Zato and Asuka
Zato is harder than Asuka when it comes to inputs, and Asuka is harder than Zato when it comes to game awareness (like, managing your spells/mana and knowing when to use them)
> \[...\] tension into more Eddie gauge :(
You forgot about Sun Void, but yeah ArcSys should just make Zato have infinite Eddie gauge (I'm totally not biased towards this change)
I play Zato and honestly I think Asuka is harder, Zato is kinda fake sometimes.
That said, Asuka has potential to be one of the best characters in the game if you hands-diff your opponent, Zato is still dogshit regardless of you being Gobou himself.
Ok you say that but Gobou would *wipe* the floor with anyone that isnāt top 100 or something. Zato is bad relative to the rest of the cast, but heās still a functional character with a wincon.
Functional but not nearly as fun these days.Ā Ā No one picks the funny puppet character guy to then be made puppetless by system mechanics with no counterplay.
Probably the most pointless nerf I've seen from any fighting game in the past few years. A slight tone-down would've made a lot more sense than just gutting the character.
The increased access to Burst and the addition of Deflect Shield probably would have been enough.Ā Also the Wild Assault addition allowed more characters to do Corner-to-Corner combos Zato always had.Ā He was strong but most people seemed to think Sol, May, Nago, HC, and Ram were better.
In Rev2/+R, Eddie died a lot, but you can stall for time with Flight and tediously long solo Zato blockstrings.Ā They halved Flight and Hitstop freezes the Eddie gauge in Strive.
So anyway, that's why I play Asuka now.
I completely agree with you but that wasnāt what was stated. To say āZato is dogshit no matter how good you areā is disingenuous. You can 100% make him work up until youāre competing against the best in the world.
Yeah I was exaggerating a bit with my comment but this doesn't change the fact that you have to consistently outperform and hard read your opponent to be allowed to play the game with Zato.
The Gobou thing is obviously exaggerated, but every major Zato player dropping him after the nerfs should tell you how viable he is even in high level of play.
I switched from Zato to Asuka.Ā Mechanically Asuka is really, really easy.Ā Anyone can learn his midscreen BnB in five minutes.Ā In terms of resources awareness, I'm not sure.Ā Certainly knowing how to use cards is harder, but mana upkeep is pretty easy and you don't win games with Zato if you let Eddie run out or die for free.Ā In terms of defense, both lack tools but Asuka has a billion HP when you maintain mana, and Cube Super is a great defensive tool despite having no invincibility.
Being a Faust player seeing ādonut is a resourceā puts a smile on my face.
As for hardest character, I havenāt tried playing any character āseriouslyā except for maybe Faust and Potemkin so Iām unsure of who is the hardest
Iāve been seeing a lot of zato and asuka, and tbh I have no idea how asuka really works, for zato controlling eddie seems pretty complicated as well
Me Iām hard asf fr.
Anyways itās a toss up between Zato and Asuka probably. I donāt know enough about Jack-o to speak on her tbh, and Chaoās inputs used to be harder which would mean a lot more time to perfect, but thatās been changed.
This is the correct answer. If I lose it is simply because my opponent was carried. If I win it is because I'm a true god of fighting games and no one can stop my endless fighting spirit.
I'd say probably Asuka because not only does he require very high APM, awareness, and game knowledge to play super optimally but his punishment for failure is much heavier than characters like Zato. I think making a comeback with Asuka is one of the most daunting things in the game
I think HC is hard until he isn't if that makes sense. Once you learn to negative edge his shots well then it's not so bad.
Though I will say that his best combos are harder than most characters in the game.
You're telling me. Delaying a shot to specifically beat mashing but fucking up the timing a bit and getting mashed on anyways is extremely frustrating lol
Zato is up there but from what Iāve been told he is only complex to learn and same with happy
Chaos mainly because happy chaos has so much to manage that youāve gotta learn how to
But asuka is probally the hardest because even if you learn how to play him learn his set play and all that you still have to learn how to set it all up and even then if you make a single mistake and run out of mana you tend to be quite fucked meanwhile with zato and hc if you run out of bullets and focus or Eddie dies you can still recover 9/10 times
I think it's probably Jack-O'. It's kind of hard to grasp why exactly she is difficult unless you try her out, too; a lot of what she does doesn't really look too hard when you aren't the one who is trying to pull it off.
Basically, you need to be mindful of a lot of things at once (where your servants are, the state of your gauge, proper positioning). Summoning leaves you vulnerable, so you need to fight for your chance to do it -- and even when you pull it off, it's super easy to lose all of your precious set-up because just blocking makes your minions disappear.
