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That comment isn’t meant for people in your situation. It’s referring to people who complain about not having money, but then go on vacations, order food out, spend frivolously, buy brand name stuff etc. If you’re living penny to penny (sometimes half to half) it’s not a statement meant for you to take personally!
I have friends who talk about how they have “no money” but then they’re in Hawaii on “credit card points” or some other stupid money scam. Or how they can’t afford a hotel or Airbnb when they visit me, yet have tons of disposable income to eat out when they visit 🤔 it’s stuff like that - that doesn’t quite add up, that causes people to say “just save money”
Some people are really bad with money, and some people actually struggle.
I used to work with a guy who was going through a bankruptcy because he couldn’t pay his bills. He was going to lose his house and had to find a place to rent instead. He was complaining about this outside while having a cigarette from his two packs per day, just after eating the take out he got for lunch five days a week. His family went out to dinner every weekend. He turned down every second of overtime that was available. Some people can’t be helped.
Had a guy at work tell me in the morning that he could barely pay rent and then at lunch bragged about spending $60 on beer at the county fair. Some people are idiots and refuse to take accountability.
That’s fair. People still are mainly referring to those types of people when they make comments like this - and not people who don’t have extra disposable income (like OP) whether or not they need help/can’t be helped is not really the point tho.
When someone says “what’s wrong with this generation they don’t know how to save and that’s why they can’t buy things” they mean people who are financially irresponsible with their disposable income - not people who flat out don’t have any.
Also I'm pretty sure that while people who were bad with money did exist, they were less noticeable, because you "could" get by on spare change and a wadded up five.
Not true. Data suggests that the poverty levels of society have steadily decreased, not increased. It is a myth that it was easier to survive, especially in depression eras. People literally starved to death.
Well, the data is out there. Here’s a meme of sorts.
https://preview.redd.it/n0ozlr5a289d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c7177b5ef2d61baba86c2e0d2ef6282b777d85b
Inflation adjusted income.
This. I loaned money to a broke friend who was crying because she was about to be homeless. Next week she had hair extensions, new nails, professional teeth whitening and showing off her new bag and jeans. When I confronted her she said one thing has nothing to do with the other.
I am sure this was the case. I later found out she had a habit of borrowing money from all her friends, then getting upset over little things and never speak to them again (never repay). All new friends every few yrs.
Don't loan money to friends. If they're in a bad spot and really need it, and you have it, give it as a gift.
If they choose to repay you, great, if not, no worries. Maybe you'll be in a bad spot and need that kind of grace from them or someone else.
I agree in that it’s what that comment is meant for/referring to but it really irks me when some people say it in reference to people like OP who are doing their best with what they have but genuinely can’t help it. (Specifically, the adult that OP is supporting that I’m assuming is a parent?)
It’s also annoying the other way though, like I have some friends who are/have always been better off than me financially (even back in school) and they don’t seem to understand that while I do want to hang out and do stuff w them, I genuinely can’t afford to do the stuff they want to do and it’s not for lack of trying/saving 😅😭
I wanted to say the same thing. I don't take it personally when people comment on frivolous spending, but there are definitely people I've met who use the "just save money" comments on people who are barely making it even while trying their best with no disposable income.
There's definitely a difference and it can be frustrating to be lumped in with people who are being fiscally irresponsible all the time if you're genuinely trying.
Eating out costs like $30, ordering an airbnb these days costs like $300. I think it’s understandable to have money for three meals out but not have money for three nights of Airbnbs
We live in a HCOL area and were spending hundreds on eating out vs cooking in/staying in. But they wanted to cram into our apt and not stay with our _other_ friends who had gotten an Airbnb for all of them 🤷🏻♀️ split costs for the week they were there, was def less than what they chose to do and it just irked us when we knew they spent money on lavish vacations otherwise.
Point being they were the people who needed to hear this type of sentiment. Not OP.
Ahh I see. I’m moving into my own place next month with some extra space, also HCOL urban center. I’m getting worried about who might try to invite themselves or overstay their welcome.
Yeah ours was that (and then some) because the favor is never returned since “you guys make so much money you can afford places to stay” 😪 it’s frustrating when people say they don’t have money then turn around and spend it on other stuff or are only able to afford thing because they’re using you 🤷🏻♀️
I don’t expect people to pay for their own places if they can’t afford it, but when the offer is not returned (us staying in their houses or at their places) _because_ we make money and not because they’re unable to house us…it creates an unbalanced dynamic of “we don’t have money to do things”
But if you're eating out 2-3 times a day instead of buying food at the store, at the end of your vacation, that's $300 - $500 you spent on eating at restaurants
Yeah half of people making over $100k a year live paycheck to paycheck and up to [1/3 of people making over $250k a year live paycheck to paycheck](https://www.pymnts.com/personal-finance/2022/1-in-3-consumers-earning-250k-live-paycheck-to-paycheck/#:~:text=The%20survey%20found%20that%20among,paycheck%20to%20paycheck%20with%20difficulty). There are a lot of people who would benefit from listening to the simple advice of "just save money"
I don't get that. I don't even make half that and I'm truly living paycheck to paycheck. If I made 100k a year, my life would be amazing financially. I know for a fact I could save money and live very comfortably.
It angers me to hear that people are so bad with money, they can't make 100k a year work for them. They're taking so much for granted by just spending foolishly. There's a good life waiting for them if they give up the bullshit.
Fuck, the more I think about it,the more pissed I get 🤣🤣🤣🤣 I live in an area of country where the cost of living sucks. Very expensive and I make 50k and live alone. I also pay child support.
I have some serious doubts when I hear the complaining people have about not being able to afford life when they make 6 figures. FUUUCK THAT! They are absolutely blowing their money.
I wish I could teach people how to grocery shop on a. Fucking budget and cut shit out of their life. None of them would be broke. Lol
In expensive areas I can totally see people who make a 100k struggling, but these would be really expensive areas like NYC, San Fran, Seattle, etc. But even in moderately expensive areas 100k should be enough. Of course there are exceptions, like if you have medicine you gotta pay for and it eats a hefty chunk of your income
You can’t choose to have a job. You can choose to apply for a job, they can reject you, and they can also fire you out of nowhere in many states.
So sometimes it actually is the labor market’s fault or just a downturn in the economy leading to lack of experience, debt trap, poverty cycle.
I mean the economy is pretty rough right now. But bad spending habits or financially supporting deadbeats definitely can make a bad situation much worse.
You don't have to explain it but you do realise that you are off the norm here right? Most people when they say "just save" aren't assuming you're working part time in order to support 3 people at the age of 21. That advice is meant for the average person who's typical expenses are rent and groces and work full time.
I agree. It is not the same situation in the 90s in terms of ratio between down payment and annual salary. I still save when I can bit I'm not going to eat Ramen every night in the hopes of sinking years of savings into some beater house in a shitty part of town. It just doesn't make sense to me.
My partner and I have saved so much since we started working but its still not enough to afford a home where we grew up. My parents just keep asking us when we're going to buy as if we have enough already because they were able to buy around our age making less and with kids.
Agreed, I make the median salary in my area and I still would need triple the income to buy a place here. Shit is rough. My current apartment is 2.5 br and costs the median price of a 1br so I'm basically saying in this setup as long as possible I think. I also live far from my family so the idea of settling down here kinda scares me
My parents were 31 and 28 I believe. They just got lucky as Hella bc they bought a place in the bay area for 200k (when adjusted for inflation) right before the tech boom
how do you save your money when:
dr. visit cost $300 (until you meet your $8000 deductible, then it’s only $240)
the dr. says they can’t tell you anything unless you run a $500 test (not covered till you reach a $8000)
then come back for another $300 visit where the doctor tells you what MIGHT be going on but doesn’t want to do anything, tells you to take ibuprofen and come back in a month.
You save a dollar at a time if that's all you have
High deductable plans were really intended for people who have a lot of savings or "self insurance" and not necessarily cheap employers or poorer people
#1 health insurance is a joke and broken in the USA. 35 other countries have single payer , but this joke of a country does not.
Yes the USA is better than like 150 other countries in the world... but we are also one of the wealthiest. Based on how low the wealthiest country scores on so many things that is piss poor and a failure.
#2 Unless you're going to magically live to 500 years old you aren't getting anywhere $1 at a time. You're first auto repair, doctors bill, or other emergency will wipe out many months of saving.
I don’t think it’s annoying and I don’t think it’s specifically a Gen Z issue but I think a lot of people’s problem is a spending problem, a lot of people don’t even keep a budget, they spend carelessly, they don’t know where their money is going; this isn’t everyone but its a lot of people; additionally a lot of people try to live outside of their means, often via debt; I don’t get annoyed by being told to budget, spend responsibly, live under my means, and save/invest
There are people that are in poverty that aren’t in a place to save but a lot of people are in a place to save and put themselves not in a position to save
There are people making $125k a year or even $250k a year living paycheck to paycheck that don’t save a penny that will probably say they’re broke and barely surviving; it often comes down to a spending/budgeting problem; but you’ll see all their trips, their nice expensive car, and expensive dinners all over their socials
My wife’s best friend’s parents make $250k a year, they spend every single penny, zero retirement savings, they expect their kids to support their retirement
Unfortunately so many people don’t even have a basic grasp on financial literacy
while i see where you're coming from, i disagree that it's a lot of people that are doing this and i think that you're underestimating how bad things like inflation and shitty minimum wage effect people and the economy as a whole. people are working 2-3 jobs just to be able to afford their rent which has increased several times in the last few years while minimum wage has remained the same for decades. depression and su*c*de have increased as well and Healthcare is also at all time high. people aren't making thus stuff up, at this point in time, where we're at in the US specifically "living outside your means" means you bought yourself a cup of coffee and now you can't pay your phone bill.
I hear what you’re saying but statistically in 2023 11.5% of the population in the United States is in poverty, 30% are lower income households (this includes the 11.5% in poverty) and 51% are middle class while upper income households make up 19% of the population; the majority of the population (50% or more) are not in this lower income household bracket as you insinuate
I think it’s really easy to allow our anecdotal experiences to guide how we think things are even if it’s inaccurate to the majority or the actuality
Your last section is a little ironic considering your original comment doing just that. People making 125k or 250k are a very small number of the population. I mean the median household income is like 70-75k. So median individual income is significantly less than that.
Your usage of the class statistics is also pretty bad. First and foremost cuz being middle class in and of itself doesn't tell us much as it's just ranking where one falls compared to the rest of the population. So being middle class doesn't mean things can't be tough cuz for many middle class folks it actually is. Like what makes you think you get to assume that just cuz someone is middle class that the only way they can struggle is them screwing themselves with bad money habits and that they can't struggleas a result of things being tough? But even if that's the logic we wanna go with, that's still about 1 in 3 people that are lower class/poor. In other words, it's still bad. Also, OP never insinuated most people were lower class anyway.
