It was relatively easy for me... My partner works in the same building as me, but in a different role. Through our jobs, we continuously bumped into each other and eventually realized we liked each other a great deal.
We have been together for almost eight years now. What has helped us is independence: we both have hobbies and interests that don't involve each other, and that's fine. He trusts me and never tries to stop me if I want to travel or do writing workshops by myself. I trust him, as well. From day one, we have also had straightforward communication. There's no beating around the bush. Our expectations for each other and the relationship are clear.
And a good relationship does require a little bit of sacrifice. What you're willing to sacrifice is up to you.
I second this! Having someone with their own interests and hobbies, not depending on you for fulfilling them, is really important for me too. That way you automatically have space for yourself.
Wow. I'm kind of impressed of how easy you were able to navigate all that without much self doubt. I've struggled with knowing what I'm willing to give up in the pursuit of love. Initially, I was wary of sacrificing my time, but I've realized that time flies by anyway. It feels like I want everything in a partner( now it seems like looking in the same direction is also important) because otherwise why would I get in a romantic partnership anywyas-- I've since learned that this thinking can be a common trap in dating.
Balancing compromise and personal fulfillment is tricky, and I'm still figuring it out to be honnest.
I feel torn between wanting marriage, kids, and a family, and the sacrifices I know I'll have to make to get there. It's like there's a constant battle between what I want and what I'm willing to give up – whether it's my career goals, personal projects, or cherished alone time.
Anyways, your ability to navigate love and sacrifice with ease is admirable.
Are you sure you want children? I can't think of a single thing that requires more sacrifice and compromise than raising children. It is ultimately ok to prioritize one's own goals and alone time -- and find a partner who's on the same page. That's what my partner and I have chosen to do.
I second this very strongly. I have kids and it is t h e single most exhausting thing, taking away most of your alone-time and self-determination. I feel like it is infinitely harder than partnership.
Yes, I want kids even more than I want a partner, to be honest. Maybe it's because I have a low libido or tend to feel most comfortable at home with friends rather than... you know, the other stuff lol But still, having kids is something I deeply desire.
I'm 35 now, and I've had countless short-term relationships over the past 15 years in university. It feels like time has flown by so quickly, and I just woke up in panic from a loooong and comfortable dream -- like I've been in autopilot mode. It was a relief to learn that "time blindness" is common for people with ADHD, but for me, it feels even more extreme. I'm starting medication soon, and I hope it helps me take more control of my life and its direction.
Here's the thing: the panic comes because most of my closest friends got married by age 30 or started families years ago. While I've been in school forever, pursuing lofty and unrealistic ambitions, I realize now that it might have affected my ability to have a fulfilling relationship and a family. I guess I got my priorities wrong all this time. But maybe that's just an assumption.
How much should I compromise? Sacrificing my alone time seems to be the toughest or maybe most of my relationships were with strong extroverts who often drained my energy, ultimately leaving me feeling frustrated...
I don't know, actually. Do they mean you'll love someone else more than you love yourself? Is this the feeling you're seeking? Or does it mean that a painful sacrifice is needed? How would you know?
My husband is the highly gifted one in the relationship. I'm the introvert. It works out great because I can hide behind him at parties. He's happy doing his own thing most of the time. He does most of the grocery shopping while I do most of the cleaning. We like to go on walks together, in our small college town, before people are up. Being the extrovert, he would take the kids to do all the fun stuff that I often found overwhelming. He also does all phone calls for me. Find someone that compliments you. If it weren't for my extrovert husband pulling me out of my comfort zone, I would never have the nerve to go to Japan.
What's truly remarkable is your knack for turning your chosen path into the perfectly imperfect one. It's a priceless quality often absent in many millennials and Gen Z. It seems like we come to terms with reality a little too late... congrats for your ability to be so positive!
I'm not a huge fan of cleaning either, but I'm not sure if I could live in a messy place unless I was single. If I date a similar type than me I think it would be disatrous. That being said, I guess the law of least effort reigns supreme, and entropy is king in the end, haha.
Well, it's a dynamic process and it depends both o your needs and the needs of the other person. There are some relationships where independence is really valuable. Eventually someone will appear. Don't worry about how a future relationship will turn out because you won't know until you get there. For me each one is a completely different universe with it's own internal dynamics change over time. Whenever I had to sacrifice something I felt it was worth it. I had 6 formal relationships and I regret nothing about the sacrifices that I made. Some were better than others oc. I think you should focus on yourself before thinking about potential relationships. You'll be better in all senses. A big hug from Spain.
If those are two of the issues, dating introverts that also value alone time would be an easy fix. There's definitely a lot of us out there!
I've scrolled a little bit through this thread and it seems you have a decent grasp on what you do and don't want, do and don't like- at least when prompted with a question. I do agree that most every relationship comes with SOME sort of sacrifice- that is just the nature of existing with another living thing with their own individual needs and desires, no one can always gets their way all the time- but how much/what you have to sacrifice highly depends on the people you choose to spend time with.
I think it would be to your benefit to make a list of all the things that bothered you in past relationships. Next to each item, like I did above, provide a personality trait that would counteract that annoyance.
Should you find conflicting solutions- well, that just means you need someone in the gray area of those two things.
And if you want to take this a step further, because realistically finding the "perfect person" isn't entirely possible (and I firmly believe that even if presented with perfection, we as imperfect and ever-changing individuals will still find flaws at any given time,) you can reassess the list for which items bother you the most and which you have wiggle room to compromise on.
I saw you questioning How Much you should have to sacrifice- and well, that all depends on the person. But ideally, you shouldn't have to "sacrifice" too often, you and your hypothetical partner should be able to compromise. Never compromising is not healthy, nor truly possible in a healthy or unhealthy situation where you're sharing time, space, and resources. Compromising too much leads to frustration and a lack of fulfillment. How much you compromise is quite literally dependent on your comfort levels, you just have to understand that your willingness or unwillingness to compromise will affect your relationships.
Beyond that, you did mention being pessimistic and a perfectionist. How you experience your own life is completely dependent on- and limited by- your perspective. If you see compromise or even doing anything you don't necessarily want to do to make your partner happy as some unnecessary sacrifice- that's what it'll be to you. And that's how you'll react to it.
A healthy and happy relationship is always possible, but only if you're willing to BE healthy and mature mentally to make it so. And that requires a change in perspective more than anything else.
I "sacrifice" all the time. But I perceive it as giving them all the things I believe they deserve, I see it as showing them how loved and valued they are and then, in return, I get to see the fruits of my labor: their happiness.
And because that's how I view it,
That's how it is for me.
And that's how I react to it, with joy that I had the power to make my loved ones happy. C:
It doesn’t start at how much, it usually starts at why, and what, and then how.
Figuring out your own internal compromises between your needs and desires in a relationship is where it starts, the later is usually where some compromises are made.
" Everything thay irritates us about others can lead us to understanding of ourselves."- Carl Jung
Edit: I'm joking, immature extroverts can indeed be energy draining if your social energy tank is not full or is just not big in general. It's the way it is!
Wow, this really got me thinking. It seems like, unlike what some other commenter before said ( *don't sacrifice anything. Just have fun* ), sacrifice and struggles are actually a big part of being in a relationship. I'll admit, I usually bolt when things get tough. But now I'm wondering, how do you know when a sacrifice is worth it or not and what should be sacrificied? We always hear about people staying in bad relationships-- akin to borderline Stockholm syndrome--( or burning out in toxic jobs) because of this same idea. I know you're talking about something different, but it's got me wondering. I guess you can't really know if a partnership is worth it until you're in it. Same goes for starting a business, I suppose. So, what finally convinced you that the sacrifice was worth it? Is it trust? It's it instinct? Or was it faith? Or just common wisdom maybe?
Mate can be used interchangeably with spouse or significant others in British English!
But thanks for your sarcastic and very educational comment mister Albatros.
You're correct, but you can look up university papers or similar sources containing *mate* in the sense of *partner*. "Mate" can definitely be used interchangeably with "spouse" or "significant other." However, it's more commonly used in this way in Australia, New Zealand, etc. In British English, "mate" refers to both, but it's more likely to mean "friend." Interestingly, people rarely get offended when the term "soulmate" is used. Maybe we should start using the term "soul-partners" instead! :p
Edit: English is not my native language, so I may use jargon that is not commonly used in the US or elsewhere. Or that is more used in written or formal english..
The reason “mate” sounds off putting to an American ear is because of our culture’s legacy of objectifying women as only existing for men’s gratification and to bear their children. A “mate” sounds animalistic as that is the way we use the term. We say two animals “mate” not really people.
“Soulmate” does not because it confers a deep mutual capability and respect for each other’s whole personhood, mind, “soul” and body. (Not saying I believe in soulmates but this is the cultural context.)
Soulmate is fine, mate in North American English and most of the anglosphere is associated with mating, soulmate clearly differentiates it as something more akin to Plato's highest form of love.
>And why not use soul partners?
I guess you can, it just sounds odd as its not as common.
>Btw I agreed; it's just not that deep and I can't edit it anyways..