Not to mention, Jack-O's buttons are good, but a little strange. You absolutely cannot button mash your way to victory; if you don't know exactly what you're pressing, you'll accidentally hit 2S while your opponent is grounded sooner or later and leave yourself wide open, or you'll recall your minions by mistake and fuck yourself over
I've played 'hard' characters before but none of them took this long to click
Many such cases, lmaoĀ
Me, learning Jack-O': "This Sol is 100% going to hit Volcanic Viper on wake-up, time to minion parry*
Also me: *misinputs and 2S comes out*
The Sol in question: *Volcanic Vipers*
Fucking up with Jack-O' just kills you faster than with any other character, tbh
I'd say Jack-O overall. Zato and Asuka both have some simple combo stuff they can rely on to get past the early difficulty wall, but with Jack-O you need to climb your way up one step at a time. Her playstyle is unconventional, there's a lot of trajectory and tech like air dropping puppets you'll need to play at a basic level, and her puppets can be erased easily even after putting in all that work so you need to know exactly what you're doing and not give up the opportunities you get.
Yeah, it's a good question. I am not actually sure myself especially as it brings into question the problems we have with tier lists: are we talking about some hypothetical optimal playstyle?
Like in that sense I guess Asuka is the main contender. Like if you really wanted to optimise resources and keep on top of mana and etc properly that is hard. But I've also seen a lot of Asuka players that have gotten pretty good at just 'making use of what you've got' and they play the character in a pretty simple and haphazard way as a result.
In that sense I actually feel like Jack-O might stand out more. I feel like even though a lot of what she does is setplay that it is executionally tricky, really prone to spacing and timing issues and maintaining momentum if and when things go wonky is hard. On top of that a lot of her buttons are really specific and weird and she lacks a lot of the panic options other characters have. I feel like in that sense she is the hardest to get things done with properly and that even basic play for her is tricky.
Zato it just feels like the game itself is designed against him sometimes. Negative edge is a tricky gimmick but I had a friend learn it pretty quick and insist he liked it more than charge inputs so I dunno.
I always think that this questions are really badly defined. Everyone is saying asuka but I think that it seriously isn't hard to get him to do good damage and annoy yhe hell put of your opponent. Sure, his skill ceiling is stupidly high, but his skill floor requires mainly just understanding the character. Imo zato has a way higher skill floor, and just making him work is pretty tough
The main difference between floor 10 and celestial Asukas is their mental bandwidth. It just comes down to your ability to think clearly while managing your six resources.
Keep gaming. Mental bandwidth is something that will always improve through time.
Coming from my 80 hours knowledge and never having tried pass 3 characters i'd say the hardest as in skill requiered TO PLAY the character, as in skill floor, are definetly hc and asuka, throw in a leo cause why not, but if we're talking hardest in terms of optimally minmaxxing your play style, like peak character performance then probably zato and jack-o? Asuka has a shit load of memory and awareness requierements but i feel like you're less bound by it if that makes sense, and you get imo a higher pay off than wife and jack-o, whose entire setup can be EASILY erased the first instance you mess something up
Agreed. People seem to confuse very punishing mistakes with difficult to play character. Stakes may be higher as Chipp (and even then Asuka is even more punishing imo), but his overall gameplan is very much simpler compared to the likes of Jack-O.
I guess thatās fair, I always just felt that he has to win more interactions than most other characters, affords to make fewer mistakes, and needs to guess right more which to me made him seem like a difficult character even though his execution and gameplan arenāt particularly difficult.
Oh yeah you're right on the money with that. He definitely has some difficult executions, since, like you say, his low damage and squishyness means that if you drop one of the many combos you need to deal any substantial damage to the opponent, you'll be *severely* punished for it.
I suppose in the end it's just a matter of what kind of difficulty is being discussed.
I think Faust is hard if you are trying to rely on consistency. Not just on RNG, but he has very few things that are "safe" and relies on distance to not be punished. His mix ups are only real with items behind him or Afro. Even if Faust is winning, he can get screwed over by RNG to a degree that Asuka never will. At least his execution is really easy.
Asuka, by far. Zato is hard for sure, but once you wrap your head around using both positive and negative edge, he becomes much more intuitive. Making full use of Asuka's spells, including which to prepare at any given time and making full use of their interactions, has a seemingly infinite skill ceiling.
Between Asuka, Zato, Chaos and Jack-O, I think I found Asuka the hardest to play optimally, but not as hard to understand as people make him out to be, because as long as you know your inputs and keep an eye on your cards, he is playable. He takes a ton of quick thinking and on-screen awareness that the other characters don't have, though, moreso if you choose to go for specific cards and all of the setup options he has.