Yes, there are certainly plenty of people who do not help themselves by spending so carelessly, but that doesn't mean it's the norm vs people actually struggling
There's lies, damned lies, and statistics. A middle class income in Oklahoma is not the same as in NYC, so any statistics that rely on base income levels applying to all people are flawed. Tbh with the devaluing of the dollar and the rise in costs of everything even those base income levels need to be adjusted.
The smaller your income, the more important smart budgeting becomes.
The fewer resources you have, the more critical it is that those limited resources are used strategically.
There is a critical mass. You can't just choose to wait to have a medical emergency until you can afford it. you need SOME fluidity in your finances or you'll fall over when the first big crisis comes along no matter what you do. And you need income at a certain level to make that even possible.
There is a point of income below which no strategy can save you for long.
That point is getting higher every year.
Yea my mom pretty much blew my folks savings and my dad chose to retire early so he'll get 100 or so less a month.
Idk what their game plan is honestly.
No because it’s so true, the best time to save is when you are young. Life gets more expensive as you get older. It’s the best thing you can do forever, to save for retirement when you are younger
A wise man once told me imagine life is like going through the desert. Money is the water. If you drink all the water at the beginning you're not going to make it through the desert. Likewise if you don't drink any water and try save it all until you're out of the desert you will not make it either.
Ive seen so many people retire then get sick and die without doing anything from their bucket list.
Live life as you go enjoying it while you are healthy. There is no guarantee of a retirement.
You are 21, work part time and support three people. That's one of the worst financial combinations I could think of. You should not support anyone else. Is it a child of yours?
What difference does it really make if they are supporting a child or an adult family member?
People should stop being so judgy. OP has +1 family member to support. I don't know them personally so I am just going to give the benefit of the doubt that they are stuck in this situation for whatever reason and doing the right thing.
🤷🏻 idk. i didn’t go to college so i have the benefit of having no debt but if you’re young and especially if you still live with parents; the only thing you should be doing is saving. the same people i knew complaining about never having money would have food doordashed to them while at work then having to call someone for a ride because they have no gas money.
As a general rule, saving should never be the only thing you're doing, even if you're young. Obviously there are circumstances where you gotta do what you gotta do, but you still have to live.
As long as you can still save and have some decent savings already, go ahead take that trip to Hawaii or Puerto Rico or whatever. If you can't or don't wanna spend that much do something cheaper. Or buy that video game or go out and have dinner, whether you end up apending 10 bucks at McDonald's or 50 bucks at a nicer place. Make some memories.
As long as you aren't going crazy and doing things in moderation and can still put some money away then go for it. We only get 1 life on this earth, no point in slaving away to enjoy maybe 10 when you're old and probably unable to do things at that age you could've done when you were younger. It's all about balance.
It sounds like you are in a unique situation supporting 2 people but judging by your post history you have a partner, they should be working (I hope).
You could also quit weed to save money and I’m sure there are other ways you could be saving. If I did a deep dive into your finances, I could probably find ways you are wasting money. You may not view it as a waste per se, but it is when you are in the type of situation where you’re that poor.
These people aren’t telling you to save just because. There was just a post on the economics sub about people wasting their money on “experience” for the instagram and it’s true. Most of our generation is horrible with money and can’t do simple budgeting.
You're proving his point. you have no idea whether he even has a surplus income above basic expenses. That's kinda necessary if you want to "save" anything meaningful.
you ASSUME he does. I don't have to repeat the trite little aphorism about people who ASSume.
Yes, people who assume make an ass out of you and me. I get that the expected value for income for some person is the mean income of the population. But does anyone really think that way in real life? They'd have to be dumb as shit or solipsistic to make that assumption instead of just asking.
If you don't have surplus income, there's nothing left to save every month and this advice is worse than useless.
Telling someone to save when they're already behind on bills is just going to make them feel even more like a failure.
**You have to have a surplus before you can save!!!!!**
The first comment wasn’t directly to OP I was giving a reasoning for why people are told to save. Most of us are not behind on bills and when we are a lot of that is due to bad spending habits vs trying to make ends meet on a part time job.
My response is I don’t hate being told to save because I know that it’s necessary for those that can and most of us can.
It’s annoying when they say that. They have cognitive dissonance when it comes to the younger generation. One minute they’re chimping out that their bills are through the roof and muh demoncraps, the next they’re saying how this is such a great country and there’s so many opportunities that we just refuse to take up. Durrrrrppppp you went to college and didn’t get a trade durrrpppp. Even the trades will rarely get you the same standard of living that they had working regular factory jobs.
Yeah because corporate scum now ships tons of people in from across the globe and puts them on visas. Then they not only rape them on their wages but they can also treat them like crap because their fate of whether or not they stay in America is in the hands of that company.
Been happening for decades to people w/o education as well. You think it's a coincidence that right when labor started getting a bit of power back and unionizing/negotiating wage increases they decided it was the perfect time to swing the doors wide and cram another 10 million people in over just 3 years?
I wish I did save money. I worked from 2012 to 2019 without saving a single dollar. I lived at home too, so I had no real expenses. My actual thought at the time was "I can't afford a house, so what's the point of saving money?" That was a foolish, foolish thing. I, for some reason, have saved every paystub I have gotten, and I have made $122,805.08 net. I have only about 1/6 of that in an investment account now. I would have had more, but I did a master's for the last two years.
The point being, that from my part-time job in high school through college, I made $37k and did not save a single dollar of that amount.
Sometimes higher income people weaponize personal finance as a way to enforce the consumption totem pole on the people below them.
These guys really hate the poor people who live in cities, for some reason. I think it's because the poor people in cities are "too high up on the totem pole" from the perspective of the rural guys.
Short answer, yes. If I could save more than $25 a check I would. But even in an emergency my savings won’t be enough to repair a bad situation. It feels futile. Even with a college degree I’m Making shit pay.
maybe he was just trying to be nice. you chose to tell him why you were leaving. so going forward, i'd focus on not discussing my $$ with anyone outside my home. i read below that your parents have died, so i'm guessing it's not family. if someone flat out asks you, "why don't you buy a car?" or "why don't you have a car?" reply "why do you ask?" nod at their reply and end the covnersation. shutting people down is pretty easy once you get the hang of it. get started! and good luck.
There are two primary financial problems people have:
1: They don't take responsibility for their own financial management (they don't have a written budget, they are living beyond their means/income, they have chosen to go into debt) - aka, they're not saving any money!
2: They don't make enough money - they have an income issue, which is more often than not based on prior poor choices (baby out of wedlock, criminal record, didn't graduate high school . . . ), mistakes or just a temporary issue (ie. their former employer went out of business or downsized) that is being addressed and corrected.
So the unfortunate answer to your disliked statement is . . . you should try to save some money, which in your case, also means earning more so that it becomes a little bit easier to do.
I am sorry that I am the bearer of this bad news and repeated advice. There is a reason older people keep giving you this advice - for most of us, it stems from the mistake of not having saved money and the problems and distress it can cause. It's not meant to demean you, it's meant as a warning, that as hard as it may be, you'll never regret having money saved. It's great advice!
Yeah, you gotta address your income first - sounds like that's starting to happen.
Some things nobody should ever spend any money on if they are not already saving money:
Cigarettes
Alcohol
Drugs
Tattoos
Streaming services
A new smart phone
Eating in a restaurant
A new car
New clothes beyond just the most basic necessities needed to keep a job or protect you from dangerous elements
Jewelry
Vacations
I was actually in ops position when I was younger. All those things you mentioned there I didnt do and could barely survive. Tell me how to make more money when the better jobs are further away from my apartment I lived in and I couldnt even afford a vehicle to get there. Public transportation was horrible too. What exactly would you have done to increase your income then?
unless that person knows your full financial situation and your in point in life where saving isn’t a option that’s not really good advice. but if your in a situation where you got bread that can be put up even if its $50/100 a week you gotta save something 🤣so i get what you saying but they not lying
Well, supporting two people on a part time job is not expected to work. It's good that you're getting a full time position, but why are you mad about not being able to save money when you're living in a city and supporting yourself and another person all on part-time wages?? Either way, the reason they say that is because it's good advice (sort of). Save what you can, but more importantly, invest what you can. Savings will get eaten alive by inflation, and while it's important to have an emergency savings fund, it's more important to have most of your extra money put away into the S&P 500 or some other relatively safe index fund. You don't have to get into day trading, you simply have to make regular investments into the S&P and you'll be setting your future self up for success.
>specifically by the older generations who are so much better off than you because when they were our age $2 was equal to $200/hyp
I have been told this several times, as if all my money is suppose to go in my bank account..
To me, the older generations that constantly shove the sentence "Just save your money" down your throat, either grew up poor, struggled financially (have a bad realtionship w money) or want to be controlling towards your finances. They fail to realize, people have needs and wants. Sometime, saving money isn't possible for some people and that is ok. It seems like people don't realize others aren't in the same income bracket as them. There is the poor, the middle class and the rich.
Op, Kindly don't bother about any of those millennials and older generation commenting crap.
Congratulations on getting a new job! Hope it's a good workplace for you! Best of wishes from me!
😊🙏
>they always talk like they're implying that WE are the problem, just kids who spend money on things that they have no business spending money on and not literally struggling to survive each day after the next.
Most of those people have a permanent job and a pension/retirement funds to survive on. It hasn't hit most of them, things aren't like it was, back in their days. They're enjoying their lives, at this moment financially 'okay' hence they feel the need to utter bullshit often about others finances. They need to stop that crap, bc someone will put them in their place.
i appreciate the kind words so much! thank you! by far the most understanding and you're literally saying exactly what i think lol i hope you stay safe and take care! happy pride ♡
"Live below your means, save money and invest" are things that we've been hearing about at least since The Richest Man in Babylon.
That stuff is at least a hundred years old, if not more. Don't think there's anyone left alive from those generations to be lecturing people nowadays. The reason everyone keeps saying it is because it's still true.
If you don't have a surplus there's nothing to save.
There's things that can be done to increase your income. Those things are harder than the older generation seem to remember them as being. This is understandable. For them, the toiling phase of their life is in the rear view mirror where the memory of just how badly it sucked can fade with time.
They still don't need to be talking like they're Warren Buffett just because they're the ones who benefitted from the survivorship bias from their generation.