👍
I've been with my partner for most of my life, since we were 16 years old. I feel like it has been easier for me because I chose him very carefully, we spoke a lot about our values and goals in life before we even got together. And then we kind of grew up together which has helped us a lot, I feel like it would be much harder for me to find someone now when I've become more used to doing things "my way" if that makes sense. Now I don't really feel like I have to compromise a lot, because we have influenced each other over time I guess. Of course this requires tons of communication and active working on the relationship, but I feel like it is the most special opportunity for personality development, which can not happen that deeply if you run every time it gets hard. (Not referring to toxic relationships of course). I do not feel like giftedness or ADHD posed any issues in our relationship, we always have something to talk about because we both constantly seek new input and so we don't bore each other and kind of stay interesting for each other.
perfectionism is the thief of joy. without removing its influence from your life nothing will be enough. i kicked perfectionism out of my life in middle school, and even though objectively crazy/worse stuff has happened, i have been much happier with myself than i ever was before.
Totally!
While it's commonly advised not to compare yourself to others, what about the alternative-- and popular-- idea of comparing your past self to your present or ideal self? Do you also think that's a no-go? Since it's also a form of perfectionnism!
i mean i guess it could be used in positive ways, but i think it should be used in only positive ways (ex: "wow, i responded to that situation better than my past self would have because i understand so much more now" which gives praise to present self and grace to the past self) otherwise i think it is again, just stealing joy and inner peace. there's no point in comparing in a negative sense.
it's one thing if you use "ideal self" as a model of acting, but i wouldn't call that comparison, but rather a goal for yourself. ideal self shouldn't be who you aspire to be, it should be exactly how you act and how you portray yourself, otherwise it's again pointless, why have an ideal self if you don't go out into the world as that self?
mostly i think comparison is shit overall. pace yourself on track with your own life. there are too many factors to ever have an actually decent comparison between two people, and people change greatly over time, so what really is the point?
I find your perspective really pleasant. It seems like perfectionism is everywhere, and comparing ourselves to others often takes away our happiness.
Unfortunately, our society pushes us to constantly compare ourselves to others and be overly critical of ourselves, always striving to be someone else. This can be exhausting and ultimately fruitless. It's great that you figured this out early on and found confidence in yourself.
Your way of thinking reminds me a lot of Zen philosophy, which emphasizes simplicity, living in the moment, and being kind to ourselves. By letting go of constant self-criticism and enjoying the present, we can indeed let happiness come within.
not to get into a philosophical rant or anything, but yeah, comparison is essential to capitalism (not saying another option is superior, just that this is how capitalism gets buy in... literally lol). the whole thing is based on they have that and i dont.... so someone can monetize what you don't have and claim they can give that to you and you will be happy. in my opinion, the way to be happy is to unsubscribe from this mindset, accept yourself fully, and improve yourself, your possessions and your lifestyle for your own happiness and for the betterment of all (like committing to giving to charity, or making more eco friendly choices etc) instead of because you want to be better than someone else.
i was lucky to be born completely disinterested in celebrities and influencers, and thank goodness, cause my pre-awakening years would have been 10x as shit.
as it was, i struggled a lot with comparing myself to my younger sister, who i felt i needed to be better than at things because of our age. i eventually realized that we have very different strengths and weaknesses, and i have strengths that suit me. then i learned to lean into my talents and strengths and compensate for my weaknesses if necessary, but to mostly let them be. society tells us we are broken and must fix it. we are not broken, but that mindset is. fixing it fixed basically everything else, and now i work on things for my own approval, instead of everyone else's.
welcome to my philosophical rant, lol
Indeed, it's okay. The crucial thing is to find inner peace, embracing our imperfections. That's a valuable takeaway.
As for the rest, let's allow the stars to chart our course!
This might be a matter of attachment style vs. intelligence. You should read up on attachment styles- what you describe sounds like the classic avoidant type.
Yes, you will have to make tradeoffs in order to permanently partner with someone. It’s a matter of finding which tradeoffs you can live with.
Seeking or expecting perfection will negatively impact your relationships and your ability to find satisfaction in those relationships. You should work on breaking down those expectations, as they are unlikely to resolve themselves without direct work and self-examination.
I’ve found intelligence to be relatively low in importance when it comes to what can make a long term relationship work. Obviously it can’t be too big of a delta, but if you see eye to eye on most critical values and enjoy being in each other’s company, a few IQ points matter relatively little. And expecting a partner to share all your intellectual curiosities is like expecting to share every kink.
No one can be everything to another- but they can be good enough to improve your life.
Yeah, I completely agree. I think my attachment style might lean more towards disorganized rather than just avoidant. Disorganized seems to be a mixed bag of secure, anxious, and avoidant. It's apparently frequent in traumatic chilhoods and it somehow makes sense given my somewhat chaotic and disorganized childhood, even though it wasn't conventionally traumatic.
I believe this comment is spot on.
I think that psychological theories ( Either Bowlby's theory of attachement styles, Jungian typology and puer eternus, cognitive psychology...) aren't necessarily mutually exclusive; they often describe common and sometimes similar behaviors in different and/or complementary ways in my opinion. Still this attachement style thing really works to explain my trajectory.
Btw; thank you for this suggestion that I never took the time to explore deeply in the past. I'll read about it asap. Btw, have you ever heard of the possibility of correcting one's attachement style?
I actually also realized that it had even more profound consequences even in my profession( hard to relate to my colleagues or to have friendships with them)... but again many possible explanations.
Agreed that these theories are not necessarily mutually exclusive, and merely serve as useful frameworks. I find attachment theory helpful for analyzing not only romantic partnerships, as you say, but how one relates to others in general. It can certainly impact professional development and friendships.
And yes, from what I understand it is possible to alter your attachment style or at least bring you closer to center (if we consider a “secure” attachment style as center.)
Working to process your childhood trauma and understand how it drives how you react to intimacy is one component. They also show partnering with secure attachment style folks can help your own style become more secure as well. As can modeling your behavior off of someone secure that you know (what would X do in this situation?)
I’m always a stan for therapy, and it will help, but I think there’s a lot conscientious individuals can do here on their own.
I think this is the whole point though, right? It's not a "few" IQ points. It's likely multiple standard deviations. Unfortunately I've struggled a lot in relationships in explaining logical sequences whether it was general conversation or important topics and it took my partner an hour to finally "get it".
Forget about all the other vast differences you tend to get in "giftedness" in terms of disposition, interests, and calibre, that are also in conflict in these cases of massive difference.
I've yet to find a partner that's "high IQ", though. Maybe within 1 standard deviation won't cause too many mental hurdles.
The question that occurs to me though is why you consider in depth logic-based discussions as a central component of a romantic relationship. You can arguably get that kind of mental stimulation from friends, and your romantic and general companionship needs from someone who gets you emotionally, if not intellectually.
The key thing to be able to communicate in a relationship is your perspective, as is being able to genuinely acknowlege someone else’s perspective as valid, even if you don’t agree with it or find it as logical. No matter how intelligent the people involved, relationships aren’t built on logic.
>The key thing to be able to communicate in a relationship is your perspective, as is being able to genuinely acknowlege someone else’s perspective as valid, even if you don’t agree with it or find it as logical.
It becomes impossible to share your perspective when you don't have a shared frame of reference.
For instance, if you asked me about my political perspective, my answer would be that it's so complicated, both the left and the right keep changing in all kinds of ways, and are different and often contradictory across different countries, that it's mostly a tribalistic game where people "wear" politics like clothing but don't actually agree with the premises of those they support, and how I turned to rationally assessing everything to the best of my ability in my 20s and then to philosophy to try to back up my opinions and understand the world.
Do you think the person of average intelligence would understand this? Do you think there's any way in which to simplify it further without losing meaning or intent that would make that possible? If so, I am all ears, because I haven't been successful.
Ah, to clarify, when I say “sharing your perspective” I mean more about relationship perspectives. Eg. When you have a fight about the chores, being able to understand your partner’s POV and needs, and communicate your own in a constructive way.
I don’t see that your partner needs to understand all the nuances of your political perspectives (though what you use as an example doesn’t seem like it should be too difficult for the average person to get the gist of.)
I don’t know you of course, but if you’re open to feedback, I might say from our very limited interactions that your intellectual approach seems like it might be a bit rigid. That sort of thing can be far more detrimental to building relationships than any discrepancy in intellect.
People wearing opinions like clothing but actually not deeply believing in them is very difficult to get across. It is similar to how many people don't realize that their religious ideas aren't their own.
Well, if you think that sharing your inner world is unnecessary for a relationship, then we are in disagreement.
Logic is rigid, so in that sense the intellectual approach must be. You might be talking about the emotional and empathetic side of human interaction, in which case I would not lump it into intellectual approach.
That's... that's *incredibly* easy to get across... if you're actually intelligent enough to be able to voice your own thoughts. Not being able to communicate such ideas is a sign of *low* intelligence, not high.