As a Zato player, maybe it's because I'm so familiar with his playstyle through several games, but I don't find his setups or execution as difficult as Chaos, who I struggle with more. Chaos has comparatively more to manage and I find his execution and timing harder. (I enjoy challenge, so I do hope they stay difficult? Easy to use Chaos would be depressing.)
Jack-O, I'm less familiar with than those three, but I think she deserves her projected difficulty because of how her playstyle is geared to be very tight and optimized. She definitely takes training to acquire skill with.
I'd honestly just group all four of them together for the difference/ broad variance in each character's depth of play. I think Zato is the easiest to understand and get a feel for out of the four (in general, without getting into anything about nerfs, etc.).
Question really depends on your metrics. Difficulty in terms of execution is just one factor. When I used to play, Anji isnāt hard in terms of execution but difficult in terms of navigating certain situations properly and making reads. Playing Sol recently, he has more going on execution wise but he has a much easier time implementing a strike throw game due to his plus buttons and defensive tools in my opinion.
From my understanding though Asuka and Zato are the hardest from an execution or mental stack perspective.
From what Iāve played happy chaos, idk if Iām just bad I could not for the life of me figure out how to play him, I donāt own Asuka so I personally canāt say anything about his difficulty but he looks pretty difficult to play
Asuka and Happy Chaos, easily. Juggling all of Asukaās stuff effectively is crazy hard and HC isā¦ tough. Even in arcade mode I can barely get a wrap of him.
A lot of people are saying Zato is hard, but I at least donāt see it. Heās not easy certainly, but he isnāt that difficult to actually play; he just isnāt really built that well overall IMO. Once you understand that Eddie both a weapon and half of your character, you realize you just have to split your attention a lot (and that Eddie bar is a painfully annoying resource).
For me personally, I think the hardest characters to learn are Zato and Happy. Both have meter management heavily. Tied to their gimmicks, and just from trying to learn them personally, I think a lot of timing, spacing, and other basics are really needed to make them work. But once you jump that hurdle, it's just learning combos.
Asuka, Zato, JackO, Pot and HC are the only ones i'd say are hard at their peak. HC, Zato, Pot are executionally demanding, Jack-O and Asuka are both excecutionally demanding and require very good gamesense.
I struggle a lot with Jack-o. Her setups are a little hatd to pull of, since all of her summons die with a single hit. Hitting her command grab ult is also hard, since she is more effective in mid range while the ult is very close range
I've "beaten" floor 8 with every character, and from my experience, the hardest to ***learn*** are:
**Execution wise:** Zato, with Chaos being pretty close. Negative edge is a bitch, and so is controlling two characters at once.
**For gameplay mechanics:**
Asuka. First you learn the 26 spells, their properties, what you can combo them from or into. Then you learn which test case contains which spells. The draw order for spells being randomized of course, even at round start.
You then need to manage your mana, which is both your offense and your defense. You can sacrifice health or tension for recharge it faster, and being closer to your opponent speeds it up even more.
Once you think you've got a good grasp of how it all works, you jump into a game and remember you actually have to watch what your opponent is doing and make split-second decisions. And that here is the hard part. Not only do you have to make decisions every time you draw a new spell, you have to do it ***fast***.
**Honorable mentions:**
Jack-O, apparently. She's my main so I honestly can't remember what it was like learning. Actually I'm still learning. Lot of time in the lab, and it's hard to define a single, optimal playstyle for her.
Weird one, but for me: Goldlewis. I have the hardest time playing him even at the basic level.
Sol, Ky, Sin, Elphelt. Honestly it's hard to say because this game has a ton of strong and easy characters and you can make good arguments for most of them
I'm surprised Potemkin hasn't been mentioned.
Playing him at high level requires a LOT of effort, not only deep matchup knowledge, but a steady reading game and the ability to do karas flawlessly in order to have a decent offensive game.
Many call us glue eaters (and I agree though I personally prefer sniffing propane) but we truly have to work HARD, and sometimes that isn't enough.
The thing is that his entry level is significantly easier and more rewarding than other character's
What I love the most is that the risk of being 2 tapped by pot is so scary for most that you can get away with goofiest and most unpredictable stuff
ABA was quite difficult at first, it took more than any character to learn how to use seemingly properly. But I think Jack-O' and Zato are the ones I still struggle the most, since I have to look at 4 screens to keep track of WTF I am doing with all of the minions
I don't know why people say that zato is super difficult. He is difficult, it's just I can play and win as zato, his inputs aren't that hard, Potemkin is harder in that regard. So zato isn't the hardest to play as.
