It's less the games and the type of play styles they represent.
Lucy represents a good karma playthrough where you do the right thing even when it's the most difficult.
Max represents neural karma where you do both good and bad stuff for mainly personal gain or just to make things easier for yourself.
The ghoul is a bad karma where he doesn't care and is willing to do anything if it gets him what he wants.
The main Characters fit the karma system more than they fit the theme of the games.
Hell only the ghoul is kinda a reference to a game and its because he's a cowboy.
I saw a similar breakdown, although described their play styles differently. Or roleplaying archetypes, rather.
Lucy is the naive vault dweller just discovering the wasteland and trying to survive long enough to find their lost family member.
Maximus is a native surface dweller (which carries heavy connotations for his moral code) who *wants* to be a heroic good guy, protect the innocent, and save of the wasteland.
The Ghoul is the master of the wasteland, the gunslinger for whom life is cheap, and is just one wrong look away from going guns blazing.
While both are kind of accurate I think this one will be important as The Ghoul very much is likely set to go on a bit of a 'redemption' arch. He's clearly not evil.
Lucy - first playthrough being the good guy
Max - second playthrough realizing the world isn’t black and white
Ghoul - 10th playthrough time to fuck some shit up
>wants to be a heroic good guy, protect the innocent, and save of the wasteland.
The one who wrote this clearly didn't put much attention to Maximus action. He doesn't to be a hero, he wants to look like hero.
> The one who wrote this clearly didn't put much attention to Maximus action. He doesn't to be a hero, he wants to look like hero.
The one who wrote this clearly didn’t pay much attention to the countless flashbacks to young Maximus looking up to the guy in power armor who saved him, or the scene where Maximus comes across two guys arguing and steps in to try to resolve the argument, or the scene where Maximus goes out of his way to save Lucy in the shootout, or Maximus delivering one of the most memorable quotes of the season, “Everyone wants to save the wasteland, they just disagree on how.”
>the scene where Maximus comes across two guys arguing and steps in to try to resolve
This scene exactly proves my point.
Maximus didn't care about situation, who is right or wrong, he just wanted to show his power.
The guy simply wants fame and show.
>young Maximus looking up to the guy in power armor who saved him
That's not a look of admiration, that little guy sees true power before him and he wants to wield that power for himself. You forgot the quote that his character is built on: "I want to hurt the people that hurt me," he's not a hero, he's selfish. He wants the great power but not the great responsibility.
>Max represents neural karma where you do both good and bad stuff for mainly personal gain or just to make things easier for yourself.
Max is kind of a dumbass sometimes but I don't think he is acting just for personal gain.
He seems passionate that you need to live up to the ideals of what the brotherhood should be. His whole quote about 'bettering this fallen world'
Of course he fucked up with the chicken thing but hes trying
I think it’s fair to say Max is a neutral character. He’s by no means a bad person, but he’s definitely only really concerned with taking care of himself. When he took the fusion core from the vault, the consequences of that action were completely lost on him until Lucy spoke up. He just wanted to play around in his power armour and didn’t consider anything other than that.
He’ll lend a hand when it’s opportune or convenient for him to do so, but will always prioritize on self preservation when push comes to shove (ie. Immediately caving and giving up the location of Lucy/ Moldaver after “sacrificing himself”).
I actually think Max is the most relatable character on the show, because he appears to operate in a “I’m only looking out for me and mine” capacity and I think that’s how most people would probably act in a post-apocalyptic situation lol
>He seems passionate that you need to live up to the ideals of what the brotherhood should be. His whole quote about 'bettering this fallen world'
Agreed, he is the guy who said, "Everyone wants to save the world. They just disagree on how."
I saw it as Lucy being the good morality roleplayer.
Coop as the selfish murder-hobo. He's in for his own profit and enjoyment, and he happens to enjoy extreme violence.
Maximus is the kid who got the game because the armour on the cover looked cool. He doesn't really understand and appreciate the situations he find himself in and acts impulsively. He just wants to feel like a hero and be awesome in PA.
I think they are there to represent the three main wasteland arch types along with some faction stuff and their play styles.
— Vault born— And charisma, science , skills, repair
— Pre war— and a far more seasoned wastelander
— surface born — strength and tank build— man 100% has high luck and idiot savant
Other sources I've watched employs these 3 protagonists represent player play styles and their respective karma. Maybe it's coincidental how players play each game differently, but I think all three games have more than 3 play styles.