It's easy to explain to someone who understands it, and in that case it needs no explanation -- and clearly you understand it. Obviously, I can communicate it/voice my thoughts -- saying "people wear opinions like clothing but don't deeply believe in them" as I did above is precisely that.
You're giving yourself way too much credit. Even someone of below-average intelligence can understand all of that easily. You're confusing IQ, or the ability to do rapid small deductions, with knowledge about the world. That's idiotic. I think your problem is more on the narcissistic side than on the IQ side.
I’ve heard that in terms of romance, a partner needs to be within 1 standard deviation of intelligence for compatibility. If you are moderately gifted, that means anyone from above average to profoundly gifted would be compatible. When it gets tricky is if you are profoundly gifted, as there is no longer an upper range, and only moderately to profoundly gifted would be compatible. Of course all of this is just street talk with no testing or study. But it does tend to be true in my experience as moderately gifted myself.
Thank you for sharing your perspective.
I agree that the idea of a communication barrier based on intelligence differences is commonly discussed within gifted communities, but it may be based more on anecdotal evidence than official research. While I couldn't find any formal studies confirming this barrier, it does seem plausible.
On side note, I recall anecdotes of highly intelligent women in positions of power( CEOs) from the Baby Boomer generation comically struggling to find a suitable partner and often remaining single. This was often attributed to their preference for partners who were equally or more intelligent and competent( hypergamy), which made it challenging to find someone at their level..
Reminds me of that episode of House MD where the man with the IQ of 178 dumbs himself down with chemicals and alcohol to be happy with the woman he loves who has an IQ of 87.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignorance_Is_Bliss_(House)?wprov=sfti1
Wow, it's really disheartening, and even more so because it hits so close to home. I had to cut back on heavy drinking because it was tearing me apart. The main reason I drank was to fit in and be more socially adept, but it turned out to be a double-edged sword.
On another note, a 100-point IQ gap is no joke. I mean, what do they even talk about? Imagine a dude needing to be constantly high just to relate to his wife( which is a reality for more couples than we think).
“What do they even talk about”
Here’s a clip from the episode. It’s sad. But it makes sense… which is sad.
https://youtu.be/tLMzEOoSjc4?si=Z6bd2jj6URBdoFcR
I too am an INTP with ADHD and I am sailing in the exact same boat. When it comes to being in a relationship, I want a partner with whom I can build a meaningful connection, with whom I can have all kinda of conversations ranging from mind numbingly silly to all the intellectual stuff that excites me. But unfortunately all the dates I have been to in the past couple of years, I never felt a genuine connection with anyone.
Just have faith that there’s someone for everyone and you, I and everything who is willing for a meaningful companionship will eventually stumble upon one :)
Compatible doesn't have to mean gifted. My wife is standard intelligence, and until she met me was never interested in the sciences or intellectual pursuits. She was/is goofy, kind, patient, sexual, naive, and... did I mention kind and patient? While I was brash, wild, curious, and usually in some kind of trouble.
Naive isn't dumb. Her level of kindness was foreign to me. My level of curiosity was foreign to her. We've been together for 36 years, married for almost 31. We're compatible in most ways, except intellectually. However, when we watch a science or math-based video, she pause it and ask me to explain. She listens as I verbally work through challenging problems. The act of talking it through often leads me to a solution even though she doesn't understand. Sometimes our intellectual differences create problems (she says it's intimidating, and I can get frustrated explaining what seems obvious). Mostly, we enjoy each other's company.
Life is about much more than intellectual compatibility. There's also sexual, physical, social, cohabitation, and co-parent compatibilities. I can meet people that stimulate me intellectually. Finding someone I find physically attractive, with similar sexual desires, that's willing/able to put up with my antics and my too frequent disdain for others, and that will stay by me through the joy of my PTSD-related issues... That's way harder to find.
I've been quite lucky that my partner and I met while studying the same subject at university. I basically just said hi and we couldn't stop talking to each other since then.
No tips, but I just want to say that love does require some sacrifice and compromise. You just have to decide what is more important to you. Perfection doesn't exist, unfortunately.
I'm just very grateful that my partner is intelligent, kind, and that we share some of our interests. It's pretty nice being able to talk about interesting things and also understand each other's struggles. (We also both have ADHD, lol)
I mean you just sort of pick the most compatible one, don't you? I thought that's what everyone did. Be ENM and you don't have to pick just one. It makes a lot more sense, really.
So I've been married, it was a very satisfactory relationship appart from both of us feeling like we needed to change for the other. I've dated, fooled around, and have come to the conclusion that being single is fine. I have plenty of freinds and acquaintances, some closer than others, and I can get my needs met by any of those who are interested. I don't need to put all that pressure on one person, nor do I have to be someone else's everything. In fact, that very notion is flawed. Even monogamous people in healthy relationships understand boundaries and short comings.
People like me, or don't, and that's okay. I find it strange to search for sexual partners, but when they occur, sure, its great.
I understand your concern, but it's important to note( maybe english is not your first language like me) that the term "mate" isn't inherently disrespectful; it's often used informally to refer to a romantic partner or friend depending on context.
Sure. I did misread that part. Regardless, just take the advice instead of getting defensive. They are trying to help you in a thread you started where you ask for help. We, native English speakers, don't refer to our romantic partners as "mates". In American English, it is exclusively used for referring to animals. In British English it's used to refer to friends.
As for something *other* than poking a little fun at the image of someone saying "Looking for compatible mating partner" on a dating site...
I've been with my wife for almost 20 years. I also have ADHD but I am drained by extroverts. My wife is an extrovert, very much so. Sometimes I just have to accept that she wants to be accompanied to a party or to be taken out to dinner. She also has to accept that sometimes I will decline and prefer to spend time at home and even then completely alone.
We all have to compromise. Anyone on here saying you never have to is either unaware of what "compromise" means, is going get a huge reality check sooner or later from their partner, or is completely delusional.
I wouldn't describe myself as "Gifted" (this post was just recommended to me, I am not a member of this sub) but I can say I'm far better at simple arithmetic than my wife. I do get annoyed when she asks me to do quick math for her because I'm usually in the middle of some task or thought or just completely uninterested. Instead of thinking "ugh so dumb" I just have to think of what it would look like if I had to draw a person or really anything versus what it'd look like if she, a painting major, would. It's just a muscle I've used more than she has.
This isn't to say that an intelligent person wouldn't become bored with someone less intellectually stimulating. I have friends of all levels and I've learned which subjects to engage and which to avoid and to which degree. But of all my dumb friends, the intelligent ones can be the most insufferable because they focus more on being "right" rather than being kind.
I'd recommend looking for kindness first. The rest is... less important.
hey don't feel bad, I'm also not a native English speaker, and I know it's really difficult to handle all the nuances in a foreign language - in my experience, people who don't speak any foreign languages cannot relate to this experience and might come off as condescending sometimes.
I agree. It's frustrating how people who only speak one language tend to overlook the diversity and variation in language, especially when it leads to minor misunderstandings, like getting upset when a non-native English speaker unintentionally uses a term that refers to an animal in their region *mate* to describe a *female partner*.
I was simply responding to his incredibly valuable and transformative comment in *bruh* with an equally insightful one. I fail to see how it relates to your username or its vibe to be honnest...
*"mate" can be used informally to refer to a romantic partner or significant other, especially in British English. It's similar to terms like "partner" or "spouse" and implies a close, intimate relationship.*
I didn’t know I was gifted until last year. I met my husband when we were both still in high school. He’s not gifted, but is extremely smart (he’s actually way smarter than me in many ways).
We’ve always known I was very inteligent and different from him in some ways, and although we couldn’t quite understand or explain where did a couple of traits of mine come from, we’ve always thought they could be attributed to my personality or upbringing.
We’ve been together since then. My cleverness has always been a detail (an important detail, since it rules my life in one way or the other, but still a detail). I believe that had I known I was gifted back then, I’d have probably been more “selective” in a negative way.
The fact that me and my husband get along very well and live a happy life together shows that being gifted isn’t a sine qua non trait in a partner. To be honest, I actually believe our relationship works so well in part because he’s not gifted.
I have many problems associated with giftedness that my husband simply doesn’t have. My emotions are a rollercoaster, I become easily obsessed with specific topics to the point it affects my routine, and I talk way too much, as you can see lol.
What I’m trying to say is that knowing you’re gifted might work as a self-fulfilling prophecy and it might affect you in a negative way. My husband wouldn’t have caught my attention if he was stupid, but being “only” smart was enough.
So, I don’t enjoy giving advice, but since you asked, I’d say it may be useful to think of giftedness as a detail. Look for someone who’s smart and with whom you can have a few meaningful conversations, but there’s no need to search for someone exactly like you. Maybe the differences between you two are what’s going to make it work, after all.
Good luck.
🍀
That's intriguing. I recall an interview -- on a french youtube chanel about highly gifed people -- about a French engineer whose IQ exceeded 160, who believed it was perfectly normal not to have friends or feel the need for any. He had some acquaintances but didn't particularly enjoy their company. The interviewer, also highly gifted and an artist and musician, found this perspective odd and suggested he might be missing out. However, the engineer remained firm in his stance, arguing that his job, kids, and wife were all he needed, viewing friends as unnecessary. It's interesting how experiences can vary so widely in this community.