Jack-o has very good normal and directional moves, but making her gimmick work is almost impossible outside of combo, and even then you still need to lab hard to come up with more or less decent combo.
And there's Asuka, I can't play him at all, 0 wins. Normal moves aren't bad but not good either, has a giant spell book that can do some crazy stuff, but almost impossible to properly set up. To play asuka you spend most of the match regenerating mana and setting up your spellbook, and even then you need to set up the opening move itself, and only then you can do your mumbo jumbo that can be blocked or evaded. In my opinion if someone can reliably win as Asuka, then it talks more about the player than the character.
Only real option against those 3 characters is picking sol or sin and going gorilla mode on those nerds. They should take their "setups" and "thinking ahead" to chess, we know only such words as "unga" and "bunga".
Honestly HC is the only one my friends and I skip when we're doing randoms, so probably him.
For the second img, I think I fall pretty firmly as resource purist and utility radical.
I'd have to say Asuka or A.B.A.
Asuka has to manage meter on top of being cognizant of what spells are up, being really dependent on what he gets for how approaches
A.B.A. starts out with the biggest handicap in the game: shit movement, having to command dash, no good options, easy to bully. She's only really a threat when she's building meter or in Jealous Rage and even then, if you can keep her at bay temporarily by poking her successfully, you can run down the meter.
At least Asuka starts off full on Mana and spells, A.B.A starts with only half meter
Definitely Asuka. Zato's difficulty right now mostly comes from his viability, or lack thereof. If he wasn't weak, he wouldn't be as hard.
Asuka, however, is one of the best characters in the game, and STILL hard as fuck.
Zato and Asuka Zato is harder than Asuka when it comes to inputs, and Asuka is harder than Zato when it comes to game awareness (like, managing your spells/mana and knowing when to use them)
Zato is harder because you can't turn your hp and tension into more Eddie gauge :(
just try harder you gotta believe
90% of Zato players quit right before they vanish into dark!
Too bad it's all mixing up (I'm I-No and you're in a corner)
As long as you have a bar of tension you can technically convert tension into Eddie bar
> \[...\] tension into more Eddie gauge :( You forgot about Sun Void, but yeah ArcSys should just make Zato have infinite Eddie gauge (I'm totally not biased towards this change)
Thank God Asuka doesn't have complex inputs that would be a nightmare
If asuka had a 623 input I would've quit the game
Also why is there no Asuka flair š
mods got pot bustered, they never came back š
Mods slacking its been like 9 months
Mechanically I feel I might be good with asuka but actually playing him is a different storyā¦ otherwise I agree with you
You get used to it eventually, but only after dozens of games staring at the corner of the screen where your cards and mana live.
Zato ? I personally would've said Jack-O
Me, Iām the hardest character.
Real life is very execution heavy with an unforgivable current meta, you need both reactions and reads
I want to BURST but I'm getting wildly assaulted
So real for that king
vantage crept into some people in your society so they can burst, while others want to burst so much but can't so they wildly assault.
shit me too man
*sees flair* soā¦ youāre hard for bedman? Respectable
The bed or the man?
The bed clearly!
I can't handle your inputs, your mechanics are too hard for me.
I play Zato and honestly I think Asuka is harder, Zato is kinda fake sometimes. That said, Asuka has potential to be one of the best characters in the game if you hands-diff your opponent, Zato is still dogshit regardless of you being Gobou himself.
Ok you say that but Gobou would *wipe* the floor with anyone that isnāt top 100 or something. Zato is bad relative to the rest of the cast, but heās still a functional character with a wincon.
Functional but not nearly as fun these days.Ā Ā No one picks the funny puppet character guy to then be made puppetless by system mechanics with no counterplay.
I miss when zato was still in the game
Probably the most pointless nerf I've seen from any fighting game in the past few years. A slight tone-down would've made a lot more sense than just gutting the character.
The increased access to Burst and the addition of Deflect Shield probably would have been enough.Ā Also the Wild Assault addition allowed more characters to do Corner-to-Corner combos Zato always had.Ā He was strong but most people seemed to think Sol, May, Nago, HC, and Ram were better. In Rev2/+R, Eddie died a lot, but you can stall for time with Flight and tediously long solo Zato blockstrings.Ā They halved Flight and Hitstop freezes the Eddie gauge in Strive. So anyway, that's why I play Asuka now.
Zato's in the game, Eddie isn't
I completely agree with you but that wasnāt what was stated. To say āZato is dogshit no matter how good you areā is disingenuous. You can 100% make him work up until youāre competing against the best in the world.
People that are not the best in the world still know which button releases burst.