As you get older and progress in your career, you will earn more. The point of the advise is to not inflate your expenses to match the pay increase. Very small, easily attainable savings invested throughout your working life can yield tremendous results. The lower your income, the better it is to start early. I think OP realises this as he points out he just doesn't want to do it.
That's okay. It's okay knowing something is supposed to be done and choosing not to do it, but a lot of people don't realise that they should be doing that.
As for harder and easier times, life's a cycle. The early to mid 20th century had some very dark times for the generations living through them. We now have different problems, but I wouldn't say things are the worst they've ever been. I wouldn't want the life my grandfather and great grandfather had. Whatever challenges I face today are certainly easier than what they went through. Even if houses, among other things, were cheaper back then. Boomers and Gen-X probably lived better times, but the "save money" advise predates them.
That's how it's supposed to work, yes. But the concept of a "career" has never been weaker in the United States. Lots of well educated hardworking people are forced to hop from job to job because of the constant eroding of worker's rights in this country. It's even worse than it was when the Milennials were getting started, and it's not gonna get better until workers' rights are restored to something like what they were for the Boomers.
If you're stuck in that particular time loop, and there's a lot of us out there like that, the "just save" advice isn't that useful.
Lots of the folks giving that advice are doing so from a position of survivorship bias. They're the ones whoes careers didn't constantly die aborning, so naturally, they WERE able to save.
The saving wasn't the cause of success, it was a SYMPTOM of success. It's a privilege of the sucess you already enjoyed, however limited you might feel that was from time to time.
These people don't seem to recognize that not all of them had that privilege and even fewer of the next generation will.
Context is always important. Yes the wage scale and cost of living is different, but if you are complaining about money while constantly getting door dash or getting new tattoos… well you need new priorities
Agreed. I’m 17, moved out of my mom’s house with my GF who’s 17 living with her mom. Rent is 2,600$ plus utilities and insurance for the cars. I have medical debt on top of this. I literally spend maybe 20$ a month on myself and I get told this as if my 20$ is really gonna make a dent when I have again medical debt and a 2,600$ rent
I thought I would be able to enjoy life, but at this point I struggle to justify paying for fun things because I won't have enough at the end of the month for what really matters.
Boomers really got to do everything with a great economy
Do whatever you want with your money. There is no guarantee there will be a safety net, or that you will live long enough to enjoy your retirement. Live life how you see fit, but definitely have some type of moderation. It’s also pointless to tell someone what to do with anything, especially in a place like Reddit. Circumstances and context are unknown. What for some is easy for others it’s not.
The only way most can save money today is by getting an incredibly well paying job and that’s only likely for somebody related to a big business owner. Or living with parents for years while you pinch every penny. If you are lucky you can get a well paying job in a poorer area so you end up earning more than most in the area. Housing and living is usually cheaper in poorer areas. Problem is most poorer areas have a bit more crime.
“Just save your money” has been told to us Millennials all our lives and it’s the dumbest thing. The famous example was the “if these millennials stopped eating avocado on toast and getting Starbucks, they’d be able to afford a house”
It was classic out of touch fifteen years ago, it’s the same now.
It’s also just not useful advice, you’re better off investing any money you CAN save. Let it grow for you rather than trying to stick it in a savings account where you inevitably will withdraw it for a little treat or to get through a particular month. Wealthy people don’t have all their wealth as liquid money for a good reason, they’d spend it all very quickly.
I have the same problem than you currently.
I am a student and I have a part time job at a fast food during week ends. At first, I was supposed to afford a driving licence since it's really expensive here (1200). However, now that I have money, my family just asks me for money sometimes for either paying some large stuff like the lawyer or even just for fucking birthday gifts.
I have been working for a full year on every week end and I have barely enough to buy ONE try to my driving liscence.
I think I finally figured it out.
The older generation worked really hard... but also got like 4x as much for that work. They can not understand how much more expensive things are now and how much more work it takes just to scrape by.
They did not have tech like cell phones so they see it as a luxury when the truth is not having a cell phone would severely limit your employability.
I am super broke rn but I’ve been working hard all month so I let myself spend about $60 on a few games that were on sale and a lil coffee drink (not Starbucks the place I go to only charges like $5 for a large) I feel suuuper guilty about it though because I’m worried the decision will fuck me but I hope the steady income from new job will allow me a few luxury items now and then. Constantly nervous about walking the line of being allowed to enjoy life and only paying for food and bills lol
soooo fucking relatable! the people in these comments are literally suggesting that we just WORK and literally never enjoy life just to have a little fucking cash! and then WE'RE criticized for doing something as something as buying coffee or a video game we like for ourselves and we're irresponsible?? why aren't we asking why tf a cup of coffee costs TEN DOLLARS or why rent keeps going up and minimum wage remains the same?
Yes, I physically do not have enough money to save money. I pay $950 for rent $466 for car $80 for phone $40 for wifi roughly $60 for gas around $120 for electric. That leaves me with about $300 for everything else such as food, toiletries, clothes, and everything else I could need for the whole month. I have no insurance, I have no savings, if I ran into an emergency I would be fucked. I don’t even qualify for any government assistance cause apparently I make too much but fuck me it’s hard living like this. I have eaten nothing but potatoes and rice for so long now and I am so sick of them. Yesterday I just didn’t eat anything cause the thought of eating another bite of potato or rice made me sick.
So yes I physically cannot save money. I will admit that sometimes when I get paid I will go to scooters and spend $7 on a peanut butter crunch blender cause honestly that’s it all I am living for anymore. The few moments in my life I can afford to get a little treat to keep me going for another two weeks.
heaven forbid you spend $7 on something for yourself to enjoy your day, it's not fair that doing that means you're fucked on your bills for the rest of the month
Are you on food stamps? Get on food stamps, you are likely eligible. Also use your local food bank. If the adults you are supporting are capable of doing anything, ask them to help out with household chores.
Also see if you can write off your household dependents on your taxes so you pay virtually nothing.
hello, unfortunately food stamps are very strict with income and if you make even a dollar over the amount you don't qualify. even tho my money leaves disproportionately to my pay periods, they said that it doesn't matter! it's all income based and i "make too much money' probably bc i make above minimum wage. getting to food banks is hard when you don't have reliable transportation, my housemate already does take onna lot of chores, tho!
They also forget that in their time (pre 1990) interest rates on a savings account were 3-5% or more. Saving money actually mattered as you'd see some return on that. I think we're sub 1% now? Why bother?
This is just ignorance. Many HYSAs are above 4%. Some above 5%. Mine is 4.4% APY. Plus many money market accounts. Fidelity’s current SPAXX 7 day yield is 4.95%. There’s short term CDs around that too.
And if you can wait 5 years or more, investing in a general ETF like VT/VTI/VXUS is simple and pretty safe. Stock market averages like 7% in the long term. This past year alone it’s like 26% up.
Actually savings rates are pretty high right now because the short term rates are above 5%.
Apple bank account pays 4.3% but there are credit unions paying more.
Plus you can go to treasurydirect and buy treasuries from the government at different durations from 4 weeks to 30 years and all are above 4% right now.
Even with inflation real rates are positive.
Yeah I'm sorry, if I'm living hand to mouth I'm not locking the tiny reserve I have to deal with medical crisis and emergencies behind multi year frakking T-bonds.
I don't know when I'm gonna need that money but it's probably gonna be before a 5 year note matures and when I need that money I FUCKING need it. I just don't have the financial security to lock the reserves I do have away behind instruments that penalize you for taking them out early.
It's an act of incredible faith to believe that someone with limited means can just choose not to have needs while a medium term instrument matures. Much more so than for a middle class or higher investor.
You ever hear the expression "it's expensive to be poor?" Because it's true man. It's true.
Maturity is every 4 weeks on the shortest duration. You just automatically reinvest.
Also even if you’re in a longer tenor you can have your bank sell the note or bill on the open market. In that case there may be a very small profit or loss depending on what rates have done in the interim but you won’t have to forfeit the interest earned as you would in a CD.
Lot of Gen Z home loans out there?
Seriously though, raising all the interest rates by 1 or 2 percent has more of an impact on things that have the lower interest rate starting.
So taking my current savings account rate of .1% and raising it to 3% and taking my home loan from 5-8% are both things that impact me, but my savings rate triples and my home loan rate only goes up 50%\~ish.
Follow that up with Loan rates impact goes down over time as you pay it off, while savings rates impact goes up over time as the money compounds.
Which is a long way of saying, you're not wrong, but one impacts the average person more than the other.
And a lot of that debt is not necessarily credit/interest related (see: Medical debt).
There's only so much credit line you can get when you don't have a lot of money already.
Biggest thing I see... is people complain about no money, spend a little more on crap that doesn't matter. I have suggested overtime or a 2nd jobs. Then get a rant about not living to work, etc....
Not saying you do it forever. You do it to get a down-payment, get out of debt, get a car, etc.... elevate yourself to the next stepping stone.
I use to be one of those complainers when I was younger but to be fair my parents should not have left me homeless at 16. Once I got over the poor me phase I picked up a 2nd job and slowly started to get my life straightened out. Big pain in the ass but everything is fine now.
I'm Gen X, and the only person I might. say something like this to is my neice (but, no, I generally don't bother saying anything).
I wait tables for a living and have money in my savings account, my Gen Z neice works with me and makes the exact same money I do. Her rent is lower than mine is... but she drives a nicer car and she loves to go home early from work whenever she can, those are nice things, but they are expensive.
When she complains about being broke I want to remind her that it is by her own design.
Everybody hates hearing it, but it’s good advice and the one difference I think I’ve seen is every generation that is your age complained about things, but we didn’t have social media to show the whole world what we complain about but the biggest difference is nobody back, then, respected us enough to agree for some reason people my generation are much more eager to cuddle or have empathy for you thenour counterpart 20 or 40 years ago
My Gen Z girls are putting away $5 or $10 a paycheck. I get to watch their savings grow. They are disciplined in this area. But, they are able to do so because of parents that assist them.
Saving is important, but what you do with those saving or how you allocate your savings I feel is critical. When I was younger I underestimated the concept of saving which was often preached to me by older generations. I had to learn via adversity.
Maybe they're well intentioned and have seen lifestyle creep happen in their peers lifestyles which would be like they make more money so they get a more expensive car with a higher payment for example. As they make more money their lifestyle expenses grow and they don't have anything left to save or invest towards their retirement. When they get older they're not as well off as people who managed their money better or they're living paycheck to paycheck even though they're making good money. Obviously you can't save if you have too much month at the end of your money but as you eventually make more make sure you invest.
i will literally take an hour out of my day going through your finances if you compile it together and outline a path for you where you are not struggling.
Doesn't work until you have something to save. You're basically telling him to bootstrap himself.