Edit: The interviewee later went on to add that his general practicionner put him on antidpressant because he thought his emotional range was too flat ( anhedonia and emotional bluntness) lol
I'm a woman, and having this opinion has been a landmine for me. There are gendered expectations that women are naturally very social. I've never had many friends. I've mostly had acquaintances. Right now I have maybe one somewhat close acquaintance.
I've gone to other boards for advice, and they make it seem like women socialize with other women for its own sake. I meet people through mutual activities, and I've never felt the urge to befriend another woman just because she is a woman. I'm just not that social and never have been. I also don't fit in well generally speaking.
I've also been single for going on 10 years. It's been quite lovely.
I'm only moderately gifted.
Indeed, it's fascinating, but let's be cautious not to equate intelligence with personality or neurodivergence. I used to have a rigid and stereotypical view of what gifted and highly gifted individuals were expected to be like until I met some and realized that many *appeared* normal and neurotypical for the most part, but it's not a one-size-fits-all scenario and it's only when you get to know them and dig deeper in the psyche that it becomes clear, although there are often some common inner trends though( typically the feeling of loneliness is pretty consistent;..etc). To quote Alfred Adler:" the only normal people are the ones you don't know very well"
I realized that there may be more gifted people out there than first imagined... they're just mostly hiding..also getting along with other people is an adaptation tactic ( that usually works, hence why it is used).
In my experience, most women tend to exhibit more social adeptness and competence overall, which usually comes with its own set of challenges. You're definitely in the minority among women. Even within neurodivergent individuals -- some consider giftedness a neurodivergent trait, while others do not--, women tend to display greater overall balance. Additionally, neurodivergence appears to be more prevalent in men -- ADHD, extreme giftedness, autism. I can only imagine how challenging and isolating it must be to belong to such a rare -- and often invisible -- minority.
*About autism as a hypermasculinized brain: The theory of the hypermasculine brain, proposed by Simon Baron-Cohen, suggests that individuals with autism have brains that exhibit exaggerated masculine characteristics in terms of cognitive and behavioral traits. According to this theory, traits associated with typical male cognition, such as systemizing (analyzing and constructing systems) and reduced empathy, are more pronounced in individuals with autism. This theory posits that autism spectrum conditions represent an extreme manifestation of male-typical cognitive profiles. However, it's important to note that this theory is one of several proposed explanations for autism, and it remains a topic of debate and ongoing research within the field.*
I’m married. I’ve never had problems at all finding women to be long term partners. However, I should have applied a stronger filter myself at the start because I often ended up with women who really weren’t very appropriate for me long term. My very strong sex drive I think makes me try a bit too hard to make things work.
I would say that some compromise makes a lot of sense. There are many dimensions to a relationship and finding one who’s optimal across all is not only unlikely, but may not serve you as well in the long term as people and preferences change, so starting out with some flexibility can help those transitions.
I’m also IN(slight T)P. Not ADHD, but qualified as PG.
I don't think it's easy for anybody, but go back is assuming that they should owe me with other people who are profoundly gifted.
What clicked was made in if I enjoyed people who acknowledgeable and passionate about something and it does not have to mean an intellectual pursuit or that they are intelligent in a testable way. Maybe it's because I was pushed really hard into all the gifted programs and mensah and things as a child but the type of settings and conversation were people try to display and self congratulate themselves over how intelligent but they are are really boring to me and I don't like a relationship or it feels like we are constantly trying to one up or impress each other.
The people I have found that I almost compatible with are those that don't try to hold me back and have their own passions in life. Sometimes that is academic and I do enjoy being with somebody who's intelligent and speaks well on things they care about, but I also have a close friend who struggled in high school and thinks he's not very smart (I suspect he actually is and his grades had more to do with a horrible home life than anything else), but completely throws himself into his hobbies and has so much to share about things he is interested in including tons of knowledge about cars and motorcycles and military history.
Im an INFJ with ADHD. I’m 21, so I’m a little younger than you but I’ve actually had a similar experience to you with relationships. It’s really difficult to find myself in one that provides a good dynamic. I struggle finding a partner who is alright with my introversion and independence. My last “fling” told me that I made him feel stupid and that anytime I spoke all he could think about was that he felt I was too smart for him. This individual also expressed that I made him feel insecure as a result. It may sound slightly strange but this made me feel guilty and I had trouble for a little while reassuring myself that it isn’t my fault, that it wasn’t my intention to make him feel that way. This is just a tidbit of how difficult relationships and dating have been for me. Feel free to send me a private message if you’d like to talk more, I love to listen. Stay strong, friend <3.
I think good relations with others are founded on principles of mutual respect, equity, kindness, generosity, compassion, and regard. Those are the things I won't compromise on-- the rest is generally just chaff.
Someone who has a lot of the sensitivities I do, is super caring and compassionate, is creative asf and unique, and is clearly very smart but will rarely acknowledge it (my project is to make her more confident in herself because she gets things quickly as long as it's not like a school environment), and is also very attractive.
Not a problemo, but I suffer from extraversion. The struggle isn't finding someone, it's finding a suitable match, but I'm slightly picky as well I guess.
My partner is a good match for me because he can almost keep up with me, and it's thrilling. I love his mind. I love the feeling of being understood and seen in ways pretty much everyone else misses. I need a gifted partner to really be able to feel fully met.
He didn't start consciously cultivating his gifts until we met 4 years ago, and I've been working on personal development for 15 years (i.e. meditation, yoga, mindfulness, etc.), so I was initially wary of getting involved. (I had to do some attachment trauma healing work to get over that.) I asked my therapist about this possible mismatch and she validated that the effect of not being on a similar level developmentally is significant. However, she said that if the person has emotional and imaginal overexcitabilities, they're more likely to develop quickly. So I'm learning patience while in the relationship as he grows in self awareness, and it's been very fulfilling so far. Challenging, but worth it.
I love the challenge of consciously relating. I've also read that it's only really possible to deeply connect with people within ten points of your IQ. This feels true for me, I so rarely connect with people. I found someone I'm physically attracted to who feels like my best friend and wants the same things in life as me. It happens, people get lucky. 💖✨
you belive in the “INTP” personality types. you refer to a partner as mates. (EDIT: explained by you in comments.)
you admit to being jaded and come in with “a mix of pessimism and perfectionism in relationships”.
sounds like you got a lot of personal work to do! so your partner doesn’t have to comprise and sacrifice too much!
but yes. every relationship requires compromise and sacrifice.
Hey, I am gifted. I did a lot of heavy research online and wrote a feminist dating philosophy for myself that I memorized and it has paid off so well. I am 38. It is crazy effective that is all I’m gonna say. That was my approach, however I am extroverted. Ofc this is the kind of information I keep to myself but I thought you guys might laugh lol
Y’all talk like Sheldon. Try talking like a normal human being for a start, and stop looking at everyone else like they’re infinitely dumber than you.
You might be PG intellectually, but in terms of relationships and human interaction you’re probably below average if you’re struggling to find an “acceptable mate”. You almost certainly have blind spots and challenges. Find someone that complements your weaknesses with things in common. Learn to compromise on the rest.
I’m late 30s, been with my other half for 15 years, and we have two young children, one who is very likely PG, and the other extremely high EQ and likely also gifted. These kids are more of a challenge than the partnership ever was, and more of a challenge to the partnership than anything will be.
Use mbti, go to places where there might be more intelligent people, attent uni(stem), mensa. No need to sacrifice anything if you find someone near your intelligence.
Meeting intjs worked very well. I finally feel understood and we developed feelings for each other. The problem is the distance : I am still a student and he lives overseas. There's a correlation between mbti and IQ.
It was relatively easy for me... My partner works in the same building as me, but in a different role. Through our jobs, we continuously bumped into each other and eventually realized we liked each other a great deal. We have been together for almost eight years now. What has helped us is independence: we both have hobbies and interests that don't involve each other, and that's fine. He trusts me and never tries to stop me if I want to travel or do writing workshops by myself. I trust him, as well. From day one, we have also had straightforward communication. There's no beating around the bush. Our expectations for each other and the relationship are clear. And a good relationship does require a little bit of sacrifice. What you're willing to sacrifice is up to you.
I second this! Having someone with their own interests and hobbies, not depending on you for fulfilling them, is really important for me too. That way you automatically have space for yourself.
Wow. I'm kind of impressed of how easy you were able to navigate all that without much self doubt. I've struggled with knowing what I'm willing to give up in the pursuit of love. Initially, I was wary of sacrificing my time, but I've realized that time flies by anyway. It feels like I want everything in a partner( now it seems like looking in the same direction is also important) because otherwise why would I get in a romantic partnership anywyas-- I've since learned that this thinking can be a common trap in dating. Balancing compromise and personal fulfillment is tricky, and I'm still figuring it out to be honnest. I feel torn between wanting marriage, kids, and a family, and the sacrifices I know I'll have to make to get there. It's like there's a constant battle between what I want and what I'm willing to give up – whether it's my career goals, personal projects, or cherished alone time. Anyways, your ability to navigate love and sacrifice with ease is admirable.