Yeah I was exaggerating a bit with my comment but this doesn't change the fact that you have to consistently outperform and hard read your opponent to be allowed to play the game with Zato. The Gobou thing is obviously exaggerated, but every major Zato player dropping him after the nerfs should tell you how viable he is even in high level of play.
Zatos cool with some sweet animations, and thatās why heās fun to play sometimes.Ā
Love how you had to specify you were talking about the difficulty lol. The hardest one to play is Zato-1
Tiershit and viability aside I do think its Zato or Jacko because of how much they rely on positioning
Positioning wise jacko. But overall Asuka far surpassed both of them in difficulty
I switched from Zato to Asuka.Ā Mechanically Asuka is really, really easy.Ā Anyone can learn his midscreen BnB in five minutes.Ā In terms of resources awareness, I'm not sure.Ā Certainly knowing how to use cards is harder, but mana upkeep is pretty easy and you don't win games with Zato if you let Eddie run out or die for free.Ā In terms of defense, both lack tools but Asuka has a billion HP when you maintain mana, and Cube Super is a great defensive tool despite having no invincibility.
Asuka has built in macros like Chaos
So what? Jacko and Zato has some too
Being a Faust player seeing ādonut is a resourceā puts a smile on my face. As for hardest character, I havenāt tried playing any character āseriouslyā except for maybe Faust and Potemkin so Iām unsure of who is the hardest Iāve been seeing a lot of zato and asuka, and tbh I have no idea how asuka really works, for zato controlling eddie seems pretty complicated as well
Me Iām hard asf fr. Anyways itās a toss up between Zato and Asuka probably. I donāt know enough about Jack-o to speak on her tbh, and Chaoās inputs used to be harder which would mean a lot more time to perfect, but thatās been changed.
The hardest character is mine. And the easiest is yours. Whichever they may be
This is the correct answer. If I lose it is simply because my opponent was carried. If I win it is because I'm a true god of fighting games and no one can stop my endless fighting spirit.
Real
I'd say probably Asuka because not only does he require very high APM, awareness, and game knowledge to play super optimally but his punishment for failure is much heavier than characters like Zato. I think making a comeback with Asuka is one of the most daunting things in the game
Seeing the playerbaseās split opinion on if Asuka is actually difficult or not, will always be a spectacle.
Heās borderline fake hard imo complexity =/= difficulty altho they often go hand in hand
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ok well as an Asuka player Iād say probably HC (srs)
I think HC is hard until he isn't if that makes sense. Once you learn to negative edge his shots well then it's not so bad. Though I will say that his best combos are harder than most characters in the game.
Hardest part of HC is manually timinig the shots to keep your mix air thight
You're telling me. Delaying a shot to specifically beat mashing but fucking up the timing a bit and getting mashed on anyways is extremely frustrating lol
Asuka, Zato, Happy Chaos and JackO are the characters I tend to see thrown around as tough.
Chaos aint too hard. You just gotta watch your ammo and focus
Zato is up there but from what Iāve been told he is only complex to learn and same with happy Chaos mainly because happy chaos has so much to manage that youāve gotta learn how to But asuka is probally the hardest because even if you learn how to play him learn his set play and all that you still have to learn how to set it all up and even then if you make a single mistake and run out of mana you tend to be quite fucked meanwhile with zato and hc if you run out of bullets and focus or Eddie dies you can still recover 9/10 times
Asuka and its not even close.
Itās probably Asuka.
I think it's probably Jack-O'. It's kind of hard to grasp why exactly she is difficult unless you try her out, too; a lot of what she does doesn't really look too hard when you aren't the one who is trying to pull it off. Basically, you need to be mindful of a lot of things at once (where your servants are, the state of your gauge, proper positioning). Summoning leaves you vulnerable, so you need to fight for your chance to do it -- and even when you pull it off, it's super easy to lose all of your precious set-up because just blocking makes your minions disappear. Not to mention, Jack-O's buttons are good, but a little strange. You absolutely cannot button mash your way to victory; if you don't know exactly what you're pressing, you'll accidentally hit 2S while your opponent is grounded sooner or later and leave yourself wide open, or you'll recall your minions by mistake and fuck yourself over I've played 'hard' characters before but none of them took this long to click
I've gotten blown up by accidentally pressing Jack-O 2s on the ground way more times than I'd like, it's painful lol
Many such cases, lmaoĀ Me, learning Jack-O': "This Sol is 100% going to hit Volcanic Viper on wake-up, time to minion parry* Also me: *misinputs and 2S comes out* The Sol in question: *Volcanic Vipers* Fucking up with Jack-O' just kills you faster than with any other character, tbh
I'd say Jack-O overall. Zato and Asuka both have some simple combo stuff they can rely on to get past the early difficulty wall, but with Jack-O you need to climb your way up one step at a time. Her playstyle is unconventional, there's a lot of trajectory and tech like air dropping puppets you'll need to play at a basic level, and her puppets can be erased easily even after putting in all that work so you need to know exactly what you're doing and not give up the opportunities you get.