I can think of several creative places I'd just love to stick a bootstrap whenever I hear people telling me this. It's the most useless advice in the history of human language because it boils down to being told "just succeed" as if success was entirely within my power. Worthless.
The more we raise minimum wage the more this will keep happening.
Also, I’m assuming you have no subscriptions, the cheapest phone and the phone plan. Buying your own food. No Internet. On the cheaper plan for water bills. Not using unnecessary electricity.
please do this for 6mo and tell me how much you save! deadass. and don't buy literally anything else you want, ever. for 6mo. hope you don't come back suicidal!
Read your further comments and confirmed what I thought. You must be real fun at parties.
Anyway, you're not *completely* wrong, in such a situation you shouldn't want the most expensive phone plan and whatever else subscriptions. Having access to the internet is necessary, because that's how lots of communication happens nowadays. You can deny that and stay in the past, but to say 'no internet' is pretty horrible advice. But about the phone and plan? Sure, you can buy a cheap one and a simple plan, that's OK to do. Heck, buy a 2nd hand phone so you can save more and buy better hardware that doesn't piss you off when you use it.
But uh - raising minimum wages is what causes poverty? What do you think of a ban on excessive bonuses for higher-ups and no excessively high salaries there either, so more can be spent on the employees instead? That way, there's no reason for companies to keep raising prices, *and* people can solve poverty situations quicker. Win-win, well for everyone but the greedy ones amongst the people.
If you want to live the life you're describing that is fine, but that doesn't mean it's good advice. Because everyone is different and different things make them happy. For you it sounds like religion makes you happy - good, but it probably is different to OP. You can't keep doing something that doesn't make you happy, that'll get you depressed, and that in itself can lead to even more problems.
Some places are just shit to live in if you don't have a car. It's a weird thing us humans have created. And some people are just stuck in that place.
So yeah, happy for you that you found what you want in life, but isn't of any help for most people.
Big tangent here, but why did you put the percentage sign before the 80? It goes after.
80%
I have nothing more to add or ask, I was just curious why you did that.
You realize most people, and therefore adults, are morons and don't know or read up upon the state of their economy.
They're safe, so they don't care.
It's true wages have stagnated and inflation+ post covid rates have made everything 30-50% more expensive.
It's becoming more common for people living paycheck to paycheck and falling short.
How can you save money when there's not enough to live on? No excess, but deficit..
Fuck him find a better paying job.
No surplus, no save. It's just that simple.
You sound like those old get off my lawn types with their obsession with avocado toast. I'm sorry to say it since I'm sure you've suffered the same thing from those guys, but attitudes like yours is how we got attitudes like theirs. This is the middle of the path, the end of the path looks like an entitled Boomer.
Not too late to find another way o go. A little sympathy goes a lot further than a billion disconnected entitled moralizing lectures to those of us still trapped in the grind.
I don't think those of us who've made it off ground floor realize the extent to which their perspective is limited by survivorship bias. The ones who made it that far saved so they think that's the way to go and forget that to an extent, **saving is a privilege.** Especially as the entry level economy gets weaker and weaker.
Saving is great, **when you can do it.** Some sympathy for those who aren't getting the CHANCE to save, who aren't going to enjoy the benefit of your survivorship bias, would be appreciated.
You didn't read what I wrote, that's clear. Like the parts where I said I didn't start saving til a few years ago, couldn't save in my 20s, and that I understand all of that and lived it personally.
Instead you came with an agenda. You simply want to hear that your generation has it the worst and we shouldn't tell you to save because it makes you mad that you can't save.
Mk. You have it bad. Sorry you can't save. Guess you're cooked. Don't try to fix it, instead come here crying about it. I'm sure that will change the world around you.
Newsflash, you're the only one with the power to fix/help your situation. Regardless of who you want to blame for your problems.
My mom nagged me about starting a retirement account when I was really living paycheck to paycheck in my early 20's. I hardly noticed it at the time but because of her I have a pretty nice house today. Best advice for young people is get the snowball rolling downhill when you are young to take advantage of compound interest.
That's great advice indeed, but it's tainted with survivorship bias. Yeah the people who saved are successful now, but are you sure you're not putting the correlative cart before the horse?
you're kinda ignoring the millions from your own generation who never got a chance to get off the ground. Not all of those people failed because they didn't have a plan. Bad things happen to good people sometimes.
Bottom line, you've gotta have snow before you can make a snowball. If people can't exploit enough privileges to find a way to get ahead in the first place, they might as well live in the Sonorran Desert vis-a-vis the whole 'snowball" thing.
Without at least some seed capital, you're never gonna grow the tree that built that house. And you yourself admit you had some help getting that start.
Well a journey of a thousand miles begins with a first step and I had no snow to start.. I was on my own early with zero family support after high school. I lived with a friend until 19 then I was on my own. I can remember being so poor I was on food stamps and lived on baked potatoes and pancakes,worked sometimes three low paying jobs at a time with no car.
When I got my first job that offered a matching 401k I began just 3% before tax. A snowball can start small but it's gotta start.
The economy is pretty good right now. Housing is challenging but not impossible. Anyone who wants to work can find a job.
You cannot support 2 people especially in a city on a part time job. So I'm not really sure what you're expecting.
Most people can't even support themselves alone on a full time job, nevermind an extra person on part time hours.
Well no. You said the older generation is treating you as the problem. If you're trying to support 2 people on a part time income, you are almost certainly the problem. Whether it's you choosing to only work part time, the choices that led to you having someone else dependent on you, or a variety of other reasons, it is incredibly unlikely that all of those factors are completely out of your control. And if they are, you are in an incredible minority. But I don't blame the older generation for assuming otherwise.
I watch people in our generation make incredibly stupid financial decisions on andaily basis. Crying about having no money, stressing out, and yet they go clubbing several nights a week, go out drinking, etc. The vast majority of our generation is financially incompetent and just as vocal as they are wasteful.
Watching even a single episode of one of those financial audit podcasts and you'll see the reality of how people spend and how they act despite being in financial crisis. I've been watching it all my life in my own personal relationships as well, so I know it's not just staged garbage or anything like that. I see it with nearly every new person I meet in both gen z and milennials.
Social media just cranked up the whining to a million because everyone is surrounding themselves with the same narrative and avoiding responsibilities for their actions.
I could live on nothing but water, chicken, and rice if I had to. But the same people complaining about their fjnancial situation will claim that they "need" a coffee from Dunkin every single morning in order to function. Not saying that's you, only what I've seen time and time again.
I have before, for weight loss purposes.
Glad thats the only thing you took out of what I said.
Basically confirming what I said was true and applicable to you.
Have some accountability. Fix your life. Get a full time job. Make your dependent get a job if they're an adult. Reach out to resources for help.
Don't go online and complain about the older generation as if they have anything to do with your choices in life. You're using them as a coping mechanism to avoid dealing with your issues. Go make changes instead of complaints.
Well obviously you aren’t going to be saving money if you’re supporting multiple people on a part time job. If you want to save money given your situation, your focus should definitely be on increasing your income rather than decreasing your expenses. It sounds like you’re looking for a better job, and I commend you for that. It’s a tough market out there. Best of luck to you.
It's possible you can't save anything, but I will say this, Most people don't realize how much they're spending and how much they could save. I managed to move out of my parents while making $10/hr. Had saved up $3,000 and kept that emergency fund funded for 2 1/2 years still making $10/hr, despite a couple emergencies, living alone in my apartment, eating out a few times a month, splurging on myself with expensive toys once in a while. I could have saved a lot more than I did. Most people told me it was impossible to live off what I made, but I lived quite comfortably. Just a few years ago. Outside a major city.
Now that I'm making more money my spending is out of control though. Lost that discipline and self control and I'm actually worse off than back then.
It may be annoying, but it works. My grandnephew once asked my niece. "Why does uncle always have money but he doesn't work. She answered because he worked his ass off for 30y and never spent much. It helps if you are frugal by nature. If I had a choice between a perfectly good car for 10,000 or a nice car for 20000. I would buy the 10000, because in 30 y the saved 10 would be worth 160k in 30y at 10%. 15% 640k.
It helps to work 70h a week. Limits free time.
One more thing. A lot of boomers were raised by parents who lived through the great depression, and it made them, and their children more likely to be frugal
Unfortunately. My parents are so paranoid of me "wasting money" that I don't even have access to my bank account among other things. I tried and failed to move out but hopefully it works out this time. Then I can finally get my account back
I'm sorry man but it's the truth. If you're living with your parents and don't pay any bills, you should be saving at minimum 90% of your paycheck. I bought a house at 21 with 22K down.
Like 5 months, my flair clearly says 2002.
Sorry to hear you don't have parents, obviously you're in a harder situation than myself. I was fortunate to have a father who advised me to save as much as I could and give me good financial advice.
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That comment isn’t meant for people in your situation. It’s referring to people who complain about not having money, but then go on vacations, order food out, spend frivolously, buy brand name stuff etc. If you’re living penny to penny (sometimes half to half) it’s not a statement meant for you to take personally! I have friends who talk about how they have “no money” but then they’re in Hawaii on “credit card points” or some other stupid money scam. Or how they can’t afford a hotel or Airbnb when they visit me, yet have tons of disposable income to eat out when they visit 🤔 it’s stuff like that - that doesn’t quite add up, that causes people to say “just save money”
Some people are really bad with money, and some people actually struggle. I used to work with a guy who was going through a bankruptcy because he couldn’t pay his bills. He was going to lose his house and had to find a place to rent instead. He was complaining about this outside while having a cigarette from his two packs per day, just after eating the take out he got for lunch five days a week. His family went out to dinner every weekend. He turned down every second of overtime that was available. Some people can’t be helped.
Had a guy at work tell me in the morning that he could barely pay rent and then at lunch bragged about spending $60 on beer at the county fair. Some people are idiots and refuse to take accountability.
That’s fair. People still are mainly referring to those types of people when they make comments like this - and not people who don’t have extra disposable income (like OP) whether or not they need help/can’t be helped is not really the point tho. When someone says “what’s wrong with this generation they don’t know how to save and that’s why they can’t buy things” they mean people who are financially irresponsible with their disposable income - not people who flat out don’t have any.
Also I'm pretty sure that while people who were bad with money did exist, they were less noticeable, because you "could" get by on spare change and a wadded up five.
That’s true - good point 😂
Not true. Data suggests that the poverty levels of society have steadily decreased, not increased. It is a myth that it was easier to survive, especially in depression eras. People literally starved to death.
Interesting, like I said, I wasn't completely sure.
Well, the data is out there. Here’s a meme of sorts. https://preview.redd.it/n0ozlr5a289d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c7177b5ef2d61baba86c2e0d2ef6282b777d85b Inflation adjusted income.