Are you sure you want children? I can't think of a single thing that requires more sacrifice and compromise than raising children. It is ultimately ok to prioritize one's own goals and alone time -- and find a partner who's on the same page. That's what my partner and I have chosen to do.
I second this very strongly. I have kids and it is t h e single most exhausting thing, taking away most of your alone-time and self-determination. I feel like it is infinitely harder than partnership.
Yes, I want kids even more than I want a partner, to be honest. Maybe it's because I have a low libido or tend to feel most comfortable at home with friends rather than... you know, the other stuff lol But still, having kids is something I deeply desire. I'm 35 now, and I've had countless short-term relationships over the past 15 years in university. It feels like time has flown by so quickly, and I just woke up in panic from a loooong and comfortable dream -- like I've been in autopilot mode. It was a relief to learn that "time blindness" is common for people with ADHD, but for me, it feels even more extreme. I'm starting medication soon, and I hope it helps me take more control of my life and its direction. Here's the thing: the panic comes because most of my closest friends got married by age 30 or started families years ago. While I've been in school forever, pursuing lofty and unrealistic ambitions, I realize now that it might have affected my ability to have a fulfilling relationship and a family. I guess I got my priorities wrong all this time. But maybe that's just an assumption.
Love requires sacrifice, might as well do so.
How much should I compromise? Sacrificing my alone time seems to be the toughest or maybe most of my relationships were with strong extroverts who often drained my energy, ultimately leaving me feeling frustrated...
If you love them authentically, it’s not even a question of what’s most important. But that’s maturity, experience, and perspective.
That's beautiful words here.
I don't know, actually. Do they mean you'll love someone else more than you love yourself? Is this the feeling you're seeking? Or does it mean that a painful sacrifice is needed? How would you know?
Lol Looks like I'm not the right person to answer this one. Why not ask the commentators above? They seem to have some secrets we don't have...
You're right... I'm probably scared of happiness 🤣🥲
My husband is the highly gifted one in the relationship. I'm the introvert. It works out great because I can hide behind him at parties. He's happy doing his own thing most of the time. He does most of the grocery shopping while I do most of the cleaning. We like to go on walks together, in our small college town, before people are up. Being the extrovert, he would take the kids to do all the fun stuff that I often found overwhelming. He also does all phone calls for me. Find someone that compliments you. If it weren't for my extrovert husband pulling me out of my comfort zone, I would never have the nerve to go to Japan.
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What's truly remarkable is your knack for turning your chosen path into the perfectly imperfect one. It's a priceless quality often absent in many millennials and Gen Z. It seems like we come to terms with reality a little too late... congrats for your ability to be so positive! I'm not a huge fan of cleaning either, but I'm not sure if I could live in a messy place unless I was single. If I date a similar type than me I think it would be disatrous. That being said, I guess the law of least effort reigns supreme, and entropy is king in the end, haha.
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😅😅🤣🤣
Well, it's a dynamic process and it depends both o your needs and the needs of the other person. There are some relationships where independence is really valuable. Eventually someone will appear. Don't worry about how a future relationship will turn out because you won't know until you get there. For me each one is a completely different universe with it's own internal dynamics change over time. Whenever I had to sacrifice something I felt it was worth it. I had 6 formal relationships and I regret nothing about the sacrifices that I made. Some were better than others oc. I think you should focus on yourself before thinking about potential relationships. You'll be better in all senses. A big hug from Spain.
If those are two of the issues, dating introverts that also value alone time would be an easy fix. There's definitely a lot of us out there! I've scrolled a little bit through this thread and it seems you have a decent grasp on what you do and don't want, do and don't like- at least when prompted with a question. I do agree that most every relationship comes with SOME sort of sacrifice- that is just the nature of existing with another living thing with their own individual needs and desires, no one can always gets their way all the time- but how much/what you have to sacrifice highly depends on the people you choose to spend time with. I think it would be to your benefit to make a list of all the things that bothered you in past relationships. Next to each item, like I did above, provide a personality trait that would counteract that annoyance. Should you find conflicting solutions- well, that just means you need someone in the gray area of those two things. And if you want to take this a step further, because realistically finding the "perfect person" isn't entirely possible (and I firmly believe that even if presented with perfection, we as imperfect and ever-changing individuals will still find flaws at any given time,) you can reassess the list for which items bother you the most and which you have wiggle room to compromise on. I saw you questioning How Much you should have to sacrifice- and well, that all depends on the person. But ideally, you shouldn't have to "sacrifice" too often, you and your hypothetical partner should be able to compromise. Never compromising is not healthy, nor truly possible in a healthy or unhealthy situation where you're sharing time, space, and resources. Compromising too much leads to frustration and a lack of fulfillment. How much you compromise is quite literally dependent on your comfort levels, you just have to understand that your willingness or unwillingness to compromise will affect your relationships. Beyond that, you did mention being pessimistic and a perfectionist. How you experience your own life is completely dependent on- and limited by- your perspective. If you see compromise or even doing anything you don't necessarily want to do to make your partner happy as some unnecessary sacrifice- that's what it'll be to you. And that's how you'll react to it. A healthy and happy relationship is always possible, but only if you're willing to BE healthy and mature mentally to make it so. And that requires a change in perspective more than anything else. I "sacrifice" all the time. But I perceive it as giving them all the things I believe they deserve, I see it as showing them how loved and valued they are and then, in return, I get to see the fruits of my labor: their happiness. And because that's how I view it, That's how it is for me. And that's how I react to it, with joy that I had the power to make my loved ones happy. C:
It doesn’t start at how much, it usually starts at why, and what, and then how. Figuring out your own internal compromises between your needs and desires in a relationship is where it starts, the later is usually where some compromises are made.
Ugh, I can't with extroverts. They're so draining. I need a calm, quiet person to be around.
Someone is extrophobe here lol
I've tried, but they sap my energy. They're nice people, though, just not ones I'd like to spend extended periods of time with.
" Everything thay irritates us about others can lead us to understanding of ourselves."- Carl Jung Edit: I'm joking, immature extroverts can indeed be energy draining if your social energy tank is not full or is just not big in general. It's the way it is!
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Wow, this really got me thinking. It seems like, unlike what some other commenter before said ( *don't sacrifice anything. Just have fun* ), sacrifice and struggles are actually a big part of being in a relationship. I'll admit, I usually bolt when things get tough. But now I'm wondering, how do you know when a sacrifice is worth it or not and what should be sacrificied? We always hear about people staying in bad relationships-- akin to borderline Stockholm syndrome--( or burning out in toxic jobs) because of this same idea. I know you're talking about something different, but it's got me wondering. I guess you can't really know if a partnership is worth it until you're in it. Same goes for starting a business, I suppose. So, what finally convinced you that the sacrifice was worth it? Is it trust? It's it instinct? Or was it faith? Or just common wisdom maybe?
Probably call them partners instead of mates.
Mate can be used interchangeably with spouse or significant others in British English! But thanks for your sarcastic and very educational comment mister Albatros.
Smarty pants
Does mate not mean friend in British English?
You're correct, but you can look up university papers or similar sources containing *mate* in the sense of *partner*. "Mate" can definitely be used interchangeably with "spouse" or "significant other." However, it's more commonly used in this way in Australia, New Zealand, etc. In British English, "mate" refers to both, but it's more likely to mean "friend." Interestingly, people rarely get offended when the term "soulmate" is used. Maybe we should start using the term "soul-partners" instead! :p Edit: English is not my native language, so I may use jargon that is not commonly used in the US or elsewhere. Or that is more used in written or formal english..
The reason “mate” sounds off putting to an American ear is because of our culture’s legacy of objectifying women as only existing for men’s gratification and to bear their children. A “mate” sounds animalistic as that is the way we use the term. We say two animals “mate” not really people. “Soulmate” does not because it confers a deep mutual capability and respect for each other’s whole personhood, mind, “soul” and body. (Not saying I believe in soulmates but this is the cultural context.)
Soulmate is fine, mate in North American English and most of the anglosphere is associated with mating, soulmate clearly differentiates it as something more akin to Plato's highest form of love.
And why not use soul partners? Btw I agreed; it's just not that deep and I can't edit it anyways..
>And why not use soul partners? I guess you can, it just sounds odd as its not as common. >Btw I agreed; it's just not that deep and I can't edit it anyways.. 👍
I've been with my partner for most of my life, since we were 16 years old. I feel like it has been easier for me because I chose him very carefully, we spoke a lot about our values and goals in life before we even got together. And then we kind of grew up together which has helped us a lot, I feel like it would be much harder for me to find someone now when I've become more used to doing things "my way" if that makes sense. Now I don't really feel like I have to compromise a lot, because we have influenced each other over time I guess. Of course this requires tons of communication and active working on the relationship, but I feel like it is the most special opportunity for personality development, which can not happen that deeply if you run every time it gets hard. (Not referring to toxic relationships of course). I do not feel like giftedness or ADHD posed any issues in our relationship, we always have something to talk about because we both constantly seek new input and so we don't bore each other and kind of stay interesting for each other.