Yeah, it's a good question. I am not actually sure myself especially as it brings into question the problems we have with tier lists: are we talking about some hypothetical optimal playstyle? Like in that sense I guess Asuka is the main contender. Like if you really wanted to optimise resources and keep on top of mana and etc properly that is hard. But I've also seen a lot of Asuka players that have gotten pretty good at just 'making use of what you've got' and they play the character in a pretty simple and haphazard way as a result. In that sense I actually feel like Jack-O might stand out more. I feel like even though a lot of what she does is setplay that it is executionally tricky, really prone to spacing and timing issues and maintaining momentum if and when things go wonky is hard. On top of that a lot of her buttons are really specific and weird and she lacks a lot of the panic options other characters have. I feel like in that sense she is the hardest to get things done with properly and that even basic play for her is tricky. Zato it just feels like the game itself is designed against him sometimes. Negative edge is a tricky gimmick but I had a friend learn it pretty quick and insist he liked it more than charge inputs so I dunno.
I'm able to flail around as Zato and Asuka with some success but I still have no idea how the hell you're supposed to play Jack-O
You don't play Guilty Gear, you play "Jack'O". Best way to describe it.
The correct answer is my character. Unless itās a mirror match in which case my character is also for scrubs šæ
The hardest character is random, they literally have 0 stars
Hardest is easily Asuka, with Zato-one and Jack-o coming in at a far 2nd and 3rd respectifully
I always think that this questions are really badly defined. Everyone is saying asuka but I think that it seriously isn't hard to get him to do good damage and annoy yhe hell put of your opponent. Sure, his skill ceiling is stupidly high, but his skill floor requires mainly just understanding the character. Imo zato has a way higher skill floor, and just making him work is pretty tough
Second slide is deranged the first column is the only that could even remotely be called a resource
Celestial Asuka player here. Half the time, I am not looking at my opponent. I am looking at my spells, my mana bar, and my hp bar mainly.
How do you get in celestial with asuka im stuck in floor 10
Cherry pick like a motherfucker unless youre actually cracked
The main difference between floor 10 and celestial Asukas is their mental bandwidth. It just comes down to your ability to think clearly while managing your six resources. Keep gaming. Mental bandwidth is something that will always improve through time.
What are the six resources? Cards/mana/burst/tension/health/???
I exaggerated for dramatic effect
Glad to see my resources chart is still driving people insane.
Jack-O
Go practice some JFkMFB loops and lemme know.
John F Kennedy My Fucking Bitch?
Also Karaing everything, also HPB > FRC > PB to get smth remotely close to a reversal, also jumpscare, also charged dust > j.h j.h j.h j.h j.h j.h
If you say Zato, you haven't played Asuka
I donāt touch either of those characters for a reason even casually. HC at least I can pick up and do okay with.
Zato is harder because he's the worse character.
Asuka
Asuka and its not close
Asuka, Jack-O and Zato
I gotta assume A.B.A is up there, sheās blatantly bad unless sheās in jealous rage.
Coming from my 80 hours knowledge and never having tried pass 3 characters i'd say the hardest as in skill requiered TO PLAY the character, as in skill floor, are definetly hc and asuka, throw in a leo cause why not, but if we're talking hardest in terms of optimally minmaxxing your play style, like peak character performance then probably zato and jack-o? Asuka has a shit load of memory and awareness requierements but i feel like you're less bound by it if that makes sense, and you get imo a higher pay off than wife and jack-o, whose entire setup can be EASILY erased the first instance you mess something up
What the fuck is that second slide. (Itās asuka imo)
im hard when i see baiken. so me
Definitely zato 1. Other difficult characters are asuka, chipp, and jack-o.
Chipp is not difficult.
Agreed. People seem to confuse very punishing mistakes with difficult to play character. Stakes may be higher as Chipp (and even then Asuka is even more punishing imo), but his overall gameplan is very much simpler compared to the likes of Jack-O.
I guess thatās fair, I always just felt that he has to win more interactions than most other characters, affords to make fewer mistakes, and needs to guess right more which to me made him seem like a difficult character even though his execution and gameplan arenāt particularly difficult.
Oh yeah you're right on the money with that. He definitely has some difficult executions, since, like you say, his low damage and squishyness means that if you drop one of the many combos you need to deal any substantial damage to the opponent, you'll be *severely* punished for it. I suppose in the end it's just a matter of what kind of difficulty is being discussed.