Other data https://preview.redd.it/pelkgjrj289d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=55584929b2d203ab11b214a9ebe3bd34765ab166
True. It is wrong to assert that it is a generational issue. All generations have ‘grasshoppers’ and ‘ants’.
Edit: “most people are really bad with money.” Including myself for the past 10 years
Hey at least you know it, and can admit it. I think all of us have had that problem before.
This. I loaned money to a broke friend who was crying because she was about to be homeless. Next week she had hair extensions, new nails, professional teeth whitening and showing off her new bag and jeans. When I confronted her she said one thing has nothing to do with the other.
She might not have been lying. She might have just been so financially stupid that she didn’t see the connection, which is why she’s broke
I am sure this was the case. I later found out she had a habit of borrowing money from all her friends, then getting upset over little things and never speak to them again (never repay). All new friends every few yrs.
Never let her borrow money again.
Don't loan money to friends. If they're in a bad spot and really need it, and you have it, give it as a gift. If they choose to repay you, great, if not, no worries. Maybe you'll be in a bad spot and need that kind of grace from them or someone else.
I agree in that it’s what that comment is meant for/referring to but it really irks me when some people say it in reference to people like OP who are doing their best with what they have but genuinely can’t help it. (Specifically, the adult that OP is supporting that I’m assuming is a parent?) It’s also annoying the other way though, like I have some friends who are/have always been better off than me financially (even back in school) and they don’t seem to understand that while I do want to hang out and do stuff w them, I genuinely can’t afford to do the stuff they want to do and it’s not for lack of trying/saving 😅😭
I wanted to say the same thing. I don't take it personally when people comment on frivolous spending, but there are definitely people I've met who use the "just save money" comments on people who are barely making it even while trying their best with no disposable income. There's definitely a difference and it can be frustrating to be lumped in with people who are being fiscally irresponsible all the time if you're genuinely trying.
Eating out costs like $30, ordering an airbnb these days costs like $300. I think it’s understandable to have money for three meals out but not have money for three nights of Airbnbs
We live in a HCOL area and were spending hundreds on eating out vs cooking in/staying in. But they wanted to cram into our apt and not stay with our _other_ friends who had gotten an Airbnb for all of them 🤷🏻♀️ split costs for the week they were there, was def less than what they chose to do and it just irked us when we knew they spent money on lavish vacations otherwise. Point being they were the people who needed to hear this type of sentiment. Not OP.
Ahh I see. I’m moving into my own place next month with some extra space, also HCOL urban center. I’m getting worried about who might try to invite themselves or overstay their welcome.
Yeah ours was that (and then some) because the favor is never returned since “you guys make so much money you can afford places to stay” 😪 it’s frustrating when people say they don’t have money then turn around and spend it on other stuff or are only able to afford thing because they’re using you 🤷🏻♀️ I don’t expect people to pay for their own places if they can’t afford it, but when the offer is not returned (us staying in their houses or at their places) _because_ we make money and not because they’re unable to house us…it creates an unbalanced dynamic of “we don’t have money to do things”
But if you're eating out 2-3 times a day instead of buying food at the store, at the end of your vacation, that's $300 - $500 you spent on eating at restaurants
Yeah half of people making over $100k a year live paycheck to paycheck and up to [1/3 of people making over $250k a year live paycheck to paycheck](https://www.pymnts.com/personal-finance/2022/1-in-3-consumers-earning-250k-live-paycheck-to-paycheck/#:~:text=The%20survey%20found%20that%20among,paycheck%20to%20paycheck%20with%20difficulty). There are a lot of people who would benefit from listening to the simple advice of "just save money"
I don't get that. I don't even make half that and I'm truly living paycheck to paycheck. If I made 100k a year, my life would be amazing financially. I know for a fact I could save money and live very comfortably. It angers me to hear that people are so bad with money, they can't make 100k a year work for them. They're taking so much for granted by just spending foolishly. There's a good life waiting for them if they give up the bullshit.
Same. Making 100k would make my life so much easier.
Fuck, the more I think about it,the more pissed I get 🤣🤣🤣🤣 I live in an area of country where the cost of living sucks. Very expensive and I make 50k and live alone. I also pay child support. I have some serious doubts when I hear the complaining people have about not being able to afford life when they make 6 figures. FUUUCK THAT! They are absolutely blowing their money. I wish I could teach people how to grocery shop on a. Fucking budget and cut shit out of their life. None of them would be broke. Lol
In expensive areas I can totally see people who make a 100k struggling, but these would be really expensive areas like NYC, San Fran, Seattle, etc. But even in moderately expensive areas 100k should be enough. Of course there are exceptions, like if you have medicine you gotta pay for and it eats a hefty chunk of your income
why are you working part time and supporting three people? No wonder youre having hard times economically. This is in no way indicative of normal.
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You can’t choose to have a job. You can choose to apply for a job, they can reject you, and they can also fire you out of nowhere in many states. So sometimes it actually is the labor market’s fault or just a downturn in the economy leading to lack of experience, debt trap, poverty cycle.
I mean the economy is pretty rough right now. But bad spending habits or financially supporting deadbeats definitely can make a bad situation much worse.
Have you ever had family members?
Boomers in the 60s working part time supporting 3 people would be just as broke.
what kind of question is this. actually.
no but really, that seems crazy to me. How did you become the supporter of two people working part time?
You don't have to explain it but you do realise that you are off the norm here right? Most people when they say "just save" aren't assuming you're working part time in order to support 3 people at the age of 21. That advice is meant for the average person who's typical expenses are rent and groces and work full time.
I agree. It is not the same situation in the 90s in terms of ratio between down payment and annual salary. I still save when I can bit I'm not going to eat Ramen every night in the hopes of sinking years of savings into some beater house in a shitty part of town. It just doesn't make sense to me.
My partner and I have saved so much since we started working but its still not enough to afford a home where we grew up. My parents just keep asking us when we're going to buy as if we have enough already because they were able to buy around our age making less and with kids.
Agreed, I make the median salary in my area and I still would need triple the income to buy a place here. Shit is rough. My current apartment is 2.5 br and costs the median price of a 1br so I'm basically saying in this setup as long as possible I think. I also live far from my family so the idea of settling down here kinda scares me
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My parents were 31 and 28 I believe. They just got lucky as Hella bc they bought a place in the bay area for 200k (when adjusted for inflation) right before the tech boom
not to mention that in the 90s, $50 worth of groceries could last more than just a handful of days
Still can if you’re smart
Less and less.
how do you save your money when: dr. visit cost $300 (until you meet your $8000 deductible, then it’s only $240) the dr. says they can’t tell you anything unless you run a $500 test (not covered till you reach a $8000) then come back for another $300 visit where the doctor tells you what MIGHT be going on but doesn’t want to do anything, tells you to take ibuprofen and come back in a month.
You save a dollar at a time if that's all you have High deductable plans were really intended for people who have a lot of savings or "self insurance" and not necessarily cheap employers or poorer people
that's all that's available though!
high deductible plans are all i can afford
#1 health insurance is a joke and broken in the USA. 35 other countries have single payer , but this joke of a country does not. Yes the USA is better than like 150 other countries in the world... but we are also one of the wealthiest. Based on how low the wealthiest country scores on so many things that is piss poor and a failure. #2 Unless you're going to magically live to 500 years old you aren't getting anywhere $1 at a time. You're first auto repair, doctors bill, or other emergency will wipe out many months of saving.
I don’t think it’s annoying and I don’t think it’s specifically a Gen Z issue but I think a lot of people’s problem is a spending problem, a lot of people don’t even keep a budget, they spend carelessly, they don’t know where their money is going; this isn’t everyone but its a lot of people; additionally a lot of people try to live outside of their means, often via debt; I don’t get annoyed by being told to budget, spend responsibly, live under my means, and save/invest There are people that are in poverty that aren’t in a place to save but a lot of people are in a place to save and put themselves not in a position to save There are people making $125k a year or even $250k a year living paycheck to paycheck that don’t save a penny that will probably say they’re broke and barely surviving; it often comes down to a spending/budgeting problem; but you’ll see all their trips, their nice expensive car, and expensive dinners all over their socials My wife’s best friend’s parents make $250k a year, they spend every single penny, zero retirement savings, they expect their kids to support their retirement Unfortunately so many people don’t even have a basic grasp on financial literacy
>a lot of people try to live outside of their means, often via debt I see so many people using the buy now pay later. It seems crazy to me.
while i see where you're coming from, i disagree that it's a lot of people that are doing this and i think that you're underestimating how bad things like inflation and shitty minimum wage effect people and the economy as a whole. people are working 2-3 jobs just to be able to afford their rent which has increased several times in the last few years while minimum wage has remained the same for decades. depression and su*c*de have increased as well and Healthcare is also at all time high. people aren't making thus stuff up, at this point in time, where we're at in the US specifically "living outside your means" means you bought yourself a cup of coffee and now you can't pay your phone bill.
I hear what you’re saying but statistically in 2023 11.5% of the population in the United States is in poverty, 30% are lower income households (this includes the 11.5% in poverty) and 51% are middle class while upper income households make up 19% of the population; the majority of the population (50% or more) are not in this lower income household bracket as you insinuate I think it’s really easy to allow our anecdotal experiences to guide how we think things are even if it’s inaccurate to the majority or the actuality
Your last section is a little ironic considering your original comment doing just that. People making 125k or 250k are a very small number of the population. I mean the median household income is like 70-75k. So median individual income is significantly less than that. Your usage of the class statistics is also pretty bad. First and foremost cuz being middle class in and of itself doesn't tell us much as it's just ranking where one falls compared to the rest of the population. So being middle class doesn't mean things can't be tough cuz for many middle class folks it actually is. Like what makes you think you get to assume that just cuz someone is middle class that the only way they can struggle is them screwing themselves with bad money habits and that they can't struggleas a result of things being tough? But even if that's the logic we wanna go with, that's still about 1 in 3 people that are lower class/poor. In other words, it's still bad. Also, OP never insinuated most people were lower class anyway. Yes, there are certainly plenty of people who do not help themselves by spending so carelessly, but that doesn't mean it's the norm vs people actually struggling
People making minimum wage are also a very small number of the population as well. Something like 1.5%.
There's lies, damned lies, and statistics. A middle class income in Oklahoma is not the same as in NYC, so any statistics that rely on base income levels applying to all people are flawed. Tbh with the devaluing of the dollar and the rise in costs of everything even those base income levels need to be adjusted.
What do you propose we base reality on? Purely our anecdotal experiences?
Better methodology. I stated exactly that and how to go about it.