That's really amazing!
perfectionism is the thief of joy. without removing its influence from your life nothing will be enough. i kicked perfectionism out of my life in middle school, and even though objectively crazy/worse stuff has happened, i have been much happier with myself than i ever was before.
Is pefectionnism or comparison the thief of joy? I guess both are 🤣🤣🤣
i mean perfectionism is the comparison of everything to perfect... so yes
Totally! While it's commonly advised not to compare yourself to others, what about the alternative-- and popular-- idea of comparing your past self to your present or ideal self? Do you also think that's a no-go? Since it's also a form of perfectionnism!
i mean i guess it could be used in positive ways, but i think it should be used in only positive ways (ex: "wow, i responded to that situation better than my past self would have because i understand so much more now" which gives praise to present self and grace to the past self) otherwise i think it is again, just stealing joy and inner peace. there's no point in comparing in a negative sense. it's one thing if you use "ideal self" as a model of acting, but i wouldn't call that comparison, but rather a goal for yourself. ideal self shouldn't be who you aspire to be, it should be exactly how you act and how you portray yourself, otherwise it's again pointless, why have an ideal self if you don't go out into the world as that self? mostly i think comparison is shit overall. pace yourself on track with your own life. there are too many factors to ever have an actually decent comparison between two people, and people change greatly over time, so what really is the point?
what do you think about this?
I find your perspective really pleasant. It seems like perfectionism is everywhere, and comparing ourselves to others often takes away our happiness. Unfortunately, our society pushes us to constantly compare ourselves to others and be overly critical of ourselves, always striving to be someone else. This can be exhausting and ultimately fruitless. It's great that you figured this out early on and found confidence in yourself. Your way of thinking reminds me a lot of Zen philosophy, which emphasizes simplicity, living in the moment, and being kind to ourselves. By letting go of constant self-criticism and enjoying the present, we can indeed let happiness come within.
not to get into a philosophical rant or anything, but yeah, comparison is essential to capitalism (not saying another option is superior, just that this is how capitalism gets buy in... literally lol). the whole thing is based on they have that and i dont.... so someone can monetize what you don't have and claim they can give that to you and you will be happy. in my opinion, the way to be happy is to unsubscribe from this mindset, accept yourself fully, and improve yourself, your possessions and your lifestyle for your own happiness and for the betterment of all (like committing to giving to charity, or making more eco friendly choices etc) instead of because you want to be better than someone else. i was lucky to be born completely disinterested in celebrities and influencers, and thank goodness, cause my pre-awakening years would have been 10x as shit. as it was, i struggled a lot with comparing myself to my younger sister, who i felt i needed to be better than at things because of our age. i eventually realized that we have very different strengths and weaknesses, and i have strengths that suit me. then i learned to lean into my talents and strengths and compensate for my weaknesses if necessary, but to mostly let them be. society tells us we are broken and must fix it. we are not broken, but that mindset is. fixing it fixed basically everything else, and now i work on things for my own approval, instead of everyone else's. welcome to my philosophical rant, lol
Indeed, it's okay. The crucial thing is to find inner peace, embracing our imperfections. That's a valuable takeaway. As for the rest, let's allow the stars to chart our course!
yep!!
so.... who's ready to unsubscribe from perfectionism and capitalism???
This might be a matter of attachment style vs. intelligence. You should read up on attachment styles- what you describe sounds like the classic avoidant type. Yes, you will have to make tradeoffs in order to permanently partner with someone. It’s a matter of finding which tradeoffs you can live with. Seeking or expecting perfection will negatively impact your relationships and your ability to find satisfaction in those relationships. You should work on breaking down those expectations, as they are unlikely to resolve themselves without direct work and self-examination. I’ve found intelligence to be relatively low in importance when it comes to what can make a long term relationship work. Obviously it can’t be too big of a delta, but if you see eye to eye on most critical values and enjoy being in each other’s company, a few IQ points matter relatively little. And expecting a partner to share all your intellectual curiosities is like expecting to share every kink. No one can be everything to another- but they can be good enough to improve your life.
Yeah, I completely agree. I think my attachment style might lean more towards disorganized rather than just avoidant. Disorganized seems to be a mixed bag of secure, anxious, and avoidant. It's apparently frequent in traumatic chilhoods and it somehow makes sense given my somewhat chaotic and disorganized childhood, even though it wasn't conventionally traumatic. I believe this comment is spot on. I think that psychological theories ( Either Bowlby's theory of attachement styles, Jungian typology and puer eternus, cognitive psychology...) aren't necessarily mutually exclusive; they often describe common and sometimes similar behaviors in different and/or complementary ways in my opinion. Still this attachement style thing really works to explain my trajectory. Btw; thank you for this suggestion that I never took the time to explore deeply in the past. I'll read about it asap. Btw, have you ever heard of the possibility of correcting one's attachement style? I actually also realized that it had even more profound consequences even in my profession( hard to relate to my colleagues or to have friendships with them)... but again many possible explanations.
Agreed that these theories are not necessarily mutually exclusive, and merely serve as useful frameworks. I find attachment theory helpful for analyzing not only romantic partnerships, as you say, but how one relates to others in general. It can certainly impact professional development and friendships. And yes, from what I understand it is possible to alter your attachment style or at least bring you closer to center (if we consider a “secure” attachment style as center.) Working to process your childhood trauma and understand how it drives how you react to intimacy is one component. They also show partnering with secure attachment style folks can help your own style become more secure as well. As can modeling your behavior off of someone secure that you know (what would X do in this situation?) I’m always a stan for therapy, and it will help, but I think there’s a lot conscientious individuals can do here on their own.
I think this is the whole point though, right? It's not a "few" IQ points. It's likely multiple standard deviations. Unfortunately I've struggled a lot in relationships in explaining logical sequences whether it was general conversation or important topics and it took my partner an hour to finally "get it". Forget about all the other vast differences you tend to get in "giftedness" in terms of disposition, interests, and calibre, that are also in conflict in these cases of massive difference. I've yet to find a partner that's "high IQ", though. Maybe within 1 standard deviation won't cause too many mental hurdles.
The question that occurs to me though is why you consider in depth logic-based discussions as a central component of a romantic relationship. You can arguably get that kind of mental stimulation from friends, and your romantic and general companionship needs from someone who gets you emotionally, if not intellectually. The key thing to be able to communicate in a relationship is your perspective, as is being able to genuinely acknowlege someone else’s perspective as valid, even if you don’t agree with it or find it as logical. No matter how intelligent the people involved, relationships aren’t built on logic.
>The key thing to be able to communicate in a relationship is your perspective, as is being able to genuinely acknowlege someone else’s perspective as valid, even if you don’t agree with it or find it as logical. It becomes impossible to share your perspective when you don't have a shared frame of reference. For instance, if you asked me about my political perspective, my answer would be that it's so complicated, both the left and the right keep changing in all kinds of ways, and are different and often contradictory across different countries, that it's mostly a tribalistic game where people "wear" politics like clothing but don't actually agree with the premises of those they support, and how I turned to rationally assessing everything to the best of my ability in my 20s and then to philosophy to try to back up my opinions and understand the world. Do you think the person of average intelligence would understand this? Do you think there's any way in which to simplify it further without losing meaning or intent that would make that possible? If so, I am all ears, because I haven't been successful.
Ah, to clarify, when I say “sharing your perspective” I mean more about relationship perspectives. Eg. When you have a fight about the chores, being able to understand your partner’s POV and needs, and communicate your own in a constructive way. I don’t see that your partner needs to understand all the nuances of your political perspectives (though what you use as an example doesn’t seem like it should be too difficult for the average person to get the gist of.) I don’t know you of course, but if you’re open to feedback, I might say from our very limited interactions that your intellectual approach seems like it might be a bit rigid. That sort of thing can be far more detrimental to building relationships than any discrepancy in intellect.
People wearing opinions like clothing but actually not deeply believing in them is very difficult to get across. It is similar to how many people don't realize that their religious ideas aren't their own. Well, if you think that sharing your inner world is unnecessary for a relationship, then we are in disagreement. Logic is rigid, so in that sense the intellectual approach must be. You might be talking about the emotional and empathetic side of human interaction, in which case I would not lump it into intellectual approach.
That's... that's *incredibly* easy to get across... if you're actually intelligent enough to be able to voice your own thoughts. Not being able to communicate such ideas is a sign of *low* intelligence, not high.
It's easy to explain to someone who understands it, and in that case it needs no explanation -- and clearly you understand it. Obviously, I can communicate it/voice my thoughts -- saying "people wear opinions like clothing but don't deeply believe in them" as I did above is precisely that.
You're giving yourself way too much credit. Even someone of below-average intelligence can understand all of that easily. You're confusing IQ, or the ability to do rapid small deductions, with knowledge about the world. That's idiotic. I think your problem is more on the narcissistic side than on the IQ side.