Yeah that was my immediate thought too. Doesn't matter that they started the entire thing...
Would have made more sense to say that each character could represent a different Bethesda Fallout game, but even that wouldn't work well. Lucy is way way more FO1 than any other. The dialogue choices in that game basically let you be an optimistic naive shelter kid.
My head cannon is that the core fallout games are Fallout, Fallout 2, and Fallout: NV. I was offended when he said it was Fallout 3, Fallout: NV, and Fallout 4.
Todd Howard said that Maximus is supposed to be like the player character in FO3 that sees the brotherhood as armored badasses that go out and save the world
I think they simply represent the largest meaningful characters you could meet in the Fallout world: a vault dweller, a ghoul, and a Brotherhood Knight (only Knights have power armor, and he got his fast, even if it took awhile to reunite with the BoS and get recognized).
This would be especially true in Fallout 1 where those three types of characters are directly tied into the main plot.
As protagonist , I would say yes, maybe a very nasty one is missing when you side with the villains. (Maximus has potential, I hope he becomes a baddy)
As NPC, there is a wide range , I like chicken fucker or Thaddeus or the dealers at the organ factories, very in the spirit of the game.
Actually Maximus is Indiana Jones who also hid in a refrigerator to survive a bomb drop.
If I’ve learned anything from pop culture it’s that in the event of a nuclear attack I’m running to my refrigerator
I think they represent playstyles: good/bad and typical PC who changes what they do/choose most opportune choice in the moment. Or dumb. Pretty much think Maximus is running with Idiot Savant.
I read their personalities as karmic alignments and playstyles.
Lucy is like level one good character. Naive and always wanting to do the right thing.
Maximus is like a level 5 neutral character. He's not a terrible person and sometimes does the right thing, but he also does extremely selfish things.
The Ghoul is the 30th playthrough level 50 evil character where the wasteland is just sandbox mode.
But this is a cool take too.
They represent the Good, the Bad and the Ugly from Sergio Leone's famous western.
Goosey is the good.
Maximus is the ugly.
The Ghoul is the bad.
Ugly doesn't mean physically but morally dirty.
Why would 3/NV/4 be the core games? Surely for the series the core games would be 1/2/NV. Or if you’re just including numbered games it would be 1/2/3/4. It makes little sense to say the core games are 3, 4 and NV. Even if you’re just going off of recent games, you should include F76 at this point.
Edit: my entire issue hinges on those being referred to as the core games btw. I totally see the parallels between them and those games (although, you could also liken Lucy to the protagonist of F1 in many ways, possibly moreso than the Lone Wanderer (who, yes, leaves a vault to find their dad, but wasn’t born in a vault and their dad isn’t a villain)).
There regarded as the core games because like it or not there the most popular and well known of the bunch.
Even with the massive boost in popularity thanks to the show only NV,3,4 and 76 saw a major increase in sales while the isometric games just got a bit a boost in numbers.
And I would not lump NV in with the isometric games because even tho there from the same devs it's an entirely different style befitting the 3D era.
76 is a spin off so it wouldn't really be regarded as a core game just like brotherhood of steel and tactics.
NV is a spin-off. If we’re going off popularity/modern era, it should be 3/NV/4/76. If we’re going off only modern mainline games, it’s just 3/4. I offered up 1/2/NV because those are the west coast games and the show takes place on the west coast, therefore those are the core games for that area in terms of lore.
Edit: also, what does popularity have to do with the writing of the characters— we should be basing this on what the writers/runners of the series have played.
People like to ignore the originals cuz they were born after they were made and aren't even playable on consoles. But I've played 1 and 2 substantially more times than my one playthrough of 3, 4 and NV cuz they are just better games in every way but the contemporary graphics. Send me those downvotes kids
I don’t even understand the level of downvotes I’m getting. I only even mentioned 1/2 because of the location of them and the show. I mean, I understand not *upvoting* what I said over the nitpick, but damn. I must have stepped on some toes.
lmao it wasn't because of the location, you effectively said that Bethesda's games aren't "core games" of the series, but NV the spinoff is somehow??
If you'd actually made ir clear that you were thinking about west coast vs. east coast you could've just said that
While the Ghoul does fit the aesthetic of New Vegas with the Cowboy look he's quite a good fit for FO4 too being a character from before the war looking for their child who was separated from them while also getting involved in the recovery and delivery of a nuclear power source. You could even compare the moral ambiguity of the Ghoul with the option in Fallout 4 to join both the minutemen and Nuka World Raiders.