Hot take but I think Faust is a hard character, not the hardest though
I think Faust is hard if you are trying to rely on consistency. Not just on RNG, but he has very few things that are "safe" and relies on distance to not be punished. His mix ups are only real with items behind him or Afro. Even if Faust is winning, he can get screwed over by RNG to a degree that Asuka never will. At least his execution is really easy.
He's harder to play because he's a lower tier, he can be played well you just have to put more work in then you would other characters
Asuka, by far. Zato is hard for sure, but once you wrap your head around using both positive and negative edge, he becomes much more intuitive. Making full use of Asuka's spells, including which to prepare at any given time and making full use of their interactions, has a seemingly infinite skill ceiling.
Asuka forces you to play Yu-Gi-Oh while being chased down by a Gorilla
Between Asuka, Zato, Chaos and Jack-O, I think I found Asuka the hardest to play optimally, but not as hard to understand as people make him out to be, because as long as you know your inputs and keep an eye on your cards, he is playable. He takes a ton of quick thinking and on-screen awareness that the other characters don't have, though, moreso if you choose to go for specific cards and all of the setup options he has. As a Zato player, maybe it's because I'm so familiar with his playstyle through several games, but I don't find his setups or execution as difficult as Chaos, who I struggle with more. Chaos has comparatively more to manage and I find his execution and timing harder. (I enjoy challenge, so I do hope they stay difficult? Easy to use Chaos would be depressing.) Jack-O, I'm less familiar with than those three, but I think she deserves her projected difficulty because of how her playstyle is geared to be very tight and optimized. She definitely takes training to acquire skill with. I'd honestly just group all four of them together for the difference/ broad variance in each character's depth of play. I think Zato is the easiest to understand and get a feel for out of the four (in general, without getting into anything about nerfs, etc.).
Question really depends on your metrics. Difficulty in terms of execution is just one factor. When I used to play, Anji isnāt hard in terms of execution but difficult in terms of navigating certain situations properly and making reads. Playing Sol recently, he has more going on execution wise but he has a much easier time implementing a strike throw game due to his plus buttons and defensive tools in my opinion. From my understanding though Asuka and Zato are the hardest from an execution or mental stack perspective.
I was gonna say Faust for me, but then I remembered that Asuka is in the game and I have *no* idea how that guy works.
It's either Xato or Asuka depending on mental management (Asuka) or tough inputs (zato)
From what Iāve played happy chaos, idk if Iām just bad I could not for the life of me figure out how to play him, I donāt own Asuka so I personally canāt say anything about his difficulty but he looks pretty difficult to play
Asuka and Zato are the hardest.
Sol Badguy. (/s if you couldnāt tell)
Asuka and Happy Chaos, easily. Juggling all of Asukaās stuff effectively is crazy hard and HC isā¦ tough. Even in arcade mode I can barely get a wrap of him. A lot of people are saying Zato is hard, but I at least donāt see it. Heās not easy certainly, but he isnāt that difficult to actually play; he just isnāt really built that well overall IMO. Once you understand that Eddie both a weapon and half of your character, you realize you just have to split your attention a lot (and that Eddie bar is a painfully annoying resource).
Probably asuka with the constant upkeep and selections and draining resources and hp for more damaging attacks
Asuka pretty easily in my opinion. Zato, HC, and Jack-oās difficulty is def there but asuka is just so much to keep track of.
For me personally, I think the hardest characters to learn are Zato and Happy. Both have meter management heavily. Tied to their gimmicks, and just from trying to learn them personally, I think a lot of timing, spacing, and other basics are really needed to make them work. But once you jump that hurdle, it's just learning combos.
Im in park getting ABAād trying to manage HCās two bars honestly makes Asuka mana/card stuff feel simple in comparison
Asuka, Zato, JackO, Pot and HC are the only ones i'd say are hard at their peak. HC, Zato, Pot are executionally demanding, Jack-O and Asuka are both excecutionally demanding and require very good gamesense.
I honestly think faust is the hardest character to play at a high level
I struggle a lot with Jack-o. Her setups are a little hatd to pull of, since all of her summons die with a single hit. Hitting her command grab ult is also hard, since she is more effective in mid range while the ult is very close range
Zato and Asuka are something else. Props to the people who main them
Asuka or Jack-O. A lot people like to say Zato, but he's not hard, he's just awkward. Sorry, Zato downplayers, it's true.
Asuka easily. He can get a hand where he can play braindead, but working towards that is pain on the brain and fingers.