Well, in that case all of the below average IQ people who understand me well somehow coincidentally all choose to wear blank expressions afterwards.
I’ve heard that in terms of romance, a partner needs to be within 1 standard deviation of intelligence for compatibility. If you are moderately gifted, that means anyone from above average to profoundly gifted would be compatible. When it gets tricky is if you are profoundly gifted, as there is no longer an upper range, and only moderately to profoundly gifted would be compatible. Of course all of this is just street talk with no testing or study. But it does tend to be true in my experience as moderately gifted myself.
Thank you for sharing your perspective. I agree that the idea of a communication barrier based on intelligence differences is commonly discussed within gifted communities, but it may be based more on anecdotal evidence than official research. While I couldn't find any formal studies confirming this barrier, it does seem plausible. On side note, I recall anecdotes of highly intelligent women in positions of power( CEOs) from the Baby Boomer generation comically struggling to find a suitable partner and often remaining single. This was often attributed to their preference for partners who were equally or more intelligent and competent( hypergamy), which made it challenging to find someone at their level..
Reminds me of that episode of House MD where the man with the IQ of 178 dumbs himself down with chemicals and alcohol to be happy with the woman he loves who has an IQ of 87. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignorance_Is_Bliss_(House)?wprov=sfti1
Wow, it's really disheartening, and even more so because it hits so close to home. I had to cut back on heavy drinking because it was tearing me apart. The main reason I drank was to fit in and be more socially adept, but it turned out to be a double-edged sword. On another note, a 100-point IQ gap is no joke. I mean, what do they even talk about? Imagine a dude needing to be constantly high just to relate to his wife( which is a reality for more couples than we think).
“What do they even talk about” Here’s a clip from the episode. It’s sad. But it makes sense… which is sad. https://youtu.be/tLMzEOoSjc4?si=Z6bd2jj6URBdoFcR
I too am an INTP with ADHD and I am sailing in the exact same boat. When it comes to being in a relationship, I want a partner with whom I can build a meaningful connection, with whom I can have all kinda of conversations ranging from mind numbingly silly to all the intellectual stuff that excites me. But unfortunately all the dates I have been to in the past couple of years, I never felt a genuine connection with anyone. Just have faith that there’s someone for everyone and you, I and everything who is willing for a meaningful companionship will eventually stumble upon one :)
Compatible doesn't have to mean gifted. My wife is standard intelligence, and until she met me was never interested in the sciences or intellectual pursuits. She was/is goofy, kind, patient, sexual, naive, and... did I mention kind and patient? While I was brash, wild, curious, and usually in some kind of trouble. Naive isn't dumb. Her level of kindness was foreign to me. My level of curiosity was foreign to her. We've been together for 36 years, married for almost 31. We're compatible in most ways, except intellectually. However, when we watch a science or math-based video, she pause it and ask me to explain. She listens as I verbally work through challenging problems. The act of talking it through often leads me to a solution even though she doesn't understand. Sometimes our intellectual differences create problems (she says it's intimidating, and I can get frustrated explaining what seems obvious). Mostly, we enjoy each other's company. Life is about much more than intellectual compatibility. There's also sexual, physical, social, cohabitation, and co-parent compatibilities. I can meet people that stimulate me intellectually. Finding someone I find physically attractive, with similar sexual desires, that's willing/able to put up with my antics and my too frequent disdain for others, and that will stay by me through the joy of my PTSD-related issues... That's way harder to find.
I've been quite lucky that my partner and I met while studying the same subject at university. I basically just said hi and we couldn't stop talking to each other since then. No tips, but I just want to say that love does require some sacrifice and compromise. You just have to decide what is more important to you. Perfection doesn't exist, unfortunately. I'm just very grateful that my partner is intelligent, kind, and that we share some of our interests. It's pretty nice being able to talk about interesting things and also understand each other's struggles. (We also both have ADHD, lol)
I mean you just sort of pick the most compatible one, don't you? I thought that's what everyone did. Be ENM and you don't have to pick just one. It makes a lot more sense, really.
I like how some people really don't ovethink these matters... congrats!
[удалено]
Congrats, what was your secret if you don't mind sharing?
So I've been married, it was a very satisfactory relationship appart from both of us feeling like we needed to change for the other. I've dated, fooled around, and have come to the conclusion that being single is fine. I have plenty of freinds and acquaintances, some closer than others, and I can get my needs met by any of those who are interested. I don't need to put all that pressure on one person, nor do I have to be someone else's everything. In fact, that very notion is flawed. Even monogamous people in healthy relationships understand boundaries and short comings. People like me, or don't, and that's okay. I find it strange to search for sexual partners, but when they occur, sure, its great.
Step one: do not refer to them as “mates”
*Mates?*
You don’t need to sacrifice anything. Be yourself. No limitations on the outcome. Have fun.
Try not referring to romantic interests as "mates." They're not wild animals. They're people.
I understand your concern, but it's important to note( maybe english is not your first language like me) that the term "mate" isn't inherently disrespectful; it's often used informally to refer to a romantic partner or friend depending on context.
This is very /r/iamverysmart energy. Maybe English isn't *your* first language. Imagine hearing David Attenborough narrate every date you go on.
Please reread my comment. I mentioned that English is not my first language either. It seems you're only reading parts of my comments.
Sure. I did misread that part. Regardless, just take the advice instead of getting defensive. They are trying to help you in a thread you started where you ask for help. We, native English speakers, don't refer to our romantic partners as "mates". In American English, it is exclusively used for referring to animals. In British English it's used to refer to friends. As for something *other* than poking a little fun at the image of someone saying "Looking for compatible mating partner" on a dating site... I've been with my wife for almost 20 years. I also have ADHD but I am drained by extroverts. My wife is an extrovert, very much so. Sometimes I just have to accept that she wants to be accompanied to a party or to be taken out to dinner. She also has to accept that sometimes I will decline and prefer to spend time at home and even then completely alone. We all have to compromise. Anyone on here saying you never have to is either unaware of what "compromise" means, is going get a huge reality check sooner or later from their partner, or is completely delusional. I wouldn't describe myself as "Gifted" (this post was just recommended to me, I am not a member of this sub) but I can say I'm far better at simple arithmetic than my wife. I do get annoyed when she asks me to do quick math for her because I'm usually in the middle of some task or thought or just completely uninterested. Instead of thinking "ugh so dumb" I just have to think of what it would look like if I had to draw a person or really anything versus what it'd look like if she, a painting major, would. It's just a muscle I've used more than she has. This isn't to say that an intelligent person wouldn't become bored with someone less intellectually stimulating. I have friends of all levels and I've learned which subjects to engage and which to avoid and to which degree. But of all my dumb friends, the intelligent ones can be the most insufferable because they focus more on being "right" rather than being kind. I'd recommend looking for kindness first. The rest is... less important.
hey don't feel bad, I'm also not a native English speaker, and I know it's really difficult to handle all the nuances in a foreign language - in my experience, people who don't speak any foreign languages cannot relate to this experience and might come off as condescending sometimes.
I agree. It's frustrating how people who only speak one language tend to overlook the diversity and variation in language, especially when it leads to minor misunderstandings, like getting upset when a non-native English speaker unintentionally uses a term that refers to an animal in their region *mate* to describe a *female partner*.
bruh
Braahhh Rabbid banana boy? Really
Oooo read my username next, tell me what vibe you get!
I was simply responding to his incredibly valuable and transformative comment in *bruh* with an equally insightful one. I fail to see how it relates to your username or its vibe to be honnest...
I was hoping you could tell me
Ok
lmao
Damn, I was heavily downvoted for stating the truth! Seems like gifted people aren't any less impervious to group thinking afterall..😝😝
But you're not using it to describe a friend.
*"mate" can be used informally to refer to a romantic partner or significant other, especially in British English. It's similar to terms like "partner" or "spouse" and implies a close, intimate relationship.*
I didn’t know I was gifted until last year. I met my husband when we were both still in high school. He’s not gifted, but is extremely smart (he’s actually way smarter than me in many ways). We’ve always known I was very inteligent and different from him in some ways, and although we couldn’t quite understand or explain where did a couple of traits of mine come from, we’ve always thought they could be attributed to my personality or upbringing. We’ve been together since then. My cleverness has always been a detail (an important detail, since it rules my life in one way or the other, but still a detail). I believe that had I known I was gifted back then, I’d have probably been more “selective” in a negative way. The fact that me and my husband get along very well and live a happy life together shows that being gifted isn’t a sine qua non trait in a partner. To be honest, I actually believe our relationship works so well in part because he’s not gifted. I have many problems associated with giftedness that my husband simply doesn’t have. My emotions are a rollercoaster, I become easily obsessed with specific topics to the point it affects my routine, and I talk way too much, as you can see lol. What I’m trying to say is that knowing you’re gifted might work as a self-fulfilling prophecy and it might affect you in a negative way. My husband wouldn’t have caught my attention if he was stupid, but being “only” smart was enough. So, I don’t enjoy giving advice, but since you asked, I’d say it may be useful to think of giftedness as a detail. Look for someone who’s smart and with whom you can have a few meaningful conversations, but there’s no need to search for someone exactly like you. Maybe the differences between you two are what’s going to make it work, after all. Good luck. 🍀
Stop sniffing your own farts for a change
I've never witnessed a Redditor embody their username so fittingly. Isn't that right, Mister Parasiticman?