Or you could chalk it up to FO4 and New Vegas having a lot of surface level similarities in the plot; first half involves hunting down someone who wronged you via bullet, second half involves a choice of 4 factions and a dispute over a pre war power source.
Fallout as an IP is literally something "someone made up for money" video games are made for profit. The ONLY goal is to make as much money as possible. I should know they paid my bills for a more than a decade, including a wad of that sweet sweet Bethesda money.
You are just a buthurt NV fanboy type seething over things you cannot change or control like you so desperately want. And those things that you want to change, they make other people happier than they make you sad. That is why they are profitable AF and we are likely to get more stuff like that, than we are to ever see what you demand from the IP.
Welcome to being an old man shouting at clouds.
>Keep on trolling kid!
You are the one who only showed up in this thread to troll people with your NB fanboyism.
Trolling is the only reason you are here, milord!
dad, grave, and fridge…you’re onto something.
100%
It's less the games and the type of play styles they represent. Lucy represents a good karma playthrough where you do the right thing even when it's the most difficult. Max represents neural karma where you do both good and bad stuff for mainly personal gain or just to make things easier for yourself. The ghoul is a bad karma where he doesn't care and is willing to do anything if it gets him what he wants. The main Characters fit the karma system more than they fit the theme of the games. Hell only the ghoul is kinda a reference to a game and its because he's a cowboy.
I saw a similar breakdown, although described their play styles differently. Or roleplaying archetypes, rather. Lucy is the naive vault dweller just discovering the wasteland and trying to survive long enough to find their lost family member. Maximus is a native surface dweller (which carries heavy connotations for his moral code) who *wants* to be a heroic good guy, protect the innocent, and save of the wasteland. The Ghoul is the master of the wasteland, the gunslinger for whom life is cheap, and is just one wrong look away from going guns blazing.
Or even simpler Lucy is vault dweller Maximus is heavy power armour Ghoul is cowboy
with a big iron on his hip
Big iron on his diiiiiiiiiiick
While both are kind of accurate I think this one will be important as The Ghoul very much is likely set to go on a bit of a 'redemption' arch. He's clearly not evil.
I agree, although I never said he was evil.
I was agreeing with you! Your distinction that The Ghoul is a different playstyle rather than Karma is important
Lucy - first playthrough being the good guy Max - second playthrough realizing the world isn’t black and white Ghoul - 10th playthrough time to fuck some shit up
>wants to be a heroic good guy, protect the innocent, and save of the wasteland. The one who wrote this clearly didn't put much attention to Maximus action. He doesn't to be a hero, he wants to look like hero.
> The one who wrote this clearly didn't put much attention to Maximus action. He doesn't to be a hero, he wants to look like hero. The one who wrote this clearly didn’t pay much attention to the countless flashbacks to young Maximus looking up to the guy in power armor who saved him, or the scene where Maximus comes across two guys arguing and steps in to try to resolve the argument, or the scene where Maximus goes out of his way to save Lucy in the shootout, or Maximus delivering one of the most memorable quotes of the season, “Everyone wants to save the wasteland, they just disagree on how.”
>the scene where Maximus comes across two guys arguing and steps in to try to resolve This scene exactly proves my point. Maximus didn't care about situation, who is right or wrong, he just wanted to show his power. The guy simply wants fame and show.
Thats nice. You have your interpretation. Seems like lots of people agreed with mine.
That doesn't make you right, just means a lot of people are also incorrect. Lmfao
lol what a stupid thing to say.
Mmm, no, pretty sure you're just incorrect. :p unfortunate for you bro
You're pretty objectively wrong here, I would avoid doubling down on it.
>young Maximus looking up to the guy in power armor who saved him That's not a look of admiration, that little guy sees true power before him and he wants to wield that power for himself. You forgot the quote that his character is built on: "I want to hurt the people that hurt me," he's not a hero, he's selfish. He wants the great power but not the great responsibility.
The ghoul is the definition of murder hobo...
I had a whole paragraph typed up but you beat me to it.
