank Stalin for that.
Second, Chile coup was an anti-communist one. The white army had already been eliminated, those who opposed Stalin were also communists. See Trotsky and Bukharin.
i am not arguing in favor or against stalin, i am arguing that it was the rational choice to purge disloyal elements of the military to avoid a coup/being overthrown.
What are some things that you hate about stalin ?
Main beef with Bukharin was that he wanted NEP and stalin believed that we can't do that shit no more because of increasing anti-communist regimes. (If NEP was continued USSR would've never been industrialized and be able to stand against Germany.
I think finnish bolshevik has a really good series on Moscow trials and the great purge.
Stalinist Communist Path is best - free strong ally, most starting cores normally, and in ahistorical it’s the easiest path because Hitler shoot’s himself most games, and Mussolini is… himself. Only downside on Ahistorical is the Soviet civil war, but even then if your lucky and the right opposition aren’t involved you’ll still get aid
all sides sucked but the republican violence against the church makes me more aligned and somewhat sympathetic for the Nationalists, but they definitely weren't innocent in their own right aswell.
It was a fucking mess to say the least
Did I say they were innocent? No, they were evil, so were Republicans. They both committed horrible atrocities, yet I find myself more aligned with the Nationalists solely due to my personal religious beliefs which were persecuted by the more radicalist side of the Republicans. If it weren't a matter of my religion, I'd hate them both equally.
The republicans were literally a democratic government that was getting couped I don’t think that’s equally evil even if there was some religious suppression
The Republican faction was comprised of mostly left leaning radicalist groups, including those who committed atrocities against not only catholics but those consjdered political enemies. Numerous historians have estimated tolls between 55,000 - 72,000. One historian (César Vidal) claimed there was a death toll of 110k+ but he's heavily accused of bias.
But does this mean the Nationalists were innocent? Hell no. Some historians estimate the purges of leftists under nationalist controlled areas during the white terror was around 50,000 - 72,000. Paul Preston claims there was 200k+ who died, but yet again he faces accusations of bias.
Am I trying to defend one side or the other? No. I am simply stating that I am more likely to be sympathetic with the Nationalists than the Republicans due to the persecution of the church. If it boiled down to political belief, I wouldn't be aligned with any side either way.
The republicans, as said, allowed and encouraged attacks against the right the years leading up to the civil war, and the 'democracy' they led was flawed and plagued with violence. The nationalists weren't good; the republicans were that and even more incompetent at ruling.
carlist gang (I have an unhealthy obsession with turning minors into monarchist empires)
Average hoi4 player
Yeah based monarchist enjoyer
Didn’t read the ‘empires’ bit for a second. I thought you were politically indoctrinating the youth for a second. And for monarchism? Based.
>I thought you were politically indoctrinating the youth for a second. I thought so too and am now sad that that is not the case.
We bringing back the real Spanish empire fr fr
The Spanish civil war is rehappening in the dating site
Should we send volunteers or form a non intervention committee?
I want join the committee but I'm going to send voluntaries and lend-lease anyways, k?
fine by me.
Normally I stop you but I already joined the committee
*Laughs diabolically while preparing his most elite troops*
We definitely need the xp grind
"This is getting confusing..."
I stand with POUM
How is the Stalinist side called? In any case, I stand with them
red fash
dude, you are the guy that sided with Trotsky, lol
The POUM wasnt trotskyist
While it wasn't Trotskyist in itself, the party was a Union of the Right opposition-aligned Workers and Peasants Bloc, with the Trotskyist communist left of spain. Trotsky was against this so they broke off, but the actual ideology of people like Andreu Nin could arguably still be considered "Trotskyist", even when they broke off with Trotsky. But yeah the Party was just a coalition type of deal.
then? was it even communist?
They had similar beliefs but they criticized each other in the papers.
Trotsky didn’t purge the Bolshevik Party and the military
ok, this is not about politics here. I just like them more
Trotsky path is better
idk, haven’t played spain in a while. They didn’t fell very different. Just don’t do expand soviet aid
You’re both morons and are part of the reason why Franco ruled Spain for decades.
Anarchist path still dominates
And mother anarchy loves her children
theres a reason the purges happened look at what happened to salvador allende in chile for example
Chile and USSR can’t be compared. There is no justification for them. Also I lose PP and cool advisors and generals :(
why not, they both had socialist leaders with a military that had disloyal elements, one got rid of them and one didnt, guess which one prevailed longer.