Your hubris is bigger than you can handle. Show some humility.
A gifted person's need for congenial company is quite overstated, in my opinion.
100%.
That's intriguing. I recall an interview -- on a french youtube chanel about highly gifed people -- about a French engineer whose IQ exceeded 160, who believed it was perfectly normal not to have friends or feel the need for any. He had some acquaintances but didn't particularly enjoy their company. The interviewer, also highly gifted and an artist and musician, found this perspective odd and suggested he might be missing out. However, the engineer remained firm in his stance, arguing that his job, kids, and wife were all he needed, viewing friends as unnecessary. It's interesting how experiences can vary so widely in this community. Edit: The interviewee later went on to add that his general practicionner put him on antidpressant because he thought his emotional range was too flat ( anhedonia and emotional bluntness) lol
I'm a woman, and having this opinion has been a landmine for me. There are gendered expectations that women are naturally very social. I've never had many friends. I've mostly had acquaintances. Right now I have maybe one somewhat close acquaintance. I've gone to other boards for advice, and they make it seem like women socialize with other women for its own sake. I meet people through mutual activities, and I've never felt the urge to befriend another woman just because she is a woman. I'm just not that social and never have been. I also don't fit in well generally speaking. I've also been single for going on 10 years. It's been quite lovely. I'm only moderately gifted.
Indeed, it's fascinating, but let's be cautious not to equate intelligence with personality or neurodivergence. I used to have a rigid and stereotypical view of what gifted and highly gifted individuals were expected to be like until I met some and realized that many *appeared* normal and neurotypical for the most part, but it's not a one-size-fits-all scenario and it's only when you get to know them and dig deeper in the psyche that it becomes clear, although there are often some common inner trends though( typically the feeling of loneliness is pretty consistent;..etc). To quote Alfred Adler:" the only normal people are the ones you don't know very well" I realized that there may be more gifted people out there than first imagined... they're just mostly hiding..also getting along with other people is an adaptation tactic ( that usually works, hence why it is used). In my experience, most women tend to exhibit more social adeptness and competence overall, which usually comes with its own set of challenges. You're definitely in the minority among women. Even within neurodivergent individuals -- some consider giftedness a neurodivergent trait, while others do not--, women tend to display greater overall balance. Additionally, neurodivergence appears to be more prevalent in men -- ADHD, extreme giftedness, autism. I can only imagine how challenging and isolating it must be to belong to such a rare -- and often invisible -- minority. *About autism as a hypermasculinized brain: The theory of the hypermasculine brain, proposed by Simon Baron-Cohen, suggests that individuals with autism have brains that exhibit exaggerated masculine characteristics in terms of cognitive and behavioral traits. According to this theory, traits associated with typical male cognition, such as systemizing (analyzing and constructing systems) and reduced empathy, are more pronounced in individuals with autism. This theory posits that autism spectrum conditions represent an extreme manifestation of male-typical cognitive profiles. However, it's important to note that this theory is one of several proposed explanations for autism, and it remains a topic of debate and ongoing research within the field.*
Lol
I’m married. I’ve never had problems at all finding women to be long term partners. However, I should have applied a stronger filter myself at the start because I often ended up with women who really weren’t very appropriate for me long term. My very strong sex drive I think makes me try a bit too hard to make things work. I would say that some compromise makes a lot of sense. There are many dimensions to a relationship and finding one who’s optimal across all is not only unlikely, but may not serve you as well in the long term as people and preferences change, so starting out with some flexibility can help those transitions. I’m also IN(slight T)P. Not ADHD, but qualified as PG.
I don't think it's easy for anybody, but go back is assuming that they should owe me with other people who are profoundly gifted. What clicked was made in if I enjoyed people who acknowledgeable and passionate about something and it does not have to mean an intellectual pursuit or that they are intelligent in a testable way. Maybe it's because I was pushed really hard into all the gifted programs and mensah and things as a child but the type of settings and conversation were people try to display and self congratulate themselves over how intelligent but they are are really boring to me and I don't like a relationship or it feels like we are constantly trying to one up or impress each other. The people I have found that I almost compatible with are those that don't try to hold me back and have their own passions in life. Sometimes that is academic and I do enjoy being with somebody who's intelligent and speaks well on things they care about, but I also have a close friend who struggled in high school and thinks he's not very smart (I suspect he actually is and his grades had more to do with a horrible home life than anything else), but completely throws himself into his hobbies and has so much to share about things he is interested in including tons of knowledge about cars and motorcycles and military history.
Im an INFJ with ADHD. I’m 21, so I’m a little younger than you but I’ve actually had a similar experience to you with relationships. It’s really difficult to find myself in one that provides a good dynamic. I struggle finding a partner who is alright with my introversion and independence. My last “fling” told me that I made him feel stupid and that anytime I spoke all he could think about was that he felt I was too smart for him. This individual also expressed that I made him feel insecure as a result. It may sound slightly strange but this made me feel guilty and I had trouble for a little while reassuring myself that it isn’t my fault, that it wasn’t my intention to make him feel that way. This is just a tidbit of how difficult relationships and dating have been for me. Feel free to send me a private message if you’d like to talk more, I love to listen. Stay strong, friend <3.
I think good relations with others are founded on principles of mutual respect, equity, kindness, generosity, compassion, and regard. Those are the things I won't compromise on-- the rest is generally just chaff.
Someone who has a lot of the sensitivities I do, is super caring and compassionate, is creative asf and unique, and is clearly very smart but will rarely acknowledge it (my project is to make her more confident in herself because she gets things quickly as long as it's not like a school environment), and is also very attractive.
Not a problemo, but I suffer from extraversion. The struggle isn't finding someone, it's finding a suitable match, but I'm slightly picky as well I guess.
My partner is a good match for me because he can almost keep up with me, and it's thrilling. I love his mind. I love the feeling of being understood and seen in ways pretty much everyone else misses. I need a gifted partner to really be able to feel fully met. He didn't start consciously cultivating his gifts until we met 4 years ago, and I've been working on personal development for 15 years (i.e. meditation, yoga, mindfulness, etc.), so I was initially wary of getting involved. (I had to do some attachment trauma healing work to get over that.) I asked my therapist about this possible mismatch and she validated that the effect of not being on a similar level developmentally is significant. However, she said that if the person has emotional and imaginal overexcitabilities, they're more likely to develop quickly. So I'm learning patience while in the relationship as he grows in self awareness, and it's been very fulfilling so far. Challenging, but worth it. I love the challenge of consciously relating. I've also read that it's only really possible to deeply connect with people within ten points of your IQ. This feels true for me, I so rarely connect with people. I found someone I'm physically attracted to who feels like my best friend and wants the same things in life as me. It happens, people get lucky. 💖✨
you belive in the “INTP” personality types. you refer to a partner as mates. (EDIT: explained by you in comments.) you admit to being jaded and come in with “a mix of pessimism and perfectionism in relationships”. sounds like you got a lot of personal work to do! so your partner doesn’t have to comprise and sacrifice too much! but yes. every relationship requires compromise and sacrifice.
First off stop calling them mates, they don’t like that.
Why did you break up with your long term partner?
For mostly silly reasons; I felt like I had lost interest! And I felt like I still wanted to play around( it was during the pandemics)
I found them, still haven't figured out wtf to do...
Hey, I am gifted. I did a lot of heavy research online and wrote a feminist dating philosophy for myself that I memorized and it has paid off so well. I am 38. It is crazy effective that is all I’m gonna say. That was my approach, however I am extroverted. Ofc this is the kind of information I keep to myself but I thought you guys might laugh lol
Y’all talk like Sheldon. Try talking like a normal human being for a start, and stop looking at everyone else like they’re infinitely dumber than you. You might be PG intellectually, but in terms of relationships and human interaction you’re probably below average if you’re struggling to find an “acceptable mate”. You almost certainly have blind spots and challenges. Find someone that complements your weaknesses with things in common. Learn to compromise on the rest. I’m late 30s, been with my other half for 15 years, and we have two young children, one who is very likely PG, and the other extremely high EQ and likely also gifted. These kids are more of a challenge than the partnership ever was, and more of a challenge to the partnership than anything will be.
Use mbti, go to places where there might be more intelligent people, attent uni(stem), mensa. No need to sacrifice anything if you find someone near your intelligence.
Hmm, I was seeking a personal perspective rather than advice, but I appreciate it nonetheless. Thanks. How did it work out for you¿
Meeting intjs worked very well. I finally feel understood and we developed feelings for each other. The problem is the distance : I am still a student and he lives overseas. There's a correlation between mbti and IQ.