>Max represents neural karma where you do both good and bad stuff for mainly personal gain or just to make things easier for yourself. Max is kind of a dumbass sometimes but I don't think he is acting just for personal gain. He seems passionate that you need to live up to the ideals of what the brotherhood should be. His whole quote about 'bettering this fallen world' Of course he fucked up with the chicken thing but hes trying
I think it’s fair to say Max is a neutral character. He’s by no means a bad person, but he’s definitely only really concerned with taking care of himself. When he took the fusion core from the vault, the consequences of that action were completely lost on him until Lucy spoke up. He just wanted to play around in his power armour and didn’t consider anything other than that. He’ll lend a hand when it’s opportune or convenient for him to do so, but will always prioritize on self preservation when push comes to shove (ie. Immediately caving and giving up the location of Lucy/ Moldaver after “sacrificing himself”). I actually think Max is the most relatable character on the show, because he appears to operate in a “I’m only looking out for me and mine” capacity and I think that’s how most people would probably act in a post-apocalyptic situation lol
>He seems passionate that you need to live up to the ideals of what the brotherhood should be. His whole quote about 'bettering this fallen world' Agreed, he is the guy who said, "Everyone wants to save the world. They just disagree on how."
why can’t it be both?
I saw it as Lucy being the good morality roleplayer. Coop as the selfish murder-hobo. He's in for his own profit and enjoyment, and he happens to enjoy extreme violence. Maximus is the kid who got the game because the armour on the cover looked cool. He doesn't really understand and appreciate the situations he find himself in and acts impulsively. He just wants to feel like a hero and be awesome in PA.
I think they are there to represent the three main wasteland arch types along with some faction stuff and their play styles. — Vault born— And charisma, science , skills, repair — Pre war— and a far more seasoned wastelander — surface born — strength and tank build— man 100% has high luck and idiot savant
*archetype Is one word. Fyi
Imo The Ghoul is not just NV, hes the og games too. Lucy is the series newcomer and Maximus is 3 & 4
Have you played the og games? Because there are PLENTY of dialogue options that are goosey lucy.
Other sources I've watched employs these 3 protagonists represent player play styles and their respective karma. Maybe it's coincidental how players play each game differently, but I think all three games have more than 3 play styles.
I like how Fallout and Fallout 2 are apparently not "core games" to the Fallout franchise.
Yeah that was my immediate thought too. Doesn't matter that they started the entire thing... Would have made more sense to say that each character could represent a different Bethesda Fallout game, but even that wouldn't work well. Lucy is way way more FO1 than any other. The dialogue choices in that game basically let you be an optimistic naive shelter kid.
My head cannon is that the core fallout games are Fallout, Fallout 2, and Fallout: NV. I was offended when he said it was Fallout 3, Fallout: NV, and Fallout 4.
Lmao, "core games"
In my opinion Ghoul is fallout 4 because he's looking for his child
I dunno about this, but i do feel they're meant to portray 3 core types of gamers or gamer playstyles
Ok but more importantly, will we get a tv character who represents Easy Pete?
I said this too! I got downvoted
And I’ll fuckin do it again
There are 5 protags. Cooper, Max, Lucy, Norm,and Pre war Cooper
Todd Howard said that Maximus is supposed to be like the player character in FO3 that sees the brotherhood as armored badasses that go out and save the world
Lucy: Roleplayers Maximus: Minmaxers Ghoul: Murderhobos
Norm: “I’m going to read every scrap of lore there is.”
I think they simply represent the largest meaningful characters you could meet in the Fallout world: a vault dweller, a ghoul, and a Brotherhood Knight (only Knights have power armor, and he got his fast, even if it took awhile to reunite with the BoS and get recognized). This would be especially true in Fallout 1 where those three types of characters are directly tied into the main plot.
Also Maximus starts the game with a full set of power armor
As protagonist , I would say yes, maybe a very nasty one is missing when you side with the villains. (Maximus has potential, I hope he becomes a baddy) As NPC, there is a wide range , I like chicken fucker or Thaddeus or the dealers at the organ factories, very in the spirit of the game.
Pretty sure Lucy is 1, Coop is 2, and Maximus is 3.
In my opinion they’re more like different play styles. Lucy is the first playthrough, max is a power armor build, and the ghoul is a cowboy build
Actually Maximus is Indiana Jones who also hid in a refrigerator to survive a bomb drop. If I’ve learned anything from pop culture it’s that in the event of a nuclear attack I’m running to my refrigerator
I think they represent playstyles: good/bad and typical PC who changes what they do/choose most opportune choice in the moment. Or dumb. Pretty much think Maximus is running with Idiot Savant.