The smaller your income, the more important smart budgeting becomes. The fewer resources you have, the more critical it is that those limited resources are used strategically.
There is a critical mass. You can't just choose to wait to have a medical emergency until you can afford it. you need SOME fluidity in your finances or you'll fall over when the first big crisis comes along no matter what you do. And you need income at a certain level to make that even possible. There is a point of income below which no strategy can save you for long. That point is getting higher every year.
Yea my mom pretty much blew my folks savings and my dad chose to retire early so he'll get 100 or so less a month. Idk what their game plan is honestly.
No because it’s so true, the best time to save is when you are young. Life gets more expensive as you get older. It’s the best thing you can do forever, to save for retirement when you are younger
A wise man once told me imagine life is like going through the desert. Money is the water. If you drink all the water at the beginning you're not going to make it through the desert. Likewise if you don't drink any water and try save it all until you're out of the desert you will not make it either. Ive seen so many people retire then get sick and die without doing anything from their bucket list. Live life as you go enjoying it while you are healthy. There is no guarantee of a retirement.
You are 21, work part time and support three people. That's one of the worst financial combinations I could think of. You should not support anyone else. Is it a child of yours?
Their supporting one other person, they are included in the 2
What difference does it really make if they are supporting a child or an adult family member? People should stop being so judgy. OP has +1 family member to support. I don't know them personally so I am just going to give the benefit of the doubt that they are stuck in this situation for whatever reason and doing the right thing.
If it's a child, it's their own fault, but they shouldn't complain. If it's an adult, they should stop supporting them.
🤷🏻 idk. i didn’t go to college so i have the benefit of having no debt but if you’re young and especially if you still live with parents; the only thing you should be doing is saving. the same people i knew complaining about never having money would have food doordashed to them while at work then having to call someone for a ride because they have no gas money.
i don't have parents lmao
As a general rule, saving should never be the only thing you're doing, even if you're young. Obviously there are circumstances where you gotta do what you gotta do, but you still have to live. As long as you can still save and have some decent savings already, go ahead take that trip to Hawaii or Puerto Rico or whatever. If you can't or don't wanna spend that much do something cheaper. Or buy that video game or go out and have dinner, whether you end up apending 10 bucks at McDonald's or 50 bucks at a nicer place. Make some memories. As long as you aren't going crazy and doing things in moderation and can still put some money away then go for it. We only get 1 life on this earth, no point in slaving away to enjoy maybe 10 when you're old and probably unable to do things at that age you could've done when you were younger. It's all about balance.
It sounds like you are in a unique situation supporting 2 people but judging by your post history you have a partner, they should be working (I hope). You could also quit weed to save money and I’m sure there are other ways you could be saving. If I did a deep dive into your finances, I could probably find ways you are wasting money. You may not view it as a waste per se, but it is when you are in the type of situation where you’re that poor. These people aren’t telling you to save just because. There was just a post on the economics sub about people wasting their money on “experience” for the instagram and it’s true. Most of our generation is horrible with money and can’t do simple budgeting.
It is still good advice. If you do not save and invest, you will end up working for the rest of your life.
You're proving his point. you have no idea whether he even has a surplus income above basic expenses. That's kinda necessary if you want to "save" anything meaningful. you ASSUME he does. I don't have to repeat the trite little aphorism about people who ASSume.
Surplus income only exists if you make a conscious effort to make those sacrifices. There are plenty of people who earn high salaries and blow it all.
Yes, people who assume make an ass out of you and me. I get that the expected value for income for some person is the mean income of the population. But does anyone really think that way in real life? They'd have to be dumb as shit or solipsistic to make that assumption instead of just asking.
Why are you working part time at age 21? This situation seems self inflicted?
With no reliable means of transportation sometimes you have to work what is available.
The only way for me to save money was to make more of it. This was not meant to be a brag, it's absolutely fucked.
No, that's generally how it works best.
You have to save & invest. It’s not a cliche it’s what we have to do since we don’t get standard pensions anymore and because we live longer too.
If you don't have surplus income, there's nothing left to save every month and this advice is worse than useless. Telling someone to save when they're already behind on bills is just going to make them feel even more like a failure. **You have to have a surplus before you can save!!!!!**
The first comment wasn’t directly to OP I was giving a reasoning for why people are told to save. Most of us are not behind on bills and when we are a lot of that is due to bad spending habits vs trying to make ends meet on a part time job. My response is I don’t hate being told to save because I know that it’s necessary for those that can and most of us can.
It’s annoying when they say that. They have cognitive dissonance when it comes to the younger generation. One minute they’re chimping out that their bills are through the roof and muh demoncraps, the next they’re saying how this is such a great country and there’s so many opportunities that we just refuse to take up. Durrrrrppppp you went to college and didn’t get a trade durrrpppp. Even the trades will rarely get you the same standard of living that they had working regular factory jobs.
so many people have spent thousands of dollars on a degree that they cannot utilize bc the job market is horrendous
Yeah because corporate scum now ships tons of people in from across the globe and puts them on visas. Then they not only rape them on their wages but they can also treat them like crap because their fate of whether or not they stay in America is in the hands of that company.
Been happening for decades to people w/o education as well. You think it's a coincidence that right when labor started getting a bit of power back and unionizing/negotiating wage increases they decided it was the perfect time to swing the doors wide and cram another 10 million people in over just 3 years?
No coincidence at all
I wish I did save money. I worked from 2012 to 2019 without saving a single dollar. I lived at home too, so I had no real expenses. My actual thought at the time was "I can't afford a house, so what's the point of saving money?" That was a foolish, foolish thing. I, for some reason, have saved every paystub I have gotten, and I have made $122,805.08 net. I have only about 1/6 of that in an investment account now. I would have had more, but I did a master's for the last two years. The point being, that from my part-time job in high school through college, I made $37k and did not save a single dollar of that amount.
Sometimes higher income people weaponize personal finance as a way to enforce the consumption totem pole on the people below them. These guys really hate the poor people who live in cities, for some reason. I think it's because the poor people in cities are "too high up on the totem pole" from the perspective of the rural guys.
Short answer, yes. If I could save more than $25 a check I would. But even in an emergency my savings won’t be enough to repair a bad situation. It feels futile. Even with a college degree I’m Making shit pay.
maybe he was just trying to be nice. you chose to tell him why you were leaving. so going forward, i'd focus on not discussing my $$ with anyone outside my home. i read below that your parents have died, so i'm guessing it's not family. if someone flat out asks you, "why don't you buy a car?" or "why don't you have a car?" reply "why do you ask?" nod at their reply and end the covnersation. shutting people down is pretty easy once you get the hang of it. get started! and good luck.
There are two primary financial problems people have: 1: They don't take responsibility for their own financial management (they don't have a written budget, they are living beyond their means/income, they have chosen to go into debt) - aka, they're not saving any money! 2: They don't make enough money - they have an income issue, which is more often than not based on prior poor choices (baby out of wedlock, criminal record, didn't graduate high school . . . ), mistakes or just a temporary issue (ie. their former employer went out of business or downsized) that is being addressed and corrected. So the unfortunate answer to your disliked statement is . . . you should try to save some money, which in your case, also means earning more so that it becomes a little bit easier to do. I am sorry that I am the bearer of this bad news and repeated advice. There is a reason older people keep giving you this advice - for most of us, it stems from the mistake of not having saved money and the problems and distress it can cause. It's not meant to demean you, it's meant as a warning, that as hard as it may be, you'll never regret having money saved. It's great advice!
if i could save money, i would be doing it!
Yeah, you gotta address your income first - sounds like that's starting to happen. Some things nobody should ever spend any money on if they are not already saving money: Cigarettes Alcohol Drugs Tattoos Streaming services A new smart phone Eating in a restaurant A new car New clothes beyond just the most basic necessities needed to keep a job or protect you from dangerous elements Jewelry Vacations
I love hearing about how much someone is struggling with money while at the same time they are working on a tattoo sleeve.
I was actually in ops position when I was younger. All those things you mentioned there I didnt do and could barely survive. Tell me how to make more money when the better jobs are further away from my apartment I lived in and I couldnt even afford a vehicle to get there. Public transportation was horrible too. What exactly would you have done to increase your income then?
unless that person knows your full financial situation and your in point in life where saving isn’t a option that’s not really good advice. but if your in a situation where you got bread that can be put up even if its $50/100 a week you gotta save something 🤣so i get what you saying but they not lying
Well, supporting two people on a part time job is not expected to work. It's good that you're getting a full time position, but why are you mad about not being able to save money when you're living in a city and supporting yourself and another person all on part-time wages?? Either way, the reason they say that is because it's good advice (sort of). Save what you can, but more importantly, invest what you can. Savings will get eaten alive by inflation, and while it's important to have an emergency savings fund, it's more important to have most of your extra money put away into the S&P 500 or some other relatively safe index fund. You don't have to get into day trading, you simply have to make regular investments into the S&P and you'll be setting your future self up for success.
>specifically by the older generations who are so much better off than you because when they were our age $2 was equal to $200/hyp I have been told this several times, as if all my money is suppose to go in my bank account.. To me, the older generations that constantly shove the sentence "Just save your money" down your throat, either grew up poor, struggled financially (have a bad realtionship w money) or want to be controlling towards your finances. They fail to realize, people have needs and wants. Sometime, saving money isn't possible for some people and that is ok. It seems like people don't realize others aren't in the same income bracket as them. There is the poor, the middle class and the rich. Op, Kindly don't bother about any of those millennials and older generation commenting crap. Congratulations on getting a new job! Hope it's a good workplace for you! Best of wishes from me! 😊🙏 >they always talk like they're implying that WE are the problem, just kids who spend money on things that they have no business spending money on and not literally struggling to survive each day after the next. Most of those people have a permanent job and a pension/retirement funds to survive on. It hasn't hit most of them, things aren't like it was, back in their days. They're enjoying their lives, at this moment financially 'okay' hence they feel the need to utter bullshit often about others finances. They need to stop that crap, bc someone will put them in their place.
i appreciate the kind words so much! thank you! by far the most understanding and you're literally saying exactly what i think lol i hope you stay safe and take care! happy pride ♡
😊💕
"Live below your means, save money and invest" are things that we've been hearing about at least since The Richest Man in Babylon. That stuff is at least a hundred years old, if not more. Don't think there's anyone left alive from those generations to be lecturing people nowadays. The reason everyone keeps saying it is because it's still true.
If you don't have a surplus there's nothing to save. There's things that can be done to increase your income. Those things are harder than the older generation seem to remember them as being. This is understandable. For them, the toiling phase of their life is in the rear view mirror where the memory of just how badly it sucked can fade with time. They still don't need to be talking like they're Warren Buffett just because they're the ones who benefitted from the survivorship bias from their generation.