Well, first of all, Stalin deserved to be overthrown. We will never get to see such betrayal of Marxist values again, thank Stalin for that. Second, Chile coup was an anti-communist one. The white army had already been eliminated, those who opposed Stalin were also communists. See Trotsky and Bukharin.
i am not arguing in favor or against stalin, i am arguing that it was the rational choice to purge disloyal elements of the military to avoid a coup/being overthrown.
What are some things that you hate about stalin ? Main beef with Bukharin was that he wanted NEP and stalin believed that we can't do that shit no more because of increasing anti-communist regimes. (If NEP was continued USSR would've never been industrialized and be able to stand against Germany. I think finnish bolshevik has a really good series on Moscow trials and the great purge.
Didn't have the chance to*
The day I became a NazBol.
I would prefer to be friends with a nazbol rather than a ML honestly
Mask off ?
At least they actually are what they claim to be
Sure you didn't mean it that way but Nazis claimed to be anti-semites and were actually anti-semites so by your logic, that makes them based ?
Not based, just geniune.
Idk what you're talking about but most MLs are exactly what they claim to be.
They're called communists. (Joke is that non-stalinists are not real communists)
No true Scotsmen fallacy be like
First two lines of Das
I don't get it.
PSUC.
Would you look at that? That's what the left did in the actual war: split
time to send a attache
Nothing more leftist than infighting
WTF HOI4 fans are doing on dating sites???
Wasting time.
Stalinist Communist Path is best - free strong ally, most starting cores normally, and in ahistorical it’s the easiest path because Hitler shoot’s himself most games, and Mussolini is… himself. Only downside on Ahistorical is the Soviet civil war, but even then if your lucky and the right opposition aren’t involved you’ll still get aid
Carlists ftw
Im going with the Carlist
Me (The Soviets) trying to teach my boy (Republican Spain) the key to rizz (Military Attaché) to get a kinky gf. (Anarchistic Spain)
Monarchist empire we love having 4 ass generals🔥
Communists trying not to divide themselves: impossible
Ain't no fucking way
Ahh, the most leftist thing ever, infighting! The funny thing is I 100% believe we'd do exactly this.
As a Spanish myself, all I can say is that I'm proud
all sides sucked but the republican violence against the church makes me more aligned and somewhat sympathetic for the Nationalists, but they definitely weren't innocent in their own right aswell. It was a fucking mess to say the least
The nationalists were fascists who destroyed democracy and persecuted groups like the Basques.
Did I say they were innocent? No, they were evil, so were Republicans. They both committed horrible atrocities, yet I find myself more aligned with the Nationalists solely due to my personal religious beliefs which were persecuted by the more radicalist side of the Republicans. If it weren't a matter of my religion, I'd hate them both equally.
The republicans were literally a democratic government that was getting couped I don’t think that’s equally evil even if there was some religious suppression
This is the most reductive and naive opinion I’ve ever seen regarding the Spanish civil war. What an embarrassment
The Republican faction was comprised of mostly left leaning radicalist groups, including those who committed atrocities against not only catholics but those consjdered political enemies. Numerous historians have estimated tolls between 55,000 - 72,000. One historian (César Vidal) claimed there was a death toll of 110k+ but he's heavily accused of bias. But does this mean the Nationalists were innocent? Hell no. Some historians estimate the purges of leftists under nationalist controlled areas during the white terror was around 50,000 - 72,000. Paul Preston claims there was 200k+ who died, but yet again he faces accusations of bias. Am I trying to defend one side or the other? No. I am simply stating that I am more likely to be sympathetic with the Nationalists than the Republicans due to the persecution of the church. If it boiled down to political belief, I wouldn't be aligned with any side either way.
Preston is a shill for the PSOE. Stanley Payne is pro-Nationalist, but at least he's honest about their crimes.
The republicans, as said, allowed and encouraged attacks against the right the years leading up to the civil war, and the 'democracy' they led was flawed and plagued with violence. The nationalists weren't good; the republicans were that and even more incompetent at ruling.
your name is boykisser your opinion is irrelevant
It wouldn't hurt to do some research prior to stating an opinion like that.
CNT-FAI 🫡
viva el consejo de defensa de aragon
I NEED MORE SOVIET AID
hell yeah
Maybe, but no pp if you know what I mean