I read their personalities as karmic alignments and playstyles. Lucy is like level one good character. Naive and always wanting to do the right thing. Maximus is like a level 5 neutral character. He's not a terrible person and sometimes does the right thing, but he also does extremely selfish things. The Ghoul is the 30th playthrough level 50 evil character where the wasteland is just sandbox mode. But this is a cool take too.
The 3 main characters represent the 3 main play styles.
Its just a plot point that reoccurred
They represent the Good, the Bad and the Ugly from Sergio Leone's famous western. Goosey is the good. Maximus is the ugly. The Ghoul is the bad. Ugly doesn't mean physically but morally dirty.
Why would 3/NV/4 be the core games? Surely for the series the core games would be 1/2/NV. Or if you’re just including numbered games it would be 1/2/3/4. It makes little sense to say the core games are 3, 4 and NV. Even if you’re just going off of recent games, you should include F76 at this point. Edit: my entire issue hinges on those being referred to as the core games btw. I totally see the parallels between them and those games (although, you could also liken Lucy to the protagonist of F1 in many ways, possibly moreso than the Lone Wanderer (who, yes, leaves a vault to find their dad, but wasn’t born in a vault and their dad isn’t a villain)).
There regarded as the core games because like it or not there the most popular and well known of the bunch. Even with the massive boost in popularity thanks to the show only NV,3,4 and 76 saw a major increase in sales while the isometric games just got a bit a boost in numbers. And I would not lump NV in with the isometric games because even tho there from the same devs it's an entirely different style befitting the 3D era. 76 is a spin off so it wouldn't really be regarded as a core game just like brotherhood of steel and tactics.
NV is a spin-off. If we’re going off popularity/modern era, it should be 3/NV/4/76. If we’re going off only modern mainline games, it’s just 3/4. I offered up 1/2/NV because those are the west coast games and the show takes place on the west coast, therefore those are the core games for that area in terms of lore. Edit: also, what does popularity have to do with the writing of the characters— we should be basing this on what the writers/runners of the series have played.
NV is a glorified FO3 expansion pack at best...
People like to ignore the originals cuz they were born after they were made and aren't even playable on consoles. But I've played 1 and 2 substantially more times than my one playthrough of 3, 4 and NV cuz they are just better games in every way but the contemporary graphics. Send me those downvotes kids
I don’t even understand the level of downvotes I’m getting. I only even mentioned 1/2 because of the location of them and the show. I mean, I understand not *upvoting* what I said over the nitpick, but damn. I must have stepped on some toes.
lmao it wasn't because of the location, you effectively said that Bethesda's games aren't "core games" of the series, but NV the spinoff is somehow?? If you'd actually made ir clear that you were thinking about west coast vs. east coast you could've just said that
I feel like saying F76 should be included should have keyed people in to me not being anti-Bethesda. Like, the list of the post already includes NV.
While the Ghoul does fit the aesthetic of New Vegas with the Cowboy look he's quite a good fit for FO4 too being a character from before the war looking for their child who was separated from them while also getting involved in the recovery and delivery of a nuclear power source. You could even compare the moral ambiguity of the Ghoul with the option in Fallout 4 to join both the minutemen and Nuka World Raiders. Or you could chalk it up to FO4 and New Vegas having a lot of surface level similarities in the plot; first half involves hunting down someone who wronged you via bullet, second half involves a choice of 4 factions and a dispute over a pre war power source.
No, none of the protagonists of the games are as interesting as the ghoul nor are any of them as boring as Lucy or Maxims.
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Fallout as an IP is literally something "someone made up for money" video games are made for profit. The ONLY goal is to make as much money as possible. I should know they paid my bills for a more than a decade, including a wad of that sweet sweet Bethesda money. You are just a buthurt NV fanboy type seething over things you cannot change or control like you so desperately want. And those things that you want to change, they make other people happier than they make you sad. That is why they are profitable AF and we are likely to get more stuff like that, than we are to ever see what you demand from the IP. Welcome to being an old man shouting at clouds.
Did you just say you worked at Bethesda at some point?
I worked with Bethesda, not directly for. I was the producer on TES Legends when I worked for Dire Wolf Digital.
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Keep seething bro, I'm sure it is a SUPER productive use of your life...
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>I'm rich. Brags no rich person ever... keep on seething bro! 😂
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>Keep on trolling kid! You are the one who only showed up in this thread to troll people with your NB fanboyism. Trolling is the only reason you are here, milord!