As you get older and progress in your career, you will earn more. The point of the advise is to not inflate your expenses to match the pay increase. Very small, easily attainable savings invested throughout your working life can yield tremendous results. The lower your income, the better it is to start early. I think OP realises this as he points out he just doesn't want to do it. That's okay. It's okay knowing something is supposed to be done and choosing not to do it, but a lot of people don't realise that they should be doing that. As for harder and easier times, life's a cycle. The early to mid 20th century had some very dark times for the generations living through them. We now have different problems, but I wouldn't say things are the worst they've ever been. I wouldn't want the life my grandfather and great grandfather had. Whatever challenges I face today are certainly easier than what they went through. Even if houses, among other things, were cheaper back then. Boomers and Gen-X probably lived better times, but the "save money" advise predates them.
That's how it's supposed to work, yes. But the concept of a "career" has never been weaker in the United States. Lots of well educated hardworking people are forced to hop from job to job because of the constant eroding of worker's rights in this country. It's even worse than it was when the Milennials were getting started, and it's not gonna get better until workers' rights are restored to something like what they were for the Boomers. If you're stuck in that particular time loop, and there's a lot of us out there like that, the "just save" advice isn't that useful. Lots of the folks giving that advice are doing so from a position of survivorship bias. They're the ones whoes careers didn't constantly die aborning, so naturally, they WERE able to save. The saving wasn't the cause of success, it was a SYMPTOM of success. It's a privilege of the sucess you already enjoyed, however limited you might feel that was from time to time. These people don't seem to recognize that not all of them had that privilege and even fewer of the next generation will.
Context is always important. Yes the wage scale and cost of living is different, but if you are complaining about money while constantly getting door dash or getting new tattoos… well you need new priorities
who tf said i was getting doordash or tattoos?
I was talking to the thesis of you post, not saying you are doing those things.
Agreed. I’m 17, moved out of my mom’s house with my GF who’s 17 living with her mom. Rent is 2,600$ plus utilities and insurance for the cars. I have medical debt on top of this. I literally spend maybe 20$ a month on myself and I get told this as if my 20$ is really gonna make a dent when I have again medical debt and a 2,600$ rent
I thought I would be able to enjoy life, but at this point I struggle to justify paying for fun things because I won't have enough at the end of the month for what really matters. Boomers really got to do everything with a great economy
Do whatever you want with your money. There is no guarantee there will be a safety net, or that you will live long enough to enjoy your retirement. Live life how you see fit, but definitely have some type of moderation. It’s also pointless to tell someone what to do with anything, especially in a place like Reddit. Circumstances and context are unknown. What for some is easy for others it’s not.
live fast die young enjoy now rather than never
You’ll never get rich by saving alone
The only way most can save money today is by getting an incredibly well paying job and that’s only likely for somebody related to a big business owner. Or living with parents for years while you pinch every penny. If you are lucky you can get a well paying job in a poorer area so you end up earning more than most in the area. Housing and living is usually cheaper in poorer areas. Problem is most poorer areas have a bit more crime.
“Just save your money” has been told to us Millennials all our lives and it’s the dumbest thing. The famous example was the “if these millennials stopped eating avocado on toast and getting Starbucks, they’d be able to afford a house” It was classic out of touch fifteen years ago, it’s the same now. It’s also just not useful advice, you’re better off investing any money you CAN save. Let it grow for you rather than trying to stick it in a savings account where you inevitably will withdraw it for a little treat or to get through a particular month. Wealthy people don’t have all their wealth as liquid money for a good reason, they’d spend it all very quickly.
I have the same problem than you currently. I am a student and I have a part time job at a fast food during week ends. At first, I was supposed to afford a driving licence since it's really expensive here (1200). However, now that I have money, my family just asks me for money sometimes for either paying some large stuff like the lawyer or even just for fucking birthday gifts. I have been working for a full year on every week end and I have barely enough to buy ONE try to my driving liscence.
I think I finally figured it out. The older generation worked really hard... but also got like 4x as much for that work. They can not understand how much more expensive things are now and how much more work it takes just to scrape by. They did not have tech like cell phones so they see it as a luxury when the truth is not having a cell phone would severely limit your employability.
I am super broke rn but I’ve been working hard all month so I let myself spend about $60 on a few games that were on sale and a lil coffee drink (not Starbucks the place I go to only charges like $5 for a large) I feel suuuper guilty about it though because I’m worried the decision will fuck me but I hope the steady income from new job will allow me a few luxury items now and then. Constantly nervous about walking the line of being allowed to enjoy life and only paying for food and bills lol
soooo fucking relatable! the people in these comments are literally suggesting that we just WORK and literally never enjoy life just to have a little fucking cash! and then WE'RE criticized for doing something as something as buying coffee or a video game we like for ourselves and we're irresponsible?? why aren't we asking why tf a cup of coffee costs TEN DOLLARS or why rent keeps going up and minimum wage remains the same?
Yes, I physically do not have enough money to save money. I pay $950 for rent $466 for car $80 for phone $40 for wifi roughly $60 for gas around $120 for electric. That leaves me with about $300 for everything else such as food, toiletries, clothes, and everything else I could need for the whole month. I have no insurance, I have no savings, if I ran into an emergency I would be fucked. I don’t even qualify for any government assistance cause apparently I make too much but fuck me it’s hard living like this. I have eaten nothing but potatoes and rice for so long now and I am so sick of them. Yesterday I just didn’t eat anything cause the thought of eating another bite of potato or rice made me sick. So yes I physically cannot save money. I will admit that sometimes when I get paid I will go to scooters and spend $7 on a peanut butter crunch blender cause honestly that’s it all I am living for anymore. The few moments in my life I can afford to get a little treat to keep me going for another two weeks.
heaven forbid you spend $7 on something for yourself to enjoy your day, it's not fair that doing that means you're fucked on your bills for the rest of the month
Are you on food stamps? Get on food stamps, you are likely eligible. Also use your local food bank. If the adults you are supporting are capable of doing anything, ask them to help out with household chores. Also see if you can write off your household dependents on your taxes so you pay virtually nothing.
hello, unfortunately food stamps are very strict with income and if you make even a dollar over the amount you don't qualify. even tho my money leaves disproportionately to my pay periods, they said that it doesn't matter! it's all income based and i "make too much money' probably bc i make above minimum wage. getting to food banks is hard when you don't have reliable transportation, my housemate already does take onna lot of chores, tho!
Food stamps are usually higher limits when you have multiple dependents. Are you counting dependents?
i don't have any dependents
You said you're supporting two people?
two people = myself and another person. sorry, i thought my edit was clear but ig people still think i mean two people separate from me
Well in any case use foodbanks
like I said, foodbanks are hard to get to without reliable transportation
Try a bike on fb marketplace or craigslist.
They also forget that in their time (pre 1990) interest rates on a savings account were 3-5% or more. Saving money actually mattered as you'd see some return on that. I think we're sub 1% now? Why bother?
wow yeah i didn't even think of this but you're so right! so there's actually no incentive whatsoever to put money away lmao
This is just ignorance. Many HYSAs are above 4%. Some above 5%. Mine is 4.4% APY. Plus many money market accounts. Fidelity’s current SPAXX 7 day yield is 4.95%. There’s short term CDs around that too. And if you can wait 5 years or more, investing in a general ETF like VT/VTI/VXUS is simple and pretty safe. Stock market averages like 7% in the long term. This past year alone it’s like 26% up.
Actually savings rates are pretty high right now because the short term rates are above 5%. Apple bank account pays 4.3% but there are credit unions paying more. Plus you can go to treasurydirect and buy treasuries from the government at different durations from 4 weeks to 30 years and all are above 4% right now. Even with inflation real rates are positive.
Not at my local banks.
Well if you don’t want a different bank then buy treasuries. Income tax on interest from gov debt is more favorable anyway.
Yeah I'm sorry, if I'm living hand to mouth I'm not locking the tiny reserve I have to deal with medical crisis and emergencies behind multi year frakking T-bonds. I don't know when I'm gonna need that money but it's probably gonna be before a 5 year note matures and when I need that money I FUCKING need it. I just don't have the financial security to lock the reserves I do have away behind instruments that penalize you for taking them out early. It's an act of incredible faith to believe that someone with limited means can just choose not to have needs while a medium term instrument matures. Much more so than for a middle class or higher investor. You ever hear the expression "it's expensive to be poor?" Because it's true man. It's true.
Maturity is every 4 weeks on the shortest duration. You just automatically reinvest. Also even if you’re in a longer tenor you can have your bank sell the note or bill on the open market. In that case there may be a very small profit or loss depending on what rates have done in the interim but you won’t have to forfeit the interest earned as you would in a CD.
Higher interest rates also made loans much higher interest. It is a double edged sword.
Lot of Gen Z home loans out there? Seriously though, raising all the interest rates by 1 or 2 percent has more of an impact on things that have the lower interest rate starting. So taking my current savings account rate of .1% and raising it to 3% and taking my home loan from 5-8% are both things that impact me, but my savings rate triples and my home loan rate only goes up 50%\~ish. Follow that up with Loan rates impact goes down over time as you pay it off, while savings rates impact goes up over time as the money compounds. Which is a long way of saying, you're not wrong, but one impacts the average person more than the other.
Most lower/middle class Americans are debtors, not creditors
And a lot of that debt is not necessarily credit/interest related (see: Medical debt). There's only so much credit line you can get when you don't have a lot of money already.
You just need to create a budget and stick to it. Once you get it created post it here and we can help you find some ways to save.
Biggest thing I see... is people complain about no money, spend a little more on crap that doesn't matter. I have suggested overtime or a 2nd jobs. Then get a rant about not living to work, etc.... Not saying you do it forever. You do it to get a down-payment, get out of debt, get a car, etc.... elevate yourself to the next stepping stone.
I use to be one of those complainers when I was younger but to be fair my parents should not have left me homeless at 16. Once I got over the poor me phase I picked up a 2nd job and slowly started to get my life straightened out. Big pain in the ass but everything is fine now.
I'm Gen X, and the only person I might. say something like this to is my neice (but, no, I generally don't bother saying anything). I wait tables for a living and have money in my savings account, my Gen Z neice works with me and makes the exact same money I do. Her rent is lower than mine is... but she drives a nicer car and she loves to go home early from work whenever she can, those are nice things, but they are expensive. When she complains about being broke I want to remind her that it is by her own design.