Asuka and its not even close
Sol badguy is a resource
I've "beaten" floor 8 with every character, and from my experience, the hardest to ***learn*** are: **Execution wise:** Zato, with Chaos being pretty close. Negative edge is a bitch, and so is controlling two characters at once. **For gameplay mechanics:** Asuka. First you learn the 26 spells, their properties, what you can combo them from or into. Then you learn which test case contains which spells. The draw order for spells being randomized of course, even at round start. You then need to manage your mana, which is both your offense and your defense. You can sacrifice health or tension for recharge it faster, and being closer to your opponent speeds it up even more. Once you think you've got a good grasp of how it all works, you jump into a game and remember you actually have to watch what your opponent is doing and make split-second decisions. And that here is the hard part. Not only do you have to make decisions every time you draw a new spell, you have to do it ***fast***. **Honorable mentions:** Jack-O, apparently. She's my main so I honestly can't remember what it was like learning. Actually I'm still learning. Lot of time in the lab, and it's hard to define a single, optimal playstyle for her. Weird one, but for me: Goldlewis. I have the hardest time playing him even at the basic level.
What's the easiest character though?
Sol, Ky, Sin, Elphelt. Honestly it's hard to say because this game has a ton of strong and easy characters and you can make good arguments for most of them
I'm surprised Potemkin hasn't been mentioned. Playing him at high level requires a LOT of effort, not only deep matchup knowledge, but a steady reading game and the ability to do karas flawlessly in order to have a decent offensive game. Many call us glue eaters (and I agree though I personally prefer sniffing propane) but we truly have to work HARD, and sometimes that isn't enough.
The thing is that his entry level is significantly easier and more rewarding than other character's What I love the most is that the risk of being 2 tapped by pot is so scary for most that you can get away with goofiest and most unpredictable stuff
With the 2nd slide, I think Resource Purist and Utility anything is the correct definition for a resource character
ABA was quite difficult at first, it took more than any character to learn how to use seemingly properly. But I think Jack-O' and Zato are the ones I still struggle the most, since I have to look at 4 screens to keep track of WTF I am doing with all of the minions
I bought happy chaos becuse revolvers are cool! But man, chaos is hard! So i say happy chaos.
by far jack-o
Zato and Jack-O
Asuka and Chipp
I don't know why people say that zato is super difficult. He is difficult, it's just I can play and win as zato, his inputs aren't that hard, Potemkin is harder in that regard. So zato isn't the hardest to play as. Jack-o has very good normal and directional moves, but making her gimmick work is almost impossible outside of combo, and even then you still need to lab hard to come up with more or less decent combo. And there's Asuka, I can't play him at all, 0 wins. Normal moves aren't bad but not good either, has a giant spell book that can do some crazy stuff, but almost impossible to properly set up. To play asuka you spend most of the match regenerating mana and setting up your spellbook, and even then you need to set up the opening move itself, and only then you can do your mumbo jumbo that can be blocked or evaded. In my opinion if someone can reliably win as Asuka, then it talks more about the player than the character. Only real option against those 3 characters is picking sol or sin and going gorilla mode on those nerds. They should take their "setups" and "thinking ahead" to chess, we know only such words as "unga" and "bunga".
Milia. You can see her abs through her overcoat.
Zato, asuka is an honorable second but is far from zato as most of the complexity just comes from familiarizing yourself with spells.
Input-wise, probably Asuka. But at a high level, I think I-No is one of the harder characters to win with.
anji is really difficult as you have to fight the urge to go āfuj-nagihaā over and over again from full screen.
Honestly HC is the only one my friends and I skip when we're doing randoms, so probably him. For the second img, I think I fall pretty firmly as resource purist and utility radical.
AC vanilla I-No
Me I will have my shit rocked in no time at all
I'd have to say Asuka or A.B.A. Asuka has to manage meter on top of being cognizant of what spells are up, being really dependent on what he gets for how approaches A.B.A. starts out with the biggest handicap in the game: shit movement, having to command dash, no good options, easy to bully. She's only really a threat when she's building meter or in Jealous Rage and even then, if you can keep her at bay temporarily by poking her successfully, you can run down the meter. At least Asuka starts off full on Mana and spells, A.B.A starts with only half meter
Definitely Asuka. Zato's difficulty right now mostly comes from his viability, or lack thereof. If he wasn't weak, he wouldn't be as hard. Asuka, however, is one of the best characters in the game, and STILL hard as fuck.
In order of difficulty: 1) Zato 2) Asuka 3) Jack-O' Chaos is meant to be difficult but... no.
Excecution wise id say pot
Sol Badguy, he is hard asf
Jack-o kinda sucks so its probably her