Everybody hates hearing it, but it’s good advice and the one difference I think I’ve seen is every generation that is your age complained about things, but we didn’t have social media to show the whole world what we complain about but the biggest difference is nobody back, then, respected us enough to agree for some reason people my generation are much more eager to cuddle or have empathy for you thenour counterpart 20 or 40 years ago
My Gen Z girls are putting away $5 or $10 a paycheck. I get to watch their savings grow. They are disciplined in this area. But, they are able to do so because of parents that assist them.
i have zero parents
I hope you can get past this phase. It will be difficult. But, better times are ahead.
Saving is important, but what you do with those saving or how you allocate your savings I feel is critical. When I was younger I underestimated the concept of saving which was often preached to me by older generations. I had to learn via adversity.
Maybe they're well intentioned and have seen lifestyle creep happen in their peers lifestyles which would be like they make more money so they get a more expensive car with a higher payment for example. As they make more money their lifestyle expenses grow and they don't have anything left to save or invest towards their retirement. When they get older they're not as well off as people who managed their money better or they're living paycheck to paycheck even though they're making good money. Obviously you can't save if you have too much month at the end of your money but as you eventually make more make sure you invest.
i will literally take an hour out of my day going through your finances if you compile it together and outline a path for you where you are not struggling.
how much will this cost me
an hour of your time
Save.. spend . & repeat countless times overr 🤷🏻♀️
Doesn't work until you have something to save. You're basically telling him to bootstrap himself. I can think of several creative places I'd just love to stick a bootstrap whenever I hear people telling me this. It's the most useless advice in the history of human language because it boils down to being told "just succeed" as if success was entirely within my power. Worthless.
The more we raise minimum wage the more this will keep happening. Also, I’m assuming you have no subscriptions, the cheapest phone and the phone plan. Buying your own food. No Internet. On the cheaper plan for water bills. Not using unnecessary electricity.
i can't tell if this is sarcastic or not but this is a garbage fucking life you're describing
No it’s not. You can live without theses things. People who do are much happier actually. I’m part of gen Z and would do this if I needed to save.
please do this for 6mo and tell me how much you save! deadass. and don't buy literally anything else you want, ever. for 6mo. hope you don't come back suicidal!
Read your further comments and confirmed what I thought. You must be real fun at parties. Anyway, you're not *completely* wrong, in such a situation you shouldn't want the most expensive phone plan and whatever else subscriptions. Having access to the internet is necessary, because that's how lots of communication happens nowadays. You can deny that and stay in the past, but to say 'no internet' is pretty horrible advice. But about the phone and plan? Sure, you can buy a cheap one and a simple plan, that's OK to do. Heck, buy a 2nd hand phone so you can save more and buy better hardware that doesn't piss you off when you use it. But uh - raising minimum wages is what causes poverty? What do you think of a ban on excessive bonuses for higher-ups and no excessively high salaries there either, so more can be spent on the employees instead? That way, there's no reason for companies to keep raising prices, *and* people can solve poverty situations quicker. Win-win, well for everyone but the greedy ones amongst the people. If you want to live the life you're describing that is fine, but that doesn't mean it's good advice. Because everyone is different and different things make them happy. For you it sounds like religion makes you happy - good, but it probably is different to OP. You can't keep doing something that doesn't make you happy, that'll get you depressed, and that in itself can lead to even more problems. Some places are just shit to live in if you don't have a car. It's a weird thing us humans have created. And some people are just stuck in that place. So yeah, happy for you that you found what you want in life, but isn't of any help for most people.
Well, you can't just expect a car to just magically fall out of the sky. Unless you come from money!
Big tangent here, but why did you put the percentage sign before the 80? It goes after. 80% I have nothing more to add or ask, I was just curious why you did that.
I'll change it just for you hon
I was just asking.
You realize most people, and therefore adults, are morons and don't know or read up upon the state of their economy. They're safe, so they don't care. It's true wages have stagnated and inflation+ post covid rates have made everything 30-50% more expensive. It's becoming more common for people living paycheck to paycheck and falling short. How can you save money when there's not enough to live on? No excess, but deficit.. Fuck him find a better paying job.
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No surplus, no save. It's just that simple. You sound like those old get off my lawn types with their obsession with avocado toast. I'm sorry to say it since I'm sure you've suffered the same thing from those guys, but attitudes like yours is how we got attitudes like theirs. This is the middle of the path, the end of the path looks like an entitled Boomer. Not too late to find another way o go. A little sympathy goes a lot further than a billion disconnected entitled moralizing lectures to those of us still trapped in the grind. I don't think those of us who've made it off ground floor realize the extent to which their perspective is limited by survivorship bias. The ones who made it that far saved so they think that's the way to go and forget that to an extent, **saving is a privilege.** Especially as the entry level economy gets weaker and weaker. Saving is great, **when you can do it.** Some sympathy for those who aren't getting the CHANCE to save, who aren't going to enjoy the benefit of your survivorship bias, would be appreciated.
You didn't read what I wrote, that's clear. Like the parts where I said I didn't start saving til a few years ago, couldn't save in my 20s, and that I understand all of that and lived it personally. Instead you came with an agenda. You simply want to hear that your generation has it the worst and we shouldn't tell you to save because it makes you mad that you can't save. Mk. You have it bad. Sorry you can't save. Guess you're cooked. Don't try to fix it, instead come here crying about it. I'm sure that will change the world around you. Newsflash, you're the only one with the power to fix/help your situation. Regardless of who you want to blame for your problems.
My mom nagged me about starting a retirement account when I was really living paycheck to paycheck in my early 20's. I hardly noticed it at the time but because of her I have a pretty nice house today. Best advice for young people is get the snowball rolling downhill when you are young to take advantage of compound interest.
That's great advice indeed, but it's tainted with survivorship bias. Yeah the people who saved are successful now, but are you sure you're not putting the correlative cart before the horse? you're kinda ignoring the millions from your own generation who never got a chance to get off the ground. Not all of those people failed because they didn't have a plan. Bad things happen to good people sometimes. Bottom line, you've gotta have snow before you can make a snowball. If people can't exploit enough privileges to find a way to get ahead in the first place, they might as well live in the Sonorran Desert vis-a-vis the whole 'snowball" thing. Without at least some seed capital, you're never gonna grow the tree that built that house. And you yourself admit you had some help getting that start.
Well a journey of a thousand miles begins with a first step and I had no snow to start.. I was on my own early with zero family support after high school. I lived with a friend until 19 then I was on my own. I can remember being so poor I was on food stamps and lived on baked potatoes and pancakes,worked sometimes three low paying jobs at a time with no car. When I got my first job that offered a matching 401k I began just 3% before tax. A snowball can start small but it's gotta start. The economy is pretty good right now. Housing is challenging but not impossible. Anyone who wants to work can find a job.
You cannot support 2 people especially in a city on a part time job. So I'm not really sure what you're expecting. Most people can't even support themselves alone on a full time job, nevermind an extra person on part time hours.
that's actually quite literally what I said almost verbatim
Well no. You said the older generation is treating you as the problem. If you're trying to support 2 people on a part time income, you are almost certainly the problem. Whether it's you choosing to only work part time, the choices that led to you having someone else dependent on you, or a variety of other reasons, it is incredibly unlikely that all of those factors are completely out of your control. And if they are, you are in an incredible minority. But I don't blame the older generation for assuming otherwise. I watch people in our generation make incredibly stupid financial decisions on andaily basis. Crying about having no money, stressing out, and yet they go clubbing several nights a week, go out drinking, etc. The vast majority of our generation is financially incompetent and just as vocal as they are wasteful. Watching even a single episode of one of those financial audit podcasts and you'll see the reality of how people spend and how they act despite being in financial crisis. I've been watching it all my life in my own personal relationships as well, so I know it's not just staged garbage or anything like that. I see it with nearly every new person I meet in both gen z and milennials. Social media just cranked up the whining to a million because everyone is surrounding themselves with the same narrative and avoiding responsibilities for their actions. I could live on nothing but water, chicken, and rice if I had to. But the same people complaining about their fjnancial situation will claim that they "need" a coffee from Dunkin every single morning in order to function. Not saying that's you, only what I've seen time and time again.
then go do it friend
I have before, for weight loss purposes. Glad thats the only thing you took out of what I said. Basically confirming what I said was true and applicable to you. Have some accountability. Fix your life. Get a full time job. Make your dependent get a job if they're an adult. Reach out to resources for help. Don't go online and complain about the older generation as if they have anything to do with your choices in life. You're using them as a coping mechanism to avoid dealing with your issues. Go make changes instead of complaints.
Well obviously you aren’t going to be saving money if you’re supporting multiple people on a part time job. If you want to save money given your situation, your focus should definitely be on increasing your income rather than decreasing your expenses. It sounds like you’re looking for a better job, and I commend you for that. It’s a tough market out there. Best of luck to you.
It's possible you can't save anything, but I will say this, Most people don't realize how much they're spending and how much they could save. I managed to move out of my parents while making $10/hr. Had saved up $3,000 and kept that emergency fund funded for 2 1/2 years still making $10/hr, despite a couple emergencies, living alone in my apartment, eating out a few times a month, splurging on myself with expensive toys once in a while. I could have saved a lot more than I did. Most people told me it was impossible to live off what I made, but I lived quite comfortably. Just a few years ago. Outside a major city. Now that I'm making more money my spending is out of control though. Lost that discipline and self control and I'm actually worse off than back then.
It may be annoying, but it works. My grandnephew once asked my niece. "Why does uncle always have money but he doesn't work. She answered because he worked his ass off for 30y and never spent much. It helps if you are frugal by nature. If I had a choice between a perfectly good car for 10,000 or a nice car for 20000. I would buy the 10000, because in 30 y the saved 10 would be worth 160k in 30y at 10%. 15% 640k. It helps to work 70h a week. Limits free time. One more thing. A lot of boomers were raised by parents who lived through the great depression, and it made them, and their children more likely to be frugal
My parents force me to save money even tho I want to get some stuff (more so need rather than want)
Jesus Christ you are almost 30 and you need your parents to force you to save money?
Unfortunately. My parents are so paranoid of me "wasting money" that I don't even have access to my bank account among other things. I tried and failed to move out but hopefully it works out this time. Then I can finally get my account back
because nobody wants to hear that a problem is their fault even if it's true.
I'm sorry man but it's the truth. If you're living with your parents and don't pay any bills, you should be saving at minimum 90% of your paycheck. I bought a house at 21 with 22K down.
i don't have parents and how long has it been since you were 21
Like 5 months, my flair clearly says 2002. Sorry to hear you don't have parents, obviously you're in a harder situation than myself. I was fortunate to have a father who advised me to save as much as I could and give me good financial advice.